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July 24, 2005: Professor George Ayittey, distinguished economist from the American University in Washington, DC, discusses social, political, and economic development in Africa with Anchor, Bill Moyers.
BILL MOYERS: With me now is Professor George Ayittey. He's originally from Ghana -- a noted economist -- who teaches now at American University in Washington, DC. Welcome to WIDE ANGLE.
GEORGE AYITTEY: Thank you for having me.
BILL MOYERS: What goes through your mind when you watch that film?
GEORGE AYITTEY: It's a very heart-breaking film, if you look at the refugees and people were starving in Zimbabwe. And they're crossing the border and they're destitute and have to come up with an electrified fence. It's sort of like a throwback to the apartheid era when the racist regime in South Africa threw an electrified fence against the border in Mozambique and even Zimbabwe to prevent them from coming in. But it's a horrible situation in Zimbabwe that we have right now.
BILL MOYERS: When I saw the film, I thought, of course, of refugees on the border between Mexico and the United States trying to leave their destitution to come to golden opportunity -- the golden arches -- of California. Is there any similarity between those two situations?
GEORGE AYITTEY: Well the similarities sort of vanish when you consider the fact that Zimbabwe used to be the breadbasket of the region.
BILL MOYERS: How long ago?
GEORGE AYITTEY: Well, this was about ten years ago, 15 years ago. But the situation has reversed completely. And the main reason why it has reversed is because you've had bad policies and a bad regime and misgovernance in Zimbabwe.
BILL MOYERS: Well, you've got a tyrant, a despot, a scoundrel, a thief as the --
GEORGE AYITTEY: Well, yes. Mugabe's become a disgrace to Africa. And I must say this because I am an African and a lot of us looked up to him back in the 1980s when he was the liberation hero. But he's now turned himself into a murderous despot. But, see, there's another thing about Zimbabwe and that is it is a repeat of the same African script where we moved out the white colonialists. And then we have black new colonialists. And country after country, they run their countries down an economic slump. Ghana, Tanzania, Zimbabwe, Zambia. All these countries are following the same script. And that is what is very disappointing about Zimbabwe.
BILL MOYERS: Can you explain that to me? Because the common argument for so long was that this was the heritage of colonial rule. That the colonial whites who ran these countries did not allow Africans to emerge into positions of responsibility and authority. So there was no one prepared when the white colonialists left to take over and run the countries efficiently.
GEORGE AYITTEY: Oh, no. That argument is really a red herring because Botswana was colonized. Mauritius was also colonized. But yet these two African countries are doing very well. The reason why Botswana has done very well is because it's the only black African country which went back to its roots and built upon its own indigenous institutions.
BILL MOYERS: What do you mean went back to its roots?
GEORGE AYITTEY: Back to its roots in the sense that if you go to an African village and there's a chief and there is, let's say, a political crisis for example, the chief will call a village meeting. Put the issue before the people. It's called a kgotla. Now put the issue before the people. The people will debate until they come to a consensus. In Botswana, cabinet ministers are required to attend weekly kgotla meetings.
BILL MOYERS: I was in Botswana many years ago for the Peace Corps. And I actually went with a Botswana official out to the village council. Fascinating.
GEORGE AYITTEY: Yeah, this is how you take development to the people. And you build up on the local institutions. Only Botswana did this.
BILL MOYERS: Why did they -- ?
GEORGE AYITTEY: Well, see, in the rest of Africa they assume that the market system was a capitalist institution. So they don't want to have anything to do with the market system. Not knowing that the markets were in Africa even before the colonialists came to Africa.
BILL MOYERS: At a very local level.
GEORGE AYITTEY: Yes. At a local level. I mean, if you go to West Africa, for example, market activity has always been dominated by women. There was free trade in Africa. There was free enterprise in Africa before the colonialists came. But anyway, they identified markets and capitalism with the West. So they rejected that. And many of them also associated democracy with the West and rejected that as well. So they went to the East and copied Socialist and Marxist models. Mugabe, for example, determined to turn Zimbabwe into one party -- Marxist/Leninist state.
BILL MOYERS: Right.
GEORGE AYITTEY: But everybody can tell you that Marx and Lenin had very little relationship with black Africa. They were not black Africans. But anyway, they copied all these alien ideologies to impose upon their people.
BILL MOYERS: But not Botswana.
GEORGE AYITTEY: Not Botswana. It went back and built upon its own local institutions. There were markets. There were participatory democracies in their villages. This is what Africa needs to return to and build upon it. Botswana did it. And it is doing very well.
BILL MOYERS: Are the people who are trying to get across that fence, are they following an illusion? Because some people say that Botswana's success is only relative. That Botswana's wealth is held by a relative handful of people at the expense of the many, particularly the diamond trade. So are these people trying to get across the border following an illusion?
GEORGE AYITTEY: Oh, no, no. They're not following an illusion. Look, any economy has its own troubles. But Botswana's doing well. It is the fastest growing economy in the world. It's doing well.
BILL MOYERS: Fastest growing in the world?
GEORGE AYITTEY: Yes. And it's because for a long time its economic rate of growth has been clocked at eight percent.
BILL MOYERS: Eight percent a year?
GEORGE AYITTEY: Eight percent a year. Back in the 1970s, in fact, the economic rate of growth was at a dizzying 14 percent. So it's one of the few African economies that is doing extremely well. Yet it has some problems. And that we have to face. Number one, income distribution in Botswana. And number two, we have an AIDS problem.
BILL MOYERS: You mean the gap between the rich and the poor.
GEORGE AYITTEY: Yes. And also you have some unemployment.
BILL MOYERS: That's growing here, too.
GEORGE AYITTEY: Yes, of course. All the economies have problems. But then compared with other African countries, Botswana is just the star.
BILL MOYERS: So there is a reality that's pulling these people.
GEORGE AYITTEY: Yes.
BILL MOYERS: That fence is not up there just to guard against cattle.
GEORGE AYITTEY: Oh, no. No. It's sustainable and it is not just a mirage. Botswana's economic prosperity and success is real.
BILL MOYERS: Would you say that the main reason for the destitution, the poverty, the mess that exists in Zimbabwe is because Robert Mugabe has imposed one-man, one-party rule and there's no transparency, there's no openness, there's no rule of law?
GEORGE AYITTEY: Oh, precisely. There are very little freedoms in Zimbabwe. There are three newspapers in Zimbabwe. They are all state-owned. And the DAILY NEWS, for example, the private independent newspaper, has been shut down. There's no rule of law. Mugabe has packed the bench with his own cronies. And there are Draconian press curbs that even restrict journalists. Foreign journalists have been kicked out of the country.
BILL MOYERS: We tried to get in a couple years ago and, of course, we couldn't. We were refused at the border. Our producer --
GEORGE AYITTEY: Yeah. And it is even very, very difficult to organize any political activity in Zimbabwe because according to Zimbabwe election laws, you can't have a political rally of more than nine people. I mean, imagine, it's also the same law that you have in Uganda, for example. But at any rate, Mugabe's Zanu-PF has taken over most of the critical institutions and sort of subverted them to serve his interests and interests of his cronies. So, in other words, what you have in Zimbabwe is a kind of a political apartheid system.
BILL MOYERS: Political apartheid --
GEORGE AYITTEY: Yes. Where if you don't belong to the Zanu-PF, you're excluded. And even when food aid is sent to the country, Mugabe's cronies distribute the food aid to their supporters. If you're not a member of them, you're excluded.
BILL MOYERS: This is something that puzzles me, and I've been to Africa often. Why do the other African leaders let him get away with it? Why don't they call him on the carpet, as we say?
GEORGE AYITTEY: Well, there are two reasons for this. Number one, if you look at certain African leaders, say Thabo Mbeki of South Africa and Nujoma of Namibia. See, they form the frontline states in the struggle against apartheid. Back then, in the 1980s, Mugabe provided sanctuary to the ANC guerilla fighters.
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George Ayittey, Professor of Economics at American University, Washington, DC
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