Online NewsHour: Newsmaker--William Cohen -- October 9, 1997

NEWSMAKER: WILLIAM COHEN

October 9, 1997

NEWSHOUR TRANSCRIPT

Defense Secretary William Cohen has issued a warning to Iraqi President Saddam Hussein. US military jets stepped up their patrols of Iraq's no-fly zone, and Secretary Cohen says they will use their fire power, if necessary. He discusses his job, heightened tension in the Middle East, and his recent trip to Bosnia with Jim Lehrer.

A RealAudio version of this segment is available.
NEWSHOUR LINKS:
September 25, 1997
A farewell interview with Gen. Shalikashvili, outgoing Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff.
September 23, 1997:
National Security Adviser Samuel Berger on U.S. troops' departure from Bosnia.
Browse the NewsHour's coverage of military, Bosnia and the Middle East.
OUTSIDE LINKS
U.S. Department of Defense

JIM LEHRER: It was nine months ago that William Cohen, the just retired Republican Senator from Maine, became Secretary of Defense in the Democratic administration of President Clinton. He joins us now for a Newsmaker interview. Mr. Secretary, welcome.
WILLIAM COHEN, Secretary of Defense: Good to be here.
Shutting down Saddam Hussein's game of hide-and-seek.
JIM LEHRER: This warning that you issued to Saddam Hussein today, what's going on?
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: Well, I think Saddam Hussein is probing for weaknesses, trying to flaunt the ban on the no-fly zones, sending his aircraft in on a sort of a quick kind of run and hide-and-seek, and so we have sent a message that we're going to enforce that no-fly zone, and to the extent that it has aircraft across that 33rd parallel. They are going to risk being shot down.
JIM LEHRER: And that is in process. I mean, the word has gone to U.S. planes. You see--you catch an Iraqi plane in there, shoot 'em down.
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: The word has gone forth that any violations will be strictly dealt with, and that would include shooting them down.
JIM LEHRER: Now, Iran has been doing the same thing, right, from the other side?
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: Iran last week--a little bit more than a week ago did have some incursions, but I have not detected any since that time, and we have not detected any. So it really is Iraqi violations to this point.
JIM LEHRER: Well, what are they each up to? Is there a problem between Iran and Iraq, and that's what's causing these violations?
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: I think prior to Iran coming across into Iraqi territory to strike what they consider to be terrorist camps that Saddam Hussein was intent on trying to break the no-fly zone prohibitions. And so I think he's using this as an excuse to see how far he can go, how much he can get away with, how strictly we're going to enforce those rules. And so he's probing. He's probing the weaknesses to see what our resolve is and the message should go forth. Our resolve is very strong on this, so is that of our allies. I've talked to our British counterparts, the French, and others. And so we intend to enforce those very strictly.
JIM LEHRER: Is there a danger that the United States could get caught in a resurgence in an Iran-Iraqi war, get in the middle?
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: I don't think there's that danger. I think the danger is for Iraqi planes to fly in the no-fly zone, or should Iranian planes be in that zone, they, of course, would bear a risk also. It's very difficult.
Both Iraq and Iran bear a substantial risk.
JIM LEHRER: Because we'd shoot them down too, right?
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: Well, we have no way of telling in a time of split second decisions as to whether it's an Iraqi plane or an Iranian plane. So the message is for the Iraqis. To the extent that there are other aircraft in the region flying in that zone, then they bear a substantial risk.
JIM LEHRER: Give us a feel for how serious a matter this is, the aircraft carrier, Nimitz, is on its way there. Is this a big deal potentially?
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: Well, we ordered the Nimitz to sail five days sooner as a signal to Saddam Hussein that we're serious. And obviously that adds to the fire power that we have in the region, which is substantial. But to the extent that we need to augment it in any fashion that's a pretty good signal and a symbol that we intend to do so.
JIM LEHRER: But you don't see this escalating into some big deal.
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: I don't see it escalating unless Saddam Hussein decides to take on the United Nations once again and the U.S. and French and the British aircraft that are flying to protect those no-fly zones.
JIM LEHRER: And no indication at this point that he intends to do that?
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: No. I think that what they do is they skitter across the line, they see our planes coming, and get right back in line, and go home. So they're constantly sort of out there teasing and testing, and we want to make sure that they don't go too far, and if they do, they'll pay for it.
Planning the troop withdrawl from Bosnia.
JIM LEHRER: Okay. On Bosnia, Mr. Secretary, some confusion has developed as to when the United States troops are actually going to leave. Is it still June of next year?
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: I recently completed a trip to Maestricht where we had a conference of all the NATO defense ministers and there was unanimous agreement that S-FOR's mission was going to end in June of '98. President Clinton has indicated--
JIM LEHRER: S-FOR is the--
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: Stabilization force.
JIM LEHRER: That's the stabilization force that's there now.
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: That's going to end in June of 1998, and what we have to do is to do everything we can between now and then to see that we can enforce the compliance with the Dayton Accords. President Clinton has indicated that he believes the international community has a longer-term interest in the stability of the region, and as does the United States. What form that interest will take, will be manifested, remains to be decided. They have been--there has been no decision made--what we intended to--as a United--the NATO alliance, itself, is to make sure that we take whatever measures we can to enforce compliance between now and June, but no decision beyond that. Obviously, there will be an interest reflected by the international community. WE will have an interest, but no decision has been made beyond that period of time.
Secondly, Congress will have a major role to play in this. Congress has indicated that it will terminate funding as of June of '98 unless the President comes forward with some rationale, an explanation, as for a need to be there, in what numbers, how long, how much, and what that would do to readiness and morale, so that Congress wants to play a significant role, as they should, and this is something that we will have to work with Congress on if the United States is going to play a role beyond June of '98. No decision has been made at this point.
JIM LEHRER: Gen. Shalikashvili in his farewell interview here on this program a week or so ago said that he thought it was generally a mistake, as in Bosnia, to give any kind of deadline as to when troops are going to go in, or when they're going to come out because what that does is invite mischief. Do you agree with him?
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: As a general proposition I think he's absolutely correct. In this particular case because of the circumstances in which we went in and because of the controversy about the U.S. involvement.

No-Fly Zone in the studio.
JIM LEHRER: Sorry about the fly there, Mr. Secretary. You're doing very well. You're holding up very well.
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: As long as it's not one of Saddam Hussein's planes it's okay. But I think as a general proposition setting time lines is not helpful. In this particular case it has served a very positive and solitary benefit, namely it has forced all of the countries to focus their energies on what we can do between now and next June. As a result, you're seeing a great deal of momentum take place. The farmers are going back into the fields; our troops have done just an outstanding job in keeping the peace. No killing is taking place. Children are able to play in the streets without being sniped at by those sniped again from great distances. So we're seeing the economy start to take hold. A great deal of progress has been made. We had 10 war indictees who've turned themselves in voluntarily this past week.
JIM LEHRER: They're Croats, right. Yes.
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: And a lot of progress is being made. So we intend to intensify our efforts to see to it that we can do as much as we can between now and next June.
JIM LEHRER: Has Bosnia been the most difficult problem you've dealt with as Secretary of Defense these last nine months?
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: It hasn't been the most difficult. It's a difficult issue for all of the countries involved, but I must say I come back to the principle that we should all be very proud of the young men and women who are serving not only from the United States; they're doing a terrific job, but from all of the nations who were there. There are some 30 plus nations who are sharing in that effort. Russian soldiers are standing alongside of U.S. soldiers as well. And so Bosnia has been a problem, obviously, to deal with, but it's one that our soldiers are measuring up to magnificently.
JIM LEHRER: What has been the impact--moving on to some other things--what has been the impact of the sex harassment and abuse scandal in the military in the various services in terms of morale and other factors?
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: From my vantage point it has had very little impact. I have made every effort to go around to visit all of our training centers. I've been out in the field visiting with soldiers, Marines, sailors, airmen, Coast Guard men. I just came back--my wife, Janet, and I were in Bosnia together. There is very little concern out in the field where our men and women are performing on a day to day basis in a fashion that the American people are really very, very proud of and should be proud of. And so I don't see that it's having much of an impact out in the field as such. The problems that we have will be addressed. They are being dealt with. Sex in the military is obviously a problem that we have to contend with but it's a problem for all of America, in corporate America, throughout our communities, on the Internet. We are going to deal with it in a fashion as we have dealt with the problems of racism in the past, of drug abuse in the past. We'll deal with this problem as well.
JIM LEHRER: Do you feel you're on top of it now, and you feel it's behind you? Is it still an ongoing problem?
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: No. It's still an ongoing problem, obviously, when we're talking about gender integration and the problems that have persisted in terms of stereotypes and how people have treated each other in the past, but I think that we will deal with it in a very constructive and ultimately very successful fashion.

General Ralston's waylayed nomination as Chairman of the Joint Chief of Staff.
JIM LEHRER: Was the decision not to promote Gen. Ralston, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, the most difficult decision you've had to make these last nine months?
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: Well, first of all, I did not submit his name for nomination but he was one of my top choices, obviously. I think it was difficult for him; it was difficult for me because I think he was treated unfairly. I believe that he would have been an outstanding chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff. He is performing admirably today as Vice Chair.
JIM LEHRER: Vice chair. He's still vice chairman.
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: Yes. He is. And on a--
JIM LEHRER: Sorry about that.
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: On a day-to-day basis he does an outstanding job. But he and now the new chairman, Hugh Sheldon, will make a terrific team. And so it was I think difficult for him because he has an outstanding record as a member of the Air Force and now as a member of the Joint Chiefs of Staff. He has just done a terrific job. He enjoys the confidence of virtually everyone. The President has him--holds him in very high regard. Gen. Shalikashvili, in his retirement ceremony, mentioned how important he is to us. I mentioned him. It was difficult, I think unfortunate, but he's a true professional, and he is serving admirably today.

A Republican in a Democratic cabinet.
JIM LEHRER: Mr. Secretary, when you came in, of course, as I said, you were a Republican, and there were a lot of questions, hey, there's a Republican going into a Democratic cabinet. How has that worked, the fact of being a Republican in a Democratic cabinet?
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: Well, it may be a new enterprise as such but it has worked just on a magnificent level. The President has treated me with the same care and comfort that he would any Democrat. I have a great relationship with the Secretary of State, Madeleine Albright, with our national security adviser, Sandy Berger. We have a terrific team. We work together very closely. Whatever disagreements there are we work out in a very cordial basis, and I am treated as one of the family. And I treat them as family members as well, and so it's a good team.
JIM LEHRER: You've worked with him closely now for nine months. What's your impression of President Clinton?

President Clinton: a "most capable person."
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: I think he's one of the most capable people to ever hold that office certainly during my lifetime and my involvement in politics. He's very intelligent. He absorbs an enormous amount of information. He is--has a very curious mind, and wide-ranging and a variety of areas of interest, and is able to not only absorb the information but digest it, collate it, and to use some analytical powers, which I think are quite extraordinary.
JIM LEHRER: Does he care about these things we've been talking about?
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: He does, indeed, and, in fact, I write a memo to him once a week, and he reads every memo and brings it to my attention on our subsequent meetings.
JIM LEHRER: How would you describe your relationship with him?
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: Very cordial, friendly. It's a very good relationship. It's a very positive one and one that I enjoy immensely.
JIM LEHRER: You went from being a United States Senator where you had freedom to speak out any given day about anything that you wanted to, to being now a member of a team. Has that been frustrating to you when you hear a story like tapes involving the White House, you've been a United States Senator, you might have gone to the floor of the Senate and said something--is that a problem for you, or not?
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: No, it's not a problem. I'm part of the administration, part of a team, and I knew that when I accepted the position, and I act accordingly. I think the biggest constraint that I feel is that as Secretary of Defense my words may carry a little more weight than they do as a Senator so that I might be able to say anything I'd like to say on the Senate floor, and few people beyond perhaps the immediate beltway and my own constituents back in Maine might have noticed. As Secretary of Defense every word is measured, every word carries certain implications, even though silence can imply certain thing, so I have to be a bit more cautious and constrained, and that's something that I've learned to do quite quickly.

Not much time for writing or poetry.
JIM LEHRER: Now, when you were a United States Senator you were also a writer of fiction and of poetry. Are you still doing that as Secretary of Defense?
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: Not much time for writing these days. I did some writing prior to taking the job, but it will not be published until after I leave.
JIM LEHRER: I mean, are you planning to write about your experiences when you do leave?
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: At some point I hope to capture some of my experiences certainly in non-fiction but hopefully even in fiction. As a fellow writer you understand nothing that occurs during our lifetime goes unnoticed by the mind and it eventually winds its way into fictional accounts.
JIM LEHRER: Is this a job your into?
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: I am really enjoying this job. It's one of the most difficult, challenging, and stimulating jobs that one could ever hope to have. The days and nights are long, and can be exhausting, but they're exhilarating as well. And I take a great deal of pleasure in being able to really represent the men and women who are serving in the military and to do my level best to see to it that we take as good care of them as they're taking care of us.

"Every decision I make has consequences for everyone."
JIM LEHRER: Do you feel it matters, what you're doing?
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: It absolutely matters. Every day, every decision I make has consequence for everyone that is involved in providing for the security of our country.
JIM LEHRER: And you're aware of that as you go about your day?
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: I am indeed. I sign every deployment order, no--the troops don't move unless I sign those deployment orders. I read them carefully. I want to know where our troops are going at any given time, and so I look upon them as our sons and daughters and want to make sure that I take as much care and concern for them as I would my own sons.
JIM LEHRER: Mr. Secretary, thank you.
SEC. WILLIAM COHEN: Thank you.

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