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GWEN IFILL: Let's start by talking about security in Afghanistan. How
would you assess it now?
 HAMID
KARZAI: We expect this year, because of our elections, to have more
of a security problem, we believe, as a result--before the elections
for the Afghan Constitutional Assembly, that terrorists will try to
increase attacks in Afghanistan in order to make elections difficult
or in order to make a bit more trouble for us.
So we will have security incidents occurring in Afghanistan before
the elections, but generally in the fight against terrorism, this war,
this fight against the remnants of terrorism will go on for some time.
It will not end this year. It will not end next year. We may have it
for many years to come.
In the meantime we'll be building our national army, our national police,
and other institutions that are necessary to fight terrorism and to
bring an orderly government to Afghanistan and the rule of law.
GWEN IFILL: You know as well as anyone, because your personal security
has been threatened, what that can reap on the ability to start a peaceful
democratic process. Last week we saw the killings of the Chinese road
workers in what we thought was a safe area of the country. Do you think
that this represents a resurgence of the Taliban?
HAMID KARZAI: That incident I don't know yet. We are investigating it.
We'll, we'll find out as to who committed that incident. This was a
ghastly act against Afghanistan's reconstruction, and really killing
people who come from a far off place to help Afghanistan.
The resurgence of the Taliban, no. The Taliban movement, the terrorism
that was associated with them, they were, as I mentioned earlier, the
ruling government in Afghanistan. They have been removed. They have
been defeated. They are now hiding. They are seeking targets of opportunity.
They are seeking soft targets, aid workers, reconstruction workers.
They're not engaging militarily with us. They cannot do that.
So as far as terrorism or the Taliban, as the structure is concerned,
it is gone. As far as they're concerned as elements or groups that seek
targets of opportunity and hit and run things, they're still there.
They will remain with us.
 GWEN
IFILL: Let me read to you something in this morning's Financial Times,
the NATO top commander, NATO's top commander in Afghanistan, General
Rick Hillier, was quoted as saying, "Perhaps some day Afghanistan
will become self-sustaining, but there are speed bumps in the road.
If they are not handled properly, they could derail the process of creating
a state."
HAMID KARZAI: That's very true. That's very right. We have in Afghanistan
achieved a lot, but we have significant difficulties as well. The difficulties
are the poppies that are growing in Afghanistan. The difficulties are
the continuation of, of the private militia forces in Afghanistan. These
are two major obstacles that we have to remove alongside fighting terrorism.
And poppies, the highest on the list because poppies are not only criminalizing
the Afghan economy, destroying our agriculture, destroying lives, addicting
people, but they are also going hand in hand with terrorism, with extremism
and with warlords in Afghanistan.
GWEN IFILL: The second thing you mentioned was the rise or the sustained--
HAMID KARZAI: No, the militia.
GWEN IFILL: --the private militia.
HAMID KARZAI: Yes, the continuation.
GWEN IFILL: Continuation.
HAMID KARZAI: The continuation of private militia is something that
the Afghan people are really [inaudible]. It slows down our movement
towards building a nation that has institutional order, that has democracy,
that has the rule of law, that can collect taxes, that can pay for its
own bread and butter.
Therefore, in order for us in Afghanistan to have a state that is free
from terrorism, from drugs, we must attack all the three menaces that
are--that can, that do, enhance to make things difficult for us and
for the region, for the world. So private militias have to go.
We have a problem in Afghanistan called the DDR, disarmament, demobilization
and reintegration. Through this program we are trying to take weapons
away and those of them that want to be part of the national army, will
be taken in, others to the police. Others will be taken in the civilian
part of the economy.
GWEN IFILL: So far in that disarmament program only 6,000 of the 40,000
militia have been disarmed. Is that a success?
HAMID KARZAI: I am personally not happy with the way the disarmament
program has gone on, and the Afghan people are not happy, and they're
pressuring us very, very hard, pressuring us very, very hard to accomplish
what we have promised to them.
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GWEN IFILL: Let's talk about politics, Afghan style. In September you're
supposed to have elections. They've been delayed before. Will they happen?
HAMID KARZAI: They-- the elections delayed or postponed from June to
September was not a delay that was related to security or any other
matter. It was purely a technical delay because we were not ready with
the registration of voters. We need voters to go to elections, and the
voters were not registered.
 Yesterday
we had registered 3.7 million voters, and if this trend continues, by
the time of the election we hope very much to have more than 6 million
voters in Afghanistan. That should be good enough for us, a basis for,
to go to elections.
Yes, I'm very much looking forward to the elections. The Afghan people
are looking forward to the elections, and we will have it.
GWEN IFILL: Is it possible to have fair, free elections without security
stability?
HAMID KARZAI: No, no. That's a very good question because it also reminds
me of something that I forgot to tell you earlier.
GWEN IFILL: Okay.
HAMID KARZAI: The, the question of the removal of private militias is
also very important for free, fair and just elections in Afghanistan
so that the Afghan people can have the right to vote the way they want
without coercion, without intimidation.
GWEN IFILL: So can that happen in time for September, I guess?
HAMID KARZAI: Well, for that there are two other ways as well. One is
the deployment of NATO forces, which we hope will occur before, before
the elections. The other is the deployment of the national army and
the national police of Afghanistan to the extent possible in areas where
we fear there is private militias or warlordism, to go and address it.
But we will try both, and we will try other means as well to enable
Afghanistan to vote freely.
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GWEN IFILL: One of the most severe criticisms that have been lodged
against you is your, your willingness to--I don't know if the word is
negotiate or coalesce or meet with, at the very least, the warlords
or representatives of many of the people who people felt brought Afghanistan
down, even pre-Taliban.
 HAMID
KARZAI: Yes, yes, that is the feeling in the people in Afghanistan.
But a lot of the people that I speak to are part of that country, part
of that establishment, and they were part of the whole process which
was initiated by the international community.
And quite a few of them are, on the other hand, very respectable Afghans
that were part of the Afghan resistance against the Soviets. They are
part of the establishment. They are recognized persons in Afghanistan.
And after all, I'm the president of Afghanistan. I'm supposed to be
talking to all Afghans. It is my job to take Afghanistan peacefully
towards a better day. It is my job to take Afghanistan towards stability
by enhancing it, by talking to people. What should I do? Not talk to
them? Shun them away? Fight them? Is that my job, or is my job to create
an environment whereby the Afghan people begin to talk to each other,
whereby the Afghan people go to voting, go to elections by reaching
compromises, by reaching agreements. Aren't we beginning a democracy?
Isn't democracy about talking?
GWEN IFILL: Is there any danger, however, that you will endanger your
own credibility in these negotiations or these conversations?
HAMID KARZAI: You see, these gentlemen or these groups are the reality
of Afghanistan, and our organization is as good as the people in it.
You can't do without, without that. I have to talk to them.
But whether I will deviate from the path that we have taken, the path
of reform, the path of the building of Afghanistan, the path of institution
building, the path of ending corruption and warlordism, and drugs, and
fight against terrorism, never.
I have a platform. That platform is for a secure, stable, prosperous,
democratic Afghanistan. Now, whoever joins me in that platform for the
future of the country the Afghan people will like. And those who do
not join me will not be part of that platform regardless of who they
are.
GWEN IFILL: You have been quoted as saying that corruption is a mirage,
something you can't quite nail down. Is it a mirage or is it a roadblock
to democracy?
 HAMID
KARZAI: The ability of Afghanistan to attack corruption is--has many
sides. One is the weakness of the administrative system, which by itself
causes corruption. Second is the weakness of the judicial system which
was also weakened by years of war. Third is the weakness to really grab
someone, to find a fact.
I'm told sometimes that so-and-so is corrupt. And I say, "All right.
How is he corrupt? Can I have an evidence? Can I--if I call him to my
office and tell him, Mr. so-and-so, you are corrupt, can I tell him
this is what you have done and this is what you've--what I have on you
that you are corrupt, so get lost and I am going to dismiss you?"
Then we find out that we have no evidence. So when I say that it's a
mirage it's because I cannot catch the person that's corrupt and tell
him, "You are corrupt and you are fired." Now we have began
a number of institutional structures to address corruption. I've asked
the intelligence, I've asked the attorney general, I've asked others
to bring me even the slightest evidence against people that are corrupt,
and I will not ask for more, and I will act on it.
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GWEN IFILL: Final question for you. You're here in Washington to meet
with President Bush and to speak to a joint meeting of Congress. Do
you bring to this task any concern that Afghanistan has become the forgotten
war in the United States?
 HAMID
KARZAI: The United States has not forgotten Afghanistan, fortunately.
There was a feeling as the war in Iraq was beginning that perhaps Afghanistan
would be forgotten and we expected that we'd be forgotten. But after
the operations in Iraq began we found out that, no, the United States
remained focused on Afghanistan. Assistance to Afghanistan has actually
increased in the past two years. In the past year since Operation Iraq,
Afghanistan's receiving close to $2.2 billion this year from the United
States, and last year it received the same. And the United States has
made commitments for the future as well. It has not reduced its attention
to Afghanistan.
Whether we in Afghanistan require, need more attention, of course, we
do. But the attention that we are receiving today is alright and Iraq
has not affected it at all.
GWEN IFILL: Mr. President, thank you very much.
HAMID KARZAI: Thank you very much, ma'am. It's good to talk to you.
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