MONDAY
E-mail a friendJasmine Guy
airdate September 13, 2004
A former dancer with the Alvin Ailey dance theater, Jasmine Guy earned TV stardom on the sitcom, A Different World. She moved on to other notable big and small screen roles and to Broadway. Guy and slain rapper Tupac Shakur were friends, and she remains close to his mother. This year, she added 'author' to her résumé with the book, Afeni Shakur: Evolution of a Revolutionary. Guy can be seen in Showtime's drama, Dead Like Me.
Jasmine Guy
Tavis: I'm delighted to have 4 dear friends with me tonight to help celebrate my 40th birthday, all of whom are 40 themselves or will soon be, Mr. Kendall. First up, primetime television fixture, Blair Underwood. Earlier tonight, his latest TV series 'LAX' premiered on NBC. Up next, the beautiful and awfully talented Jasmine Guy, the former star of 'A Different World.' Yeah, Jasmine, 40, y'all. She currently stars in the Showtime series 'Dead Like Me.' This next guy is certainly not a TV star, but he's an awfully good executive producer. His name is Neal Kendall, and he is the E.P. of this show, and for that matter, other notable shows before I came and rescued him, and finally--and finally, my dear and abiding friend, actor Wren T. Brown, most recently starred on the NBC sitcom 'Whoopi.' Welcome to each of you.
Jasmine Guy: Hey!
Blair Underwood: And happy birthday!
Tavis: Happy birthday! Whoo whoo! [Laughs] Jasmine, let me start with you. Ladies first. Notice that you are the only woman of 5 of us on this panel because so often women don't want to admit that they're 40. Here you are, puttin' all your business on national television.
Jasmine: I was very happy to turn 40.
Tavis: Uh-huh.
Jasmine: I am 30. But I think--
Tavis: You know, the truth of the matter--that's an honest question. It's a legitimate question and my honest answer is when I turned 39 last year, I did start trippin'. But because my entire life, Dr. King was always my hero. I mean, he was, you know, basically dead by the time I could walk. But I've always, you know, studied and learned and read everything about him. When I first met Coretta Scott King years ago, I was speechless. The only time in my life I couldn't say nothing. Wren has never had that problem. But I was speechless for just one second when I met Coretta Scott King because of who she was, who her husband was. I raise that because Dr. King died, as you know, was assassinated at 39. So when I turned 39 last year, I started asking myself if I really--am I really doing with my life what I'm supposed to be doing? What's my legacy going to be? So I started trippin' about a year ago. But as I got closer to 40, I was cool. How about you, Wren?
Wren T. Brown: You know, for my life, I always wanted--I had 3 primary goals as I moved into my adulthood. I wanted to be a working actor. I wanted--
Tavis: I thought you were gonna say Evan, Morgan, and Brandon, your 3 babies. But I was just teasing you.
Wren: Yes, those 3 achievements.
Tavis: Yes.
Wren: But I always wanted to be a working actor. I wanted to be a parent, and I wanted to be a husband, and I've been married now 13 years as of October 12th. We've been blessed with 3 extraordinary children, Evan, Morgan, and Brandon. 11 on the 17th of September, 7 and 4 years old, and I've been a working actor without having the opportunity to wait a table for 22 years now.
Tavis: Now, I know Ann, and Ann's your wife. If Ann were here, she'd say you ain't made it to October 13th yet.
Wren: That's right. October 12th.
Tavis: October 12th.
Wren: See, that's right. It's not October yet. So don't claim 13 years.
Tavis: Yeah, so, Blair, you're just handsome as ever, and everybody watching--the sisters know that.
Blair: Oh, God bless you, brother.
Tavis: Did you start trippin' when you got close to 4-zero?
Blair: You know what? Not really. I kind of embraced it. Like Wren said, I was--I'm glad to be a husband and a father and have 3 beautiful kids like Wren. But also, I look at the fact that I'm still alive, and fact, a lot of--especially African-American men in America, especially in this city, don't make it to 40. So I mean, I just really focused on that. To make it to 40, to make it to that point of life, and to just really embrace it. So I didn't trip too hard. I got some gray hairs up in there now. But I didn't trip too hard.
Tavis: Well, it's lookin' good. ‘Cause I can't see it from here.
Blair: Got a little dye up in there.
Tavis: Yeah, I can't see it from here. Neal, did you start trippin'? Neal always trips. That's what E.P.s do. But that's not the issue.
Neal Kendall: No, but here's the problem. With all the criteria that Wren just laid out, I'm a miserable failure. I'm single. I have no children, you know, no loved ones. You know, family. But, you know, not a wife. Not a family. Not children, and I feel like a failure.
Tavis: Stop, stop, ‘cause you're calling me a failure, too.
Neal: Well, you know, but listening to Wren talk about it, it makes me realize that I'm 40 and I don't have the things that I thought all my life I would have at this age. So, uh...
Wren: Well, I would suggest that you didn't fervently desire them. Because you are handsome, you're very successful in your career, and you just haven't found that wonderful lady.
Neal: No, no, I'm a disaster.
Tavis: How much pressure?
Neal: Wait. Hold on. You know, the problem with putting a producer out here is the producer's gonna take up the show. Second, actually, real quickly, I think we may have a special phone call for you, Tavis, and let me see if I can get this. Caller, are you there right now?
Woman: I am.
Tavis: A call for me?
Neal: Go ahead, caller.
Dr. Maya Angelou: 40. The first 40 years are the hardest. Tavis, this is Maya Angelou...
Tavis: Oh, my God.
Maya: wishing you everything. I know you're a man to meet these mountains--the mountains of the next 40 years. You have met some incredible mountains, climbed them and held the banner high. God bless your heart. God bless your laughter, your wit, your intelligence, your courage, and your love. You are a great black man, and you're growing into a greater one. Happy birthday.
Tavis: Dr. Maya, I love you dearly, as you well know. I'm almost in tears here. My producers pulled this over on me, and they knew that there was nobody I'd rather hear from on this special day than you, and after I heard you say 2 words, we all gasped on the set. ‘Cause when you hear that voice, you know it's Dr. Maya. So I love you, and thank you so much for calling, and if I can just make just a scintilla of the contribution to this country that you've made, I will have lived a decent life. So thank you, and I love you dearly.
Maya: I love you dearly, and thanks to your guests. Because they're very intelligent, because they love you, and they have achieved so much themselves. God bless you.
Tavis: Thank you, Doc.
Maya: All right. Love you.
Tavis: Bye-bye now. All right, well, we still got 14 minutes left. I don't know where we go after that.
Jasmine: That was a nice move, Mr. Producer.
Blair: Yeah, that totally was kinda smooth.
Tavis: Yeah, that was smooth.
Neal: I had a lot of help.
Jasmine: You know, it's interesting for me to hear the male perspective about the marriage and the baby thing. ‘Cause, of course, the pressure is so obvious on women, and it switched on me after I turned 30. My mama just switched on me, you know? I'm growing up with Gloria Steinem, and she's like, 'When are you gonna give me grandbabies?' I didn't even know who she was.
Tavis: How much pressure your mama putting on you right now? ‘Cause I'm catching it.
Neal: No, a lot. My family's from the South, originally from Alabama, and my parents got married when they were 18, and I think about where they were at 40, which was that they had 3 children, 2 of whom were about to graduate college. One was in high school. And they were already looking forward to their life, you know, after having kids leave the nest, basically, and I haven't even gotten a kid in the nest yet. So I just think about, you know, the difference between our generations, especially with them growing up in the South. So I get a lot of pressure, and, uh--
Jasmine: The life is being constantly redefined.
Neal: Yeah.
Jasmine: I mean, we are really living individual lives now. We don't have to carry on the cookie-cutter way of being happy and purposeful, and this was the argument I had with my mom. I was like, 'This may not happen for me, Mommy, and I'm not going to carry that into my thirties.' I have something to offer somebody, and it may not--I mean, I have great joy in my marriage and with my child. But I didn't think it was gonna happen, and I was OK. I was gonna be--I'd do something. I'd be something to somebody.
Tavis: Wren, have you struggled at all with--I should have raised it earlier--have you struggled personally with the notion of legacy, with the notion of purpose and calling and what your life is supposed to be? Have you struggled with that at all or do you feel like you're in the zone on what you're supposed to be doing here on planet earth?
Wren: Tavis, I feel like I'm in the zone. I've always desired--I was saying this to Jasmine in the green room--I've always desired to be a whole person, and a part of being a whole person, for me, was developing myself and then embracing someone, having someone as a mate, a person who could run the long distance, really run that marathon with you. I have found that in Ann. I found that, you know, those many years ago--August 9, 1989, when I met her and we literally have been inseparable from that day to this, and then we were blessed with these children, and I'm constantly working in my career, doing the thing that I love to do, and so I do feel, you know, 'Ephesians' 4:1 --'I therefore serve unto the Lord, beseech thee that ye walk worthy of the chosen vocation wherewith ye were called.' I believe that as a communicator, I feel like I'm right in the zone in terms of my communicative prowess and how it's continuing to develop, so I looked at 40 and I embraced it with open arms.
Tavis: Anybody had the thought that--honestly--that it goes downhill from here?
Blair: Oh, can't say I went there just because, I mean, that's just--I choose to take the positive road.
Tavis: I mean, folk--let's be honest about it, Blair. Folk are afraid to get older. I mean, we're living longer and that's a good thing, I think, but people do, in fact, fear the whole notion of just getting older. And 40 is like the first time you really realize that--well, maybe except for Jasmine, but 40 is--this is the first time in my life I actually was confronted or faced, at least, the issue that I am aging. The life expectancy for black men--you know, George Wallace tells a joke, as you know, you don't know why black men should pay Social Security ‘cause we don't live to be 65 to collect in the first place.
Blair: You know, I don't think I approached it with dread, but I think definitely, especially coming up to 40, I do start seeing certain things. That's the joke, man. I do see gray hairs, like, that I never saw, I'm thinking maybe 3 weeks ago, I'm seeing more gray hairs now. Things like prostate cancer checks, things that they say, when you hit 40, you have to check every year, annually, and all those kind of things, so you become more aware of it and things you could do 5 years ago physically I'm not able to do like I was--can't believe I'm admitting this, but it is the truth, so you are confronted with the fact that your body is aging, but I just try not to trip on it and focus on it too much.
Tavis: Are you feeling older?
Neal: Well, I'm going to answer that in just one second. I have one other phone call, I believe, here and then we'll wrap it up, we'll get back to your question, but I believe we have one more call for you, Tavis. Caller, are you there?
Man: I'm here.
Neal: Yes, go right ahead. Talk to Tavis.
Sidney Poitier: this is Sidney Poitier here.
Tavis: Mr. Poit--ha ha ha! Mr. Poitier, how are you, sir?
Poitier: I'm quite well, my good sir, and I was listening in for a moment there as you guys discussed the wonders of being 40. Yes. Well, let me tell you, hurry up and enjoy it because you'll soon be 77.
Tavis: What do you know about that? You're not yet 40.
Poitier: Oh, my goodness sakes. I am almost twice 40.
Tavis: I should tell the audience right quick, and I don't want to divulge too much, but Wren and I and certainly Blair--I recall Blair sitting in Mr. Poitier's box when he received that Lifetime Achievement from the Academy, so Blair's had the chance to have a relationship with Mr. Poitier, Wren and I oftentimes have lunch with Mr. Poitier, and I don't want to speak for Blair and Wren, I'll let them say a word, but we have all been so fortunate, Mr. Poitier, to have had you as an example and to have had access to you as we approach 40 to kind of develop our own lives and our own careers and fashion the contribution we're going to make in the life that Mr. Poitier has. Wren.
Wren: His humanity is so transcendent, and I'm blessed beyond measure to have had Mr. Poitier in my life and the way that he has been in my life across a decade now. I mean, just a man of immutable principle, supreme dignity, grace, integrity, and he is a standard bearer, I think, for all people. I don't think that it has black specificity. I don't think it has gender specificity. He is a man truly for all ages, and I'm exceedingly thankful to know him.
Tavis: Blair.
Blair: Yes. Just ditto. He's a treasure to us, of course, in America and in cinema and he's been so kind to us personally, but what a gift for him to call, ‘cause he's trying to deflect right now. But to call on your birthday and giveo
Poitier: Well, the three of you are examples for me that I can take to my grave and find a peaceful rest because I will know that I left behind me such remarkable young men and at the very young age of 40, you indeed have 43 times yet to come, and work that you will do, if it reflects the work you've done, it will move the world to a much higher and better place.
Tavis: Mr. Poitier, we're always honored to be in your presence and just almost speechless that you took the time to call, but we thank you, we love you, and hope to see you over lunch sometime soon.
Poitier: Thank you, and a very happy birthday to you, good sirs.
Tavis: Thank you, Mr. Poitier.
Poitier: Right-o.
Tavis: Oh, my God.
Neal: That's all the tricks I've got in my bag.
Tavis: Yeah? What you got next? Yeah. does God call next? I mean, what happens next? I'm sorry, Blair.
Blair: No, no. But you talked about tripping at 39. We haven't had a chance to talk in a heart-to-heart approaching 40, really, but I hope you see and I hope you know in your heart--I mean, look at the people--Dr. Angelou calling and Mr. Poitier and others--how much you've affected people and touched people, so you've been a blessing to all of us.
Tavis: Yeah.
Blair: So God bless you.
Tavis: I appreciate that. Jasmine, what do you envision--I don't want to get too personal here, but what do you see for the other side of 40 for you? Have you set new goals? Do you have new dreams, new aspirations? I mean, has anything changed as you approach this?
Jasmine: I'm in a period of transition. I'm not sure what it is, but I feel it--I'm sorry, I was really moved by your phone calls.
Tavis: You and me both.
Jasmine: Sorry.
Tavis: That's all right.
Jasmine: They're certain people I've always loved in my life, and I want to find the other stuff that makes me who I am. I have focused so much on the performing art of what I do, so I've written a book, as you know. I would like to write more. I'm just been very open right now to listening and being a part and not being caught up in my own preconceptions of what my life was going to be, ‘cause I have been wrong. I see in the last 3 or 4 years and just with the birth of my child that I was perhaps wrong about what I thought I was gonna do and be by now, so I'm very excited. I don't know what is going to be, but I hope that I can rise to the occasion and rise to the her...s in my life that do inspire me.
Tavis: Speaking of the her...s of our life, Wren, to Jasmine's point--I'm just as moved as Jasmine is and just trying to hold it together here for the next 5 minutes--when you have a phone call and I'm humbled, obviously, and, Blair, I thank you, when Maya Angelou calls you to wish you a happy birthday and Sidney Poitier calls you to wish you a happy birthday, you have 2 authentic American her...s here in Sidney Poitier and Maya Angelou. I'm humbled by the phone call, but it also makes me wonder whether or not our generation, Wren, is living up to the expectation. I mean, their generation made such a significant contribution so that we could be sitting here today with a TV show that I own. And Blair starring on primetime and Jasmine's on cable and you've been on 'Whoopi' and, I mean, we--and Neal--I mean, we have benefited greatly, as you said, black or white, from the sacrifice of generations past. What are they gonna say about our generation? Have we made any significant contribution to making this country and the world a better place to live as a generation of people?
Wren: You know, I don't know about the generation, but I can speak with absolute specificity to you, which, if I may, I want to turn the tables to you for a moment. Tavis, your sense of community, I think, makes Dr. Angelou and Mr. Poitier exceedingly proud and all people of their generation. You know, you have always had a philosophy of, 'I'm not for you because you're for me, I am for you because you are me,' and I'm very proud of that. Every time you take to airwaves, whether it's on your radio show at NPR or whether it's here on PBS or out in, you know, the convention just last week, you are such a brilliant representative as a part of our anti-defamation league as black people, you're an extraordinary representative, and so, I think that the fact that the impact that you're having on the succeeding generation, the impact that you're having on your peers, I think is a very, very serious impact and I do think that there are a lot of people who are doing very, very positive things to carry us positively into the future. I don't know if there's a collective consciousness or if the total generation is grabbing hold of the things, of the halcyon days of the forties and fifties and the civil rights movement, but I certainly know that there are significant numbers who are trying to strike slavery a metaphorical blow.
Tavis: Wren--Neal, I'm sorry. You and Wren look so much alike, I got you confused for a couple seconds. Do you feel, aside from the pressure your mama's putting on you--we're both catching that--do you feel any pressure at all at this point in your career whats...ver? I mean, just set that aside for the moment. I know we were joking about that earlier.
Neal: Career pressure?
Tavis: Any pressure. Turning 40, do you feel pressured at all?
Neal: No. Not really. No. Not really. You know, I'm, you know, I think somebody said earlier, you kind of, you know, you make the road for yourself and you just sort of learn to live with it and, you know, I'm happy with where I am and what I'm doing. You know, you make the best of it, but I will ask a question on behalf of your dear mother. When are you getting married?
Tavis: You know what? Shut up. Don't start that. No. Stop the hatin'.
Neal: But I mean--
Tavis: Stop the hatin'.
Neal: Let's answer now. We've got all your friends here.
Tavis: Here's my answer to camera one. Right after you, Neal.
Neal: Let's do a double wedding.
Tavis: Ha ha ha! Yeah. Can we get a discount in Vegas for a double wedding at the little wedding chapel or something?
Neal: Absolutely.
Tavis: OK. Let me ask you this right quick, and everybody be honest with me, what is--there's got--everything ain't roses now. We ain't been honest about this. What's the worst thing about turning 40? Is it the gray hair, Blair? There's got to be something you don't like about it, something you don't like about turning 40.
Blair: I've probably got 30 years less of a life that I want to live. I mean, I'm just--I really--
Tavis: That's a good answer.
Blair: I'm really am just enjoying family and that just means I got maybe 30 years less than--
Tavis: For me, I can't eat everything I want to eat.
Jasmine: I was gonna say fat.
Tavis: Man, this working-out thing is killing me.
Blair: No, no. I have to flip it, then. That's it.
Tavis: Ha ha ha!
Jasmine: It's a drag.
Tavis: Not being able to eat what you want to eat is a drag. Wren, what do you not like?
Wren: My girth.
Jasmine: He had to come up with a big word for it.
Tavis: What does 'girth' mean? I don't know what that means, even.
Jasmine: I don't even want girth, whatever it is. It sounds too big.
Wren: You know, when you're buying 5 to 6 wardrobes a year just to address the distended stomach, you know what I mean? Your gluteus minimus maximus immedius gets spread in a way that's, you know, devastating to most.
Jasmine: It's like which body am I today?
Wren: You know, I'm offended by the way I feel and look at this point, but I'm happy to be alive.
Tavis: Yeah.
Wren: Yes.
Tavis: Neal, what do you think?
Neal: I feel like when I start working around people who are still in their early twenties especially, and you realize, oh, my God, you know, they're almost an entire generation younger.
Tavis: Don't you hate that when people call you 'Mr. Smiley'? 'Mr. Underwood'?
Jasmine: 'You look just like my mama.' I'm like, wow!
Blair: I remember watching you do soaps.
Tavis: I grew up watching you on 'A Different World,' Jasmine.
Jasmine: I know.
Tavis: Yeah.
Wren: I gotta tell you, I love 'Mr. Brown.' I really love when my children's friends say, 'Mr. Brown--'
Jasmine: He's been dreaming of it since he was 7.
Blair: Say it again. Say it again.
Tavis: You've been waiting for 40 years to hear somebody say, 'Mr. Brown.' Well, Mr. Brown, Mr. Kendall, Ms. Guy, Mr. Underwood, thank you all for coming. Happy birthday to all of you and all of us.
Wren: Mr. Smiley, happy birthday to you.
Tavis: Up next, I'll have some--thank you, Wren--up--it is my birthday, isn't it?
Wren: It is.
Tavis: Thank you. Up next, I'll have some thoughts about this day and what it means for me, what turning 40 means. Stay with us.
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