E-mail a friendRep. Barbara Lee
airdate August 5, 2004
Elected to the U.S. House of Representatives in '98, California's Barbara Lee continued a career of public service that began when she became a Congressional intern for the district she now represents. She garnered national attention as one of Congress' most vocal opponents to the Iraq War. Lee sits on the Appropriations committee and co-chairs the Progressive Caucus. She previously served in the state legislature. She chronicles her rise to power in her autobiography, Renegade for Peace & Justice.
Rep. Barbara Lee
Tavis: So your microphone's open now, so if you wanna say, "I told you so," you can say that.
Lee: I'm not gonna say that because let me tell you, right after 9/11, of course, the horrific attacks, the deaths, the suffering, the despair that was upon us really required, I thought, a very thoughtful response. Yes, we needed to and I insist that we bring terrorism to a halt, we deal with terrorists in a way that's effective, but in no way could I grant any president the authority to use force forever against unnamed enemies forever, and that is exactly what occurred, and I just believe that that was the wrong decision to take. At that moment, I believed we should have, as I said on the floor, step back, try to understand the nature of the threat, and respond appropriately, and do not engage in any actions that would create any more havoc and more violence on the world and especially on America.
Tavis: Take me back 3 years ago when you when you cast that lone dissenting vote, because, as I recall, I remember this very well, you were persona non grata. You were vilified. You had to have police protection because of the death threats that were made against your life because you were the only member of Congress who didn't give the President what he wanted in this arena of hoopla and patriotism. And now Michael Moore has made $100 million with a movie saying the same thing that you said. John Kerry spent 70% of his speech talking about what you said. So you're kind of like Robert McNamara, who finally came around years later to admitting that Vietnam was wrong. But you were there before anybody else, but take me back a few months--a few years, rather, to what it was like during those days when you had police protection because you were the only person to vote your conscience in that way.
Lee: Those were, of course, difficult days not only for myself, but, again, for the families and the victims of those who had been killed. I think, as I look back upon those times, you know, it was very sad, first of all, to see that there are those in our country who don't understand that dissent is patriotic, that voicing one's opinion, debating issues is central to our democracy, and we have a duty and a responsibility to engage in that kind of debate, especially when we're under such assault. And I was quite amazed and appalled at those that didn't understand what democracy was about. My dad, 25 years in the military. I'm as patriotic as the next person and will stand by that any day. Those that came after me--again, the right wing is very alive and well in America, and it's unfortunate that the right wing talk show hosts pumped up those out there--
Tavis: And they poured money into your campaign to defeat you.
Lee: They did. But, you know, we had to run hard, and we ran hard and we won by over 80% of the vote. But it's because people understood what I said, and rallied around in terms of supporting me in my district.
Tavis: So your constituents never wavered in their support for you?
Lee: My constituents did not waver. Of course, they were traumatized just like the rest of the country, but when they read that resolution, Tavis, and when I went home and we talked about what took place, the wording of the resolution, what it meant short term, long term, they understood very well that while it was a tough decision and while, yes, I was the only one, that that was the correct decision, and one must--I think even those who didn't agree with me, uh, told me in their own way that they appreciated just my taking a stand and saying what I thought should have been the appropriate response.
Tavis: I mentioned a few moments ago that John Kerry spent a great deal of his speech at the democratic convention, as you know, talking about the war on terror and how he would be a better Commander-in-Chief than President George W. Bush. Uh, he didn't get a real bump out of the convention, but what he did do was close the gap with Americans who believe now that he is perhaps better equipped than George Bush to at least be the Commander-in-Chief. Um, what did you make of what he had to say? And, obviously, you're a Democrat, but do you believe that John Kerry is better equipped, uh, to be Commander-in-Chief than George Bush on this issue?
Lee: I absolutely believe that John Kerry is better equipped. First of all, he's seen death and destruction and dying in Vietnam. He understands there's a very serious nature of making decisions to send our young men and women into war. If you look at what's going on now, we have nearly a thousand of our young men and women dead, a countless number of Iraqi civilians, a countless number of our own men and women in uniform, uh, injured for life. And I don't believe John Kerry would risk, uh, going to war unnecessarily as President Bush has done. And, in fact, John Kerry, uh, I think he said in his speech, would really look at the appropriate ways to deal with terrorism, and that does not mean waging war against any country forever.
Tavis: Let me ask you what you make of the fact that there hasn't been much debate...even from your Democratic colleagues, who we suspect it might come from were it to ever come...but there's not been any real debate about the notion that President Bush has shifted our policy of military engagement not of one--from one of being reactive when we think that we need to be, uh, to one of a pre-emptive strike. What do you make of this whole notion that we now have as our basic policy coming out of the White House of pre-emptive strike? "If we think you gonna hit us, we hit you first."
Lee: That is a very flawed and dangerous foreign policy, Tavis. In fact, when Bush came up with this doctrine of pre-emption, the use of first strike...and this is a very serious foreign policy-- military policy initiative whereas you can strike first based upon a perceived future threat. Well, I introduced a resolution actually disavowing the doctrine of pre-emption and saying that we should not use first strike to prevent what we see as perceived future threats. We have maybe 30 co-sponsors on it, but I'll tell you one thing. I'm gonna continue with this resolution. We're going to continue to provide alternatives, and I believe at some point when Senator Kerry is elected President that we will be able to repeal this doctrine of pre-emption and use of first strike. It does not make the world any safer; it does not make America any safer. It promotes more terrorism, and it makes the world a more dangerous place.
Tavis: Let me shift gears quick because my time is running here. Um, I mentioned Michael Moore earlier, and there's big debate about whether or not his film "Fahrenheit 9/11" is gonna impact this election and all the other documentaries coming out now. Um, but you are behind, um, the idea that the U.N. needs to come in and monitor U.S. elections. Now, again, a lot of folks are saying, "Barbara Lee done lost her mind to be asking for some organization outside of the U.S.A. to come monitor our elections."
Lee: Let me say, it's not just Barbara Lee. It's 12, 13, 14 members of Congress. Congresswoman Eddie Bernice Johnson has led us on this effort very valiantly, I must say. I monitored elections in South Africa and Nigeria. In fact, when I monitored the presidential elections in Nigeria, Secretary of State Colin Powell was with me. We want to make sure that elections are transparent, they're fair, and they're free.
Tavis: But we're America. Come on, we don't need that.
Lee: Yeah, but we know our election was stolen in 2000. And so we're America, yes. We're the greatest democracy in the world, so why not allow international monitors to come in and look at our elections and look at what happened? We can't afford to lose one vote. People died for the right to vote, and I say we need international monitors, we need the Carter Center, we need everyone here, we need our lawyers, our labor union members, everyone monitoring these elections, and we're gonna do that.
Tavis: We got about 20 seconds left. What's your sense of how this race is gonna play out between now and November? Does Kerry really have a shot?
Lee: Kerry has a shot, and he's gonna win, but, you know, it's gonna be because the black community, the Latino community, the Asian community, the progressive community, Democrats, moderates, uh, decline to states come out and vote for Senator Kerry. And we're going to organize, we're gonna register people to vote. I participated in a hip-hop summit in Boston during the convention. Many, many millions of young people are out there. Women. We're gonna form a massive coalition and make sure that never again will we allow an election to be stolen, and we're going to disband this Bush-Cheney-Halliburton-Enron regime.
Tavis: Congresswoman, nice to see you. You're welcome back here anytime. Up next on this program, the talented creator of "Six Feet Under," Oscar winner Alan Ball. Stay with us.
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