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>>> HELLO, EVERYONE, AND WELCOME TO "AMANPOUR AND COMPANY."
HERE'S WHAT'S COMING UP.
PUTIN LET ME DOWN.
THOSE WORLDS FROM PRESIDENT TRUMP ON DAY TWO OF HIS UK STATE VISIT.
FORMER UKRAINIAN DEFENSE MINISTER RUSTEM UMEROV JOINS ME FROM KYIV.
AND FROM UKRAINE TO GAZA, PALESTINIANS FEAR THE NEW AIR AND GROUND INVASION OF GAZA CITY.
I SPEAK TO THE NEW PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED NATIONS GENERAL ASSEMBLY, ANNALENA BAERBOCK.
PLUS, WHY JK IMMY KIMMEL'S LATE NIGHT SHOW GOT PULLED OFF THE AIR.
BRIAN STELTZER WITH MORE.
AND DEMOCRATIC CONGRESSWOMAN SARA JACOBS TELLS MICHEL MARTIN HOW FERTILITY TREATMENTS COULD BE MORE AFFORDABLE.
>>> "AMANPOUR AND COMPANY" IS MADE POSSIBLE BY -- THE ANDERSON FAMILY ENDOWMENT.
JIM ATTWOOD AND LESLIE WILLIAMS.
CANDACE KING WEIR.
THE SYLVIA A. AND SIMON B. POYTA PROGRAMMING ENDOWMENT TO FIGHT ANTI-SEMITISM.
THE FAMILY FOUNDATION OF LEILA AND MICKEY STRAUS.
MARK J. BLECHNER.
THE FILOMEN M. D'AGOSTINO FOUNDATION.
SETON J. MELVIN.
THE PETER G. PETERSON AND JOAN GANZ COONEY FUND.
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KOO AND PATRICIA YUEN, COMMITTED TO BRIDGING CULTURAL DIFFERENCES IN OUR COMMUNITIES.
BARBARA HOPE ZUCKERBERG.
JEFFREY KATZ AND BETH ROGERS.
AND BY CONTRIBUTIONS TO YOUR PBS STATION FROM VIEWERS LIKE YOU.
THANK YOU.
>>> WELCOME TO THE PROGRAM, EVERYONE, I'M CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR IN LONDON.
HE CAME, HE SAW, HE WAS FETED.
AND THEN, DECLARED AN UNBREAKABLE BOND WITH BRITAIN.
AFTER THE GOVERNMENT AND ROIL FAMILY DID ALL THEY COULD TO COURT PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP.
PUTTING ON LAVISH PAGEANTRY, FIRMLY BEHIND CASTLE WALLS, SHIELDING THE PRESIDENT FROM THE BRITISH PEOPLE AND ANYONE WHO MIGHT PROTEST.
TODAY, IT WAS DOWN TO BUSINESS.
NOT LEAST, RUSSIA'S WAR IN UKRAINE.
TAKE A LISTEN.
>> IN RECENT DAYS, PUTIN HAS SHOWN HIS TRUE FACE, MOUNTING THE BIGGEST ATTACKS SINCE THE INVASION BEGAN.
WITH YET MORE BLOODSHED.
YET MORE INNOCENTS KILLED.
AND UNPRECEDENTED VIOLATIONS OF NATO AIR SPACE.
THESE ARE NOT THE ACTIONS OF SOMEONE WHO WANTS PEACE.
>> THE PRESIDENT STRUCK A SLIGHTLY DIFFERENT TONE FROM THE PRIME MINISTER, BUT AGREED THE WAR MUST END.
>> IT DOESN'T EFFECT THE UNITED STATES, AND HE, LOOK, IT DOESN'T SO MUCH EFFECT YOU, OF COURSE, YOU ARE A LOT CLOSER TO THE SCENE THAN WE ARE.
WE HAVE A WHOLE OCEAN SEPARATING US, BUT I WILL SAY THIS, IT'S -- MILLIONS OF PEOPLE HAVE DIED IN THAT WAR, MILLIONS OF SOULS.
AND THEY'RE NOT AMERICAN, THE SOLDIERS, MOSTLY SOLDIERS, AS YOU KNOW, THE SOLDIERS ARE BEING KILLED AT LEVELS NOBODY'S SEEN SINCE THE SECOND WORLD WAR.
BUT THEY'RE BEING KILLED, AND I FEEL I HAVE AN OBLIGATION TO GET IT SETTLED FOR THAT REASON.
>> SEATED NEXT TO THE KING THE NIGHT BEFORE, TRUMP GOT THE SAME MESSAGE STAMPED WITH THE ROYAL SEAL.
>> TODAY, AS TYRANNY ONCE AGAIN THREATENS EUROPE, WE AND OUR ALLIES STAND TOGETHER IN SUPPORT OF UKRAINE, TO DETER AGGRESSION AND SECURE PEACE.
>> AHEAD OF THIS TRIP, PRESIDENT TRUMP AGAIN ASSERTED THAT ZELENSKYY IS GOING TO HAVE TO MAKE A DEAL WITH RUSSIA.
THIS DESPITE THE FACT THE UKRAINIAN PRESIDENT HAS EMBRACED EVERY U.S.
PROPOSAL FOR AN IMMEDIATE CEASE-FIRE WHILE RUSSIA HAS NOT.
NOW, RUSTEM UMEROV WAS UKRAINE'S DEFENSE MINISTER UNTIL EARLIER THIS YEAR, AND HE'S NOW THE SECRETARY OF UKRAINE'S NATIONAL SECURITY AND DEFENSE COUNCIL.
WHICH IS LEADING NEGOTIATIONS WITH RUSSIA, HE'S JOINING ME FROM KYIV FOR AN EXCLUSIVE INTERVIEW.
WELCOME TO THE PROGRAM, IN YOUR NEW ROLE.
I SAID YOU'RE LEADING NEGOTIATIONS.
ARE THERE ANY NEGOTIATIONS?
ANYTHING MEANINGFUL GOING ON, BETWEEN RUSSIA AND UKRAINE, OVER ENDING THE WAR?
>> AH, CHRISTIANE, WE SUPPORT -- UKRAINE SUPPORTED PRESIDENT TRUMP INITIATIVE FOR A PEACE PROCESS.
WE HAVE MET TWO TIMES IN SAUDI ARABIA, WE'VE MET TWO TIMES IN EUROPE, IN PARIS AND LONDON, AND WE HAVE PARTICIPATED IN THREE MEETINGS.
AT THE MOMENT, WE CONTINUE THE HUMANITARIAN PART, WHERE WE RELEASE AND EXCHANGE PRISONERS OF WAR.
ON THE OTHER SIDE, AS YOU KNOW, THE EUROPEAN LEADERS, ALONG WITH PRESIDENT ZELENSKYY, VISITED WASHINGTON, AND THERE WAS AGREEMENT THAT THE TRI-LITERAL AND BILATERAL MEETINGS WILL BE DONE UP ON WASHINGTON VISIT.
SO, AT THIS STAGE, I THINK WE'RE WAITING WHEN THE TRI-LITERAL AND BILATE RAL MEETINGS WILL BE DONE.
>> OKAY, SO, IT SOUNDS VERY FORMAL, BUT IT SEEMS TO BE -- THE RESULT IS NO REAL -- WELL, NO NEGOTIATIONS TO END THE WAR AND TO IMPLEMENT A CEASE-FIRE BETWEEN YOU.
CAN I JUST PLAY YOU WHAT PRESIDENT TRUMP SAYS ABOUT PRESIDENT PUTIN NOW, TODAY, HERE IN THE UK?
THIS IS WHAT HE JUST SAID.
>> THE ONE THAT I THOUGHT WOULD BE EASIEST WOULD BE BECAUSE OF MY RELATIONSHIP WITH PRESIDENT PUTIN, BUT HE'S LET ME DOWN.
HE'S REALLY LET ME DOWN.
GOING TO BE RUSSIA AND UKRAINE, BUT WE'LL SEE HOW THAT TURNS OUT.
>> YOU KNOW, HE SAID THAT HE EXPECTED HIS DIRECT DIPLOMACY WITH PRESIDENT PUTIN, HIS RELATIONSHIP WITH PUTIN, FROM HIS FIRST TIME IN OFFICE, WOULD HELP HIM END THIS WAR, BUT CLEAR LY IT HAS.
HASN'T HAPPENED.
DO YOU THINK PRESIDENT TRUMP IS COMMITTED TO USING ALL AMERICAN LEVERAGE, OR DO YOU FEEL LIKE HE'S ESSENTIALLY THROWING IN THE TOWEL A BIT AND LEAVING IT UP TO YOU ALL AND EUROPE?
>> I THINK PRESIDENT TRUMP IS THE ONLY PERSON WHO IS ABLE AND CAPABLE TO FINISH THIS .
AT THIS STAGE, RUSSIA LETS HIM DOWN, AND THERE IS NO COMMITMENT FROM RUSSIAN SIDE TO CONTINUE THIS NEGOTIATIONS.
WE, AS I ALREADY MENTIONED, WE SUPPORT THE INITIATIVE, AND I THINK THIS WAR NEEDS TO END.
AT THIS STAGE, ALL THE EUROPEAN ALLIES, ALONG WITH U.S., ARE SUPPORTIVE OF THIS IDEA.
UKRAINE SPOKEN OUT THAT IT NEEDS GUARANTEES, IT NEEDS STRONG UKRAINIAN ARMED FORCES, IT NEEDS COALITION WILLING TO BE BESIDE IT.
IT NEEDS U.S.
SUPPORT.
AND I THINK AT THIS STAGE, WE'VE DONE OUR PART OF THE DEAL WITH U.S.
AND EUROPEAN ALLIES, I THINK NOW THE TURN IS ON RUSSIAN SIDE.
>> SO, I WANT TO ASK YOU, YOU'RE FEELING IT, I KNOW, IN -- IN UKRAINE, AND CERTAINLY NATO ALLIES ARE FEELING IT.
THERE'S A HUGE STEPUP, IN FACT, SINCE THE ALASKA SUMMIT, WHEN PUTIN VISITED PRESIDENT TRUMP IN THE UNITED STATES.
OF ATTACKS ALL OVER UKRAINE, INCLUDING ON CIVILIANS, AND CIVILIAN INFRASTRUCTURE, NOT TO MENTION INCURSIONS BY RUSSIA INTO NATO AIR SPACE.
SO, YOU ALSO ARE JUST RECEIVING THE FIRST TRANCHE OF, YOU KNOW, WEAPONS AGREED TO UNDER THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION, THAT ACTUALLY THE EUROPEANS ARE BUYING FROM AMERICA TO SEND TO YOU.
GIVE ME THE STATE OF WHAT RUSSIA IS PUMMELING YOU WITH, AND DO YOU THINK YOU'RE GETTING THE WEAPONS NOW TO HELP DEFEND?
>> AH -- AFTER ALASKA MEETING, RUSSIA INCREASED THEIR ATTACKS TO UKRAINE, AND IT IS COMBINING ATTACKS WITH CRUISE BALLISTIC MISSILES, INCLUDING THE KAMIKAZE DRONES.
WE ARE THANKFUL FOR UNITED STATES FOR THEIR SUPPORT, WE'RE THANKFUL FOR EUROPEAN ALLIES THAT ARE FINANCING THIS SUPPORT, SO THEY CONTINUE THEIR SECURITY ASSISTANCE AND IN ADDITION, NATO HAS PROVIDED A NEW MECHANISM THROUGH THE PROGRAM TO FINANCE THE U.S.
ARMS THAT WILL BE SENT TO UKRAINE.
WE NEED, OF COURSE, MORE AREA OF DEFENSE.
WE NEED INTERCEPTOR DRONES FINANCING, BUT RUSSIA IS TRYING TO INCREASE THE ATTACKS PER THOUSAND ATTACKS PER DAY, SO BY THE END OF THE YEAR, I THINK THEY WILL BE EXPANDING IT.
AND IT SHOWS THAT THERE IS NO BIG INTENTION FROM RUSSIA TO END THIS WAR.
>> DO YOU THINK RUSSIA HAS THE INTENTION TO DO SOMETHING MAJOR TO TRY TO FLIP THE BALANCE AND TRY TO SAY THAT THEY'VE WON THIS WAR BY THE END OF THIS YEAR?
AND -- AND TOGETHER WITH THAT, HOW MUCH LAND, TERRITORY, ARE THEY TAKING NOW, IN A REGULAR WAY?
>> SO, LET'S SAY THAT -- LET'S REMIND EVERYBODY THAT THE WAR STARTED IN 2014, AND FULL-SCALE INVASION STARTED IN 2022.
ANY STRATEGIC OBJECTIVES, THEY ARE STOPPED.
WE HAVE STABILIZED THE SITUATION, OUR STRATEGY IS NOT TO ALLOW THEM TO MANEUVER, EVEN THOUGH THEIR MEDIA IS SAYING THEY ARE PROGRESSING, THEY ARE STOPPED.
WE STOPPED THEM IN NORTHERN DIRECTION, IN SUMI, THEY WANTED TO MAKE THE INCURSION, WE STOPPED THEM.
WE -- THEN THEY MANEUVERED TO ZAPORIZHZHIA, WHERE WE STOPPED THEM, AS WELL.
AT THIS STAGE, WE ARE DOING MAXIMUM.
THE LINE IS STABILIZED.
WE PROTECT THE SKIES, BUT THEY CONTINUE TO ASSAULT AND THAT'S WHY WE NEED THE PARTNER SUPPORT.
WE NEED U.S.
SUPPORT, AND WE ARE THANKFUL FOR WHAT THEY ARE DOING FOR US WITH THE SECURITY ASSISTANCE, WITH THEIR DIPLOMATIC INITIATIVES, TO END THIS WAR.
>> SO, WE'VE BEEN REPORTING, WELL, I'VE BEEN REPORTING THAT SOME VERY KEY INTELLIGENCE ASSESSMENTS HERE IN THE UK, DEFENSE INTELLIGENCE, AND OTHER INTELLIGENCE, SAY THAT, YOU KNOW, AT THIS RATE, IT WOULD TAKE SOMETHING LIKE FIVE YEARS FOR RUSSIA TO GET ALL OF DONBAS IN OFFENSIVES.
A, DO YOU AGREE WITH THAT ASSESSMENT, AND B, WHAT CAN YOU TELL US ABOUT YOUR OWN TROOP LEVELS?
BECAUSE WE KNOW THERE'S ONLY A FINITE NUMBER.
AND TELL ME A LITTLE BIT MORE ABOUT WHAT, IF YOU ARE BUILDING YOUR OWN, YOU KNOW, EXPANDING YOUR OWN MILITARY PRODUCTION?
>> SURE.
FROM THE BEGINNING OF THE FULL-SCALE INVASION, I WOULD LIKE TO REMIND THAT UKRAINE DEFENSE FORCES REGAINED 50% OF WHAT HAS BEEN CAPTURED FROM THE FIRST DAYS OF FULL-SCALE INVASION.
AND THAT'S WHY WE ARE HOLDING THEM.
WE ARE NOT ALLOWING THEM TO MANEUVER.
THEY ARE NOT GETTING ANY STRATEGIC OBJECTIVES.
AT THE SAME TIME, WE MANAGE TO REBUILD OUR DEFENSE INDUSTRIAL BASE.
AND OUR MILITARY TECHNOLOGY IS DEVELOPING.
OUR CAPABILITIES ARE FAR BIGGER THAN OUR FINANCIAL ABILITY TO FINANCE THEM, BUT AT THIS STAGE, THEY'RE LEARNING FROM US.
UNFORTUNATELY, THEY HAVE THE FINANCIAL RESOURCES, BECAUSE THEY ARE OIL AND GAS BEING BOTH, AND WE HAVE TO LIMIT IT.
SO, THE RIGHT INSTRUMENTS TO STOP THEM, THERE ARE OPPORTUNITIES AVAILABLE IN OUR PARTNER'S HANDS TO SANCTION THEM, SO, THAT'S WHY WE HAVE TO INTRODUCE NEW INSTRUMENTS, HOW TO STOP THEM.
UNTIL THEY COME AND SIT AND NEGOTIATE WITH US.
>> SO, THIS WEEK, PRESIDENT ZELENSKYY SAID THAT HE IS, QUOTE, READY TO MEET RUSSIAN PRESIDENT, YOU KNOW, PUTIN, FOR FACE-TO-FACE NEGOTIATIONS.
AS YET, THAT'S NOT BEEN ACCEPTED BY PUTIN.
THE KREMLIN SPOKESPERSON SAID RUSSIA IS OPEN FOR NEGOTIATIONS AND HOPES TO SETTLE THE WAR DIPLOMATICALLY.
YOU JUST MENTIONED PUNITIVE MEASURES.
AS YOU KNOW, PRESIDENT TRUMP HAS SAID, IN ADDITION TO PUTIN HAS LET ME DOWN, HE'S EXPRESSED ANGER AND FRUSTRATION AND IMPATIENCE WITH PUTIN OVER THE NINE MONTHS OF HIS ADMINISTRATION.
BUT HE'S ALSO PUT THE ONUS ONTO THE EUROPEANS AND OTHER MEMBERS, LIKE TURKEY, HUNGARY, YOU KNOW, SLOVAKIA, FOR, YOU KNOW, FOR BUYING RUSSIAN OIL AND GAS.
DO YOU THINK HE'S RIGHT?
SHOULD -- SHOULD THESE COUNTRIES STOP THAT BEFORE TRUMP PUTS SANCTIONS ON RUSSIA?
>> I THINK PRESIDENT TRUMP INITIATIVE SHOULD BE SUPPORTED.
THEY -- ALL OF THESE COUNTRIES HAVE A GREAT RELATIONS WITH PRESIDENT TRUMP, AND WE -- WE HAVE TO SIGNAL THE WORLD THAT MORE THEY BUY THIS OIL AND GAS, MORE THE WAR WILL CONTINUE, SO IF THEY ARE PRO-PEACE, THEY HAVE TO STOP IT.
AND THEY NEED TO SUPPORT THE -- PRESIDENT TRUMP'S INITIATIVE.
AT THIS STAGE, WE CAN LIMIT THE IN-FLOW OF MONEY TO RUSSIA, TO CONTINUE THIS WAR.
SO, I THINK THE COUNTRY SHOULD SUPPORT THIS INITIATIVE.
>> ALL RIGHT.
SECRETARY RUSTEM UMEROV, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR JOINING US FROM KYIV.
>>> WHEN IT COMES TO GAZA, DONALD TRUMP AND KEIR STARMER BEG TO DIFFER.
THE UK PLANS TO RECOGNIZE THE PALESTINIAN STATE NEXT WEEK.
TAKE A LISTEN.
>> WE ABSOLUTELY AGREE ON THE NEED FOR PEACE AND A ROAD MAP, BECAUSE THE SITUATION IN GAZA IS INTOLERABLE.
THE HOSTAGES HAVE BEEN HELD FOR A VERY, VERY LONG TIME.
AND THEY MUST BE FREED.
AND WE NEED AID TO GET INTO GAZA AT SPEED, AND SO, IT'S WITHIN THAT CONTEXT OF A PLAN FOR PEACE, WHICH WE'RE WORKING HARD ON, WHICH NOT ONLY DID WE DISCUSS THIS MORNING, BUT OUR TWO TEAMS HAVE BEEN WORKING TOGETHER ON, THE QUESTION OF RECOGNITION NEEDS TO BE SEEN.
>> AND THAT WILL HAPPEN ALONG WITH A NUMBER OF OTHER COUNTRIES AROUND THE ANNUAL UNITED NATIONS GENERAL ASSEMBLY.
MEAN MEANWHILE IS CONTINUING ITS GROUND OFFENSIVE INTO GAZA CITY.
YET MORE BLOOD WILL BE SHED, EVEN AS THE DEATH TOLL OF THE WAR PASSES 65,000, ACCORDING TO AUTHORITIES THERE.
YET MORE TIME THE SURVIVING HOSTAGES WILL REMAIN IN CAPTIVITY.
IN YEARS GONE BY, THE GATHERING OF WORLD LEADERS AT THE U.N.
MIGHT HAVE BEEN AN OPPORTUNITY TO NEGOTIATE AN END TO CONFLICT.
BUT THIS YEAR, THE U.N.
LOOKS MORE DIVIDED THAN EVER.
ANNALENA BAERBOCK WAS SWORN IN LAST WEEK AS THE NEW PRESIDENT OF THE U.N.
GENERAL ASSEMBLY.
SHE WAS FOREIGN MINISTER OF GERMANY UNTIL EARLIER THIS YEAR.
AND SHE JOINED ME FROM NEW YORK TO DISCUSS THE CHALLENGES FOR LEADERS NEXT WEEK.
MADAM PRESIDENT OF THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY, WELCOME TO THE PROGRAM.
>> THANKS FOR HAVING ME AGAIN.
>> AND CONGRATULATIONS, ONE OF THE RARE WOMEN WHO HAVE BEEN ELECTED AND APPOINTED TO THIS POSITION.
BUT LET ME FIRST ASK YOU, IN YOUR OPENING REMARKS, YOU SAID, THIS IS NO ORDINARY SESSION, THE ONE THAT GETS UNDER WAY WITH THE TOP WORLD LEADERS NEXT WEEK.
WHAT DO YOU MEAN BY THAT?
>> WELL, IN A NORMAL WORLD, WE WOULD REALLY CELEBRATE NEXT WEEK, BECAUSE OUR UNITED NATIONS TURNS 80 YEARS OLD.
THIS IS A LIFE SPAN, BUT IF WE LOOK AROUND THE WORLD FROM GAZA, UKRAINE, SUDAN, CLIMATE CRISIS HITTING EVERYWHERE, WE HAVE NOT REALLY CELEBRATING MOOD.
WE NEED THIS INSTITUTION, WHICH BRINGS TOGETHER THE WORLD TO SOLVE PROBLEMS, MORE THAN EVER, BUT AT THE SAME TIME, THIS INSTITUTION IS UNDER HEAVY PRESSURE, FINANCIALLY AND POLITICALLY, SO THIS IS A MOMENT TO REFLECT AGAIN, WHY IN THE DARKEST HOURS OF HISTORY, THIS INSTITUTION WAS BUILT, AND HOW WE CAN PRESERVE IT, BUT ALSO REFORM IT TO MAKE IT FIT FOR THE FUTURE, FIT FOR THE 21st CENTURY.
>> SO, TELL ME THEN, THE INSTITUTION, YOU SAID, IN GENERAL, IS NOT REALLY DOING WHAT IT'S, YOU KNOW, WAS BORN TO DO, GIVEN THE WARS THAT ARE RAGING RIGHT NOW.
WHY DO YOU THINK?
IS IT THE LEADERSHIP STRUCTURE?
WHAT DO YOU THINK IT IS?
>> IT'S THE POLITICAL WILL OF THE INTERNATIONAL COMMUNITY, AND THANKS FOR ASKING THIS QUESTION, BECAUSE THERE ARE SOME PEOPLE OUT THERE SAYING, SO, OBVIOUSLY, WE DON'T NEED THIS INSTITUTION ANYMORE.
BUT THE WORLD WOULD BE IN NO WAY BETTER OFF WITHOUT THE U.N., BECAUSE THE U.N.
IS NOT ONLY THE SECURITY COUNCIL, WHERE WE SEE OFTEN A BLOCKAGE WITH HICH CAUS MANY, MANY PROBLEMS TO NOT MOVE FORWARD ON PEACE AND SECURITY, BUT THE U.N.
IS ALSO UNICEF.
THE ORGANIZATION FOR CHILDREN.
WITHOUT UNICEF, FOR EXAMPLE, 100 MILLION CHILDREN COULDN'T GO TO SCHOOL LAST YEAR.
WITHOUT THE WORLD FOOD PROGRAM, 125 MILLION PEOPLE WOULD HAVE LITERALLY STARVED, BECAUSE THEY WOULDN'T HAVE RECEIVED FOOD.
SO, THEY ARE EVERY DAY BIG SUCCESSES OF THE INTERNATIONAL COMMUNITY, BUT AT THE SAME TIME, WE SEE THAT FOR THE PURPOSE OF PEACE AND SECURITY, UNFORTUNATELY, WE ARE NOT MOVING FORWARD, AND THIS IS WHY THERE IS A REFORM UNDER WAY, ALSO MAKING CLEAR THAT THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY, WHICH REPRESENTS THE 193 MEMBER STATES, SHOULD TAKE MORE RESPONSIBLE RESPONSIBILITY IN THIS AREA.
>> SO, WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT LEADERSHIP, HERE'S WHAT RUSSIA SAID ABOUT YOUR APPOINTMENT, THE DEPUTY AMBASSADOR TO THE U.N.
SAID IN MAY, MS.
BAERBOCK HAS REPEATEDLY PROVED HER IN INCOMPETENCE AND LACK OF UNDERSTANDING.
THIS IS ABOUT YOUR VALID AND NATO AND THE EU'S AND THE U.S., YOU KNOW, PUSH-BACK ON RUSSIA'S INVASION AND INTERFERENCE.
IN THE INTERIM, RUSSIA HAS FURTHER TESTED THE WEST, BY INCURRING DRONES INTO NATO AIR SPACE, TWO COUNTRIES, POLAND AND ROMANIA, INTERFERING IN ELECTIONS, ALL THAT KIND OF STUFF.
HOW DO YOU REACT TO WHAT THE RUSSIAN DEPUTY AMBASSADOR SAID, AND WHY DO YOU THINK THEY KEEP PUSHING THE ENVELOPE INSTEAD OF BEING TOLD TO GET BACK IN THEIR BOX?
>> THE CHARTER OF THE UNITED NATIONS IS VERY CLEAR THAT THE INVASION OF ANOTHER COUNTRY BREACHING THE SOVEREIGN RIGHT OF ANOTHER COUNTRY, IS A CLEAR VIOLATION OF INTERNATIONAL LAW.
AND THEREFORE, THE GENERAL ASSEMBLYREPRESENTING HAS BEEN CRITICAL CLEAR IN MANY RESOLUTIONS THAT THE SOVEREIGNTY IS THE RIGHT TO UKRAINE, LIKE ANY OTHER NATION IN THE WORLD, AND THAT THE INVASION, THE FULL-SCALE INVASION HAS TO END, AND IT CALLS ON ALL ACTORS IN THE WORLD, IT CALLS ON RUSSIA TO END THIS INVASION AND TO GET INTO A DIALOGUE ON PEACE.
>> YOU ARE IN THIS POSITION NOW.
YOU WERE GERMANY'S FOREIGN MINISTER AT THE TIME OF THE FULL-SCALE INVASION, AND YOU WERE VERY VOCAL ON BEHALF OF YOUR COUNTRY, ON BEHALF OF NATO, ON BEHALF OF UKRAINE, ON BEHALF OF THE EUROPEAN LEADER ABOUT PREE PRECISELY THAT, ABOUT THE BASIC RULES OF THE U.N., WHICH IS, YOU DON'T INVADE A NEIGHBORING SOVEREIGN STATE.
YOU DON'T INVADE YOUR NEIGHBOR.
DO YOU THINK, AS MANY ARE NOW SAYING, THAT NINE MONTHS INTO OFFICE, PRESIDENT TRUMP, WHO WIELDS, AS THE UNITED STATES, THE LARGEST AMOUNT OF LEVERAGE OVER UKRAINE OR EVEN OVER ISRAEL, IS STANDING BY AS AN OBSERVER, MORE THAN AN ACTUAL ACTOR, USING HIS LEVERAGE?
OTHER WORDS, WITHOUT THE LEVERAGE AND THE FULL COMMITMENT OF THE UNITED STATES, DO YOU THINK IT'S POSSIBLE TO GET THE U.N.
TO -- TO MEET ITS OBLIGATIONS?
>> IT'S NOT MY POSITION TO COMMENT ON INDIVIDUAL STATES.
IT'S TO BRING FORWARD THE PRINCIPLES OF THE UNITED NATIONS, AND OUR CHARTER.
AND THE CHARTER IS ALSO CLEAR ON THE RESPONSIBILITY, ESPECIALLY OF THE P-5 MEMBERS.
SO, THE PERMANENT MEMBERS OF THE SECURITY COUNCIL.
THEY DO NOT ONLY HAVE RIGHTS LIKE A VETO RIGHT, BUT THEY ALSO DO HAVE A RESPONSIBILITY FOR PEACE AND SECURITY.
THIS IS WHY THEY DO HAVE THE SPECIAL RIGHTS IN THE SECURITY COUNCIL.
AND THIS IS WHY THERE HAS BEEN SUCH A FRUSTRATION OVER THE LAST DECADE, BUT ALSO LATELY, BY MANY, MANY OTHER COUNTRIES, WHO ARE NOT PART OF THE SECURITY COUNCIL, OR NONPERMANENT MEMBERS, THAT THESE SPOTS OF THE P-5 MEMBERS ARE OBVIOUSLY NOT BEING DELIVERED.
AND THEREFORE, THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY HAS TAKEN ALSO THEIR RESPONSIBILITY UP, AND HAS SAID, IF THERE'S A VETO IN THE SECURITY COUNCIL, WE WILL TRANSFORM IT TO THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY.
ALMOST EVERY COUNTRY IN THE WORLD HAS A BIGGER NEIGHBOR.
SO, NO COUNTRY IN THE WORLD COULD SLEEP IN SILENCE, ACTUALLY NOT EVEN THE BIGGEST SUPERPOWERS.
IF WE WOULDN'T HAVE OUR CHARTER ANYMORE.
IF WE WOULD LOSE THIS BASIC RULES THAT YOU'RE NOT ALLOWED TO INVADE YOUR NEIGHBOR, THAT YOU HAVE TO RESPECT THE TERRITORIAL BORDERS, BUT ALSO, THAT HUMAN RIGHTS ARE UNIVERSAL.
>> LET ME ASK YOU ABOUT GAZA, BECAUSE OBVIOUSLY, THE U.N.
IS VERY, VERY INVOLVED.
AS YOU WELL KNOW, MANY NATIONS, INCLUDING EUROPEANS AND OTHERS, ARE ABOUT TO RECOGNIZE PALESTINE AS A STATE, THE -- A PALESTINIAN STATE.
AT THE U.N.
BUT THE U.S.
HAS DENIED VISAS FOR THE PALESTINIAN AUTHORITY PRESIDENT, THE INTERNATIONALLY AND ISRAELI RECOGNIZED PRESIDENT OF THE PALESTINIAN AUTHORITY, ABBAS, AND 80 OTHER PALESTINIAN OFFICIALS.
NOW, THERE IS A VOTE THIS WEEK, TOMORROW, ON LETTING ABBAS ADDRESS THE ASSEMBLY BY SATELLITE, OR REMOTELY, ZOOM, WHATEVER YOU WANT TO SAY.
WILL YOU, AS PRESIDENT OF THE ASSEMBLY, VOTE OR AGREE TO ALLOW THAT TO HAPPEN?
>> WELL, FIRST OF ALL, LET ME SAY, THE SITUATION IN GAZA IS UNACCEPTABLE.
AND WE HAVE SEEN THAT THERE'S VERY RARE MOMENTS WHERE WE DID HAVE A SHORT CEASE-FIRE.
THIS WAS NOT ONLY A RELIEF MOMENT FOR THE PEOPLE SUFFERING IN GAZA, THAT MEDICINE, THAT FOOD COULD COME IN, BUT THIS WAS ALSO THE MOMENT WHEN HOSTAGES, ISRAELI HOSTAGES, COULD BE FREED AND WERE BROUGHT BACK TO THEIR FAMILIES.
SO, IT'S CRYSTAL CLEAR, THIS LONG-STANDING CONFLICT BETWEEN ISRAEL AND GAZA CANNOT BE ENDED BY WAR, NEITHER BY OCCUPATION, NOT BY TERROR.
AND THEREFORE, THE DECLARATION OF NEW YORK IS SO CLEAR.
WE NEED THIS IRREVERSIBLE PATHWAY TOWARDS A TWO-STATE SOLUTION.
WE NEED A CEASE-FIRE NOW.
WE NEED HUMANITARIAN ACCESS AND THE RELEASE OF ALL HOSTAGES.
AND THEREFORE, THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY HAS ALSO MADE VERY, VERY CLEAR THAT THIS TOPIC HAS TO BE ADDRESSED AT THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY.
THIS IS WHY WE HAVE THE UNITED NATIONS.
THAT IN THE DARKEST HOURS, WE COME TOGETHER.
SO, WE HAVE THIS TWO-STATE SOLUTION CONFERENCE, AND YES, IT'S THE RESPONSIBILITY OF THE HOST COUNTRY TO ALLOW MEMBERS, TO ALLOW ACTORS OF THE INTERNATIONAL COMMUNITY TO COME TO OUR UNITED NATIONS IN THESE MOMENTS.
WE HAVE TO BRING TOGETHER THE DIFFERENT ACTORS.
SO, IT'S AN OBLIGATION TO GRANT VISAS.
BUT THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY HAS ALSO PREPARED, IF THERE'S VIOLATION OF THE OBLIGATION, IS TAKING PLACE, TO ENABLE AN ALTERNATIVE, IF THE HOST COUNTRY IS NOT FOLLOWING WHAT THEY ACTUALLY SHOULD, TO ALLOW ALSO ABBAS TO COME TO NEW YORK.
>> OKAY, SO, OUT OF ALL OF THAT, I THINK I GET YOUR MESSAGE, WHAT YOU'RE TRYING TO SAY, BUT CAN YOU TELL ME, YES OR NO, IF HE CANNOT COME, WILL HE ADDRESS IN SOME OTHER WAY?
>> WE ARE MAKING SURE THAT THERE'S A WAY TO ADDRESS, BUT AS YOU SAID, THE VOTE IS TOMORROW, SO, YOU SHOULD TAKE THAT, BUT THERE ARE PREPARATIONS ONGOING, BECAUSE IT'S THE PURPOSE OF THE UNITED NATIONS TO HEAR IN THESE KIND OF SITUATIONS ALL THE VOICES WHICH HAVE TO BE HEARD.
>> PRESIDENT OF THE UNGA ANNALENA BAERBOCK.
THANK YOU.
>> THANK YOU.
>>> NOW, IN THE UNITED STATES, A PRESSURE CAMPAIGN IS MOUNTING ON THE COUNTRY'S BROADCASTERS.
DISNEY IS PULLING JIMMY KIMMEL'S LATE-NIGHT SHOW OFF ITS ABC AIRWAVES INDEFINITELY.
THE DECISION WAS MADE OVER THE COMEDIAN'S REMARKS ON MONDAY ABOUT CHARLIE KIRK'S ASSASSINATION.
HERE'S WHAT HE SAID.
>> WE HIT SOME NEW LOWS OVER THE WEEKEND WITH THE MAGA GANG DESPERATELY TRYING TO CHARACTERIZE THIS KID THAT MURDERED CHARLIE KIRK AS ANYTHING OTHER THAN ONE OF THEM, AND DOING EVERYTHING THEY CAN TO SCORE POLITICAL POINTS FROM IT.
>> ABC CAME UNDER HUGE PRESSURE FROM THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION, THE POWERFUL HOLDER OF TV LICENSES, FCC CHAIRMAN BRENDAN CARR HAD SAID, WE CAN DO THIS THE EASY WAY OR THE HARD WAY.
THIS ALL RAISES FEARS ABOUT FREE SPEECH IN AMERICA AND THE RELATIONSHIP BETWEEN THE ADMINISTRATION AND MEDIA CORPORATIONS.
JOURNALIST BRIAN STELTER HAS BEEN FOLLOWING THESE DEVELOPMENTS CLOSELY, AND HE'S JOINING ME NOW TO EXPLAIN WHATS HAPPENING.
BRIAN, THANKS FOR BEING WITH US.
YOU ARE A VERY WELL-KNOWN AND WELL-INFORMED MEDIA ANALYST.
AND YOU'VE WRITTEN A LOT ABOUT THIS, INCLUDING WITH YOUR BOOK "NETWORK OF LIES."
SO, FIRST AND FOREMOST, WHO TOOK THIS DECISION TO PULL JIMMY KIMMEL, AND I WOULD JUST SIMPLY LIKE TO SAY, LIKE SO MANY HAVE DONE, IT WAS CERTAINLY AN OFF-COLOR REMARK IN THE WAKE OF THIS ASSASSINATION, WHICH IS BEING DEEMED, YOU KNOW, A POLITICAL ASSASSINATION, I THINK, AS WELL.
>> IT WAS, YES, JIMMY KIMMEL'S OBSERVATION ABOUT THE POLITICAL ENVIRONMENT IN THE WAKE OF THAT ASSASSINATION, KIMMEL CERTAINLY NOT THE ONLY FIGURE TO MAKE A SIMILAR OBSERVATION, ALTHOUGH HE WAS CRITICIZED PRETTY HARSHLY BEGINNING ON TUESDAY BY SOME CONSERVATIVE WEBSITES AND PRO-TRUMP TV SHOWS.
THEN, ON WEDNESDAY, THE FCC CHAIRMAN BRENDAN CARR DECIDED TO WADE INTO THIS.
HE DECIDED TO APPEAR ON A RIGHT-WING PODCAST AND MAKE A VERY OVERT THREAT TO DISNEY, BY SAYING THAT KIMMEL -- MIGHT BE APPROPRIATE TO SUSPEND HIM, IF THAT DOESN'T HAPPEN, STATIONS SHOULD TAKE OTHER STEPS.
BRENDAN CARR, ESSENTIALLY, VERY LOUDLY POINTED OUT THAT THE FCC HAS POWER OVER LOCAL STATIONS THAT ARE AFFILIATED WITH ABC ALL ACROSS THE COUNTRY, AND MOST OF THOSE STATIONS, CHRISTIANE, ARE NOT OWNED BY ABC'S PARENT COMPANY DISNEY.
THEY ARE OWNED BY OTHER COMPANIES THAT HAVE THEIR OWN BUSINESS PENDING BEFORE THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION.
COMPANIES LIKE NEXSTAR AND SINCLAIR, NEED TRUMP ADMINISTRATION APPROVAL FOR MERGERS AND OTHER DEALS THAT THEY WOULD LIKE TO PURSUE.
SO, WHAT WE ARE SEEING HAPPEN IN THE U.S.
ARE THESE STATION OWNERS TRY TO CURRY FAVOR WITH THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION BY CONDEMNING KIMMEL, ANNOUNCING THEY'RE NOT GOING TO AIR THE SHOW, AND THAT IS WHAT LED ABC AS A NETWORK TO YANK THE SHOW NATIONWIDE.
THIS WAS ULTIMATELY A MOVE BY DISNEY, BY THE CEO, BOB IGER, BUT IT CAME UNDER TREMENDOUS PRESSURE, POLITICAL PRESSURE AND BUSINESS PRESSURE FROM THOSE STATION OWNERS, AND THAT'S WHY KIMMEL IS NOW IN THIS VERY STRANGE LIMBO SITUATION.
>> YOU KNOW THAT PRESIDENT TRUMP TWEETED ABOUT IT LATE NIGHT LONDON TIME, UK TIME, FROM WITHIN THE CASTLE WALLS AT WINDSOR, EITHER BEFORE OR DURING OR AFTER THE STATE BANQUET, BASICALLY SAID IT WAS GREAT NEWS FOR AMERICA, THE RATINGS CHALLENGED JIMMY KIMMEL SHOW IS CANCELED, CONGRATULATIONS TO ABC, ET CETERA, KIMMEL HAS ZERO TALENT, WORSE RATINGS THAN COLBERT.
THAT LEAVES JIMMY AND SETH ON FAKE NEWS NBC.
AND HE'S CALLING, DO IT, NBC, PRESIDENT DJT.
SO, LET'S FACE IT.
BRENDAN CARR, AS WELL AS OTHERS IN THIS ADMINISTRATION, HAVE WRITTEN KEY PARTS OF THE PROJECT 2025, WHICH LAID OUT A ROAD MAP FOR TRUMP 2.0.
IS IT SURPRISING, THEN -- >> THAT'S RIGHT.
>> THAT HE WOULD USE ALL THIS POWER TO BRING PEOPLE IN LINE, ACCORDING TO THEIR LINE, AND THE LINE THEY HOLD?
AND IF THAT'S THE CASE, WHAT DOES THAT MEAN FOR ALL OF US?
>> WELL, YOU KNOW, ONE OF THOSE LINES THAT BRENDAN CARR WROTE IN THAT PROJECT 2025 WAS, QUOTE, THE FCC SHOULD PROMOTE FREEDOM OF SPEECH.
SO, WHEN CARR WAS IN THE MINORITY, WHEN HE WAS ONE OF THE LONELY REPUBLICAN COMMISSIONERS AT THE DEMOCRATIC-CONTROLLED FCC, HE WAS, OF COURSE, ADVOCATING FREEDOM OF SPEECH.
BUT NOW THAT HE HAS THE POWER, AND NOW THAT HE KNOWS WHAT PRESIDENT TRUMP WANTS FROM HIM, HE IS ACTING VERY DIFFERENTLY.
AND, YES, THERE'S A LOT OF HYPOCRISY ON DISPLAY IN THIS STORY THIS WEEK.
IT IS CLEAR, PRESIDENT TRUMP WANTS TO SQUASH DISSENT IN THE U.S.
HE WANTS TO SILENCE CRITICS.
AND HE'S VERY CLEARLY GOING AFTER LATE-NIGHT COMICS, ENTERTAINERS, AS ONE OF THOSE AREAS.
THIS HAS CREATED A REAL CHILL IN HOLLYWOOD AND ACROSS THE ENTERTAINMENT INDUSTRY.
BUT YOU KNOW, FEAR IS CONTAGIOUS, AND SO IS HOPE AND OPTIMISM.
SO, I DON'T THINK FEAR IS THE ONLY APPROPRIATE RESPONSE IN A MOMENT LIKE THIS.
IT'S ALSO IMPORTANT TO SEE SOLIDARITY, AND ACTS OF FREE SPEECH FROM OTHER MEDIANS, FROM OTHER STARS, AND WE ARE SEEING SOME OF THAT TODAY.
WE HAVE SEEN UNIONS AND MUSICIANS AND COMEDIANS SPEAKING OUT, FREE SPEECH GROUPS, FREE EXPRESSION GROUPS, THERE IS NOW A LOT OF NOISE, A LOT OF CRITICISM OF ABC, AND WE DON'T KNOW YET HOW THIS IS GOING TO PLAY OUT, AND WHETHER THE KIMMEL SHOW WILL EVER COME BACK ON THE AIR.
>> AND MEANTIME, YOU POINTED OUT, YOU KNOW, FCC CHAIRMAN TALKED ABOUT FREE SPEECH, ET CETERA, BUT SO DID PRESIDENT TRUMP, ONE OF THE FIRST EXECUTIVE ORDERS CALLED FOR, YOU KNOW, FREE SPEECH AND ENDING ANY CENSORSHIP.
SO, IT IS, BASICALLY, YOU KNOW, ONE PERSON'S CENSORSHIP IS ANOTHER PERSON'S ET IS TRA, BUT YOU'VE LAID OUT, YOU KNOW, THE -- THE DESIRE TO CONTROL CRITICISM AND TOW THE PARTY LINE.
BUT WHAT ABOUT THE OTHER THING THAT'S SUPER CYNICAL?
AND THAT APPEARS TO BE THE BUSINESS IMPERATIVE.
YOU KNOW, ABC, DISNEY, SETTLED WITH THE PRESIDENT ON A DEFAMATION SUIT, REMEMBER, THEY PAID, I THINK, SOMETHING LIKE $16 MILLION.
THEN YOU HAD CBS SETTLING.
ALL OF THIS BECAUSE OF ALL THIS CONSOLIDATION AND DEPENDENCE ON GOVERNMENT FOR VARIOUS, YOU KNOW, MEDIA CONTRACTS AND THE BUSINESS ENVIRONMENT.
TELL US WHERE THAT'S GOING TO LEAD.
>> IN MANY WAYS, WE SEE RIGHT NOW -- WE SEE KIND OF A CLASH BETWEEN FIRST AMENDMENT RIGHTS AND BUSINESS INTERESTS.
AND OFTENTIMES, THE CORPORATE INTEREST WIN OUT WHEN THOSE CLASHES OCCUR.
YOU'RE RIGHT TO POINT OUT THAT DISNEY ARGUABLY BEGAN THIS CYCLE OF MEDIA CAPITULATION BY SETTLING WITH TRUMP LAST DECEMBER.
THAT MADE IT A LOT EASIER FOR PARAMOUNT, THE PARENT OF CBS, TO SETTLE WITH TRUMP OVER THE SUMMER WITH A SIMILAR PAYOUT TO TRUMP'S FUTURE PRESIDENTIAL LIBRARY.
AGAIN, THESE THINGS ARE CONTAGIOUS.
SO, AS WE SEE THIS -- THIS KIND OF CAPITULATION, WE ALSO SEE ENERGY FROM REVIEWERS WHO ARE FRUSTRATED AND AGGRAVATED ABOUT IT.
A LOT OF PEOPLE SAYING TODAY THEY MIGHT CANCEL THEIR DISNEY+ SUBSCRIPTIONS.
WE KNOW THE REACTION.
WE DON'T KNOW THE COUNTER REACTION.
BUT IT'S CLEAR, WE'RE SEEING A PROFOUND FREE SPEECH TEST IN THE UNITED STATES.
THIS IS A STRESS TEST.
AND WE DON'T KNOW WHAT THE RESULTS ARE GOING TO BE.
WE KNOW WHAT TRUMP WANTS.
WE KNOW THAT HIS VIEW OF FREE SPEECH IS REALLY ABOUT POWER.
AND HE IS EXERTING HIS POWER TO EVERY POSSIBLE LIMIT.
WE HAVE SEEN SOME MEDIA COMPANIES STAND UP, LIKE "THE NEW YORK TIMES," WHICH WAS SUED THIS WEEK.
"THE TIMES" SAYS IT GOING TO FIGHT THAT.
"THE WALL STREET JOURNAL" HAS SAID THE SAME THING.
THE OTHER MEDIA COMPANIES HAVE TRIED TO MAKE TRUMP GO AWAY.
I CAN TELL YOU, HE'S NOT GOING AWAY.
THIS IS GOING TO CONTINUE TO BE A THREAT TO MEDIA COMPANIES, AND IF THESE OLD FASHIONED MAINSTREAM NEWS BRANDS AND ENTERTAINMENT COMPANIES DON'T STAND UP TO TRUMP, THEN STARS AND COMEDIANS AND JOURNALISTS ARE GOING TO ULTIMATELY LEAVE.
AND THEY'RE GOING TO GO SET UP SHOP ELSEWHERE AND LAUNCH STARTUPS AND CREATE NEW SUB STACKS AND YOUTUBE CHANNELS, AND I WONDER IF THAT'S GOING TO BE ONE OF THE OUTCOMES HERE IN THIS KIMMEL CASE.
>> THAT'S REALLY INTERESTING.
AND LOOK, WITHOUT BEATING, YOU KNOW, A DEAD HORSE HERE, IN TERMS OF THIS AUTHORITARIAN PLAYBOOK, IT DOES COME STRAIGHT OUT OF A LOT OF STUFF I'VE COVERED, YOU KNOW, A FEW YEARS AGO, I INTERVIEWED PRESIDENT ERDOGAN OF TURKEY, AND HE WAS IN THE PROCESS OF GETTING REALLY ANGRY AND POTENTIALLY TAKING LEGAL ACTION AGAINST A GERMAN INTERNET COMEDIAN WHO DID LAUNCH A PRETTY, YOU KNOW, DIE TRIBE AGAINST HIM.
AND THIS IS WHAT I ASKED HIM -- WHY DO YOU CARE?
WHY IS IT SO IMPORTANT FOR YOU TO MAKE A BIG DEAL ABOUT THIS?
AND DOESN'T IT SHOW THAT YOU HAVE A VERY THIN SKIN AND THAT ACTUALLY, BY MAKING A BIG DEAL ABOUT THIS, PEOPLE KNOW ABOUT IT, WHERE AS PEOPLE MAY NOT HAVE KNOWN ABOUT IT IF YOU HADN'T BOTHERED WITH IT AT ALL.
>> Translator: WELL, I MUST PUT IT IN VERY IMPORTANT TERMS.
WE SHOULDN'T CONFUSE CRITICISM WITH INSULT AND DEFAMATION.
WHETHER IT BE SATIRE OR NOT, EVERYTHING HAS TO HAVE BOUNDARIES.
WE HAVE LAWS IN PLACE, AND LAWS ALLOW YOU TO HAVE FREEDOM TO THE EXTENT DEFINED BY LAW, AND, OF COURSE, IT'S MY NATURAL RIGHT TO SEEK OUT FOR MY OWN RIGHTS, THROUGH MY LAWYERS AND THROUGH MY SOLICITORS, I CAN DO THIS.
>> THIS IS REALLY IMPORTANT.
WHEN I HEARD WHAT JD VANCE AND STEPHEN MILLER SAID ON THE, YOU KNOW, WHEN THEY TOOK OVER AND FILLED IN FOR THE LATE CHARLIE KIRK ON HIS PODCAST, THIS IS WHAT STEPHEN MILLER SAID ABOUT THIS, VERY SIMILAR TO WHAT -- TO WHAT ERDOGAN TOLD ME YEARS AGO.
JUST TAKE A LISTEN.
>> IT IS A VAST DOMESTIC TERROR MOVEMENT.
WE'RE GOING TO USE EVERY RESOURCE WE HAVE AT THE DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE, HOMELAND SECURITY, AND THROUGHOUT THIS GOVERNMENT, TO IDENTIFY, DISRUPT, DISMANTLE AND DESTROY THESE NETWORKS AND MAKE AMERICA SAFE AGAIN FOR THE AMERICAN PEOPLE.
>> HE MEANS BY NETWORKS, WHAT THEY CALL RADICAL LEFT WING NETWORKS, BUT HE USED THE WORD TERROR.
THIS IS VERY MUCH LIKE WHAT FOREIGN AUTHORITARIANS DO.
>> TO BORROW FROM THE LATE EDWARD R. MORE URROW, THEY ARE CONFUSING DISSENT FOR DISLOYALTY.
OBVIOUSLY, IN THESE CASES, IF THERE ARE PEOPLE THAT ARE PLOTTING ACTS OF VIOLENCE, THERE ARE GOVERNMENT AGENCIES AND AUTHORITIES THAT ARE EQUIPPED TO HANDLE THAT.
BUT WE HAVE NOT SEEN EVIDENCE FOR THE CHARGES THAT MILLER AND OTHERS HAVE LAID OUT, IN THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION.
>> YEAH.
>> I UNDERSTAND THEY FEEL A -- THEY'RE COMPELLED TO ACTION, A DESIRE TO TAKE ACTION IN THE WAKE OF THEIR FRIEND'S MURDER.
THAT'S UNDERSTANDABLE.
BUT IN THIS COUNTRY, FIRST AMENDMENT RIGHTS ARE SO SACKRY SANT AND WE ARE SEEING THE ARGUMENTS ABOUT THEM PLAY OUT IN REAL TIME.
THE AUTHORITARIAN PLAYBOOK, IN TURKEY, IN HUNGARY, AS WELL, VERY CLEAR.
WEAPONIZED LEVERS OF GOVERNMENT FOR PARTISAN PURPOSES, PRESSURE PRIVATELY OWNED MEDIA COMPANIES TO TOW THE PARTY LINE, REWARD THE ONES WHO ACT KWEE YES, SIRING.
THAT'S WHAT WE'RE SEEING FROM PRESIDENT TRUMP RIGHT NOW IN THE U.S.
AND REMINDS ME OF THAT OLD LINE, YOU EITHER HAVE TO USE YOUR RIGHTS, OR YOU'RE GOING TO LOSE YOUR RIGHTS.
>> YEP.
>> THE PRESS IN THE UNITED STATES, WE BETTER USE THEM.
IN CASE WE DON'T LOSE THEM.
>> THIS IS A VERY TIMELY WARNING FROM YOU, AND, YES, WE DO.
BRIAN STELTER, THANK YOU SO MUCH.
>>> AND NOW, TO A DEEPLY PERSONAL STRUGGLE THAT AFFECTS MILLIONS OF PEOPLE AROUND THE WORLD, THAT IS INFERTILITY.
IN AMERICA, ONE OF TRUMP'S CAMPAIGN PROMISES WAS TO MAKE FERTILITY TREATMENTS MORE AFFORDABLE FOR AMERICANS, BUT LITTLE HAS BEEN DELIVERED.
ONE YOUNG DEMOCRATIC REPRESENTATIVE, SARA JACOBS OF CALIFORNIA, IS NOW LEADING THE PUSH TO EXPAND COVERAGE OF PROCEDURES LIKE IVF.
MICHEL MARTIN ASKED HER WHY SHE'S FOCUSING HER INITIAL EFFORTS ON PROVIDING THIS FOR U.S.
SERVICE MEMBERS.
>> THANKS, CHRISTIANE.
CONGRESSWOMAN, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR JOINING US.
>> THANKS FOR HAVING ME.
>> I DO WANT TO FOCUS ON YOUR BILL, PROVISIONS THAT WERE IN THE DEFENSE BILL THAT JUST PASSED, BUT BEFORE WE GET TO THAT, WHAT'S THE ATMOSPHERE ON THE HILL?
IT'S JUST BEEN A VERY -- LOOK, TUMULTUOUS DOESN'T REALLY CAPTURE IT, BUT IT'S BEEN A REALLY DIFFICULT COUPLE OF DAYS, WE'RE TALKING IN THE WAKE OF THE MURDER OF THE, YOU KNOW, CONTROVERSIAL CONSERVATIVE ACTIVIST CHARLIE KIRK.
THAT STIMULATED, YOU KNOW, SOME FEELINGS, YOU KNOW, IN A LOT OF DIFFERENT INSTITUTIONS.
AND I JUST WONDERED, WHAT IS THE ATMOSPHERE ON THE HILL RIGHT NOW?
>> YEAH, I'LL BE HONEST, IT'S REALLY TENSE HERE.
I HAVE BEEN HERE FOR FIVE YEARS NOW, WHICH MEANS MY FIRST WEEK IN OFFICE WAS JANUARY 6th, 2020.
AND IT FEELS VERY SIMILAR TO THE TIME RIGHT AFTER THAT, WHERE MEMBERS ARE DISTRUSTFUL OF OTHER MEMBERS, AND THEIR INTENTIONS -- THERE'S A LOT OF CONCERN AROUND SAFETY FOR MEMBERS, FOR OUR STAFF, AND JUST A LOT OF TRIOL BEING THROWN AROUND.
AND IT'S A REALLY DIFFICULT TIME TO BE HERE, AND OBVIOUSLY, THAT ECHOES THE DIFFICULTY THAT THE COUNTRY IS FEELING RIGHT NOW.
>> I'M GLAD YOU MENTIONED JANUARY 6th, BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, ONE OF THE ISSUES RIGHT NOW IS POLITICAL VIOLENCE.
THAT'S OBVIOUS, I MEAN, IT'S OBVIOUS THAT MR.
KIRK WAS TARGETED BECAUSE OF PUBLIC STATEMENTS THAT HE'S MADE AND THAT, YOU KNOW, HE WAS OBVIOUSLY A VERY KIND OF ADMIRED AND EVEN LOVED FIGURE IN SOME QUARTERS, BUT OTHER PEOPLE FOUND HIM INSENSITIVE.
NOT -- POLARIZING DOESN'T REALLY CAPTURE THAT.
SOME PEOPLE FOUND HIS COMMENTS RACIST, SEXIST,S SET TRA.
JANUARY 6th, THIS WAS AN INSTANCE OF POLITICAL VIOLENCE.
I UNDERSTAND THAT PEOPLE ON THE I'LL SAY LIBERAL/PROGRESSIVE/DEMOCRATIC SIDE FEEL AGGRIEVED RIGHT NOW THAT THERE DOESN'T SEEM TO BE AN APPRECIATION OF HOW TRAUMATIC THAT WAS FOR PEOPLE, AND I'M JUST WONDERING, HOW DO YOU NAVIGATE THIS GOING FORWARD?
>> YEAH.
I MEAN, IT'S REALLY DIFFICULT, RIGHT?
I WAS IN THE HOUSE GALLERY ON JANUARY 6th, TRAPPED, LITERALLY INTRODUCING MYSELF TO MY NEW COLLEAGUES, WHILE HIDING UNDER A CHAIR.
>> OH.
>> AND IT WAS REALLY SCARY.
AND MY BACKGROUND IS IN ACTUALLY WORKING IN POST-CONFLICT TRANSITIONS AND POLITICAL VIOLENCE AT THE STATE DEPARTMENT AND THE U.N., AND SO, I KNOW ONE OF THE MOST IMPORTANT THINGS WE NEED IN THIS MOMENT IS LEADERSHIP TO STEP UP AND SAY THAT VIOLENCE IS NOT OKAY, WE CAN DISAGREE, BUT WE SHOULD NEVER USE VIOLENCE AS A TOOL TO SETTLE OUR POLITICAL DISAGREEMENTS.
AND UNFORTUNATELY, THAT'S NOT WHAT WE'RE SEEING RIGHT NOW.
AND, YOU KNOW, JANUARY 6th, BUT ALSO, YOU KNOW, MELISSA HORTMAN IN MINNESOTA, RIGHT?
THIS IS AN ISSUE THAT'S TOUCHED BOTH SIDES, AND IT SHOULDN'T BE THAT HARD FOR ALL OF US TO COME TOGETHER AND SAY THAT IN THIS COUNTRY, WE DECIDE OUR POLITICAL DISAGREEMENTS THROUGH THE BALLOT BOX, NOT THROUGH THE BARREL OF A GUN.
>> AND THIS IS THE LAST QUESTION I HAVE ABOUT THIS, THE ADMINISTRATION, THE PRESIDENT, THE VICE PRESIDENT, A NUMBER OF OTHER CONSERVATIVE ACTIVISTS HAVE BEEN DETERMINED TO MAKE THE ARGUMENT THAT THIS IS A PROBLEM OF WHAT THEY CALL THE RADICAL LEFT.
AND THE PRESIDENT'S FIRST PUBLIC REMARKS ABOUT THIS, HE DIDN'T EVEN MENTION THE MINNESOTA LAWMAKERS WHO WERE GUNNED DOWN IN THEIR OWN HOME, ALONG WITH THEIR SPOUSES, ONE COUPLE FATALLY, THE OTHER COUPLE GRIEVOUSLY WOUNDED.
DIDN'T MENTION THEM.
DIDN'T MENTION ANY OF THE DEMOCRATS THAT HAVE BEEN TARGETS OF POLITICAL VIOLENCE.
SO, GIVEN AN ENVIRONMENT LIKE THAT, WHERE YOU HAVE TOP POLITICAL LEADERSHIP DETERMINED TO LAY THE BLAME AT ONE SIDE OR THE OTHER, I JUST WONDER HOW YOU, AS A DEMOCRAT, WHO IS NOT PART OF THAT GROUP, HOW DO YOU FACE THIS MOMENT WOULD SORT OF FEEDING INTO THE VITRIOL AND THIS KIND OF POINTING FINGERS?
>> YEAH, LOOK, THE DATA DOES NOT BEAR OUT WHAT PRESIDENT TRUMP SAID, RIGHT?
THIS IS AN ISSUE THAT IS HAPPENING TO PEOPLE ON BOTH SIDES OF THE AISLE.
AND WE ARE ALL AMERICANS, AND WE SHOULD ALL BE AMERICANS FIRST AND ONE OF THE CORE PRINCIPLES OF OUR COUNTRY IS THAT WE SETTLE OUR DIFFERENCES THROUGH ELECTIONS.
NOT THROUGH VIOLENCE.
>> SO, LET'S MOVE ONTO A BILL THAT -- SOME PROVISIONS OF A BILL THAT YOU JUST GOT PASSED, THE ANNUAL DEFENSE BILL, THE HOUSE JUST PASSED THE ANNUAL DEFENSE BILL.
YOU HAVE PROVISIONS TO EXPAND FERTILITY COVERAGE FOR MILITARY FAMILIES, REQUIRES IVF AND EGG FREEZING TO BE COVERED.
SO, FIRST OF ALL, WHY DID YOU CONSIDER THIS NECESSARY?
AND WHY WAS THIS DEFENSE POLICY BILL THE RIGHT PLACE TO ADVANCE THIS LEGISLATION?
>> SO, WE KNOW THAT MILITARY FAMILIES FACE HIGHER LEVELS OF INFERTILITY THAN YOUR AVERAGE POPULATION, AND IT MAKES SENSE, RIGHT?
WE'RE ASKING THEM TO BE FAR AWAY FROM THEIR LOVED ONES AND DO REALLY DANGEROUS THINGS IN THEIR PRIMARY PRODUCTIVE YEARS.
RIGHT NOW, UNDER TRICARE, THE MILITARY INSURANCE PROGRAM, THEY CAN ONLY GET FERTILITY TREATMENTS COVERED IF THEY CAN PROVE A SERVICE CONNECTION TO THEIR INFERTILITY, WHICH IS REALLY HARD TO DO.
AND SO, I'VE HEARD FROM SO MANY SERVICE MEMBERS WHO BASICALLY WERE FACED WITH THREE CHOICES, LIKE, FOREGO BUILDING A FAMILY, PAY TENS OF THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS OUT OF POCKET, IN ORDER TO DO IT, OR LEAVE THE MILITARY TO GET A JOB IN THE PRIVATE SECTOR THAT HAS HEALTH INSURANCE THAT COVERS THIS KIND OF TREATMENT.
AND THOSE ARE NOT GREAT OF COURSE OPTIONS.
I'MAL 38-YEAR-OLD WOMAN, I TALK ABOUT THIS ALL THE TIME.
I FROZE MY EGGS, I'M IN THE PROCESS OF DOING ANOTHER ROUND OF FREEZING MY EGGS RIGHT NOW.
AND IN TALKING PUBLICLY ABOUT THAT, I ACTUALLY HEARD FROM SERVICE MEMBERS WHO TOLD ME THEY WISH THEY COULD DO THE SAME THING, BUT IT WASN'T AVAILABLE TO THEM.
AND SO, YOU KNOW, I THINK EVERYONE SHOULD HAVE ACCESS TO THE FULL RANGE OF FERTILITY TREATMENTS COVERED BY THEIR INSURANCE.
BUT I THINK OUR MILITARY COMMUNITY IS AN IMPORTANT FIRST STEP, AND COULD BE A FIRST STEP THAT COULD ENABLE OR PUSH OR INCENTIVIZE PRIVATE INSURANCERS TO START COVERING THIS, AS WELL.
>> HOW DO YOU EXPLAIN TO COLLEAGUES AND CONSTITUENTS WHY ACCESS TO FERTILITY TREATMENT IN THIS MORE EXPANSIVE DEFINITION, NOT EVEN IF YOU CAN'T DIRECTLY TIE IT TO MILITARY SERVICE, WHY THAT'S IMPORTANT TO SUPPORTING MILITARY FAMILIES AND SUPPORTING READINESS?
>> YEAH, SO, LOOK, WE INVEST A LOT OF MONEY IN OUR SERVICE MEMBERS' TRAINING, RIGHT?
LIKE, MILLIONS AND MILLIONS OF DOLLARS IN TRAINING THESE FOLKS.
AND IT'S REALLY IMPORTANT FOR US TO THEN BE ABLE TO RETAIN THE BEST OF THEM TO MOVE UP THE RANKS.
AND IF PEOPLE ARE LEAVING THE MILITARY BECAUSE THEY CAN'T BUILD A FAMILY AND NEED TO MAKE OTHER CHOICES, THAT'S REALLY BAD FOR OUR READINESS.
AND I THINK THIS WILL ALSO BE AN IMPORTANT THING WHEN WE'RE DOING RECRUITMENT, WHICH NUMBERS HAVE BEEN DOWN, THAT, YOU KNOW, THIS IS AN IMPORTANT INCENTIVE THAT PEOPLE MIGHT BE INTERESTED IN JOINING THE MILITARY IN ORDER TO ACCESS.
>> SO, SOME PEOPLE ARE GOING TO LOOK AT THIS AND SAY, WELL, THAT'S WHY WOMEN SHOULDN'T BE IN THE MILITARY.
SO, JUST OR CLARITY'S SAKE, THIS IS FOR SPOUSES OF MALE SERVICE MEMBERS, SO THEY KW CAN PRESERVE THEIR FERTILITY, WHILE MEN ARE ON THESE LONG DEPLOYMENTS, OR ARE PERHAPS EXPOSED TO, YOU KNOW, ELEMENTS THAT MIGHT COMPROMISE THEIR FERTILITY, CORRECT?
>> THAT'S RIGHT.
THIS IS SERVICE MEMBERS AND THEIR SPOUSES.
>> YOU ACTUALLY TALKED PUBLICLY ABOUT -- YOU JUST SAID IT, ABOUT FREEZING YOUR EGGS.
A, WHY DID YOU TALK ABOUT IT, AND WHY DID YOU FEEL COMFORTABLE TALKING ABOUT IT?
>> I MEAN, FIRST OF ALL, I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT TO DESTIGMATIZE THESE THINGS, RIGHT?
LIKE, THIS IS WHAT I TALK ABOUT WITH MY FRIENDS ALL THE TIME.
WHO IS HAVING A BABY, WHO IS NOT HAVING A BABY, WHO IS GOING THROUGH IVF, WHO CAN'T AFFORD CHILD CARE?
AND THE IDEA THAT THIS SHOULD BE SHAMEFUL, LIKE, PEOPLE OFTEN THINK ABOUT FREEZING YOUR EGGS AS THIS, LIKE, SAD THING, RIGHT?
LIKE, OH, YOU'RE SO OLD, YOU DIDN'T FIND A PARTNER.
BUT IN REALITY, LIKE, I FIND IT VERY EMPOWERING, LIKE, I'M ABLE TO TAKE AGENCY IN THE DECISIONS ABOUT MY LIFE AND, YOU KNOW, WHAT IS A BIGGER DECISION THAN WHEN AND HOW TO START A FAMILY?
AND ALSO, LIKE, I WORK IN A BODY WHERE IT'S OUR JOB TO MAKE LAWS FOR THE WHOLE COUNTRY.
AND SO MANY OF MY COLLEAGUES DON'T UNDERSTAND THESE TECHNOLOGIES, HAVE NEVER HEARD OF THEM.
IT'S NO SECRET THAT THIS IS THE THIRD-OLDEST CONGRESS IN HISTORY, AND SO, YOU KNOW, FOR ME, ANOTHER BIG PART OF IT IS THAT WE'RE NOT GOING TO MAKE GOOD POLICY IF WE'RE NOT TALKING ABOUT THESE ISSUES, BECAUSE IF MY COLLEAGUES DON'T EVEN KNOW ABOUT THEM, WE'RE NOT MAKING POLICY ABOUT THEM, AND THIS IS AN AREA WHERE WE NEED TO BE MAKING GOOD POLICY, AND EXPANDING ACCESS.
>> SO, WHAT WAS IT LIKE WHEN YOU FIRST SURFACED THIS PUBLICLY WITH YOUR COLLEAGUES?
I KNOW YOU SAID, WITH YOUR FRIENDS, YOU TALK ABOUT THIS ALL THE TIME, BUT WHAT ABOUT WITH YOUR COLLEAGUES?
DO EYEBROWS RAISE?
THEY'RE LIKE, OH, LITTLE SQUEAMISHNESS, YOU KNOW?
>> DEFINITELY.
DEFINITELY ALL OF THAT.
THERE'S ALSO JUST, I THINK, A LOT OF, LIKE, DIS AND MISINFORMATION ABOUT FERTILITY OUT THERE.
THERE'S A LOT OF EDUCATION THAT HAS TO BE DONE.
MANY OF MY COLLEAGUES DON'T REALLY UNDERSTAND HOW REPRODUCTION WORKS, LIKE?
I HAD A REPUBLICAN COLLEAGUE WHO WANTED TO INTRODUCE A BILL THAT BANNED ABORTION AT SIX DAYS.
BUT YOU ACTUALLY START COUNTING PREGNANCY BY YOUR LAST PERIOD, SO, YOU'RE LITERALLY NOT EVEN PREGNANT YET BY SIX DAYS.
AND SO, LIKE -- THERE'S JUST SO MUCH MISINFORMATION AND DISINFORMATION OUT THERE, AND YET, AT THE SAME TIME, WOMEN ARE FEELING SO PRESSURED TO BUILD A FAMILY, AND HAVE KIDS.
BY THIS ADMINISTRATION, BY OTHERS.
AND, YOU KNOW, I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT THAT WE TALK ABOUT HOW THAT REALLY WORKS AND WHAT IS -- WHAT ARE THE REAL POLICIES WE CAN DO TO HELP PEOPLE WHO WANT TO BUILD THEIR FAMILIES?
>> IT'S MY UNDERSTAND THAT THE ADMINISTRATION IS ALSO CONSIDERING BANNING ABORTION ACCESS AT V.A.
FACILITIES.
I DON'T KNOW, IS THAT ALSO PART OF THIS BILL OR CAN THEY DO THAT BY REGULATION OR BY EXECUTIVE ORDER?
>> THIS BILL ONLY COVERS ACTIVE DUTY SERVICE MEMBERS.
BUT WE ARE WORKING ON OTHER EFFORTS TO TRY AND COMBAT WHAT THEY'RE DOING AT THE V.A.
>> SO, THAT HASN'T SET IN STONE YET?
>> THEY CAN DO IT BY EXECUTIVE ORDER, BUT WE'RE TRYING TO PUSH BACK.
>> IT'S A CONUNDRUM, IN A WAY, BECAUSE ONE ARGUMENT MIGHT BE, LOOK, IF ON THE ONE HAND, YOU'RE SAYING YOU WANT TO BAN ABORTION, BECAUSE I THINK THAT'S WRONG, BUT YOU WON'T ENCOURAGE PEOPLE TO HAVE FAMILIES OR SUPPORT THEM IN DOING SO -- I DON'T KNOW IF THOSE ARE RELATED ARGUMENTS OR IF YOU'VE HEARD THOSE LINKED IN THAT WAY.
>> YEAH, ABSOLUTELY.
AND, YOU KNOW, THEY ROLLED BACK THE -- THE POLICY THAT ALLOWED SERVICE MEMBERS TO TRAVEL IN ORDER TO GET ABORTIONS IF THEY WERE STATIONED IN STATES THAT DIDN'T -- DIDN'T HAVE ACCESS TO ABORTION, AND SO, NO, I THINK IT'S A HUGE COMPONENT OF IT.
IT'S WHY I SPEND SO MUCH TIME THINKING ABOUT QUALITY OF LIFE FOR OUR SERVICE MEMBERS.
I REPRESENT SAN DIEGO, THE BIGGEST MILITARY COMMUNITY IN THE COUNTRY.
AND WHEN YOU TALK TO SERVICE MEMBERS, THE THINGS THEY WANT TO TALK TO YOU ABOUT ARE, LIKE, CHILD CARE, HOUSING, HEALTH CARE, JUST LIKE EVERYONE ELSE.
BUT WE HAVE, LIKE, THESE FOLKS ARE SERVING OUR COUNTRY.
WE HAVE A RESPONSIBILITY TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY CAN, YOU KNOW, TAKE CARE OF THEIR FAMILIES, TOO, NOT TO MENTION THAT IF THEY'RE WORRIED ABOUT THEIR FAMILIES AT HOME OR THEY'RE STRUGGLING TO BUILD THEIR FAMILY OR TO AFFORD IT OR CAN'T FIND CHILD CARE, LIKE, THEY'RE NOT FULLY FOCUSED ON THE JOB WE NEED THEM TO DO.
>> WELL, IN FACT, THERE'S A BLUE STAR FAMILY SURVEY FOUND THAT ABOUT 1 IN 4 SERVICE MEMBERS OR THEIR SPOUSES REPORT INFERTILITY.
CAN YOU JUST EXPLAIN, WHAT IS IT ABOUT MILITARY SERVICE THAT MIGHT MAKE THAT UNIQUELY TRUE?
>> THAT'S RIGHT.
LOOK, THE MILITARY POPULATION IS MORE LIKELY TO BE OF REPRODUCTIVE AGE, SO, THAT INCREASES JUST THE NUMBER IN GENERAL, BUT THEN IF YOU THINK ABOUT, LIKE, MILITARY SERVICE, IT'S DURING YOUR PRIME REPRODUCTIVE YEARS, THE MAJORITY OF PEOPLE IN THE MILITARY ARE UNDER 40 YEARS OLD.
AND WE'RE ASKING THEM, ONE, TO BE AWAY FROM THEIR LOVED ONES DURING THOSE YEARS, ON LONG DEPLOYMENTS.
BUT ALSO, THE THINGS WE'RE ASKING THEM TO DO ARE REALLY DANGEROUS, RIGHT?
THEY'RE INTERACTING WITH A LOT OF CHEMICALS, WITH EXPLOSIVES, WITH OTHER KINDS OF THINGS.
AND ALSO, YOU KNOW, IN RECENT YEARS, OBVIOUSLY, ALSO HAVE BEEN SENDING THEM INTO LITERAL WAR ZONES.
AND CONFLICTS.
AND SO, I THINK IT MAKES A LOT OF SENSE THAT THEY THEN ARE HAVING MORE OF THESE STRUGGLES WITH FERTILITY THAN THE AVERAGE POPULATION.
BECAUSE OF THE THINGS WE'RE ASKING OF THEM.
>> BUT YOU KNOW, EVEN PRESIDENT TRUMP DURING HIS CAMPAIGN FOR THIS TERM CALLED FOR MAKING IVF MORE AFFORDABLE.
DO YOU SEE ANY EVIDENCE THAT THERE'S A MOVE IN THAT DIRECTION?
>> YOU KNOW, WE'VE NOT SEEN ANY EVIDENCE OF THAT, ALTHOUGH I'M STILL HOPEFUL, BECAUSE I DO THINK IT'S SOMETHING THAT IS REALLY, REALLY IMPORTANT.
AND WHILE OUR BILL THAT IMPACTS MILITARY SERVICE MEMBERS DOES NOT COVER EVERYONE, IT STILL COVERS MILLIONS OF PEOPLE, AND WE HAVE OFTEN SEEN THAT WHEN TRICARE STARTS TO COVER SOMETHING, PRY VAULT INSURERS TEND TO FOLLOW.
>> ONE OF THE THINGS THAT DISTINGUISHES YOUR TENURE IS SORT OF TRYING TO FIND KIND OF NUANCED APPROACHES TO DIFFICULT ISSUES.
FERTILITY COVERAGE, BUT ALSO, ON ANOTHER POLARIZING ISSUE, ISRAEL AND GAZA.
YOU'VE SUPPORTED ISRAEL'S RIGHT TO DEFEND ITSELF, BUT YOU'VE ALSO TRIED TO SPEAK UP FOR HUMANITARIAN ACCESS, CALLING OUT ATROCITIES.
AND I JUST -- I JUST HAVE TO WONDER, ARE YOU KIND OF A CAUCUS OF ONE IN THAT?
OR DO YOU FEEL LIKE THERE ARE OTHER PEOPLE LOOKING FOR THAT MIDDLE SPACE?
I MEAN, THERE HAVE BEEN THESE DIFFERENT GROUPS OVER TIME, YOU KNOW, THE PROBLEM SOLVERS CAUCUS, THE BLUE DOG DEMOCRATS, PEOPLE WHO SAW THEMSELVES AS PEOPLE WHO WERE LOOKING FOR THESE CENTRIST POSITIONS, BUT DO YOU -- DO YOU FEEL THAT THERE'S SPACE FOR SOMEBODY LIKE YOU?
>> I'M THE YOUNGEST JEWISH MEMBER OF CONGRESS, SO, YOU KNOW, FOR ME, THE ISSUES IN ISRAEL ARE VERY PERSONAL.
I HAVE FAMILY WHO LIVES IN TEL AVIV, AND, IN FACT, YOU KNOW, MY FIRST COUSIN ACTUALLY MOVED TO SAN DIEGO AFTER OCTOBER 7th, BECAUSE SHE DIDN'T WANT HER KIDS TO BE IN A BOMB SHELTER EVERY NIGHT.
AND, YOU KNOW, MY COUSINS, MY AUNT AND UNCLE SEND PICTURES OF THEM IN THE BOMB SHELTER MANY NIGHTS.
AND I THINK ABOUT THE FAMILIES IN GAZA WHO DON'T HAVE BOMB SHELTERS TO GO TO.
AND I'VE BEEN ALL OVER ISRAEL MANY TIMES, I'VE BEEN TO GAZA, I'VE BEEN TO THE WEST BANK.
FOR ME, I THINK IT'S MAYBE BECAUSE OF THAT, EASIER TO SEE THE HUMANITY ON BOTH SIDES, BUT I ACTUALLY THINK THAT MY POSITION IS WHAT THE MAJORITY OF AMERICANS FEEL, THAT OCTOBER 7th WAS REALLY BAD, THAT ISRAEL HAS A RIGHT TO DEFEND ITSELF, BUT ALSO, WHAT WE'RE SEEING IN GAZA RIGHT NOW IS HORRIFIC AND TERRIBLE AND SHOULD BE STOPPED.
AND THAT'S PARTICULARLY TRUE OF YOUNG JEWS.
AND SO, YOU KNOW, I THINK -- IT'S OFTEN HARD HERE IN CONGRESS TO -- TO FIND A NUANCED POSITION, RIGHT?
EVERYONE WANTS YOU TO PICK A SIDE, BUT I ACTUALLY THINK THAT MOST OF MY COLLEAGUES AND MOST OF THE AMERICAN PEOPLE ARE ACTUALLY WHERE I AM, AND I JUST HAVE THE PERSONAL STORY TO BE ABLE TO TALK ABOUT IT A LITTLE BIT MORE LOUDLY.
>> AND AS WE ARE SPEAKING NOW, ANOTHER POSSIBLE GOVERNMENT SHUTDOWN, BECAUSE OF AN INABILITY TO PASS A BUDGET ON TIME.
AND AN ABILITY TO RETURN TO WHAT'S CALLED REGULAR ORDER, WHICH MEANS JUST DOING WHAT WE ALL LEARNED ABOUT IN FIFTH GRADE, WHICH IS, YOU KNOW, COMMITTEES MEET, THEY TALK ABOUT THE BUDGET, BOTH SIDES PASS IT, PRESIDENT SIGNS IT, THEY WORK OUT THEIR DIFFERENCES IN COMMITTEE THAT'S NOT HAPPENING FOR THE MOST PART.
SO -- >> LOOK, I DON'T KNOW IF WE'RE GOING TO END UP IN A GOVERNMENT SHUTDOWN.
I MYSELF DON'T THINK I CAN VOTE FOR A CONTINUING RESOLUTION THAT DOESN'T INCLUDE PROTECTING PEOPLE'S HEALTH CARE, THAT WE KNOW IS BEING GUTTED WITH THEIR CUTS TO MEDICAID, NOT TO MENTION THE THINGS THEY PUT INTO THIS ACTUAL CONTINUING RESOLUTION.
AND SO, YOU KNOW, THOSE CONVERSATIONS ARE ONGOING, BUT I THINK IT'S UNFORTUNATE THAT BASICALLY IN MY WHOLE TIME IN CONGRESS WE'VE HAD TO GET TO THIS POINT WHERE IT'S A CRISIS BEFORE WE CAN GET A NEGOTIATION.
AND I THINK THAT IT'S, YOU KNOW, I THINK WHAT THE AMERICAN PEOPLE WANT IS TO KNOW THAT WE CAN GET THINGS DONE, AND THAT'S -- THAT'S WHAT I'M TRYING TO SHOW HERE.
>> ARE YOU STILL GLAD YOU CAME?
TO CONGRESS, I MEAN.
I MEAN, YOU SERVED IN PUBLIC SERVICE BEFORE IN OTHER AREAS, BUT ARE YOU STILL GLAD YOU'RE SITTING IN THAT CHAIR?
>> MOST DAYS, YES.
SOME DAYS, NO.
BUT IT IS TRULY MY HONOR TO GET TO REPRESENT MY COMMUNITY DURING THIS REALLY DIFFICULT TIME.
I NEVER THOUGHT MY BACKGROUND WOULD BE QUITE SO RELEVANT TO WHAT WE'RE EXPERIENCING HERE IN THE UNITED STATES, BUT I ALSO KNOW THAT, YOU KNOW, IF I WASN'T IN A POSITION TO TRY TO MAKE THINGS BETTER, I WOULD ACTUALLY FEEL WORSE, SO, EVEN ON THE HARDEST DAYS, I REMEMBER TO BE GRATEFUL FOR THE OPPORTUNITY I HAVE TO TRY AND FIX THINGS.
>> CONGRESSWOMAN SARA JACOBS, THANK YOU FOR SPEAKING WITH US.
>> THANKS FOR HAVING ME.
>>> AND FINALLY, TOGETHER FOR PALESTINE.
LONDON'S WEMBLEY STADIUM HOSTED A STAR-STUDDED FUND-RAISING CONCERT LAST NIGHT, WITH PROCEEDING GOING TO PALESTINIAN-LED NGOs.
IT BROUGHT PALESTINIAN AND BRITISH ARTIST S TOGETHER.
BENEDICT CUMBERBATCH READ A POEM BY A PALESTINIAN POET.
AND RICHARD GERE, ONCE ON THIS SAME STAGE, INTRODUCING NELSON MANDELA'S BENEFIT CONCERT WHEN HE WAS STILL IN JAIL IN 1988, SUMMED UP THE NIGHT.
>> THE LAST TIME I WAS HERE, I WAS ON STAGE AND I INTRODUCED DIRE STRAITS AT THE CONCERTS FOR NELSON MANDELA.
>> WOW!
WOW.
>> FOR NELSON MANDELA.
BUT I THINK IT'S ONLY RIGHT THAT THE SECOND TIME I COME, IT'S FOR OUR PALESTINIAN BROTHERS AND SISTERS.
>> MANY OF THE SPEAKERS CALLED FOR A CEASE-FIRE AND AN END TO THE WAR.
>>> AND THAT'S IT FOR OUR PROGRAM TONIGHT.
IF YOU WANT TO FIND OUT WHAT'S COMING UP EVERY NIGHT, SIGN UP FOR OUR NEWSLETTER AT PBS.ORG/AMANPOUR.
THANKS FOR WATCHING, AND GOOD-BYE FROM LONDON.