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Tavis: As we continue our celebration of the 50th anniversary of the "Brown vs. Board of Education" ruling, I'm delighted to have Blair Underwood and documentary filmmaker Sharon Baker with us tonight. The two have teamed up on a documentary coinciding with the anniversary, called "With All Deliberate Speed: The Legacy of Brown vs. Board." The documentary airs this month on select PBS stations, with public screenings scheduled as well. Here is a scene from "With All Deliberate Speed."

Blair Underwood: By this time, the Legal Defense Fund was overwhelmed with litigation. Marshall himself would no longer be able to spearhead each case. Moreover, he and the team determined that the best strategy for dismantling school segregation once and for all would be to present a single argument to the Supreme Court in an alignment of suits that would become known as "Brown vs. the Board of Education of Topeka."

Tavis: Blair, Sharon, nice to see you both. I can't touch you, Sharon, but, Blair, I can shake your hand. I'll wave at you. Thanks for coming on, and thanks for the wonderful piece. I think there aren't enough opportunities--with all of the conversations being had, there aren't enough opportunities for us to converse and to talk about the significance of this seminal case, "Brown v. Board," particularly for young people. And I want to get to your documentary in just a second. Let me start, though, Sharon, by suggesting to you that everybody I've talked to--left, right, Republican, Democrat, liberal, conservative--everybody agrees 50 years later on this one thing, that there is an unfinished agenda of "Brown v. Board." For you, what is that unfinished agenda?

Sharon Baker: Well, it's huge. 50 years after the decision, a great number of our children are still lagging behind consistently in testing, and this is the wealthiest nation on Earth, the strongest nation on Earth, and we're leaving a large part of our citizenry behind.

Tavis: Blair, for you, what's the significance of having this conversation 50 years later around this notion of there being an unfinished agenda?

Blair: I think just for the same reason. I mean, you know, I have 3 young kids. You know, for us, education is very important. You know, growing up, we were--we had access to that education, and the reality is that enough kids today don't have that. So you know, I like making noise, and refocusing is what you do so well. But to refocus the attention on education and not leaving our kids behind in a very real sense.

Tavis: Right. I know you have 3 kids. Sharon, you've got kids and grandkids.

Sharon: I do.

Tavis: Let me stay with this notion of the kids here just for a second, Blair. I was in a conversation the other day, Sharon, with some adults who have--I don't have kids yet, but they were talking about their kids, and one of them was telling a story that I've heard any number of times about their black kids who were being teased and being taunted by some other black kids at school for acting white. I'm sure you both have heard this. Their black kids were being teased by other black kids for acting white. Acting white because they were getting good grades, because they were studying, because they were like standout, stellar students in the classroom. For that, they were taunted and teased for acting white, to which I said, of course, you know, if getting good grades and being smart is acting white, then how do you act dumb--how do you act black? Like an idiot or acting dumb? But how do you raise kids in an environment where they get taunted and teased 50 years after "Brown v. Board" for getting good grades?

Sharon: Well, it's more than that. It's 140 years after the Civil War and Reconstruction, and that's where the film starts. And in fact, the scholars that speak in the film talk about the fact that education was the one thing that mattered when people were freed. The people were willing to give their lives for the right to be educated. And so this whole myth that today being educated is acting white is something that our scholars addressed--Julian Bond, in particular--you know, saying to the students, you know, get over this. Succeeding is what matters for everyone here. Learning.

Tavis: So, Blair, Paris comes home one day and says, "Daddy, you know, they've been teasing me at school for acting white, because I'm studying, I'm getting good grades." What do you say to Paris or the other 2 kids, for that matter?

Blair: Daddy needs to go to school and jack some kids up, then.

Tavis: Daddy's going to jack somebody up.

Sharon: But you know what? That won't happen to his children, because they are growing up in a home where their mother and father read to them and where they see their parents valuing education, and that's another big issue, that you know, is being brought to the public eye with the "Brown" anniversary, that is the need to refocus our kids on reading and to reinstill the value of reading.

Blair: Right. But your point is well taken, 'cause you're dealing with an environment and society. The other kids may not be feeling that or necessarily have that. They do in this school, but not always. Another dynamic to that is just with mainstream popular culture, you know, to show--not just to show, it's already there--that to be educated and to be articulate and intelligent can also be cool. Look at yourself. Perfect example--Cornell West, Michael Eric Dyson, the show that you take on road. You look at P Diddy, for that matter. I mean, that's a brilliant businessman. You know, there's certain style and flavor to it, but there's intelligence, there's education that's worked all throughout those careers.

Tavis: Sharon, you make this point about the importance of parental involvement and how that conversation--Again, I'm fascinated by this anniversary, because there's so many issues, so many conversations that ought to be had, as I said earlier, around this anniversary, and we don't normally get into these conversations in this country, I think, the way we should. But I've learned personally, as I've traveled around this country speaking at schools, and you've done the same thing. For me at least, there's one thing I'm certain of. There are a lot of things we can debate around how to turn around the crisis that public education is enduring right now, but I'm certain of one thing, that the schools that do best in this country are the schools where parents are involved. And yet around this anniversary, I'm not hearing a lot of conversation, Sharon, about the need for parental involvement if we're ever going to complete that unfinished agenda of "Brown v. Board."

Sharon: It's huge, though, and it's so complex. That is one of the issues. Another issue is the way history has and has not been taught. For example, Charles Hamilton Houston, the architect of the strategy that overturned "Plessy" and enable the Legal Defense Fund to succeed. Who really knew about Charles Hamilton Houston prior to this present conversation? How many, as one of our scholars said, black American intellectuals are there, tens, hundreds that we weren't taught about when we were in school? Children need to be inspired in the classroom, and so we need to, our scholars say, revamp the way we teach history to our students. We also need to do something about funding in terms of equalizing opportunity for our children once they get to school. We can't control what goes on in the home. We can suggest to parents that they read, that they set the example by turning off the television, sorry about that, and reading to the children more. And modeling, as you do, for your children. But you know, we can't go in the home and really kind of flip that around.

Tavis: Well, you raised the issue of funding, and I should mention please do turn off the TV, but during this half-hour, not right now. Not about right now.

Sharon: It's not this program. This one's fine.

Tavis: I appreciate that. Well, you raised the issue of funding. Again, back to one of these debates, 'cause everybody is using this anniversary to make their own political points. Everybody again, as I said, agrees there is an unfinished agenda, but what that agenda is and how we accomplish completing that agenda raises all kinds of political questions for debate. But you mention funding, one of those issues at the top of the list people debate about. People say all the time, Sharon, with all due respect to you, that the way to solve the public education crisis is not to throw more money at the problem. Yet here you are talking about money again.

Sharon: Well, Tavis, one of the scholars that we interview was an author and activist named Jonathan Kozol, and he tells the story of speaking to a man who sent his children to Exeter, a very expensive private school, and he says, "Hey, throwing money at it seems to work it for your kids," but why, when it comes to poor children, you know, can't we see that, you know, there is a need to provide sort of these basic quality materials, experienced teachers, a building where the roof doesn't leak, so that when children come to school, no matter what they're coming from, they're in an environment where they are at least able to develop?

Tavis: Blair, you know that one of the things I've admired about your career is that you've been so good about the quality of roles, the choices of roles that you have taken. Be it a doctor on "City of Angels" or a lawyer on "L.A. Law," you're always taking on the right kinds of roles to put forth that image not just to your kids, but indeed to black viewers and other viewers around the country. Over the last few years, though, we've celebrated a number of historic occasions in black America. We had the 35th anniversary of James Baldwin's book, "The Fire Next Time;" the 100th anniversary of DuBois' book, "The Souls of Black Folk;" last year, the 40th anniversary of the march on Washington; and now the 50th anniversary of "Brown v. Board." Of all the roles that you could have taken, all the things you could have done, why this one? Why work on this project?

Blair: To narrate this, as a narrator?

Tavis: Sure.

Blair: You know, funny you mention that. My kids are young. There are very few things that I have done, especially recently, "Sex and the City," and some other things that--that my kids will not be watching.

Tavis: They didn't see "Sex in the City." They didn't see daddy do that.

Blair: No.

Tavis: But I saw you.

Blair: Well, not for a long time. But you know, to be able to do something--I said this to you early on. We had done one documentary before this, prior to this.

Sharon: With the Underground Railroad, where you played William Still.

Blair: And one of the things I said to you then was I want to be able to do projects that my kids can watch and be proud of and also, you know, educate to them at the same time.

Tavis: Yeah. To that point, though, Sharon, how do we get people? See, the thing about the point I tried to raise with Blair a second ago, the 40th anniversary of the march on Washington is easier, it seems to me. You're a documentarian. I'm not. Seems easier to talk about, because there's so much visual. You know, you can see the march, and we love Dr. King's "I Have a Dream" speech, et cetera, et cetera. "Brown v. Board" happened inside a cavernous courtroom. How do you get that, that significant moment, that seminal moment again, that happened in that courtroom to translate to young people so that they understand what "Brown v. Board's" importance was all about? How do you do that?

Sharon: Well, we took this continuity of information. We began with post-Civil War. But then the last 15 minutes of the program, we are in public high schools today, talking to real students and real teachers about their concerns and their needs, and I think it's pretty compelling. And then all of the excess information is on a big web site where viewers can go and access a lot of information, from bibliography and more comments from the scholars to what teachers think and what students think.

Blair: What's the web address? What's the web address.

Sharon: Can I plug it?

Tavis: Sure you can.

Sharon: It's brownvboard.info. 3 Ws, brownvboard.info.

Tavis: Let me close with a question I could have began with, and that is the title, "With All Deliberate Speed." For those who don't know all the background of the story, why the title, "With All Deliberate Speed?"

Sharon: Well, there were actually 2 "Brown" cases, the one in 1954, and then of course they waited a year because they were afraid the South would freak out about this decision, and they needed to put a plan together. So when they finally came down with a decision, they instructed schools to implement this "with all deliberate speed."

Tavis: And here we are 50 years later still waiting for that implementation to happen. Blair, nice to see you. Sharon, congratulations. Nice to see you, as well. Thanks for coming on. "With All Deliberate Speed." I hope it's on your PBS station in your neck of the woods. Check it out if it is. You will be empowered and enlightened by this documentary. Thank you for watching. That's our show for tonight. As always, you can catch me on the radio on NPR, and I'll see you back here next time on PBS. Until then, thanks for watching. Good night from L.A., and keep the faith.

Captioning made possible by KCET Public Television and the U.S. Department of Education.

Captioned by the National Captioning Institute. www.ncicap.org.