Holly: Teaching people younger than you is a big part of what you do, or mentorship?

TS: Yeah, because we have a lot that we need to teach and if we don't pass it down to our younger generation, we could lose a lot of our knowledge…We almost lost [our indigenous language] because of colonization…our ancestors weren't allowed to speak our first language, they weren't allowed to teach us Maori medicines or show us how to carve…they were either jailed or you know, just this, 'Well if you don't do this, this is what's going to happen to you,' so, in the end, they decided that Okay, let's put it aside, you know, bury it and hopefully that it's not going to harm the next generation.

Holly: Where did you fall within that, in terms of, were you a generation that was or wasn't exposed to that culture?

TS: When I was going to school it wasn't even part of the curriculum; it was the basic, you know, science and English… But I think growing up in the city, being urbanized, that's where a lot of the colonization just gets put on you, and it wasn't until I was like 14 or 15 years until my first kapa haka in school, and from then, that was my first introduction to the Maori culture.

Holly: That's the dancing?

TS: Yeah, and it was like my first introduction to Maori culture and I just, it was like, 'wow, this is me'…

Holly: So how did it, when you started to learn about the culture, how did it change you?

TS: It was just like something within me that was hungry, you know; want to eat it, eat it, and because it was there at that time and I was lucky to be a part of it, that's how it began for me. And then when I finished high school, you know, where do you go, and this is where I came. This is the place, this is where it's where it all happened for me. It was just anything and everything you wanted, it was here and it was just all surrounded by just Maori there in front of you, so, this became my home for the next ten years.

Holly: Are there many women, do you have peers in terms of your weaponry arts here?

TS: Back in those days, there was a few women that came on board, and, because of their reasons for not wanting to carry it on, some left but then some come back, and there's a few of us now, where I'm at. We've been here for quite a while now, but unfortunately we don't all live in the same place, so there's a few branches all around Aotearoa, New Zealand.

Holly: How does it feel to be doing something that you know your ancestors were doing?

TS:Well when I first started, I didn't realize, I mean, because I didn't know where I was from, who my people were, so it was a big calling for me to get into that, and to go back home…we went to this competition of kapa haka, and it was the Nationals, in Taranaki, my home town which is where I'm from, had the big powhiri, a huge welcoming, and the first time I'd seen some of our women elders come out and display the beauty of our weaponry, to see it happen was like wow, you know. So, it was my first insight and then later on, I wanted to get into a little bit of study in what was out there and I happened to be watching a program on TV one time, and it was about the battalion, the Maori battalion, returning from the World Wars, there was a wero or a challenge that was done where the Taiaha was wielded by a women elder. It is uncommon for a woman to display this ceremony, because this was a male's duty — to wero, or challenge. And so this was one of my memories of great women warriors, our ancestors.

Holly: So, wero means challenge?

TS: Wero, yeah…so it was, that was another, that was another fascinating thing to see the end, and so when I see that I think wow, you know, it did happen and…I haven't done much research in the iwi, but I believe that every iwi had a women fighter with a babe with her.

Holly: What's an iwi?

TS: Iwi is like, just Maori people.

Holly: Ah, okay.

TS: I just think that they were a powerful women in their time that used to do a lot of things for their people, and so I believe that every iwi must have, did have, women fighters… whether it been in a subtle way, whether it been a strong way, whether it had been with weapons, without weapons, you know they were here…

Holly: What's possible when you look beyond what you just see?

TS: That we're allowed to revive our traditions, without having people come down on you, being able to bring it alive so that you can teach your children and their children, and their children who aren't even born yet — you know so we have to look, we have to look at the future, because we're going to be gone, and they're going to be our leaders and we need to always focus on our babies.

Holly: Do you apply that to your life across the board, I mean how does it change the way you operate on a daily basis?

TS: With all the influences that are going on now, I mean our people are struggling with housing, trying to pick up our own identity, and because I've walked through those sorts of things, it's like, I just don't want to see our next generation go through that, so how can we as an iwi help the next generation? And if this, what I'm doing now has helped me out, then definitely, it's like, hey this is a waka or a vehicle for anyone who would like to come on board and just take it on and then maybe one day you'll be like myself or one day you'll be like other mentors that you've seen. And so, because we're up against all the influences that are around us, it's quite hard, but it's also a wero as well, a challenge too…are we just going to play Maori one day and something else the next or are we going to live what we believe in, so it's slowly coming around now. What we do here, we also take back to our homes…so basically, what you see here, we also do in our homes, and for us to have that freedom to do that is another step to helping our next generation. If it's not going to happen at home, it's not going to happen…

Holly: It has a lot to do with identity.

TS: Oh, definitely.

Holly: It seems like there's a bit of identity, it's a critical time in New Zealand's history in terms of identity, there's lots of questions, questioning.

TS: …There was that deep space within me that just really needed to be filled, and the only way for it to be filled was to go home. I think that was the scary part, is going home was like, you're just going to another lot of strangers, because I knew my aunties and uncles, but just, that was it, and it was just like, who do I go to for this? What's the history about it? I didn't know who I could go to, to talk about those things, and so there was that calling but I was too scared because you know… I felt like I was an intruder, or a visitor as opposed to that I belonged there, you know, so it was another journey for me. And …part of our teachings and our curriculum is that you've got to be able to get up and talk about yourself in terms of where you come from… So I got to a point where I was growing up in stages, it's like, oh you don't seem to know it, and you go back to another stage and oh yeah…

Holly: What's the hazard of not knowing where you come from?

TS: At the end of the day, if you're not with your family, you're just basically lost, and that's what we were seeing.

Holly: Is that your, what you call your personal mission, to try to help people to have the experience you've had?

TS: Definitely, if that is what you want. There are a lot of waka that you can jump on board and it will take you to different journeys and mine was raising a family, raising two children, not even working you know, it was, that was my sole concentration was my two babies, and then after that, it was like, okay, now that they've grown up, what are we going to do now? Oh, okay, I better do something with the community, so I came back here again…

Holly: How do you see the warrior ethic manifesting?

TS: Yeah, I think the moment you start a new journey or a new pathway, that becomes sort of like a weapon to you, that you either take it or you leave it alone, you know and so with me learning the different styles of the weapon related back to me living my life…

Holly: So how does that change with, how does that change how you go to the grocery store?

TS: When I was younger, I was very quiet and very shy — people won't believe that but — very shy, didn't say much, and then when I came on to learn mau rakau we talked about like things like self-esteem and that lifted my confidence to be able to handle things that come my way. So it's empowerment, it's self-esteem, it's confidence. It's also being able to know about Maori history.

So the challenges in my life have become like the weaponry, what we learn…So for me, if there are any influences that come on me, that becomes the strike and then it's how I take that on board in terms of how am I going to block that out or how am I going to use it becomes a part of me.

And now to stand in front of people and teach, it is like a woman, you know, there are aspects… men would come and go, 'oh, there's a woman teaching it.' It's like, you know, why is she teaching all? And in the end it was like, 'hey, I've got knowledge and if you want it, you know, I can give it to you…we can walk together as one.' At the end of the day, it's not an issue, you can prove or you can do what you say you do…

You know, not all the times is it easy, but not all the times is it hard either. But one thing that I've really learned to see, you got to balance, you've got to be balanced within yourself…you gotta look within yourself first and have the ability to change, to change things within yourself.

TS: A diva? Oh, I envisioned it to be, you know, just like go there and do the entertainment shows or women out there, I remember watching one show, I think it was music, American Music Divas, and so you had all these women from way back, you know, soul singers and all that, people like, oh gee, Aretha Franklin is her name, you know. They made a mark, not just for themselves, but for other women who loved that sort of stuff…But they were still my mentors in terms of like, you know they're always out there, you know when you see Mariah Carey when she's like our era and like she's going to be like that one day, so…

Holly: So when you're out there, when you're in a challenge, where's your head?

TS: Oh, it's just focused, you have to be focused because I know from the old days that when they come out, you can go out and do the challenge, also expect to be challenged back as well. The moment you hold a weapon, you're telling other people who have been doing that sort of stuff… you've already started that first challenge: 'okay, she's got that weapon, I wonder if she knows how to use it.' So we have to remember that the moment we pick up a weapon, we better know how to use it. You sort of have to remember that it's not a show thing, it's not entertainment or anything like that or to make a flash…And you have to be focused — for me as a woman, it's even more than focused. You have to be prepared. Your integrity, your mana is…

Holly: Can you tell me about mana?

TS: Mana is like, how I perceive it is that all their teachings, all the knowledge, all the knowledge that I've got from here is on the line. And when you go out there, that's what you're carrying all our ancestors… they were here, they made a stance, they brought this marae, you know, up to where it is, and we have to follow that through so that our integrity is always up here, never dropped, it's just consistent.