{"id":617,"date":"2009-05-20T16:08:25","date_gmt":"2009-05-20T21:08:25","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.pbs.org\/wnet\/blueprintamerica\/?p=617"},"modified":"2010-12-09T16:38:08","modified_gmt":"2010-12-09T21:38:08","slug":"road-to-the-future-interview-governor-dick-lamm","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.pbs.org\/wnet\/blueprintamerica\/uncategorized\/road-to-the-future-interview-governor-dick-lamm\/617\/","title":{"rendered":"[INTERVIEW] Governor Dick Lamm"},"content":{"rendered":"

Governor of Colorado, 1975-1987<\/em><\/p>\n

on developing denver <\/strong><\/p>\n

BLUEPRINT AMERICA: You are not from Colorado. When did you come to the state? What was it like back then?<\/p>\n

GOVERNOR DICK LAMM: I was born in Madison, Wisconsin, and I was stationed in Colorado in the Army in 1957. I went to Berkley, to law school, and came back permanently in November 1961 \u2013 and I didn\u2019t know a soul. Right out of the University of California I had passed the bar, but Colorado was one of those places where anybody could come and nobody would ask what your background was or how long you had been here. So I took to the place with a liking.<\/p>\n

\n\n\n\n
\"\"<\/a>Dick Lamm<\/em><\/td>\n<\/tr>\n<\/tbody>\n<\/table>\n<\/div>\n

I remember Denver \u2013 the air looked like it had a bunch of little sparkling diamonds in it, when the sun was just coming up or going down. It was a wonderful little town. It certainly lacked certain cultural advantages, but the mountains were fresh and near \u2013 I loved the outdoors always. It was a wonderful mid-sized town in which to plant your roots.<\/p>\n

BA: When did the state begin to change?<\/p>\n

DL: In about 1962, my wife and I went up to Boulder to buy a couple of cats, and the Boulder Turnpike was one of the most beautiful roads in America. You could see Longs Peak and the whole mountains there in the background, and it had this pastoral countryside. And all of a sudden, I noticed somebody had placed a very unsightly building and it never entered my mind that they would develop along the Boulder Turnpike. It was just my na\u00efvet\u00e9, but I remember thinking how incongruous it was. It was almost a desecration to put a building on the Boulder Turnpike, which is now US-36 and is almost backyards and even junkyards all the way up.<\/p>\n

We didn\u2019t have to put development just cheek to jowl all the way up to Boulder. There\u2019s enough room in Colorado! But we did.<\/p>\n

BA: When did you become involved?<\/p>\n

DL: It was only a harbinger, just when the initial insight came \u2013 it was years later before I was in any kind of position. It was, when I really think about it, my first time into the state capitol in Denver as an unpaid lobbyist for the Women\u2019s Garden Clubs fighting against billboards. I was very concerned about the unsightly nature of how we were designing our cities, how we were designing our roads.<\/p>\n

BA: But, what was wrong with that design then \u2013 what is wrong with it still?<\/p>\n

DL: I think that the whole way that we do this \u2013 where you build a road to alleviate traffic and that road has development, sprawl and so much growth. You just never can get on top of it. You roll the rock to the top of the mountain and is just rolls back right down on you.<\/p>\n

Roads are necessary but the fact that we don\u2019t fully recognize that when you build a road you\u2019re doing more than building a road \u2013 you\u2019re building the future development of your city. And, that\u2019s what\u2019s never dawned on people. It still doesn\u2019t, in a way.<\/p>\n

BA: Denver \u2013 and the entire Front Range of Colorado \u2013 never did recognize it, did they?<\/p>\n

The Denver Post in 1971 said in California they invented Los Angeles, but we don\u2019t have to do that here. Los Angeles was the first and what happened in Los Angeles you can argue that, well, they didn\u2019t know any better. But in Denver we should have had the wisdom \u2013 and the foresight \u2013 to look at Los Angeles, and think that we can do better.<\/p>\n

And so [my wife and I] ran this big ad in the paper. We didn\u2019t have a lot of money, I was a young lawyer, and we put a little coupon down on it and said if you believe in this cause, send us some money. Well they sent us enough money to run two more ads and then we got enough money to run one more ad and we just kept doing this. I was in the legislature at the time, actually. I really was starting to get involved in land use planning, but I felt so strongly about this, that nobody was debating the future of Denver and how it was connected to roads.<\/p>\n

BA: And then, all of a sudden, you were Governor of Colorado\u2026<\/p>\n

DL: Once I tried to kill the highway \u2013 and thought that I had successfully killed the highway \u2013 the whole world came down on my head. The I-470 decision \u2013 this was my first year in office and it was not skillfully handled on my part.<\/p>\n

The Denver Post, as I recall, ran over 30 editorials, many times, day after day after day about this new, young governor that was standing in the way of progress. It was very intense. I didn\u2019t have support, even of my own party. I remember going out to a meeting of the Arapaho County, which is south of us and one of the places that sprawls \u2013 down to Arapaho County Democratic Party, here I was, a newly minted governor and they were very unhappy. I really just fought back. I said you have to have vision when you\u2019re developing. We are trustees of a beautiful place called Colorado, and called the Front Range, and called Denver, and if I\u2019m not right here, then you tell me, how do we not become another Los Angeles? They didn\u2019t buy it.<\/p>\n

BA: Was it your failing as a young Governor \u2013 not stopping the development of I-470?<\/p>\n

DL: I think it\u2019s because I poorly handled it. I think the chief reason that I was unsuccessful was I was very heavy-handed \u2013 I was also unilateral. I take a lot of the responsibility on myself.<\/p>\n

Having said that, it is amazing to take on the real estate industry. It is even more amazing to take on the combination, what we call the highway lobby \u2013 which is the auto industry, the repair shops and gas stations \u2013 and all of the economic interests that are related to highways and have invested in highways. We really have to remember that to this day, most of the millionaires in America achieved their wealth through the real estate business. I really kicked the economic back-end of the business community \u2013 probably a bad way to put it, but I kicked the real estate industry and they fought back, and they won.<\/p>\n

BA: And, as a result, Denver became another Los Angeles?<\/p>\n

DL: Sprawl is the American ideal way to develop. I believe that what we\u2019re developing in Denver is in no appreciable way different than what we\u2019re doing in Los Angeles \u2013 did in Los Angeles and are still doing. But I think we have developed the Los Angeles model of city building and I think it is unfortunate.<\/p>\n

You go to Europe \u2013 and you go to other places in the world \u2013 and the cities stop, and then there\u2019s agricultural land and there\u2019s beautiful land around it. There\u2019s a whole different thought process here, where people look at land as a commodity \u2013 no sense of trustee-ship, no sense of stewardship about the future of this area. It\u2019s only in economic terms \u2013 it\u2019s only in how do we grow bigger and better.<\/p>\n

The bible says that \u2018woe onto them that lay field upon field and house upon house\u2026\u2019 And I feel that\u2019s exactly what we\u2019re doing. This is the Los Angeles school of city building.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

Governor of Colorado, 1975-1987 on developing denver BLUEPRINT AMERICA: You are not from Colorado. When did you come to the state? What was it like back then? GOVERNOR DICK LAMM: I was born in Madison, Wisconsin, and I was stationed in Colorado in the Army in 1957. I went to Berkley, to law school, and […]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":46,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[3749,1251,1,7085],"tags":[4997],"class_list":["post-617","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-blueprint-america-by-program-reports","category-by-program","category-uncategorized","category-web-only-features","tag-dick-lamm"],"yoast_head":"\nThe Next American System ~ [INTERVIEW] Governor Dick Lamm | Blueprint America | PBS<\/title>\n<meta name=\"robots\" content=\"index, follow, max-snippet:-1, max-image-preview:large, max-video-preview:-1\" \/>\n<link rel=\"canonical\" href=\"https:\/\/www.pbs.org\/wnet\/blueprintamerica\/uncategorized\/road-to-the-future-interview-governor-dick-lamm\/617\/\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:locale\" content=\"en_US\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:type\" content=\"article\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:title\" content=\"The Next American System ~ [INTERVIEW] Governor Dick Lamm | Blueprint America | PBS\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:description\" content=\"Governor of Colorado, 1975-1987 on developing denver BLUEPRINT AMERICA: You are not from Colorado. 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