Holly: I was wondering about your-your choice of wearing a hat. It's OK for you to wear a hat as opposed to a scarf?

PZ: As long as it covers the hair. It's all right, I guess.

Holly: Do you wear it when you perform?

PZ: If I'm performing for ladies I'm not wearing any scarves or hats. If they ask me I would, because the main thing is to perform no matter what kind of custom. The main goal for me is to present my career and make people happy and give them also education for better music.

Holly: What do you mean, what's the educational component?

PZ: Actually the pieces that I choose to sing are not the usual music that they hear every day. It's some Western classic, operatic, even modern, mostly Iranian modern poetry and melody.

Holly: What do you mean poetry?

PZ: We have very famous poets and I sing their pieces for people to show them how poetry, new poetry of Iran can combine itself with modern music.

Holly: You sing poetry?

PZ: Sometimes I even write poetry. The idea has come to my head about a year ago that my concerts are mostly educational. Sometimes I talk on the stage, describe the piece, the melody, the mood, the composer, and the poet to give the maximum information to people. That's why I call my concerts educational concerts. Of course, I don't try to be away from the average knowledge of my Iranian people and also I don't want to show off whatever I have gathered all these years. I just stand in front of them, like not a professor or a diva, but like a student. Whatever life teaches me, I give them with all my heart, through music.

Holly: You've performed here at home in Iran and places in the United States, and I would imagine…

PZ: Well, since four years ago we are allowed to sing for ladies, which is a great occasion. For me it doesn't matter if they are gentlemen or women. I don't struggle with the idea that why should we sing for men and women together. I think it's good enough, I'm thankful we go step by step.

Performing in the United States is very difficult because the States are very far. And the facilities are also not pleasant and suitable for me. Sometimes, although I have always asked that my concerts should be held in either universities or concert halls, or even in churches, but I sometimes been trapped by unsuitable sponsors, and sometimes my pianist and I have found ourselves in a hotel in a hole or in restaurants. Of course that has happened rarely, but it has been a disaster enough that I wanted to refuse to perform. At the other hand, I saw my audience eagerly sitting there and I didn't know what to do.

Holly: Right: the show must go on.

PZ: The show must go on, that's right.

Holly: I was just going to ask you what are the rules here about singing. I don't really understand them… how and where you can sing as a woman. You can perform as long as it's only for women but it wasn't like this before the revolution?

PZ: Well it's been like this since the changing regime in Iran. That women are a little bit under pressure, the activities are restricted. Before the revolution, you were singing publicly, and afterwards, you couldn't sing at all for a while, and then, I guess, four years ago we were allowed. The restrictions were a little bit more free for ladies.

It's just that the hearing the voice of women singing solo is forbidden. And one thing is I think the government or the responsible people want to take the first steps but maybe some groups, the prejudiced groups, are a little afraid of that. Even they themselves have discovered that it doesn't harm the behavior — human behavior. But somehow they are trapped with this idea.

Holly: And when you say they're trapped with the idea, what is the idea?

PZ: The idea that the voice of the woman makes the men — it is really absolutely funny — it's tempting, that's it, nothing else.

Holly: Tempting in what way? When you say tempting, what is the context?

PZ: Tempting towards the sexy feelings of men. It persuades, it tempts the feeling of the relation between a man and woman. It makes men eager to…well, don't ask me to say something that I don't believe in it. Right?

I don't believe in stopping to hear the voice of a woman. I mean, I sing, but have I done it in society, I have put my voice at the service of needy people, right. And not only when I sing at in a hall, I mean, nothing happens to men. And if they hear my voice would they go after, even without hearing, let's say it this way, without hearing the women's voice… they do lots of corrupt lots of horrible things to women. I think women can show their hair, can sing for women, in a distinguished way. A mother is a woman.

Holly: How do you do your concerts now in Iran?

PZ: Well, mostly for charities. I sing sometimes to educate the blind or help other societies…the cancer society or schools or needy people.

Holly: Where do you do them? Where do you actually do the performing?

PZ: If I go to big cities, usually the university stadium.

Holly: So you can perform in universities here?

PZ: Sure. As long as the students are ladies, I can sing for students.

Holly: What do you think has happened in the last four years to make that possible?

PZ: I don't know. Maybe the people who were responsible, they found out that music cannot do anything against the good behavior of women.

Holly: How would you talk about what the Iranian spirit is, what the Persian spirit is?

PZ: Spirituality is very strong in Iranian people. You can tell that by all the poetry we have and this has been most strong among the youngsters.

Holly: Why is that do you think?

PZ: I think that is a way of escaping of difficulties of life.

Holly: Can you talk a little bit about your career from when you started to singing, what it's been like?

PZ: Actually, I have recently started to write a book. And that idea came to my mind when I taught singing classes and those classes made me very tired. Because I saw my students without any background education in music. I had to start with opera from centuries ago to tell them how we can train the voice. Because these days you don't hear this subject, because of all the modern sound systems which help the voice. Nobody's training the voice. So I had to start from there. And that took a lot of my energy. So I started to write a book, and of course, it was very, very precious for me that, in this age, women, ladies in Iran, have less opportunities to become a singer, a soloist. Still, even the housewives, they come to these classes. And I always tell them even if you don't find yourself to be talented, still it is good to educate yourself to know how to be a better wife for your husband, and to be an educated mother for your children.

Because you know that children today with computers, sometimes their knowledge is more than their parents, more than their parents know. Well, I think this book will become very successful to give the minimum education to people. As I've always said, I don't think singing is very important, even if you don't sing, the sun will shine, the moon will come out at night, ok. Nothing will change the nature.

But it's good if you educate yourself. If you know music or any other career like knitting, cooking, all these actions, these artistic actions in life, you design your life better. Right?

So, I come back to my career. I have the voice as I mentioned. In my book, I have mentioned that voice is not something you can correct in yourself. You can train it but it's absolutely something physical, hmm? The muscles which make the voice, they must be prepared from childhood, from your birth. When you discover that you have the voice, it comes naturally, normally. Like a painter. From childhood it shows itself, right? So I used to sing without wanting to become a singer. I never wanted to become a singer.

Holly: Really?

PZ: Isn't that something? I have so many difficulties about my singing. Because the attitude of the majority of people. This is the first time I open my mouth after 30 years of singing and it has affected my personal life with my children. I have two daughters and sometimes I see it myself that when I give concert, people, my people, they come to me and ask how much I collected from this concert. Which is not my goal, of course. Nobody wants to lose and if I collect something, that would be for printing books. Suppose I need this money in my life, does it matter if somebody by an honorable work/career earns his own living or not?

Holly: So wait, just so I understand: Your complaint is that they're talking about the business end?

PZ: Sure, if they come to the hall, they don't listen, they don't read the program, they just start to count the chairs. How many tickets are being sold? Or has the sponsor of the concert fooled me or cheated me? From one point it's good that they see themselves responsible for not being cheated. The other hand is they want to see how many tickets were sold and how much I collected. They don't know that singing itself has to have some education and effort on the stage. Standing two hours this is one thing I like to teach and show to people. If they see me standing two hours this is something they haven't seen before, because the music of Iran is always improvising, sitting, spiritually, and this way they sing and maybe they play for hours and hours. But the concert is another thing.

Holly: Can I ask you to backtrack a little bit about the idea of never wanting to be a singer. I assume that changed at some point?

PZ: I used to sing without wanting to. This was a talent in me that showed itself. Well, I grew up, I was a student. I used to sing for school parties and then for my friends when I was a teenager until some friends of the family convinced my father to send me to conservatory. They believed I have gold in my throat. I went to the conservatory of Tehran without wanting and knowing what do I want to be. And after two years of studying, I was engaged with my ex-husband. I remember, one spring, I wanted to study my eternal language with my teacher. When she heard I was becoming engaged she told me Pari, once you will become a star in the world with your voice, so you better not get married. Marriage will stop you from going after your career.

Holly: Do you think that's true?

PZ: Well, knowing my husband I knew he would not stop me. He was a very bright, educated and broad-minded person. But he didn't want me to sing Persian songs, he persuaded me to sing opera.

Holly: How come?

PZ: Because at the time I started he thought that I might be a singer for parties. Giving concerts was not very popular in Iran. That's why he didn't want me to become a singer for parties.

Holly: When was this?

PZ: Oh, 35, 36 years ago.

Holly: Do you think that if one has a talent that they have a responsibility to…

PZ: I think so. Yes. If you have any abilities, any career talent in you, you must, educate it.

Holly: So you can't ignore it even if you didn't want to be a singer?

PZ: Exactly, I couldn't ignore my talent. That's why I went after it seriously. Until I stopped after having two children. Classical music is very serious so I didn't have any place to perform it. So I thought it's a useless talent. Except getting a lot of my time, it's very serious. But when I lost my sight in a car accident, I found that the sound in my life has a big role. So I went back to my study again, and I should say my teachers, voice teachers, singing teachers they came to me. In order to calm me down or have sympathy for this accident with me. They persuaded me to go back again to singing. That was when a new light came to my life. And then I started to study again maybe for a year, studying repetoire. And working for the blind, knowing the blind life, knowing the blind schools in Iran combined the two ideas.

Holly: Do you think had you not lost your sight you'd be a singer now?

PZ: I didn't want to be a singer. If I had not lost my sight, I didn't want to be a singer. Maybe not seeing people is another positive point of it. Because when you look at people you can hardly perform. I would be a little bit shy. But this way I'm in my own little world. I guess, when I'm on the stage I see myself in a separate side of the world. And I know people are watching me. But it protects me and gives me a little more confidence.

Holly: Is it another way of seeing the world, communicating for you? If you lost one way of communicating with the world, seeing the world, does singing become that much more important?

PZ: I don't know what I'd be if I was sighted. Well, I'd be like any other person, any other woman. Working, running the house, maybe I would do more handiwork like flower arranging, which I learned in Japan. You know, two years of my life passed in that beautiful country, Japan. That was when I was 16, 18 years old I was sent to Japan just for summer holiday with my uncle and his wife. I stayed there about two years. I studied Japanese flower arrangement. And I used to study English with a missionary. So when I came back to Tehran, I used to teach at women's society when I was 19 years old.

At the same time I went to school, singing school, I mean, conservatory. When I introduced myself to the voice teacher, she examined my voice, the range of my voice with the piano. I would never think of what future I was building. I did not know what I wanted to be.

Holly: So when you teach women's singing lessons if women singing is a bit…not officially sanctioned, how is that received by the government that you teach?

PZ: It's quite all right, because I was running my classes in official schools and nobody was against it. So, that was good enough to go on.

Holly: As someone who travels a lot, I'm interested in hearing about the relationship between the Iranian community here and in the United States. People have relatives and friends. So many people we've met have said, 'Oh, I have a brother here or a sister there.' So I was wondering if you could talk about that relationship between communities.

PZ: You mean the Iranians here with their relatives in the United States?

Holly: Yeah, with the Iranian community in the United States. You probably have a big following in the United States.

PZ: It's quite good in my eyes. It's amazing when I travel, when I go to the United States, especially the youngest look at me with such wanting to go. Or they tell me, 'Oh good for you, you're going there.' And even when I come back, even the Iranians there, because they have established their life, it's difficult to new, to start a new life again here. So they are always…they want so much to come back. They tell me always, 'Oh good for you, you have this opportunity, you travel, you go back home.' And here in opposite, they tell me, 'It's good you're going to United States, that's a country I always wanted to go to,' especially the young people as I mentioned. They're fascinated. Of course, I find people when they come out on first days, they are lost almost in the United States. Such a big country, everything is so in a rush and the distances are oh-so-long, more than a distance. The distances are more than distances I should say, in my style of English. The distances are really distant.

…One of the funniest things is that last month I was late when I arrived to the airport. The plane was almost taking off. I had to leave my suitcases, which were full of my books and my concert costumes. So I just had to take a little bag with me. And I was begging my brother, 'Oh please, open the zip of the suitcase, take some books, my skirt or this, that — anything that we can take out to put into my little bag.' Anyway, when I arrived there, fortunately, I had some books and a suitcase that I left with friends so I could have another costume and dress.

Holly: Do you wear a head covering when you're performing abroad?

PZ: No, but I have my hairstyle somehow that all tightened, I mean, I put back my hair. A little moderate in everything. I moderate everything. In order not to have problem here and not to be — I don't know what to call it there — be a proper, civilized person in this world.

Holly: What do you think of the word diva?

PZ: Who? The word diva, in English? You mentioned it earlier. Diva means that prima donna, first lady in art.

Holly: Is it positive or negative?

PZ: Absolutely positive. When they call you diva it means the goddess of art. Diva is the goddess of art.

Holly: Do you think you're a diva?

PZ: Hmm, well, how can I say? I would never be a diva because this much love from people makes me go ahead and go ahead. Maybe I still have a goal to reach. Still I think I'm a student. People have put so much loads on my shoulders by their appreciation. That still I think I have to study and give them always new, new ways of my career, new pieces, new music, and never stop and perform what I did last year.

Holly: Even in olden days in Iran, maybe two thousand years ago, women were very respected. And they are respected now?

PZ: In a way, yes, we are. Compared with Afghanistan and India and Pakistan, women are respected here in Iran. I should say yes. Look at the government: they have ministers, they have secretaries. I think women are showing themselves. I think Islam itself has put a lot of respect for women. It has.

Holly: So do you think things are better for women before or after the revolution?

PZ: Things were better for women before the revolution, they were more free, but they used their freedom in a bad way.

Holly: Do you think that people in other countries know that things are really different for women in Iran than they are in Afghanistan and Pakistan and some of the other countries?

PZ: Maybe so, but let me say let me say that I'm also not in agreement with lots of activities, lots of behavior in the West. I'm not insulting you— I just don't agree with that kind of life either. I mean…how can I say this…movies, everything, just open publicly, that's not nice either.

Holly: There is a very strong sense of public subtlety here, aside from Islam's rules. In terms of the character of the people, do you think that's true? There are issues of privacy because of Islam, but there is a sense of privacy that I believe, I think, people here have, and I'm wondering if that's true? 'Cause you were saying women in the West open-book maybe too much so…

PZ: Maybe too much. I myself like to moderate everything. I don't accept the behavior of poor women in some parts of Africa where they cut them in order to put down their sexual sense and all that.

Holly: Genital mutilation.

PZ: Yeah, sure. I don't believe in that, and I don't believe in doing like those commercial shows especially in the United States do. With well, stars like Madonna or those horrible sexy movies. Well, if I want to say things, I should start from the bottom of everything so we cannot reach to the point, it needs a long conversation, Holly, you see, which does not fit in this hour of my interviewing with you and your television. It's something we should discuss later or after this shooting.

If you ask me if I am against many of these television shows everywhere which unfortunately have been fashionable here too in our television. Like robbery and gangsters the police. They're teaching youngsters how to use the gun, how to cheat, how to use their selves. This little thing the cell phone. Look how much this is under the surface of robbery and prostitution. Isn't that so? To make the movie interesting. They make all kinds of scenario: how to use the cell phone to provide prostitution and robbery from the banks and everything. But this puts ideas in youngsters, isn't that so? And the next day you see in the newspaper that the same thing happens.

Holly: Who is your favorite singer?

PZ: We came to the point. My favorite singer is Barbara Streisand.

Holly: Barbara?

PZ: Barbara Streisand. I sing and I know the ability of her voice — beautiful, wonderful. And I have another news for you, Holly. I am planning, I will go after it, to have a concert with Stevie Wonder and Bocelli. Three of us. The representative of three parts of the terror of the world. From Europe, Bocelli, from Asia, myself, and United States, Stevie Wonder. These three unity, is that good? Of course, we need a very, very big sponsor, big company who could support us and arrange concerts all over the world.

Holly: Well, we'll have to talk about that. It's a great idea.

PZ: Great idea. To show the ability of the blind. A big advertising of the blind. And just to bring the love of every nation together by music. By who? By those people that you think are disabled. Look at the great thing that comes from their heart. It's by this concert I want to show that what we need is friendship. A friendship hand is for me important no matter if it's black or white, from which nation it comes. When I want to pass a difficult path, if any hand comes, I hold it. All right? What do you call this? Friendship and love. The necessity of love for today's life. No religion, no political ideals could have helped today's people of the world, unfortunately. This is supposed to be a bridge, a path to go over it. But you see people hanging on the bridge instead of passing.