BOB ABERNETHY: On Perspectives this week -- more than any other current social issue, homosexuality continues to split denominations and churches. This week in Nebraska, United Methodist Minister Jimmy Creech faced a church trial for presiding at a covenant ceremony for two lesbians. For Episcopalians, the emotionally charged question of whether to ordain gays as priests will be one of the difficult questions at this summer's worldwide Anglican Conference in England.And in Texas, Reverend Larry Bethune's University Baptist Church in Austin has been disciplined by the State Baptist Convention because it ordained a gay deacon. Reverend Bethune is here with us. Also here, Diane Knippers, the president of the Institute of Religion and Democracy in Washington. She is an Episcopalian, active in church debates of homosexuality and other social issues.
Diane, why is this so painful and so divisive for the churches?
DIANE KNIPPERS (Institute of Religion and Democracy): Well, it's a difficult issue because it's reflecting a huge debate going on in our society and in every generation. The church must respond to the debates and challenges, and it takes place at a time that we've experienced 30 or 40 years of a sexual revolution in the larger society, and the church is trying to figure out how to respond to this crisis.Reverend LARRY BETHUNE (University Baptist Church): The church has always had difficulty talking about human sexuality. We tend to throw rules and principles at it rather than dealing with it rationally with the people involved.
ABERNETHY: But isn't it particularly difficult for the churches because what is at stake really is your attitude toward the Bible?
Ms. KNIPPERS: Well, that's the underline. In one respect, people argue that the debate over homosexuality is the symptom of an abandonment of the high view of the authority of Scripture. And so there clearly is that. There's not a common understanding of what our sources of authority are.ABERNETHY: You think Scripture prohibits homosexuality?
Ms. KNIPPERS: I think Scripture is very clear on that point.
Rev. BETHUNE: And I think the Bible is not so clear on that. The Bible speaks against certain specific homosexual behaviors, but not all homosexual behavior. The Bible has been used in days past to support slavery, on the basis of the Bible we argued against it. Integration, the spiritual inequality of women in the church. The Bible doesn't change, but our understanding of it changes, and should as our understanding of the world around us changes. We go back to the Bible to ask specifically, "What is this text saying?" I think you and I agree on a high view of Scripture.
Ms. KNIPPERS: In every case you mentioned, in slavery, in the treatment of women, there are clear text[s] that talk about equality in men and women and that talk about -- and text[s] that opposed slavery, but there is nothing in the Bible that gives a hint of the acceptance of homosexuality. The important point is the larger context from Genesis to Revelation, Scripture lists marriage as the fundamental social unit, as the image of the relationship between God and his people.
Rev. BETHUNE: But why isn't the analogy heterosexuality? We say to the heterosexual person, there are certain behaviors that are inconsistent with the Christian ethic. Other behaviors are entirely consistent and appropriate out of who God has created you to be. It seems to me the most natural analogy is not with alcoholism or with pedophilia, it is with heterosexuality, which is a neutral state of being, certain behaviors being acceptable and others not in the Christian ethic.
Ms. KNIPPERS: Absolutely. I would have no problem with that whatsoever. We all have a sin orientation, and I'm quick to admit that I'm not naturally monogamous. I was born a sinner; I'm tempted to all kinds of things. And we don't expect our priests to be perfect. What we do expect is the teaching of the church uphold the sanctity of marriage and uphold biblical standards. That's all we're asking for.
