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| CEASE-FIRE AGREEMENT | |
 October 17, 2000  |
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After a background report, two representatives discuss today's cease-fire agreement between Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Barak and Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat.
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MARGARET WARNER: Joining us from Jerusalem are two key advisers to Prime Minister Barak and to Palestinian leader Arafat. Dan Meridor, chairman of the Foreign Affairs and defense committee in the Israeli Knesset, and a member of the Center Party that's part of Prime Minister Barak's governing coalition; and Faisal Al Husseini, a member of the Palestine liberation organization executive committee and the senior Palestinian official responsible for Jerusalem. MARGARET WARNER: Gentlemen, this agreement was announced about midday today, and the fighting continued throughout the day. Mr. Husseini, when is it going to stop?
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| Stopping the violence on the ground | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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MARGARET WARNER: So, what are you looking for specifically, or what do you think they are looking for specifically on the ground? FAISAL AL HUSSEINI: I believe, at first, some would insist that Israelis totally must stop it; they must withdraw to the areas that they were before this clashes, this from one side; from the other point, that the language that they are talking to us. The problem here is that we are listening carefully to the Israeli side. The Israeli side is listening carefully to us. And if we will continue the statements like, "Yasser Arafat is not a partner for peace," that, "we will not stop until the Palestinians will do, one, two, three, four," and this will bring reaction from the Palestinian side, and this will create a real problem. So what we are in need is, first off, to see that the Israelis are withdrawing from the sensitive areas, and this will help us. I can't say that it will bring immediately the calmness, but it will help us to go ahead and bring a real stability. MARGARET WARNER: So Mr. Meridor, what do you think it's going to take to stop the violence?
Unfortunately we heard on the ground from people, Fatah people, other people saying, "we will continue." I hope he is able to restore calm by saying, "stop violence." He has undertaken to do so. Second, stop incitement. The Palestinian television and radio are under his control. And until recently, they spoke very, very tough language, speaking like, "killing the Jews will never stop," and things of this sort. And the third thing is to call back to prison all the people of the extreme Islamic organizations, Hamas, Islamic Jihad, who threaten to try to carry out explosive, difficult terrorist attacks on Israel. If these three things are done in the coming hours, then, I believe, we can restore calm and reassess what happened and try to be on the track again. MARGARET WARNER: But Mr. Meridor, you seem to both be saying that each side's waiting for the other side to make the first move. How can you ever get off the dime if each one is taking that attitude? DAN MERIDOR: No, I did not say this. I did not say this. There was an agreement reached at Sharm el-Sheikh, and it was quite specific. And the two leaders had to issue orders, and Mr. Barak, about two hours ago, issued a statement. He ordered Israeli forces to do whatever is necessary under the agreement. We wait for Mr. Arafat to do the same. Then, subsequently, we went to see the firing and the violence stopping, and we will do our part. And I understand orders were given already on our side. I hope they were given on the other side, because what is at stake here is very high-risk if we don't stop it now.
FAISAL AL HUSSEINI: I believe, yes, that Arafat did, that we must calm the situation and stop any kind of attacks. But, you know, the people, when they are hearing the Israelis saying that they want to bring nonviolence, but they are seeing in their eyes and hearing their helicopters over some cities, rockets are bombing refugee camps, as it happened today, this is what I hear. I hope that is not, but this is the information that I have. To threaten the city of Beit Jalla that will be bombed and asking 16 houses to be evacuated from their people because it will be bombed. Maybe they will not bomb, but this in itself, this language can bring difficult results. About those three points that Mr. Meridor was talking, I would like to say that for the people of Hamas and Jihad who have been released, and they were released in the moment that the public centers were threatened to be bombed by the Israelis. And most of them, they came back by their own desire to the Palestinians and submitted themselves to the Palestinians. Those who are not, they will be under... we are searching for them. But, for the second one, the incitement, actually, that very man who was calling for such incitement and which can understanding from this that using violence and maybe even killing others, this man is already in the prison. He caused a big problem for us in Gaza, but he is in the prison. And so we are making our efforts from this point of view. But what we are asking also the Israelis to stop telling these stories about, we have no partner for peace; Yasser Arafat is not a partner for peace, or he is the leader of the enemies of peace. This will not help. |
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| Putting Barak and Arafat to the test | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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MARGARET WARNER: Mr. Meridor, the beginning of the agreement also calls for both leaders to publicly declare, "it's time for an end to the violence." Has Prime Minister Barak done that, and has chairman Arafat done that? DAN MERIDOR: Well, Prime Minister Barak has done that two hours ago. It was published on Israeli TV. I just saw it about two hours ago. Unfortunately, we heard at noon the statement by President Clinton, noon our time, and four hours later, a man was critically wounded, and two other people were wounded in Jerusalem, being shot at from a neighboring Arab/Palestinian village under their authority. We did not react because we want to keep calm. But this, of course, cannot go on. I think that what is needed now is really a test of leadership. You know, Mr. Arafat spoke of the peace of the brave.
Stop the violence now. We were so close to an agreement at Camp David. I spent about two weeks there incarcerated with 12 Americans and 12 Palestinians and 12 of our people. And it was such a shame and a pity that instead of going on negotiating, he turned the table on us and went to the streets. It's time to stop it and try to restore calm and try to reach agreements. It's needed in the area. MARGARET WARNER: Mr. Husseini, has Chairman Arafat said anything publicly about ending the violent demonstration, and if not, why not? FAISAL AL HUSSEINI: I believe that he's already given this order, and he asked his security forces to take care about this matter. But about courage steps and position, Yasser Arafat took the most important courage steps and because he was telling his people things that his people were not ready to accept it, Yasser Arafat, the last several years he was forced to go sometimes in clashes with other fractions of the PLO. And he lost the support of a lot of Palestinians, but he went on and he continued because he believes in the peace of courage, and it is so. And I believe that he is continuing doing such. But the problem here is that people are forgetting what Yasser Arafat accepted when we accepted the 242 Resolution. It means that we told our people, "forget about 78% of the land that you believe that it is your land and 50% of the land that has been given to you by the U.N." So it was not a simple matter to do. It was a real difficult job, but Yasser Arafat is doing it, and he is going on doing it, accepting also agreement against all this propaganda and media war against him. It was also a courageous step, coming back here and being under autonomy and not as the head of a state. It was also a very difficult matter. So we'd like just to remind that these steps have been taken by the Palestinian leadership. |
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| Can the leaders control the people? | |||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
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MARGARET WARNER: Mr. Meridor, you heard earlier Mr. Husseini say essentially, Arafat can't just turn off this violence. How confident are you that Mr. Arafat can bring an end to the violence, that all the factions in the Palestinian movement will actually obey him if he gives this order or now that he has, if Mr. Al Husseini is correct?
And I really think that this is the test for him, because along the history that both of us sitting here know on our own experience, so many opportunities were missed, and if I may say so, by the Palestinian side, all the offers that were made, all the compromises were rejected. Now there was one, there is one on the table. I don't like all of it. I don't dislike all of it. But it's for the basis of negotiation. It was rejected. Let's not miss this opportunity again. And we made this very clear. We will have to either negotiate or react to violence. We will not have both. And if Mr. Arafat thinks that the support of Saddam Hussein from Iraq, and the Iranian support in Arabia today, and Hezbollah and others is the right way, I think he will bring tragedy again and not peace and not future. So it is very important that he does everything he can, if he wants to, and I hope he wants to. Stop the violence in every form, stop incitement, restore order, and then we will reassess the situation together and see how we can proceed. MARGARET WARNER: Mr. Husseini, we're almost out of time, but could you respond to that? FAISAL AL HUSSEINI: Yes. I would like to say that, of course, it is
unfair to compare the rockets and tanks with stones and maybe someone
who is shooting here and there. It is unfair to compare this with that.
But in the same time, I would like to say also to the Israeli side,
we are going to have a peace process. If you would like to do that,
you mustn't also call those enemies of that peace who tried to stop
this peace process before, and because this will put the Palestinians
in the same side. MARGARET WARNER: All right. Well, gentlemen, thank you both very much. |
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FAISAL
AL HUSSEINI: Actually, it is a real problem, because the order of the
Palestinian people was... it was not a certain order. It is not an army
that will give the order, stop, and then they will stop immediately.
It is a procedure that those people must see that there is something
changed on the ground, which will help us bringing stability. And we
hope that the Israelis will understand that and will not go into actions,
which can destroy the whole matter. 
DAN
MERIDOR: It's a crucial time, the coming 48 hours, and a strategic decision
is to be made. Are we going for violence or for peace? If we want to
stop violence, three things should happen, as we can see it: One, simply
stop violence. And, I believe, that we were led to believe that Mr.
Arafat is in charge, and if he says, "stop violence," they
will listen to him. 
MARGARET
WARNER: So Mr. Husseini, has Mr. Arafat given similar orders? 
DAN
MERIDOR: I have to admit that our assumption was, and we were led to
believe that he is the leader. If there is anyone there who can give
orders and who may be obeyed, it is Mr. Arafat. If it appears that he
has no control over the street, then the question to us is: Why do we
negotiate with him? When we have an agreement, if he cannot implement
it, he's not the negotiator, not the partner. I don't elect the people
to lead the Palestinian partner. They chose Mr. Arafat. I think he can
do it. It may be difficult. It's not easy. It's not easy in Israel,
as well. It's hard. But this is the issue. 
I
mean, someone who is calling for a unified emergency government, and
he would like to unify his internal front, it means that he is going
to the external front. And this will push the Palestinians to put Yasser
Arafat under pressure to unify his internal front. And that will lead
to escalation. So, I hope that we will hear from the Israelis their
positions and not to go on threatening us with a unified emergency government,
because the reaction will not help neither us nor them.