LUCKY SEVERSON: Bob, the question is whether torture is sometimes the lesser of two evils. For instance, would it be justified if it might be the only way to get information that could prevent another terrorist attack?
Since 9-11, U.S. officials have denied strongly that this country uses torture. Critics do not offer hard proof, but some of them allege the U.S. does use torture, and that it condones its use by other countries.
Ibrahima Bah was only 18 when he was stopped at the border of his African country, Guinea, and wrongfully accused of being a revolutionary. He was tied up, interrogated, and then tortured, first with a burning cigarette.
IBRAHIMA BAH (Torture Survivor): He tied here. And he started burning me. And you can see some scars (opening his sleeve). They were telling me, "Tell us the truth, tell us the truth!"SEVERSON: He said he didn't know the names of any revolutionaries, so they attached wires to his finger and left toe, and then his genitals.
Mr. BAH: He removed the wire that was at my finger here and then he put it at my genital organs.
SEVERSON: The pain was so intense, Ibrahima passed out. Later he was beaten repeatedly and eventually released, after giving false information. Now, he is receiving therapy at the Boston Center for Refugee Health and Human Rights.
The director here, psychiatrist Michael Grodin, has treated torture victims from around the world.
(to Dr. Michael Grodin): Does the U.S. torture?
Dr. MICHAEL GRODIN (Boston Medical Center for Refugee Health and Human Rights): I believe so, yes. Torture should not be condoned under any circumstances. To start to torture is to take away from our own humanity.SEVERSON: But even as they are trying to capture suspected terrorists, the Justice and Defense Departments deny the use of torture under any circumstances, and the U.S. has signed several treaties banning torture. But Harvard law professor Alan Dershowitz says other countries do it and so do we.
ALAN DERSHOWITZ (Professor, Harvard Law School): The provisions about torture are just the worst example of hypocrisy. Egypt signs the treaty. Jordan signs the treaty. The Philippines sign the treaty; Libya; the worst countries in the world. It's easy to sign a treaty. And we know they're breaking the treaty every day. And we're breaking the treaty.
SEVERSON (to Dr. Grodin): Did the violence of September 11, 2001 usher in a much scarier world where torture can now be justified, in some cases, because of the greater threat?
Dr. GRODIN: I think so. And I think that's misguided, misinformed, and frightening.
SEVERSON: Dr. Grodin's suspicion, shared by critics worldwide, begins, but does not end, in Guantanamo Bay, Cuba. The U.S. has imprisoned approximately 625 suspected al Qaeda terrorists here without hearings, due process, or the aid of a lawyer -- some for longer than two years.
Dr. GRODIN: I think that it's not just torture that we're talking about, but cruel, inhuman, degrading treatment.
SEVERSON: The military strongly defends the treatment of prisoners here at Guantanamo, but skeptics are not convinced. Alan Dershowitz, who has written a book on terrorism, is one of them.
ALAN DERSHOWITZ: We try to make them very confused. We put smelly hoods over their heads. Put them in uncomfortable positions. Play loud music. Occasionally slap them around a little bit -- what I would call "non-lethal torture-lite."
SEVERSON: If the U.S. is only using "torture-lite" at Guantanamo, how are we getting what could be vital information out of alleged terrorists? Well, what the Bush administration is apparently doing is sending suspected terrorists to countries known for torture. It's called "rendering," and, in one case, our neighbors in Canada are outraged at what they call the worst kind of hypocrisy.
MAHER ARAR (Torture Victim): I thought it was going to be routine, and then, all of a sudden, I see FBI agents in front of me.SEVERSON: The Canadian uproar centers on this man, Maher Arar, who emigrated from Syria when he was a teenager and became a Canadian citizen with a wife and two kids. Returning ahead of them from an African vacation in September 2002, he was detained during a stopover at JFK airport in New York.
ARAR: I was getting more and more terrified because, of course, they alleged I was a member of a terrorist organization, but they never told me what's next.
SEVERSON: After 13 days in a tiny cell at the Brooklyn Detention Center and, finally, one call to let his wife know where he was, U.S. agents escorted, or "rendered," Arar on a private plane to Syria.
Mr. ARAR: Imagine the cell they put me in -- a dark cell, three-feet wide, six-feet long, and seven-feet high. That place alone felt like a grave.
Mr. BAH: I wanted to stop the pain.
ALAN DERSHOWITZ: We live in a practical world in which we have to understand that no public official, elected or appointed, is ever going to allow thousands of deaths to occur if they could have been prevented by the possibility of taking extraordinary steps, including the use of torture. It will happen, whether it should happen or not. It will happen. And if it will happen, we have to make sure that it happens within the rule of law and not outside of it.
