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Tavis: Diane McWhorter is the Pulitzer Prize-winning author of the terrific book "Carry Me Home: Birmingham, Alabama, The Climactic Battle of the Civil Rights Revolution." Her latest book is aimed at teaching young readers about the civil rights movement. The new book is called "A Dream of Freedom: The Civil Rights Movement from 1954 to 1968." Diane McWhorter joins us tonight from New York City. Diane, nice to have you on the program.

Diane McWhorter: Thanks, Tavis. Nice to be here.

Tavis: Glad to have you here. Let me start by asking, aside from the obvious, I guess, which is that you grew up in Birmingham, Alabama, or back in the day, Bombingham, as it was called. Aside from the fact that you grew up there, what draws you, whether you're writing for adults or young readers, to the notion of race and class and civil rights?

Diane: Well, I think it's just the core story of our country. I think of slavery as being the original sin, and that's this stain we've been trying to expunge for, you know, the last couple hundred years. So, I think that, you know, instead of saying--I don't see this as sort of a black history story. I see it as the American--the domestic American story, so I keep being drawn back to it, and it keeps--The lessons of certainly the civil rights era keep being replayed over and over again now, even in the last election, for example.

Tavis: Let me ask you why it is you think more Americans who happen not to be African American don't see it as you see it? That is to say they don't see it as American history, as opposed to black American history?

Diane: You know, I keep asking myself that, because I spent 20 years writing--almost 20 years writing "Carry Me Home," and to me, it was just the most interesting subject that anyone could possibly devote their lives to. It may be partly because of the way it's been taught and that the conflict is often minimized because I think kids come to this at such an early age because of the Martin Luther King holiday that they aren't really ready to hear about how bad it was for African Americans in this country. And so then they come away with this impression that Martin Luther King had this dream and he told everybody to be nice and that's what resolved it. And it was really a fight, I think, of the movement as a continuation of the Civil War, and you don't see the Civil War really as sort of being a, you know--either only about the South or only about the North. You see it as being this national story, and that's how I see the civil rights movement, as well.

Tavis: This new book "A Dream of Freedom" is aimed at young readers, specifically those in the age range of 9 to 14. Because the civil rights movement has, to your earlier point, so much ugly associated with it, it wasn't just this guy named King "who had a dream and told everybody to be nice," to use your phraseology. There is some ugliness clearly associated with the historic battles that were fought, thankfully and won by my ancestors, but how does one, against that backdrop, decide what you can or ought to write? What you can or ought to say to kids who are 9 to 14?

Diane: Well, I think at that age, they're pretty much ready to hear the truth. When they're younger, I don't know whether they're really ready to hear about lynching. I remember when I went and talked to my daughter's first grade class about segregation--second grade class it was, actually. I didn't know whether to tell them stuff like that the black housekeeper had a separate drinking cup in the house. You know, I thought almost that was too disturbing. They're certainly not ready to hear about lynching or miscegenation or the strong stuff like that, but I think at this age, that they really are ready to hear it, and we even have a lynching photograph in the book, because lynching--You really have to understand lynching to understand how African Americans were controlled so much in the South when they were in some places--when they, in some places, outnumbered whites. And so I really wanted to get across also how really mainstream this was, this treatment, that the--that lynchings, for example, were this community--almost like a community picnic. They had the atmosphere of that...that it wasn't this vigilante action that was done in dark of night and secrecy. It was really open. That's a--I think they need to know that. I also--Even though it is for young kids, I'm hoping the book is gonna have a life as Cliff Notes for college students and adults and certainly for teachers who need to know how to teach this material, just 'cause it tries to tell--you know, take it chapter by chapter and say this is why, for example, the Montgomery bus boycott is important.

Tavis: I'm wrestling with your notion that at the age of 9 to 14, young people are ready for this. Let me concede for the sake of argument here that they are ready to deal with issues like lynching, that they are ready to deal with things like the Emmett Till story and all the other stuff that you put in this book. Let's just for the sake of argument assume they are ready for this. What would be the ultimate goal here? I mean, it's one thing for them to be ready to, I guess, digest it. It's another thing to consider what they're going to do with it. So once they are exposed to this in the most multicultural, multiracial, multiethnic America ever, that ain't just black and white anymore, what are they supposed to do with what they learn in "A Dream of Freedom"?

Diane: Well, I hope that they will see how normal--seemingly normal people were capable of behaving, and I'm talking about the white jurors who acquitted Emmett Till's murderers in the face of, you know, overwhelming evidence that he was--that these murderers were guilty. And I really want them to ask themselves how they might behave under circumstances where they would have carte blanche, basically, to do whatever they wanted to. The lessons that I want to get across is that people who have power are capable of behaving in really abominable ways toward people who don't have power. And I think that's why it's important for stories like Emmett Till to be told. It's not just the story of a gruesome lynching or murder.

Tavis: Mm-hmm.

Diane: It's also the story of how the state of Mississippi initially wanted to punish the murderers or were willing to. And then when the country ganged up on them, they said, "No, we're not gonna--Y'all can't tell us what to do," and just how human nature works that way. And I think that there are a lot of lessons to be--you know, huge lessons about how power works. And also how oppressed people have to organize in order to overcome this social injustice, that it's not enough just to--You know, the black middle class used to think that if you just strived enough--And that's kind of a lesson that a lot of kids are getting today, that--you know, that if you're just--you know, take personal responsibility and all that, that you'll be able to do anything, and that's not necessarily true. You really have to organize.

Tavis: Young people, as you well know, were so central, so integral to the success of the civil rights movement on both sides of the equation. That is to say, they--it was necessary for them to get in the streets and to march, and when the world saw Bull Connor siccing those dogs on young kids, that was important. By the same token, when we learn about Emmett Till, the four little girls killed in the Birmingham church--16th Baptist Church there. Throughout the entire movement, young people were central to the struggle. I raise that because it's not lost to me that you were in Birmingham, 10, as I recall from my research. You were 10 when those girls were killed in that church. How much of your childhood do you recall from Birmingham?

Diane: Well, that's the other interesting irony, that I ended up spending most of my adult life writing about this, because I was just a perfect specimen of the white status quo in Birmingham. I mean, I--A lot of people who end up being attra--You know, white people who end up being drawn to this field are people who were from the only liberal family in town or something, but that was not the case with me at all. I mean, I was--I believed exactly what the sort of mainstream thinking was about race at the time, and the mainstream thinking among white people at the time of the demonstrations, the fire hoses, the police dogs, and the church bombing was that it didn't have anything to do with us. The sort of standard line was that Martin Luther King was an outside agitator; that he was doing this for personal gain; that our "colored people," as white people thought of them, were happy until he came to town and put, you know, these fancy notions in their head. And that's pretty much--See, I mean, the reason I feel privileged to be able to tell this story is because I know exactly what those white people were thinking, because I was one of them. And one of the things I say in the introduction and conclusion to the children's book is that these kind of cataclysmic historic events have an effect on you whether you realize it or not at the time and that you can always go back and try to figure it out. And that's what I've done with my career, really, is trying to figure out how people I knew, people who were good people, white people, could act in such a dehumanizing way and think of themselves still as good, Christian people and really go against their religious principles so, um, just horribly and, you know, try to figure out what was in it for them and why they would do that.

Tavis: Let me ask you what may be a difficult question here with, you know, the last minute and 30 seconds I have here. Probably not fair to do this. But I'm struck as I listen to you by what I saw on Election Night. I saw red on that map all down through the South. The Democrats have got to find a way--If you're a Democrat, Democrats have got to find a way to win the South again. I don't know if that's ever possible, but to the extent that it is possible, given that the Republican Party is not known as the party fighting for civil rights and human rights--Democratic Party more often bears that mantra--how do the Democrats ever win the South again? You're from there. You got a prescription for them?

Diane: I don't. I think that it's--The fact that the South, which used to be the solid Democratic South, is now Republican is sort of a depressing sign about how well race works, because the Republicans are the ones who are now working the race card. And you see the same dynamics going on with the new, quote, "morality card," that you appeal to people's fears and prejudices. Because, you know, I think behind the gay marriage thing, was--Really homophobia was why that worked so well emotionally. And that's what works with race, too, is that you trigger people's emotional prejudices that--They have--Those have to be activated in some way by people who need to do it in their self-interest, and then what--you know, what you end up doing is getting people to act and vote against their self-interest, which is what we see when poor or middle-class white people in the South side with the party that's really for promoting the interest of people who already have the money.

Tavis: We could spend a series on this program talking about that notion, but for the moment, she is the Pulitzer Prize-winning author of "Carry Me Home." Now a new book out, "A Dream of Freedom: The Civil Rights Movement from 1954 to 1968." She is, of course, Diane McWhorter. Diane, nice to have you on the program. All the best to you.

Diane: Thanks so much, Tavis.

Tavis: Take care. Up next on this program, Joss Stone. Stay with us.