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SIR
DAVID FROST: I met with President George W. Bush in the Map Room
here at the White House for an interview on the eve of his historic
visit to the U.K.; his historic state visit, the first by an American
president for more than 80 years. There was much else to discuss,
of course, as well as the visit.
Looking
Forward to London
SIR DAVID FROST: Mr. President, a lot of people say this might
be your first trip to London, but it's not.
 PRESIDENT
GEORGE W. BUSH: No, it's not. I've been there a couple of times.
I remember Laura and I went to see "Cats" in London.
Gosh, I remember going to some nice pubs -- when I was drinking
man - in London. It's a great city, and I'm looking forward to
going.
SIR DAVID FROST: Well, we're looking forward to see you there, too. In fact,
of course, you're famous for the fact that normally social - dressing
up socially is not your favorite thing, and you once said that
marvelous quote, "Read my lips; no new tuxes."
PRESIDENT
BUSH: (Laughs.) That's right.
SIR DAVID FROST: Are you going to take a new tux this time?
PRESIDENT
BUSH: Well, I'm going to take a tux, and I'm going to take a -
tails. And I - don't tell anybody, but I had to rent them.
SIR DAVID FROST: (Chuckles.)
PRESIDENT
BUSH: (Chuckles) - I'm looking forward to it. It's a huge honor
to be invited by Her Majesty to stay in Buckingham Palace. It's
hard to imagine me even considering staying in Buckingham Palace
when I was living in Midland, Texas.
SIR DAVID FROST: What would you like to see come out of this trip in terms
of - in addition to the fun part?
PRESIDENT
BUSH: Well, I've got some business to do with Tony Blair. We've
got a lot of things to discuss. We're going to talk about how
to continue to spread freedom and peace, we'll talk about how
to work the compassion agenda on the AIDS Initiative, for example.
There's been some time talking about that. I value his advice,
and I - every time I visit with him, whether it be on phone or
on video, or in person, I come away with a - you know, he's got
some interesting ideas about how to advance a positive agenda.
Secondly, I look forward to speaking to the people of your great
country. I have a chance to give a speech, to talk about the importance
of our relationship - the unique relationship between America
and Great Britain - and I'll have a chance to answer some questions,
I'm certain, from the - from what we call the Fourth Estate here,
the mighty media, and I look forward to it.
Praising
Britain's Leader
 SIR
DAVID FROST: And Tony Blair, on Monday night - and he will probably
have told you he's expecting there to be quite a lot of protesters
about the war. What would - what would be your message to those
protesters?
PRESIDENT
BUSH: Well, freedom is a beautiful thing, I would first say, and
it's - aren't you lucky to be in a country that encourages people
to speak their mind? And I value going to a country where people
are free to say anything they want to say.
Secondly,
I would say that I understand you don't like war, and neither
do I. But I would hope you understand that I have learned the
lessons of September the 11th, 2001, and that terrorists declared
war on the United States of America and war on people that love
freedom, and I intend to lead our nation - along with others,
like our close friends in Great Britain - to win this war on terror;
that war is my last choice, not my first choice, but I have obligation
as the president to keep our country secure.
SIR DAVID FROST: And at the same time, you'll be working with Tony Blair.
And what is the key to your working together so well? I mean,
it's like you have a special relationship. Is partially the bond
the bond of - that you're both men of strong faith?
PRESIDENT
BUSH: I think so. Tony is a man of strong faith. You know, the
key to my relationship with Tony is he tells the truth and he
tells you what he thinks. And when he says he's going to do something,
he's going to do it. I trust him, therefore. I have seen him --
under some tough, tough circumstances -- stand strong, and I appreciate
that in a person. The other thing I admire about Tony Blair is
that he has got a vision beyond the current; in other words, he
can see a world that is peaceful. And he agrees with me that the
spread of democracy and freedom in parts of the world where there's
violence and hatred will help change the world, that there are
reformers in the Middle East that long for democracy, that long
to live in a free world. And Tony Blair, like me, agrees - you
know, kind of rejects the elitist point of view that only a certain
type of person can adapt to habits of freedom and democracy, and
he knows that freedom in the Middle East will help change that
world in dramatic fashion.
Speaking
to International Opponents
SIR DAVID FROST: And in terms - as you look at the world, Mr.
President, at the moment, and you see that the protesters in Australia
or wherever they are, and you see that poll that came out in the
EU - poll the other day that showed that the United States was
second among the most dangerous countries in terms of war in the
world, level, for God's sake, with North Korea and Iran. When
you see things like that, do you think the world is out of step
with America or America is out of step with the world?
 PRESIDENT
BUSH: (Chuckles.) Well, first of all, you have got to know I don't
pay attention to polls. I just don't. I have got a job to do for
the American people. It's a job that was changed on September
the 11th, 2001, and I refuse to - I refuse to forget the - I will
never forget the lesson, is a better way to put it, of what happened
to this country. And there are terrorists who are willing to kill
innocent life in order to create fear and chaos. There are terrorists
who want the free world to retreat from duties so that they can
impose Taliban-type governments and enslave people. There are
people like Saddam Hussein, who tortured and maimed and killed,
and at the same time threatened and created conditions of instability.
And I know some people don't understand the need to deal with
that, but I feel firmly we must deal with those issues.
SIR DAVID FROST: But do you need to woo people more in the rest of the world,
do you think?
PRESIDENT
BUSH: Well, we wooed. We did a pretty good job of wooing them
at the United Nations. After all, remember 1441 was a unanimous
vote that said after a decade of sending messages to Mr. Saddam
Hussein for him to disarm - 1441 said disarm or there will be
serious consequences, and that was a unanimous vote; in other
words, the world, at least on the Security Council, came together
and sent a clear signal.
Obviously,
there was a disagreement about the definition of serious consequence,
but I can assure you serious consequence isn't more resolutions
or more debate. Serious consequence was with dealing with Mr.
Saddam Hussein today, before it became too late. And I understand
people don't agree with that position, but nevertheless I am convinced
that the decisions we made - and there's a lot of countries that
made that decision with us - that decision will make the world
more peaceful and more free.
SIR DAVID FROST: But do you -
PRESIDENT
BUSH: That decision is in the long-term interest of people who
love freedom.
SIR
DAVID FROST: And will you ever be able to forgive Jacques Chirac
and Chancellor Schroeder for their actions at that time in undermining
the second resolution?
PRESIDENT
BUSH: Of course. It's like I can understand why people express,
you know, their disagreement with the policy. I understand not
everybody is going to agree with every decision that I make or
others make. But I have had meetings with Gerhard Schroeder and
Jacques Chirac since then. They have been very cordial meetings.
Gerhard Schroeder has now committed German troops to Afghanistan,
which is a very important mission, to help stabilize that good
country as it not only enacts a Constitution but heads toward
elections, and I appreciate the contribution of the German government
toward Afghanistan. I'm proud to say that it is a - it is a vital
contribution, and I appreciate their willingness to work with
us. Again, we're not going to agree on every issue, but a Europe
which works closely with America and an America which works closely
with Europe means the world will be better off.
The
Lingering Issue of Weapons of Mass Destruction
SIR DAVID FROST: Tell me about - in terms of Iraq, tell me about
weapons of mass destruction. The fact that we didn't find them
and so on has been much discussed, but do you think that you were
the victim of a failure of intelligence in a way?
 PRESIDENT
BUSH: Not at all.
SIR DAVID FROST: No?
PRESIDENT
BUSH: No, not at all. I think our intelligence was sound and I
know the British intelligence was sound. It's the same intelligence
that caused the United Nations to pass resolution after resolution
after resolution. It's the same intelligence that was used by
my predecessor to bomb Iraq. And I'm very confident that we got
good intelligence. And not only that, Mr. David Kay, who went
over to kind of lead the effort to find the weapons or the intent
of weapons, came back with a report that clearly stated that Mr.
Saddam Hussein had been in material breach of resolution 1441;
in other words, had the inspectors found what Kay found, they
would have reported back to the United Nations that he was in
breach, that he was in violation of exactly what the United Nations
expected him not to do.
We
will find - you know, we will get to find the truth, but this
guy for many years had been hiding weapons, deceiving weapons.
He had dual-use programs that could have been sped up. Nobody
could say that Saddam Hussein wasn't a danger. I mean, not only
was he a danger to the free world - I mean, and that's what the
world said. The world said it consistently.
SIR DAVID FROST: But did he really -
PRESIDENT
BUSH: And he's a danger to his own people as well. Remember, we
discovered mass graves with hundreds of thousands of men and women,
and children, clutching their little toys, as a result of this
person's brutality.
Go
ahead. Sorry. (Chuckles.)
SIR DAVID FROST: Did you ever believe that stuff about him having weapons
of mass destruction that could be unleashed in 45 minutes, or
did you never really believe that?
PRESIDENT
BUSH: I believed he was a dangerous man.
SIR DAVID FROST: But you didn't believe that?
PRESIDENT
BUSH: And - well, I believed a lot of things, but I know he was
a dangerous man, and I know that for the sake of security he needed
to be dealt with. After all -- again, I repeat this because it's
a very important point that people in your country must remember,
and that is the world has spoken - universally spoken - about
this man's danger for 12 long years, and in order for - at the
very minimum, in order for a multinational organization to be
valid and effective, something has to happen other than resolutions.
And when an organization says if you don't disarm - in other words,
in order to say they don't disarm, intelligence convinced a lot
of nations, including France, that he had weapons; in other words,
he had to disarm something. Dismantle your programs. If you don't
do that, there will be a serious consequence.
And
the fundamental question is what is a serious consequence? It's
not another resolution. It's not more empty debate. A serious
consequence, in this case, was removing Saddam Hussein so those
weapons programs would not be activated. And David Kay found evidence
of weapons
programs. He found some biological weapons - evidence of biological
weapons. And it doesn't take much time; it doesn't even take much
-
SIR DAVID FROST: No, but we really need the big discovery, don't we?
PRESIDENT
BUSH: Well, that's pretty big, what I just told you. Now remember,
for a long period of time, it was assumed that he didn't have
a nuclear weapons program, and yet, after 1991, the world had
to change its attitude about this man's nuclear weapons program
and admitted that it was very advanced. A nuclear weapon in the
hands of somebody like Saddam Hussein, particularly given the
lessons of September the 11th, 2001, would be a horrendous development.
And we had to deal with him, and we did in a way, by the way,
that was a compassionate way. We spared innocent life, we targeted
the guilty, and we moved hard and fast, and very little of Iraq
was touched in toppling Saddam Hussein.
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