Daniel: It’s human nature to like just automatically label somebody. It’s almost always got to be in your head. You might not say it. You might not share it with somebody else but you’re going to feel that way.

Frank: I do get stereotyped as gothic. Vampire, I get sometimes. I guess the attention is nice, but I’d rather not be stared at.

Eliza: People consider us to be snots. We became like the pretty group of girls.

Teen Guy: Just cause I play a sport, people gotta—people got to mess with me. You got to bring me down cause I play a sport! What is that, bro?

Rebecca: We’re like the ones that always get messed up on drugs and alcohol. We’re the ones that start trouble—

Christopher: We’re the ones—

Rebecca: --in between people. We’re supposed to be bad kids.

Juli: I used to wear really, really big pants and wear dark colors and I used to have really long hair and I’d always have it in my eyes. And they’d call me ugly. And, and just too much of a boy.

Geoffrey: People make fun of me all the time. It happens a lot. Having people make fun of you day after day, it’s hard and it hurts inside more than anything could hurt physically.

Teen Guy: Everyone wants that—to have that feeling that they fit in some group. You know, there’s no one wants to be a loner in a high school, you know.

Jerry: Let’s face it, being a teenager is not the easiest job in the world. Whoever labeled it the best years of our lives, obviously was never sixteen.

Cassidy: You’re dealing with family stuff, school pressure, trying to figure out who you are while planning for the future, and trying to have fun at that same time. No wonder we want to be around people who look, dress, talk and act the same way we do.

Jerry: Being in a clique can make us feel accepted. Safety in numbers, right? But cliques can be pretty vicious toward one another and that can result in a lot of teasing. I’m Jerry O’Connell.

Cassidy: And I’m Cassidy from In the Mix. Today we’re looking at cliques, the stereotypes that go with them and the way it affects our lives.

Jerry: We’ll meet kids from across the country to have a lot to say of the subject and, despite the way they may look or act, they’re really not that different from one another or from you.

Teen Girl: I think it’s inevitable that kids form cliques because people naturally group together.

Teen Guy: That’s just the way that people identify other people.

Eliza: And it doesn’t have to be because of class distinction or special interests. It can be because of anything.

Geoffrey: Gradually, it just happens because you’ve been with the same people for so long that you starting acting alike and dressing alike.

Teen Girl: I wouldn’t say we’re in like one specific clique, because we have many different groups of friends. I guess. Would you guys agree?

Teen Girl: I’m not always in one area talking to like the same people every single day. You know, I always move around.

Eliza: Everyone hangs out with people that they feel more comfortable with and it’s like, it’s like—and there’s nothing wrong with that, but that’s really the thing—that’s the way it all begins. We hang out with people that we feel more comfortable with. I know I wouldn’t want to hang with someone who was into computers because I haven’t—what am I going to talk about? Microsoft Word? That’s the only program I know.

You don’t have the opportunity to get—to get to know these people because you don’t hang out with them all the time.

Missy: Yeah, you’re going to the same parties with the same people.

Eliza: Yeah, exactly. You see the same people every single day.

When you meet a man, you
judge him by his clothes
when you leave, you judge
him by his heart
-- Russian Proverb

Rebecca: If everyone was like walking around naked or had no clothes on, you would have no idea what they were. It’s the way you wear and the way you present yourself is how you can tell what that person is.

I like wearing jeans, and ____ spikes, and like black nail polish, a lot of bracelets and basically you see us with a lot of people, skating stuff. That’s how they would classify you as a skater.

Teen Girl: When everyone comes you know like to our school, like dressing the way they like, it’s always like ___________________________ you know?

I think people consider like gothic people like everyone who wears like baggy pants and you know like that. But like I used to dress that way but I would never consider myself gothic. You know, I always like to go back to like, like you know my baggy pants, but I don’t want people to be like, ‘Oh, look at her, she turned like a gothic person.’ And like that’s, that’s the way that people would like look at you as, you know?

Daniel: It’s automatic. You know, you see somebody, you’re going to think something about them. You’re going to think something about the whole group because they have common interests and you can see that.

Dave: All of us got together, just like decided to form this group, to like protect each other. Yeah, protect each other from the police. We don’t have like a specific labeling for our group case we just like so many different things that we—kind of like in the middle. Like we kind of like Hip Hop, and _______________. We’re into the same things. Usually--

Daniel: A variety of music.

Dave: I like to dress hip hop one day. One day I like to dress preppie. We kind of adapt. Like if one day I could all black and live gothic.

Steve: I mean, I think a lot of people encourage their own labels.

Becky: People dress a certain way because they want to be perceived a certain way.

Steve: So automatically, you’re going to develop your label of that person from what you see on the outside.

Olga: I’m just a normal person that looks different. People think I’m a freak because of my piercings, but I’m really pretty sane. There’s a lot of really insane people that look pretty normal.

People usually stereotype me as a like a devil worshiper or a witch and they just stare at me.

Eliza: People consider us to be snots because of our clothing. We became like the pretty group of girls. It’s so funny because now that I’m a senior I realize the whole reason I’m friends with my friends is because of my looks and not really who I am as a person. I think that really bothers me.

Frank: I could be dressed in a white tee shirt and blue jeans and still be into the same things that I’m into right now. This is just a good way to express like this is what I listen to, this is what I like.

You get a lot of people harassing, maybe making fun of someone if they wear makeup or you know, ‘You look like a girl.’ So it’s like they don’t really get to get to know the inside of a person rather than the first appearance. It’s a lot like that with any other genre of style. It’s like if you wear baggy jeans, you’re automatically associated with gangsters and rap.

I know what it feels like to feel ugly,
awkward, stared at—the freak
--Drew Barrymore

Rebecca: We’re supposed to be the ones that always get messed up with—on drugs and alcohol. We’re the ones that go and steal everything in there in sight. We’re the ones that start trouble—

Jeremy: We’re the ones—

Rebecca: in between people. We’re supposed to be bad kids.

Rebecca: Everyone has beef [?] with everybody. We’re not that certain way. Like I know ten people who don’t like me just because of the way I look. People are intimidated by us because we’re a big group. I’ve seen people that have literally just stood there, like started straight--

Christoper: Staring at us.

Rebecca: And just stared, sometimes out of fear or just, ‘Ugh, look at them!’

Daniel: On certain days, I know people just think I’m a thug, cause it might just be a day that I didn’t feel like getting dressed up. It might be, you know, I have a pretty straight face. When I walk down the street, I know people thinking, ‘Oh, watch out. Watch out.’ It’s human nature to like just automatically label somebody. I mean, it’s always got to be in your head. You might not say it? You might not share it with somebody else but you can feel that way.

Frank: But I do get stereotyped as gothic. Vampire, I get sometimes. All right, this is the scene. You’re now supposed to be all depressed and weary and gothic. That’s a big stereotype also like if you’re goth, you’re depressed. You can not be gothic. You can listen to gothic music.

I see people taking on different names to certain vampire clans and like sometimes seriously believe that they are vampires. Some people get so wound up into this scene that they lose track of who they really are and the fact that this is just music. This is a scene that you’re into.

A lot of times people dress the way they do to be emotional, or to block themselves and isolate themselves from all people.

Deborah: People pretty much stick with who they bond with, you know, who they have common interests with and there’re still like sometimes those bonds can be so tight and so interlocked that they may not let other people get into that.

Becky: Just like at parties and stuff or something like, they won’t invite everyone or like at pep assemblies, they will only—or at lunch—they’ll only sit with certain people.

Deborah: I’d want to go up to someone and say, ‘Hey, do you want to go do this sometime?’ But like I might feel like they may not want to because they already have their friends they’re going to do it with.

Missy: In the beginning, we might have been drawn to each other for popularity, but it’s changed now. I mean, you know, we found our niches and our friends and what we have in common. People expect us to be a certain way, so they decide to give us that stereotype but it’s not really true.

Eliza: The best stereotype I ever got was that I was—that I’ve never had any problems in my life before and that I was perfect.

Missy?: I get that one a lot. I get that a lot.

Eliza: Our life isn’t perfect. I mean, we all have our family issues.

Teen Girl: It’s not like the teen shows where the jocks and the cheerleaders are the most popular and they all hang out with each other. It’s—

Teen Girl: I don’t even think--

Teen Girl: And it’s like everyone’s dream to like date like you know the star of the football team.

Teen Girl: We have cheerleaders, but it’s not like a group that always sticks together, you know.

Teen Girl: It’s like football season like comes and goes.

Teen Guy: Jocks can do anything they want going in this school. They pretty much own this school. Like with the teachers, like if a sports coach teaches a class, that kid in the class doesn’t have to do anything. They’ll just sit there and no homework and every test, ‘Oh, a 95.’

Teen Guy: We pull some strings. I don’t know.

Teen Girl: Jocks make fun of a lot of freaks and they’ll put them down because they don’t play sports.

Teen Girl: Jocks think—jocks think they rule the school.

Teen Guy: Just cause I play a sport, people gotta—you gotta mess with me. You got to bring me down cause I play a sport! What is that, bro?

Teen Guy: Cause everybody doesn’t play sports, wants to play sports. So if they don’t play, they’re jealous.

Teen Guy: People are intimidated cause all the jocks always hang out together and in like big bunches and everything like that.

Teen Guy: Yeah, maybe that’s what makes them more powerful cause everyone hangs out together.

Teen Guy: Hey, that’s it!

Teen Guy: Oooh, oooh, look at that tough guy walking around school. He’s so tough cause he plays sports.

I’m not tough! I’m just like a regular person…trying to pick my way in school. You know?

Frank: It’s not wrong to assume, but it’s wrong to look and judge without asking to get to know who the person is.

This is another picture of me and my girlfriend.

If you know someone’s looking at us, I’d rather them ask me why rather than just wondering why.

Being in a small community where you can walk down the street and everybody knows everybody’s family history on the block. When they look at you, they’re going to wonder.

I guess the attention is nice, but I’d rather not be stared at. I’d rather be looked at as anybody else, just like somebody glancing at me, and glancing back down as if I was anybody else.

Olga: People are just scared of things that are different than them. And when they see someone on the street that looks different, really they just like make fun of them because they don’t know like what they’re about.

Missy: Girls tend—girls tend to hate us. They classify us as popular quote popular. It’s nice to get dressed up once in a while or get dressed up for school, or whatever. But there’re also days where you just want to roll out of bed and wear sweat pants and put your hair up, you know.

Then people, if you walk in school, ‘You look very sick today. What’s wrong?’

‘Nothing.’ I just didn’t feel like putting on makeup

Eliza: Makeup.

What I resent the most about being, you know, kind of known and popular in school is that people do shut themselves off to me and my group of friends and we don’t even understand why. Snotty to you and disrespectful. It hurts. It makes me feel like I have to prove myself to them. I have to prove that I am a good person. I’m just the same as them.

Steve: You know, I think a real misconception in cliques is that if you’re a part of one, you cannot be friends with other people.

Deborah: : I don’t like to belong to a certain group because, you know, at lunch I can go sit at different tables and really get to know everyone in the group. And I feel really, you know, I feel awesome when I go off somewhere and see them in public and I know they go to school here and can actually talk to them by name. You know them.

Becky: If I were in like just one group of friends or just one clique, then I wouldn’t like get to know so many people.

Deborah: Yeah, exactly.

Becky: Well, I think that sometimes I like overextend myself, and you know like I meet all these people, and I have like a lot of acquaintances, but I don’t really have those really close friendships with as many people as I’d like.

Steve: I feel bad for those kids who I see sitting at lunch by themselves. They don’t really know anybody.

He was high strung and sensitive.
He didn’t have any friends.
Until he was 18, he didn’t have a date.
--Dennis Rodman’s Mom

Juli: You look at the popular kids and what you’re supposed to wear and what you’re supposed to act like and it just seems like there are rules that everyone wants to play by. And to be popular, you have to act a certain way and go with all the fashion. I don’t understand the rules.

Olga: I tried to fit in but it didn’t work. It was pointless anyway because I went through like every phase…I guess, grunge and alternative, metalhead, goth, raver. So it wasn’t that I didn’t feel like I fit into one of them. It was just like if you’re in certain group, you have to be similar to them in a certain way, like certain slang words and like certain types of clothing and music.

Juli: I didn’t fit into any group that I saw. Like I didn’t—I wasn’t outgoing, and I wasn’t pretty.

I used to wear really, really big pants and wear dark colors and I used to have really long hair and I’d always have it in my eyes, to basically conceal myself.

Frank: When I was little, I was never into sports. I was never into watching TV. I really didn’t like anything else but fantasy movies. I was always like an outcast my whole life so I pretty much believe that that’s how you get into this scene when you’re not accepted by a lot of other things.

Keep away from people
who try to belittle
your ambitions
--Mark Twain

Daniel: I mean, I’ve made fun of people when I’m with my friends. You know, I’m not going to lie. You know? And I feel that the reason why I did that is pretty much for laughs, to make my group laugh, like to put me like almost on a higher pedestal, even though I would do that like on a constant basis, but like it does kind of boost you up a little. You know, you can talk to this person in a certain way and get away with it.

Dave: A kid is just kinky looking, whatever, high waters[?]ou know, thick glasses, you know. Everyone just sees them and like, ‘This kid is too weird,’ you know, so—whatever—they see the opportunity to make fun of them.

Geoffrey: Kids will make fun of you for anything, for any reason, for being overweight, or…having a really bad haircut or something. And if you don’t run fast, if you’re not good at sports, if you’re not wearing like the best clothing.

People make fun of me all the time. It happens a lot. Like a hair was sticking up like that, they make fun of me for it, you know. And they fun you reasons, you know, just things you can’t help.

The worst thing that’s happened to me is that a bunch of people just kept making fun of me. It was a horrible feeling and people made fun of me even after I told them, ‘Look, I’m having a lot of trouble with my life. Just leave me alone!’ They’d make fun of you for saying, ‘Leave me alone.’ Having people make fun of you day after day, it’s hard and it hurts inside more than anything could hurt physically.

Juli: People did make fun of me for a while. They’d just call me any names that would try to hurt me. They’d call me ugly and just too much of a boy. It was just the baggy clothes and punk rock image. That’s what I was. I wasn’t Juli. I had no self confidence. I didn’t like myself anyway. So everything was just kind of building up and building up until I just broke. I ended up becoming depressed because of it.

Christopher: Sophomores, there’s upper classmen, have a problem with the freshmen, they’ll have a grudge against the skaters and they’ll brook us because we’re skaters. They will come up in like a gang of like five or six people—

Rebecca: And they’ll pick you up and go—

Christopher: And they’ll pick up you. They’ll either take you by the feet and dip you in the brook, or they’ll full blown throw you right in.

Rebecca: Which hurts, cause the brook is not that deep.

Jeremy: It’s full of rocks, too.

Rebecca: It’s full of rocks, so when you get thrown in, you’ll get cut.

Christopher: I got brooked four times this year.

Rebecca: Oh, I had my backpack brooked, thrown in the brook with all my books.

Frank: Pretty much when I first started school, I would get harassed and, you know, sometimes I would even skip school cause I didn’t want to deal with it that day. I found myself being very quiet. I didn’t speak to not one person when I was in school. I didn’t. I isolated myself. And they filled my locker with all these like dead rats. And they were just like—they crucified like this rat in my locker. So I was just like, ‘All right, this is not working.’ So I had to start talking to people, letting them know like I didn’t like this and stop.

Geoffrey: When people are mean to me, I kind of have to tolerate. So what am I going to do, you know? They know way more people than I. If they don’t, they could be bigger

than me. They could have a knife in their pocket, you know. You have to tolerate some things, without losing your head and stuff.

It takes courage to grow up and
become who you really are
--e.e.cummings

Teen Girl: I think it’s a 50/50 like effort, you know. Like if you think of yourself as like an outcast, you still have to go and like, you know, make the effort to like meet other people. You know? It’s like you can’t be just like, ‘Oh, like they won’t talk to me.’ Like, ‘You know, I’ll just go and sit by myself.’

Teen Girl: You can’t expect everyone to come to you and if they don’t, they’re mean, they’re bad. You have to make, yeah, the effort, yeah, as well.

Juli: I didn’t want to change myself to fit necessarily. I just wanted to be happier with myself and have people accept who I was. I got sick of being introverted and got sick of being the one who stayed home all weekend until I found the social workers, who know the school, and they know the people, and it’s not like talking to a complete stranger about it. It was gradual and I think when I started to accept that I could do art, and I started playing with music, seeing what I could do in it, and that would feel really good. And all of a sudden, I’d have a little bit of confidence.

Frank: And they look at me, I mean, I’m in the corner just like—of course, I’m going to attention rather than if I’m talking to any other people. I realized when I started opening my mouth, and started talking to people, I started getting warm responses. Not everybody all of a sudden warmed up to me, like it was one big happy family. I mean, yeah, there were still people who disliked me, but I gained more friends rather having none at all.

Geoffrey: I’m voting for a popularity contest known as class president.

When I was at the bottom, I felt the worst when I just hated everything. I’d go home and hide in my room and read and still feel bad after that cause I’m not doing anything about my problem. So I stopped being as shy as I was around a friend of mine. And we became better friends. And I met friends through him and friends through them. And it was great finding out that it gets a lot better.

Juli: I just suddenly decided that I had nothing to lose. Really what was going to happen besides a little bit of rejection. And I can handle that. I’ve had a lot of rejection.

I thought about things to then --I just decided that I was going to take a first step and be outgoing a little bit and see how the response was and go from there. And then, all of sudden, everyone gave me a good response.

Before, people that I didn’t like and I thought they were all snooty and popular and they didn’t want anything to do with me, now that they’re all like, ‘Oh, Juli!’

Olga: What is that in your ear? Why is your ear hole so big? What is i your nose?’ I feel really comfortable the way I look. It used to hurt my feelings, but now it’s just like…they’re losing out.

When people are put off by the way I look, I can find friends who will like me for who I am.

Geoffrey: The people who I hang out with, I hang out with them cause they don’t care if you’re a little overweight or if you don’t wear the right clothes. They care about you for who you are.

Teen Girl: You walk down the hall and like judge someone like you don’t even know them. And it’s like if you actually did get to know them, like that’s a cool thing to know.

Christopher: You shouldn’t have any kind of stereotype stuck to us because they don’t know us. Cause we all act different.

Rebecca: We’re not just like skaters, whatever. We’re all…we’re all our own person.

Frank: I find that the easiest way to get along with people you don’t understand is to let them know how…how you are and why you listen to things and open up your mind to them, because they’re not as much different than you are. They just may listen to different music. You know, people are people. They pretty much have the same emotions as I do and anybody else.

Dave: It feels strange to say hello to someone at times maybe because of the friends that they’re with. They don’t think you should talk to that person. Like they don’t think you should go say hello to people, whatever. You know, so that makes you feel uncomfortable because, you know, you don’t want to seem like you’re letting your boys down.

Daniel: If that person can be friends, don’t say ___________________ . You get above that. You say hello anyway. What are your friends going to do? Are they going to disregard you just because you said hello to somebody that’s different in the hallway.

Teen Girl: It makes me feel good if somebody I didn’t know was just like, ‘Hey, how you doing?’ You know? It’s cool, you know. They’re a cool person.

Missy: I think once people get out into the real world, it’s like a shocker, you know. It’s like reality check in spots. It’s not the same as it used to be. I’ve heard stories about going back to reunions and, you know, people who were dorks in high school that are the ones that end up being the most attractive because they’re the ones that have made the most of themselves.

Eliza: Yeah, it’s so true.

Normal is not something to aspire to,
it’s something to get away from
--Jodie Foster

Juli: I think finding yourself is basically accepting who you are instead of trying to change yourself for other people. It’s always going to be hard to actually try to get out of my timid shell and go talk to people. Of course, I think about things a lot first and then I say, ‘No, it doesn’t matter. I’ll just go for it.’

This above all: to thine own self be true
--William Shakespeare

Jerry: What were some reactions to the kids in the show? Did they remind you of anybody that you go to school? Did you find yourself judging thembased on their looks, clothes, interests?

Cassidy: Do you think cliques will always be a part of high school and you just have to get used to them or do you think we can break them down little by little?

Jerry: I think, unfortunately, cliques will be around for…forever. I mean, all over the world, you get these little pool pockets of people hanging and pretty much ostracizing everybody around them. The big thing is you should just be aware of them and been cooler than that. You don’t have to designate yourself with one group of people. It’s a lot more fun to meet a bunch of different people.

Cassidy: Yeah. Do you have any advice for someone that feels out of place in school or get teased a lot?

Jerry: Yeah, you know, I mean, nobody has an easy time growing up. It’s always a tough gig, but, you know, as you get older, you get a little more self assured and it gets easier, believe me. Just remember this: a person is much more than the way they dress, who their friends are and how they spend their free time. Keep an open mind.

Cassidy: So take some time to look behind the labels. You might be surprised at what you find.

If you’d like to share your experiences, opinions, ideas about dealing with cliques and labels, or if you have any ideas for new shows, send us an e-mail at inthemix@pbs.org.

Jerry: Now, you can find lots more info about our show by checking out our website at inthemix.org.

Cassidy: Who did you like in high school? What kind of kids did you hang out with?

Jerry: I really wasn’t designated to one specific clique. I really…I bounced around a lot. You know, I think it’s pretty wrong to pigeonhole yourself in one group and I had a lot of fun not designating myself to one, you know, specific clique.

Cassidy: Did you ever see kids being mean to other kids?

Jerry: Well, yeah, there’s really a lot of teasing going on. You know, I was—I was teased a lot. I was a little heavy as a kid, you know. You know you just take it in stride.

Cassidy: Your first movie role was Frank in STAND BY ME. A lot of kids could identify with Frank cause he was picked on a lot, even by his own friends. How close to Frank’s situation to your own at that age?

Jerry: I was definitely picked on as a kid. You know, I never really let it get me down that much. I was fortunate enough I had a brother who I always went to school with and he was always backing me up. But I think everyone gets picked on to…to a degree, and I think the trick is to realize that it is just teasing and you can’t really get to you.

Cassidy: Another role you played was Trip McNealy, a popular kid who had a rude awakening once he got to college. Do you think this happens a lot?

Jerry: Yeah. When I went to college, it was sort of a very rude awakening because you go from being seniors to being the freshman again and it’s definitely a step backward. But, you know, once again, it comes down to that how you handle people getting on your nerves and teasing you. I never really let it get to me that seriously. You know, I mean, using the old adage: I’m rubber, you’re glue. Whatever you say bounces off me and sticks to YOU.

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