BRYANT GUMBEL

October 29, 1999
		Bryant Gumbel, co-anchor of CBS's new morning news venture, the "Early Show," recently spoke with media correspondent Terence Smith about his return to morning news. The following are extended excerpts from the interview.

Return to the morning news index Sept. 8, 1999: The success of ESPN July 29, 1999: The impact of falling ratings July 7, 1999: Vying for cable news viewers June 1, 1999: Quality in local news Jan. 13, 1999: The growth of TV news magazines NewsHour coverage of the media     The Early Show Good Morning America The Today Show	TERENCE SMITH: So it was Les Moonves, a year ago, said Bryant Gumbel would rather be shot in the head -- BRYANT GUMBEL: Yeah. TERENCE SMITH: -- than go back on morning television. BRYANT GUMBEL: He ran out of bullets! Yeah, he, he really did say it and -- TERENCE SMITH: The head of CBS Television -- BRYANT GUMBEL: -- and I reminded him of it, when we, when we announced the, the program. But I always say he didn't ask me before he said it the first time, and he did ask me to come and, and try it this time, and I'm glad he did. It's, it's going to be a lot of fun and, and it's something I'm, I'm enthusiastic about doing. TERENCE SMITH: Did it take some persuading? I mean, you did 11 years -- BRYANT GUMBEL: Yeah. Fifteen! TERENCE SMITH: Fifteen, was it? BRYANT GUMBEL: Yeah, Terence, I, I don't know if it took persuading as much as it did some assurances that CBS was willing to, to make the kind of commitment to a morning broadcast that they had never made in the past, I mean, and that's, that's really what I was searching for. I mean, you know, you and I were talking a little bit. I mean, CBS, for years, was, was embarrassed to be doing a morning show, or so it seemed, and so it was, it was a -- not just a low priority, it was a "no priority" in terms of the corporation and the division, and it was the, the starting point for people who got jobs here, until they could get a "real job," you know, on the evening news, or on, on one of the magazine shows or it was, it was a stopping off point for everybody. It was, it was the low man on the totem pole when it came to resources, both human and financial, and, and so they never really made a commitment towards it. And now I think the landscape of morning television has changed to such an extent that they realize morning is where they have the opportunity to, to make a great deal of headway.
	A commitment to morning news
	TERENCE SMITH: Well, tell me about that because that's a very interesting point. What has changed? BRYANT GUMBEL: I think what's changed is the proliferation of channels has made it very difficult for you to maximize your profit potential in prime time, in day time, and so many other sectors of the 24-hour clock. TERENCE SMITH: Right. BRYANT GUMBEL: The morning is really the only place where the networks are showing an expanding audience and have the potential for expanding even more. Let's face it. In the, in the evening, or, or late night, or even the daytime, you might choose to watch a movie on Showtime or HBO. In the morning, they're not running them. You know, there's no ball games opposite you in the morning. There aren't a lot of things happening from 7 o'clock to 9 o'clock that are a competition, that the others can put on. So, so, really, it's the one area where the networks remain preeminent, and it's a chance for them to maximize their investment dollars, and I think they realize that. TERENCE SMITH: In fact, numerically, the audience has actually been growing. BRYANT GUMBEL: Yeah. Yeah. It's the only place where the audience has been growing. It's -- TERENCE SMITH: Explain that. BRYANT GUMBEL: Probably some, some -- some factors that have nothing to do with television, I mean, among them that, that the National Sleep Foundation tells us that people are getting up earlier than ever before. That I think the number now is like 43.6 percent of all Americans get up before 6:00 a.m. I think the increasing number of people working in offices. I think it's, it's -- it's the 24-hour clock that we're on, the global economy that we're on, the end of the Cold War, the inter -- TERENCE SMITH: The long commutes. BRYANT GUMBEL: Interdependencies of democracies now. Expansion of corporations, internationally. So that now what happens is people have a vested interest in, when they wake up, in knowing what's happened in the European day and knowing what's happened in the Asia day. And so as a result, you know, when I first started doing morning television in '82, the mornings were viewed as a rehash of the prior evening's news. Now it's viewed as ground zero of what's happening for the day. It's -- TERENCE SMITH: That's -- BRYANT GUMBEL: -- the evening newscast that has a shrinking audience and the, the morning news that has a growing audience. TERENCE SMITH: Is this why CBS now has made the big commitment that they have -- BRYANT GUMBEL: I think it's -- TERENCE SMITH: -- in terms of a new studio -- BRYANT GUMBEL: Yeah, I think that's pretty clear. I think that's pretty clear. I think, I think, I think Mel Karmazin is, is a businessman, and, and I think he, he looked at, you know, what's out there, and he sees the profit numbers that are being reeled in at, at NBC, and at ABC, and says, "You know what? We should be really in this ball game more than we are," and like every other business venture, in order to get something out of it, you have to do a little investment in it.
	Tell people what they need to know
	TERENCE SMITH: All right. What works in the morning? BRYANT GUMBEL: What works in the morning? You know, Steve and I used to have this, this inside joke which was when people wake up in the morning, they want to know is the world still in one piece, 'cause if it's not, don't get up. You know? Stay home. Don't go to work. Don't spend your last day on Earth, you know, commuting. So I mean I think your, your first job is always, is always first, last and foremost -- deliver the news -- deliver the news, tell people what they, what they need to know, what they want to know in a brief amount of time in the morning. You know, the mornings are different than every other time period in that people don't have a lot of time to spend with you. The shows last two hours but the average viewer doesn't come close to watching two hours. I mean, if they had an hour to spend, they'd spend an extra hour sleeping. That's the reality of it. So the, so the idea is in as clean and concise and entertaining a fashion, tell people what they need to know, and then after you've done that, you try to, to -- to move beyond that, and, and morning television has always been a combination of news, slash, entertainment, slash, information. It's a little bit of all of those. I think it was Tom Shales who characterized it, once upon a time, as the last of, of the, of the town meetings. Town marketplace. That this is the place where everybody comes to exchange ideas, to pass along information, to bring new ideas to the marketplace, to get lifestyle tips, to be entertained, to learn something to talk about as the day goes on, to learn the prior evening's news. It, it's kind of the central marketplace, if you want to put it back in the Middle Ages, where everybody came and gathered, and exchanged their thoughts, exchanged their ideas, exchanged their, their theories, and then went back to, to do their business, and that's kind of what happens on these broadcasts. And so some mornings wind up being 85 percent hard news and 15 percent otherwise, and on days that are slow it's, it's quite the contrary.
	Doing the same thing -- differently
	TERENCE SMITH: Anyway, let's talk about the competition that's going to evolve after November 1. BRYANT GUMBEL: Uh-huh. TERENCE SMITH: What you think of it, what you think you're going to need to do to compete with it. BRYANT GUMBEL: I can answer you in a couple a ways, Terence. I mean, number one is I've, I've -- I've always been a believer that all you do is worry about your product, make your product as soon as you can, and, and the rest will take care of itself, and so I, I -- even when I was on the Today program for 15 years, I never ever was concerned with what ABC was doing. I didn't care what they were doing. I really didn't. TERENCE SMITH: Uh-huh. BRYANT GUMBEL: Didn't know; didn't care. What I cared about was how well we could do our job, and how effectively we could, we could maximize our potential, and that's kind of what I'm preoccupied with here. So that's -- that's number one. But number two, in terms of a game plan, I'm, I'm -- I'm big on telling people that, that the way things are going right now, we don't have to -- although I would certainly welcome them -- we don't have to steal viewers from -- we don't have to steal NBC's viewers, we don't have to steal ABC's viewers. The CBS network is a network that is performing very well in all time periods except the morning -- except the morning. What we have to do is stop those people who are CBS fans and CBS viewers from feeling they have to go elsewhere to get their morning fix. You know as well as I do that -- much like politics -- all television is local. You walk down the street in Chicago and somebody goes, "Hey, I watch you on channel 5." They don't know what network it is. You walk down the street in LA or Omaha, "I watch you on channel 8." They have no idea what network it is. They become fans of a channel and, and what's happened over the years is, is those CBS viewers have had to go elsewhere for their morning fix, to be serviced in the morning. So I think what we have to offer is ourselves as a professional, viable alternative to what's out there, and, and maximize our potential and the rest will take care of itself. TERENCE SMITH: How do you expect it to be different from what's out there? BRYANT GUMBEL: I'm not sure you have -- I'm not sure you have to be different. I'm not sure you have to be drastically different. Look -- America, for better or worse, has voted on morning television. They have voted on this melange, if you will, of, of, of news, entertainment, information, and they've decided they like it. And I think it'd be pretty presumptuous of someone, least of all me, to come along and say, no, you know that mix you like -- hey, we're getting rid of that; you know. So I don't think the, the challenge is to do something different. I think the challenge is to do a lot of the same things with, with an edge, with an attitude, with a, with a little bit more personality, and, and do them effectively, and do them pro -- professionally, and, and, and I'm, I'm, I'm convinced and I'm confident that we can do that. TERENCE SMITH: And yet the three shows of the major networks -- BRYANT GUMBEL: Uh-huh. TERENCE SMITH: -- are turning out to be clones of each other. They are all three going to have street-side studios. BRYANT GUMBEL: Yeah. TERENCE SMITH: They're all three going to have this basic mix that you were talking about. BRYANT GUMBEL: Yeah. TERENCE SMITH: Two principal anchors. So forth. It, it suggests that there are no new ideas in the morning. BRYANT GUMBEL: Well, I, I -- I think it depends on how you define ideas. I mean, I, I guess I, I could say the same of news magazines. TERENCE SMITH: Uh-huh. BRYANT GUMBEL: You know, that World News -- U.S. News & World Report, Time, and Newsweek, are basically the same and they're devoid of ideas because they all offer this melange of politics, international affairs, some entertainment, et cetera, et cetera. Or I could say the same of newspapers. The Washington Post, the New York Times, the Daily News, the LA Times, they're, they're devoid of ideas because they all have sports sections and lifestyle sections, and, et cetera, et cetera. So, so I don't know how, how far you want to carry it. I think differences come in, in your approach, in your -- in, in the people involved in doing them, in the edge you bring to them, in the chances you're willing to take, in the proper mix of those varying elements. I think you're right. I mean, I think all news and information programs are basically the same. They are basically the same. But what makes one better than another is the manner in which you do things and the mix in which you, you try to achieve. TERENCE SMITH: And the personality. BRYANT GUMBEL: Yes, the personalities matter. TERENCE SMITH: Without suggesting that you have to reinvent the wheel in the morning, is the viewer going to see much difference between these three? BRYANT GUMBEL: Yeah, I think, I think the discerning viewer will be able to tell a difference. I do. I think if, if you, if you -- if you're just looking at in a broad landscape and somebody reports back, yeah, they did some news, they did some entertainment, they did some information, they did some lifestyle -- no. But I, I think, for example, our first half hour is going to be as -- as hard a news half hour as there is on television and as comprehensive a, a news half hour as there is on television because we, we firmly believe that, that if you don't deliver the news you lose. Plain and simple. TERENCE SMITH: Uh-huh. BRYANT GUMBEL: So, so we're going to, to do that first half hour as a, as a solid half-hour newscast that has interviews included in it, off a top story, off a secondary story, off, off a third story, where, where you're hearing from principals and, and you're getting some depth, and you're getting on-site reporting, and, and, and the like. And that's really what we'd like to do with it.
	A booking war
	TERENCE SMITH: You're, you're going to be in a booking war of the first order. BRYANT GUMBEL: Uh-huh. TERENCE SMITH: For guests. BRYANT GUMBEL: Uh-huh. Has ever been thus. Has ever been thus. Yeah, I mean, we're gonna win some and we're gonna lose some. I know people are inclined to say, "Well, you know, you'll lose because you're the new kid on the block." Well, I, I don't know if that's true. I think there's a variety of reasons people choose to go on some shows and pass on others, and only one of those elements is the ratings game. I think people also choose by the manner in which they're treated, by the audience they're trying to reach, by how they are perceived as a result of sitting across from someone, as opposed to someone else. And, and -- and who they want to reach where. So, so I'm, I'm -- I really don't have a lot of concerns about us holding our own in the so-called booking wars. I mean, you know, there -- there's a lot of information out there and, and there are a lot of good people with something to say, or are capable of saying it well, and, and we're going to find them, and, yeah, we're going to lose some people, but we're gonna, we're gonna get our share. TERENCE SMITH: This is a difficult question perhaps for you to answer, but how much pressure do you feel to make this effort a success in an area where CBS has not succeeded before? BRYANT GUMBEL: I'm, I'm probably the worst person to ask, Terence. I really am. I guess only because I'm not somebody who ever realizes, recognizes, feels a bunch of pressure. I mean, I, I may be the most happy-go-lucky, easy-going guy, come November 1, as, as anybody involved. Look -- I'm aware that, that there's a lot at stake. I'm aware that CBS has a considerable investment in this. I'm aware that there are people who are going to be anxious to, to see how the Bryant Gumbel on CBS compares with the Bryant Gumbel of, of NBC years. But I can't help all of that. I mean, all I can do is, is, is -- is do a job as well as I can, and, and the rest of it is gonna take care of itself. I'm going into this, obviously, expecting to do well, and hoping to do well, but I'm not gonna slit my wrist, you know? I enjoy doing television and I happen to be one of those people who, while he takes it seriously, doesn't get terribly hung up on ratings. I mean, I -- my responsibility -- yes, it's to CBS -- but primarily my responsibility is to the viewer. On any given minute of that program, my responsibility is to the viewer and the staff, and that's what I'm concerned with, and, and you know what? If the rest of it falls into place -- terrific. But, but if I feel good about what I did for the viewer and the staff, I can walk away with my head high. TERENCE SMITH: Finally, what about -- what is it about Bryant Gumbel and the morning? There does seem to be some -- BRYANT GUMBEL: I, I -- TERENCE SMITH: -- connection there. BRYANT GUMBEL: I have a quirky -- my lifestyle, my, my interests, my, my talents -- for whatever they are -- fit the morning. I'm, I'm somebody who, who gets engaged by a variety of new ideas, who, who likes ad libbing, who manages to stay fairly calm when everybody else around him is going nuts, and, and who enjoys conversation. And so that kind of a mix works well in the morning. I'm fortunate in that television has something that suits my, my brand of personality. TERENCE SMITH: And the moment has come where it's the "hot slot," it's the -- BRYANT GUMBEL: Yeah, yeah, it's kind of fun. I mean, it's, it's fun. There'll be a lot of people watching, and, and there's a lot of competition, and there's a lot at stake, and, and, you know, you get to play, and I think that's terrific! TERENCE SMITH: Truly final thought. BRYANT GUMBEL: Sure. TERENCE SMITH: Will CBS do with you what they haven't done in the past, and stick with it? BRYANT GUMBEL: Your guess is as good as mine, Terence. I mean, look, I ha -- I -- you and I both know how television works. I could get all the assurances on Earth, and you and I both know what they're worth. I, I fully believe that CBS is committed to this. I fully believe that from a business standpoint alone, they recognize the investment, and how long that investment takes to pay off. But I've always said, it's, it's their store, it's their candy shop, and they're free to do with it what they want. I am a paid employee. TERENCE SMITH: But you're -- you mentioned how long it takes to change -- BRYANT GUMBEL: It does take -- TERENCE SMITH: -- people's habits in the morning. [Simultaneous conversation.] BRYANT GUMBEL: That does take a while. You have to, you have to make a commitment, you have to be in it for the long haul. You really do. I mean, expansion teams don't win Super Bowls their first year out. TERENCE SMITH: Perfect. Thank you. BRYANT GUMBEL: My pleasure.