TONIGHT
E-mail a friendSen. Dianne Feinstein
airdate May 9, 2007
Dianne Feinstein is California's senior senator. She has a career of female firsts, including: San Francisco Board of Supervisors president; San Francisco mayor (to date, the only woman to hold the position); member of the Senate Judiciary Committee; and chair of the Senate Rules and Administration Committee. She also serves on the powerful Appropriations Committee. Since '97, Feinstein has been a member of the bipartisan Aspen Strategy Group, which explores foreign policy puzzles facing the U.S.
Discusses closing the Guantanamo Bay detention facility (1:14).
Sen. Dianne Feinstein
Tavis: Dianne Feinstein is serving her fourth term in the Senate, representing those of us who call California home. She is a member of a number of key committees in the Senate, including intelligence and appropriations. She's also chair of the Senate Rules and Administration Committee. Before joining the Senate, she of course served as mayor of San Francisco. Senator Feinstein joins us tonight from Capitol Hill. Senator, nice to have you on the program.
Sen. Dianne Feinstein: Thank you, Tavis, good to be here, I think.
Tavis: Of course it's good to be here, I'm not going to be mean to you (laugh). There are a few things that I want to cover. I want to start, though, with Guantanamo Bay, and this is an issue that you've been tracking and talking about of late. Let me just ask you, frankly, why it is at this point that we are still having a conversation about closing this facility with all of the drama that we know that exists around this facility?
Feinstein: Well, we're having the conversation because clearly, the administration does not want to close the facility. Despite the fact that Secretary of Defense Gates testified before Defense Appropriations last year that he felt that the facility should, in fact, be closed.
I went to the facility early on, so I actually saw it and saw the situation there. America's justice system stands for something. And that is equal protection under the law for everybody. It is due process of the law for everybody. And here in Guantanamo, we have created a separate category of individual: detainee.
Now, nobody, including myself, wants to release a terrorist. That's not the point. But you can hold people virtually incommunicado for long periods of time without resort to counsel, without resort to trial. It's an isolated facility, and basic due process rights such as habeas corpus, available to virtually everybody in this country, doesn't apply out there.
Now, that's a contested thing. I think eventually that what the courts have done had said, "You have to change the law." So the military commission law was put forward. I voted against it, largely because it denies certain basic rights to detainees.
Tavis: Let me ask how it is that we juxtapose for the world our being the beacon of democracy with a facility that exists like this, number one, and number two, what kind of damage this has done to our reputation around the world, given that every human rights organization in the world has checked us, has called us on this facility?
Feinstein: Well, you're right on both counts. It has done enormous damage to our credibility abroad. People say that we tell others to do as we say, not do as we do. It is a breach of trust with the world, and it makes us look, I'm sorry to say, like hypocrites. I think it has done enormous damage among our allies. It's helped recruit rather than abate terrorism. I think it's been a tragic mistake.
Tavis: What do you say to people who see the flip side of this argument, which is that, to your point earlier of your not wanting to release a terrorist, nobody else wants to, either? And that when you're fighting this so-called war on terror you can't do it with kid gloves. Why should we be concerned about how terrorists are treated at a facility?
Feinstein: Well, first place, you can house these terrorists, detain them, imprison them here in the United States. They have easy access to lawyers, American or military commission law would prevail. They'd have access to military tribunals. And we would avoid this argument that we're hypocrites by creating a lesser standard at Guantanamo Bay.
Essentially, as I understand it, at Guantanamo, they intend to try just 60 to 80 people out of the approximate 390 people that are there. There are a lot of people that are there, I think, caught in the wrong place at the wrong time. There are some people there who deserve to be in prison for a very long time. I believe that, I know that. However, to do it in a way that you create an isolated facility I think is a big mistake.
Tavis: Let me ask you right quick about Secretary Gates, who you mentioned earlier in this conversation for testifying last week about this issue. He testified before a committee that you're on earlier today with regard to this conversation - this debate, quite frankly - about troop funding. He was there today testifying on the Hill, Secretary Gates, as was General Pace.
What was your attempt today - what was your effort, geared with regard to your questions today of those two gentlemen?
Feinstein: Well, I had two efforts; a very short time for questions, like five minutes or so. One was to get a good understanding of what the administration intends to do with this co-called surge in Iraq. The month - excuse me, September has surfaced as being a month of relative decision, and I use that in that there will certainly be evaluation as to whether the surge is effective or not.
But I became convinced, after listening to others' questions and answers, that this administration has no intention of pulling out of Iraq any time soon. And I think that is a very tragic recognition. And the only change in this would be if we had enough Republicans joining with Democrats to pass legislation that clearly set a timeline.
Today, out there in America, beyond the Beltway, a majority of American people want a timeline. I think it's something like 59 percent now of Americans want us to set a timeline. Iraq has gone on for longer than World War II.
Tavis: So why are the American people wrong and Congress and the White House are right on this issue?
Feinstein: Well, I don't think the American people are wrong. I think the Democratic Party right now is aligned with the views of the American people, and that's the battle that's going on. We have sent the president a supplemental appropriation for the war of $124 billion and in that supplemental we have included Iraqi language.
And the president has vetoed that and sent it back. The House is about ready to send us another draft, meaning to the Senate. I don't know that the Senate will find it acceptable, but we will work our will and send the president another version of that. But it will certainly have benchmarks, and the benchmarks have to have some form of sanction.
We cannot go on as we are. Iraqis have been trained now. They should be stepping up, they should be providing for the security of their own country. All that's accomplished by the American military is putting the American military in between warring factions of Iraqis so that our men and our women become victims. I think the American people have had enough of that.
Tavis: Got a minute to go here. Let me ask you right quick about Alberto Gonzalez. You were one of the members of the United States Senate that called some time ago, courageously, for his resignation. He has obviously not resigned. Do you have any sense that he is going to at this point, or has he basically survived this storm?
Feinstein: Oh, I don't think he's survived it yet. I think the entire Department of Justice has taken a real hit. I think the credibility of the leadership of that department has been seriously impugned by the attorney general scandal. I think the American people are also viewing the fact that the leadership of this great department should, in fact, be changed. That is my belief. I am hopeful that the White House will wake up and agree.
Tavis: She's a member of any number of powerful committees in the Senate. She is a Democrat of California. She is, of course, U.S. Senator Dianne Feinstein. Senator, nice to have you on the program. Thanks for your insight, and we will do it again soon, I hope.
Feinstein: Thank you, Tavis, appreciate it.
Tavis: See, that wasn't so bad, was it? See?
Feinstein: No, not at all, thank you.
Tavis: Okay, all right. (Laughs) So now next time, you won't have to think about being happy to be here, you'll just be happy to be here next time.
Feinstein: Okay, it's a deal, thanks.
Tavis: All right. Nice to have you here.
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