NYT Journalist Discusses the Killing of Hamas Leader Yahya Sinwar

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CHIEF INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: OK. So, as we, though, have been told by the IDF, the foreign minister, that it is absolutely confirmed. And the U.S. has been told that it’s been confirmed. Just for people who might not understand how Israel would know and check, obviously, because Sinwar was in Israel jails for about two decades, right? They would have his DNA, his teeth pictures, and x-rays, and all the rest of it.

RONEN BERGMAN, STAFF WRITER, THE NEW YORK TIMES MAGAZINE AND AUTHOR, “RISE AND KILL FIRST”: Yes. They have all of these, the dental record, the fingerprints, which could be also examined back in Gaza. They don’t need to fly the body or the fingerprints over. They have the online database and the DNA all taken when — from the time he was a prisoner, he was released in the Shalit deal in 2011. So, this could be easily matched and identified.

AMANPOUR: And I want to ask you a question because people want to know who are the other two or one other body there? Some Americans have said and others, and I think even you know, Qatari — anyway, people have been saying that if the successor is Yahya Sinwar’s brother, Mohammed then, quote/unquote, we’re screwed, because he apparently is no touchy-feely kind of guy in terms of ceasefires. And it might even be worse. And certainly, hostage deals. What do you know about that?

BERGMAN: So, the brother, Mohammed Sinwar, is considered to be even more extreme, more rogue as much as someone can be more extreme or rogue than Yahya. He was not in the vicinity where the alleged Sinwar was killed. He is believed to be somewhere else in Southern Gaza. And it is assessed by Israeli intelligence that he will be the successor. The late Sinwar was holding two hands. He was the leader of Hamas in Gaza, but also, he replaced Ismail Haniyeh as the political leader, the head of the political bureau of Hamas. These two hands, if given to Mohammed Sinwar, I think in the coming future, we should expect a more hard line from Hamas and not something that would get us anywhere close to the final ceasefire and exchange of hostages. This is even before I speak about the expected positions from Israeli prime minister.

AMANPOUR: And we are going to hear from the Israeli prime minister. But I want to ask you, again, because all Israeli families and friends of the hostages, that’s their main demand to have their people back. A Qatari — the Qatari prime minister has told reporters in Brussels this week, basically, in the last three to four weeks, there’s been no conversation or engagement at all. And we’re just moving in the same circle with silence from all parties. So, Qatar, who’s been brokering and hosting a lot of these ceasefire talks. What more can you tell us about what might happen if this is the case, Yahya Sinwar gone or not?

BERGMAN: So, maybe this will be the opening of yet another round of talks because everything is completely stuck. Hamas has given its final answer on July 3rd and then Benjamin Netanyahu, Israeli prime minister, in what was called the clarification letter, just loaded more obstacles and more new terms, some of them already given up by Israel. And then, Hamas loaded new terms. So, it’s — this road is nowhere to be sold. Maybe now, with the killing of Yahya Sinwar there could be a new opening. There are some ideas that the Israeli leadership to maybe offer a ceasefire in exchange for hostages, maybe some immunity. If someone gives the hostage back. This is yet to be seen and decided. But it’s a watershed moment yet to be seen what kind of direction Hamas will take. One concern, big concern of Israelis, of Israeli officials, is that now with no direct control of the late Yahya Sinwar, maybe the teams guarding the hostages will have less command-and-control system and will, you know, have their own opinion on how to continue, not just them, but also all of Hamas forces. This could lead to defragmentation of the organization, which does not necessarily mean good news.