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• Bio on Ms. Franklin
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Tavis: What can you say about the Queen of Soul? I am just honored to have the opportunity to sit and talk to her, principally here in Los Angeles because she never comes to Los Angeles. 21 years it took you to make your way back to L.A. It's nice to see you.

Aretha Franklin: Thank you. It's wonderful to see you.

Tavis: Now, you know the obvious question. Why so long? Why-- I know you love Detroit, but you love Detroit so much that you couldn't--

Aretha: Well, you know I love L.A. I--you're talking about coming over hills and mountains, literally.

Tavis: Ha ha ha. Right.

Aretha: OK? I'm back.

Tavis: But for those who don't know, you have stayed away for 21 years. Not because you wanted to, per se, but because you don't fly anymore.

Aretha: That's right.

Tavis: For those who don't know why you don't fly, when did you stop flying, and why do you not fly anymore?

Aretha: I stopped flying in, what, '83. I took a small prop plane out of Atlanta going to Detroit. I really wanted to get home, and there was nothing else available. I said, 'Hey, let's just take that.' Got on it. Big mistake. Big, big, big mistake. It was like doing dipsy doodles all the way to Detroit, and I said, 'When we get to Detroit and I get to Metropolitan Airport, I'm gonna kiss the ground when I get there, and that's it for flying.' Unfortunately, I haven't been flying since, but, um, I'm due to go at it again in October.

Tavis: You're gonna fly again in October?

Aretha: I hope so.

Tavis: Wow.

Aretha: Short flight.

Tavis: Yeah?

Aretha: I'm in L.A.

Tavis: Yeah. You are in L.A. It took you how many days on a bus--how many days?

Aretha: 4 days--

Tavis: 4 days on a bus to get here.

Aretha: And one morning.

Tavis: But you got one of those nice big--you weren't on Greyhound.

Aretha: No, no, no.

Tavis: The queen don't do Greyhound.

Aretha: No.

Tavis: You got a nice big luxury bus, don't you?

Aretha: Very nice.

Tavis: What's on your bus?

Aretha: What's on my bus? Everything. I've got, um, hmm. Videos. We have movies, tapes, my books.

Tavis: Beds.

Aretha: Yeah, beds. Everything. A lounge in the back. Um... Good people, good conversation.

Tavis: What is--what's the best part? My mother loves to travel. My mother literally can get on a train by herself...

Aretha: OK.

Tavis: And go all across the country and back. My mother lives in Indiana--not too far from Detroit. She can drive to L.A. and back. My mother just loves to travel. She'd have a field day on a bus with you. What's fun about being on a bus for 3 or 4 days? That's a long ride for me, but you must enjoy it.

Aretha: Well, you really have to have a good group of people.

Tavis: Right.

Aretha: Particularly--these people were hand-selected just for my group, and I just felt that--I selected people that were very compatible with each other intellectually and otherwise. Very harmonic-type people.

Tavis: I guess you'd have to do that, 'cause 3 or 4 days--

Aretha: And these people...yes, right, who get along well.

Tavis: 3 or 4 days with the wrong people on a bus can be-- ha ha ha.

Aretha: Uh-huh.

Tavis: That's a long bus ride.

Aretha: Uh-huh.

Tavis: Um, so before I move off of this, what happened to make you consider flying again? 'Cause this is the first I've heard of it. Aretha Franklin's gonna fly again after all these years. Why October? Why now?

Aretha: Just because I'm tired of not being able to go where I really want to go.

Tavis: Right.

Aretha: And, uh, I would have done the U.S., with L.A., by car or by bus--not car, but by bus, and, uh, I wanna go back to Paris. I want to go to London and places that I have been before and I'd like to go again.

Tavis: Is that born of--and I say this respectfully--is that born of getting older and wanting to have some experiences that you've not had for a long time? I'm just trying to figure out what it is...

Aretha: Mm-hmm.

Tavis: That makes that happen.

Aretha: No. Just because I love Paris. I love being there. I like the ambience. I like the people, and I'd like to go again.

Tavis: OK. Um... The folk here in L.A. are--this has been the talk of the town for weeks and weeks and weeks, and it's very hard to get folk in this wonderful, but jaded city to be excited about something, but you got--people are mad, 'cause you got 2 shows this weekend in Los Angeles. They're both sold out, and people wish you were gonna do more, but you already headed to Vegas for a couple days when you're here.

Aretha: I'll be there in Vegas, the 24th and 25th at the Mandalay Bay Hotel and then back to Detroit and then to Memphis and over to Little Rock for the opening of the Clinton library.

Tavis: Bill Clinton loves you. You performed at his first inauguration, at his second inauguration, other stuff in between.

Aretha: Yeah.

Tavis: And now you're at the library opening. What's up with you and Bill Clinton?

Aretha: Ha ha. Nothing!

Tavis: Ha ha ha. Yeah. What does Hillary not know--

Aretha: OK. You're gonna get sued just like--

Tavis: Ha ha ha!

Aretha: Uh, nothing. He's a good man. I appreciate him, as we all do, and, uh... Bill Clinton is all right with me, OK? He's all right with me. I like what he stands for.

Tavis: Well, he has good taste. He knows how to throw a party. And who better to do that than the queen? Speaking of throwing a party, I think, um, I am certain in my career I've asked this question of other people. I can't imagine, though, off the top of my head, anybody who this question has more significance for. When you are doing a concert, with all of the stuff, queen, that you have done, how do you decide what you're going to do? I mean, I--

Aretha: It's not easy. It really isn't easy.

Tavis: That's an understatement.

Aretha: I have changed the program at least 10 times now. So down to the wire, sometimes, I'm changing the program to the very last minute.

Tavis: And you change it based upon your mood, on your voice? What makes you make these changes, how you feel?

Aretha: No, just--just... I wanna present what it is people want. I wanna be sure that I give them exactly what they want.

Tavis: How do you know what they want if you don't know who's gonna be in the audience that night?

Aretha: Because you got a backup of record sales. I listen to what people have to say. I think I know what it is they like, and, uh, I like surprises sometimes, so we'll throw in a few of those, too.

Tavis: Do you ever get lazy on stage? I mean, it's just me and you here. Did you ever walk out on stage--?

Aretha: Sure. Just me and you a few million people. 40 million people.

Tavis: You ever walk out there and just some nights you're like, you know, 'I'm the queen, and I can give them just a little bit, and they're still gonna jump up and down?'

Aretha: Oh, I would never, never, never, ever say that. I don't think like that. Um, there have been times that I've gone on stage and I didn't really feel well, and I would far have preferred to be at home, but the audience has a way of motivating you beyond how you feel. They can lift you up, and you feel a million times better when you leave there then you did when I got there. You know.

Tavis: Speaking of feeling better when you leave a stage on any given night, what have you enjoyed all these--

Aretha: That's just occasionally.

Tavis: Yeah. Yeah. What have you enjoyed so much all these years about singing? And I know that question might sound a little trite, but what have you enjoyed most about the blessing, the gift you have been given to share to--this voice you have? What do you--

Aretha: Just that I, and I think mainly that--and I have been fortunate and blessed to do so, and that is just to be able to give people what it is I wanna give them, and to deliver it and put it where I want it.

Tavis: Mm-hmm. What's been the greatest challenge to you to maintain, to keep this thing going? I mean, if we had--we don't have the time to run a list of people who were one-hit wonders. You had hit after hit after hit after--what's been the greatest challenge to stay relevant through all the changes in this business? The musical changes, the stylistic changes, the record company changes? What's been the greatest challenge of staying relevant in this business all these many years?

Aretha: Hmm. I think just for me, it's the love of music. Being contemporary. I consider myself to be very old-fashioned sometimes with old-fashioned values and a very contemporary and progressive woman as well. So I guess that aspect of it carries me on.

Tavis: You grew up in Detroit. We had on this program a couple nights ago Anita Baker, who, as you know, is out with her new CD for the first time in 10 years. She couldn't open her mouth fast enough to tell me how much she loved Detroit and why Detroit's such a great city. And the first thing she mentioned was Aretha Franklin still lives in Detroit.

Aretha: Oh, wow.

Tavis: Everybody knows the queen lives in Detroit, loves Detroit. Let me ask you a few questions about Detroit if I can. First of all, tell me what it was like for you growing up in Detroit?

Aretha: I love Detroit. Detroit is a very rallying kind of city. It's very neighborly depending on where you live. We do have a real community. People do care in Detroit. I grew up on the north end and--

Tavis: North side!

Aretha: Huh?

Tavis: North side.

Aretha: Yeah, the North end. Big thing in Detroit.

Tavis: Yeah. Big thing in Detroit, yeah. 'I'm from the North end.' What high school? What high school?

Aretha: Northern. What else, Eastern?

Tavis: Well, King?

Aretha: Come on. You don't look 40. You don't look 40.

Tavis: Cass? Ha ha ha! I got that. I got that. I got that. But I know these Detroit high schools. Now, you see how I know that? You go to Detroit enough times, you just notice--you know Detroit. King, Cass, Northern.

Aretha: Yeah, right. You're just down the road...from Detroit. Out of Indiana. You're an Indiana boy.

Tavis: Yeah.

Aretha: OK.

Tavis: So you still love Detroit after all these years. I mean, you could've lived in New York, you could've lived in L.A. A lot of industry folk do.

Aretha: I have lived in L.A. I lived down in Encino for 6 years.

Tavis: But you didn't like it enough to stay out here?

Aretha: No. My dad. I had to go home. I lived in New York for 6 years, East Side. Upper East. I loved New York. Yeah.

Tavis: You mentioned your dad. Your father. And there's no way I could have a conversation with you because one of the things I regret... You mentioned my being 40. One of the things I regret is that I did not have the chance--I grew up in the church, as you know, and I did not have a chance to meet your father, but I have heard so many stories from so many people in Detroit, outside Detroit, around this country, about your father.

My favorite story is that when Dr. King went to--we all know the famous 'I have a dream' speech at the March on Washington. A few weeks prior to that, 6 or 7 weeks prior to that, your father, the baddest minister in the city of Detroit, had a huge march in Detroit that many say was bigger, or as big, certainly, as the March on Washington. He and Dr. King were friends. He invited Dr. King to Detroit. And weeks before he gave that speech at the March on Washington, that 'I have a dream' speech, he tried that thing out, as a good Baptist preacher does. He tried it out first in Detroit. It worked in Detroit. He tweaked a few things, went to the March on Washington, and that speech we all know now, we thought we heard for the first time. You were there that day.

Aretha: Actually, I was not.

Tavis: Your dad was there, but you were not there.

Aretha: Yes, my dad was there. I was not there. I was in New York at the time, I think, living there. But, yes, the march in Detroit set the pace for the one in Washington. He got a call from Mahalia Jackson, who had gotten a call from Harry Belafonte, who had talked with Dr. King, and, you know, that kind of thing.

Tavis: Yeah.

Aretha: That kind of thing.

Tavis: I just love this, man. 'Mahalia talked to Harry, Harry talked to Dr. King, Dr. King talked to Reverend Franklin.'

Aretha: Well, hey. Anyway, he organized it. He put a group of ministers together, and that's how that whole thing came about.

Tavis: Tell me more about your father.

Aretha: What would you like to know?

Tavis: What made him so outstanding, so liked? I mean, people, to this day, still talk about how your father could put down a sermon like nobody's business.

Aretha: Yeah. He was the best. He was the greatest. Uh-huh.

Tavis: Everybody says that about their dad, but I feel that coming from you, though.

Aretha: I know that. I knew you would say that. But he was.

Tavis: No, I feel that coming-- what made your dad so great for you?

Aretha: Because he was a great father and he was a great leader. He cared. He was a very, very sensitive man. He, for, what, 35, 40 years, he brought indigent people to the church. He saw to it that they were taken care of in whatever way he could see that they were taken care of. That they had food, that they had clothing, and so on. He was real. He was real.

Tavis: Speaking of real, I need you to tell me the real story of how you learned to play piano so well. I think people know you, obviously, as a great artist, but the thing I, I think, like about you so much in addition to that is that you can wear a piano out. I wish you'd just put out a record of just Aretha does the piano.

Aretha: Instrumentals.

Tavis: Yeah, just an instrumental thing. You ever thought about doing that?

Aretha: Yeah.

Tavis: Would you do that just 'cause I asked?

Aretha: I'd do that, sure. The first song will be called 'This is for Tavis.'

Tavis: OK. Ha ha ha! Tell me. But you never took lessons. You never took lessons?

Aretha: No, I play by ear.

Tavis: You just play by ear.

Aretha: Actually, James Cleveland is the person that inspired me to play. Gospel artist James Cleveland. And I used to just stand by the piano and watch what he was doing, and I loved it so much. He had a group of him and his sisters, and he had subsequent groups to them, but the group that I loved the best was his sister and himself. And I would just soak it up. I'd just stand there all day and listen to him play and watch him play.

Tavis: How blessed is that, though, to be able to just learn to play piano--

Aretha: My sister took classical piano, and I used to stand there and just watch that while she got her knuckles rapped.

Tavis: Ha ha ha! You said, 'I ain't going for that. I'll just learn to play by ear.'

Aretha: None of that for me. By ear.

Tavis: You have a couple of sons who are in the music business. Did they ever come to you and say, 'Mama, I'm thinking about dong this music thing?' With all that you've been through, the ups and the downs, what did you say to them, if you said anything, about their interest in a career in this business?

Aretha: Actually, they didn't come to me in that way. They just got into it and started doing their own thing, and I tried to be supportive to them as they went about doing what they were doing. They are very, very independent folks. How--

Tavis: Wonder where they got that from.

Aretha: I wonder where they got that from? Not me, but anyway, just trying to be supportive to them, and I know that they will excel at what they love, so I never interfere with what they want to do.

Tavis: This is an obligatory question, and I hate asking these kinds of questions, but you can't sit with the queen on this rare opportunity and not ask this, but I know you've been asked this before by everybody. What do you most like about the way the music business is today, and what do you least like about the way you've seen this business change over all these many years?

Aretha: I most like that artists have become more independent and more willing to become the chieftains and the CEOs, et cetera. After coming out from these major deals with people like Clive Davis and Ahmet Ertegun and other chieftains in the business, I most like that. What I like least about it is, what...hmm...what do I like least about the music industry? The fact that they seem to have just thrown away some of the artists of the sixties. Yeah. People who have mass audiences out there right now, who can't get a record deal.

Tavis: Why do you think that is?

Aretha: I think the emphasis is on youth, and they just don't care about it, unlike Europeans, who regard age and wisdom in a far kinder and better way than we do.

Tavis: We're not very appreciative of those who are chronologically gifted, are we?

Aretha: Well, not when a new crew comes in, but we've had our times. We know how to do our thing. We're big girls and boys. We can do our thing with what's happening.

Tavis: How do you process, if at all--

Aretha: But I don't think that that group should be forgotten, just, 'All right, you're off the air,' boom, and that's it. 'See you later.' That's so cold.

Tavis: But how do you process the fact that you have been fortunate enough to still get radio airplay? I mean, do you get in the car in Detroit, on your bus, and turn the radio on, and I assume you turn the radio on and you hear Aretha Franklin stuff comin' through the radio. After all these years, like, what happens? If I were you, and I turned on the radio, I would just get tickled every time I turned the radio on and heard my stuff, especially all these years. How do you process, turning the radio on these many years later and hearing a song you did back in 1962?

Aretha: You've been blessed, you've really been blessed, especially with our generation practically off the air, unless you're listening to an oldies station or stations that play a mixture or a diverse mixture of music.

Tavis: When people come to you, I think, now, as a matter of fact, on the way to this conversation today in the car, I heard the duet you did with Lauryn Hill, 'A Rose is Still a Rose.' Love that song.

Aretha: Thank you.

Tavis: How do you process what you want to do, what you will do, what you will consider doing when stuff comes your way now for a duet? I want to talk about your duet project in a second. When people send you something and say, 'Ms. Franklin, would you consider doing this?' How do you decide what you want to do or don't want to do at this point in your career?

Aretha: I'm listening. I'm always listening for content, for melody, writers. Who's the writer? What's the track record and so on. I'm waging it.

Tavis: Another one of these questions that I hate to ask, but I'm just curious, so y'all forgive me for asking a question that is really boring and staid, but I'm just curious. What were you listening to on the bus? What's in your CD player?

Aretha: What was I listening to on the bus? I was listening to Bishop Paul Morton. We just did a duo together, and I was listening to his album coming out, and what else? Some tapes that I have to rehearse, some things I have to rehearse for the concert next week, and what else? A lot of reading.

Tavis: You like to read?

Aretha: Sometimes.

Tavis: Non-fiction? Fiction? What kind of stuff do you like to read?

Aretha: I like biographies.

Tavis: Biographies?

Aretha: Uh-huh. I'm a people person.

Tavis: What draws you to biographies? You like people?

Aretha: I like people, and I like style. I like just getting into who they are, you know?

Tavis: I mentioned duets. You're working, I'm told, at least, that you're working, I hope this is true, you're working on a duets album?

Aretha: 'Duets' is coming out. Clive is working on that, and should be out in about a month or so.

Tavis: I haven't gotten my phone call.

Aretha: You'll get it, you'll get it.

Tavis: All right, so, I know that's a lie. Anyway--

Aretha: Would I sit here and lie to you, Tavis? Would I sit here and lie to you? Come on.

Tavis: Yes, you would.

Aretha: No, I wouldn't.

Tavis: All right, so tell me, who have you called? Who have you called?

Aretha: Who have I called?

Tavis: Yeah, who you singin' with? Who's singin' with you? Let me rephrase that. Who's been honored to be asked to sing with you since I ain't got my call yet?

Aretha: Let's see, who's singing with me, or who am I singing with? Myself and Mariah, myself and Jill Scott.

Tavis: Her new CD is amazing.

Aretha: You like it? OK. I haven't heard it. Let's see, who else?

Tavis: Got any men on the list? Mariah, Jill. Any brothers?

Aretha: Men, let's see, who am I singing with? Hmm...having a mental block here. I can't think through all of this, but anyway, there's gonna be 3 originals on that album.

Tavis: I love it when you do the opera stuff.

Aretha: Thanks.

Tavis: Puccini. You like that?

Aretha: I love it. Like it a lot. Great songs.

Tavis: This may be a silly question, but after all the music that you have done, you may surprise me with an answer, I don't know, after all the various forms of music that you have tried, performed, excelled at, I assume that, for lack of a better phrase, soul music is still what you love most or maybe gospel, I don't know.

Aretha: Yes. Soul. I love it all, as long as it's good music, I love it all, but I think soul would be first and foremost.

Tavis: The word got out that you were gonna be on our program tonight, so I got all kinds of folks sending me questions that they want me to ask the queen. I think the one question I probably got more than any other was what advice you would give to a young person? You're in L.A. Now, you're out in L.A. This weekend, and everybody, everybody wants to be in the business, everybody wants to do their thing the way Aretha put it down. What advice would you give to folk who are interested in trying to have a career in this business?

Aretha: I would think coming in, it's most important, really, to finish your education first.

Tavis: Wow.

Aretha: First thing so you have that if you don't make it, and the odds are steep. Um, after that, you've gotta find the best people out there: entertainment attorneys, not just a civil attorney or this kind of attorney or that kind. Entertainment lawyers, the best out there, the best accountants. It is a real business, and should you be fortunate enough to become successful, you really need the best people protecting you and watching your back.

Tavis: Well, you have been fortunate to become very successful, but more importantly, we are fortunate that you became successful. We, in L.A. Are especially fortunate after 21 years, you finally back here. It's gonna be a lot of fun this weekend here in L.A. Nice to see you.

Aretha: I'm delighted to be back.

Tavis: I'm delighted to have you on the program, delighted to have you here.

Aretha: Thank you.

Tavis: All hail the queen.

Aretha: Hey. No, you won't.

Tavis: You can't fade the queen of soul. You gotta love Aretha Franklin. That's our show for tonight. As always, you can catch me on the radio on NPR. I'll see you back here next time on PBS. Until then, thanks for watching, good night from Los Angeles, and keep the faith.