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PARTY SHOWDOWNMay 12, 1998The NewsHour with Jim Lehrer Transcript |
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Partisan rancor has risen to new heights in the House committee investigating campaign finance abuses. Democrats are calling for the removal of Rep. Dan Burton (R-IN) for his release of the Webster Hubbell tapes. Can Congress overcome the delays and disruptions and continue its investigation? After a background report, Rep. Henry Waxman (D-CA) and Rep. John Mica (R-FL) address the issue. You can also participate in an online forum regarding congressional investigations of the president.
MARGARET WARNER: And now the Republican perspective. It comes from Congressman John Mica of Florida, also a committee member. Welcome, Congressman. Your response or your reading of what Chairman Burton was trying to do today and what he said today.
A RealAudio version of this segment is available.
NEWSHOUR LINKS:
May 12, 1998:
A background report on the partisan rancor in the House Government Reform and Oversight Committee.
May 12, 1998:
Rep. Henry Waxman discusses the partisan showdown.
May 19, 1998:
Participate in an Online Forum on congressional investigations of the president.
May 8, 1998:
A report on Dan Burton's release of the Hubbell tapes.
May 6, 1998:
A debate over executive privilege with two former White House counsels.
May 1, 1998:
Our pundits discuss the war of words between Mr. Gingrich and Mr. Clinton.
May 1, 1998:
A report on the week's developments in the Starr Investigation.
April 30, 1998:
The NewsHour's commentators assess the President's press conference.
April 17, 1998:
Our pundits discuss Kenneth Starr, Paula Jones & a poll of government leaders.
Browse the Online NewsHour's coverage of the White House and Shields & Gigot.
OUTSIDE LINKS:
The U.S. Senate.
The U.S. House of Representatives.
The White House home page.
Praise for Chairman Burton's efforts.
REP. JOHN MICA, (R-FL): Well, I think Chairman Burton tried to lay out on the House floor for the members and for the public the pattern of obstruction of justice, obstruction of this investigation that we have had to endure during the past months, being blocked at every turn by Democratic committee members and a concerted effort by the White House. I think he laid it out very well.
MARGARET WARNER: You heard Congress Waxman say that, in fact, he had been ready for a much more bipartisan investigation and it was Congressman Burton who didn't want that.
REP. JOHN MICA: Well, that's--I think that's so much political rhetoric. The fact is Mr. Waxman and the White House and the administration, the DNC have done everything they can to stall this investigation. We've only held 14 hearings to date. Now the issue gets a little bit close to Mr. Waxman. One involves the Chinese individual who's been involved in funneling cigarette money. And he's blocked the immunity that's even recommended by their own Department of Justice, so they may try to make Dan Burton or some minor problem with the investigation the major issue. And--
MARGARET WARNER: Well--
REP. JOHN MICA: They're just diverting attention away from their troubles.
MARGARET WARNER: Well, now Congressman Waxman seemed to be suggesting--he was suggesting that if Republicans on the committee would, as he said, take back more power from Congressman Burton, that the Democrats would be willing perhaps to vote for immunity tomorrow, and--
"They don't want this investigation on any front to proceed; they want to try to get by the November elections; and that's what this is about. Dan Burton is not the issue."
REP. JOHN MICA: That's just--that's another one of these tangential issues. This is a detraction issue. The issue is whether we--whether they close down the investigation. Mr. Burton has the support of every one on the committee to proceed. The Justice Department agreed with granting immunity. They just want to stall. This is a stalling tactic, and you in the media have fallen victim to their rhetoric. They don't want this investigation on any front to proceed; they want to try to get by the November elections; and that's what this is about. Dan Burton is not the issue. This is granting immunity tomorrow to four individuals who've been recommended by the Department of Justice. One of them happens to funnel Chinese cigarette money into Democratic National coffers, and I'm sure it's making Mr. Waxman have heartburn.
MARGARET WARNER: Well, I'm afraid we can't get Mr. Waxman to respond on that point, but are you saying then that you think tomorrow the immunity vote is going to go just the way it did before?
REP. JOHN MICA: Absolutely. There's no question. This is, again, not about Dan Burton. This is about stalling this. They've wasted about a month now. They've done this with everything, with documents we've tried to get. He said they gave us two million documents. They've given us menus from Charlie Trie's restaurants. They've given us blank pages from the White House. They have played a game that verges on obstruction of justice. And really I'm concerned because it's obstruction of the congressional process, an oversight process that's so important to keep our government and this elections process clean. And they have been caught with dirty hands, and they just don't like it.
MARGARET WARNER: So do you think it would be a good idea--as has been reported, Speaker Gingrich is considering that if the immunity vote goes the same way tomorrow and you all are essentially frustrated in your ability to call these four witnesses, that at least that part of the investigation would be turned over to a committee where you already have a two thirds majority?
REP. JOHN MICA: Well, I serve on both those committees. I'm the only one that serves on both of them-- House Oversight and Government Reform & Oversight. I think we're prepared to take that, but we're not prepared to close down the investigations. Every time we've investigated--if you'll notice--the Department of Justice has acted. Every time we investigate, you find more people being indicted or pleading. So we think that we should get to the bottom of this. People want the current laws enforced. They want oversight of what's gone on in the elections, and they want the process cleaned up. And that's what we're going to do, and we're going to do it with or without Mr. Waxman's cooperation.
Do Republicans want Chairman Burton to keep his position in the committee?
MARGARET WARNER: Would you say that you and your fellow Republicans are completely behind having Chairman Burton retain his chairmanship of this committee?
REP. JOHN MICA: Absolutely. Mr. Burton is not the question. The question is whether they stop this investigation in its tracks. And look at what they've done so far. We've lost about a month. And we'll lose more time in this process. They don't want this to continue, and the path of every one of these, we'd be glad to look at Republican abuses; we'd be glad to look at all the Democrat abuses; but each time we see an incredible unprecedented amount of foreign money coming in to Democratic coffers. And that's even by the press's own investigation. This is a precedent in the history of our republic, and we need to get at the bottom of it, and I don't know why they're trying to block it.
MARGARET WARNER: Congressman, I have to ask you this. You keep saying that Mr. Burton isn't the issue, but Speaker Gingrich was quoted as telling Congressman Burton last weekend in a closed-door meeting that he should be embarrassed by the way the tapes matter was handled. You're quoted in Newsweek this week, saying it's very frustrating that so much attention is focused on Chairman Burton, rather than alleged abuses by the White House. Who is to blame for this?
REP. JOHN MICA: Well, I think there was a mistake made, and Republicans admit their mistake, and one of our staffers took a hint, and he resigned, Dave Bossick. It wasn't handled properly, and the Speaker said that; Mr. Burton said that; and Mr. Bossi said that. That's not the issue. We're talking about tapes from a convicted felon who has no rights or privileges. We're not talking about releasing tapes of children, as Mr. Waxman said, of their children's conversation. And we made them available. A mistake was made. Don't make that little issue overshadow the tremendous infusion of foreign money, illegal activity, and cover-up that we're seeing going on. And that's what they want to do.
MARGARET WARNER: All right. Well, Congressman, thank you very much.
REP. JOHN MICA: Thank you.
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