DETAINED JOURNALIST

September 14, 1999
		Freelance journalist and East Timor pro-independence activist Alan Nairn, currently detained in Dili, discusses his experiences with pro-Jakarta militias and the Indonesian military.

Online NewsHour Special Report: East Timor Independence Online Backgrounder: A look at East Timor's stormy history. Sept. 13, 1999: Two United Nations representatives discuss the creation of an East Timor peacekeeping force. Sept. 13, 1999: Indonesian President B.J. Habibie says he will allow international forces into East Timor. Sept. 10, 1999: Three experts discuss the international reaction to the militia violence in East Timor. Sept. 9, 1999: Samuel Berger on the East Timor crisis. Sept. 8, 1999: An interview with 1996 Nobel Peace Prize winner Jose Ramos-Horta. Sept. 7, 1999: Two experts discuss the militia activities in East Timor and how Indonesia and the U.N. can end them. Sept. 7, 1999: Indonesia institutes martial law in East Timor. Sept. 6, 1999: The Carter Center's lead vote monitor discusses the post-election violence. Sept. 3, 1999: East Timor chooses independence. Sept. 2, 1999: U.N. workers are killed as militia attacks continue. Sept. 1, 1999: Militias lead an uprising outside the U.N. compound. Oct. 25, 1996: Online Forum: Nobel Peace Prize winner Jose Ramos-Horta responds to viewer questions. June 2, 1998: Indonesia attempts to form a democratic government. May 22, 1998: A discussion on changes in the Indonesian government. May 21, 1998: Indonesia in the wake of Suharto's resignation. May 20, 1998: Should Suharto resign? May 19, 1998: Suharto announces plans to step down. May 15, 1998: A report on the riots in Jakarta. May 14, 1998: Students protest against Suharto. Nov. 13, 1996: A discussion with Jose Ramos-Horta. Oct. 11, 1996: Two East Timorese dissidents win the Nobel Peace Prize. Browse the NewsHour's coverage of Asia.     United Nations Mission in East Timor Indonesian Embassy in Washington National Council of Timorese Resistance U.S. Embassy in Jakarta Carter Center	MARGARET WARNER: Nearly 24 hours ago, the Indonesian police/military in East Timor detained Allan Nairn. He's an American freelance journalist and an activist with the pro-independence East Timor Action Network. The State Department today termed his detention "unfortunate." I spoke with Allan Nairn a short time ago by phone. I began by asking him to describe where he was. ALLAN NAIRN: I am being detained in military headquarters in Dili, Timor. MARGARET WARNER: Are you in a cell? What's the situation exactly? ALLAN NAIRN: No, I'm in a room in headquarters surrounded by soldiers. I was picked up this morning while walking around the streets of Dili, brought here by the military, and have been questioned, interrogated ever since.
	Keeping militias under control
	MARGARET WARNER: Tell us what you have observed really since the weekend, since the U.N. mission came in, and I gather that particular day things were pretty quiet. What did you see and witness since then? ALLAN NAIRN: Well, once the U.N. visitors left, they started up again with the targeted burning of houses, of independence supporters and offices, burning done by the militias and the military. It seems that they are trying to, one, punish independence supporters, and, two, just destroy any kind of infrastructure that's left in Timor. So now you can't find a store. You can't find a warehouse. It's all gone. It's all burnt and looted. And on the streets, some bodies have been left to rot in full public view. The militias, which operate out of this very base that I'm being held at, this very military base, they go out in their full militia uniforms, they roam the streets, still staging occasional attacks, although there really aren't many people left to attack. Tens of thousands have fled Dili and entire neighborhoods look to be abandoned. MARGARET WARNER: So are you telling us that this is a military base, but that these militias are also operating out of that base? In other words, you have both Indonesian military and these militias? ALLAN NAIRN: Yes. The whole portion of the base is located to the local militia group. When I came here, I saw then in the back in their black militia T-shirts. And I said to one of the officers, I said, "is that the militia?" He said, "yes. We have them here," he claimed, "to keep them under control." I saw them going out on their trucks and motor bikes to stage their attacks. Later in the day, I was brought to the police headquarters of Dili, and it was the same situation there. Uniform military would be mingling with uniformed militias. MARGARET WARNER: Did the activity change at all once President Habibie on Sunday had said that the international force would be a lowed to come in? Did anything change? ALLAN NAIRN: Not really. The days since then have been pretty much the same. The main change now is that there is rising fear among the Timorese because almost all of the international observers have been driven out.
	A nerve center for the militia
	MARGARET WARNER: Now, in the military camp where you are, what's going on there? How much can you observe, first of all? ALLAN NAIRN: Well, earlier in the day, I was sitting at a place where I could observe a lot, and you saw the militia constantly going in and out. There was a -- there were some vehicles that the militia used that have their name painted on them. They were parked right here on the base side by side with the military intelligence vans with the blacked out windows that I often saw earlier in the week cruising the city during militia attacks. They would be the only non-militia vehicles on the street at the time. So this is clearly a nerve center for the militia. MARGARET WARNER: You had said something to our reporter, Dan Sagalyn, about you saw some burning of files. Tell us about that. ALLAN NAIRN: Yes. At the police headquarters, as I was being interrogated this morning, the police intelligence people were hauling out their own files and burning them in a bonfire. They said that, as one of my interrogators, a captain named Napoleon put it, he said Timor is about to become a free country, and that meant that they would be leaving within a week or so. So they had their files of interrogation profiles and surveillance of Timorese activist, and they were now burning them because he said they were preparing to leave. MARGARET WARNER: Tell me something. It's surprising really that, one, they speak to you that frankly, and also that they re allowing you to use a cell phone to talk to us. Explain that. ALLAN NAIRN: Well, I'm not the usual interrogation subject. Usually it's a Timorese person on whom they feel free to use electroshock, knives, iron bars. I've interviewed a number of Timorese who have been held prisoner in this very military headquarters building where I am right now, and they described horrible, sustained torture. But because I'm an American citizen, a journalist, also somewhat politically notorious in Timor, I think they figure that they can't get away with that kind of thing. So there's no physical danger to me. And they give me a great deal of space. MARGARET WARNER: All right. Well, Allan, thank you very much, and be safe. ALLAN NAIRN: All right. Thank you. MARGARET WARNER: Nairn said he'd been told he would be taken to Indonesia for further questioning.