African Expert Offers Closer Look at Darfur Crisis

SARJOH BAH: Well, I mean, since the start of the conflict, you have very close to three million people who have been displaced. The great majority of them are internally displaced persons living within Darfur itself, living in several, you know, IDP (Internally Displaced Persons) camps that are scattered across the region. And then you have several thousands more that have moved across the borders, primarily into Chad.

The living conditions in the camps are certainly, you know, appalling. I visited several of the camps when I was in Darfur last year; and, to give you a view as an idea of what the living conditions are during the summer months, it is like living somewhere in Arizona or in New Mexico at the heat of the summer, living in tented camps.

RAY SUAREZ: So, it's hot, it's dry, and a lot of the resources, if not all of them, have to be brought in from somewhere else.

SARJOH BAH: Right. It is -- it is hot, dry, and it's a -- very typical desert conditions; and at night the temperatures will plunge, which means that, I mean, it gets terribly cold during the rainy season. But the resources, as you rightly mentioned -- you know, water and, you know, just firewood for cooking -- will have to be, you know, fetched and brought into the camps.

Now, one of the major challenges for the African Union force on the ground has been how to protect the civilians when they venture out of the camps to look for, you know, scarce resources, like water and firewood, for their basic sustenance.

RAY SUAREZ: So, that's when a lot of people are targeted, when they're exposed in that search for the things of everyday life?

SARJOH BAH: The highest number of rape incidents, or incidents of rape that were noted by the African Union, took place during those attempts, when women predominantly move out of the camps in search of water or firewood. The African Union, sort of, force -- the reaction of the force in late 2005 was to mount what proved to be quite effective. It was referred to at the time as "firewood patrols," and what the mission basically did at the time was to identify an area where, you know, women will go out to fetch firewood, and that area will be cordoned off for a particular period, during which time the people are allowed to, you know, get the firewood or the water that they are in search of.

RAY SUAREZ: The African Union is the successor organization to the Organization of African Unity, and, even in the best of circumstances, it's a -- an organization that lives in some difficulty. The force of the AU that's been sent to Darfur has been small, partially at the insistence of the government, partially because it's difficult to get African states to send their armies to Darfur. Have they been effective in policing such a large piece of land? This is a huge area.

SARJOH BAH: Absolutely. I mean, the biggest challenge for the African Union force has been, How do you police an area that most people have always said is the size of France and with a force of under 7,000 uniformed personnel? That has proved to be quite a monumental challenge. And the other challenge, actually, is the fact that the force went in there as an observer force. Their mandate, initially, was just to monitor, to observe, and to report. So, that made it also difficult for them, in terms of their dealings with the government, to, you know, intervene directly in protecting civilians.

But, that being said, I mean, the forces actually was quite effective by late 2005 in protecting civilians. The first time I went to Darfur was in 2005, and the people I spoke to in the IDP camp were very complimentary of what the AU was doing. But this situation changed significant after May 2006, when the Darfur Peace Agreement was signed, leading to a deterioration in the security situation on the ground.

RAY SUAREZ: Well, and just this past week the Sudanese rebel factions attacked, not the militias supported by the government, the janjaweed -- attacked, not government soldiers, but the AU peacekeepers themselves; they killed ten of them in a raid. How does that change the situation for the AU? Does it encourage them to beef up the force or make African governments even less willing to send troops in?

SARJOH BAH: Well, I mean, it's contrary to what most people will expect. Actually, African countries have reacted to the attack -- or most African countries have reacted to the attack by reaffirming their determination to send more troops in the joint hybrid U.N./AU mission that will be -- that is taking over from the African Union mission. So, it is quite encouraging to see that African member states have recommitted to sending additional troops into Darfur despite the recent attack on the AU peacekeepers in the town of Haskanita. But the -- what the attack actually, you know, also demonstrates is the need for the hybrid U.N./AU mission to be deployed with robust elements in order to be able to deter such attacks and protect civilian populations when they come on the trip.

RAY SUAREZ: Are people still dying at the rate that they were during the worst months of 2005-2006, or is it actually a little safer to be a civilian in Darfur?

SARJOH BAH: The situation for civilians have actually been extremely difficult since May last year, when the Darfur Peace Agreement was signed. And that is primarily due to fighting between the government and the groups that did not sign the DP Agreement. And, later on, it -- there was also infighting between the groups that did not sign. So, what you essentially have is the very, you know, difficult security situation, especially for the unarmed civilians, because, you know, having a weapon in Darfur these days is sort of a guarantee of security, and the majority of the people who don't have weapons don't have the necessary security to go about their daily business.

SARJOH BAH: That will be hard for me to way, in terms of exact numbers, but what we've had over the past three to four years, the estimate runs up to something like 200,000 civilians -- or 200,000 people killed in the Darfur region. But this is certainly, you know, not scientific; it hasn't been established by anyone.

RAY SUAREZ: Why did it take so long for Darfur to be labeled a "genocide," when hundreds of thousands of people have been killed? The government is different in origin and ethnicity from the people who are being targeted, yet there's been some question over whether this fits the definition of "genocide."

SARJOH BAH: I mean, the biggest problem with the whole issue of, you know, labels as to whether what is going on in Darfur is genocide or not brings to mind an interesting or unfortunate development in '94 during the Rwandan genocide. The problem here is, the only government to date that has labeled events in Darfur as "genocide" is the current administration of President George Bush. Other than that, no other government or institution, like the U.N. and the AU, has actually labeled the events in Darfur as genocide. The major explanation for that is, when a government -- or if the international community establishes that what is going on in Darfur in -- is genocide, or constitutes genocide, then they are obliged, under international law, to take action. So, one of the reasons for, probably, failure to label events in Darfur as genocide could be attributed to the broader implications for the international community when such a label is given or attached to what is going on in Darfur.

RAY SUAREZ: William Booth, from West Palm Beach, Fla., writes, "To what extent, if any, are the proceeds from the sale of Sudanese oil to the Chinese used to support the janjaweed's destruction of Darfur?"

SARJOH BAH: Well, I mean, the government of Sudan gets a lot of oil -- gives a lot of resources from their oil fields to China and other countries. China is not the only, sort of, country that invests in Sudanese oil. You have the Malaysians, you have the Indians in this. But the resources are certainly used by the government to support the Sudanese Armed Forces. And, to the extent that the government, you know, funds militias as part of this counterinsurgency strategy, one could make the argument that proceeds from oil fields are being used to support the janjaweed militia. But it is very difficult, because the government has never acknowledged its support for the janjaweed, but it is clear to most observers that the janjaweed will not have been effective, as it has, without the support of the government. So, clearly, resources from oil are being used to support the janjaweed.

RAY SUAREZ: Ross Rega asks, from Bradenton, Fla., "I've read that what is under the ground in Darfur is the ultimate reason the government needs to clear out the inhabitants. Are there oil and gas or mineral deposits under the ground in this area?"

SARJOH BAH: I am not aware of any, you know, clear geological results on that. I'm not sure whether there is oil. There is speculation. But, at the moment, that it is what it is; it is just mere speculation. And the speculation is based on the fact that there is oil just across, you know, from Chad; and chances are, because, you know, these are just contingent areas, that there will be oil in the Darfur region, but this has not been scientifically proven.

RAY SUAREZ: Laura Lundstrum, in Washington, D.C., asks, "I've heard that there have been some roadblocks to getting UNAMID, the African Union/U.N. hybrid operation in Darfur, up and running successfully, integrating U.N. and AU forces to make the mission effective. With the recent spate of violence inflicted on peacekeepers in the region, when do you foresee that UNAMID will be fully functioning? And, given the splitting off of rebel groups and sporadic violence, do you think the force will be able to meet its mandates?"

SARJOH BAH: I will start with the latter part of that question. Yes, the force will be able to meet its mandate. And the primary objective of the mandate is to restore stability, and, most importantly, to protect the vulnerable civilian population. And the most recent Secretary General's report on progress in implementing the hybrid U.N./AU force points to some difficulties with the government in signing, you know, land agreements, in terms of, you know, leasing land to the U.N. and the AU for the establishment of camps for the new troops. And there are also some delays, in terms of just releasing some of the U.N./AU equipment through the Customs Department. So, already there are some worrying trends, in terms of the degree of cooperation that the U.N. and the AU is receiving from the government, but they've brought these issues to the attention of the government, and all we can hope is that the government will respond favorably and, you know, cooperate at -- as it has already promised it will do.

RAY SUAREZ: CC writes, from Culver, Ore., "Conflicts like the one in Darfur seem to involve both centuries-old grudges and racial and religious tensions. Short of committing troops from other countries, whose tenure may last for decades, what else can international organizations do to reduce the violence and achieve a lasting peace?"

SARJOH BAH: The international community has a very important and significant role to play in resolving the crisis, and the major contribution of the international community will be having, you know, political coherence by the members of the -- permanent members of the Security Council, which has not been as coherent as most people will desire it. And the continued engagement of the international community -- even after the signing of a peace agreement, the most difficult phase is not the signing of the peace agreement, but, actually, implementation of the agreement. So, the international commitment will have to transcend the signing of peace agreements to actually -- ensuring that those agreements are implemented by the parties, and the parties are held responsible if they fail to implement their part of the deal.

RAY SUAREZ: Charles asks, from Detroit, Mich., "I'm troubled by the slaughter going on, but my cynical side sees oil and raw minerals as the driving force behind a civil war. What can resource-competitive nations do that could credibly help in this mess? Sending U.S. troops would be seen as imperialists intervening, and I don't see many nearby nations in Africa jumping up and down to go there." And, Dr. Bah, since you mentioned India, China, Malaysia as having resource and mineral interests in Sudan, do they have leverage to stop the killing?

SARJOH BAH: Well, clearly they do, especially, you know, with the Chinese, because the bulk of the oil from Sudan actually goes to China. And we saw that clearly play out in the recent resolution and the government's acceptance of the U.N./AU hybrid mission into Darfur.

The Chinese have been very clear, as they always have on issues of this nature, that they don't interfere in internal affairs of member states. But, after some pressure and lobbying, the Chinese were able to lean on the Government of Sudan to accept the U.N. -- the hybrid mission by the U.N. and the AU. And, to the extent that, you know, Malaysia and other countries have, you know, serious investments in the oil industry in Sudan, gives them a fair degree of leverage over the government. So, clearly, I mean, those powers have leverage.

But, in addition to them, the League of Arab States -- as the question from the caller indicated, there are racial undertones to the conflict -- the League of Arab States would have a very positive role to play here. And, to date, they haven't been as helpful as one will have expected them to be in the resolution of the conflict. So, in addition to the countries that have direct oil investments in Sudan, the League of Arab States, which comprises countries from the Middle East and North Africa, will also, you know, play a significant role if their attention is drawn to the crisis fully.

RAY SUAREZ: Molly asks, from Seattle, Wash., a question that I think probably occurs to many Americans as they watch this unfold, "How can an individual best help alleviate the situation in Darfur?"

SARJOH BAH: I will say lobby your local Congressmen and -women, and participate in local forums that deal with the Darfur crisis. Essentially, do what you can in your local community to raise awareness about what is going on in Darfur.

SARJOH BAH: Well, the real story here -- there is more than turning a blind eye to what the Sudanese government is doing. It is -- it is clear to most observers that the government is supporting the janjaweed militia. And, just to add a bit of perspective to that, this is not the first time that the government has actually used militias. In a related conflict in the 20-year-old north-south conflict with the Sudan People's Liberation Army, the government was very effective in arming local militias in southern Sudan to engage the SPLM (Sudan People's Liberation Movement). So, this is -- it's not a new strategy; it is a strategy that the government has always used. And to say that they are just, you know, turning a blind eye to [inaudible], you know, is a bit of an understatement.

RAY SUAREZ: Finally, Wayne Morse writes, from Boulder City, Nev., "I feel the USA and the U.N. have been largely ineffective. And we're also seeing the situation deteriorate in the peace talks, as well. What's your solution to solving this crisis, besides adding more peacekeeping forces?"

SARJOH BAH: Well, my solution, I mean, would be certainly adding more peacekeeping forces, but, most importantly, applying enough, you know, pressure to revitalizing the peace process, which has stalled -- or which stalled since the signing of the DPA last year, because, no matter the number of peacekeepers you deploy to Darfur, if there is no political framework, the -- their effectiveness will be largely limited. So, there should be, you know, a two-prong approach, which the Secretary General has already, you know, clearly outlined. The deployment of the hybrid force will be, you know, a first step, but then the process of revitalizing the peace process will have to take place, you know, concurrently. So, the two stages will have to occur concurrently; one should not happen before the other.

RAY SUAREZ: Dr. Sarjoh Bah, thanks for being with us today.

SARJOH BAH: Thank you very much.

RAY SUAREZ: And thanks to everyone who sent in questions for this week's edition of the Insider Forum. Join us again for the next discussion on the Online NewsHour. I'm Ray Suarez.