>> Sreenivasan: CALIFORNIA FIRE

OFFICIALS ANNOUNCED THAT THE

MASSIVE CARR FIRE, WHICH BURNED

FOR OVER A MONTH THIS SUMMER IN

AND AROUND THE CITY OF REDDING,

HAS BEEN FULLY CONTAINED.

THE FIRES, WHICH BEGAN IN LATE

JULY, CLAIMED EIGHT LIVES,

DESTROYED MORE THAN 1,000 HOMES,

AND COVERED OVER 229,000 ACRES.

MULTIPLE FIRES CONTINUE TO BURN

THROUGHOUT THE WESTERN U.S., AND

WILDFIRE SEASONS ARE EXPECTED TO

LAST LONGER AND BURN HOTTER.

FLAMES ARE NOT THE ONLY DANGER

FROM FIRES.

SMOKE CAN DRIFT FOR HUNDREDS OF

MILES.

THE SMOKE FROM THIS YEARS

WESTERN WILDFIRES HAS BEEN

OBSERVED ALL THE WAY IN NEW

HAMPSHIRE, SWEPT TOWARD THE EAST

BY THE JET STREAM.

A NEW REPORT BY NON-PROFIT

SCIENCE AND NEWS ORGANIZATION,

CLIMATE CENTRAL, SHOWS THAT IN

PARTS OF CALIFORNIA, AS WELL AS

IDAHO, OREGON, AND WASHINGTON

STATE, PROGRESS IN REDUCING

TRADITIONAL AIR POLLUTION IS

BEING UNDERMINED BY WILDFIRES.

SENIOR SCIENCE WRITER JOHN UPTON

JOINED ME RECENTLY TO DISCUSS

THOSE IMPLICATIONS.

JOHN, WHEN WE THINK ABOUT PEOPLE

AFFECTED BY FOREST FIRES, WE'RE

USUALLY THINKING ABOUT THOSE

PEOPLE WHO HAVE HOMES THAT ARE

TOO CLOSE TO THE FIRES.

THEY EVACUATE.

THEY GET OUT OF HARM'S WAY.

BUT YOUR REPORT REALLY STARTS TO

LOOK AT A GROUP OF PEOPLE THAT

CAN'T GET OUT OF HARM'S WAY, NOT

FROM THE FIRE, BUT FROM THE

SMOKE.

EXPLAIN.

>> WELL, THE SMOKE ACTUALLY,

FROM WILDFIRES, IS BECOMING A

HUGE PUBLIC HEALTH ISSUE ACROSS

THE WEST.

IT'S ACTUALLY BLOWING ALL THE

WAY TO THE EAST COAST.

IT'S RECENTLY BEEN REACHING NEW

YORK, LOUISIANA, MAINE.

SO THE SMOKE FROM THE WILDFIRES

IS AFFECTING A LARGE NUMBER OF

PEOPLE, BUT IT BECOMES SO THICK

IN SOME PLACES, IT'S JUST SUCH A

DEFINING TRAIT OF THE

ATMOSPHERE, OF THE WEATHER IN

THE WEST RIGHT NOW, THAT IT IS

INESCAPABLE.

SOME PEOPLE ARE MORE VULNERABLE

THAN OTHERS.

THOSE WHO LIVE AT THE EDGES OF

FORESTS THAT ARE BURNING, THEY

OBVIOUSLY GET HIT WITH VERY

INTENSE SMOKE WAVES, WITH VERY

SEVERE HEALTH CONSEQUENCES.

BUT THERE ARE ALSO PEOPLE WHO

ARE LIVING IN AREAS THAT ARE

ALREADY POLLUTED, WHO ARE

ALREADY FEELING UNWELL, WHO HAVE

CONDITIONS SUCH AS ASTHMA,

EMPHYSEMA, THAT ARE LINKED TO

BREATHING AIR POLLUTION.

THIS IS CERTAINLY THE CASE IN

CALIFORNIA'S CENTRAL VALLEY,

WHICH WE THINK OF AS A FARMING

REGION THAT PRODUCES A LOT OF

OUR PRODUCE.

BUT THAT'S A REAL BOWL, WITH THE

MOUNTAINS AROUND IT AND THE AIR

POLLUTION FROM THE FARMS AND THE

TRUCKS THERE, IT GETS STUCK IN

THE VALLEY.

AND THEY'VE BEEN MAKING GREAT

STRIDES IN CLEANING THE AIR

THERE IN RECENT YEARS AND

DECADES, THROUGH ENVIRONMENTAL

REGULATIONS, TECHNOLOGY

IMPROVEMENTS, BUT NOW WHAT'S

HAPPENING IS THESE FIRES ARE

BURNING ALL AROUND CALIFORNIA

AND THE WEST.

THE SMOKE ENDS UP POURING INTO

THE VALLEY AND HAS NOWHERE TO

GO, AND THE PEOPLE WHO ARE

BREATHING THAT SMOKE NOW ARE THE

PEOPLE WHO ARE ALREADY THE MOST

AFFECTED BY AIR POLLUTION.

>> Sreenivasan: SO GIVE ME AN

EXAMPLE OF SOMEBODY WHO'S OUT

THERE, LITERALLY IN THE FIELDS

ALL DAY, WORKING, PICKING OUR

PRODUCE.

WHAT ARE THEY BREATHING IN NOW

AS THIS FIRE SEASON EXTENDS?

>> WHAT THE BIGGEST CONCERN IS,

IS THESE TINY PARTICLES IN THE

SMOKE.

WHEN THE WOOD BURNS, WHEN

MATERIAL BURNS, IT PRODUCES

THESE TINY PARTICLES CALLED

PARTICULATE MATTER.

THESE PARTICLES GET INTO OUR

LUNGS, THEY TRIGGER ASTHMA AND

OTHER CONDITIONS, BUT THEY'RE SO

SMALL, THEY ACTUALLY PASS

THROUGH INTO OUR BLOODSTREAMS

AND THEN THEY TRAVEL THROUGH OUR

BLOODSTREAMS INTO OUR HEART AND

OUR BRAIN.

AND THEY EXACERBATE RISKS OF

EVERYTHING FROM HEART ATTACK,

STROKE, EVEN DIABETES AND

DEPRESSION.

>> Sreenivasan: YOU ALSO TOOK A

LOOK AT THE LARGER CONTEXT OF

HOW THIS IS HAPPENING.

YOU'RE SAYING THAT THE WORST AIR

QUALITY DAYS ARE ACTUALLY

HAPPENING WHEN THE FOREST FIRES

ARE GOING.

THAT SEEMS PRETTY LOGICAL.

BUT YOU'RE ALSO POINTING OUT

THAT THERE ARE MORE AND MORE

DAYS WHEN FOREST FIRES ARE

BURNING ALL OVER THE WEST.

>> CLIMATE CENTRAL'S RESEARCH

HAS LOOKED AT A NUMBER OF

DIFFERENT REGIONS IN THE WEST

AND COMPARED THE NUMBER OF

HEAVILY POLLUTED DAYS THAT ARE

OCCURING NOW TO ABOUT 20 YEARS

AGO.

WE'RE SEEING MORE AND MORE

UNHEALTHY DAYS OCCURRING DURING

WILDFIRE SEASON, AND THEN AT THE

SAME TIME WE'RE SEEING THE

WILDFIRE SEASON IS ACTUALLY

EXTENDING.

>> Sreenivasan: SO GIVE ME AN

EXAMPLE.

SOMEONE WORKING IN THE SAN

JOAQUIN VALLEY, LIVING IN THE

SAN JOAQUIN VALLEY, HOW LONG, OR

HOW MUCH LONGER, NOW, IS IT THAT

THEY'RE WALKING OUT INTO BAD

AIR?

>> IT CHANGES FROM YEAR TO YEAR,

AND IT'S AN AVERAGE-TYPE THING,

BUT CERTAINLY THE FIRE SEASON IS

100 DAYS LONGER THAN IT WAS IN

THE '70s.

SO YOU WOULD ANTICIPATE SMOKE

IMPACTS ALSO BEING EXTENDED

BY A SIMILAR AMOUNT.

>> Sreenivasan: LET'S ALSO TALK

A LITTLE BIT ABOUT WHY THAT'S

HAPPENING-- HOW MUCH DOES

CLIMATE CHANGE CONTRIBUTE TO

LONGER AND LONGER FOREST FIRE

SEASONS?

>> THERE'S THREE REASONS THAT

WE'VE BEEN SEEING REALLY

TERRIBLE FIRE SEASONS LATELY.

ONE IS BEYOND OUR CONTROL,

THAT'S THE WEATHER.

THE WEST HAS VERY VARIABLE

CLIMATE CONDITIONS.

IT WILL BE VERY DRY ONE YEAR,

VERY WET THE NEXT YEAR, OR EVEN

FROM ONE CENTURY TO THE NEXT.

BUT THERE'S TWO OTHER FACTORS

THAT ARE VERY MUCH UNDER OUR

CONTROL.

ONE OF THOSE FACTORS IS CLIMATE

CHANGE.

THE TEMPERATURES ARE INCREASING,

AND WHEN YOU GET WARMER

TEMPERATURES, THE MOISTURE GETS

SUCKED OUT OF THE LANDSCAPE SO

YOU HAVE DRYER CONDITIONS.

AND THE FIRES ARE GOING TO BURN

HOTTER.

THEY'RE GOING TO BURN OVER

LARGER AREAS.

THE THIRD THING THAT'S ALSO

UNDER OUR CONTROL IS FOREST

CONDITIONS, FOREST MANAGEMENT.

WE HAVEN'T BEEN SPENDING VERY

MUCH MONEY IGNITING AND MANAGING

FIRES ALONG THE FOREST FLOORS.

A LOT OF THESE WESTERN

LANDSCAPES, AND THOSE FIRES USED

TO OCCUR NATURALLY, OR UNDER THE

CONTROL OF TRIBES UP UNTIL, YOU

KNOW, A COUPLE OF HUNDRED YEARS

AGO, AND THEY WOULD REALLY

REMOVE A LOT OF THE FUEL FROM

THE FOREST FLOOR.

AND WHEN YOU HAVE THAT FUEL

BUILD UP, THAT ACTS AS A LADDER.

IT ACTUALLY LIFTS THE FLAMES

FROM THE FOREST FLOOR UP INTO

THE CANOPY, AND ITS ONCE THE

FLAMES GET INTO THE CANOPY,

THAT'S WHEN YOU HAVE PROBLEMS.

THAT'S WHEN YOU HAVE THESE BIG

WILDFIRES THAT KILL PEOPLE AND

DESTROY PROPERTY AND CAUSE ALL

THIS POLLUTION.

SO WE ARE INEVITABLY LOOKING AT

A FUTURE WITH MORE FIRES AND

MORE SMOKE.

THAT'S WHAT THE MODELING SHOWS

US.

WE'RE EXPECTING TO SEE CONTINUED

IMPROVEMENTS IN AIR QUALITY FROM

A CONTINUED SHIFT TO SOLAR POWER

AND SO FORTH, BUT AT THE SAME

TIME, WE ARE EXPECTING TO SEE

WORSE IMPACTS UNDERMINING THAT

PROGRESS FROM WILDFIRES.

>> Sreenivasan: CLIMATE CENTRAL

SENIOR SCIENCE WRITER JOHN

UPTON, THANKS FOR JOINING US.

>> THANKS, HARI.