Read more of Kim Lawton's February 6, 2008 interview with the Rev. Clifton Kirkpatrick, stated clerk of the Presbyterian Church (USA) and president of the World Alliance of Reformed Churches. He was part of an international ecumenical delegation just back from a fact-finding trip to Kenya:

Q: What were your impressions about how difficult the situation in Kenya is right now?

A: The situation in Kenya is very difficult. I really think in many ways it's at a tipping point kind of situation where there is tremendous hope and positive will toward reconciliation, but at the same time a very strong sense that if things don't change, and change for the better shortly, it could degenerate into a situation far more like Rwanda than anybody ever wished.

Q: How surprising is this, given that Kenya was always considered one of the more stable places in Africa?

A: Oh, it's very surprising. I think everyone in Kenya almost was really shocked and indicated how in the world could this have happened in Kenya? I talked to one woman who had just come back having been sent by Kenya to Sierra Leone to help them with election processes, because Kenya had developed a model in Africa, and she was just profoundly shocked, and I think that was typical of many people I talked with, that this was not expected there, although I think if people had looked at the issues there, some of it probably should have been expected.

Q: I want to talk more specifically about those issues in a minute, but first let's get more context. Talk about the role of churches in the society in Kenya.

A: Well, the churches are very active and have been very important in the life of Kenya. Roughly 80 percent of Kenyans are Christians, and somewhat in contrast to the situation here in the United States, 80 percent of Kenyans are in church on a given Sunday, and they're in church for hours at a time -- a great passion about their worship. Churches have been key to health care, to education, to the well being of society. So I think the church plays a very active role in Kenya, and that's why a visit by a delegation like ours was so important in that situation.

Q: How have the churches and their ministries been affected by the turmoil there?

A: Well, the churches are deeply affected. I obviously come from what's called a Presbyterian and Reformed tradition, and there are really two churches out of our tradition in Kenya, one's a Presbyterian Church, probably has four million members, another is a Reformed Church that has two million members. The tragedy is Presbyterians are almost exclusively Kikuyu; the Reformed Church is almost exclusively Luo and Kalenjin. So out of the very same church tradition have been people really at odds with each other, and we've probably got now two to three hundred thousand Presbyterians who are displaced people. So it has really torn into the heart of the church as well as into the heart of the church's message of reconciliation and their hopes and dreams that people could live together in peace and in harmony and in justice with one another.

Q: How big a humanitarian burden is being placed on groups that are trying to help?

A: Well, a huge one. I mean, I'm not sure anybody has the exact figure, but it's getting up close to a million displaced people in Kenya. We went to many refugee camps for internally displaced people. I think groups like the Red Cross, who are taking the lead in those, are doing a good job with the resources they have, but while they keep people from starving to death, they're really not able to provide the kind of counseling, the kind of support for people that are victims of sexual abuse, the kind of support for health needs of people. And so all of the churches are also joining in that effort, but the crisis is growing so fast that I'm afraid more still needs to be done.

Q: What did you see as the key humanitarian needs right now?

A: Well, the key humanitarian needs right now are people have lost their homes. They need shelter. People have lost their jobs. They need food to eat. People have lost their belonging and community, so they need community support. Many people have been victims of violence, have had family members killed, have had sexual violence, so they need counseling and support and spiritual strength to move forward.

Q: We've heard figures here that 300,000 people are displaced. You mentioned that people on the ground say nearly a million. Do you think people in the West are adequately informed about what's really happening there?

A: No, I think a whole lot more needs to be done. I certainly thought I was well informed and have had a lot of history working internationally and have known Kenya and studied greatly for this trip, but I need to say, in just a few days in Kenya, I learned a whole lot I never imagined, and so I think programs like this, and in a whole lot of other ways, it's important for Americans to realize both how serious the crisis is and how much those core issues at the heart of this crisis are issues we need to be responsive to as Americans and as Christians.

Q: What are those core issues?

A: Well, on the surface it may look simple as, you know, the issue of an election in question, and that's certainly a major part of it. But we had a member of our delegation from the United Kingdom who said this is about as complex as Northern Ireland, and I think he was right. At one level, it obviously is the problem of an electoral process that was deeply flawed and has created huge conflict and tension and sense of unfairness among people. But underneath that is obviously the tension between ethnic groups. Political parties are often organized around ethnic lines, and the ethnic tension has obviously resulted in the violence and the conflict there now. Underneath that are patterns going back to colonial days when the Kikuyus were in some ways favored by the British and got land that other ethnic groups think should have belonged to them. Those issues have never been sorted out. And underneath all of that is a much, much deeper issue of Kenya being one of the places with the greatest gap between the rich and the poor, and the whole failure to address the issues affecting the poorest of the poor in that part of the world and all over the world. So those are some of the core issues at stake there, and they are issues not only related to Kenya, but they are really issues in some ways in our own country, but also relative to relations with nations all over the world.

Q: What specific things did your delegation come away calling for?

A: Well, we came away calling for several things very clearly and very strongly, that this mediation effort that has been initiated by Kofi Annan must work. The parties must make some compromises so that both can have a sense of participation and that peace and calm can return. We came away with a very strong conviction, shared certainly by the churches in Kenya, that the violence needs to end and that people need to find alternate ways to deal with their disputes. We came away with a conviction that much work must be done in churches and in other groups to work on reconciliation between ethnic groups. And, finally, we came away with a strong sense that efforts need to be taken toward land reform, toward dealing with social justice for the poor and disenfranchised. So I think those are the core issues we came away with.

Q: As an American, what role do you see for the US in this situation?

A: Well, I do think the US government now is supporting strongly this mediation by the United Nations and Kofi Annan, and I think that's exactly the right thing to do. I think the US government has also raised questions about this electoral process, and I think those need to be raised. My hope in the long term for the US government is not only will we support those initiatives, but we will support development programs in Kenya that really address the needs of the poor. We'll be working to support and stand by governments that work for democratic processes, and we'll stand strong for human rights.

Q: Haven't many churches in Kenya been very political and taken sides in the political conflicts? What is your assessment of the moral authority of the churches there? Do they have the moral stature to credibly work for peace and reconciliation?

A: You're right. Churches have been part of the problems. One of the issues going all the way back to our missionary history is that so many churches have been organized along ethnic lines. Clearly, those identities, which have led many churches at times to identify with political parties related to that, have caused some of these problems, and so I think one of the great challenges for the churches these days is to transcend those differences, those different identities, and to really talk with integrity about the wholeness of the Gospel, the unity of God's people, and to work for reconciliation. What was encouraging to me out of this trip was that I really found a huge hunger and support of churches to do just that. They've planned a joint memorial service for the people burned in that horrible fire in Eldoret a few weeks ago, in which all communities will participate together. And so I think the churches have really had a wakeup call out of this and are taking major moral leadership calling for reconciliation, calling for mediation of the current dispute, calling for a way forward in Kenya based on nonviolence. I think that's a very hopeful sign, and I think their voice will be heard in that process.

Q: How pivotal is this moment? What is the potential impact, not just in Kenya, but across the African continent, if this situation doesn't get reined in?

	How can we improve our program or Web site?

A: I think there is huge concern across the continent of Africa. This was the second international ecumenical delegation visit, and it was partly out of both Kenyans and Africans being concerned that if a place that was seen as the hope of Africa -- Kenya -- could come apart ethnically, could have this kind of conflict, could degenerate into the kind of violence we saw in Rwanda, what hope was there for some of the other places in Africa that seem far less stable? So I think a lot is riding on this, not only for Kenya but also for the rest of Africa and indeed for the rest of the world. I think one of the big questions this time is, can the world, can the churches in a particular place, can the government do things when you start having these ethnic tensions that resolve them rather than let them deteriorate into ethnic cleansing and violence? And I think the real hope of the moment is that the world, the churches, the people of Kenya will say yes to that challenge. But it is a dangerous time if those efforts don't happen at this time.