Chris Sununu

A make-or-break moment for Nikki Haley in New Hampshire…..this week on Firing LIne

 

Trump:…Iowa, thank you. We love you all. [applause]

 

After Donald Trump’s decisive win in the Iowa caucuses all eyes are on the Granite State, the first-in-the nation primary with a history of notable upsets. 

 

Bill Clinton: New Hampshire tonight has made Bill Clinton the comeback kid [cheers]

 

Former South Carolina Governor Nikki Haley is in a head-to-head race with the former president. Haley performs well with moderates and independents who can vote in New Hampshire’s GOP primary. 

 

Sununu: …the next President of the United States, Nikki Haley! 

 

Gov. Chris Sununu, the popular Republican governor of this swing state, is her biggest and most important supporter…

 

SUNUNU: She’s a winner, and she can get more winners and build more winners. Trump is a loser.

 

With the battle lines drawn…

 

Trump: Nikki Haley is a disaster…

 

Haley: Chaos follows him. 

 

…and as voters prepare to cast their first primary ballots in the 2024 presidential election, what does New Hampshire Gov. Chris Sununu say now?

 

‘Firing Line’ with Margaret Hoover is made possible in part by: Stephens Inc., Vanessa and Henry Cornell, The Fairweather Foundation, The Tepper Foundation, The Asness Family Foundation, The Beth and Ravenel Curry Foundation, Kathleen and Andrew McKenna through The McKenna Family Foundation, Pfizer Inc., Charles R. Schwab, The Rosalind P. Walter Foundation, Damon Button, Craig Newmark Philanthropies, Roger and Susan Hertog, Cheryl Cohen Effron and Blair Effron, Al and Kathy Hubbard.

 

INTERVIEW

HOOVER: Governor Chris Sununu, welcome to Firing Line. 

SUNUNU: This is great. I’m very excited. Thanks for having me on. 

HOOVER: After this week’s decisive win by Donald Trump in Iowa, all eyes are on your state of New Hampshire– 

SUNUNU: Sure.

HOOVER: –where you have endorsed Governor Nikki Haley. What are the stakes of New Hampshire? 

SUNUNU: Well, the stakes are very high for Donald Trump because in the first three states of Iowa, New Hampshire, South Carolina, it’s all been said. And he has said he’s going to win them– he’s going to win hands down and run away with it. He did well in Iowa, as was expected. But Nikki did well. No one expected Nikki to have such a strong finish. She went from 2% to 20%. Almost beat DeSantis first for second place when DeSantis had put every dollar, every person, everything he had into Iowa. In New Hampshire right now, we effectively have a one on one race, right? It is Haley versus Trump. And that’s an amazing opportunity. I always wanted to get it to Haley versus Trump by Super Tuesday. But now we have Haley versus Trump. The glide path really is designed for Nikki because she goes from here, she’s going to do very, very well. She’s definitely going to end up in second place, may even, may even beat Trump, which would be an absolute shocker. But that actually could happen. And then she goes to South Carolina. A state she has won multiple times. And when it’s just a one-on-one race, you’re not asking the voter to sift out ten different candidates like we did back in 2016. It’s one on one. It’s a clear choice. And in South Carolina, they know the alternative. And it looks really good for Nikki Haley. 

HOOVER: It sounded to me just now like you were lowering expectations in terms of what we should expect in terms of her finish here, that a second place finish would be a win. 

SUNUNU: Oh sure

HOOVER: Isn’t a win a win if it’s a two person race? 

SUNUNU: Uh, no one’s ever expected Nikki Haley to win any of these early states. I mean, no polls have said she’s going to win. No one has ever– She– Her team has never said, we’ve never said she’s definitely going to win New Hampshire and South Carolina. 

HOOVER: So you think a second place finish is a win for her? 

SUNUNU: Of course. Yeah. Because again, Why? Because there were 14 candidates in this race, for me, it’s always been about getting through the first three states with a one on one. It’s happening sooner than later. So if anything, this just–

HOOVER: You’re saying the win is that she’s winnowed  the field.

SUNUNU: Yeah, that’s a huge win. That’s exactly what America was asking. 

HOOVER: So Ron DeSantis is a non-factor is what you’re saying?

SUNUNU: Complete. Yeah. 

HOOVER: Okay. Unaffiliated voters are 40% of the voters in New Hampshire. About 30% are Republicans, 30% are Democrats. 

SUNUNU: Yeah. 

HOOVER: How does this impact Nikki Haley’s chances? 

SUNUNU: The more voters, whether they’re Republican or undeclared, the more voters that turn out, the more it doesn’t favor the incumbent, which is Donald Trump. He’s effectively the incumbent. Right. So the higher voter turnout we can get, the better chance we have of– those are the voters that are new voters that are more likely to be no voters. They say, we want change. We want something different. We’re not going with old school, with yesterday’s news. And New Hampshire has a tradition of doing that, of saying, give us the next generation of leadership, not the same old thing. And that’s what Trump is, kind of the same old thing. 

HOOVER: Compared to 2016, Iowa had low turnout, even more than the weather could account for. 

SUNUNU: Oh, yeah. Sure. 

HOOVER: Does that give you pause about the degree of enthusiasm this time around? 

SUNUNU: Absolutely. When you ask those Trump voters, or a lot of voters, you know, ‘who are you going to vote for?’ ‘Well, I guess Trump’s just going to win anyway.’ And there’s folks that say, ‘well, I don’t like Trump, but he’s going to win anyway. I won’t go vote.’ So you had that same– you had a lot of that apathy over and above the cold weather issue in Iowa. Very concerned about it here. And that’s why when you do the retail campaigning, right– Uh, Nikki was in Littleton. She’s in Whitefield. She’s in the north part of the state. And that actually helps galvanize a new turn-out-the-vote opportunity there.

HOOVER: Demographically, polls suggest that Nikki should do better in New Hampshire than in Iowa because, well, for one thing – 

SUNUNU: And she will – 

HOOVER: It’s a higher income state, higher educated state. These are groups she performs well with. What is the message that Haley should use to New Hampshire’s Trump-Sununu voters, the non-college-educated, blue collar, you know, voters who vote for Trump– 

SUNUNU: Well, I would say this. I mean, going after a Trump voter is great because that’s effectively two votes. You’re taking one from him and you’re adding one to yourself. And because when it’s a binary race, that’s the real opportunity that you have there. Um, the discussion is this is not, and don’t assume that Trump is going to run away with this. Right. Those are the voters most likely to move because they haven’t really looked at a lot of policy. They just said, well, I guess he’s going to win. But when they, again, shatter that presumption, kind of show that this really is a horse race at this point, people go, ‘Oh wait.’ And they take the last week, they come to the town halls, they engage with her on her retail stops. That’s the opportunity to bring those Trump voters across. That hardcore 35% that are absolute zealots, almost like a cult or something or other, I mean, they’re not moving. They are not moving. At the end of the day, though, the ones that, again, are just kind of in it. Well, because, well, I guess he’s going to win. Those are the ones you want to engage a little more here in New Hampshire. 

HOOVER: So do you think that 30% of the Republican Party is like a cult? 

SUNUNU: No, no. Look, there are about 30, 35% of the Trump voter that is just not going to be moved. 

HOOVER: Yeah. 

SUNUNU: You know, they’re just not going to be moving very, very little that you can say to them to get them off the bandwagon. 

HOOVER: How much does New Hampshire like an upset? I mean, how much does the history of the New Hampshire primary that delivered Bill Clinton, the ‘comeback kid’, that made John McCain relevant in 2000 again, how much– 

SUNUNU: HW Bush, right, back in ‘88? McCain. You know, McCain had a huge upset win.

HOOVER: How much is that baked in the DNA of New Hampshire primary voters? 

SUNUNU: We like that. We like the underdog. We like people– We like candidates that are scrappy and honest and just connect with us, you know, at a very real level. Don’t stand on a stage and just tell us what we want to hear, get in your fancy plane and go back to the country club. That’s kind of the Trump thing right now.

STRATEGIES FOR TAKING ON TRUMP

HOOVER: In the campaign so far we’ve seen various approaches to Donald Trump. You’ve seen Vivek Ramaswamy flatter him endlessly. You saw Chris Christie here in New Hampshire aggressively go after his lawlessness, and–. 

SUNUNU: Chris took the nuclear option on Trump. Not that he was wrong, but it was, man, it was, it was tough. 

HOOVER: What is the best way to run in New Hampshire if you’re going to– What is the best way for a Republican to challenge Donald Trump in New Hampshire? 

SUNUNU: I think I honestly believe the way Nikki is doing it is the best way. 

HOOVER: It seems like she’s taking the Goldilocks approach, right? She’s contrasting herself with policy. She’s not going after the– she’s not taking the nuclear option. 

SUNUNU: Well, she took– look she called him out on January 6th. She called him on election denial. She’s called him on his failed policies. 

HOOVER: She did go back on the January 6th piece, though

SUNUNU: Well, in the last debate, again, she called him out on it. So, again, she’s spending the time about what she’s going to deliver. For a New Hampshire voter, that’s important. We have a lot of voter engagement here.

HOOVER: Trump’s approach to Nikki Haley is to demean her, call her bird brain-  

SUNUNU: Well, he does that to everybody –  

HOOVER: He does it to everybody. But there’s a special, there’s a special flavor, though with Nikki. It’s “bird brain.” It’s that she’s not tough enough. It feels sexist. Do you think it’s sexist? 

SUNUNU: Um. Uh. I would say he has a history of that, so it shouldn’t surprise anybody. Right? Obviously he has a history of demeaning women. 

HOOVER: Yeah. 

SUNUNU: And so it wouldn’t surprise anyone. I’m not going to answer that. I would say Nikki’s the only one that can–. 

HOOVER: Do you think it is sexist? 

SUNUNU: I think he has a history of making sexist remarks. I’ll let Nikki answer that. But yeah, it’s demeaning.

HOOVER: Tell me something. On the campaign trail here with your electorate, do policy arguments against Trump matter? You all have constantly pointed out that he promised a border wall and he didn’t deliver it. He promised to revive the manufacturing sector, and it shrunk on his watch. He promised to eliminate the federal debt, and it grew by 7 trillion, almost more dollars on his watch. Do New Hampshire Republicans consider these broken promises? 

SUNUNU: They do. They do, more than anywhere else. I mean, to be sure, because again, we get into a lot of the nitty gritty details. So again, I can’t speak to other states, but it definitely matters here. You got to know your stuff. 

HOOVER: You’ve said in the past that you aren’t supporting Donald Trump, you’re supporting Nikki Haley because of the electability argument. That – 

SUNUNU: That’s a piece of it. 

HOOVER: What’s the rest of the argument? 

SUNUNU: Well, so let’s talk about electability. Trump, Trump. When I talk about electability, it isn’t just Trump winning or losing. It’s how he affects the rest of the ticket. Right. So with Nikki Haley, we win Senate seats back. We win governorships. We win school board seats. We win all these seats that we have lost, that we should have won over the past six years. I’m so tired of losing with this guy. He’s a loser. So I want a winner. So electability isn’t just winning the seat. Trump could potentially maybe squeak out a win, but he’d have no ability to do anything he’s talking about, right? So what’s the point of– what’s the point there? Let’s look to someone that we know will win and carry all these other Republican initiatives along the way. That’s how you get stuff done. 

IMMIGRATION

HOOVER: Let’s compare a hypothetical President Haley versus President Trump. What would be the outcome of a President Nikki Haley on immigration and the border versus a second Trump presidency? 

SUNUNU: Well, she can actually build the wall and secure it. You have to secure the border. 

HOOVER: Why can she do it and Trump couldn’t? 

SUNUNU: Because she has a record– As a governor she has a record of knowing how to work with a legislature, even when they opposed her. As a governor, you have to do that. Trump– one of his ultimate flaws was that he thought you could run the government like a business. It sounds good, but it’s public money. There’s checks and balances. There’s a Congress and legislature. Even when he had Republicans in the House and Senate, he couldn’t get stuff done. And you think he’s going to– he’s not going to have, likely, the Senate back, right. So you think Democrats are going to work with them to do anything? God, no. And that’s why he said, ‘well, I’ll just be a dictator for a couple days,’ or whatever it is. Right? That kind of stuff gets a little scary because what he’s saying is, because I don’t know how to do it the right way, because I’m not strong enough to do it the right way, I’ll just try to bulldoze my way through. Nikki has a record of knowing how to work in the public sphere and get something done and negotiating this stuff out. That’s the key to all of it.

UKRAINE

HOOVER: As former U.N. Ambassador Nikki Haley says that continuing support for Ukraine is imperative. This puts her stance at odds with Donald Trump who refuses to commit to sending U.S. aid to Ukraine. How is the future of Ukraine under President Haley versus a President Trump? 

SUNUNU: Nikki Haley has a better understanding and expertise of international issues than all of these candidates, all the candidates put together. 

HOOVER: Even Donald Trump, who has been president? 

SUNUNU: Oh, absolutely. Trump showed up at the meetings doing, you know, taking the policies of Secretary State Mike Pompeo and U.N. Ambassador Nikki Haley. They’re the ones that understand these details. Trump calls Putin his friend. He doesn’t understand the nuances of the issues overseas. He negotiates overseas as if they’re Americans that he’s negotiating with. And it’s a very culturally different thing. So again, I think her experience there, her willingness to put America first and make sure that, as she did in the U.N., she took the kick me sign off our backs at the UN, made sure America was respected again. It’s a very important, um, attitude, philosophy and experience going into the international sphere that Trump cannot match. 

HOOVER: What is the economic outlook of the United States under President Haley versus a President Trump? 

SUNUNU: Balanced. Stable. I mean, inflation is driven by one thing. Inflation is the biggest crusher, right, on low income and middle income families in America. When you balance a budget at the state level and force a balanced budget at the federal level, all the opportunity now flows forward. You’ve got to make tough decisions, to be sure, but that gets your house in order. When you have to borrow or print money, that’s the only thing that creates inflation in America. That’s the only thing, borrowing and printing money. Trump was horrible at it. And so for all those conservatives who are tired of the federal government mistreating and disrespecting their hard earned dollars, that is exactly why you should not be voting for Donald Trump. You want an accountant. I mean an accountant in the White House like Nikki Haley. What an amazing opportunity. She brings that stability back to the table. That’s an amazing opportunity that we just haven’t had in decades. 

HOOVER: [16:24:19] What does the future of the Republican Party look like after a president Haley is elected– 

SUNUNU: After next week? Who knows? [laugh]

HOOVER: So you think the future of the Republican Party actually does hinge on New Hampshire. 

SUNUNU: Look, from New Hampshire could create an opportunity to get Nikki elected in South Carolina and then Super Tuesday, and that would be amazing–. 

HOOVER: So what does the future of the Republican Party look like if Nikki Haley is the nominee and then becomes the president, versus the future of the party if Donald Trump is reelected? 

SUNUNU: Well look, Nikki brings a lot of– she allows everyone to come together as a strong conservative. She’s somebody that everybody can galvanize around. We haven’t had that in so long. Right. The same can be said for the Democrats, though. Understand, Democrats are in their own turmoil. Now, they have the presidency, and they’re not in a big election battle right now. So they’re able to kind of avoid a lot of their internal strife. But believe you me, there’s massive internal strife there too. So, you know, I try not to say, well, I think five years, this is where the party is going to be. Nobody really knows. I think what’s going to happen is this. Trump is at the center of the chaos and the disruption. There’s no question about that. 

HOOVER: That’s putting it lightly, isn’t it? 

SUNUNU: Well, but he is. It is putting it lightly, but he absolutely is. Over time– well let me put it this way. I think this is an important point. A former president once said to me, we’ve gone through a lot in this country. We went through a civil war that almost tore apart, but our institution stood strong. We went through a world war, a couple of them. We went through, you know, the 60s where we had great American voices and leaders literally getting assassinated in front of us. And people said, it’s all over for America. 9/11, a pandemic. Our institutions stood strong. Bad leaders come and go. But the institutions here are strong. So this is– I think we’re, there’s a lot of polarization and firebranding right now. I think as those folks kind of aren’t part of the system anymore, eventually, the temperature comes down a little. And then, slowly, both of the parties– there are always going to be a spectrum within those parties, but less of the polarization within themselves. So it’s a domino chain reaction. It all starts with leadership. And again, Donald Trump is gasoline on the fire. Nikki Haley brings folks together with a record of experience. I want young people in this party. I want the suburban moms back. Right. I want a lot of folks who have walked away from this party to get back in. But right now, there’s a wall there. We’re not going to win unless we build the party bigger. And I’m tired of losing. People ask me, you know why I’m so passionate about Nikki Haley. She’s a winner, and she can get more winners and build more winners. That’s what this is all about. Trump is a loser. Look, we lost big in 2022. All of his candidates, all of his branding, all lost, all across the country, vehemently rejected. So I’m just tired of that level of losing. I want more Republicans to win. And I think more Republicans should want more Republicans to win. But it only happens if we say, ‘thank you for your service, Mr. Trump. We’re moving on to the future.’ 

HOOVER: So you won’t vote for Donald Trump? 

SUNUNU: Well, look, if he’s the nominee, if we have to go with our weakest candidate, of course I’m going to vote for the Republican, because that’s how bad Biden is. But yeah, this is– we’re talking primary here. And of course, you know.– 

HOOVER: Yeah. But, like, what about the consequences? I mean, you painted this picture of how damning he would be on foreign policy, how damning he would be on the border, and how damning he would be on fiscal policy again, how bad he would be for our economic outlook again. 

SUNUNU: But look at what Biden’s done. Look at how bad this administration is. Put it this way. Biden is so bad– like, Trump had no electability six months ago. Biden has become so bad that now he actually could squeak out a win. That’s how bad Joe Biden is, is that America would take all that chaos, potentially, over Joe Biden.

HOOVER: Look, on a policy from apples to apples, I can understand the argument you’re making on a policy front for Trump over Biden. The difference, as we all know, is that there’s never been a president in history who has tried to hold on to power and participated actively in a violent act at the Capitol to hold on to power, that peaceful transition of power which has been the bedrock of American institutions and our democracy. 

SUNUNU: Mm Hmm

HOOVER: So can you really consider this an apples-to-apples transaction when you consider the future of the country under a future Biden, a second Biden or a second Trump presidency? When one of them–

SUNUNU: Well, according to the polls, most Americans agree with me. 

HOOVER: Well, that’s not true. 

SUNUNU: I mean, according to the polls, Trump would beat Biden today by a point or two. So, this isn’t- 

HOOVER: That is correct – 

SUNUNU: This isn’t some obscure thought that the Republican governor is going to get behind the Republican nominee. I hope that doesn’t shock anybody – 

HOOVER: I know. But when you do look at the polls you also notice that Trump begins to lose under the hypothesis, or under the circumstance where there is a conviction of Donald Trump, 

SUNUNU: There’s not going to be, look –

HOOVER: And I know you don’t think there’s going to be a conviction – 

SUNUNU: That’s a way out there. If everyone’s waiting for a conviction and some external factor to stop Donald Trump, don’t. Go to the ballot box. You better participate in democracy. Democracy is what moves Donald Trump on. Democracy is what beats Donald Trump. But you got to go out if you’re in New Hampshire and South Carolina, you got to go vote. Don’t wait for somebody else to fix this problem that you foresee. Go participate. Go be the solution. That’s the democratic process. 

HOOVER: I fully endorse that approach. I think that is the healthy approach. I think you have to beat people at the ballot box. Why, though, when people go into the ballot box– because you have said in New Hampshire, the court cases are not weighing on people’s– 

SUNUNU: Anywhere in America they aren’t. 

HOOVER: Okay. So explain to me, explain that to me, why, for example, in one court case, a jury of Trump’s peers found him liable for sexual abuse and defamation in a civil case for an incident that the judge called rape. 

SUNUNU: Mm hmm.

HOOVER: Why do you think that doesn’t resonate with voters? 

SUNUNU: So there’s a couple things going on. You have multiple court– This is why it doesn’t resonate. You have multiple cases. Some are civil. Some are federal. Some are state. Some over elections. Some over the sexual abuse and all this kind of stuff. Some are legitimate. Some people think they are politically driven, and I would agree with that. I think there’s some of these– but it’s all convoluted. You get a different story about a different court case every day–

HOOVER: You’re saying if there were one case it would be fine, but 91 felonies is too confusing to follow?

SUNUNU: It’s all become white noise, unfortunately. The average person out there is just trying to figure out how to pay for their next meal at McDonald’s because of inflation. The average person out there today in New Hampshire, it’s 14 degrees. They just got a bill for 750 bucks to fill their fuel tank, and they’re figuring out how to pay for it. They understand there’s a lot of this chaos out there with Trump and all this other stuff. But don’t fool yourself. Most American voters are not following the details. They’re not following the bouncing ball, knowing that this is going to go on for years, so it won’t enter the calculus when they come to the ballot box. 

HOOVER: So, as you say, people are thinking about what the best choice for them is, are you really such a partisan that you think that you would vote for Donald Trump, that that would be the best choice for the country if he were the nominee? 

SUNUNU: Well I– such a partisan? I don’t– That’s, that’s labeling right there. Are we othering? Are we othering now? 

HOOVER: No, no. Because you say you’re a republican so you’re only going to vote for the Republican even if he has done all these things–

SUNUNU: It’s a binary choice. If you don’t vote for one, it’s essentially a vote for the other. And there’s I mean, what Biden has done to this country, the lack of management, the massive amounts of this wokeism, this socialism, yes, I would vote for the Republican. This is my other hope, it’s not just the president, it’s who he surrounds– my hope is that he would bring in a better team. Biden’s cabinet is awful, I mean, awful. Trump at least has the ability to put a good team in place. 

HOOVER: Does he? 

SUNUNU: Sure. He has the opportunity to do it. Yeah. Yeah. 

HOOVER: If it’s Governor Haley versus Biden in New Hampshire who wins? 

SUNUNU: Oh, Haley would crush him.

HOOVER: If it’s Trump v. Biden who wins?

SUNUNU: In New Hampshire? 

HOOVER: Yeah. 

SUNUNU: Oh, Biden. Yeah. Biden would beat him again. 

HOOVER: You say that Biden would be worse than Trump. 

SUNUNU: Oh, without a doubt.

HOOVER: But how do you then really grapple with the things Donald Trump is saying he will do when he’s president? He says he’ll use the Justice Department to target his critics. He says that he will terminate the Constitution and use the military for domestic law enforcement. I mean, he’s saying things that are outrageous. And he’s said them before. But you know what? He’s also more organized this time. 

SUNUNU: He is.

HOOVER: And he has very effective people around him. Does that give you pause? 

SUNUNU: No. I mean, campaign rhetoric, extremism. Nothing new. I mean, that’s what Trump has done forever, right? Trump has said outrageous things since well before he was president. He’s never slowed down. 

HOOVER: But he’s been able to mobilize violence now, which we’ve seen since then. And does that give you pause? 

SUNUNU: In terms of? 

HOOVER: Well, after January 6th.

SUNUNU: You’re talking about January 6th. Um, of course it gives me pause. There’s no question. It should give everybody pause. Nobody likes to hear that kind of stuff, especially out of someone who could be the leader of the free world. But I believe he could potentially put a much better team together to manage the individual aspects of government far and away better than Joe Biden. There’s no question about that. And most Americans would agree with me. 

HOOVER: I’m just going to say, it feels like fantasy thinking, but I’m going to move on. 

SUNUNU: What fantasy thinking, what? That he would put a good team together? 

HOOVER: That would put a great team together. That we have any reason to believe–

SUNUNU: Better than Biden. Biden’s is that bad.

HOOVER: To your point about the strength of institutions. I mean, he wants to use the Justice Department to target his enemies. 

SUNUNU: There’s, look, I don’t want to get into the– There are arguments to be made that the Democrats have done just that. 

HOOVER: But no Democrats have marshaled violence against the Capitol to hold onto power.

SUNUNU:  Look, January 6th was awful, right? It was absolutely awful. But to say, well, just because of January 6th, he’s not going to get elected? No. 

HOOVER: No.  I’m not saying just because of January 6 he won’t get elected. I think he very well could get elected. But should he? That’s what I’m asking.

SUNUNU: If the people vote for him. Yes. Right? Because it’s not up to you. It’s not up to me. It’s only about the voters. And the voters have the say–

HOOVER: Isn’t there a degree of leadership here? You’re the governor of a state–

SUNUNU: Yes. Because the voters decide–

HOOVER: You have a responsibility to say what should happen. I mean, you know, you’re taking a stake for Nikki Haley– 

SUNUNU: No, I have to be honest. That’s a really dangerous premise that you’re putting out there. 

HOOVER: That leaders should stand up for?–

SUNUNU: That because I’m a governor, I should say what should happen?

HOOVER: Or you– Then you can say what you would do– 

SUNUNU: The voters decide what should happen. 

HOOVER: Absolutely. No question. 

SUNUNU: It’s all about the voters. 

HOOVER: But you would still vote for Trump, under that circumstance?

SUNUNU: I would. Yeah. Yeah. 

HOOVER: I want to move, but I just, I think the point is, it’s hard to believe that you, Chris Sununu, who recognizes how severe January 6th was, would still vote for Donald Trump. 

SUNUNU: I’ve been very consistent on supporting the Republicans – 

HOOVER: I know you have. But it’s– I know, because you’re a good partisan. 

SUNUNU: I’m not a Democrat. I’m not an Independent. 

HOOVER: So there’s no Republican you wouldn’t vote for, even a convicted criminal. 

SUNUNU: He’s not going to be convicted. Again, that’s you’re throwing the hypothetical out there. But–

HOOVER: Well you don’t know that. We don’t know that. I mean, we can guess that, but we don’t know that for sure. 

SUNUNU: Yeah, I know. You’re asking me hypotheticals. I’m going to go on what this– what it is today.

HOOVER: OK. Let’s move on. Your dad, John Sununu, after being governor of New Hampshire, having the same job you have now, went on to be chief of staff for George H.W. Bush. 

SUNUNU Yeah. Great president. 

HOOVER: George H.W. Bush appeared on Firing Line when he was chair of the RNC. And he was discussing how Republican candidates should handle President Nixon in the wake of Watergate. See what he said then. 

 

BUCKLEY: As head of the Republican Party, is it uncomfortable for you to cooperate with people running for Congress on an “I have nothing to do with Nixon” ticket? 

 

BUSH: I think we’ve got room in our party for diversity. It’s not uncomfortable for me to cooperate with them. And my advice to them, and very few people seek it these days, but if they do, I’ll say, “Look, emphasize the good things that the Administration has done and jump up and down and say you don’t like Watergate,.” Be against the bad things, be for the good things.

HOOVER: Very different approach to Nixon than I think is the approach to Trump. Trump has been endorsed by more than half of GOP members of Congress and several of your fellow governors. Is there room in the party for, like there was with Nixon, a diversity of viewpoints about Donald Trump? 

SUNUNU: Of course. Yeah, absolutely. You know, look as, as– 

HOOVER: What’s the evidence of that?

SUNUNU: Well, as the former president said, you know, there’s a lot of room in the party for a lot of different ideas. There’s no doubt about it. 

HOOVER: Look, you’re a successful Republican governor in what is essentially a blue state, purple state, 

HOOVER: Is there a model here for a national– a Republican who can win nationally. 

SUNUNU: Look, people want someone they connect with. They want someone who’s likable. They don’t need to buy off on every policy. They don’t need to agree with you on every policy to be successful. They just want to know that you’re genuine, that you’re connecting with them. And at the end of the day, you have the ability to get stuff done and move the ball forward the way they want it moved forward. Yeah. 

HOOVER: Governor Sununu, thank you for being here.

SUNUNU: You bet. This was great. Thank you.