>> We know about solar energy

and wind energy, but one company

in California, CalWave, is

harnessing the renewable power

of ocean waves to produce both

electricity and fresh water.

As part of our ongoing series of

reports, "Peril & Promise: the

Challenge of Climate Change,"

CalWave co-founder

Marcus Lehmann joins me now via

Google Hangout.

Marcus, thanks for joining us.

First of all, explain what

CalWave does.

>> Yeah, thanks for having us.

And we're developing

a new technology that is similar

to the offshore windmill,

but uses the power of ocean

waves to generate electricity.

And as a second application,

we're looking into desalination

for freshwater production.

>> Well, harnessing the power of

a wave has been around for a

while, but how do you figure out

where to put this, and what kind

of an object is underwater

that creates this energy?

>> Yeah, so that's really our

big innovation, that we're able

to harness the power efficiently

so that's one criteria.

But at the same time, we can

also survive storms really well.

And that's what we found

were exactly the two features

that a windmill needs to survive

and operate and be commercially

competitive.

And, yeah, we've implemented

similar features into our

design.

>> One of the things that I've

seen is this idea of a wave

carpet.

Is that the core product?

>> So that was our

initial technology.

We started as a shallow-water

design, close to shore.

That's also based on the

research here conducted,

and then based on that initial

concept, we further developed it

as part of the

U.S. Wave Energy Prize.

So the Department of Energy

started a nationwide competition

similar to the XPRIZE, and,

yeah, we've been competing in

that for two years and advanced

quite well.

>> So, give me some idea of how

much energy you can generate

with this wave carpet

on a per-square-meter basis,

or how it compares to, say,

solar or wind on the land?

>> Yeah, so, we see that one of

the advantages of wave power is

actually that it's not competing

directly with solar and wind.

It's more complementing.

And I think in the future, we

need the mix of all renewables

available, and so wave power can

contribute with a resource that

is more predictable.

That means the utilities and the

consumers, they can plan better

ahead.

With solar and wind, it's very

volatile.

That means any other second, the

wind can change, and so we need

a lot of storage or a very fast

ramp-up of gas power to

complement that.

So that's the first one --

It's really the predictability.

The second one is the energy

density, as you mentioned.

So, on average, the climate

we're targeting at the moment

has 50 to 60 kilowatts per meter

of coastline in California and

Oregon, and other locations like

Hawaii.

And so that gives an advantage

that compared to a windmill

where we say a square meter of

wind has one kilowatt, yeah,

we require less land and hope in

the long run, actually, to also

become less carbon efficient,

or less carbon impactful,

because of the pure energy

density of waves.

>> And what about the fact that

so many populations live near

water?

And usually one of the big

challenges is getting the power

from the wind turbines to the

cities where people live.

>> Yes, so, we see the fact that

we are fully submerged allows us

to be closer to the load

centers, and we found in the

U.S., actually, half of the

population lives within 50 miles

of the coastline.

That means having a technology

that can be close to the big

load centers on the cities

like San Francisco or L.A.

and the other coastal cities

and the West Coast,

that gives you great advantage

because the cable costs

are going to be lower.

And also transmission lines

are not needed.

>> So, one of the concerns

people always have is what's the

impact on the ecosystem where

these things are placed?

Whether it's a wind turbine

and the birds that might be

affected or solar panels and

what happens to grazing lands?

What happens underwater if

you're putting out these

wave carpets or other devices?

>> Yeah, so, I would say our

structure and the structural

impact can be compared to other

existing offshore structures.

So, as you mentioned, windmills,

they have fast-moving blades,

and they're not used to it

because that normally doesn't

happen in nature.

So they can't see them.

They just fly through it and

think there's no obstacle.

In our case, we're moving with

the water particles, with the

wave motion.

So the mammals can actually see

it.

It's like a pier, you would say.

So they're able to notice it and

pretty much navigate around it.

>> But where are you in terms

of the competitive landscape?

Are there are lots of other

companies trying to harness

wave technology now?

>> Yes, it was actually quite

interesting.

It is an early-stage industry

compared to wind and solar, but

we're moving forward quite well

from the concept phase to a

demonstration phase.

So there are multiple test

sites.

The U.S. actually just awarded a

group in Oregon to implement

a 40 million test site that

is planned to go online in 2020,

exactly to facilitate

this demonstration phase.

And that's a very critical step

for us, because that's how

we can prove the cost

competitiveness of this

technology and how we can

operate it.

>> So, what's the best-case

scenario?

Let's say five years from now,

if we're having another

conversation like this, you're

standing in the gleaming

giant lobby of CalWave.

What do you hope happens,

and how do you see this

technology rolling out?

>> Yes, so, for us, the next

phase will be demonstrating

the technology before we really

provide it as a solution to the

market.

And an ideal scenario in 5 years

is that we can co-locate

offshore wind and offshore wave

sharing infrastructure, sharing

installation, reducing the costs

for both technologies.

And also kind of utilizing

the cable connection,

interconnection at its most

efficiency, and, yeah, I think

there are great challenges --

I mean, there are still

challenges ahead, but it's a

huge potential where multiple

offshore technologies can

collaborate.

>> All right. Marcus Lehmann,

co-founder of CalWave.

Thanks for joining us.

>> Thank you so much.