I hope that true democracy will one day be practiced in China and not the false kind as it is in America.
The children in this 'experiment" actually practiced a bastardized, ersatz version of democracy, one where the cult of personality is most influential, where mere superficial formal procedures take precedence over inculcating real democratic sensibilities and petty minded squabbles are focused more than substantive matters just like the "democratic" processes you have in the US. The only difference is that these children are far less corrupt and human than their adult American counter-parts in the political game.
I stumbled upon this website today while searching my subject matter "middle school bribery for student council votes" a rather personal subject for this a.m. I will explain. My 6th grader, first year of middle school, called me at 7:20 this morning and said mom I forgot my speech on the table can you drive it to me, yes I said. Upon arrival at the school his eyes were slighly watery and his shoulders hung low, not like him. I asked what was wrong and he explained that the boy he was running against in class had handed out candybars this a.m. to the whole class so they would vote for him. We had just told him last week that this type of behavior is unacceptable when he asked us about it, he had heard in advance that this other child would be handing out the candybars. My son had inquired at the office if this was the right thing to do. The secretary replied well thats how politics works! I was angry and astounded at this answer to a first year middleschool student to get these warped believes in his head and to be crushed at his first taste of the american dream. Truly this adult does not belong working with children. I find that some of the staff in schools would curl up into a ball and die if they had to deal in the business world with adults. Instead they have a pulpit of children to preach to. I later called the principle and explained what occurred. I hope he speaks to his secretary number one and two has some boundaries set for these classroom elections. It really stinks when a child gives up feeling good about themselves and its only the 4th week of school. I told my son to put his shoulders back, take a deep breath, read his speech and the cards will fall where they may.
Great film! By the way, the 'adult' democratic politicians behave no differently than these cute, cherubic, bratty 8-year-old Chinese kids. They just wear suits to cover it up.
RE: "The abusor, as a monitor now, next time when he beat other kids, he should be punished by student trial with possible punishment like cleaning the classroom, cleaning the toilet and writing individual apology letters to each and every kids that he has beaten in the past.
if this is not done, he might possibly become abusive criminal in the future. It is not OK to abuse people, power and honor.
Posted by: Kunkun on January 21, 2009"
China does punish its most embarrassing government screw-ups by the not so democratic method of summary execution.
One needs to watch this fascinating film with some historical perspective. The kids' parents and the teacher were probably victims or perpetrators, or their children, of the cultural revolution, when far more humiliating things were done, including vicious and violent attacks AGAINST the teachers and parents. "PVFM" seems almost benevolent.
Also one might look at Hong Kong today, where "elected" candidates are successful if they shine the shoes of the Beijing powers that be, who pretty much hand-pick the SAR's chief executive. Hong Kong was promised universal suffrage -- eventually -- but when that might happen seems to be farther and farther into the future. A democratic China is far from imminent.
Finally, think about this film the next time you observe democracy in action at your own condo association board or small-time city council meeting. Some of the noisiest shouting matches you'll ever hear.
Wow The posts here are proof positive of the level of ignorance of your own existence. Please vote for Me mocks you from the start with its title and none of you got it. It is a propaganda film welcomed by our own government. Lets start from the beginning, The teacher could go to jail and never be heard of again if she tried this on her own. Therefore she had complicit instructions from the state on how to run the election. The purpose of the election was to make the children ( citizens ) think that they were responsible for choosing someone to control them. Yes control that s what the Monitor position was all about. The monitor takes a lot of the work load off of the teacher and at the same time relieves her from being seen as both disciplinarian AND state Mother/Father figure.
It is also in her best interest to see that whomever she picks ( remember geniuses that the Teacher got to pick/force the candidates for/onto the children some freedom of choice ) is going to serve her purposes as well. True democracy, not found in America either, would have the choice of having no Monitor to hassle you at all. Let s look at her ( the States) choices for candidates: A lovely young girl ill suited to the job ( there were plenty of bossy little girls in that class that could have done the job ) next we have a gregarious boy who if elected could do the job well enough but at his heart is more of a politician than an officer and last she of course picked the INCUMBENT Monitor a boy who has already proven to be ideal at the job. All of these choices were the Popular kids in the class. The teacher sees these students every day and knows everything. And if it was about democracy why didn t every kid get a chance. Or if it was just about a lesson or trying something new then why was the incumbent chosen. It was a popularity contest. Please vote for me means humans always vote for their own perceived self interest. And just like excuse me ,,,
And exactly like elections in America there were bribes, mudslinging, smear campaigns, henchmen, and meaningless speeches that never talked about what all of this was really about or for. The teacher did not have to allow the field trip offered by the Incumbent or any of the other gifts offered to the class. She in no way provided an even playing field. Money ( power ) won. And if any of the others won the class would still have imposed tyranny. And the teacher would have someone to do her dirty work. It s a film about democracy knuckle heads not about China. duh.
I find this film disturbing in a couple ways. One way is how poorly the women are treated in China. I did know that women were not valued as much as men in China; However, I had no idea it was that bad. The fact that Luo Lei was allowed to shove his mother out of the room while he practiced disturbed me.
Another disturbing fact was that Cheng Cheng had his father clean his bottom when he had finished his buisness on the toilet. Honestly, by the time you are eight years old you should at least be wiping your own bottom and cleaning your own messes.
But i also find this film very educational. For the people who posted before me that thought that it was terrible that these children had to live in a communist country and sing songs about communism, these children haven't known anything other than communism for their entire lives. As far as they know, communism is the only right way for a government to run. Besides, it's not like they are taught about what a democracy or a vote is, as you can see in the opening of the film. If the Chinese government did choose to teach their children about democracy, don't you think that there would be alot more riots and rebellions by the people that would prefer a democracy over communism? That's why the Chinese government has refused to let this film be broadcast in China.
As for the people that have a problem with the songs the chinese children sing about communism, what do you call the "Pledge of Allegiance" that I, as a middle school student, am told to sing each morning at school? Do we shun our government for telling America's youth that we need to memorize and sing a song about democracy each morning? No, because it is a custom that we are taught at an early age, just as it is in China when they sing their communist songs. And, just as America's youth (myself included) are taught that communism is bad, Chinese youth are probably taught that communism prevails over democracy, if they are even taught about democracy at all.
But when it comes down to it, I am pleased that my social studies teacher chose to share this documentary with my class.
At first I was upset that they put these little kids up to this kind of ordeal. My summation was "Lord of the Flies" with adults involved. But upon reflection, I thought that this kind of hazing is preparation for the real world and this is, after all, another culture that went through the Cultural Revolution, and all the other craziness of Chinese Communism. The American way of always telling kids they are are wonderful and protecting them from ugliness may be why the Chinese are eating our lunch now. I wondered about the boys' hair cuts. Is that some kind of Chinese thing or a western influence?
I would not have voted for Cheng Cheng as I find him naturally manipulative. Notice how he told his assistants to jeer the girl before and after her speeches. I would have voted for the girl, but sadly she would not provide enough order. Cheng Cheng had the power to use his voice to control the class, but Luo Lei had to use his hands. He never really "beats kids up." He is less abusive in my opinion than Cheng Cheng.
I remember I saw this film ages ago and I still remember it today. I logged on to find out about its next showing. I think this film is a great teaching piece. I am surprised about all the negative comments, and instead I think the film should be used to motivate Americans. It is a wake up call - the world is moving away from being centered around us. In fact it is travelling light years ahead of us , and before it is too late we need to seize our opportunity to at least catch up.
Absolutely compelling documentary. It is interesting to see how the Chinese children view democracy. Without having any true democratic institutions- Democracy is at its essence a popularity contest. The child who promises and buys off the most children unsurprisingly wins the election. (Look at your local and federal elections and tell me how they are different?)
The founding fathers had a similar view of a national democracy:
“. . . [D]emocracies have ever been spectacles of turbulence and contention; have ever been found incompatible with personal security or the rights of property; and have in general been as short in their lives as they have been violent in their deaths. Theoretic politicians, who have patronized this species of government, have erroneously supposed that by reducing mankind to a perfect equality in their political rights, they would at the same time be perfectly equalized and assimilated in their possessions, their opinions, and their passions.” - James Madison, The Federalist Papers
It is no accident that the United States is a representative republic, although most Americans are unaware of that. Inherent in our American belief of freedom is that the rights of the minority have to be preserved - in China, the minority, whether house Christians, or political dissidents are nothing more than pesky mosquitoes to be swatted by the elephant of the state.
America's democracy is deeply rooted in the belief that we are created by God with rights that He gave and that men take by nature try to take away. American democracy is a product both of the humanism of the Enlightenment and the mistrust of sinful man found in of 4000 years of Judeo-Christian thought.
The belief that democracy in itself is enough, is sorely lacking. A democracy where might makes right is China. A country where might is voluntarily limited by the belief in a higher power than man, has traditionally been a very American (and British) worldview.
One of the most prominent features of this little experiment in democracy was the absolutely ruthless nature of the two boy candidates. There was no moral law to curb their behavior, no appeal to a common courtesy based on religious belief. As America abandons her collective belief in a Creator and institutions like the church are marginalized where are we headed?
Alexis de Toqueville said it best in Democracy in America: “I sought for the key to the greatness and genius of America in her harbors…; in her fertile fields and boundless forests; in her rich mines and vast world commerce; in her public school system and institutions of learning. I sought for it in her democratic Congress and in her matchless Constitution. Not until I went into the churches of America and heard her pulpits flame with righteousness did I understand the secret of her genius and power.”“America is great because America is good, and if America ever ceases to be good, America will cease to be great.”
I saw this documentary last night and seriously ,it was astounding. When I was 8yrs old, I do not remember being this 'people' smart. These kids are groomed to get manipulative from a young age. I guess in a way, this is a lot better to show kids reality than coddling them with happy smiley and unreal themes from Disney and other fantasy shows.
About the election process, IMO the filmmaker was trying to show that while democracy in theory is a lofty concept, in practice, the democratic process is dependent on the people participating in it and in that respect, anything goes!
I was flabbergasted by the outcome of this and am left with many questions to ponder.
I'm deeply disturbed that some Chinese, particularly the children thought that this was representative of a quality election. The parents of those children, yes, even the little girl's mother are responsible for the nastiness that ensued. Instead of focusing on geniunely positive and uplifting means to garner votes, those parents taught their children to be vindictive, liars, and just plain putrid. AS a teacher and mother of 3 children, I believe firmly in uplifting children - not criticizing them, telling them what they're bad at and who they are not as good as, or letting them talk to their parents with such backtalk. I certainly would not condone or encourage my child to rip another person apart, esp with such lies. Open discussion should be fostered and thoughts exchanged between parents and children, but I was struck by the fact that the parents allowed their children to tell them to get out and so on.
I'd like to think that the children learned something beneficial, but it seems that they have learned that lies, bullying, and bribery go hand in hand with democracy. It should be mentioned that America is not a democracy, but a republic.
*I'm amazed at the comments made by Benny Castillo that seemed to call people disgusted with the behavior of this film, hypocrites. I'm not sure if you willingly created a straw man argument or if you truly equate Americans wanting their children to have a good education and quality of life with teaching children to lie about others and stoop to vicious behavior to get ahead. As a parent and teacher, I do my best to make sure my children (biological and students) have opportunities and skills to become people who will help make this world a better place - that is the point of why we parent isn't it and why we are alive? HIgh GPA's equivalent bad? Good schools with quality educators spending hours every day with my children are not what every child deserves? As far as the big car thing goes - look at the news Benny - things are changing. IF someone wants a green grass - let 'em. Why do you have to run over people for green grass, good schools, and encouraging your child to do their best and find their niche in life to help this world?
*I also was surprised of how the children were allowed to behave in school. I hope this is not representative of how children behave in China. I can only hope that the teacher didn't step in for the sake of the authenticity of the film. Judging by her demeanor though, it seems the children are just allowed to be disrespectful to others.
Once again money talks. It seems to me the winner's father had deep pockets which equalled votes for his son. However, I thought both boys were pretty ruthless. But, then again, politics is hardball after all.
great documentary. I am stuck to the television when i watched it. I just do not know why the filmmaker has to show the father wiping his son's bottom after using the rest room. I think it will be embarrasing to the child when he gets old.
What I found so disturbing is that how the teacher allowed bribery and intimidation to occur in this film. The whole exercise in democracy was the worst example I have ever seen. Is this how the chinese think democracy works? The seeds of corruption born in the hands of children.
Why are some posters here so surprise about a video like this? Isn't that exactly what's taught in the great USA at a very young age? Compete against your neighbor, attend the best schools, have the highest GPA, have the biggest car and the greenest grass on the block? No worries about who you run over! Why is this documentary so surprising, a sign of ignorance and inhumane when that is the norm here in the US? Oh, I forgot because it is in China right? Give me a break.
At least these people are not pretending to anyone. This video is evidence of how different cultures present themselves and how other want the world to see them. We do the same here. It is just washed up and cleaned up a little. The competition, the selfishness, the needing to get ahead by any means. What better place than America to understand all of that was displayed in that classroom? What is it that we reward in this country that is so different than others?
I found the film both fascinating and disturbing. It was shocking to see the tactics used in this so called democratic election. It wasn't. The winner was like a little mobster. They were cute however, showing behavior of an 8 year old. The look of horror on the children's faces after they had elected the bully monitor said it all. What a mistake. I read further that the bully boy was chosen as an assistant to the teacher and he liked it better. It seems that is what is rewarded in this culture abuse and bullying but what do we expect from a country with horrible human rights. It is a viscous cycle perpetuated by ignorance.
I watched the documentary and it was great. I am on the other end of a member on this board that expressed the fact that the teacher allowed the students behave in such fashion. The same member also stated that she did not know that Chinese kids behave so poorly.
I personally think that any 8-year old from any country would act similar considering the setting. They were in a debate and competing for a very prestigious position. THAT IS HUMAN NATURE & what better example than kids in our classrooms in the US. What I am really concerned about is a lot of our adults in the US that still act like the kids in this film. Selffish and out of control! I think that allowing the students to act in their natural way teaches them how their behavior can lead to many things (bad and good). It was great seeing the teacher taking a back seat and allowing the kids to have autonomy of the classroom. Maybe us teachers in the US can learn something from this experience. I am going to use the video and show it to all my 8th grade students. Our students here can only wish to have the maturity & the independence that all those kids showed on this film.
To the poster who said they called their son in China and told him and his wife NOT to have children while in China sounds like a dictatorship to me. Why would anyone feel they have the right to tell anyone when and where to have children? This is exactly the dictatorship that prevails in countries like China.
I TIVO'ed this program for my daughter to watch. It was just amazing.
This class of 8-yr. old Chinese kids have a class project to elect a new class monitor. Of course they do not know the words 'Democracy' or 'Vote.' Here is a group of sweet, innocent school children who become cunning, ruthless, underhanded, backstabbing little politicians given to dirty tricks and bribery once the office of Class Monitor is dangled over their heads.
The teacher really should know better about norm and ethic, if not democracy.
Luolei who was elected in this election, he beat many other kids during the previous 2 years of being the Monitor. He surely is a good little actor, put on good behavious and say the right things to get elected. but the reason of his "success" is not "Fair Play". He promised to change from a dictator to a manager. He got elected.
If he forgot or ignored what his promised, he should be the monitor no more!
Kids were afraid of not voting for the monitor who beats them up. they got excited about the gifts and the monorail ride which was paid by Luolei's parents.
In my opinion, Luolei should not have the chance to be a candidate of this election, because he already abused the honor of being the class monitor in the previous 2 terms.
The teacher was fully aware of the abusing monitor, but i think she is really unfit to let this happened, and he will be the monitor once again. She also allow Luolei to give gifts. Those bribe are forms of corruptions.
It is also typical for abusive relationship: Abuse first, then offer gifts as compensation. From time to time, those who was abused think the abuses are OK. But they are not OK.
I respect CHENCHEN and the little girl's courage and the huge amount of preparation for this election. I think CHENCHEN did a very good job. Their effort will not be wasted. I hope that their feelings would not be hurt, because they did good, especially CHENCHEN.
Also this program shows how much of the kid's work are actually done by their parents which is unproper. Parents need to understand that there is a fine line between asist kids' work and actually do kids' work for them.
Democracy is not about casting a vote. It is about the process, it is about why you vote for this person, what is the reason.
In a word, if there is no FAIR PLAY, there is no real democracy. it is just something that you pretend to have.
The teacher and the school should know better. At least know better about common sense.
The abusor, as a monitor now, next time when he beat other kids, he should be punished by student trial with possible punishment like cleaning the classroom, cleaning the toilet and writing individual apology letters to each and every kids that he has beaten in the past.
if this is not done, he might possibly become abusive criminal in the future. It is not OK to abuse people, power and honor.
The power that be,(School,Teachers)gave the students only three choices. Not unlike how the elite of the western world give the citizens a choice of usually two or three candidates. It doesnt matter to the teacher/elite which of the candidates the students/citizens elect. Either one will carry out the agenda of the teacher/elite. Having a real choice is only an illusion perpetrated by the power that be.
I just watched Independent lens's "Please vote for me". What a wonderful show. Leave it to public television to go into the heart,(the children), of China and get a view that we otherwise would never see. It was so interesting to see how this election would end up. It sad to know, that even adults,(our elected) still behave like children in order to get elected.
it's amazing to watch a comunist country practicing democrcy with their future.... it shows their desires to be free and express themselves...... very nice movie....congratulations...... very well edited
Democracy has to start with respect for others. I was frankly shocked that the children were being beaten by Luo Lei who had been 'monitor' for the past two years and was, amazingly, re-elected. I agree with Cheng Cheng that governing by force is not the way -- nor is it democratic! Luo Lei appears to be a little snot and I was shocked that he won the election. However, his win made me realize that looks and money count for more than honor and intelligence -- even among 8 years olds and I find that profoundly sad.
It was obvious from the furnishings in his home and the bribe his father gave him to pass out just before the election that Luo Lei's family has more money than Cheng Cheng or Xu Xiaofei. Rich kids are often more confident and popular and, from what I saw in the film, that's about all that Luo Lei had going for him other than his pushy father.
I have no problem with parents who support their children but I do object to parents who do the work for their children as did Luo Lei's dad. It was quite obvious that the little girl, Xu Xiaofei, had written her own speeches and I applaud her! She has more courage and integrity than Luo Lei.
It was disturbing after the election that the teacher and parents kept telling Cheng Cheng and Xu Xiaofei that "it's alright" and to "stop crying." It's not alright! Both children took their loss as personal rejection by their classmates and that's crushing for anyone. Acknowledging and accepting their tears would go far to alleviate the personal rejection. It would be more appropriate to discuss people who, despite crushing defeats, both personal and professional, brushed themselves off and tried again and again to reach their success -- even fat people (and Cheng Cheng is NOT fat, just a little chubby which I predict will not hold him back but will spur him to achieve much more than others.) My personal favorite is a saying attributed to Thomas Edison who eventually invented the light bulb and held thousands of patents for his inventions --- he said, "I have not failed. I just found 1,000 ways that won't work."
It also seemed inappropriate to make the two who didn't win approach and shake the hand of Luo Lei. It should have been the other way around.
I hope someone explained to Cheng Cheng and Xu Xiaofei the true reasons that Luo Lei won because it certainly was not because he was the better candidate -- he wasn't!
I saw this film today, Jan. 20, 2009 and was appalled at the behavior of these children. At first I didn't know what Asian country these children were from. And, I could have been watching any North American classroom. I am a teacher and see this rude, hyperactive behavior every day in every class. I was also appalled at the educational methods employed by the teachers in encouraging this behavior and conduct. They encouraged the mean behavior of the children and didn't offer any concrete direction in guiding this so called "process of democrary." Where did they take their lesson plans from, the recent U.S. presidental elections?
I also realized that the parents were at fault, as well as the teachers. I thought that Chinese children were more respectful, and better behaved. I tuned in a few minutes late and thought, "these kids need one of those super nannies" to help these families.
Imagaine, teaching 8-year-olds to act and behave in this fashion. Real democracy is instilling a respect for, first, parents, then schools, then the world at large. and then the world. These very behaviors shown in this film is exactly what is destroying democracy here in North America. They only taught these children rudeness, bribery, and looking our for their own interests. If this is democracy, I want no part of it.
The movie was very confusing! At the ending how they just left both children crying.....it was sad. I think the girl should of won and for eight year olds they were way to mean in my opinion , and there parents went crazy trying to help them especially Luo Lei's dad who wanted him to BRIBE.Which was really crazy , and I think he might of lost if he didn't.Overall I really liked this movie.
I just watched " Please Vote for Me" and found it very moving. Of course I knew that China was a communist run country, but I never realized what a strong-hold that communism has over a country. I live in the US and though I understand there are limitations here as well, I guess I've never really felt held down by my own government. To see these children do something completely experimental and foreign, was amzing. I thought it was beautiful that the students ended up voting for Luo Lei, the one from the very beginning whom said he 'didn't want to control his classmates, he wanted them to vote for whomever they wanted.'
I love learning about new countries and systems. I feel as though my brain can't sop up enough, and I think this film shows a slow but coming movement for China.
I am a Chinese and now study in Canada... I really hope freedom will come to China ASAP!!!
The concept of the class representative (banzhang) has existed in China for decades and they are always the top performing students that are elected by their peers, there's nothing groundbreaking about the elections reflected in this documentary. Communist Party members are also elected by their peers in a similar manner and democracies exist in different forms in different countries.
Although democracy it is ultimately the best way to govern a nation, I tend to agree that China needs further develop, improve rule of law, and create stronger institutions before moving towards a completely democratic state. The atmosphere is relatively apolitical in China, with a government that is driving results rather than rhetoric. They have reserves of over 2 Trillion that increases by one billion everyday...and the improvement in infrastructure and standards of living is staggering.
Democracies exist in different forms in different countries, you have parliamentary and presidential systems and there is further differentiation in the Asian context. Japan is considered "Democratic" but the LDP has ruled for the 61 out of 63 years. Thailand is "democratic" but there have been 18 military coups which would lead to civil war if it occurred in China. India's "democratic" but has levels of poverty unseen in China. I think China should find it's own direction for political pluralization rather than blindly following existing models.
DEMOCRACY IS IDEPENDENCE AND JUDGEMENT.dEMOCRACY IS ALSO FREEDOM FOR OUR PEOPLE DEMOCRACY IS ALSO THE FREEDOM TO VOTE FOR WHO YOU WANT TO VOTE.THE PEOPLE ARE FREE TO GIVE A SPEECH WHEN THEY GET ELECTED.THATS DEMOCRACY.
I think democracy is about freedom,to vote and voting equally to who they want. Also to be a manager and not a dictator. Not to boss and be selfish to the people. Democracy listens to the peoples opinions, needs and attitudes. The people all have a freedom of speech. This is freedom to me! :P
democrocy is free of election and to vote who ever you want
democracy is when you have a right to vote for your leader
grat movie, they knew what they were doing, seemed nice and mean great clip.
I think they were copitive and, at first dint know a anything about democracy. they seem nice and mean but they knew what they were doing though. Great movie.
i think this film was great
my definition of democracy is,
having the right to vote for whoever you want,
or just being able to vote period.
basically having a voice,
in what happens in out country/world.
i think that those chinese children should not have to go through that communism. But thats just how i feel.
i think this was a great film and these young kids did great.. i remeber when i was about the same age and i was running for school president democracy is when the highly paid get to vote to see who gets to be in the office .. i think thats what it means but i now i am on the right track.. well nice video and i am glad to have watched it.. ps yall kids did so good..
well i thought that the two boy's were realy agressive and mean to there perents. the girl on the other hand seamed realy nice but she didnt realy exprese her self and that isnt realy helpfull.
the meaning of "democracy" is that you have the right to vote. on "elections" you can speak out to who you are going for and 'want' to win. that is just it. you have a voice....
to vote and who will be a elected
This is sad because they don't know what vote is.
democrocy is free of election and to vote who ever you want
Democracy mean's that everyone has a voice, it's just not always heard. I like the way all the perant's were showing support to there children.
I Think That DEMOCRACY Is A Type Of Government With People That Have Rights : ]
I loved this movie! I was surprised by a lot of people's reaction to it though. Why was anyone surprised that the parents helped so much? Of course they were going to help, don't be so naive. "That the kids were so cruel!" Did you go to school at DisneyLand? They were kids, rapacious and loving at the drop of a hat. The way the teachers handled the class as well as the parents interactions with their children was where I felt the true slice of life came out. Children were spoiled yet oddly accomplished. That they would be spoiled yet told that "They were playing horribly!" Kids are spoiled here as well but not forced to perform. There, even if the child was an unruly tyrant, he memorized his lines to near perfection. I was truly surprised by how articulate the children were. That they also seemed to grasp the nuances of politics (bribes, mud-slinging). At the very least, I liked that even when the kids wanted to quit when they faced their first difficulty they were still told to keep trying. Otherwise, what would they learn? Cheng's mom said almost exactly that. Education can sometimes be uncomfortable. Children are tougher than we give them credit for and some of the best lessons in life are not easily learned. Maybe we need more of China's system over here.
What's the big deal of this. Class president is always elected beginning 3nd grade. You just need someone is nominate you, another one to second that nominate and meet the grades requirement. It's pretty simple affair, people are nominated the first day, then vote next day by show of hands. I was nominated twice, but never won. So this definitely not the first time, once we even elected someone the teacher didn't like. But he was disqualified halfway that year since his grades has slipped, but no one really know if the teacher has something do with it or not.
I think there definition of democracy is differnt from ours, because they still have a dictatorship. Its a good movie. I think this film represented the reason they don't have a democracy. In China Communism helped the farmers and everyone else, improve life. It still exists today.
It is disturbing to read some of the comments that quick to dismiss this film for fear that it revealed dirty politics that is so rampant in "democratic" elections. For those who blaimed parents for coaching their 8-year olds on speeches, remember how many of you have reviewed/rewrote/polished your kids' college essays? It found this deep-rooted bias/sense of superiority towards other cultures laughable. Bill
It was fascinating to watch this documentary but upsetting that children so young are put through so much stress. I would have waited until middle school or High School to do this type of electing.
There was little supervision by the teacher, even when children were taunting or being mean to each other.
Lord of the Flies came to mind when dirty politics was relied upon. Having one child seems to have created spoiled chilren, at least when Cheng Cheng disrespects his mother and orders her out of the room. She tolerates this treatment (perhaps because he is a boy). Too much too soon for these kids. More supervision needed and manners taught.
The film showed a dirty election process far from what the ideal fair election should be like. There was little guidance from the teacher and the children were allowed to run rough shod over the opponents at times.
The director's take home message seems to be that democracy is inherently selfish and chaotic and 'western' democracy is incompatible with China and can come only very slowly.
It is good to see that children nowadays are more expressive and have chances to express themselves. However, it is sad to see that manupulative behaviour are encouraged and mind of majority of children are submissive and can be so easily bought.
I just watched this film on the web today, and it is quite interesting. However, the film's translation is not very good. For example, during the debate between Luo Lei and Cheng Cheng, the latter said that he would not become a "dictator", if elected. A better translation here would be "ruler", which has a quite different connotation from the word "dictator". Also, some of the phrases in the film are not translated at all, which affects the overall viewing experience. Lastly, as some of the posters here have pointed out, "class monitor" is not a good translation. "Class representative", "class manager", "class officer" are all better translations.
I am also puzzled by certain generalizations about Chinese society made by some of the posters here (e.g. status of women in China..etc). I think it is dangerous to make judgments on any society based on a documentary film. In order to understand another society other than one's own, one must look at it from multiple angles. Relying one's information on a single source, no matter how good it is, is simply unwise.
There are so many elements in this film that can be be discussed (the children's relationship with their parents, with each other, the "campaigning" process, the staging of the film, etc). However, what stood out most to me was Luo Lei's victory. That he was a bully was of no threat to and obviously embraced by the other students. Here was an opportunity for them to actually CHOOSE their "leader" and they still went with the guy who abuses them. What does this say about the human race, hmm.... It would have been interesting to hear the children's reasons for selecting Lei after the election. Was it that he "bought" them (e.g. the trip and the gifts at the end of his speech)?
Although, as I was watching the film I really wanted the little girl to win, I felt like Cheng Cheng would be the victor. Yes, he was a bit manipulative (as are most children...and politicians) but he was correct when he said, "...but I'm a quick thinker." I thought his debating skills (though coached by his mom) were phenomenal for a child of his age.
This film would be great for grade school children to watch and discuss as a class.
How interesting that the traits that make up today's American political candidates (and probably politicians all over the world) show up even in eight year old kids in China. The manipulative kids and parents demonstrate how early in life the ultra-competitive mindset is drilled into us. The way Liu physically pushed his mother out of the room shocked me a little, and watching Cheng Cheng lie and trick his classmates was more than a little disturbing. Still, school in general can be such a high-pressure environment, so it's no wonder the kids were so desperate to succeed.
I thought this was well-done and captured not just the manipulation and pranks of the parents and kids involved, but also their absolute cuteness. Little Cheng Cheng saying, "I'm fat and so it's hard to suck my stomach in" was too precious and reminded me that these driven people were just kids.
Fantastic film and so well put together. I first watched this while in in Nagoya, Japan. One week later I was lucky enough to catch the show again in Canada.
The interaction between the parents, the teachers and the children is spell binding.
Personally, I would have voted for the young girl. To fight past her personal demons at such a young age is quite amazing. Also, watching the little girl cleaning the chalk board always makes me laugh...ultra cute!
This is an amazing documentary I have seen and it lets me recall some bittersweet memories when I was studying in a primary school in China. A lot of western audience can't understand how important a class monitor is. Class monitor works like a pseudo-teacher. Class monitor has the right to order other students do anything and any students should respect the class monitor. That is why Chan chan said he wanted to be a class monitor because he can control others (the original sentence is a Chinese idiom: if I order others sit, no body dare to stand up).
However, lots of audiences misunderstand the role of girls in a class. Not all girls in China as shy as Xu Xiaofei. According to my experience, because girls become mature early than boys, in some situation, some brave girls always control the class.
For me, I used to be a class monitor in my primary school. Most audience doesn’t understand that to be a class monitor, excellent academic record is the basic requirement. Therefore, no wonder all candidates were successful academically. With one or two talents are very common for Chinese primary students. I have learnt calligraphy and painting since 6 years old. Most my friends are good at flute, piano, ect. You don't need to surprise that all candidates were so smart. With 1.3 billion populations, China is lack of resource and opportunity. Everyone has to strive to win in any single chance and the loser got nothing--this is social evolution--only the winner can survive.
That's why the competition is so brutal even between kids--they have to learn all skills to win in future from an age when most US kids are still believe fairy tale. They lost their childhood forever!
I experienced all of them but it doesn’t mean that I agree with the education system. After passing through this rigid education system, all students lose the ability to imagine. When look at one question, everyone reflects to have the same answer.
The most important is all students lose the interest of science or knowledge. It is true Chinese students have learnt more academic knowledge than any western students. A talent primary school student in China can easily solve math questions which a high school student in US can't solve. However, it doesn't mean the talent Chinese student love math or have passion on it. Chinese student can be a perfect worker but can't become perfect scholar.
After watched this film, I just want to say: "Please save these kids!!!!!!!!"
Democracy means that everyone should be involved and never excluded from being heard. WE ARE THE PEOPLE...we, each ONE of us, creates the union that SHOULD form our country's government and it's democracies. Everyone needs to be envolved and interested in our government and, most importantly, feel confident that our opinion does count for something and will make a difference.
I found it interesting that the candidate with the most money won this election. Even though many students in the class agreed that he is abusive, they gave them his vote based on (in my opinion) the gifts he handed out at the end of his speech.
That said, I was impressed by all three of the candidates. How articulate and mature they all were!
This was such a fascinating film.
The classroom behavior experiment in Please Vote for Me reminded me of the Jane Elliot blue eyes/brown eyes lesson. The take-aways and methods are different, and it makes for a facsinating film, but it seems cruel and unethical to manipulate kids like that.
See for yourself: http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/divided/etc/view.html
I enjoyed this film a great deal. It was actually comforting to see Chinese children learning about practicing democracy through mock elections. I thought the 3 children who ran again each other did an exceptional job for their age, and it seemed to come across as if they acquired a solid basic understanding of the concept of democratic elections.
I personally hope this wasn't just a one time lesson and that Chinese educators continue to expose their children to ways of the west that make sense, and in theory and ideally, contribute to the common good of the people.
Competitiveness is a big thing in Chinese culture. It reflects traditional value, much of it Confucian (conservative). This drive to excel should not, however be viewed in isolation. Chinese culture is an intertwining of two streams - the Confucian balanced by the Taoist. The Taoist one, is the pressure escape. Taoism views all struggles as ultimately futile. The girl, having lost and been hurt, would hopefully find solace in that philosophical outlook.
As for comments that convey surprise (oh but they were only little kids), check out our parental and passionate involvement (winning at all cost) at the baseball diamonds and skating rinks all over the country.
One more thought ... if anyone thinks this kind of competitiveness does not exist in American culture, take a look at the world of school sports. I once saw a documentary about high school cheerleading squads competing for some big prize. The competition was so fierce that the losing teams could not fathom why they had lost -- because their coaches had told them they could only win. The students had not been prepared for loss (by either their parents or coaches) and were unable to exhibit any graciousness toward the winning team. Even taking second or third place was so abhorrent to them that they were unable to congratulate the other teams, and were not expected to do so by their coaches or the event organizers. The only thing the coaches had to say was that the judges got it wrong. THIS was shocking.
This was an utterly fascinating and gripping film. At first, I also reacted with some shock, but then began to look at it as a tiny window into a world I know very little about and try to put it into context. I think we should remember that our tendency is to react to this film from the point of view of our own culture and social experience. While the behavior of the children might seem shocking or disturbing to us here in the U.S., much of their behavior may be quite normal and accepted in China. This film was much more about human behavior, individual and social, than about democracy. It was not the democratic experiment that caused the children to behave the way they did -- it was their culture. You only have to watch the parent-coaching scenes to understand a bit more about the core societal values at work here.
Well, that's democracy for you - the big money interests always win.
These elections are viciously cutthroat. When I was in elementary school (early 90's) and we had class officer elections, we had to give like 1 speech and that was it. There were five spots and I got fifth. That was the last time I had anything to do with politics.
Great filmmaking; struck some very nostalgic chords, especially the calisthenics and face massage exercises. Don't get what's with the weird Jedi-style ponytails though. I felt for these kids even though I kind of disliked all of the candidates. You had to wonder how much the campaigning really affected the voting body; these are little kids we are talking about.
It felt kind of weird and foreign even for me, and I WAS one of these kids (though they have a hell of a lot nicer school.) I can only imagine what Americans watching this program might think.
Why is the director so focused on talking about "Chinese culture" and "eastern culture" as an opposite to democracy? Is he not familiar with Taiwan or Japan? He should say Peoples Republic of China, not try to disguise it with culture which is untrue.
After watching this program, I immediately called my son in China to tell him he and his (Chinese) wife should not have any children while they lived there. The total lack of personal moral responsibility towards the other shown in this vignette of daily life in China is unfortunately common, it seems. Unkindness is not only overlooked, it is rewarded. Hurting the other, emotionally and physically, is the norm. Intelligent little boy, big for his age, with deep feelings and brains as well, is reduced to tears and then told to 'stop crying' and made to shake hands with the poor policeman's son who does not even know how he is being warped at home and at school. The little girl may as well not have tried at all.
I could never even watch this video again, although I think everyone should see it. To those viewers who spoke about Piaget - Thanks, but Piaget is no star in China, where rote and imitation of the model is the key to learning.
To those who said similar stories can come out of American classrooms - of course, you are correct, and the producers could find such stories, BUT the ground of our culture will not back up these examples of cruelty. If you come across a classroom in the United States or Europe and find two third graders crying at the front of the classroom and others sobbing in their seats, I doubt very much that no adult would protest.
We are talking about the intentional hurting of others - by the bully, who is anointed by adult teachers, and by the teachers who allow it, and by the policeman who is only interested in his son's 'winning.' Of course children are betrayed by school systems in the USA, but, as I said above, intentional hurt is not in the curriculum. It happens, but it is not stamped "approved behavior." An 8 or 9 year old child cannot comprehend protecting the rights of the minority and majority, nor the concept of the person, but children know right and wrong in their bones - the emotion so powerfully shown in this video production gives the evidence.
After watching this powerful documentary, I urged my son to move back to the USA.
F.X.K.
I was so mesmerized by this show I couldn’t quit watching it. I thought it was very interesting on how the parents interacted and how they were coaching their kids. Cheng Cheng was my favorite and I wondered if he would have won if Luo Lei did not give out the gifts. I could get into the pro and cons as others did before but voting and running for an office can be dirty hard work but living in a democracy is hard work but rewarding and it’s not to be taken for granted. I think that the kids handled it well for their age especially for the pressure they were under and to learn what voting is all about. I thought it was also endearing to watch how the other kids interacted with the ones that didn't win and cried but I thought that was great for them to be able to show their emotions and then congratulate the winner. I remember running for office of secretary when I was in third grade and lost but it still was a good experience for me. I loved the film
Margo Allison's comment cleared up the most puzzling part for me. I couldn't understand what cultural norm allowed the teacher to encourage such chaos and misery. It only makes sense if the real lesson is "Democracy is bad."
Perhaps, too, they really don't know how to conduct elections or use the democratic process, so the horrid way the election was run may have been due to ignorance. Do the Chinese believe democracy is in itself an entirely cut-throat, corrupt idea? In the U.S., big money politics is mean and corrupt, but the concept or ideal of democracy is a beautiful thing. This is the element that the teacher in the film, and probably the entire society, doesn't know. Certainly, creating an artificial presidential-style election using eight-year-olds is itself corrupt and mean spirited.
There was no teaching of how to "do" democracy as there is in American elementary classrooms. Sure, high school elections are a popularity contest, but somewhere inside most young Americans is the knowledge of how real democracy works: a spark of decency, a moral compass.
The way the boys order their mothers around proves that women haven't made many gains in China, but the most sickening part was the stepfather wiping an eight-year-olds anus after a bowel movement. In fifteen years, what will he and his cohort be like? Entitled a bit?
Great documentary!!! This will give us conversation and research topics for a long time to come. Before even commenting on the film one must look at the history of the region. Ancient city, taken by the Japanese, the Wuhan Incident, the Cultural Revolution just to scatch the surface. Now bring into account that the very people introducing this new political ideology were raised in deep communism and nationalism and have had to endure (rightly or wrongly) the consumerism that is present China. Hello Independent Lens. Now mix in "only child policy" and the class society of the regime and we get a brilliant documentary.
Some posts have mentioned "honor" but I think they are thinking of Japan not China. Collective is China's history not individuality and honor of a person.
How does a teacher raised in communism with the threat of prison suddenly move forward and teach a strange concept freely? How do parents sit back and allow their only child to find his own way when their way was marked by class and party? Will this new way last? Will they be retrained if the new way fails?
To me the most disturbing aspect was not the experiment but what we found in the school previous to the experiment. Children were ruling the classroom and striking other children. Only one child reflected that stupidity of that concept. Did anyone else hear the song that said that communism brought the gift of democracy?
This first step into democracy is so much like the first step of Russia and its succumbing to dark side during the onset.
The first time the children cried,and it spread throughout the class, I was vividly reminded of learning many years ago that open emotional expression, and a strong collective consciousness are fundamental to Chinese society. We saw these kids being indoctrinated in these principles through songs, speeches and slogans,urging collective action against "enemies". Knowing who and what the enemies of China are, I had wondered exactly how valid principles of democracy could be implemented in such a setting. From the get-go the three"candidates" were chosen by the teachers. Then it started to get to me; the ubiquitous Communist Youth Organization scarves, the government functionary teacher impassively observing kids suffering vicious attack by the rest of her class; the position of the parents of the Current Occupant; the overbearing interference by the parents, it wasn't pretty. It began to dawn on me that this "exercise" was causing a lot of negative emotional impact in this class, and that more than once they were reminded that "this is "democracy" . I sadly concluded that delightful as the portrayal of the children,their lives and families was, I was watching a blockbuster source of anti-democratic propaganda. "See what this democracy thing does? It destroys brotherhood, our great national values of caring,and equality,our comradeship in batle against our enemies- you've felt the harm yourselves. Isn't our way best?" It would be extremely interesting to know if and how this film might be used in China. I'm left with a bittersweet afection for the darling children-all of them, but also the sad if cynical opinion that this eminently well intentioned enterprise might possibly have done more harm than good. I'll be the first one to rejoice if this surmise is proved wrong.
Great film! As a current teacher in the U.S. and as someone who went to China to adopt a daughter in 2002, I thought it really provided a raw slice of that culture -- the good and the bad. Of all of the comments above, only one noticed what bothered me the most, and that in passing. The boys, when frustrated at home, commanded their mothers to leave the room. Their mothers complied and the fathers did nothing. Clearly, women are still second class citizens there. When the little girl prepared to play the flute (she had the most talent of the three) the boys were allowed to humiliate her and shred her confidence and shoot her out of the water as a realistic candidate from the start; she never recovered from that. In a land of 1.2 billion people, all competing for resources and opportunities, you have to perform or you get left out. It is not a land of handouts for the inept like America has become. Actions and decisions are based on ability and connections (the ability to procure resources, not on sentimentality and "feelings"). I think most viewers didn't understand what a "Class Monitor's" job is... to herd the kids along between classes or at lunch efficiently and to be able to make things happen... not "represent them" aka American Politics but more like a drill sergeant. The girl was clearly not the best candidate for this task. They chose the boy with the most experience, the Policeman Jr. They stuck with what they knew, and if he had connections to gifts and the monorail and the local government (more resources for them)and could get his classmates to move efficiently and to perform, then, from their perspective, he was their best choice. But as he resumed his authoritarian hand of discipline, maybe next time, they will consider "at what cost" does his leadership come. As intimidating as his leadership style was, the girl's lack of authority and the resulting chaos that would have followed was even more frightening to the class, because they too, are driven for progress and respect strength. I taught a summer class of 39 13 & 14 yr. old Chinese boy and girl students here in Amercia one summer. They were incredibly spoiled, especially the boys. They were little Emperors who were disrespectful, rude and used to getting their way. When I rewarded some by taking them to the fair early and left the "naughty" half behind to join us later they threatened me with the influence of their parents, that they were rich and that they could act the way they wanted to because of who their parents were. But they were very capable academically and athletically. But spoiled? One of them was still bathed daily by his grandmother (at age 14). Did you notice the father wipe his son's bottom when done on the toilet? At age 8? A teacher who tries to stand up to the little Emperors there is soon reported and fired. Parents and politics wield amazing influence over who can do what in China. This, and the preference for boys, explains why the female teacher did so little to control the environment. There, it is okay for the boys to assert themselves over the females, and it is naive to think their female teacher doesn't understand that. That said.... weren't those kids capable? They were articulate. Did you see the girls doing the dancing, gymnastics or flutes and then the whole group doing exercises? They have far, far more abilities than most American kids, and this also includes reading, math and science. And this is what I'd like my American students to see... how driven Chinese youth are. They are building the next world power while our kids are, as someone above said, "More concerned with eating Cheetos and playing video games." America is going to be left in the dust until our youth rediscover what a work ethic is. But hey, it's all about Halo 3 and feeling good and watching Paris Hilton updates and calling that news.... Folks, let me tell you... our local ASB student elections in our school in the 6th & 7th grade are not superior to what you just saw. The kid who is popular (good looking, smug and generally silly) gets elected. It has nothing to do with ability, ethics or potential leadership. There are a lot of promises made and many bribes (candy) handed out, but every year, it is a popularity contest. The entertaining one with the quick one liners wins.... Voting in a Democracy is an educational process. I'm glad China is trying, but it will take a while to reach our level (or maybe not). Still, those families love their kids, eat more healthily than most Americans, and work hard for results. Hold on, it is going to be a rude awakening for our kids and grandkids. Maybe women there will take on a higher status as they become a greater and greater minority as men already outnumber women by 60 million. We do a better job at fostering true individual creativity, but China has us in spades when it comes to numbers of people, working hard and producing results. C. Winn
Fantastic. You had me up watching till 4 am. I don't know China at all. What got me was the natural political instinct Cheng Cheng had -- do his parents know they've got an incipient mobster there? The votecounting, the collaring others to run errands, the intimidation and pressuring -- where'd he learn it all?
Watching Xu Xiaofei, watching how the boys pushed their mothers around...I wondered what response Xu Xiaofei might have drawn if she had behaved like the boys, politicking aggressively. I wondered how long it would've been before another child criticized her with "Girls should be _______."
I watched PLEASE VOTE FOR ME with both fascination and horror. For all of the so-called discipline in Chinese schools, it seemed to me that decency and self-control were the last things on anyone's mind. The children had none intrinsically, and the teachers and parents imposed and encouraged little, if any. The coaching that went on to encourage the children to tear each other down mentally and emotionally was unconscionable. Sure, it was an interesting look at democracy (rather made me think of Golding's Lord of the Flies), but these children, rather than being enriched by the mini-exercise in democracy, will bear emotional scars from the humiliation they suffered at the hands of their friends and classmates. We always hear that 'honor' is so important in the Chinese culture. If you beat your opponent by trashing his reputation, buying votes, and corrupting the process, where is the honor in that? This was nothing more than a dressed up version of Michael Vick's dogfighting. No bloodshed, true, but vicious and relentless just the same. You'd never find this process sanctioned in any school in the U.S.
this was a GREAT film. Kudos to the great film team and the producer who came up with the idea!! I'm sharing it with many people.
China has been Communist since 1949. No doubt any election in China is special. An election in school is very special; but I did not think it was much of an democracy when the teacher selected the three candidates for class monitor! But the Chinese are new at democracy and need to learn about it. Thus school is a good place to start.
I also missed the first bit of this show, but found immediately for it to be captivating. I'm first generation Canadian born to Hong Kong Chinese parents. I've travelled to and spent half a year in various provinces in China. I must say, the aspects of this film I found most interesting/disturbing, upon hindsight are all elements I would feel the same about if filmed anywhere else int the world. Just seeing the effect of the "experiment" on the young children of 8 - candidates, campaign assistants, and classmates alike - was a little frightening. Absolutely understandable, and when you imagine the same situation put upon any other group, be it children or adults, predictable in any case. Yes, it's a little unbearable to witness just how "managed" each candidate is by his or her parents, but I can easily (sadly) see the same happening for children all around the world where parents have enrolled their children into activities with aims, at the highest, "to win" or "be the best" amongst their peers. Like this "opportunity for learning", even a good intentions will all likely result in both bad and good outcomes.
Thank you for such an outstanding film. Degree of success is demonstrated by the wide cross section of comments submitted.
In reviewing the comments, I noted that most viewers watched with a "Western" bias on how society should be. Therefore, most criticism were aimed at the parents, teachers, school and even at the producer, speculating that some sort of bribery is needed in doing such a film in China.
One must put down the American flag for a second and immerse themselves as one of citizen living today's China to appreciate their plight and progression to a more democratic society.
I would like to see post production interviews with each of the 3 candidates, plus the teachers and parents on their perspectives of this film.
That was a great show. I felt so bad for those kids. I wish I knew more about the other things that they were studying, like when they were rubbing their faces. What was that about? I also love how the kids kept singing pop songs. None of my elementary school classes ever broke out in song that I can remember. In fact, those kids seemed overall much happier (except when they were crying - they were so emotional over one another).
Democracy is a very general term that applies to a variety of different governments that work in completely different ways. Show me a system with healthcare that leaves the people alone, and I'll move there - who cares what it's called.
The program was addictive, mostly because of how dissapointing it was to see parents teach their children to malign others for personal gain; especially when the profits seemed more important to the parents that the children. As the children were walking into school they were singing about honesty and good will for others and yet were learning to do the exact opposite from their homes. As an educator myself, it was hard to watch the teacher not intervene and correct the children as they were purposely cruel to each other. Yes,as pointed out earlier,the children seem more advanced in speaking skills and such as compared to our students, but I'm fairly certain that was not the lesson these kids took away from the experience.
A very amazing film. Makes you think why asain culture is so bent on personal gain. Maybe if american schools would take the same idea. We would not be in such an import inbalance.
This was an interesting documentary. I was surprised to see a school in China voting. I felt sorry for the two who didn't have gifts to bribe the students. I think the children were too young to be in an election.It should have been Jr. High level. Especially when they called each other names etc, even bringing them to tears. It seemed that the teacher did not monitor her class well. I thought the class would be quieter since it is in China. I was pleased to see a form of democracy being carried out in a communist country. Maybe some day these children will be leaders in helping their country to be a democracy. They learned that you can bribe people just like they do in the United States. It didn't take long to learn this trait.
For our all politically-correct “teachers” and “parents” on this board believing that there is too much bribery and corruption in Chinese schools, that Chinese parents are too involved and too “pushy”, that the American school system is extremely advanced and upright and democratic and liberated and all, tell me why your elementary schools and high schools do so poorly compared with some other countries, including China?
This show was mesmerizing! The involvement of the parents, while a little scary at times, makes me wonder how high-achieving our 8-year-olds would be if their families made their education as much a priority. A great program! It will be very interesting to see where these kids are at when they're 12-- or 20!
I did not see any rules about posting links, but I really think that it would be impossible to anyone come to an informed conclusion about what is best for children unless you were able to compare and contrast what is actually happening in the educational world.
If anyone is interested, watch the nine minute video at:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=Bero7U6DvnE
It is like seeing the polar opposite of the school in China.
I am going to be attending a teacher conference next weekend, and as it happens that one of the topics is inviting children into the democratic process in the classroom. I have also written several articles on this subject.
1) This was one of the best video's I have seen in a long time.Real life video's about life are always the best..Weather it is in China.Japan,U.S.S.R.
or any were in the World.We all get to learn about the world and other people in this world,And how they live..
2) Of course it is very interresting to see how Democracy will develope in the world..I was in World War II.And I have seen the Idea's of Democracy spread from place to place.And I hope it we spread all around the world.And maybe freedom,peace will spread as well.Also I hope people will think about how little Democracy and freedom we use to have in the world..
3) Finely I thought the kids in this video was very cute and probly did not care about about what the teacher was trying to teach them,They look like they were more interrested in playing and going places,As all kids are at that age are..
I thought the little girl was more grow up than the boys and deserved to win..She probly will in the future.I also think and agree that the parents seem a little self centerd and pushey.And only thought of them self and not the well being of the kids...
I think we mite see Democracy spread more and more.I can only hope...
A+A+A+A+Great Video,Make more so people will think more about life and other people in the world.We all share this world together..Peace to all....
You know, I read a lot of conjecture and analyzation here about the democratic system, the behavior of the teachers, the influence of Chinese culture on the "experiment", blah blah... but no one seems to be focusing on the fact that these are little kids! No young child should be subjected to that! The movie instantly made me think of all the idiotic things educators made me do at that age, all in the name of "learning" and "preparatory experience". There is absolutely no reason why EVERY experience in a young child's education can't be positve, reinforcing learning. There is no reason why anything regarding education has to be negative! It is utterly ridiculous to think kids of that age need harsh, real life, experiences. So what about the parents... hey, that was no culture thing! Think about all the papers and projects your parents spent hours on for you, right here in the United States. No, the real tragedy is that some adult thought this whole thing was a good idea. Watching those kids getting there hearts broken was just sad. Even the winner, little Leu Li or whatever ultimately learned that all the deception, force, and gifts will win the day.
Thank Yo PBS, you have opened up my mind. I stumbled upon this show about 20 minutes in and i must say i am extremely pleased with it.
I agree that the parents were a little too hands on, but it is their only child after all. Its interesting to observe another culture and see that they are just human like me.
I don't understand the U.S and other nations's claim to spreading democracy, its not working so well here so why would you want to put others in the same boat?
I think we should love our fellow man regardless of his beliefs, actions or thoughts, so long as he does not pose harm to the survival of the species, he is welcome in my home.
I taught it is an adorable documentary on suffrage being exercise by these kids and with participation of their parents. It has all the components of a regular small town mud slinging election. Great, great documentary, I hope it wins a ton of awards.
"I’d call the train-ride and the cards more of GIFTS than briberies. "
Isn't giving with ulterior motive a form of bribe?
As I stated before it's fine reflection of REAL China - government connection and bribes. I have been going to China 3 to 4 times a year since 1996 on business.
Lanky lad Luo Lei got elected based on:
1. Government connection - Dad is a big shot at "Gong An" or police. Must be an ardent communist party member too.
2. Bribes - Handing off envelopes even it contains no money not to mention field trip.
Nice train ride too and show off that your dad can pull that off via connection or "Guan Zi" and bureaucratic influence. Sadly even the little kids recognize it.
My daughter and I both thought Cheng Cheng was going to win but his dad is only engineer and so much for better campaigning and speech.
This is indeed today's China.
The horrible tactics Cheng Cheng employed, and his parents amoral "at all costs" mentality that sought to see the election results favor him over his development into a young man deserving of winning is a splendid metaphor for the today's quest for hollow triumph without ever considering the ramifications of what happens when the leadership knows only how to "win", and not how to carry out the posititon he was elected to fulfill. Karl Rove anyone?
This was an extremely interesting documentary, although, I ended up feeling horrible for the kids who didn't win. All of the children worked very hard to 'defeat the dictatorship' that they were currently being ruled under. I am saddened as it seemed to me that the children were misled. I only hope they understand that their 'lesson' in democracy was quite simplistic. As children, I believe that they needed to learn the basics in a different format. It seemed that this was way too much for them to handle. Cheng Cheng was adorable. He gets my vote!
Sadly, after seeing "Please Vote For Me," I'm beginning to understand H.L.Mencken's little aphorism: "Democracy is the theory that the common people know what they want, and deserve to get it good and hard."
A word of summary:
What a miniature of life and society --- laughter, tears, disappointment, jealousy, friendship... all human emotions are perfectly captured. A real gem. Bravo! Watched three times in two days already :)
A word of reminder:
The original children's dialogues are way funnier than the often rigid, vague, and sometimes inaccurate subtitle translation.
A word defending Luo Lei:
I’d call the train-ride and the cards more of GIFTS than briberies. In China, policemen are quite involved with school, often delievering lectures about safety, traffic, etc. A ride on a monorail train? No big deal! Schools regularly organize such outings anyway, often assisted by police department. Sending greeting postcards right before the Mid-Autumn Festival? Wonderful and thoughtful idea! Why didn’t the other two candidates, I mean their parents, play such “ emotion card”? Otherwise, they wouldn’t have lost, at least not in such a big margin!
A word about parent’s involvement:
Yes, Chinese parents are like that. The result, some children get spoiled, but others become more competitive and intelligent under intensive care and nurturing. The pianist Lang Lang and NBA star Yao Ming, both only children, would not have been so successful without the dedication and sacrifice of their parents. I wouldn't be surprised if the campaign-speech writers in the film were the grandparents, or great grandparents :)
A word last but not the least:
I believe the three kids would definitely learn a lesson or two from the campaign, become more mature, and would likely overcome their shortcomings, say, Luo Lei become less bossy, Xiao Fei become stronger, and Cheng Cheng handout some greeting-cards before the next holiday :)
The film reveals that while Chinese citizens have much to learn about "democracy," they understand very well how to engage in "politics." Keep in mind that for the parents' generation, the most important aspects in life were dominated by politics: what job one would hold, where they would live, and whom they would marry. In other words, politics was, literally, a matter of life and death. Small wonder they know how to play the game, and play it well.
But if you listen carefully, you'll find that despite phrases such as "voting is sacred," neither the teacher nor the parents understand "democracy" well enough to make the election an exercise in democracy. In answer to the question of "What is democracy?", one adult responded (as I can best recall) that this meant you are your own master. One Chinese elementary school textbook on citizenship I translated last year (for a college paper) defined democracy as "being master of your own house" -- a very authoritarian (and traditionally Confucian) rendering of the concept of democracy!
And in the end it was the authoritarian figure of Luo Lei who won the election, despite his past performance as class monitor. Volumes have been written on whether or not Chinese citizens are ready for democracy or still prefer a strong authoritarian figure. Why did all the children begin crying when one or two began crying? Perhaps because the harmony of the group -- always more important in China than the rights of the individual -- was disturbed? (Would love to hear from Paul Guo and others from PRC on this point...)
This documentary elicited many opinions and criticisms of the film maker and the teacher involved. I would like to say that this "experiment" in democracy has to be taken in the context of Communist Chinese culture and mores.
Why did the teacher not interfere when things got dirty? I think that it was to teach the children life experiences. The one child policy leads to many little emperors and empresses and coddling by the authority figure would only encourage more selfish behavior.
Why were the parents so involved?
In a Confucian culture where being a scholar is respected and childrens' upbringing considered a major tenet in how a society progresses, parents get involved. It is not unusual for parents to go to the school and have impromptu meetings with the teacher nor for the teacher to stop by family's homes afterwork to discuss issues with parents.
The buying of votes and use of influence or Guan Xi has been a part of China since its beginning. It is part of the culture. Look at any business books on how to do business in Asia and this is brought up consistently. People are more comfortable with the familiar especially someone known for a long time than with just advertised merits.
I think that if most of the dirty tactics were stopped and the lobbying and backroom politicking were not shown or ceased then the film would not have been made or even been that thought provoking. One thing that China's leaders want their citizens to understand is that they supposedly have their citizen's best interests at heart and that they know better. And in some cases they do. This film probably also serves as a warning that democracy is not a clean and sacred as others in the West have made it out to be.
Democracy,people for get is the Democratic Party of the U.S. as it stands now.And as it stands in the verations in England,France,Cannda,Germany Ect..Even now in USSR and China...Time will tell....
This was a great show...And reminds me of my child hood in school...
In 2nd grade I remember my teachers trying to teach us Democracy...by trying to get us kids to vote for what president of the U.S would win...Being kids at that age we did it,but we did not care about it,or what president won...We just wanted to play....
But on the other hand the teachers were all rapted up it it,and fought back and forth,also they were worryed about who are parents voted for...
Some of the kids were all rapped up in it because of there parents and fought with the teacher,and other students...I thought at that age how dum,and stuped these people were to not have there own ideas,thoughts...
I Guess the wourld has not changed on that point....
I hope that it will lead to world peace in the.... :)
I was curious about how the translation/dubbing affected the final production of the film. The kids sound so eloquent and articulate for their age. The use of the word "dictator" and "manager" during the debate seemed so profound coming from the mouths of babes. Of course, with all of the parental coaching, maybe it was not so spontaneous, but still it came off that way to me. I wonder if the translation was literal, or did they inadvertently edit out some of the childhood language mis-steps common to this age group?
Like several other comment writers, I found this film shocking on many levels. Reviewing the comments, I am saddened.
The children in the film basically behave as children do. But the behavior of the adults is unbelievable! The little girl is totally humiliated and bullied by an entire roomful of her classmates, yet the authority figure, usually trusted by children -- the teacher--does absolutely nothing to relieve it! One day, this little girl will be an old woman and still vividly remember, with bitterness, her hour of humiliation. I am usually of the opinion that American children are being weakened by ever-present philosophy that they are so "special" that no negative word should ever be uttered in their direction, lest it hurt their feeling. But this was ridiculous! You don't deliberately set up anyone for humiliation....let alone a child! In American society,this is commonly considered BAD! It reminded me of the time in Chinese history when adults were made to wear dunce caps and public humiliation was a common form of punishment for trivialities. While it is true some adults do engage in such things, imagine the public reaction to a US teacher who "set someone up" like that! Bad things do happen, but they are not considered the "goal"!
And yes, I feel fully justified in critisizing the Chinese. No one thinks twice about criticizing the US. I am an American: I state my opinion and this is what I think.
I am saddened by some of the comments that clearly show a profound lack of knowledge about both the basis of the American democratic system and common practices w/i US society. Yes--politics is usually a dirty business. (A business carried on by adults, not children.) BUT...the "dirt" of politics is not held up to young people as the ideal to strive for; it's not something to be proud of! It's scorned and lamented by the majority of Americans. I am a substitute teacher in an urban school district and as unbelievable as it often seems, concepts of respect, compassion and forgiveness are still the goal of most classrooms. (If you think this is a failing goal, give a good look to the type of adults so many children are going home to!) And to those Americans who think US democracy began...and/or will end with the disasterous Bush years...these are 8 years out of 200+ years of US democracy...and we're still using basically the same Constitution! We are a success story...dirty politics notwithstanding! China has no such firm foundation on which to build a democracy. And democracy is dead or dying? A convenient cliche for those too lazy to actively participate in its ongoing development. To them, I quote Cheng Cheng: "Quiet!"
I must respectfully disagree with Courtnay.
Scientific study of human development finds that trauma in childhood is detrimental. Alice Miller talks about the "enlightened witness", and describes the damage experienced by children that are helpless bystanders (and their feelings of guilt for not acting to stop cruelty), as well as the direct participants and victims of abuse.
In childhood, the child's brain not has completed the task of being fully "wired". There simply has not been enough time, so children operate with only partial brain development. (See Piaget's work.)
Neuro-connections that are most used are the ones that will remain strongest. This means that the results of this type of schooling will be adults that have been programmed to be ruthless, not necessarily best prepared and adapted for an adulthood "together".
If you kick and mistreat a puppy, it will become a mean dog that can not be trusted. Of course children are not puppies, but hopefully this simple analogy can help illuminate the situation.
For children to become healthy adults that can fully participate in a democracy, expectations must meet children's actual abilities for functionality, NOT imposed adult themes.
Hopefully adults of all nations will become aware of the needs of our children and more proficient in providing appropriate learning experiences and limits.
With population and pollution concerns looming in the future of all people, we need to be raising the next generations to be problem solvers and innovators, not more cruel, manipulative and ethically void.
Unfortunately, this is not happening anywhere on the planet to any great extent, so God help us all.
I believe "Class Monitor" is not an accurate translation.
It should be "Class Leader or Manager" based on "Ban" or class and "Jang" chief/manager/leader. Another definition is "Classroom President".
Sadly the even the 9 year olds clearly recognize that one with connection or "Guan Zi" in Chinese and bit of bribery wins the election. But it's true reflection of China where connection and bribery will get you to where you desire to be.
This was one of the most outstanding programs I've seen to date about China. It seems that no matter what culture, race or religion one belongs to human nature is indifferent to all of it. Too bad it has to be so brutally impulsive at times but I guess that's the real world. I wonder how the children who lost the election will benefit from their experience. The support from the parents was notable. Its no different from coaching in little league or having a parent who is a school teacher. I think that the best lesson learned here for children and adults is that it's not what you say but how you say it that gets the best results.
This was an outstanding look at the power of education in China--many small things--the student erasing the board for the teacher, the sense of discipline in spite of the youth of the kids, the high expectations for public speaking--our educational system would have a lot to learn from this film, and I hope teachers all over the U.S. will view and discuss it.
Beautiful film.Congratulations! Watching the film, remind me of my country: Mexico, where the candidates give you groceries, gifts, etc. They give away a lot of stuff to buy your vote. Last year in the little town where I was born, the best looking candidate won. He was well educated but hundreds of women vote for him because the looks. How funny is that?And we are adults. Sometimes democracy is a dirty game.
I love the kids in the film, they are adorable.Watching them campaigning and using the faults of the opponents made me think about BUSH and KERRY.
AMAZING! Please give us more.
I found this to be a fascinating documentary & commend & thank the film makers for producing it. I have visited in several schools across China & did find them to be very controlling in their approach to education; therefore I agree with an earlier comment that it was nice to see that the students were given an opportunity to 'think for themselves', although this proved very difficult & painful for some of the children (slander, shouting, tears!... in an elementary school election- come on!!). I was saddened by the rude tactics of both Cheng Cheng & Lao, but realized that parallel tactics take place in our own elections. The most disturbing part of the film was the type of counsel the parents were giving their children- a 'win at all cost' theology with the reward being the power to 'boss people around' & punish those who step out of line. Too much pressure, too much competition! Scary! These children barely get to be kids. Gratefully in the States we do have the right & responsibility to voice our opinions without fear of punishment, and the privelege to get involved & make changes. This film showed us a picture of 'democracy- China style'; taking democracy & putting it into a communist mold~ good luck with that.
Chinese children are being taught how to behave in the world, accomplishing the necessary techniques adults need to be successful. This documentary is a powerful representation of the speed at which Chinese children are learning invaluable concepts compared to American children. The deindividualized culture of the Chinese teaches social strategies so they can better adapt in the world, together.
I would just like to thank the director and all those involved in making this film to prove how much we liked it.
Outstanding!
Why is class monitor or "BanJang" position such a big deal in China and other parts in Asia including Korea?
It's an honor as "best student" and appointed/elected to this position. Parents will lobby the teacher and kids in vain attempts as it really is an honor extended to parents as well. It becomes parents' fight as much as their kid.
It's common to bribe the kids by giving gifts, host parties, donate expensive items to class, etc. Often outright cash to the teacher is accepted via thick envelope since the teacher in many ways can subtly and/or out right influences the outcome of the election.
I wish the producer showed more of the lone girl who ran against the 2 boys. Often there is "vice" class monitor and girl is picked for such position in Korea.
It's a fantastic show. Kudos to the producer and the director!
Democracy, no matter how imperfect it is, it's far better than autocracy. Yielding to power tends to be a human weakness, but love of freedom is also in human nature. The tricky part is to choose 'who' to represent 'us'. How do we really know those people who want to be in powerful positions are for love of (serving) people or for love of power? Even if he/she loves people, is he/she going to serve his/her 'own' people or the majority of people?
What a lost of innocence for those kids who went through this election in the film? I hope American parents won't subject their kids to such realities at young age. Keep on teaching kids things like creativity, independent thinking, sharing, respecting others and fear of God.
Paul Guo is right on:
"Min, regarding to your question. If you think back to the show and recall the positions held by each student's parents, you will remember that Luo Lei's father is the local police director. As most people know, if a person wants to reach a certain position within the the communist controlled agencies, manipulations have to occur."
I was glued to this documentary of "kids play" because it reflected today's PRC. Sadly even the 9 year olds recognize the power of connection or in Chinese "GuanZi". Bribery is also commonly used and often involves other than passing the envelope filled with cash.
Is this democracy? Yes, it's considered democracy in many non-western parts of the world. It's just that our perception of democracy is different.
Isn't this manipulation? No, accepted especially in the Asian culture and ever "entertaining" Asian politics.
Lastly KUDOS to producers for this documentary which both adult and child in my family found to be gripping filled with real human drama.
I think one of the most meaningful parts of the film took place in the beginning, when the teacher announced three candidates had been chosen by teachers at the school, and that this was what democracy was. Democracy with Chinese characteristics, indeed.
This was not a case of the type of "parental involvement" that teachers hope for in America. (Chen Chen's mother wrote his speech FOR him!) These parents have only ONE child...so children are over-parented (which is just as destructive as the polar opposite of neglect). Over parenting and neglect are both negative extremes, and the child's true nature and potential is destroyed.
While certainly there is corruption in government in the United States, the difference is that here it is ILLEGAL and prosectuted, not celebrated and encouraged in our children!
The people that think we should teach our children harsh realities must not realize that the proven result of tormenting young people is the development of a criminal mind. Children do not learn integrity, self-discipline, self-control or effective problem solving through cruelty and humiliation.
These children were being taught psychological warfare. One could easily see these children grow to become leaders that could write policies to break the will of their people while stifling opposition, simply for their own personal and political gain.
Consider that democracy is not an American concept and that even in the US the form of democracy we have today with women and minorities in the electorate, the enormous influence of lobbying groups and special interests, and the immense advantage of the incumbancy is something that our forefathers would not have recognized. Remembering the evolution of our own democracy and in the age of hanging chads, let us not assume that our own system is so perfect that we are so quick to criticize everyone else.
Bottom line, democracy is a political concept and not an ideal, different societies will implement it as they see fit, and given the alternative of dictatorial communism in China or religious facism in the Middle East and Israel we should be encouraged that even at the youngest levels of society, Democracy is being embraced in China.
If the honest image of the hardnuckle campaigning on the part of idealistic children in the film was uncomfortable for viewers, perhaps they would have been more "comfortable" with scene more alike a typical jaded American classroom where the candidates sleepwalk through the process, the entire thing is taken as a joke, and everyone involved would rather be sitting at home on the couch playing video games and eating Cheetos
For me, as an older person I was struck at the common elements of this film throughout cultures. In a more idealistic time, class president and hall monitor were enormous honors in America as well and I can well remember lollipops wrapped with campaign slogans as "bribes" and children rehearsing speeches (with the help from) parents.
it was a very good documentary and it showed me a whole different culture and it was very interesting to see these young kids debate. they all had very good pionts and i was surpised to see the parents so involved. i've never seen such dedication in the younger people.
This is my answers/views/opinions for some who found this film too shocking!
In China, parents are extremely involved their children's studies - to a point where in Westerners' eyes would seem oppressive and abusive. Did these kids use dirty and negative tactics - yes - but that's not too far off from the political campaigns we see here. However, the main point to keep in mind is that although viewers here might see this as the seeds of democracy being planted in this new generation - I bet you that the parents and students only see this as one big class assignment...that they have to WIN, and therefore ethics is not of primary concern.
(The Chinese school system is highly competitive and expensive. It do well in life means to be at the top of the class at all times.)
I don't really like the connotation of surveillance that comes with the term "class monitor." I would equate that with the position of class representative. Of course, in the States, being a class representative is not a big deal at all - you go to a few meetings and maybe make some annoucements. Being a class monitor immediately portrays you as a model student who knows better and so everyone can look up at them. The bullying aspect and think is more in the case of the candidate Luo Lie - I really don't think that's typically the case.
My bottom line - even though I was even disgusted at how the kids and parents schemed and manipulated - I am glad to see the Chinese school system branching outside of the typical "read and memorize" education method and conducting more activities of "applied knowledge."
"In the beginning of the film, it was mentioned that in the democracy process, "it is a little dirty". Does anyone have comment on how manipulative some kids are and be disturbed by the way some parents behave?"
Min, regarding to your question. If you think back to the show and recall the positions held by each student's parents, you will remember that Luo Lei's father is the local police director. As most people know, if a person wants to reach a certain position within the the communist controlled agencies, manipulations have to occur. What bothers me the is the fact that the teacher in the class allowed such dirty plays appear, especially at the end of the election when all three students were allowed a fair chance to give a speech, but Luo Lei was able to pass out gifts to each student which should have been blocked by the teacher. It is true that politics are dirty, but when children are taught about democracy, it should have been pure. Obviously Luo Lei's father has the most economical access and political experience, but the teacher should have controlled the environment in which the election was been held. I went to elementry school in the region of Xinjiang and I can greatly relate to those students and the "rules" made up by the class monitor which is a pointless ideal in the first place; which allows for more manipulation and abuse. This show shows the roots of authoritarian rule in China. Children are been taught to enforce strict rule when others disobey even with the use of force. I hope this would be broadcasted in China, but again if the Communist China allowed democracy, Tiananmen Square massacre would have never occured.
Fine reflection of REAL China - government connection and bribes...
Lanky lad got elected based on:
1. Government connection - Dad and mom work for "GongAn" or police.
2. Bribes - Handing off envelopes even it contains no money.
Nice train ride too and show off that your dad can pull that off via connection and bureaucratic influence.
My daughter and I both thought Cheng Cheng was going to win but nah his dad is only engineer and so much for better campaigning and speech.
An amazing documentary, just amazing.
In particular, the emotions, changes of allegiances and posturing reminded me very much of the major elections I see in the United States.
Human nature truly is not only universal across cultures, but ages as well.
Thank you for creating this documentary.
Paul asked "why that show was so gripping? I don't understand it. I could not turn away after watching the first few minutes."
I believe that it would be difficult for any responsible adult to look away. While it was terrible, it was also reality. In a democracy culture, it is the responsibility of each individual to part of an informed electorate. This was definitely new information.
The children in this documentary where emotionally overwhelmed by their own cruelty. The fact that their cruelty, corruption and lack of compassion was promoted and even fine-tuned by the adults is vile. We were watching the training of evil genius and child abuse, while suggested that it is wonderful progress. It was similar to watching a documentary about children soldiers or slaves, as their captors tell us of their positive treatment.
While I want to be informed of what is REALLY happening in the world, my sincere hope is that NO FILMMAKER ever puts children in this type of situation solely for entertainment value or awards.
I also wanted to say that I think that the little girl cried because she was caught completely off guard by the severity of her classmates, not because she was weak. I do not believe that ANYONE could have performed well under those circumstances. The boys also cried deeply during the course of the film.
The human is an amazing being, capable of both wonderful and horrendous acts.
It is self defeating for humanity to raise its children up in the latter.
Having spent this last summer educating students in junior and senior middle school in China, I must say that I found this documentary to be shocking and disturbing. While I did not experience any of this type of behavior and attitudes, its to be sure I did not have a 'true grit' representation of reality either. What I can attest to is that the themes we used to educate -- individual uniqueness, achieving one's dreams, cooperating with others, trust and honesty, overcoming limitations and obstacles, and working through problems with others using forgiveness and reconciliation are concepts that are not taught by teachers and are concepts that they are largely unfamiliar with. They understand the concepts readily, they just didn't seem to know that such were available to them. There was conveyed on occasion an underlying sense of discontent with the current system and prospects for a successful future, with so many people competing so vigorously for so few opportunities. What the film also didn't convey (and could not really) is the vast differences across the country among the various community settings. Even smaller urban areas were quite familiar with western culture and technology, while even slightly more rural areas have never seen a western face, know little of western technology or society and are taught that western ideas (such as democracy) are to be feared and rejected.
I thought the program was very interesting on some of the ways of teaching kids democracry. I did not like the part where the parents of Luo Lei were bribing the students by taking them on a trip and giving them gifts so that their son would win. This is not a good practice to teach kids about democracy. They should win on their debates and their values. It was a good start but more needs to be learned about democracy.
This film is a very harsh indictment of democracy. Were the children really better off electing their "class monitor?" One has to wonder if the Chinese government intended the film as an indictment of Western-style elections and campaigning. If so, they scored a direct hit. The behavior of the children candidates mirrored that of real adult politicians in so many ways as did the behavior of the school electorate.
This was just so hilarious... I like the fact that the teacher did not intervene as much in the process, let it be an experience. I think, right after the election, would be the most oportune time to go into a discussion of fairness, and a light history lesson in democracy, maybe composition and comprehension around various leaders, the children will take it to heart. This could have been a private Upper West Side School...
And wow talk of parental involvement!!! Looking at the parents lining up around the playground.
This show is so inspiring for our kids. However, my niece was not comfortable with the fast reading which the sub-titles required. I wish I can get the DVD or VHS to buy. I'll get it voiced-over if possible.
This was an excellent documentary on the topic of democracy. It has many layers of significance: perspective of democracy through the lens of 3rd graders (kids in general), a clever way of introducing/infusing complex democratic principles to a populace against shoving down the throat of an inflexible demography(the adults), child development when treating them as matured individuals, social interactions of children in a school environment, glimpses of positive signs of transformation of a country of significance whose shape and form of development has direct consequences on the world around us, the commonality of family values between the populace of two corners of the world, glimpse of the wonderful love for one's kids, parents and friends that is universal (the failed candidates' friends crying was an extraordinary moment)
Can someone explain to me why that show was so gripping? I don't understand it. I could not turn away after watching the first few minutes.
In the beginning of the film, it was mentioned that in the democracy process, "it is a little dirty". Does anyone have comment on how manipulative some kids are and be disturbed by the way some parents behave?
I watched it with two of my children, ages 12 and 16, and we all enjoyed the film immensely. We talked about it long afterwards. It is a wonderful look into a Socialist culture's view of what democracy is (with obvious parental and teacher influence). The children had a deep emotional involvement in the whole process and we laughed and cried along with them. Hopefully this experiment is a spark that gets this young generation thinking (us included). I can't wait to watch it again!
I watched this film in disbelief. I found it shocking on SO MANY levels!
First and foremost, I could not believe that young CHILDREN were being ENCOURAGED by the adults (teachers and parents) to be so completely CORRUPT (to slander their opponents, shamelessly buy votes, manipulate the electorate, etc.) It begs the question that if the children are TAUGHT to be so corrupt, what kind of adults in government can they expect? Where were the ETHICS?!!!
Second, I could not believe that a position of "class monitor" even exists! Why does the teacher need someone to bully other children into compliance? Is it democratic to vote for the person that will take away your rights?
Third, it was interesting to see the family dynamic of having only one child, where adults poured so much time and energy into one person, and giving them such an adult perspective at their young age. I found it very sad to see children so manipulative, disrespectful, and self absorbed.
In the end however, the truth in democracy is that you get what you vote for. Even though in this particular election the children might have fallen for bribes, their faces showed horror as soon as they realized their mistake. Next time they will not be so easily fooled. In democracy, there is the ability to have some power over your own destiny, to grow in wisdom, to suffer the consequences of your own mistakes, and to work toward a better tomorrow.
"Chinese schooling" the lessons for democracy may seem contradictory. But it is not.
Democracy has paralell in balance & beam physics. And the mechanism of the balance and fulcrum must be hewn true to within a reasonable margin for significance.
Only with a reasonably hewn balance may you next measure the weights of people's one veiw versus another.
Democracy is the weighing of one Politic versus the other . . . the standard of measurment is
important along with civilized adherance and acceptance of result. I think that can only be accomplished by inculcating broadly based public support. If "Chinese schooling gets a people their balance & beam along with adherance to reslutant . . . it will have served Democracy's purpose - I hope.
Consider the etymology of the word: demos mean the people, and cracy means rule by; therefore democracy means rule by the people. The hard part is to have REAL rule by the people rather than some communistic sham such as we see in China.
Democracy allows for the voices and beliefs of the majority to be heard when implemented in a just and proper manner. Democracy is a system that allows the current and popular feelings of the moment to be manifested by the choices of a group or society although that belief may not be whats "right" for them. Please vote for me portrays the tactics and methods used by adults worldwide - and I think that is why its such a thought provoking film. It shows "us" in these children. Ruthless and cut-throat - until someone or something yells, "Quiet !!!"
I lived in the same city as in the documentary and it's nice to know what's happened since I was in grade school in China. (moved to North America when I was 7)
Being a originally mandarin speaker, I understood certain gags that made us laugh out loud when we watched this.
China is going to take time to become democratic, the evolution might be just a tiny seed right now, but over a few more decades more freedoms will be granted to the people to the point where China evolves from Communism to Democracy. There were far less freedoms in the decades past and that has evolved into the freedoms the Chinese people enjoy today.
This is a comment directed to the content of the film presented, and not the question posed by the site, but is rather a discussion about concepts regarding Democracy that they film posed to the viewer.
I believe it is important to remember that, while China has embraced the free market to a certain extent, it has yet to politically embrace Democracy as a valid form of government. The current revolution is an econimic one, and not a political one. There is still only one politcal party in China, and it is a party that has a long history based in part on a rejection of Democracy.
I believe that a valid perspective of this film would be to view it as a piece of propoganda against the concept of Democracy. The film picked as its target group of subjects- children, which is appealing as a subject, but is not a true referendum on democracy, as the children are divorced from any substance in their chioce. The choosing of a Hall Monitor, is comparable to the chosing of a minor beauracratic official who will be themselves monitored by the real authority, the teachers and faculty. Children lack the full faculty to gauge the impact of their choice and the long run consequences. Certainly, I will allow that from their frame of reference the choice is significant, but it is the very limitation of their frame of reference that makes the experiment so limited in its scope.
That said, it does highlight some of the traditional and well documented problems that occur with a democracy, and with one of our most American of values, that being our love of competition and its naturally occuring value: to win at all costs. This idea is destroying a proud legacy of athletics in the United States, whereby our atheletes who stand to gain multi million dollar salaries see no real dis-incentive to the use of performance enhacing drugs. The "win at any cost" mentality is corroding the virtues of many of our democratic institutions. Every parent in the film seemed most concerned not on the lessons their children would learn by the process, but on the absolute necessity to win. I believe this to be a thoroughly institutionalized Chinese viewpoint of what United States parents are like, and is a bit of a mockery, rather than an honest depiction of Chinese parents.
I think it's stunning how all the elements of the American democratic process are captured here. You have the strong newcomer, starting out with a promising campaign. You have the power of the incumbency, even if not everyone was happy with the job the incumbent did. You have rough'n'tumble negative politics, with the negative attacks on the incumbent (Obama, take note here). You have press-the-flesh person-to-person campaigning. The only negative is some of the parents were a little bit too involved - directing their kids on what to say.
I thought this movie was very interesting and I was very drawn to the children's ideas and opinions through out the whole election.. it was great seeing how these little children reacted during the debates, they had very strong rebuttals and logical questions..And most important, they were actually very committed to the election. It was very exciting to watch! To me democracy is a form of government and freedom of speech which allows the people to make a decisions for their country or people.
As in this country, putting down your opponent is encouraged by seemly everybody, parents and students alike. The one attempt at a positive policy, being equals, not a dictator, was minimized as being a style issue (Luo Lei was a pro). The coup de grace was giving gifts. Bribes are illegal here.
Still, I can't see any country being a true democracy. There has to be a republic or parliament. It looks like a dictator in the making.
I think democracy is a wonderful and nobel idea. One of the better ideas of human kind. Unfortunately, it's very suseptible to corrupt human nature and it will eventually fail. The powerful and wealthy who have influence over career politiceans will usually have thier way over the will of the people.
Nothing is new under the sun. Everything goes in cycles and I believe we are now reverting back to where very few control very many. A world wide, corporate feudal system, if you will.
It was nice while it lasted, the democracy experiment that is-- as much as it did. Remember, black people were still being segregated and lynched in this country while we were putting people in space. We thought we were so advanced as we reached to the stars. It remains disgraceful black mark against our "the city on the hill".
On a lighter note, your film was fantastic!! Absolutely first rate. The children were marvelous and adorable- notwithstanding being naughty or sometimes mean.
I'm a big Xiofei fan, now. What a sweet and beautiful child.
Love your show,
Phx,AZ.
The kids were precious and the story in general was very entertaining. I cared about, and wanted to see what would become of the candidates. I was drawn in and ultimately not disappointed. I think I learned something, too.
Chinese people, at least in the film, are unburdened by self conciousness. So called democracy in China is about what it is here. Is it any wonder the planet is headed for the meat grinder? All that hoopla and fanfare and they elected Bush again! I don't know why I let it bother me. The MAJORITY of six billion don't let it bother them.
Democracy is a government by the people. Supreme power is vested in the people and exercised by them or by elected agents under a free electoral system. My definition of democracy is freedom to voice your ideas and vote for leadership. I have so much to say about the video. I will only make a few remarks. I was interested in watching it because I have studied three leadership styles in my sociology class and we discussed leadership roles in the book, Lord of the Flies. Luo Lei would be the authoritarian leader. He was called a dictator by Cheng Cheng in the debate. I wanted to believe Luo Lei when he said he wanted to change his ways if they are wrong. Cheng is a democratic leader. He said he wanted to make himself equal to his classmates and have discussions to gain a consensus. In my opinion, Xu Xiaofei would be a laissez-faire leader. One that is passive. She didn’t stand up for herself when the class made fun of her before she could perform her talent. A laissez-faire leader gives almost total freedom to the people to do what they wished. I thought that Luo Lei won the majority vote because he used bribery. I thought Cheng Cheng was too confident about being the class monitor that he said he was not afraid of God. I am careful when it comes to picking a leader because not everyone will do what they say. Cheng showed authoritarian leadership when he asked one boy to stop looking out the window. He yelled at the class to be quite but he should of told the class when they have something to say than the hand should be raised. I liked how Cheng never used forced on his classmates. It is a difficult decision to pick leaders because they all have faults. I did enjoyed watching the video and observing their behaviors.
Democracy will exist if people allow it. Ask you're self these two questions, what's the supreme law of the land? And, how did it come about?
Absolutely wonderful. If Cheng Cheng is not a modern pol, with his dirty politics, operational research and debating skills, I don't know who is. We need more docs like this. Kudos to the producers.
Just to show you that even in a democracy, if you can buy votes you are guarantied to win.
The Chinese educators, as well as many Americans obviously never heard of the great Swiss Psychologist (1896 - 1980) who studied tens of thousnds of children's mental development. The outcome of his extensive studies have resulted in a sort of a scale to show at which chronological age the children are ready to absorb, understand and synergize different concepts, behaviors or tasks. If the children are pushed to act on a concept for which they psychologically or mentally are not ready, they may become devastatingly insecure in their future, and will act in a way that is morally, at best, not acceptable. It makes you wonder what kind of up-bringing the unscrupulous businessmen and politicians had. This Chinese experiment in democracy is obviously done to and with children who are mentally and psychologically not old enough to go through a mean-spirited competition as we have seen in this film.
I found it interesting in this film how the one set of parents encouraged their child to buy the votes and the parents of Cheng Cheng encouraged him to talk about the desired role of the monitor. Because the whole idea of voting is new to this population I found it especially interesting that buying votes seems to be a universal successful technique.
Democracy does not exist, it is just an illusion where people vote for a party. If the party in power is making incorrect choices in place of the people, then the party that will win is the opposition party. There is no basis on what type of party they are, just the choice of who will screw you over less. With each party, they have their goals and the majorities voice is never really heard. Like all democracies, on the surface it seems all fine and dandy, but in reality it is all based on lies and deception. In truth a democracy is a dictatorship in which you get to vote who will make your life less messed up.
On top of everything else, the people that vote do not really know all the issues and base their vote on what they are told and not what information they have gathered themselves. For instance, the liberal party is going to decrease tax, whoop freaking doo with the .5 percent sales tax taken off. Get rid of the f'ing GST. There was a reason why GST was put in place, but there is no longer a need for it. Notice the surplus' we keep getting in BC.
I was amazed at the dedication and maturity that this lesson taught these students. They were so dedicated and it brought them all together and brought their families together. Also, the most memorable line in the film was when the teacher told the students to really think about their vote because voting is sacred. VOTING IS SACRED. Wow.
I bet the students will remember this lesson forever and they will also realize when the incumbent won, that if he keeps beating them, they won't accept a little give like a card as a way to convince them to vote again.
The extent to which these children were pushed and encouraged by their parents was scary and amazing. While one mother (of Cheng Cheng) seemed to want him to stand on his own merits and indeed understood the concept of democracy, it was disheartening to see the parents of the winner push him to use tactics one would hope never to see, especially in children, and indeed in my eyes "buy" the election. This film taught me a lot about Chinese culture. The worst aspects of democracy were portrayed, belittling your opponent; attempting to create negative impressions; what we now deem "dirty politics".
I tuned in late, so I didn't know that this was filmed in China. All the while I was thinking that this must be Japan or perhaps Thailand. I was stunned to find out that this was allowed in China. I was stunned because I have always believed that their government was super pro-active in subverting democracy. STUNNING!!!
Things that I noticed that I find note-worthy:
The handkerchiefs they wore about their necks reminded me of boyscouts.
The winner of the election appeared to hold up a symbol that reminded me of the star of David. (this symbol means different things to different cultures; to me, it represents the divine perfection of the universe)
The exercise program reminded me of boot camp.
The children, at times, appeared to march. (Training wheels for the military?)
The children seemed very free to display emotion. Crying. Hugging. I never thought of Asian people as emotional. I suppose as they grow older they, like us, do not display these emotions publicly? There was no shame in crying. That impressed me.
The parent involvement was impressive. Though, I felt that perhaps they were yet young to be driven so hard to compete. Parents here, at least where I am, are not that involved.
The children demonstrated an extremely astute understanding of democracy. This must have been handed down by their parents. These are the children of the Tianeman Square era. It makes me cry, though, I hide from people when I cry. This is the bravest thing... the freedom to cry. Again, I am stunned.
I was also stunned by the use of the words such as: dictator, manager, and even FACIST! Wow!
I thought Cheng Cheng ran the most clever campaign.
Loa Leou (spelling sorry) provided the most order.
but I would have voted for the female Xu Xeou (spelling sorry).
I expected Cheng Cheng to win and was surpised when he didn't. He's sharp.
Thank you for airing the film "Vote for Me." I was enthralled with the story and the children. But I also questioned the extent of its authenticity. Was the story partly staged? Why were there no rules to the debate? There was so little structure to the experience of the election. True, the democratic process is messy and often unfair as exhibited in divisive actions such as shouting down another candidate or giving presents out to influence voters. Nevertheless, I would have thought the teacher would have set up more boundaries so the children could engage in a good discussion about what it means to be a class monitor. Instead, the children were allowed to continually attack on each other and divide the class. I was disturbed by the teacher's lack of intervention in these nonproductive scenes. Isn’t a classroom a place to model the best behavior possible? I was also disturbed by the parents pushing their children into adult roles. Perhaps because I am a teacher I could see a more purposeful and structured experience about how we all struggle to discuss our views with each other, our definitions of different roles, how to agree or disagree with each other, and how to agree to disagree; all part of a democratic process. Is this a scripted film about the ills of democracy or an honest unstructured experiment? Thank you.
Dispite what anyone says, there is no perfect form of government. The best we humans can do (being imperfect ourselves) is to have a system that tries as much as humanly possible to be inclusive, responsive, and accessible to the governed.Democracy is about the will and well-being of the people and their ability to have a say in such matters.
great documentary. you get to see corruption at that "level," just imagine reality.
"Democracy is the worst form of government, except for all those other forms that have been tried from time to time."
Sir Winston Churchill
Democracy is the sense of idealism to contribute to the ongoing maintence and evolution of the community, the humility to realize that one does not have all the answers, and hopefully the tolerance of individual differences in a wide variety of spheres.
The kids were adorable, but what's up with the rattails?
Experimentation and children should never be used in the same sentence. I applaud the efforts to teach 8 year-old children in China about democracy, but at what cost? The election placed too much pressure on children who were too young and without the cognition to handle the stress. Did I mention the kids in the film were 8 year olds?
I watched in amazement as small children were encouraged by parents and teachers to scheme, connive, slander, and attack their opponents. Why would anyone want to subject their children to a competition in which all that was important was victory, at the expense of all moral responsibility?
Let me just say that these kids were so adorable and intelligent. At eight years old they knew the difference between a dictator and a fascist! I did not catch this program from the beginning but from what I saw I found it amazing that democracy seems to be the same whether you are a small child to an adult. They even managed to engage in the shadier side of democracy in shelling out dirty politics (i.e finding personal faults in opponents) as well as buying votes. Democracy to me means everyone having a voice and using the principle of self control to adhere to the majority yet having the common sense and freedom to veer when the majority strays from the course healthy to the people. However, democracy is not always fair, the only true fairness is that it exists.
I thought the film was great, but again, defining the word "Deomocracy" is like trying to capture smoke in your hands. While the film itself was very telling, I thought a number of points were vital, the key being that the "Gift giving" child won. While this is very telling, it appears that Western Democracy is easily understood...Bribery, corruption, and the true buying of votes appears to be alive in China as well as in the US. Does the idea of true "Campaign finance" reform resonate with anyone?
Should have been a study in a constitutional republic. Remember those days? Ahh...now all we hear is the sound of bankers crushing souls for material that should be a fundamental human right.
Anyways, this show was AWESOME! Funniest thing I've seen in a while. Thanks PBS, for putting on shows that are worth watching.
I found it interesting that the encumbent won by an overwhelming majority. This despite the fact that the children seemed to dislike his authoritative style. Could this be becuase they are taught to inherently respect authority? Cheng Cheng was very articulate and quick on his feet and I thought surely the children would vote for change. Then again, it seemed that the children could indeed have been bought off, lol. I also felt it interesting that the little girl's speech was more of an entreaty, I will work hard for you, I will try hard. I do not recall her asking directly for the vote (though I could have missed this) and she was not assertive at all. It seemed clear to me that after the election, when the teacher spoke of the value of the experience, the children seemed to shake their heads in contradiction. I almost felt that this may have temporarily damaged them a bit, but then, I am always concerned when children are put into very competitive situations. I would imagine that this may be more of an alienating experience for these kids because their culture is not really based on competitiveness the way ours is. I do believe that this U.S. obsession with competition and the individual may not be the best thing for us as a Country or individually. I very much enjoyed this film.
Democracy (my definition) is a political system in which the government can be held responsible by the people and where every person has a right to express their satisfaction/distaste with the government via the vote. I think the greatest weakness of Democracy is the tendency for those in power to attempt to manipulate the voting process through methods like voter intimidation or ballot stuffing. Barring that, any prolonged malfeasance in governance is implicitly approved of by the people.
The contrast between those in power in China and those in power in most democracies is striking.
Highest education of last 4 US presidents and last 3 Chinese presidents:
USA
George W. Bush - MBA from Princeton
Bill Clinton - law degree from Yale
George Bush - BS in economics from Yale
Ronald Reagan - BA's in economics and sociology from Eureka College
China
Hu Jintao - BS in hydraulic engineering from Tsinghua University (it and Beijing University are the best schools by far in China)
Jiang Zemin - BA in electrical engineering from Jiaotong University (first Chinese leader that graduated from college)
Deng Xiaoping - started graduated from a prep school at 15 whereupon he went on a work-study trip to France where he worked as everything from a metalworker to a fireman.
Wow! Democracy in a communist country. Now there's a strech. My heart aches for the children. Yes, children. This was not a place for democracy, but compassion. How sad that the parents were coaching children to beat down their opponents instead of emphasising their own personal strengths. So typical of true democracy today in America. Just so sad to see this display among children. I'm glad my adopted daughter, from Wuhan, is no longer subject to such a cruel way of teaching children. This reality of democracy will come soon enough for her at a more appropriate age.
Democracy means that everyone ideas,thoughts,and suggestions matter or can contrubute to a hole...It means the freedom to go an,return to any country you want,And to work in any country you want..As long as you met to their laws..It means you are not juged by others....And you do not juged them...It means respect,and being respected...It means honor...It means marrying who you want,regardless of race....It lead to freedom,It means freedom...maybe hope for world peace....
Of course the DICTIONARY say:
1.goverment by the people,either directly or through elected representatives.
2.a country,state,ect.with such a goverment.
3.majority rule.
4. the acceptance and practice of the principle of equality of rights,opportunity,and treatment.
5. example..the Democratic Party of the U.S.,or the principls of this party.
Was the film a critique of democracy in general, democracy in America, or the notion of democracy in China? In any case, the film was shocking in terms of the level of recklessness on the part of adults involved in exposing young children to unnecessary humiliation and emotional abuse.
What is the result, Patrick?-----I enjoyed hosting a screening event for PLEASE VOTE FOR ME in Seattle where the theatre audience all voted along with the class. The results were surprising
I wonder what the outcome would have been if Luo Lei hadn't bribed the class at the last minute. He may still have won, but I suspect the margin would have been much smaller. Watching this film only increased my respect for the Chinese people. Although I love America and what we stand for, you see that even at a young age, they are training their children for the harsher realities of "the real world," whereas in our society we focus on things like using your imagination, sharing, and accepting that others are different. It's an interesting divide!
This is a fabulous show about 8-year olds running for Class Monitor in a Chinese School and the inability of their parents to let them be themselves. It is extraordinarily honest and occasionally heartbreaking. Thank you.
Democracy is a illusion just as any religion. What comes out of true "vote" can never be the best becoz majority of people are not "the best", just the majority ... Most human civilization has been achieved without it, and I can't see how is can benefit any nation ... I agree democracy to some degree, at some places, is very good --- but overrate it as a saver to any problem is just too much (just like religion) ... there are many many serious problems in the world just can't be solved by democracy.
Democracy means adherence to orderly , lawful principles, laws and elements of a constitution by the people for the people.
I enjoyed hosting a screening event for PLEASE VOTE FOR ME in Seattle where the theatre audience all voted along with the class. The results were surprising, and it lead to quite a spirited discussion following the film. You've gotta watch this movie with a bunch of friends. You're going to want to talk about afterward!
To me democracy means that everyone's ideas matter. Of course, not everyone's voice is given equal weight and importance, but I think it's up to individuals to be responsible for making themselves heard.