{"id":77,"date":"2008-10-14T23:50:33","date_gmt":"2008-10-15T04:50:33","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.pbs.org\/wnet\/blueprintamerica\/?p=77"},"modified":"2018-09-10T16:52:12","modified_gmt":"2018-09-10T20:52:12","slug":"america-in-gridlock-web-exclusive-pennsylvania-governor-ed-rendell-interview","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.pbs.org\/wnet\/blueprintamerica\/video\/america-in-gridlock-web-exclusive-pennsylvania-governor-ed-rendell-interview\/77\/","title":{"rendered":"[VIDEO] Ed Rendell: The Infrastructure Governor"},"content":{"rendered":"

Gov. Ed Rendell (D., PA)<\/span><\/strong> is an advocate for reforming infrastructure policy and practice in both his state and throughout the rest of <\/span><\/strong>America<\/span><\/strong>. He co-chairs Building America\u2019s Future<\/a>, a bipartisan effort to change the way infrastructure is discussed in American politics, with Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger (R., CA) and Mayor Mike Bloomberg (I., <\/span><\/strong>NYC<\/span>). <\/span><\/strong>In <\/span><\/strong>Pennsylvania<\/span><\/strong>, Gov. Rendell has proposed varying measures to improve the state\u2019s infrastructure, which rates particularly poor in road and bridge quality<\/span><\/strong>, from tolling to privatizing public roads. <\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/em><\/p>\n

[Transcript]<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/em><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

Part One ~ Pennsylvania Governor Ed Rendell Interview: <\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

Why talk about infrastructure?<\/span><\/em><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

Gov. Rendell:
\n<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

This is a battle for <\/span><\/strong>America<\/span><\/strong>\u2019s future. Infrastructure in this country is important \u2013 how we deal with our infrastructure in the next two decades is as important to our competitiveness as how we deal with educating our children. They\u2019re both things that are involved in the long term economic competitiveness of this country. Do we want to be a third rate nation or do we still want to be the greatest country in the world when it comes to economy and moving around?<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

The American infrastructure \u2013 our transportation system \u2013 was the envy of the world for decades and decades. Now, it\u2019s laughable. You go over to <\/span><\/strong>Europe<\/span><\/strong> and meet with transportation secretaries of European states, and they make fun of us because we don\u2019t have any rail transportation for passengers and even rail freight that\u2019s so much better for the environment, that\u2019s so much more economical\u2026 You\u2019ve seen those commercials where they say the equivalent of one gallon of gasoline will move X amount of tons of rail freight, X amount of miles \u2013 it\u2019s stunning. Yet, we\u2019re spending a whole lot less on rail freight than we are on road transportation \u2013 we\u2019re not spending smart. I saw in the newspaper now that they\u2019re thinking of putting trucks on rail lines because it\u2019s so much more economical. We\u2019ve got to start becoming very smart in how we conserve and in how we spend, and that\u2019s the way to deal with the infrastructure. <\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

Ray Suarez: <\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

So what has to change about the way people like you talk to the public about what\u2019s at stake here? <\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

Gov. Rendell:<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

Well, first of all, people have to start talking about infrastructure. Infrastructure is not very sexy \u2013 it\u2019s not like the economy, it\u2019s not like jobs, it\u2019s not even like renewable energy. When I tell people that we\u2019ll be able to get gasoline from a part of the tobacco plant in five years, people go, \u201cWow!\u201d When I tell people that you can get energy from microwaving tires, they say, \u201cWell, that\u2019s incredible!\u201d That stuff is sexy! Infrastructure isn\u2019t sexy. But, we all need it, we all rely on it, our safety depends on it, and it\u2019s time that people start talking about it.<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

Part Two ~ Pennsylvania Governor Ed Rendell Interview: <\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

The benefits of infrastructure repair<\/span><\/em><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

Gov. Rendell:<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

The wonderful thing about infrastructure repair is that it\u2019s the best economic stimulus we can have. No offense to President Bush and the Congress who fashioned the last economic stimulus program, but those rebate checks if you judge by retail sales in the various department stores it\u2019s pretty clear that people got those checks and used it to pay off existing debt \u2013 didn\u2019t create one new job in America, didn\u2019t create one new order for any American business. But, infrastructure repair creates thousands of jobs. It has been estimated that as many as 47,000 jobs come from $1 billion of infrastructure spending. And they\u2019re good jobs \u2013 they cannot be outsourced because the work has to be done right here, they have family sustaining wages \u2013 they\u2019re construction type jobs \u2013 and even better than just the jobs, they\u2019re orders for <\/span><\/strong>Pennsylvania<\/span><\/strong> businesses or American businesses. <\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

Let me give you just one example. In the accelerated bridge repair program, of those 411 bridges in <\/span><\/strong>Pennsylvania<\/span><\/strong>, we will use the equivalent amount of concrete that is used in building 16,000 new homes. Last year in <\/span><\/strong>Pennsylvania<\/span><\/strong>, we only started 25,000 new homes because of the slump \u2013 16,000 would be a 60 percent increase. So, just doing 411 bridges in terms of those concrete manufacturers is the same as increasing new home starts by 60 percent. Steal, you know we\u2019re still a big steal state, there\u2019s enough steal in rebuilding those 411 bridges to build four <\/span><\/strong>Eiffel<\/span><\/strong> <\/span><\/strong>Towers<\/span><\/strong>, one the largest steal structures in the world. An incredible amount of orders for <\/span><\/strong>Pennsylvania<\/span><\/strong> and <\/span><\/strong>U.S.<\/span><\/strong> businesses come from infrastructure.<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

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Part Three ~ Pennsylvania Governor Ed Rendell Interview: <\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

The Cost<\/span><\/em><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

Ray Suarez: <\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

Do you have to spend a billion dollars today, because money wasn\u2019t being spent in the 1970s and 80s on some of these things?<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

Gov. Rendell:<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

To some degrees, that\u2019s so. But also because the federal government, in my judgment, has abdicated its responsibility over the course of a few years. When Dwight Eisenhower left the Presidency, the federal government was spending 11.5 percent of our non-military domestic budget on infrastructure. Today, we spend less than 2.5 percent. <\/span><\/strong>America<\/span><\/strong> spends about a half of a percent of its GDP \u2013 its gross national product \u2013 on infrastructure. European nations spend seven times that much, and <\/span><\/strong>China<\/span><\/strong> and <\/span><\/strong>India<\/span><\/strong> spend almost 20 times as much on infrastructure. So, it\u2019s no secret that we\u2019ve fallen way behind. <\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

The Highway Trust Fund, which is the only thing that supports spending on transportation infrastructure, is anywhere from $3 billion to $8 billion in debt right now. No one has given any real thought to how we are going to cope with infrastructure problems. <\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

The American Society of Civil Engineers says we got a $1.6 trillion infrastructure debt \u2013 meaning just to take what we have now and to repair it and to put it into good working condition would cost $1.6 trillion. That\u2019s not considering, for example, the cost of building high-speed passenger rail, which we need desperately. <\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

I just left a convention of aviation executives \u2013 they can\u2019t cope because we fly too many short flights, 300 miles, 250 miles, 400 miles. If you go to <\/span><\/strong>Europe<\/span><\/strong> or <\/span><\/strong>Asia<\/span><\/strong> there\u2019re no plane flights less than 500 hundred miles, that\u2019s all done by high-speed rail.<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

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Ray Suarez:<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

If you were to go on TV here or in <\/span><\/strong>Pittsburgh<\/span><\/strong> and say, \u201cCome on folks, we\u2018ve got to do something\u2026\u201d We\u2019re sized by these twin contradictory impulses \u2013 we don\u2019t want to spend the money, but we want the stuff fixed or maintained or built\u2026<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

Gov. Rendell:<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

It\u2019s true. You know, I formed an organization with Mayor Bloomberg of <\/span><\/strong>New York<\/span><\/strong> and Governor Schwarzenegger of <\/span><\/strong>California<\/span><\/strong> \u2013 who have done great things on infrastructure in their own jurisdictions and who also really believe we have to have a national program \u2013 and Mayor Bloomberg always says, \u201cThere\u2019s no free lunch,\u201d and people have to understand that on infrastructure spending. <\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

It\u2019s interesting, people know about our bridges, they complain to me all the time, \u201cWhen\u2019s that bridge going to be fixed, we need a new bridge,\u201d they know about the bridges, they know about the roads in <\/span><\/strong>Pennsylvania<\/span><\/strong>, they know about mass transit\u2026 But, in a recent poll, they didn\u2019t want to pay for road and bridge repair by tolling I-80, which is an interstate that goes through <\/span><\/strong>Pennsylvania<\/span><\/strong> and it\u2019s untolled now, they didn\u2019t want to pay for it by leasing the Pennsylvania Turnpike, they didn\u2019t want to pay for it by raising the state gas tax. So, think it through folks, you don\u2019t want to pay for it by any of those methods \u2013 how do you want to pay for it? Now, in defense of the citizens, in the last decade and decade and a half, confidence in infrastructure spending has eroded because of the Bridges to Nowhere, because of the Big Digs \u2013 supposed to cost $1 billion, now what\u2019s the latest tab for the Big Dig, $14 billion? I mean, things like that, where the earmarks have made it so clear that a lot of transportation spending depends on the strength and political power of your local congressman or senator, not the worth of the project. So, there is some skepticism about infrastructure spending that didn\u2019t exist before and that\u2019s why proposals like from Sen. Dodd and Sen. Hagel to set up an infrastructure bank with a board of directors of experts and academics, and their the ones who make the decisions on what gets spent based on cost-benefit analysis, based on need \u2013 they\u2019re the ones that make the decisions, those are the good ideas to restore public credibility in infrastructure spending.<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

Part Four ~ Pennsylvania Governor Ed Rendell Interview: <\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

The <\/span><\/em><\/strong>Pennsylvania<\/span><\/em><\/strong> example<\/span><\/em><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

Ray Suarez:<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

Let\u2019s talk a little bit about the economic side of some of these ideas. Like making I-80 a toll road, like leasing the Turnpike. It takes away some of what people value about it \u2013 that it\u2019s ours, that our money built it in the case of leasing the Turnpike, making I-80 a toll road is to take a free-flowing artery, or ideally free flowing artery, and put stop signs up on it\u2026<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

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Gov. Rendell:<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

Well, let\u2019s take I-80 first. We built it with public money, no question about it, but we haven\u2019t been able to maintain it or repair it with public money. And, now the Highway Trust Fund in <\/span><\/strong>Washington<\/span><\/strong> is broke \u2013 it\u2019s anywhere from $4 billion to $8 billion in debt and there is no public money to maintain it. People don\u2019t want to ride on an unsafe I-80 or an I-80 with gaping pot holes, you can bet on that. They expect us to maintain it. Well, maintaining it costs money. <\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

We\u2019re a cold weather state that has hot weather in the summer, there\u2019re contractions and expansions, we get tons of pot holes, we have to do constant repairs \u2013 people don\u2019t do it for free. The asphalt people don\u2019t give us the asphalt for free, so somebody has to pay for it. And, people don\u2019t want to see an increase in the state gas tax and neither do I, not at a time when fuel prices are so high. <\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

So, tolling is a user fee. And I give the Turnpike Authority some credit, when they and I haven\u2019t seen eye to eye on everything recently, but they\u2019ve developed a great plan where the average Pennsylvania citizen who\u2019s driving on I-80 to see his sister, they won\u2019t get tolled at all. Because they\u2019re going to have these <\/span><\/strong>Easy<\/span><\/strong> <\/span><\/strong>Pass<\/span><\/strong> pass-throughs, no toll booths, if you don\u2019t have <\/span><\/strong>Easy<\/span><\/strong> <\/span><\/strong>Pass<\/span><\/strong>, then they\u2019re going to take a picture of your license plate and they\u2019re going to bill you later. And, the toll areas are going to be stretched out, so that there\u2019s going to be about 50-60 miles in-between for the short hops made by Pennsylvania citizens. Now a lot of this freight will be paid for by people who use I-80 as a way to get through the state without using the Turnpike. So, I give them some credit for that. <\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

In terms of leasing the Turnpike, people react emotionally \u2013 they can\u2019t concentrate on the difference between lease and sale. People say, \u201cWell, I don\u2019t want to sell an asset, I don\u2019t want to give away an asset,\u201d and I said we\u2019re not selling it, we\u2019re not giving it away. We\u2019re maintaining control over when tolls can be raised, we\u2019re maintaining control when repairs have to happen \u2013 all the important things \u2013 we the state are going to maintain control. I give them the example, if you sell your house and the buyers decide after they move in to paint your beloved house fuchsia, you can\u2019t stop them. But, if you lease your house to them \u2013 even if it is a twenty year lease \u2013 they want to try to paint the house fuchsia, they need your permission to do so. It\u2019s the difference between a sale and a lease. But people react very emotionally. But, again, the recent poll showed people don\u2019t want to toll I-80 to pay for transportation repairs, they don\u2019t want to lease the Turnpike, they don\u2019t want to pay more gas tax\u2026 Well, what to they want to do?<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

Ray Suarez:<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

Can you point to places in the country where that approach has worked? I know a Spanish company controls the Chicago Skyway between <\/span><\/strong>Indiana<\/span><\/strong> and <\/span><\/strong>South Chicago<\/span><\/strong>\u2026<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

Mayor Daley tells me it has worked. Mayor Daley tells me it has pumped additional money into the <\/span><\/strong>Chicago<\/span><\/strong> transportation infrastructure and the road is running about the same as in other places. Governor Daniels in Indiana, a conservative republican, did the same thing I think when an Australian company won the right on one of their toll roads\u2026 The Australian company put in capital repairs on the road that were 2.5 times what the state was requiring them to do because they wanted the road to be attractive to attract more customers. So, on the Turnpike, the leading bidder here was a combination of a Spanish and CitiBank, the oldest bank in <\/span><\/strong>America<\/span><\/strong>, they had a combined bid. And people said, \u201cWell, we don\u2019t want a Spanish company running our Turnpike,\u201d and I said do you ever go to Disney World? \u201cYeah, sure, I take my kids or my grandkids there all the time.\u201d I said do you fly into <\/span><\/strong>Orlando<\/span><\/strong>? \u201cOh, yeah, sure, all the time.\u201d I said you got to stop flying in because the same Spanish company that wants to lease the Pennsylvania Turnpike, operates the <\/span><\/strong>Orlando<\/span><\/strong> airport, and they do a very good job. <\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

Ray Suarez:<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

But if the numbers work for a private company to do these things, how come they don\u2019t work for government to do them?<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

Gov. Rendell:<\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n

Because a lot of the private investors get tax benefits from investing in long term assets. When a government does a project we don\u2019t get the tax benefits. They are willing to invest, hypothetically, $120 million when the government might be only willing to invest $100 million because they get tax benefits from that. Number one. And number two, private business doesn\u2019t have all of the restrictions \u2013 they\u2019ll run a leaner and tighter ship most often than government authorities will, most often, there are some exceptions to that. <\/span><\/strong><\/p>\n

<\/strong><\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"

Gov. Ed Rendell (D., PA) is an advocate for reforming infrastructure policy and practice in both his state and throughout the rest of America. He co-chairs Building America\u2019s Future, a bipartisan effort to change the way infrastructure is discussed in American politics, with Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger (R., CA) and Mayor Mike Bloomberg (I., NYC). In […]<\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":46,"featured_media":0,"comment_status":"open","ping_status":"open","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"footnotes":""},"categories":[3543,1028,2392,3757,1452,4281,69,71,7085],"tags":[5509,1576],"class_list":["post-77","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","hentry","category-america-in-gridlock","category-blogs","category-bridges-roads","category-economy-by-topic-reports","category-northeast","category-the-dig","category-video","category-web-exclusives","category-web-only-features","tag-gov-ed-rendell","tag-pennsylvania"],"yoast_head":"\nAmerica in Gridlock ~ [VIDEO] Ed Rendell: The Infrastructure Governor | Blueprint America | PBS<\/title>\n<meta name=\"robots\" content=\"index, follow, max-snippet:-1, max-image-preview:large, max-video-preview:-1\" \/>\n<link rel=\"canonical\" href=\"https:\/\/www.pbs.org\/wnet\/blueprintamerica\/video\/america-in-gridlock-web-exclusive-pennsylvania-governor-ed-rendell-interview\/77\/\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:locale\" content=\"en_US\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:type\" content=\"article\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:title\" content=\"America in Gridlock ~ [VIDEO] Ed Rendell: The Infrastructure Governor | Blueprint America | PBS\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:description\" content=\"Gov. Ed Rendell (D., PA) is an advocate for reforming infrastructure policy and practice in both his state and throughout the rest of America. He co-chairs Building America\u2019s Future, a bipartisan effort to change the way infrastructure is discussed in American politics, with Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger (R., CA) and Mayor Mike Bloomberg (I., NYC). 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