Visit Your Local PBS Station PBS Home PBS Home Programs A-Z TV Schedules Watch Video Donate Shop PBS Search PBS
Photo of Bill Moyers Bill Moyers Journal
Bill Moyers Journal
Bill Moyers Journal
Watch & Listen The Blog Archive Transcripts Buy DVDs

« Buying the War, Again? | Main | Impeachment: The Conversation Continues »

Poll: Civil Liberties and National Security

Constitutional scholar, Bruce Fein states:

“Most important thing for the American people to know is that the great genius of the founding fathers, their revolutionary idea, with the chief mission of the state is to make you and them free to pursue their ambitions and faculties. Not to build empires, not to aggrandize government. That's the mission of the state, to make them free, chart their own destiny. And the burden is on the government to try to understand why that freedom has to be curtailed for a security purpose or otherwise.”

Photo: Robin Holland

Answer our poll question, then debate the topic below.


TrackBack

TrackBack URL for this entry:
http://blogs.pbs.org/moyers/mt3/mt-tb.cgi/310

Comments

I can't understand why congress hasn't impeached Bush & Cheney.They have done so much harm to the country! Getting us into a war under false pretenses,spying on Americans without a warrant,tax cuts for the rich,increasing the deficit,ignoring climate change, torture in Gitmo and elsewhere, extraodinary rendition. All these and many more, have lowered the country's status in the eyes of the rest of the free world.

Dear Mr. Moyers,
The writers above are so eloquent in their expressions of patriotism. They believe in our form of government and they want our country to function as prescribed in the Constitution. Where is it written that members Congress can skirt the law with narrow interpretations that cover up graft and overt crimes while in office? How can a president claim 'executive privilege' with no explanation how it affects investigations by the peoples representatives, the Congress? Why can members of the Armed Services be cavalierly given death sentences while those who sentenced them have no responsibility, in this case, for an illegal war?

I am so dispirited for our country. How can we look the world in the eye when we are so corrupt?

Dear Mr. Moyers,
The writers above are so eloquent in their expressions of patriotism. They believe in our form of government and they want our country to function as prescribed in the Constitution. Where is it written that members Congress can skirt the law with narrow interpretations that cover up graft and overt crimes while in office? How can a president claim 'executive privilege' with no explanation how it affects investigations by the peoples representatives, the Congress? Why can members of the Armed Services be cavalierly given death sentences while those who sentenced them have no responsibility, in this case, for an illegal war?

I am so dispirited for our country. How can we look the world in the eye when we are so corrupt?

Mr. Moyers,

You are a true American hero and I hope you understand I use the word in its correct and not over-trivialized manner of late. I thank you for having the depth and courage to present us with such fine programming. PBS owes much of my donation dollars to you.

As much as I was amazed at your July 13th program, I was equally frustrated, as it seems we are shouting in a vacuum created by a new press controlled by big money. I feel impeachment, if not executed at this time, may indeed be the continuation of the end of this great experiment in democracy. I only hope that I am wrong and that we are not already too late.

Your commentary last week, however, made me more of a cynic than ever as young republican students gave their soapbox talk on the importance of fighting terror “over there” presumably so they can continue their carefree existence “over here.” Of course, their plans do not ever include the same sacrifice our troops are asked to make.

In that light, I am amazed at the turn in the polls regarding these wars we’ve initiated. Why is it that the polls have gone south? Is it that we have all begun to realize the unethical behavior of our state in its attack and invasion of two sovereign states, one of which having absolutely nothing to do with 911? Could it be the anger we feel toward an administration that not only used intelligence to instigate a war, but furthermore, cherry picked and misrepresented intelligence to justify these wars? Was it the self-realization that if another state had done the same, we would have abhorred the attacking state’s behavior and condemned their action?

No, I think not. The mantra I hear is primarily with regard to the execution of the war: we didn’t go in with enough force, we didn’t have a plan, we didn’t guard the (non oil-related) ministry buildings, we didn’t guard weapon stockpiles, we had too little body armor, we had too few this, too few that, we didn’t this, we didn’t that, we just didn’t. It is as if a murderer were on trial only for the method employed in perpetrating the crime, rather than the act of murder.

We appear as spoiled children impatient in our parents’ progress during a long drive to a Disneyworld that does not exist. We Americans have lost our way somewhere, wrapped in our materialism purchased with poor credit at an impossible interest rate. I endured my own shock-and-awe when I heard a colleague, excited when the war with Iraq seemed imminent, exclaiming with glee how gas prices were now going to drop. Where is the humanity? Maybe it drowned in New Orleans? Very likely as we don’t seem to give any more of a damn for our own people in Louisiana than we do for the Iraqis.

The selfishness and greed that has become so pervasive in this country is reflected in our Congress. I believe the Democrats will not impeach as they selfishly covet the power they hope to gain in 08 if they ride the wave of this Bush/Cheney disaster. Congress has already abrogated its constitutional duty to the American people by cowardly failing to declare war - and then pointing fingers at the failures of an inept executive. It will also fail the constitution if is does not impeach this president and vice president.

Perhaps if the Democrats understand that though I have always voted Democrat, I will no longer be coerced into voting for the lesser of two evils in 08. If impeachment is not initiated, on principal, I WILL NOT VOTE DEMOCRAT! They will have proven to me that they are as self-serving as the republicans from whom they proclaim to be so different. The objective my dear Democrats is not to win elections, it is to uphold the Constitution - even it you loose the fight. To uphold and defend the Constitution is not only their sworn duty; it is also, what those brave men and women are supposedly fighting for.

Mr. Moyers, please continue the good work. I find your program an oasis in a vast sea of Paris Hilton reporting. Thank you! Besides, your continued presence on the air is an indication to me that we still have a fighting chance.

The articles of impeachment against President Clinton appear evermore trivial when compared to the egregious acts of President Bush and his administration.

My letter to Speaker Pelosi


Dear Speaker Pelosi,

Last spring I had the exhilarating honor to sit in the front row as you spoke to the Union of Reform Judaism's Consultation on Conscience. I listened to your moving description of your trip Syria, proud to be a Democrat and exceptionally proud to be a woman from the Bay Area.

Unfortunately, it is no longer pride I feel as I watch the embarrassing procedural gamesmanship that is being played between the White House and Congress. What must the world think of a nation that allows Attorney General Gonzales to remain in office? Why is Congress reduced to splitting legal hairs while ignoring the heart of the Constitution?

I am mostly frustrated by your insistance that "impeachment is off the table." My messages to Congresswoman Eshoo and Senator Feinstein drew responses that reiterate your position, explaining that Congress has important work to do that would be impeded by time-consuming impeachment hearings. It is disappointing that my own legislators, women whom I respect, have forgotten the lessons taught by another Congresswomen three decades ago.

Barbara Jordan, the remarkable scholar from Texas who served on the Rodino Judiciary Committee during Watergate, gave this eloquent speech exactly 33 years ago today http://www.americanrhetoric.com/speeches/barbarajordanjudiciarystatement.htm. She too acknowledged that Congress had a lot to do -- "Appropriations, Tax Reform, Health Insurance, Campaign Finance Reform, Housing, Environmental Protection, Energy Sufficiency, Mass Transportation" -- sadly, the very same problems we're still trying to solve today. But she argued that Congress' bigger task was to question whether the executive branch was impeachable in that they "behave(d) amiss or betray(ed) their public trust."

I believe Congress and our nation won't be able to solve our day-to-day problems until we finally solve the Constitutional problem that remains unresolved since Watergate: what are the bounds of executive privilege. This administration -- whose actions have so diminished us as a nation -- intends to drag the question through the courts. Only Congress can stop this ludicrous charade.

Former Congresswomen Elizabeth Holtzman outlined a path to impeachment that Congress has begun to take (http://www.thenation.com/doc/20070212/holtzman ). The inquiries she recommended last February are underway, but I fear that they will drag on until the election with nothing having been accomplished, the forest lost for the trees.

I encourage you to take Senator Boxer's lead and say that impeachment needs to be put back on the table. Perhaps impeachment of the Attorney General should be the first step in educating Americans about how the Founders provided the people with the power to correct the tragic course our democracy is taking.

Dear Mr, Moyers,

What can we do ?
Where do we start ?
The time I know is NOW.
How do we, The People,
save our country ?

Thank you
for all that you do,
R.A. Chavarria

Here's a copy of an email I sent to Rep. Pelosi. I hope many others also implore her to do her duty. Her email (as Speaker of the House) is AmericanVoices@mail.house.gov

Dear Rep. Pelosi,

I hope you saw Bill Moyer's interview of Bruce Fein and John Nichols a couple weeks ago on public television. If you didn't, I hope you watch Keith Obermann's interview of Mr. Fein tonight on MSNBC TV.

Mr. Fein, an ardent Republican who drafted the articles of impeachment against Bill Clinton, says Mr. Bush and Cheney make Mr. Clinton's transgression look insignificant. He recognizes something many, many citizens also see, but you seem to be blind to: that we are in a constituional crisis that can't be cured simply by waiting for the next presidential elections; that the essence of our constitution and our country requires the Congress to institute impeachment proceedings against Bush and Chene forthwith.

Our country is in grave danger from within and without. Following our constitution by instituting impeachment proceedings will go a long way to mitigating those dangers. America was strong in the past because we were viewed by the world as standing for law and decency. Now we have been greatly weakened by the opposite view.

Please stop worrying about appearances and any possible backlash against Democrats; rather, put your duty and this country first. Americans are not tired of investigations by Congress, but they are frustrated by toothless and thus ineffective investigations.

Please change your mind on this matter. Don't emulate the stubborness of the arrogant fool in the White House who has weakened this country and ignored our rule of law..

Yours very truly,

And to add to the mix of all the abuses, now there is an Executive order signed July 17, 2007 which blocks property of certain purposes who threaten the stabilization of efforts in Iraq - and it is talking about US citizens. Check it out in detail for another wake up call with this administration. What do you think are the ramifications of this?

To all Congressmen (and Senators),

My questions for Congress are pretty simple: Does Congress want to be relegated to total unimportance by an imperial presidency? Does Congress want to see the great experiment of Democracy fail?

If the answer to those two questions is "no," then Congress had better overcome its revulsion at the idea of impeaching the President and the Vice President.

I, a concerned citizen, call on Congress to begin the impeachment process immediately. The evidence of criminal behavior on the part of the Executive and its officers is clear. There is more than enough evidence to justify that proceedings begin. Don't take my word for it, go ahead and read the story for yourself. Read The Constitution in Crisis: The High Crimes of the Bush Administration and a Blueprint for Impeachment, by one of your own, Rep. John Conyers Jr. (D-Mich.). While you're at it, read The Assault on Reason, by Al Gore. You'll find plenty of evidence for the impeachment of Bush-Cheney.

The nation can take it--America won't be "torn apart." We are a strong country. It won't traumatize the country--to the contrary--it will make the country healthy again. It will be the emetic that starts the restorative process. Article II, Section 4, of the Constitution is quite clear: "The President, Vice President and all civil officers of the United States, shall be removed from office on impeachment for, and conviction of, treason, bribery, or other high crimes and misdemeanors." The Founders put that language in the Constitution to protect the country from the abuses of the aforementioned "President, Vice President and all civil officers of the United States."

Article I, Section 2, Paragraph 5 says "The House of Representatives shall choose their speaker and other officers; and shall have the sole power of impeachment."

Did you see the word "sole" in that sentence? Do you understand that it means "only" and "unique" in this context? Only the House can impeach. Americans are counting on you Representatives to do the right thing. ONLY you can do it. If you let us down, your names will live in infamy down the years as cowards.

Congress, I call on you to protect us from a totalitarianism potentially far worse than the Fascist and Communist dictatorships the United States defeated in the 20th century. If Congress doesn't engage, and engage soon, the moment of opportunity to do so will have passed and the country will begin to slide into just such a totalitarian state. It will be a continuance of what is certainly going on right now: the death by a thousand cuts of freedom in the United States of America.

Respectfully and insistently,
Eric Adair Whitney (That's my real name.)

As a couple of people here have wondered, I ask why wasn't Kucinich mentioned? He HAS been pushing for impeachment. Are these intelligent people just skimming through MSM headlines? Kucinich voted against Iraq war to begin with, and he has consistently voted against funding the war (another point that was mentioned in the program) so why didn't he get a mention? Otherwise, this was a great discussion.

You three have obviously confused Dennis Kucinich with chopped liver. What other reason could there be for only the briefest mention of him during your discussion? I'm not surprised the MSM is stonewalling him, but you gentlemen? You do your viewers a disservice.

Mr. Moyers,

Wow.

Thank you, sir. You are so very appreciated by so many of us. I finally got around to watching this one. A podcast would be a great idea.

Yes, the news media have failed us all. We now live in a country where we must dig mighty deep to find real dialogue taking place. I don't watch much TV anymore. But the kids do. Think about what the media are doing to the kids.

It's all so very Orwellian, isn't it?

All I can think of after watching Bill Moyers interviews every week, is the lyrics of a song. "In this world of ordinary people, extraordinary people, I am glad there is you." Thank you, Bill Moyers and staff and PBS for bringing up the issues that all other American journalists are too scared to address. I can't think of anyone else who covers today's news who can be compared to Edward R. Murrow except for you, Bill.

Thank you!

Dear Bill Moyers,

(Getting close to cataract surgery and vision very poor. Please excuse any typos)

Regarding Bush and Cheney (Doofus and Dead-eye Dick), I agree with your guests that impeachment is warranted and that over-reaching executive power should be reined in. I'm a life-long registered Democrat and I don't think it would be wise to leave too much power on the table for Hillary Clinton, should she become President. She is not, I think, a kinder, gentler human being.

So yes, we should throw the rascals out. But do you really think a populace which can't even say no to Big Pharma and the Agra-business conglomerates has the guts or smarts to do so?

Everyone seems to have their heads down trying to keep their jobs and homes and still live a care free suburban 1950's lifestyle.

Heck, we haven't even figured out yet that SUV's burn gas. If we had the fortitude to box congresses ears we wouldn't be in a lot of the messes we're slipping further and further into as it is. I think it must be an American thing to callously and contemptuously reject any kind of gratificatus interuptus.

We pay celebrities and sports figures enough to provide every child in this country a good education and decent living conditions and still help others across the globe, and yet we don't see to it that this happens. Again I ask if you really think such a lazy, greedy citizenry is going to insist on real honesty, competence and integrity in its public officials?

I think if that were going to happen we might not have had to have this conversation. Thanks for your concern and your program.

Bill Barrows

Vancouver, Washington

Shame on you Mr. Moyers for not being aware of HR 333, drafted by Dennis Kucinich calling for the impeachment of Cheney.

After several emails to my representative about impeachment, with vague responses about 'this topic not currently being up for discussion', I visited his office yesterday to ask what it would take to *make* this action 'up for discussion'.

There was no satisfactory response given. I am deeply disappointed with my Congressman Elijah Cummings from Maryland for lacking the courage to consider this action at this critical time.

Are there others out there who are not getting a satisfactory response from their Congressmen about *why* this issue is not important enough to be discussed?

I have forwarded my letter of July 20 (posted below) calling for impeachment to Sen. Feingold.

Dear Mr. Moyers,

I've been a fan of yours for decades and would like to add this to the discussion about impeachment. The human brain contains a specific area where behaviors associated with political power are concentrated. Ironically, it's in the reptilian cortex, or as I like to refer to it, the lizard brain, the least evolved of the brain's four cortexes. All leaders, whether they are political, business, religious or social, draw on qualities invested in the reptilian cortex to promote their agenda. The lizard brain is the penultimate power broker. What we humans are supposed to do with our lizard brain is integrate it with the agenda of the frontal lobe, the only human part of the brain. Think of the frontal lobe as Jesus. When he kicked the money lenders out of the synagogue he was using his lizard brain, not to bully, but to protect those where were being bullied. When we don't integrate the lizard brain's agenda with our human agenda, what we get is George Bush and Dick Cheney, men who use the lizard brain to become bullies and to defend bullies. That's what we're talking about with impeachment, stopping the president when he becomes a bully to his own people. I hope someone in Congress steps up to the plate, and with their lizard brain fully integrated into a frontal lobe agenda, calls for impeachment to stop the president's and the vice president's bullying of our American, constitutional and legal rights. Lizard brains are not who we want in power.

Sincerely, Glynda-Lee Hoffmann

Today there was an announcement that Sen. Feingold will "censure" the Administration: http://feingold.senate.gov/~feingold/releases/07/07/20070722.html
I have no doubt that this is in response to the outcry that followed the Moyers Journal show on impeachment. Even Feingold admits that censure is "a relatively modest response..." Yet it seems TOO modest after he claims that it is in response to "some of the worst misconduct and the worst abuses of the law in American history." Although Feingold has been a fighter all along, it seems that he is trying to run the gauntlet between Pelosi and party discipline on the one hand, and the American public on the other hand. He provides his email address at this link. Those who feel so strongly about impeachment should repost their comments for his benefit.

The discussion was one of the most important few tens of minutes in recent decades. The people seem to understand what is at stake but reading the form letter responses from senators and congress members tell another story, they speak loudly that they just do not care or know what the constitution means. Short term political gain(not wishing to "divide the country") or party advantage is more important doing either their sworn duty or listening the their constituents. The people are united in this, they get it. Who are the congressmen afraid of offending, surely not their voters who are demanding them to do their job?
Each mentioned not wanting to divert attention from other important legislation.
What could be more important than assuring the country's survival? All other tasks depend on this , no bill can pass that is not more beneficial to corporate donors than the citizens. Until this administration is reined in, congress might as well just go home for the duration.
These responses show us one thing very clear, we have already lost any influence on the process of self governess. All the elected office holders have to know they will be removed, dems, republicans or independent, if they refuse to do their job. I've always voted for Fienstein but never again after this display of arrogance. A good house cleaning is in order, not just the white house but congress as well.
Forget party, think and vote constitution, it is the only thing that unites us.

I'm a little late, but have been thinking about this broadcast for a couple of weeks now. So, I have to say what I think. I was thinking it wouldn't be worth impeaching Bush and Chenney as we only have 1 1/2 years to go - but after listening to this broadcast, I feel it is extremely urgent to pursue this action. We may not last th 1 1 /2 years. Also, it is imperative that this attitude not be carried over to the next presidents. It is possible to copy this program and send it to our legislators? I just think this is something very vital.

Below are three email exchanges with my US Congressional Representative Anna Eshoo.

===============================================
July 14, 2007
Dear Congresswoman Eshoo,
I was moved to write this letter based on Bill Moyer's July 13 presentation of Tough Talk on Impeachment.

I am writing to remind you of your obligation under the Constitution to investigate impeachable actions of the President and Vice President.
"... the founders who had recently fought a revolution against a king named George would tell you that monarchical behavior, the behavior of a king, acting like a king, is an impeachable offense. You need not look for specific laws or statutes. What you need to look for is a pattern of behavior that says that the presidency is superior not merely to Congress but to the laws of the land, to the rules of law. And that is why we ought to be discussing impeachment. Not because of George Bush and Dick Cheney but because we are establishing a presidency that does not respect the rule of law. And people, Americans, are rightly frightened by that. Their fear is the fear of the founders. It is appropriate. It is necessary."
JOHN NICHOLS
Tough Talk on Impeachment
http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07132007/profile.html

If Congress fails to correct this administration's distortion of Executive power, future Presidents will assume these monarchical powers and probably usurp additional ones.

Lew M@ieee.org

PS.
Be sure to remove the Vice President before removing the President.

===============================================
July 16, 2007
Dear LewM,
Thank you for contacting me about the Scooter Libby trial and
your thoughts about impeaching Vice President Cheney.

The Bush Administration has been able to operate in an unfettered
and unchecked way under Republican majorities in both the House
and Senate over the last six years. As a result of this, no questions
were asked, no oversight was exercised and essentially, blank
checks were issued. We're now, with a fragile new majority,
actually reversing the above.

Recently, the President commuted the prison sentence of I. Lewis
"Scooter" Libby who was the Vice President's Chief of Staff. Mr.
Libby's trial and conviction of perjury and obstruction of justice in
the Valerie Plame leak case raised many questions about the
integrity of the Executive Branch. The President's action raises
additional questions about his commitment to hold accountable
anyone in his Administration involved with leaking Ms. Plame's
identity. Congress is already holding hearings to investigate the
abuses of the Administration and will continue to. What disgusts
me and many others is the fact that Paris Hilton has served more
time than Scooter Libby ever will for what he was convicted of.

On the subject of impeachment, I've lived through the
impeachment process and witnessed firsthand how it tears the
country apart. I think it's time to bring the country together. We
have to move forward and impeachment, in my view, will heavily
distract from the critical work of reversing the disastrous policies
of this Administration and will bring to a halt progress being made
on important issues including ending the war, healthcare, global
warming, and our nation's economic competitiveness.

Since the start of this new Congress, the House has held hundreds
of oversight hearings covering the war in Iraq, the response to
Hurricane Katrina, the firing of United States Attorneys, and the
treatment of our veterans at Walter Reed. And there's so much
more to do. We either grind to a halt, or move forward.

If you have any other questions or comments, let me hear from
you. I always appreciate hearing from my constituents and ask that
you continue to inform me on issues you care about. I need your
thoughts and benefit from your ideas.

If you'd like to receive information on other issues, I've created an
e-newsletter to keep constituents informed on a variety of topics.
If you'd like to receive it, go to my website at
http://eshoo.house.gov and click on "E-Mail Sign-Up."
Sincerely,

Anna G. Eshoo
Member of Congress

===============================================
7/20/07
Dear Congresswoman Eshoo,
Thank you for clarifying your position on investigating impeachable actions of the President and Vice President. Certainly there are many great issues to be addressed along with impeachment proceedings. I also remember the Clinton impeachment, the Iran-Contra and Watergate hearings, when Nixon tried to hide his crimes behind the veil of "national security".

I also lived through the Kennedy assassination and witnessed the transition of power to Johnson. Our American History teacher in high school, Miss Ratner, made it clear to everyone of us how important that moment was. "The Constitution works! In most countries of the world, when a leader is assassinated, there's usually panic in the streets followed by gunfire and the installation of a new leader, supported by the military, who 'temporarily' imposes martial law to insure national security."

I get a sense that the underpinnings of America are being attacked (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/07/19/AR2007071902625_pf.html) while Congress and the Executive argue about whose favorite project gets how much of my tax dollars.

This congress will most likely spend its remaining months arguing with Bush and Cheney and probably get little accomplished. And, when the 2008 elections are over we will still have an executive branch with a distorted view of its authority.

If the next President decides to contemptuously stretch the bounds of its Constitutional authority, the next steps, I fear, will bring us closer to a time when panic in the streets will be followed by gunfire and 'temporary' martial law, just until we regain homeland security.

Make sure this congress reins-in the power of the Executive branch. That's your job and no one else's.

LewM@ieee.org

If you want peace, pursue justice.

A typographical error was in my just publlshed comments: I meant: Who appologized for the killings of our soldiers, whom we are NOT allowed to see when they are returned home in flag-draped coffins

Perhaps this is inappropriate for you to address, but I wish someone (you?) would progressively continue reporting political and ethical issues/problems that affect my (our) lives--with possible solutions.

The first time I perked up my perceived “problem/solution” ears was your discussion with Bruce Fein, John Nichols. The initial words of another commenter (July 20) echoed my reaction because it “crystallized a vague dread that has been hovering in the back of my mind for years”. This was posted by Leeb July 20 or Elizabeth Johnson Tsang (a confusion of your comments entries since either you indicated Posted by in body of the post or after a dotted line following the post).

The question/problem they crystallized for me was not Impeachment of particular individuals for perceived “illegal wrongdoing or imperial presidency”. The question was which of our Senators/Representatives: 1) Know or have read our Constitution that they swore to uphold: 2) Ask and demand answers in all hearings and in all votes on bills by highlighting and emphasizing the authority of the Constitution; and 3) Strive to rewrite or obliterate parliamentary procedures that prevent exercise of Constitutional authority and debate.

It was a much-publicized issue when our first Muslim/Islamic elected official decided to be sworn in by placing his hand on the Qur’an. (As if the “Bible” was symbolic of non-hypocritical “truthful” allegiance to uphold the Constitution). Why isn’t the Constitution the proper document upon which to swear, not some “religious” object many have never read completely?

Why aren’t candidates required to “prove” they know the Constitution, similar to a Bar Examination (with scores publicized) or SATs, before being allowed to run?

Who, out of ignorance or with nefarious motives, handed over their Constitutional authority to the Executive Branch? Who voted for the Patriot Act, under which the Executive Branch is acting within each legal “dot-coma-and-crossing-of-every-T” authority handed over? Who voted for the renewal of the Act, without reading it and then suddenly realizing some item was “sneaked” in allowing unchecked power to Justice Department? Who voted for the Middle East Wars/War on Terror and Total Presidential Authority and Privilege to conduct it as he wished, then lost their jobs because of it? Who allowed and defined “signing privilege” of the Executive Branch to bypass authority and directives of the other two branches. Who appologized for the killings of our soldiers, whom we are know allowed to see as they are returned home in flag-draped coffins?

Who challenged the constitutionality of “enemy combatant” and the rounding up of citizens to be sent to concentration camps/prisons, stripping them of constitutional rights, to torture them, and without anyone's knowledge of their whereabouts? Where are those among all elected officials who voiced constitutional/history-based objections and concerns about our emulation of WWII camps, which were done for nationalism pride and economic power for true-blooded “citizens”.

“We never knew” formerly implausible arguments of German citizens is suddenly plausible to USA citizens, under the umbrella of “national security”. IT IS NOT A PLAUSIBLE EXCUSE OF ANY OF OUR ELECTED SENATORS/CONGRESSMAN WHO ARE PAID TO UPHOLD OUR CONSTITUTION AND BILL OF RIGHTS, BUT WHO, OUT OF IGNORANCE OR ECONOMICS, DON’T.

I have searched the ACLU website and with their blog’s help located voting records of current crop of Presidential Candidates, who, until now, skirt Constitutional Issues and their Stances about what they intend to do to correct wrongs.

So Bush and Cheney won’t show us theirs. When they get out of office, who will open up all their refused records, publicize them, and institute legal prison-based proceedings for these “wrong-doings” done by these newly designated private citizens? Why not?

Dear Mr. Moyers,
greetings,

I love your program and hope that you will soon cover the status of health care in the US.

I can share some links that you might find helpful:

http://suttercorporatewatch.org/

I hope that you have seen the "Damaged Care" film based on Dr Linda Peeno's experience with HMO's.

http://www.workingtv.com/damagedcare.html



Thank you

As I have said 100 times, being a women in America there is a more likelyhood that I will be attacked and or create fear of my fellow Americans (i.e. rape) then by some supposed terrorist./

This interview would be great as a podcast. I enjoyed watching but would like to be able to take with on my ipod / mP3. Can you make your programs available in this format?

I am inspired by Bill Moyers Journal nourishing subjects rising up from the belly of this earth and the humanitarian soul...much richer than the news weather sports clones...this is a Joseph Campbell universal reunion.

Very intellectually stimulating show. The blog comments are almost as interesting . . .

It would be interesting to know how many members of Congress have watched the show. Is anyone out there . . .

overcome your modesty and allow pbs to do a biography on you and to what you attribute your success. leave aside the possible accusations of a headtrip and clue in others who might want to attempt it. i certainly would like to at least hear the story behind your leaving and returning to pbs, including all the politics.

The show about impeachment of Pres. Bush and VP Cheney was so enlightening. Why can some people still not get it? Because they have blinders on. Our country is going down the tubes.

uga6-
why aren't you fighting in Iraq or Afganistan?

watch this:
Olbermann: "Go to Iraq and fight, Mr. President"

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19859124/

This is maybe the most meaningful discussion I have heard in a very long time -- years. Excellent.

Why shouldn't we impeach Bush/Cheney?
I believe that they should be charged with war crimes! They ordered the invasion of two countries without provocation. Used false information to manipulate congress, and our foreign allies, to go along with them. And have been responsible for Thousands of deaths.
Bush/Cheney used 9/11 as an excuse to invade Iraq because they thought that they Iraqi people would be so happy to be free of Saddam, that they would just give us their OIL!
By declaring war on a non-existent foe, "Terror", he elevated himself to the status of King. He does what he wants, and answers to no one, because we are at War (without end).
There is no country named Terror, so we can never win, so the war never ends. Sound Orwellian, "Love is Hate, War is Peace, Freedom is Slavery"
Other dictators have been brought to trial for Less!

Democrats are rallying around a psychologist who says the way to win elections is to reach voters "emotionally" and not to worry with facts.

In his war against President Bush, Bill Moyers is brilliant in his emotionalism. From the blog comments, it appears the "emotional" viewers care less about facts.

Do you have to take an IQ test for dumb and dumber to be a Democrat? Impeach Bush? Of course the "Dims" will attempt this with people like Bill Moyers leading the charge! Media types like Moyers may not care about the facts, but their conniving and wily ways together with the leadership of NPR, CBS, NBC, ABC, and CNN MAY end with impeachment hearings.

SAD! SAD! SAD!

President Bush is one of the more honest and honorable presidents that we have had.

WE HAVE NOT HAD ANOTHER TERRORIST ATTACK SINCE 911. IT IS NOT AN ACCIDENT!

The media and the Democrats led the charge for our defeat in VietNam and the impeachment of Richard Nixon....years ago. History is important if it teaches us something worthwhile. Apparently the Media and Bill Moyers think defeat in Iraq and the impeachment of President Bush is an ideal template of the past.

YELLOW JOURNALISM AT ITS WORSE. The "Dims" are destroying our country!

300 investigations in 100 days....And the 2006 election was supposedly an attempt to "do the work of the people".

Is there no real work to be done?

A loss in Iraq will result in a terrorist takeover. The mideast will be in turmoil. DEFEAT IN IRAQ WILL REST WITH HARRY REID (WHO DECLARED THE WAR LOST) AND MEDIA TYPES LIKE BILL MOYERS!

There are numerous reasons why both George W. Bush as well as Dick Cheney should be impeached. Their Administration has been complicit in the following:
1) Authorizing the NSA wiretapping of Americans in clear violation of the FISA law;
2) Authorizing the torture of prisoners of war in clear violation of the Geneva Convention and thereby placing our own soldiers at greater risk of being tortured themselves;
3) Authorizing and attempting to cover up the outing of CIA spy Valerie Plame (clearly an act of treason) for political retribution (her husband was critical of the invasion of Iraq); 4) As discussed in Resolution 333: they deserve impeachment for actively and systematically seeking to deceive citizens and Congress about an alleged threat of Iraqi weapons of mass destruction and an alleged relationship between Iraq and al Qaeda and for openly threatening aggression against Iran;
5) Incompetence in their conduct of the war in Iraq (yes they can be impeached just for screwing up) since as Joe Biden rightly put it, “they have not been right about one thing” in regards to their policy in Iraq;
6) Firing U.S. prosecutors for political reasons;
7) Commuting the sentence of law breaker Scooter Libby found guilty of breaking the law by his obstruction of justice… and on and on.
Each of these acts and others justify impeachment on their own merit but together they indicate a clear lack of respect for the people and the laws of our constitution that they have sworn to uphold. In my opinion many of the actions of this administration remind me of the actions of fascists from the past.
It is my opinion that to ignore impeachment for such crimes is akin to supporting such crimes and an admission that our constitution is merely a piece of paper with no merit.

Sincerely,
Jason Dumas
Rochester Hills, MI

Your Bill Moyers' Journal last week was just so important that I sent an e-mail to all my contacts to be sure to watch the program when it repeated on Sunday the 15th at 7 p.m. I hope that my family and friends took the time to see this important show that brings attention to the loss of our basic liberties, and the fact that our President and Vice President are ignoring the laws of our land and doing as they please without a thought as to what the people of this country want of their leaders. If we let them get away with this travesty, we deserve whatever happens to us. When will the voters wake up and see what this rotten administration is doing to our country?

I have been blogging about the Bush Administration, its hypocrisy, and its atrocities for more than two years. I not only agree that President Bush should be impeached and removed from office, but I have also outlined and detailed a full case for the impeachment of President Bush. I have posted it on both my MySpace page and on my primary blog at http://eyesongovernment.journalspace.com. If you read and agree to what I have posted, please help spread these articles of impeachment around and contact your elected representatives in support of them. I am going to begin the process this weekend of sending this through E-mail to ALL 535 representatives in the Senate and House of Representatives. I am hoping to provide the catalyst we need to not only remove Bush from office, but also for his prosecution for the atrocities he has been involved with. Please use the following links if you wish to contact your representatives:

In the House of Representatives

In the Senate

Thank you to everyone who helps support this endeavor to free our country from the tyranny of the Bush Administration.

This has led to a lot of abuses of freedom of speech and freedom of the press that I discuss further in the following website: http://narj-clirus.blogspot.com/

Your bio section of that blog is totally blank...Whatta shock!

Bruce Fein, John Nichols, and Bill Moyers crystalized a vague dread that has been hovering in the back of my mind for years. In what sense is the Bush/Cheney administration NOT tyrannical? They have abrogated citizens' rights to privacy and habeas corpus (could they deem me an 'enemy combatant'?) My response to this program us to urge my Senators, Kerry and Kennedy, my Congressman, Jim McGovern, Speaker Nancy Pelosi, and Senator Patrick Leahy (a likely leader), to bring a bill of IMPEACHMENT against both Bush and Cheney IMMEDIATELY. I have urged others to speak up, as well. This is my letter:


The United States faces a grave Constitutional crisis. President George W. Bush and Vice-President Dick Cheney are two lawless men who have conducted an unprecedented, systematic assault on the separation of powers at the heart of the United States Constitution. We the People demand that you impeach President Bush and Vice-President Cheney immediately and return our great nation to the rule of law.

By claiming authority to conduct warrantless spying on American citizens and even imprisoning them without charge simply by declaring them citizens are ‘enemy combatants’ President Bush and Vice-President Cheney have abrogated citizens’ fundamental protection from the power of the state.

By signing laws passed by Congress and then reserving the right not to enforce those laws, President Bush has undermined the authority of the Congress.

By firing US Attorneys for political reasons, President Bush and Vice-President Cheney have systematically undermined the authority of the Justice Department to check usurpations of power by the Executive Branch.

By ‘outing’ undercover CIA operative Valerie Plame, by cooking up an excuse to invade Iraq, by authorizing the use of torture in secret prisons, and other abuses, President Bush and Vice-President Cheney have not only failed to protect the United States from its enemies, they have inflamed others to become our enemies.

It is time to impeach these lawless men. NOW.


7-20-07

I believe it was Benjamin Franklin who said, "Those who would give up freedom for safety deserve neither." And while much has already been said about these issues, I was compelled to make my own contribution to this community of thought.

On a macrolevel, the U.S. has intervened in and attempted to usurp the governments of approximately 50 different foreign countries. A compehensive account of this and other related topics is found in the interesting book by John Perkins entititled, The Secret History of the American Empire. There are approximately 750 permanent U.S. military bases worldwide with a megabase proposed for in Italy, which is currently under great protest, as it is feared that it will be used to engaged in warfare eith Iran. And 14 permanent U.S. bases, along with two major airstrips would belie the notion of withdrawal from Iraq. For critical thinkers, American imperialism seems obvious. Of course the culpability of oganizations like the nefarious Military Industrial Complex, World Bank, IMF with their vulture funds, soulless corporations, theo-con think tanks etc. is obvious, but is never discussed by major news channels, who are nothing more than the minions of the status quo; who are owned by the very same elitists and dominionists that are obsessed with the New Manifest Destiny. And it was five-star General and former President Dwight D. Eisenhower who coined the term, Military Indusrial Complex and publicly warned the country about this dangerous trend in his farewell speech to the nation back in 1961. His forgotten words were an eerie portent of the present. It is frightening, and much like grasping a handful of water; the tigher you clench your fist, the less you end up with.


We know that the three basic tenets of Nazism were nationalism, militarism and totalitariansim, yet we turn the other way so that we don't see that we have become what we most hated.

On more of a microlevel, we do not own the darkness in ourselves. The human race is not divided into two separate categories: the good and the bad. We each have the capacity for both. It is a monumental task, but darkness and evil must be addressed on an individual basis because the collective is only the sum of its individuals.

Yet we continue to eschew and ignore the psychological (non-traditional psychology) perspectives and so miss an opportunity for a real understanding of man's inhumanity to man and our own god-awful behavior. We inevitably end up psychologically projecting our own darkness onto others when we are unaware and unconscious of our own
-and to our own demise. We should attend to the wisdom of a great teacher who once said, "We can be grateful for our enemies, for their darkness allows us to escape our own."

Narcissism, hedonism, toxic consumerism, materialism, scientism and all the "wretched isms" are the progeny of a culture of corruption and an age of meaninglessness. We have money, power and things yet remain spritually bankrupt and emotionally impoverished.

We can no longer be sustained by mendacious leaders and the political rhetoric of failure. Neither can we be led by rigid dogma and religious abstractions. It begins with and in each of us, no matter our faith or denomination. It involves a genuine spiritual experience. And there does exist a means by which to unite the masculine and the feminine; the conscious and the unconscious; the sacred and the secular. What we have done so far does not seem to be working well! The incessant desire for connection, meaning and transcendance is innate us and is the most powerful force in the human psyche -the religious function. It is our true collective vocatus. Leaving the age of Pisces, we are now entering a time when we must personally and individually find our own connections to something numinous.

A vital key is given to us in the Gnostic Gospel of Thomas: If you bring forth what is within you, what you bring forth will save you. If you do not bring forth what is within you, what you do not bring forth will destroy you.

Thank you for bring this issue to the forefront. I hope the American people will act now while there remains courage among us. Many have been intiminated over the past few years as some in the media allowed us to be lambasted by claims that any critical of the present administration are guilty of undermining our troops. The president subtly tried the same thing in Thursdays speech. Yes, fear has stifled many knowledgeable citizens and ignorance has muffled the "dumbed down." What does that say about a "free people?" Where can it lead?

Heretofore, we see the results of a community having little understanding of the importance-even sacredness of our constitution to protect us from a tyrant. We must demand provision for a better education in our schools. In many places solid civics teaching has been "watered down." Are our representatives outraged when they see our values trodden upon, and our sensibilities moistened with renegade spittle? No! Some are behaving like unlearned preschoolers, educated fools and spineless politicians. This indolence does suggest a lack of understanding and appreciation for our form of government from those in whom we have "granted" and entrusted responsibility for preserving it. It is not surprising then, that we average citizens have become in many instances, stunned, paralyzed and mute.

Let us seize this moment while people still dare verbalize their angst. There is support for our representatives now, while it is so glaringly vivid that Bush & Company are stuck on a stubborn course with no regard or respect for innovatiave, creative, lawful democratic pur suits. Where are you Congress and Senate - Ms. Pelosi? Seize this time before more smoke is blown into our eyes.

Here is Congresswoman Susan Davis’ response to my earlier posting (see July 15 below):

July 16, 2007

Mr. Dan Landrum
San Diego, CA 92104

Dear Dan ,

Thank you for your contacting me with your support for impeaching President Bush and Vice
President Cheney. I appreciate hearing from you on this matter and welcome the opportunity to respond.

Please know that I share your strong frustrations with this administration . I have long been a
vocal critic of many of its practices and policies, including warrantless surveillance, the Military Commissions Act, the dismissal of U.S. Attorneys, and certainly the course of the war in Iraq . However, I do not believe that impeachment is the only way to demand accountability in these matters.

Several committees, including the House Oversight and Government Reform and Judiciary Committees, are continuing and even increasing their investigations of the Bush administration due to withholding of information, dismissal of Congressional subpoenas, and other administration mismanagement.

There are several larger issues that Congress must move quickly towards addressing, including immigration reform, global warming, and finding a workable solution to Iraq. I believe that these issues should take precedence, and that the distraction of impeachment would hinder our momentum in making positive changes in the daily lives of American families.

As a practical matter, impeachment is a very long and expensive process and, with little more than a year before the administration moves out of office, I believe that the process would be a waste of taxpayer dollars as well as divert attention from correcting and demanding accountability for the administration's mistakes.

Once again, thank you for contacting me. As your representative, I both need and value your perspective. Please sign up for my E-Newsletter on my website, www.house.gov/susandavis , if you would like to receive monthly updates about what is happening in Congress.

With warm regards,

SUSAN A. DAVIS
Member of Congress

--------------------------
and my reply:
--------------------------

Dear Susan,

Thank you for making the time to respond to my concerns regarding impeaching President Bush and Vice President Cheney. However, I find your viewpoint misses the forest for the trees. Certainly the issues you mention as your priority are important ones, but none even fractionally as important as preserving the integrity of our democratic institutions. This is not about Bush and Cheney, per se. This is about preserving the very core of those Constitutional rights and obligations we inherited. It's about the various bodies of government doing their specific Duty to insure the checks and balances of power don't run amok.

Believe me, those many issues you want to make headway on will still be there, but unchecked, the precedence set by the overreaching, grabbing and misuse of power will de facto become part of the executive branch long after the present administration leaves office. The time is now to rectify the inequities.

Susan, you say, "impeachment would hinder our momentum in making positive changes in the daily lives of American families." I can understand the strong frustrations you must have felt being in the minority party for 6 years unable to garner "momentum in making positive changes." But, I strongly sense you underestimate the gravity of this moment and misgauge the perception of those of us "outside the beltway" both in the depth and effect of corruption in government. And I believe you will find, even if the Impeachment process does not end with the desired result to oust the current administration, that the thorough and attentive investigation will have a cathartic effect that will not only help cleanse and heal our deeply divided citizenry, but stimulate fresh vigor and open new avenues for change in those very issues so dear to you.

In any case, let's get down to basics. Let's parse what you were elected to do, your functions from your Duty. The issues you mention are significant Functions for the House that represents us people, but they are not its unique and solemn duty. The House of Representatives uniquely "shall have the sole Power of Impeachment." That is your Duty. If you don't do it, it can't be done. As I understand it your Oath of Office was not to "maintain momentum for the popular polemic politics of the day," but rather to "support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic.''

Overwhelmingly, the present administration poses a clear and present danger. Leading us into war on false pretenses, dissolving our civil liberties, robbing our treasury to give huge no-bid, no-accountability contracts to cronies, building clandestine torture chambers that flaunt international conventions of decency, the unchecked stealing of elections . the list goes on and on. These are NOT mere "mistakes", these are callous, criminal acts, strategically planned and methodically executed. Can you honestly say these outlaw manipulations of power do not threaten the very existence of our union as we know it?

If "We the People" dare to live in a fair and just society, then no one can be held above the law.

Please, Susan, please, please . set aside your other ambitions and do your Duty.

Thank you for your earnest consideration,
Dan Landrum

This beyond-excellent program was the first media discussion in six years that reminded me of what I'd learned in college poli-sci about how our system once functioned before it was hijacked by the current admin. Our government no longer serves it's citizenry in any real capacity and panders to the real owners of America - the corporate criminals. They have no interest in civil liberties or the safety of the military. Interesting how the most verbose bloggers want to limit the freedoms of others to speak or act! While so-called conservative conglomerate radio prattles on about "the godless liberal media our once proud nation has disappeared into the "global economy" like Britain did not that long ago.

I agree with Olivia. My civics teacher could (if he were still alive) give each branch of government a quick review of the Constitution with a pop quiz and he never graded on a curve. In class we had to read three newspapers every day (provided by the teacher and deemed to be fair and balanced news) and on Friday we held debates on revelent events. You never knew until Friday which side of the debate you would be assigned, so it was imperative to be well informed. Today it is pretty difficult to find any impartial news which makes Bill Moyers Journal the light at the end of the tunnel for those of us searching for the truth.

It's been almost a week since the Moyers, Fein and Nichols segment on impeachment - where's the follow-up? People are blogging about it like crazy, but zero attention in the media.

Great program. THANK YOU!!!

NOW let's see what you can uncover about the MYSTERY of Conyers, et al....

BEFORE the election Conyers and 28 others SUPPORTED impeachment investigation & proceedings. (that is why we elected the "new democratic congress"....

....BUT........

AFTER the election, every stinking one of them RETRACTED their support... and CONYERS, as well as the others ACT like they are SCARED TO DEATH OF THE "I" WORD...

....enquiring minds want to know "w-h-y?" What in blazes are they so afraid of?????????

//

I wrote United States Senator Diane Feinstein of California a very angry letter about how I felt that President Bush and Vice President Dick Cheney had lied and violated the laws of the United States constitution with respect to their reasons for invading Iraq and the implementation of illegal wire tapping. I urged the Senator to support impeachment proceedings (if they were to be started in the House of Representatives) against both Cheney and Bush.

Senator Feinstein, in her letter back to me, wrote:

At this time, however, I believe that impeachment proceedings against President Bush or Vice President Cheney will only divide the country even further, frustrating our hopes for a meaningful change in direction, while having little chance of success.

Now I ask you, how is it possible that a Senator or Congressperson is less interested in making sure that ALL of our elected public officials follow the rule of law and instead care more about whether the country is "divided" or not?

What does it matter if a country is divided? Why should a public servant care no less? In a democracy, we should welcome dissent! Democracy is one of the most challenging forms of government because it requires constant negotiation and compromise in order to meet the demands of the people it serves. The most important consideration given by any public official should always be that the laws of this country are being abided by ALL! If a President or Vice President violates the law than the FIRST ORDER OF PRIORITY for ANY public official is to hold that public servant ACCOUNTABLE!

And yet hear we have Senator Diane Feinstein not even ACKNOWLEDGING the fact that Bush and Cheney DID violate the law and they MUST be held accountable.

It's unbelievable. And now I'm reminded why the United States, as a democracy, is failed time and time again by the very public servants the people elect to serve it.

I signed Impeachment petitions at www.ImpeachBush.org and democrats.com. There will be a march on Washington DC on September 15 to protest the war and call for impeachment. I hope Congress gets the message.

Initially, I thought impeachment was a hysterical subject to entertain, even though I'm a disgusted conservative and would love to see Bush and Cheney disappear. But after hearing the arguments set forth by the guests, I am now absolutely behind the idea. Another important point made was how ignorant Congress is of its role and the Constitution. We the people get it. When will they?! Excellent show, Mr. Moyers.

Charges and Counter Charge

Mr Fein charges that even though America is engaged in a war, Bush and Cheney should be impeached because they have taken away liberties guaranteed by the Constitution or have assumed power not provided to the President by the Constitution.

If Mr Fein is correct, then Bush and Cheney should be impeached, however if Mr Fein is wrong, he should be charged with treason because he is giving aid and comfort to the enemy. What enemy would not be delighted to see the leader of their enemy assassinated.

The reason the Constitution calls for a Deceleration of War and the associated censorship is to prevent people from giving aid and comfort to the enemy by criticizing the president who is the Commander and Chief of the Armed Forces.

This is a very black and white issue. No soldier should ever be sent into battle unless there is an absolute commitment to do whatever it takes to win. I believe that is why the Constitution require a Deceleration of War. If there is not a commitment to win don't go to war. Surrender to the enemy is better than criticism of the President that causes the war to be extended or lost.

Mr Fein talks about a box of powers that Bush and Cheney have assembled that he does not think any president should have. Others would say the box of powers was necessary to fight the war against an enemy who was using certain liberties to attack America.

I believe Clinton should be reprimanded for his failure to protect the American people from the Islamic Terrorists that Clinton knew existed. Clinton was a coward who would not face the Islamic Terrorists, because he feared the criticism that Bush is getting. Clinton had policies in place that prevented the sharing of information between the FBI and CIA that could have connected the dots, but because Clinton did not create a box of powers, he did not do his job of protecting America thus he should be reprimanded.

The New York Times should be charged with treason for disclosing government operations that were helping to defeat the enemy.

I believe Republicans have been soft on treason and should charge a lot of people with treason. The best way to avoid treason would have been to have had censorship. With censorship, most would have avoided the popularity of criticizing elected officials.

Mr Fein talks of filling a box with powers, but by his criticism, he is emptying the box of options available to the President to fight a war. The only options now appear to be to launch a nuclear strike if America is ever attacked again because the critics will start eating the President alive if the war lasts over six months.

Mr Fein says that the President is not elected to be a four year dictator, but in time of war I do not see how it will work in any other manner. Lincoln said a house divided will fall. When America is electing a president it is a very serious business because America cannot work if there are four groups (President, Senate, House of Representative and the News Media) vying for control.

This is very serious issue, because there is no question there will be future wars and that America needs to figure out how to win future wars both politically and militarily.

We would not be discussing this whole issue if there had been a Declaration of War as called for by the Constitution and the associated censorship.

People who criticize need to be held to a high standards and held accountable for their statements. For too long critics have been allowed freedom without responsibility. This has led to a lot of abuses of freedom of speech and freedom of the press that I discuss further in the following website: http://narj-clirus.blogspot.com/

Every critic should be required to state a better way.

Oh what a web we weave, when we at first we begin to deceive.

In many cases the answer you get in a poll depends on the question. I challenge you to ask the following question in a poll.

Security vs Liberties Poll - Different Question

If an enemy was using some of your liberties in an attempt to take away all you liberties, would you give up some of your liberties until the threat was gone? Do you:

Agree - Safety of the nation as a whole takes precedence over individual civil liberties.

Disagree - Nothing diminishes the importance of protecting our civil liberties.

Neither - Depends on the situation at hand.

Thanks Bill for a very informative program, well spoken, all facts in unison, villains unmasked and solution stated-impeach!
Probably, if this program were well distributed, it just might wake up enough American citizens that could right the nations subverted laws, fix the power balance and get rid of the parasites living lives of royal luxury and decadence while the private citizen wonders at the tragic mess taking place in their National Capital. The laws and balance of power should be in place before the two masters of darkness are totally and finally impeached.
The 'Apple Wood Presidential Powers Box' referred to in the program struck my imagination and I believe, in my seventy years, I've seen our Sovereign States drop powers into this 'box' either from ignorance, bribery, or from just being cowed. Of course, our Representatives go to the Washington 'Imperial Palace' and live it up, make millions and seemingly do little and, I suspect, give no thought to their proper accountability to their constituency, adding to the 'box' by their neglect of duty.
The Bushs and Chaneys (& the others serving our country) are born in and of these times, but we expect more from them than we expect from ourselves, our families and those that entertain us. Why are we surprised at our governments perverse activities. We, as a nation, have allowed and eccepted moral perversions that would make our parents cry for the shame of their children. There are only excuses for the present mess...!
To ride an old Horse , 'These things should be done for our children's sake' , a well worn but dead theme in our self serving potbellied society.
Thanks again Bill and please excuse me for seeing the 'box' as crowded by so many human neglects.

Dual impeachment would not make Pelosi president. Bush could prevent a Pelosi presidency just by appointing a new VP who hasn't done anything impeachable. The new VP would need the approval of both houses of Congress, so Bush would need to appoint someone uncontroversial, like Gerald Ford. (Yes, Ford was uncontroversial, before he pardoned Nixon.)

Speaking of civil liberties, I am very shaken today by Elliott Cohen's article at Buzzflash - "This Summer, Will America Officially Become a Totalitarian State?"

I urge everyone to read this article to learn about the quietly posted National Continuity Policy Presidential Directive established on May 9, 2007, in which, according to Cohen, "bypasses Congress and puts him in charge of all three branches of the federal government if there is a 'catastrophic emergency'".

Cohen concludes the article with:
"Like a game of chess drawing to a close, there is a chilling aura that the final checkmate is imminent. In the least, democracy in America is in grave danger and at best dependent on chance."

At the same time, The Guardian (in the UK) reported on Monday that Cheney's push for attacking Iran is finally overstepping Condi's attempt to try diplomacy.

Given the lawlessness of Bush/Cheney, it is extremely important to know these things, and share the information loudly -- before it's too late.

A wonderful review of what the role of each branch should be. However, in wondering why Pelosi doesn't bring up impeachment--if they are both impeached, she becomes President. Makes it look totally political.

In the hearings held by the Democrats, perhaps their agenda is to brimg the "Kingship" attitude of the Pres. and V.P. and create an impeachment groundswell?

I just saw the Bill Moyer, Bruce Fein and John Nichols discussion.

First it was Bush that was wrong.

Then it was Congress that was worse.

Then it was a failure of the news media.

It would appear they think the only people that are right are themselves.

While there is still freedom of speech, I would like to say that the three that think themselves perfect are fools.

The next president who faces the next war will do what was done in WW II which was to censor fools that think themselves perfect, but who hinder the winning of the war.

There is an old saying that you should lead, follow, or get out of the way. Many do none of these but have chosen the art form of criticism.

What all this criticism is leading to is that the next president facing the next war will have to use nuclear weapons because a war cannot be won if it lasts more than six months unless there is censorship. The only wars that have been won are the ones where censorship was used.

What a powerful and intelligent discussion of the importance of understanding the foundations of the American political system! I join all the others in thanking Bill Moyers for his patriotism in producing this discussion.

This is one of the most important videos of the last five years. It needs a far larger audience. All those who see this video should copy the URL and send it to everyone they know. Especially their congressperson.

Thanks, Bill Moyers.

--Rowland Scherman

That was a show that became more intriguiging by the minute.

Thanks to Bruce Fein and John Nichols for some much needed candor regarding Pelosi's stance on this issue vital to our nation.

If you appreciated the program as well, please join us to discuss it in real-time at DemocracyInteractive.com

Thank you, Bill Moyers, for presenting Bruce Fein and John Nichols' crystalization of what every American must understand about the Constitution, especially in their definition of impeachment as the medicine for the high crime of changing the Executive Offices into an Imperium. If Congress does not impeach both Bush and Cheney, we will have followed the same path as the Roman Senate as they transmogrified their Republic into Empire.

This show was argueably one of the most important shows to air within the past 10 years! On any subject.

There simply are no words to describe the elation I felt while listening to these two constitutional scholars point out that in America the President and his men work for us and therefore are responsible to us for everything they do.

Paine and the boys are cheering from their graves!

Good Night & Good Luck

I would like to like to encourage people to let their friends and neighbors know about Mr. Moyers segment on impeachment. We are showing the clip this Thursday at our local Philipstown for Democracy meeting. What is frustrating to me is that no major media figure besides Mr. Moyer is addressing this issue or has picked up his lead on the current debate... like many others who are posting, I am writing letters to my local representative (John Hall), as well as Speaker Pelosi with hope that they are listening to us. If I have these numbers correct, public opinion at the time of Nixon's impeachment hearings was around 39% in favor of proceedings - why is Congress turning such a deaf ear when we are seeing public opinion at 46% for Bush and over 50% for Cheney. What is the tipping point??

Democratic Society Devoted to the Rule of Law

A discussion between Bill Moyers and Bruce Fein on the Impeachment.

Bruce Fein: More worrisome than Clinton's - because he (President Bush) is seeking more institutionally to cripple checks and balances and the authority of Congress and the judiciary to superintend his assertions of power. He has claimed the authority to tell Congress they don't have any right to know what he's doing with relation to spying on American citizens, using that information in any way that he wants in contradiction to a federal statute called the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act. He's claimed authority to say he can kidnap people, throw them into dungeons abroad, dump them out into Siberia without any political or legal accountability. These are standards that are totally anathema to a democratic society devoted to the rule of law.

--------------------------------

What is the "rule of law"? When I hear people talk about the rule of law, my question is which law, God's Law or Civil Law?

I have come to two conclusions when it comes to the Impeachment of President Bush for not doing what the Atheistic Liberal News Media and the democrats want.

The ALNM and democrats know little about the law.

The ALNM and democrats know even less about how to fight a war.

If one were devoted to Civil Law (original Constitution) there would still be slavery, and women would not be allowed to vote.

I am sure some will say that Civil Law is being improved and becoming perfect, but I see no evidence of that. Legalizing pornography, abortion and homosexuality, all of which lead to disease, death and destruction is not improvement.

Christians are devoted to God's Law and Civil Law so long as Civil Law does not violate God's Law. Atheists are devoted to Civil Law because they see Civil Law as a way to subjugate Christians.

The relation of Civil Law and God's Law is discussed in the following reference.

http://www.lonang.com/exlibris/blackstone/bla-002.htm

William Blackstone's Commentaries on the Laws of England states, "This law of nature, being coeval with mankind and dictated by God himself, is of course superior in obligation to any other-It is binding over all the globe in all countries, and at all times; no human laws are of any validity, if contrary to this: and such of them as are valid derive all their force, and all their authority, mediately or immediately, from this original."

The key point stated by Blackstone is that law was dictated by God himself, it is superior to all other law, and that no laws contrary to the laws dictated by God are valid.

--------------------------------------------

For those who are devoted to Civil Law I will remind them that everything that Hitler did in Germany was legal because he took over the government and made Civil Laws that authorized the killing of Jews.

When Civil Law is consistent with God's Law, Civil Law is good, but in the hands of Atheists, Civil Law can be used to kill those you hate.

--------------------------------------------

When the Constitution was written there were two things that were acknowledged.

There should be a Deceleration of War with news media censorship.

There needs to be a different set of laws for those who serve in the military. That different set of laws is the Uniform Code of Military Justice.

Civil Law does not apply to people serving in a combat situation and any aspect of fighting a war should be under Military Law and not Civil Law. People that think Civil Law can be applied to the enemy during a war is silly.

The War On Terrorism is different than any other war and has required measures that have test the relationship of Civil Liberties and Security. There was no question that the Terrorists were using Civil Liberties to attack America. The ALNM and democrats are putting America at great risk when they do not know how to form a correct balance between Civil Liberties and Security.

--------------------------------------------

The ALNM and democrats do not know how to fight a war because they think a war can be a civilized war.

The purpose of a war is to win doing whatever it takes to win. In WW II America used fire bombing of cities and nuclear weapons that killed men, women and children to win the war. If further measures would have been needed, they would have been used.

If people do not want to win the war and do whatever it takes to win, they should never go to war. No soldier should ever be sent into battle without the sure knowledge that they have the absolute support of those who sent them into battle. This is why censorship is so important. Being a Monday Morning quarterback may be cute, but criticizing the military and military leaders during a war is treason.

Those who say they voted for the Iraq War, but were deceived, should resign from office because they are can and will be easily deceived again thus unworthy of trust.

--------------------------------

I truly feel sorry for Bill Moyer. I feel he is a man that once was close to God, but now is out of fellowship with God because he has spent too much time in association with the Atheistic Liberal News Media and the democrats.

---------------------------------

All of the above can be put into the context of the Cultural War.

There is a cultural war in America between Christians and Atheists. This war is being fought on the battlefield of politics. The battles are in the voting booth. The prize in the cultural war is the hearts, minds and souls of the children. The Atheistic liberal news media greatly influences both domestic and foreign policy by constantly reporting only bad news about Christians, conservatives and Republicans and only good news about atheists, liberals and democrats. The agenda of the Atheistic liberal news media is to promote extreme environmentalism, socialism, feminism, pornography, abortion, homosexuality and the Atheistic Lifestyle by having democrats in control of government.

Atheists want control of the government because they see Civil Law as a way to subjugate Christians. The Atheistic Liberal News Media is doing all they can to get the democrats to be in control of the government.

This talk of Impeachment exists because the Atheists hate President Bush because they cannot control Bush's position on Stem Cell Research, Global Warming, Homosexuality/AIDS, etc.. By assassinating President Bush they hope to get control of the government and restore a judicial system that will again favorable to the Atheistic Lifestyle.

Important topic and discussion... thank you. At least Bill Moyers can be counted on to report and discuss issues of serious national import. I felt the interview touched on the critical constitutional question of impeachment which is alive in our body politic: Nixon, Reagan, Clinton and now Bush and Cheney. We should not be afraid of impeachment becuase it is a serious legal instrument for maintaining Executive accountability. FYI: I searched the NY Times, NPR, Newshour, Wash Post archives and aside from some blogging it is as if the Bush/Cheney record and the impeachment discussion among many citizens were non-existent.
I think Pelosi was/is wrong in stating 'impeachment off the table' since the credible threat of impeachment is a powerful constitutional check on Executive abuse of power. On a journalistic note, it would have been interesting to hear Mr Fein's thoughts on whether Reagan's Iran/contra actions deserved impeachment, if not conviction on same.

The first post didn't get published.

My husband and I were thrilled to see two so articulate and intelligent people as Nichols and Fein discuss rationally what we've known for a long time has been going on.

We both contacted Nancy Pelosi's office, our Senator, Ken Salazar's office, Rep. Diana Degette's Office, Representative Morris Udall and Representative Ed Perlmutter, everybody we could think of to indicate that impeachment should go back on the table

Thanks for airing such a critical piece on the state of our nation, especially the state of our President.

Over the years, you've questioned what I've questioned.
Nothing is as important as reining in this government gone wild.
I hope PBS will re-air your Joseph Campbell interview, one of your best pieces aside from this extremely critical issue!

I also sent a letter urging impeachment to my congressman (Earl Blumenauer, OR 3rd Dist.) His response (as explained to me on the phone by a staffer, as the letter itself made no sense) was that an ultimate trial in the Senate would not garner enough votes to remove Bush from office, so why bother, and; Karl Rove would like nothing more than to see this unfold before the American public. There you have it, the Democratic hack mindset, as exemplified by my representative, Pelosi, and (surprise!) John Conyers: all power to the Party and to hell with any legacy for the future.

I sent a letter to my Congresswoman as follows:

The U.S. government is in a Constitutional crisis: it is ill and needs medicine. Our whole concept of democracy, a government by the people, is in danger of eventually becoming a mere shell of itself.

We should be a nation of laws and not of men (or women). The President behaves as a monarch while his putative Vice President functions as a President. The two have fashioned tools for themselves from nothing catalogued in our Constitution. These contrivances have been used to eliminate citizens’ rights and will likely be passed on to the next President if, and only if, Congress doesn’t act to protect the citizens from such overreaching self-appointed powers.

The remedy for these ills lies in the very Constitution that gave us our nation: the medicine of impeachment.

The current Speaker of the House of Representatives has placed this relief off limits. The speaker, as did all representatives, swore to uphold the whole Constitution, not just parts of it. It is time for the members of the House to remind its Speaker that this country is in dire straits and must use this means in order to set the country back onto its Constitutional path.

This mechanism should not be used in retaliation for any previous action by one political party against the other, but for the repair of the democratic foundations of our nation. It should be exercised by all parties for the good of the country. The purpose should be for the Congress, in its oversight capacity, to defend the rights of the citizens against an oppressive, even despotic, Administrative branch.

It is time for you, my representative, and others like you to save our democratic government from further decay.

From the Stop LFAS Worldwide Network's newsletter:

I am the coordinator of the Stop LFAS Worldwide Network and we now have less than a handful of days to respond to NMFS's proposed ruling on SURTASS Low Frequency Active Sonar.

My Comments on the Media's Role - Using Bill Moyers & John Nichols Discussion on Impeachment are posted in the body of a discussion about the agency's and the media's manipulative manner of blocking the public's input.

--------------------

The press is calling it a "Preliminary Approval."

Here's a comment about the "Preliminary Approval" by NOAA/NMFS for the 5
year permit application regarding SURTASS LFA Sonar.

I have been very frustrated these last few days as I have been trying to put
together an understanding of what's happening with this "proposed ruling"
and the comment process.

This ruling is supposed to be in the proposal stage. There is a process
which is designed to include the public's input prior to the final ruling.
That process is our opportunity to not only comment on and influence a
proposed ruling ... but possibly to even turn the whole thing around.

SURTASS LFA Sonar is a dangerous technology to whales, shore birds and
coastal communities. This is a contentious issue; a point which this
rag-tag newsletter has been documenting since 1998.

I am frustrated that years of our combined efforts can not be made to produce a quick wrap-around response in a manner which is sufficient to this issue.

I am frustrated by the way the public has been "short-sheeted" as undesired guests at the Hotel Democracy. It's as if we don't own the place but are simply under the management's prerogative.

And I am frustrated that the media is informing one and all that the results
are already in. The press stories fail to bring the public's attention to
the comment period. In many of the posted articles, there is an absolute
lack of concern for the public's opportunity to respond and comment. The
press shows no regard for the comment period or anything the people might
want to say to NMFS because either they're not aware of it or they contend our contributions to this process will be ignored anyway. The comment period is therefore already deemed to have concluded before it has begun!

There may be letters to the editors of the papers who run these stories. Those same people who will respond to the editors will remain in the dark about the comment period which they could have known about if:

1) The media had afforded a complete and balanced depiction of the
required process

2) The stories printed didn't portray the whole thing as a "done deal"

Here's an example of journalism ethics to show y'all how they done us wrong:

As a resident of California, I'm aware of the fact that the media now deems it unprofessional to draw premature conclusions about national elections
before the polls close. It was observed and was well documented that early
claims of victory for one candidate or another in the Eastern United States
actually discouraged people in California from participating in the process. The "done deal" depiction of this public process is a known ploy for keeping people away from the polls. If left unchecked, the media thus dissuades people from participating in the process by making them believe that their
participation would be fruitless. It's extremely unprofessional journalism.
And it's an old ballot trick.

This SURTASS Low Frequency Active Sonar ploy looks like the same old media
trick. People could be reading about their opportunity to respond.
Instead, they receive information which inspires inertia.

Late last night, I turned on PBS and watched the impeachment interview with
Bill Moyers. A friend of mine had told me this was an important interview
so I saw it in the wee hours of the morning when it was on the air. There's
also a transcript to the interview at this location on the Internet:
http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07132007/transcript2.html

"July 13, 2007

Bill Moyers talks with Bruce Fein and John Nichols"

I want to share a snip from that interview which indicates the significance
of a manipulative press and why we MUST BE FURIOUS.

>>

JOHN NICHOLS: Let me mention the unspoken branch of government, which is the
fourth estate: The media. The fact of the matter is the founders anticipated
that presidents would overreach. And they anticipated that at times politics
would cause Congress to be a weaker player or a dysfunctional player. But
they always assumed that the press would alert the people, that the press
would tell the people. And the fact of the matter is I think that our media
in the last few years has done an absolutely miserable job of highlighting
the constitutional issues that are in play. You know, you can't have torture
and extraordinary rendition. You cannot have spying. You cannot have a--
lying to Congress. You cannot have what happened to Joe Wilson and Valerie
Plame, you know?

BILL MOYERS: When she was outed and they tried to punish--

JOHN NICHOLS: Plotted out of the vice-president's office without question.
Notations of the vice-president on news articles saying, "Let's go get this guy." Right? You know, you can't have that and not have a media going and saying to the president at press conferences, you know, "Aren't-- isn't what
you're doing a violation of the Constitution?" Now, just imagine if the-- if
the members of the White House Press Corps on a regular basis were saying to Tony Snow, "But hasn't what the president's done here violated the Constitution?" The whole national dialogue would shift. And Congress itself
would suddenly become a better player. So I'm not absolving Congress. I'm
certainly not absolving Bush and Cheney. But I am saying that we have a
media problem here as well.

We do indeed have a media problem.

This is a perfect example of that media problem.

Without an extension on the comment period, for this proposed ruling; there's no real means to inform the public about their role or their ability to contribute to the decision-making process. If the big media are selling this baby as a "done deal" - the only recourse is to convey more detailed and accurate depictions of the public's choices and the public's role through other, usually slower, information sources. There's insufficient time. There's insufficient awareness and there's insufficient opportunity to increase that awareness.

Gee. that must have happened by accident. NOAA/NMFS didn't see this date coming.

How could they have known that a five year permit would expire in five
years?

We could make a difference if they would work with us instead of against us.

I thought the program on civil rights and impeachment to be the most outstanding, informative, inspiring offering I have ever seen on TV. I hope that all our senators and representatives get to see or read the content and choose to act on it. Only PBS could accomplish this. Thank you.

I just wrote my Representative (again), John Sarbanes from the 3rd district in Maryland requesting he sign on with H.R. 333. This program so moved me! Fein and Nichols impressed me with their impassioned, articulate argument for impeachment. And Kudos to Mr. Moyers for getting a conservative and a liberal- it proves that this ought to be beyond party lines. When Mr. Nichols corrected Mr. Moyers and said impeachment was a cure for constitutional crisis, and not in fact the crisis itself I wanted to jump up and shout, I was so energized. This had not occured to me- we always frame this as retribution. As if we must be lowered into the mud in an endless round of shots back and forth to bring justice about. His statement showed that impeachment can be a noble and *healing* thing for this country. Indeed, we are not children. We will be better off, and so will the real children of this country, if we tell the whole truth of this episode.

Great conversation!. One thing I found missing from the conversation is the difficulty presented to Nancy Pelosi were the house to begin impeachment proceedings against both President Bush and Vice President Cheney. She could easily be attacked as trying to push them out to get into the White House herself.

BRAVO! The Impeachment program was one of the best ever. Bill Moyers' Journal is one of the best programs on the air. The guests are always interesting, but these 2 win the prize! I believe they advocated for "impeachment" with out actual removal from office. Most of the postings I've read seem to want Bush/Cheney out, but it just occurred to me who we get when they go...Ms. Pelosi who has disappointed me more than I thought possible. I no longer know which side she is on. Where would we be with her in charge?
However, I am heartened by your postings. There ARE lots of us out here. Speak up, write, email, FIGHT BACK!

Bill,
Thank you for your excellent
choice of John Nichols (Blue)
and Bruce Fein (Red). When brillant men speak the truth their color becomes PURPLE!

Thank you for presenting Bruce Fein. However, I was flabbergasted to hear him say something to the effect that the Congress contained no one who was familiar with and voted within the Constitutional power.

Surely, I misunderstood him because RON PAUL, who is not only in the Congress but is currently one of the presidential candidates in the Republican Party, has never voted for anything which is not within the power granted Congress by the Constitution.

Could you please get Mr. Fein to comment on this?

Again, thank you for the most excellent program.

How come I can't post anything on Libby, Eagles, Trade and more?

Does anyone know? is it closed?

Finally, how come there is no place to contact PBS? or B Moyers blog or am I missing something right in front of me?

I am a first time blogger so this is new. I guess this is really for the Journal staff. Why would you let Moyers appear ignorant of the other voices in Congress (House) who have already advocated Impeachment? Namely, Kucinich and the other 14. I am aware of busy recording schedules, writing editorials deadlines and other constraints. However, the same public for whom Moyers (and his two guests) advocates may well be put-off or off put by the apparently oblivious threesome we were allowed to view in that particular edition of the Journal.
Many other recent bloggers responding to this edition of the Journal also recognized the omission; eight in fact on July 15, mentioned Kucinich and/or his bill.
Anyway, my concern is really a backhanded complement to the Journal for presenting this excellent edition on the constitutional importance of impeachment as a last resort process rather than a stand-alone condemnation.
Cheers to future editions for continuing to be a positive provocative voice among the great PBS offerings. Thanks.

This is now being posted twice because the first time it didn't appear. Are the servers down?

Thank you Katherine the Greater, your words are true and valid and I am in total agreement. The unfortunate situation with having these "2 parties" and for so long, is that the vast majority of the USA is uninformed and apathetic unlike in Europe or Austalia, et al. Those who aren't, are not willing to stake their precious vote on an alternative candidate for fear of allowing this 'mass', who thoughtlessly waste their votes on sheer appearances and bravado, totally obscure any chance of their vote having even a slight impact. It is always a matter of voting for the lesser of 2 evils, it seems. Some, however, realize that that is the only valid option both morally and ethically and do vote for the best. Therefore we end up with jellyfish candidates who are afraid to put on the gloves for fear of losing all unless they see a majority of the populace is behind them. And even then it is difficult if they already are in the deep pockets. Often, those who do put on the gloves don't have much of a chance of winning to begin with and have not as much to lose; those are the ones to whom we should look for better 'facts'.

I have noticed that Joe Biden recently put on the gloves and started swinging. If he continues to do this honorably and without fail, recognizing that of the many candidates he seems best to combine honesty, courage, high intelligence and well rounded knowledge, in my opinion, and he would get my vote at this moment in time. He must not waver. This country is looking for a leader; not another follower.

Thank you, Bill, for the intelligent and passionate discussion which aired in Maine last night. It was more than refreshing to watch two individuals with a real love of our country and our constitution take on the topic of impeachment. Bravo to all three of you.

PBS, please reconsider your sharp turn to the right of a few years ago. I am no longer a financial supporter of my local PBS/NPR stations because the majority of your reporting is no better than that coming out of CNN and Fox. We need more journalists like Bill Moyers who are willing to ask difficult questions, and who interview intelligent people who do not reflect the views only of the rich and powerful.

Thanks for a great discussion regarding the impeachment of President Bush and VP Cheney. As much as I would not want the country to go through Impeachment Hearing, it is the right thing to do. This administration has taken too many liberties on the laws of this country. The rule of law is the backbone of this great country of ours and niether the president nor vice president should think they are above these laws.
I hope that the American people demand that these hearings be heard.

Dear Uninformed Bruce ( 7/16/07 @ 8:46 AM),

I just couldn't let this one go; especially after the blog just prior to it.

1) Please read the blog just before your's because it is directed especially to individuals like yourself.
2) First of all, you are the one misinformed; but because you think you are right, without being qualified, your opinion is essentially un useable for it does not contain any true facts, other than possibly that of 'the mass of America' not being of one mind. That part may be true, but does not mar the validity of Moyers views or comments.
3) If someone wishes to have a show with opposing viewpts, they are more than welcome to apply and aire their views, as long as they have validity.
4) If you wish to hear opposing views, you can continue to listen to FOX News, where you will get fair and balanced news; I know this because they say it on their networks.
5) Without meaning any disrespect, you really need to put yourself in check until such time as you do your due diligence in regard to the state of this country, this Congress and this administration. When you have completed your due diligence and have good and valid reasons for your opinion, than it may very well be worth something. Thank you!

i was disappointed in bill's interview of bruce fein and john nichols. He always favored mr. fein and the latter did about 75% of the talking. John nichols was very polite but must have been frustrated. surely bill could give a little more respect to mr. nichols. He interrupted mr nichols but not mr. fein and looked at fein much more than nichols. mr fein should also learn to be more respectful of his fellow guest.

I strongly urge you to review the many hearings that have been held by the Senate Judiciary Committee on the misdeeds of the Bush Administration. Senators Leahy, Schumer, Durbin and, even on occasion Specter, have expressed the very outrage you and your guest say are lacking in Congress. True, they haven't called for impeachment, but, as Senators, they should not, given that they would serve as judges. But I don't think it serves the cause to ignore the genuine outrage that has been expressed by these leaders. We all wish there were more like them. But please let's celebrate their courage and passion when discussing these issues. You might also take a look at the activities of Rep. Henry Waxman on the House side.

Kudos to Bill Moyers and PBS for discussing serious issues that other media source will not touch.

But I am pessimistic about any hope of impeachment proceedings against Bush and Cheney and about the likelihood of reining in the continued growth of executive power. The Congress is supine and shirking its duty to protect our constitutional system. The American people seem completely disconnected from their civic responsibilities. Too much Reality TV? - or is that Disconnection from Reality TV?

Jefferson noted that in the course of human history the tendency is for authority to advance and liberty to retreat. If we do not set our system in order, it might indeed require the manure of patriot blood to revive the tree of liberty.

Dear PBS

I will not be contributing to PBS now or anytime in the future as long as you continue to provide Bill Moyers a platform to spew his misinformation without providing opposing views. I will also be calling my representative to ask why our tax dollars continue to support an individual who is so out of touch with America that he cannot find any commercial broadcaster to provide a forum for him. How about giving the opposing side some air time, the mass of America is not calling for Bushes impeachment in spite of what Bill and his friends believe. It is blatantly obvious that Bill cannot wait for the impeachment hearings to begin.

"We are sitting on the tracks. We hear the train coming, we feel the rumble under us, but, because up the track there is a bend and we can’t see the rest of the track, we continue to sit where we are. It’s nice where we are, we are comfortable. We have all we need, although the vibration coming through the rails is rattling the table where our snacks are set out. We are listening to the radio, and they are not saying anything about the train. Neither is the TV. We have a vague, uneasy feeling. It’s probably nothing, although the sound is almost deafening now". ...............................................................................Anonymous

The country and the world are in crisis; more so than ever before and partially due to the constant spread of misinformation at a rapid pace. In addition, a good % of our population is uneducated and unread; substituting religious and philosophical beliefs and/or facts for the truth. It almost can't be helped because everyone thinks they are right; as do I. Only if one voraciously reads, thinks, discusses and uses their intellect and sensibilities in an open-minded fashion to pry and discover the truth from the pile of facts, misinformation and outright lies … using other’s opinions, especially valued opinions of educated but also wise observers, will the truths become apparent. Bill Moyers is one of those people.

“Three things cannot long be hidden … the Sun, the Moon and the Truth.” .........................Buddha

We know that accurate and complete info is lacking from the media; but even if available, only a small percentage of people have the education, time and inclination to not only gather the facts but also to assimilate them. This is an unfortunate side effect of a people driven to accumulating as much as they can in as short a time as possible. It is the side effect of lack of education, reasoning ability and ability to make wise choices. It is the side effect of a people who wish to be entertained; to watch sports, not do sports; to live vicariously thru the lives of 'desperate housewives' and 'survivors' et al. Additionally, it is a side effect of pride; the inability to listen, learn and change; in other words, an inability to gather information and put it to use by transforming one’s beliefs, philosophies, ideologies, etc. based on the continuing flowage of bits and pieces of the truth. Some say this is human nature; I say this is human nature sans humility and wisdom.

The issues presented here by Bill Moyers et al are issues that for a long time have been expressed in "The Media" that most Americans never get to see : that "Media" is the alternative press of the internet and the many blogs therein. After reading a good many of the letters sent in, I am convinced a good percentage of the commentators have never been to alternative web-sites where the news is alive and well. You'll have to find them on your own for this site won't let me list them.

“If the sage would guide the people, he must serve with humility. If he would lead them, he must follow behind. In this way when the sage rules, the people will not feel oppressed; when he stands before them, they will not be harmed.” ..........................................................................Lau Tzu

The MO of our government and probably most governments is one which seeks to glorify, justify and intensify it’s actions based on what the largest portion of that smallest percentage of the population holding the greatest amount of power, influence and wealth desires; even if that happens to be only one person e.g. Pharaoh, and even if it is against the will of the other 90%+ of the population. A product of this is the falsification of the news, the facts and the cover ups themselves to the point of absurdity. WORD of the day … SPIN. Without the dissemination of “true facts” as opposed to “any and all facts”, no wonder people are bewildered. When our leaders have consented to the appeasement of that small minority of the power and wealth brokers to constantly lie about the “true facts”, then “all facts” take precedent, becoming equal. The same can be said for people’s opinions. When opinions are based on misconceptions, ignorance, pride, manipulation, propaganda, etc. and are put forth head to head with “true facts”, they, in many people’s eye, become equal. This is neither accurate nor appropriate; but try telling that to a belligerent or unsophisticated or uneducated Everyman; you will be rebuffed. Yes, the “truth will out”; but not before great tragedy may unfold.They, the religious rightous, call themselves Christians; a word that has all but lost it’s true meaning. If anyone is to be believed in all of this, I put my money on the One to whom the Name deserves credit.

“Woe to you scribes and Pharisees (read religious fanatics) you frauds! … like whitewashed tombs, beautiful to look at … but inside full of filth and dead men’s bones. … hypocrisy and evil fill you within.”
......................................................................Jesus Mt 23:27-28

Hats off to you Bill Moyers, KO, SC, JS, FR, WRP, and a good few others for continually having the guts to present to the public that the 'emperor has no clothes'.

WE WILL REAP WHAT WE DESERVE IF WE DON'T ACT NOW.

PLEASE CONTACT YOUR CONGRESSPEOPLE AND DEMAND IMPEACHMENT; I HAVE AND I WILL CONTINUE TO DO SO; BE PERSISTENT AND ALSO KEEP EMAILING YOUR FRIENDS WITH BITS AND PIECES OF THE TRUTH.

Because of the present administration, the rest of the world fear and despise America. The only way to get trust and respect back would be to show that the American people honestly believe in truth, justice and freedom for all. The world needs to understand that we do not approve of the methods used by the present administration and that we are just as disgusted with Bush as they are. Presidential impeachment and criminal prosecution are the consequences of illegal acts against American that all other nations will understand and approve of.

If we want to promote democracy and lessen the threat of terrorism we don't need to start a world war on terrorism. What we need to do is demonstrate democratic power in action by getting rid of any political leader who threatens our individual rights and freedoms. This will prove that Americans do not approve of depots, imperialism or have imperialistic designs on other countries.

Terrorists are just dangerous criminals that have used the imperial attitudes of the Bush administration to recruit young malcontents to their cause. Once we return sanity to America, by removing Bush, the world will come to understand we are not warmongers or a threat to their culture or sovereignty. This will instantly calm the world and remove most of the support for terrorism.

Hard core terrorists are just dangerous criminals and we know how to deal with criminals. From Al Capone to Adolph Hitler to Bush, we've seen them come and go. We might not be able to stop every suicide bomber, but if we can pour a soothing balm on the breeding grounds of terrorism we can at least keep the problem in check.

The Government of the U.S. and its allies, hanged at Nuremberg and Tokyo, SOME individuals that committed less severe crimes than Cheney and Bush and SOME others that committed the same crimes as have these two and their accomplices. Impeachment is too soft.

"Just War", The Interrelated Predicates and Precedents of Nuremberg and the Iraq War
-
-Copyright 2007 by James M. Craven/Blackfoot Name: Omahkohkiaayo i'poyi
-

The privilege of opening the first trial in history for crimes against the peace of the world imposes a grave responsibility. The wrongs which we seek to condemn and punish have been so calculated, so malignant, and so devastating that civilization cannot tolerate their being ignored because it cannot survive their being repeated...
-
...We must never forget that the record on which we judge these defendants today is the record on which history will judge us tomorrow. To pass these defendants a poisoned chalice is to put it to our own lips as well. We must summon such detachment and intellectual integrity to our task that this trial will commend itself to posterity as fulfilling humanity...
-
-Opening address at the first Nuremberg Trial by Justice Robert H. Jackson, Representative and Chief of Counsel for the United States of America
-
“Calling a crime or body of crimes a “mistake”, is like calling rape “sex”.
-
"If they [the powers that be] can get us to ask the wrong questions, they need not fear the answers"
-
-THE INTERRELATED PREDICATES AND PRECEDENTS OF JUST WAR AND NUREMBERG
-
In the first Nuremberg Trial, 22 war criminals went on trial of whom 12 were hanged. They were all charged with varying levels of responsibility for five interrelated, concomitant and mutually supporting crimes:
-
a) Launching and Waging Aggressive and Illegal War; which implies--and if proved supports a charge of:
-
b) Conspiracy to Launch and Wage Aggressive Illegal War (since no parties go to war without planning and giving asserted reasons );
-
c) Crimes Against Peace (which all illegal wars, launched and waged on the basis of illegal conspiracy, imply and entail ,per se);
-
d) Crimes Against Humanity (which charges a, b, c, imply and entail per se by virtue of the known horrors and effects of war) and:
-
e) War Crimes (no such right of "self-defense" or "necessary measures" by those guilty of charges a, b, c, d, ).
-
At the time of the Nuremberg Trial, it was recognized that the foundation (sources, precedents and authorities) of "established" international law vis-a-vis the Nuremberg charges, was limited with respect to established principles and their widespread understanding, acceptance and application. This led to the charge by the defense at Nuremberg of the charges themselves representing a case of ex post facto: creating and applying legal principles, and even applicable international law, that did not exist at the time of alleged offenses having been committed. Thus, it was argued by the Defense that, at the time, the alleged offenses were not crimes however odious; and thus further, any prosecution would be an example of ex post facto.
-
The prosecution argued that in addition to established international law "(which evolves with customary use/acceptance" of certain principles; e.g. Conventions like the Hague Convention, Geneva Conventions etc) that established that the Nazis knew what they conspired to do and did was illegal, as attempts at cover-up reveal mens rea and consciousness of guilt (no need to cover-up what you believe to be clean only what you know to be dirty), there was also a body of established principles of "Just War" (JW) that the Nazis themselves had recognized. They, themselves, had actually referred to and made use of some of these JW principles in contriving the various phony pretexts that they employed for their own violations of those same principles in the various wars they launched and conducted. This is exactly what the Bush Administration does today.
-
Principles of "Just War (JW):
-
The principles of JW were primarily established, and were often concomitantly violated, by the Roman Catholic Church via writings and pronouncements ranging from: Marcus Tullius Cicero (106-43 B.C.); to Augustine (354-371 A.D.; to Thomas Aquinas (1225-1274 A.D.); to Francisco de Vitoria (1480 to 1546 A.D.); to Francisco Suarez (1548 to 1617 A.D.); up to various pronouncements by Popes Pius XII, John XXIII, Paul VI and John Paul II. They have had a large impact in informing and shaping the content and evolution of international law and have been repeatedly referred to even--or perhaps especially--by nations invoking them in order to contrive pretexts for violating them; as the Bush Administration has repeatedly done to attempt to justify preemption.
-
What Nuremberg established, is that no nation can claim exemption from the very principles it itself benefits from and invokes for its own purposes. This is especially in the case of invoking and using, as instruments of breaking international law and established principles, the very same laws and principles they are conspiring to break. It is somewhat like using free speech in the particular in order to destroy it in general or using the trappings of “democracy” de jure to destroy democracy de facto; it is much more and much more dangerous than mere naked hypocrisy.
-
From the common-sense premises of :
-
a) "no need to construct a phony event or context to try to justify that which is clearly “legitimate, or, what you believe to be “legitimate”;
-
b) “no need to cover-up what is clean only dirty”;
-
Then, the Nazi attack against Poland and all other Nazi attacks against other nations were aggresson and illegal per se.
-
The initial planning (Conspiracy) to set up a phony attack against a German radio station, using concentration camp inmates dressed as Polish soldiers, as a contrived pretext for a JW in "self-defense", made the attack and war in reality preemptive and without the very narrow JW criteria for a "just" preemptive attack.
-
Thus the war was aggressive, and thus the launching and waging of it illegal per se.
-
Thus the planning for an illegal and aggressive war was "Criminal Conspiracy" per se.
-
Thus the waging of the war and its effects constituted "Crimes Against Peace" and "Crimes Against Humanity" per se.
-
Thus many of the military actions and actions against civilians became "Crimes" and some "War Crimes" at various levels of culpability: a person, for example, doing or directing a home invasion, has no "right" of "self-defense" as if he shoots the homeowner, it is murder in the commission of a felony, whereas, if the homeowner shoots the home invader, or the one imminently directing him, it is self-defense).
-
The basic principles of JW can be broken down into Jus Ad Bellum (having to do with "Just Causes" of going to war) and Jus In Bello (having to do with "Just Conduct" in a Just War)
-
Principle I: JUST CAUSE: (AD BELLUM)
-
-There must be a Gross Injustice. It can be on the part of ONE and ONLY ONE of the contending parties. It must be for self-defense against imminent , present, credible, certain, and capable threats to life and actual survival, and/or imminent and intentional threats to innocent life, and/or imminent and intentional violations of human rights, and/or vindication of justice or avenging intentional wrong doing for purposes of deterrence of future lethal injustices and intentional wrong doing (this does not in any way sanction "Regime Change" as it cannot be selectively, opportunistically, unilaterally or preemptively applied in certain contexts and cases and not others).
-
The scenarios in which there might be a “Just Cause” for a peremptory attack are extremely narrow. There must be a clearly manifest and certain intent and capability on the part of the enemy, with no time or alternatives available in terms of possible deliberation or attempts to mitigate an imminent attack through non-military means.
-
Take the often cited case of U.S. forces encountering the Japanese force that attacked Pearl Harbor, who might have been able to claim being on a “military exercise”, without the 14-part Purple Code intercepts as to their real intentions. Under Just War (JW) criteria, the most the U.S. would have been able to do is signal Japan, give notice of intent to take out the Japanese force without proof of lack of hostile intent, and given notice of a line beyond which the U.S. was prepared to go to War. But neither JW nor international law at the time, would allow a preemptive attack against Japan on the basis of Japan's potentialities through military “preparations”, the militarization or capabilities of Japan, or even “uncertainty” as to the true intentions of the attack force against Pearl Harbor vis-à-vis what they “might” do against the U.S. Even the Japanese imperialists understood this as they had planned to deliver their notice of War and supposed reasons for it prior to the commencement of the attack on Pearl Harbor but were delayed in delivering it.
-
One of the most patently disingenuous post hoc rationales for the present realities of the Iraq War is the “Roach Motel Theory” (“guests check in but do not check out"). This says that the U.S. does not have the forces to fight dispersed forces of terrorism all over the world, so the present Iraq War is acting like a “Roach Motel”: drawing in and concentrating forces of terrorists from many nations in time and space to be killed more “efficiently”; this is especially sick and twisted as a rationale for the Iraq War.
-
Principle II: GROSS FORMAL MORAL GUILT ON ONE SIDE (AD BELLUM)
-
Material moral wrong is not sufficient. This means that the guilt of the enemy must not only be implicit and even material (objective but perhaps unintended effects), but it must be formal and clearly substantial or extensive and clearly intended even beyond the levels of willful blindness or depraved indifference (consequences clearly predictable by a reasonable and prudent person and thus likely intended).
-
Principle III: UNDOUBTED KNOWLEDGE OF GUILT (AD BELLUM)
-
The guilt of the enemy must be undoubted and not datable by a reasonable and prudent person free of subjectivity; this is even to the point of being free of a “Gettier problem”. The Gettier concept, having to do with epistemic certainty (how do we really “KNOW” anything and on what basis can we be responsibly “certain” something is true and thus responsibly assert and act on the basis of such something being true?). In his Is Justified True Belief Knowledge? by Edmund L. Getter, (in Knowledge and Belief, A Phillips Griffiths, ed, Oxford; Oxford U Press, 1967, pp 144-146) Gettier notes that even if something is true, and an individual believed it to be true, and sound reasons exist for that person to be justified in believing something to be true, still, nonetheless, there may be an insufficiency of foundation for “knowing”—and thus acting on the basis of—something held to be true. This applies especially to the supposed “solid” basis or epistemological/evidential “foundation”, of “knowing” or believing Saddam Hussein had WMD as a pretext for a preemptive attack.
-
And since JW principles also include “right intention” for going to war (no ulterior motives allowed), and mens rea (state of mind and intent) of the decision makers at the time of a decision to go to war is very much at issue, then what intelligence the decision makers actually had available at the time of decision making to go to war is also very much at issue. That means after the overthrow of Saddam Hussein, it is immaterial what new documents they come up with documenting WMD if those documents were not available at the time of decision making to go to war. One cannot use “Divine Inspiration” or Calvinistic Preordination as "One of the Elect" as a cause for going to war and then look for “evidence” God was right in how He inspired the "Elected" decision maker.
-
Principle IV: WAR CAN ONLY BE CONDUCTED BY A COMPETENT, POLITICALLY LEGITIMATE AUTHORITY IN CHARGE OF THE PUBLIC ORDER BEING DISTURBED (AD BELLUM)
-
This is the main reason why no one nation has legal “standing” to summarily and unilaterally act in the name of or for another nation or group of people being oppressed. The U.S. has no legal standing to act outside of international and internationally recognized treaties, structures, authorities, organizations and mandates; especially those it invokes for itself selectively. The U.S. may go to war as a last resort because of attacks against U.S. citizens and imminent threats to the U.S. and its own survival and “public order”; but may not unilaterally and preemptively act in the name of victims and “public order” in say Darfur outside of international and internationally-recognized organizations, structures and mandates.
-
The reasons for this principle should be obvious: nations could, as they routinely do in the present, pick and choose which “horrors” they wish to stop and which “public orders” they wish to “restore”, and, in the course of things, not only generate new horrors and disturb new “public orders”, but, as in the case of Iraq, make the horrors they are purporting to stop and the public order they are purporting to restore even worse. This, in fact has been the record of preemptive U.S. covert and overt operations all over the world: a long chain of "Blowbacks" (operations producing the exact and very costly opposites of intended effects) from which the world and the U.S. have never escaped or recovered.
-
Principle V: RIGHT INTENTIONS FREE OF REVENGE, BLOODLUST, And HIDDEN GEOSTRATEGIC AGENDA AND STRICTLY CONFINED TO THE GOALS CONNECTED WITH THE “JUST CAUSES” FOR WAR. (AD BELLUM)
-
This means that the intentions and reasons for war are advanced and vetted at the time of commencing war; and decision makers do not get to make it up as they go along or selectively contrive new rationales as old ones are exposed as unfounded or worse. No nation gets to contrive reasons let alone switch from contrived reason to contrived reason as each previous reason gets exposed as bogus (e.g. from WMD to 9-11 to "Regime Change" to "war abroad to protect the homeland from war here" ). How to know real intentions? Consistency is one way; classified memos like those in the book The Price of Loyalty: The Education of Paul O’Neill by Ron Suskind is another way.
-
If a nation is purporting to go to war to save victims of oppression in Iraq, and even convinces the UN to go along and authorize it, then it still begs the question why it is not seeking the same in other places where even worse oppression is going on. Having oil on your soil is not sufficient reason why the forms of oppression and disturbances of “public order” you face are more critical than the same conditions faced by countries that have no geostrategic locations and resources.
-
Principle VI: WAR SHOULD ONLY BE DECLARED WHEN EVERY MEANS TO PREVENT IT HAVE BEEN EXPLORED, TRIED AND HAVE FAILED. (AD BELLUM)
-
There are so many insider accounts from the Bush and other administrations in U.S. history that document thoroughly intention to go to war (Gulf of Tonkin in Vietnam and WMD in Iraq) supported by intention to contrive phony intelligence and rationales for going to war. Not only were the means and institutions like the UN and its Charters, designed to prevent war, not recognized, explored and attempted, they were, in fact , as in the case of the Iraq War, used, circumvented, corrupted, cherry-picked and even used as instruments for creating conditions to go to war rather than conditions to mitigate it.
-
Indeed the clear body of instruments of Imperial Social Systems Engineering that the U.S. and other nations have developed, is about generating conditions, exacerbating contradictions and even providing supposed JW rationales for going to war. Imperial Social Systems Engineering is about "engineering" what is commonly known as "manufactured consent" or "perception management" in the interests of imperial control and hegemony; it is not about mitigating war as an instrument for handling intern-nation disputes.
-
Principle VII: JUSTICE MUST FAVOR THE SIDE OF THE OFFENDED NATION BUT NO NATION HAS ABSOLUTE JUSTICE ON ITS SIDE (AD BELLUM)
-
All nations must understand that it is the governments of nations that declare and go to war; it is the citizens who suffer. Further, when considering say historical reasons for why a given nation has a “Just Cause” for War if disputes cannot be resolved through non-violent means, it is important to understand that historical time frames are easily contrived and framed for propaganda and other purposes. For those, for example, who decry the alleged crimes of a Khomeini, would there have been a Khomeini without a Shah?; and would there have been a Shah without the violent overthrow of the democratically elected Mossadegh regime by the U.S. CIA in 1953? The same question applies with respect to Saddam Hussein once a darling of the U.S. imperial establishment as was Osama Bin Laden and the Taliban who were armed and supported by the U.S., to draw the Soviets into Afghanistan to "give them their own Vietnam" (see Interview with Brezinski).
-
Principle VIII: THE INTENDED AND LIKELY “BENEFITS” OF WAR IN TERMS OF WRONGS THAT ARE STOPPED AND “PUBLIC ORDER” RESTORED MUST LIKELY OUTWEIGH THE LIKELY COSTS OF THE WAR IN TERMS OF SUFFERING AND DESTRUCTION. (AD BELLUM)
-
This means that before a nation goes to war, it must plan and assess carefully. It must consider ALL information and expertise available, with no cherry-picking and contrived “intelligence” or “framing” allowed by the doctrine of “Right Intention”, the likely costs and benefits (before, during and after the formal cessation of war including reconstruction) on ALL potential parties including those nations in no way parties to the war. What have the true costs of the Iraq War and other imperial adventures really been on the purported victims being “saved” and also on developing nations (e.g. high gas prices, refugee flows, spin-off terrorism etc) that have had no part to the war but have only been victims of it?
-
Principle IX: THERE MUST BE A GROUNDED AND REASONABLE PROSPECT OR HOPE FOR SUCCESS (AD BELLUM)
-
A nation may have all the elements for the prosecution of a Just War on their side but have no realistic hope of prevailing. This is the case with many Indigenous Nations today. JW Doctrine says that given the likely horrors of any war, and especially the effects on innocents, having “just causes” and even an imperative from the prospect of national survival to go to war, that is still not sufficient. Each nation must consider if it is not only trying to delay the inevitable (this also applies to the issue of continuation of a JW as well as launching and prosecuting one) in facing overwhelming force with the result of only more death and destruction on innocents with no prospects of a JW having anything but an inexorable unfavorable outcome. This means that the so-called "Samson Option" of Israel, to light-off their 200 or so nuclear weapons and take down the whole "temple" (planet earth) if they deem their own national survival to be threatened, is, in addition to being patently illegal and a violation of JW, also just plain monstrous and highly narcissistic and chauvinistic.
-
Principle X: THE LIKELY EFFECTS OF THE METHODS AND INSTRUMENTS OF WAR AS MEASURED IN LIKELY DEATH AND SUFFERING MUST NOT BE GREATER THAN THE WRONGS BEING STOPPED AND/OR GOOD BEING ESTABLISHED. (AD BELLUM AND IN BELLO)
-
This principle again establishes a burden to make a good-faith attempt to realistically assess and forecast and weigh the likely effects—“positive and negative”—on all potential parties (including global spillover effects). This JW principle and mandate is to ensure that the net result will not likely be greater harm than any good coming from purported evils to be stopped or purported good to be established via a war that meets all other tests of JW.
-
Principle XI: CIVILIANS AND NON-COMBATANTS (Those not intentionally, directly and materially engaged in support of combatants) MUST BE DIFFERENTIATED FROM COMBATANTS AND NO INTENTIONAL FORCE IS TO BE DIRECTED AGAINST THEM. (Jus in Bello)
-
This principle recognizes that although so-called “collateral damage” is inevitable in war, it must be totally accidental, not predictable by an average and reasonable person, and all attempts to mitigate it must be pursued and built into military operations, tactics, weapons uses and strategy. This principle prohibits embargos of materials for primary use by civilians (even in some potential dual-use cases like critical chlorine to clean water to prevent cholera and typhus as a result of 70 % of Iraqi water treatment plants knowingly and calculatingly bombed), the likes of the bombings of Dresden, Hiroshima, Nagasaki etc. This means that the deaths of over 500,000 Iraqi children from embargos are not, as Madeline Albright characterized them, "acceptable costs" or "acceptable collateral damage" from the points of view of Just War, International Law and the presedents of Nuremberg.
-
Civilians and non-combatants are defined and differentiated from combatants not in terms of whether or not they have tied yellow ribbons, screamed “Banzai” or have attended Nuremberg rallies, but on the basis of whether or not they have given intentional, material and direct support to combatants.
-
CONCLUSION:
-
The reasons for acceptance and authority of international law and the principles of “Just War” are the same as those for any law. Where there are contradictions, there are contending interests and parties. Where there are contradictions, contending interests and parties, and, where those contending parties are unevenly endowed with weapons and capabilities that, when used, in the particular, can damage or destroy the whole, then each of the parties enjoying the benefits of the whole must abridge/limit some of their supposed “rights” and capabilities in the particular, in the interests of the preservation of the whole that the individual parties gain benefit from being a part of. This also applies in that all individuals, groups or nations must respect for others, the very same rights and protections that they assert for and benefit from themselves. That is why in the U.S. for example, like in most societies, municipal laws are trumped by country laws that are trumped by state laws that are trumped by federal laws: so that potentially destructive contradictions and interactions on the micro level do not spill over to compromise the survival and stability of the macro.
-
So it is with international law especially in the age of very sophisticated weapons of mass destruction and other capabilities that may be used as weapons of mass destruction given the possible global spillover effects as we are presently witnessing. The alternative is something like Mad Max Beyond the Thunder Dome—where even in “Barter Town” they had laws and institutions like “Break a deal, face the wheel”—in which the literal survival of the whole planet is threatened by the unchecked lawlessness, ambitions, ruthlessness, destructive capabilities and hubris of predatory and ruthless terrorists---imperial and otherwise.
-


Posted by Omahkohkiaayo i'poyi at 4:08 PM


At no time in our past, has our Country been so gravely threatened; not Hitler, Not Stalin, or the missles of October. For the Destructiveness of enemies within our midst, far out weigh the threat of those abroad. Cheney first, then W, their belligerence and flagrant destructive actions against us, the People, DEMAND Impeachment, War Criminal Trials, and a traitor's death.

Thank you Bill, and PBS, for adding to the growing wake up call; I am beginning to gain back some of my lost hope!

.

Lincoln once said: "Our safety, our liberty, depends upon preserving the Constitution of the United States as our fathers made it inviolate. The people of the United States are the rightful masters of both Congress and the courts, not to overthrow the Constitution, but to overthrow the men who pervert the Constitution."

That would be impeachment. Without it, we have abdicated our freedom, our liberty and our rights as the determining force in our government. Who are we to hand over this freedom that so many previous generations fought and died to preserve? I will not squander my freedom, or fail to defend my Constitution due to any amount of bullying or fear.

These freedoms that we take for granted have been paid for already, and in blood. Our vigilance is required, not optional.

I can think of few truths more self-evident than the need to impeach these two homegrown war criminals. An aggressive war is a violation of the laws of war.
Thank you for bringing reason to a discussion which the press has made murky with their usual timid defense of the status quo. You successfully established the responsibility of each of us to restore our democracy from the malignancy of this antidemocratic precedent.

Therewith, hope is restored.

Dear Bill Moyers: Your program Friday, July 13, 2007, was superb. You, Bruce Fein and John Nichols said what needed to be said, to get us back on the right track, for the sake of this country. We are in a terrible situation since the unprovoked war against Iraq, all because of a mistaken belief that we can police and bully the world, and rewrite the Constitution per the wishes of the occupant of the White House. Thank you for clarity, courage and a belief in the need to do what is right.

Mr. Green

Impeachment is on the table. Dennis Kucinich has introduced H.R. 333, calling for the impeachment of Cheney. It is inexcusable that Moyers, Nichols and Fein failed to mention this and many of us are wondering if they seriously want impeachment or just want to discuss it. Discussion is fine, but we need action. Call your house representatives and demand that they support H.R. 333! And support Dennis Kucinich for president. Clinton and Obama will not change anything. Ron Paul might, but Dennis Kucinich has a long history of standing against this administration. He doesn't have the money to compete, so he is not taken seriously. Go to his website, research his record. We can talk until we are blue in the face, but it is time to act. Do your research and call your representative, if you want to do more than just talk. The Bush administration is destroying our country; if you agree with this statement, do something!

Thank you so much for being one of few voices of truth, and honest in depth investigation, etc.

In your programs, especially this past week about impeachment, why has there not been any mention of Ron Paul who is standing out like a beacon of light in pitch darkness on the subject of saving, restoring, and protecting the constitution, civil liberties and drastically reducing the size and extent of our government? Could you not do an interview with him? Thanks much.

We need a March on Washington to demand our representatives take immediate action. Something on the scale of the "Million Man March".

And we should do it every month if necessary to show them we will not put up with dictators nor will we allow our military, CIA, NSA to torture anyone or strip us of our privacy.

Investigation And Impeachment

Three points. First, thanks so much for your one hour interview on the impeachment issue. It was very enlightening and timely. Your guests, John Nichols and Bruce Fein were very adept at pointing out the need to begin the impeachment process now. They see it as a "cure" or remedy to the over-reaching of powers the administration is establishing that would become a precedent for future administrations. Stopping its growing dictatorial powers is one of the most important issues of our time. We can't shrug our shoulders and ignore it.

Second, George Bush and his advisors have committed, and are still committing, a massive criminal fraud against the country. They've committed a multitude of impeachable offenses, but this one offense, deceiving the people and Congress about prewar intelligence to justify a war with Iraq, is enough to convict the defendants of high crimes and misdemeanors. This is not even controversial. It has been accurately detailed by Elizabeth de la Vega, a former US federal prosecuting attorney of twenty years. She devoted two years researching the fraud and reported it in a proposed grand jury hearing in United States v. George W. Bush et al. It's a book every person and every member of Congress ought to read.

Third, in that light, how can a president who tricked the American people and Congress into war, be allowed to continue the fraud as the sole decider in carrying out the war? It makes no sense. And Congress ought to operate from that perspective. It's a pity Congress continues to honor George Bush's authority when they should be challenging it. Ignoring the fraud probably has much to do with Congress' extremely poor rating in the polls. If Nancy Pelosi values the balance of powers established in the Constitution, she would put impeachment back on the table. The people are way ahead of her (45% are for impeaching President Bush, and 54% for impeaching Vice President Cheney). George W. Bush's role as "the decider" in war matters, has no credibility.

I was overcome with joy when I watched this program. Mr. Nichols and Mr. Fein spoke eloquently and magnificently. The American people must now rally and begin to act.

These are truly Dark times for this country and Mr. Moyers, Mr. Fein, Mr. Nichols and PBS have a Great Light shining through them, God's light.

I want people to know that this Government is also torturing Americans too using Directed Energy Non Lethal bio electromagnetic weapons. I am one of those being tortured and there are others. I have never known that such horrific evil could exist until they began to attack me a few years ago and that my own government would do such evil things.

YES!! Impeach Chaney and Busch.

Send a LOUD wake up call to congress to STOP the ABUSE of POWER and HORRIFIC CRIMES AGAINST THE AMERICAN PEOPLE.

My story can be read in a News blog entitled "Mind Control Directed Energy"
at www.myfoxny.com

God Bless Us All

More vile than either Bush or Chaney is Nancy Pelosi in whom we placed our trust and gave our votes. Nothing strikes more at the heart of this country than these impostors who claim to represent the people but actually support the continued debasement of our Constitution by this illegitimate government. We need laws to protect us against these lying politicians.

Bruce Fein is intelligent, articulate, straight forward and appears to be an honest man. It's hard to believe such a scholarly person could have lent any support to the Clinton impeachment proceedings. Now that he's provided us with some clarity perhaps he can tell us how to get out of this mess despite our very disappointing representatives.

Let this fantastic show be a catalyst for discussion, action and change! Donate to PBS and let them know you are doing this specifically out of gratitude for Bill’s show, and encourage more shows like this. Write your elected officials with links to Bill’s show. Educate everyone - your family, friends, neighbors, classmates; expand beyond “the choir”. Write the media demanding they do their job, although given the current control of the media, change may be difficult. It is largely the absence of media coverage of such important information that has allowed so many to be lulled into a stupor with “reality” shows, while the true reality, our country and our Constitution are being decimated. People cannot respond to that they don’t know about, so until the media does a better job, we must educate others. Write all the presidential candidates telling them to put country ahead of personal political ambitions. All their time, energy and money invested in campaigning could well be for nothing if we don’t first address and resolve our huge immediate crisis; we may well have NO elections in 2008 if this continues!

It is easy to feel hopeless since our government and much of media have failed us, but people power works! Just look back to a month ago; the ill-conceived Immigration Bill failed largely due to pressure from the people. The people-powered Civil Rights Movement of the 1960’s resulted in tremendous, unthinkable changes. Search the internet for information on what companies contribute to whom, and boycott those companies contributing to elected officials or to causes detrimental to this country. If you’re invested in these companies, pull out. Encourage your family, friends, neighbors, classmates to do the same. As in the Civil Rights boycotts, as in South Africa, change will more likely come through impacting these companies financially.

We have little time. In May 2007 bush signed Presidential Directive 51, granting him extraordinary powers under martial law. bush’s declining public support, Chertoff’s “gut feeling”, bush’s “feeling in his head”, and escalating problems with Iran lead me to a very bad feeling that the stage is being set to implement PD51 soon, especially troubling as we enter the presidential election cycle. This group has been planning for 20 years. It seems not likely they will give up all this power to Democrats in ‘08. This group met with no resistance over questionable elections in 2000 and 2004, what’s to stop them from calling the whole thing off in 2008 and letting bush carry on under martial law. Throughout history, in extraordinary times, the people have acted and brought about change. Can there be a more critical time than now?

What a great disscusion , absoultly Bush and Cheney should be impeached,they are war crimminals.How many
people have to die before the neocons are happy and we control the oil in Irac,no oil no war. How many car bomb went off in Irac, every week before we arrived.

Fellow citizens: given that al quaida is more properly called al ciada, given that 911 was an inside job, given that most of us are hopelessly brainwashed by a media owned by the military industrial intelligence drug smugling cleptocracy - - given that another act of synthetic terrorism will unleash our fascist state even further from the rule of law its hard to feel hopeful that an impeachment process will address the rot in our political system.

Thank You Bill for giving Bruce Fein and John Nichols the chance to be heard. They are right and I find it comforting to be able hear a conservative idealog like Fein, who's point of view I have never admired, speaking clearly and and to the point on a solution to the mess that the country is in. This must be heard by the Congressional Leadership. It may give them some courage and back bone to act for the salvation of the country.and the service of some one besides themselves.

The Bush Administration has been deaf to all criticism even from bi-partisan sources such as the Iraq Study Group. Certainly the Administration has been deaf to public opinion. This immutabilty has made me feel fully disenfrancised as a citizen; I have been opposed to virtually every policy and action Bush has taken with regard to the war, terrorism, human rights, and the environment. My conscience has been deeply troubled about the state of our democracy and my responsibility to oppose actions taken by the government in my name. I believe impeachment proceedings against the President and Vice President are necessary to preserve the Constitution.
I also think Moyers was right to hammer on the question about Americans' fear of terrorism as a justification of Bush Administration Policy. Our fear of danger has led too many of us, including me, to be silent too long while the freedom our nation prizes has been threatened most greviously by Cheney and others in the White House who disdain the Constitution. I will contact my representatives and ask them to take action on impeachment. Thank you for addressing this issue head-on.

In November, 2004 when der Fuhrer Bush was "elected" yet again, it only served to illustrate just how corrupt the US government had become. This is an interesting dialog, but BushCo has hijacked America and nothing short of a full-blown revolution will wrest from them the omnipotent power they have criminally procured for their folly. Good luck, America. You're going to need it.

Dear Mr. Moyers,
Thank you for first-rate journalism, so badly needed in this time of crisis when a power-hungry president and his maniacal vice-president are rapidly undermining our constitution.
They both should be impeached. Their behavior should not be allowed to stand. Otherwise, others will be encouraged to try the same thing.

A great show and its good to know that there are some people out there who share the same view on the subject.I hope sooner than later more people will come around I think most people fell like ther is no way to eprees their feeling either by there chosen representatives or anywher.

The question is fascist - "In time of war" - Neocons made the war, did 9-11, cheated the vote, are taking away our liberties, torturing people, bombing us, preparing to do it all again. And have taken over PBS. We must boycott and protest constantly to overthrow these neonazi corporate globals, and be free. Thank you.

I want to thank you from the bottom of my heart for this evenings program. I can truly say that I haven't been so moved by one single event or program as I have been this evening. As soon as Mr. Moyers closed I came right to my PC. Now I am not a rich man, in fact I am a poor man. By that I wanted to let you know that deep down inside, I feel that no one wants to hear my I have to say. As God is my witness, I said to hell with anyone wants to hear what I have to say, I am going to say it. I as I feel alot of Americans somehow feel that despite the fact that the President is doing alot of things wrong, should he be impeached. I now know that something has to be done and impeachment in a step in the right direction for the country as awhole.

I also want to say that I agree with Mr. Nichols with regards to the media. I admit I may have missed something but I have they haven't said it loud enough. Where is the Times, The Wall Street Journal and even 60 Minutes. I could never put my finger on why I stopped watching 60 Minutes but after this program I now know.

Thanks again and God Bless

The dialogue with Bruce Fein and John Nichols was one of your best shows yet. Thank you for presenting this discussion to the American people in a way that shows that impeachment is a good thing for the country and that it is past time for this administration to be reigned in. If this is not done now it will set a precedent that will forever doom our government and our Constitution. You continue to do a great service not just to Thirteen and PBS, but to our country. On September 15th there will be a march in Washington to show support for impeaching the Bush/Cheney administration. I urge everyone who sees their secrecy, lies and power grabs as not just objectionable, but as the illegal acts and threat to our Constitition that they are, to take part.

I greatly appreciated the discussion of impeachment and the severity of the violations of law and our Constitution in which Bush & Cheney have engaged. I was disappointed, however, that no one mentioned Representative Kucinich bill to impeach Richard Cheney. He and it needs massive support from the electorate, in my opinion.

very interesting program it makes you feel good that you are not alone in your thought but it makes you feel bad how many people are not aware of whats going on

I was very pleased to see this discussion finally happening on television. Perhaps a copy of this discussion should be sent to the members of congress. I'm not being facetious. I'm inclined to agree that noone seems to understand the constitution and the government has seemingly just believes that they are there for politics not to do the people's busines and to protect the people's rights. Thank you Lillie Galan

I watched the Moyers broadcast on impeachment twice to be sure I had it all right. And I do. I am writing to Pelosi, my senators and congressman, and want to do more but don't know what.
I am frightened. And where are the candidates? Where is the media?

Thank you for the journal on impeachment! The maddening thing is that few people understand how grave a crisis is under way; few people understand the constitution or the framers' intent. George Washington and Thomas Jefferson must be revolving in their graves.

Bush and Cheney MUST GO!!

Bruce Fein says no one is standing up in Congress to press Nancy Pelosi and the Judiciary committee to open an impeachment investigation. Wrong! Dennis Kucinich has introduced a resolution to that effect and 14 representatives have signed on.

Excellent discussion with Bruce Fein and John Nichols. Useful to take the Democrats to task once again for their profiles in uncourage. But puzzling, indeed, especially after Nichols explained what someone in Congress needs to say to Pelosi, that none of you mentioned that Dennis Kucinich has done just that. And doesn't John Conyers deserve credit for his earlier attempts to keep impeachment on the table?

Thank you Bill Moyer for this valuable service to your country. Thanks also to Bruce Fein; you are the essence of a true conservative. I hope we also here more from Kevin Phillips the author of the term "silent majority", becuase he is equally critical of the Bush Administration.

When I hear we need to stay in the Iraq war to win. I wonder what do they mean? Is it that if we win in Iraq, we'll have their oil? An essay by Koppel on PBS radio commented that "blood for oil" was okay, just part of our present world situation.

I've decided to e-mail my members of congress daily to insist that they cut-off
ALL monies to the Executive Branch.
I've had Congressman Bleumenauer deflect Impeachment requests cos 'it'll distract us from doing our best'. ???!!!

Thanks for the fantastic commentary and
details.

we sent our representatives an e mail to begin impeachment hearings. We want the Congress to examine what is in this presidential 'tool-box' that gets passed on to future presidents.

This week's program on the "constitutional crisis"
over the war debate was absurd. The constitution is working just fine which is why there is a freedom to debate. The Party of Defeat (Democrats) just can't deliver the votes to
force an end to Iraq, because most Americans want
to fight to win it, but are fed up with the PC war being waged because of liberals. The liberals have
wanted to frame the debate
as a new Vietnam/Nixon, etc.
The crocadile tears over
the war, the troops, and on
and on are a rehash of 60's
defeatist rhetoric and inside they couldn't be happier that they can relive glory days. Come on gang, get this in your heads, wrap your hearta and minds around this truth: there is no war in Iraq...
only a battlefield in the war against the Jihadists
who have openly declared a
Jihad to the death against
the west (you). That's all
we need to know to attack and destroy Al Qaeda. Intended or not we now have a kill box for Jihadists in
Iraq, and our forces, in spite of the PC burden are
absolutely decimating Al
Qaeda. Now, if we "end the war in Iraq" it does not end the Jihad. What plan
do the liberals, democrats,
have to destroy the Jihadists? How will they
defend America? I don't think you have a plan and that you are handwringingly
incapable of doing anything but talk your way to the
death of the west. Respond.


Every one of our representatives needs to be reminded of their oath to serve
the people and protect the U.S. Constitution.

We can only hope that the media FINALLY stands with the people in removing these criminals from office.

IT IS TIME!

A powerful lesson!

Now the question: Who in Congress is so dedicated to the principles of our Constitution that he/she will put the good of this nation above personal self-interests?

The Executive Branch seems to disregard the Constitution at every turn. And the Legislative Branch seems to allow the President and his men/women to "kick sand in its face."

So who in Congress has the integrity to do what is right? Who will stand tall and take on the "Patrick Fitzgerald role" now?

It is time the congressional representatives that we the people have "hired" -- read, understand, and follow the laws -- contained in our Constitution!

Our Constitution states:

* Article 1, Section 8, Page 9, "... To raise and support Armies, but no Appropriation of Money to that Use shall be for a longer Term than two Years;..."
* Source: http://www.gpoaccess.gov/constitution/html/conart.html

From coast to coast we the people must hold ALL who represent us, accountable; after all we pay their salary.

The poll question was overly broad and used the term "any means necessary". Obviously the true answer lies somewhere between both options. It would be more enlightening to be more specific in the poll. The question smacks of sand bagging for the left to me. I enjoyed the discussion like most other posters. I believe it would have been much more valuable had Fein and company had to support their arguments for impeachment against a skilled debator from the other side as opposed to simply returning the softball question lobbed to them by Mr. Moyers. A reasoned debate is much more significant than a diatribe from three committed adversaries of the Bush administration.

Sir:

Thank you for broadcasting an unequivocal and well-argued call for impeachment. I wish that it were more likely actually to be done. It seems to me unlikely in part because to do so would amount to an admission that, for all the discussion in your program about the genius of the founding fathers, there is a serious flaw in a political system that continually puts impeachable people into office. Consider the list: Nixon, who escaped impeachment only by resigning; Reagan, whose actions over Iran/Contra, while more bumbling than mendacious, hardly seemed constitutional; Clinton, whose crimes were not at all high but nevertheless distastefully tawdry; and now Bush, whose crimes are high indeed. Were his recent predecessors of more consistently unimpeachable character then his appaling record would have long since led to proceedings against him. But instead standards have become so low that he doesn't stand out as being dramatically worse than others whom the Republic has survived.


I urge you in a future program to take the next step. Pleae go beyond calling for impeachment of the current executive, and examine why we keep electing such people, and what needs to change.

Forget about impeachment, let's start looking at war crimes trials for Bush and Cheney. More than 3000 Americans dead for nothing and tens of thousands of Iraqis, not to mention our lowered standing in the eyes of the world. The whole Iraq war is based on Cheney's lies to congress and the American people. If nothing else, let's give that whole sleazy Republican mob a good send-off in November 2008....not that the dems are any better, mind you.
P.S. For more info on the fourth branch of governement, watch the PBS video "The Dark Side".

Thank you for breaking the media silence and having the most informative and vital discussion on impeachment in a public forum thus far.
I am puzzled, though, why after your repeated questions of why no one in Congress is attempting to hold this administration accountable that Mr. Fein, Mr. Nichols and you never mentioned that Representative Dennis Kucinich is attemtpting to do just that. HR 333, introducing articles of impeachment against Vice President Cheney, now has 14 co-signers. And Senator Russell Feingold attempted unsuccessfully to move to censure President Bush early last year for violating FISA and the Fourth Amendment to the Constitution.
We are down the rabbit hole in this country: we have now a president who for the first time in our nation's history has admitted to an impeachable offense by violating the Fourht Amendment and announcing his intention to continue to violate the Fourth Amendment. Yet only now after his commutation of 'Scooter' Libby's sentence have the American People reached a 'tipping point,' demanding impeachment be put 'back on the table.' There has been a grassroots impeachment movement in this country ever since the Downing Street Memo was leaked to the press demanding this administration be held to account for its deception, its secrecy, and its dangerous expansion of powers. Mr. Nichols is right: where has the media been for the last three years?

Great show (7-13-07), but why has it taken all these years for anybody to join me in worrying about the Constitution? The abuses have been blatant.
Kenneth L. Zuber

The commentary is very important and revealing. The big question I have is do you want DC in the White House if GWB is impeached? Further more if both GWB & DC are impeached who takes over the White House? I personally think the entire staff needs to impeached including KR, DR, PW and key department leaders who have lied to Congress and the American People for the last 7 years.

I just watched the best show of yours i have seen yet! My husbands statements are always that nothing will make a difference. i now feel maybe something will come of this - if more people will follow your show. please continue the great job you are doing of giving us the news - not what you think will raise ratings. i am 62 years old and must say i feel more encouraged now than i have in a long time.

Thanks Bill. It has been clear to me since 9/11 that something stinks in DC and its name is Bush-Cheney-Rove. I think these guys deserve to be
tried and imprisoned for a very long time for not only overreaching their power but lying, stealing and collusion with Saudis. Apart from that, Ms Pelosi should be ashamed of herself for not having the decency to listen to what the American people and her constituency have been saying about impeachment. How dare she claim "it's off the table". And finally, I am happy to see Ms Cindy Sheehan, despised by so many for speaking the truth and refusing to just disappear, is running against Pelosi to force her hand in this issue. I only wonder why we are not all out in the streets demanding impeachment, trial and imprisonment. Bush and Cheney will go down in history as WAR CRIMINALS, MURDERERS and THIEVES and for creating a world where innocents die by the thousands daily and we are much less safer today than we were BEFORE September 11th thanks to their criminal behaviour....are they really any better than Nazis? So thanks again, I will make sure as many people as possible hear this interview....

Bill,
Your conversation with John Nichols and Bruce Fein was interesting and necessary. The response here was somewhat predictable. Of course the administration's behavior is illegal, of course they deserve impeachment, of course we should be outraged, and worst of all, of course the congress and the press are 'invertebrate'. What I don't understand is Bruce Fein speaking as if he was truly apolitical and an independent. He was good. But he maintains a post at the Enterprise Institute and the Heritage Foundation. If he wrote the 1st article of impeachment against Bill Clinton for a trivial offense of illicit sex and the weak attempt to cover up how can he be considered a believer in the impeachment process where a 'high crime' must be involved? Clinton's ugliness was not a 'high crime'. It was an minor closet episode. And how can Bruce maintain his position at these ultra conservative think tanks and still berate the administration in public?
Has Bruce changed colors? Or, has the plot thickened? Now that the conservative party has attained a certain grip on the power in America, is it time to take away the tool box so that the next administration has much less power to undo the damage? If the conservatives believe that they can win back congress and hold it, it won't make a bit of difference who is elected president. It seems to me that they would say to themselves, "Now is the time to take away the 'tool box' powers and act like we are the leaders of integrity in the nation. The people will love us for it. It will give us back our prestige and increase our poll standings". How do we do that? We strike the first blow against the obvious offenders and steal the democrats thunder. We send out someone like -- maybe Bruce Fein, and employ the preeminent attack tactic. The Democrats have so far failed to take on the gauntlet of the Bush/Cheney/neocon sneer and smear campaign. If the Republicans take the initiative in righting the wrongs that they themselves perpetrated, they will reap the ethical rewards and, at the same time, they will be able to maintain the newly formed 'status quo' typified by a Roberts court and a tax scheme that favors wealthy individuals. And if the Republicans can gain control of congress and, God forbid, they retain the presidency, the Republican controlled congress can, if it becomes necessary, just reinstate the 'tool box' powers just as they did under Bush. It's a no brainer. Lets see, what forum should we use to initiate this campaign?
I always have to wonder when I see a wolf and that wolf opens his mouth and a bleat issues forth.

I applaud this long-overdue discussion of the need to impeach the Cheney-Bush regime. However, your discussion ignored the reality that about 100 million Americans now believe their most serious crimes took place on September 11, 2001.

Bush successfully blocked an independent investigation into those pivotal events, and Congress and the U.S. news media went meekly along for the ride.

No recent event more clearly illustrates the failure of the American Republic.

As far as I see there is at least one Statesman in Washington today, and that is Russ Feingold. He puts the country and constitution ahead of his own political gain, and he should be acknowledged and applauded for his courage.

Thanks for airing that discussion. It's nice to know there are at least two people in Washington that understand why George Bush needs to be held accountable.

The only thing that stopped the Vietnam War, was when, the funding was cut off by your Congressmen in 1974. Research it yourself. A march on Washington D.C or any other city is not very effective. A participant in the march might think their Congressmen might care, but they don't care, so you better get over it. The only thing that "marching" does is to increase the ego of the marcher. So the marcher will say, I showed the world what I want and now I feel better about myself. What would be more effective, would be to lobby(like the professionals do)your Congressmen until they get the message of what true Americans want. This is what happened in the recent vote for the Immigration Bill. The polls told the Congressmen that 82% of the American people wanted their Congressmen to vote "no" on the Immigration Bill. Still, the Congressmen were prepared to go ahead and approve the Bill. Only a determined effort by thousands of true blue Americans that called, emailed , and raised hell with their Congressmen stopped the Immigration Bill from passing. When Congressmen are personally involved with their constituents, that is the only time that they will vote in favor of the American people. If a Congressman refuses to vote for what is good for the American people, then he should be "recalled" as soon possible. In the book, "Running On Empty" by Peter Peterson, he said there is no longer a Democratic Party or Republican Party. What there is, are Corporations that "donate" approximately $ 15 million for each candidate(that votes the way that they are told to). To confirm that, I asked Dennis Kucinich(face to face), "How many members of the House of Representatives, did he think, received their re-election funding solely from Corporations?" He told me, he thought about "about 80% of the House Members". So right there, that is a loophole in our Constitution that needs fixing. I hope you can see that the majority of Congressmen are not working for you, that is, unless a bunch of Americans holds their feet to the fire.

I was tremendously impressed by the July 13 Journal program. I have, for some time, been of the opinion that impeachment proceedings against both Cheney and Bush were necessary in order to preserve the very core of our form of government. However, the mention of Nancy Pelosi’s not wanting to consider such action now caused me to reflect on somewhat of a paradox. To what extent does the very wisdom of the presidential succession act, by designating the speaker of the house as “next in line,” make the speaker vulnerable to accusations of personal ambition to be president when he or she acts to bring articles of impeachment forward?

Bill, thank you! Your conversation with Bruce Fein & John Nichols prompted me to post this comment to my Congresswoman, Susan A. Davis -- http://www.house.gov/susandavis --:

***** SUBJECT: Impeach Bush and Cheney *****

Dear Susan,

The dialog on Moyers Journal -- http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07132007/profile.html -- this past Friday evening made a good case that you, and every other member of the House of Representatives who is not ardently pursuing Impeachment Articles against Bush and Cheney, are derelict of your Constitutional duty. I agree.

Please give this matter your full, immediate attention and make a public statement as to your position.

Thank you,
Dan Landrum

It was both a wonderful and educational show (its about time someone had the guts to come forward on this issue!) If there was one drawback, it was the failure to mention the fourteen brave representatives (led by Dennis Kucinnich) who have opted to Cosign an article of impeachment.

The level of sincerity and intelligence in the discourse on this blog is prompting me to copy it and send it to my Congressional Delegation. (Would that we heard such discourse on the Floors of the Chambers on C-SPAN!)

I urge all posters to do the same, with the firm request to our House Reps. to support H.RES. 333.

I am so glad Bill Moyers is back and is not afraid to address the elephants in the living room. Thank you, Bill Moyers.

No one in Congress standing up to Pelosi? No one going to the People? No one submitting Articles?

It is a sad day when even Bill Moyers fails to research his topic to learn that we have such a person in the House. When John Conyers stepped back because Nancy Pelosi hijacked the PEOPlE'S "table" (and we're taking it back, Speaker Pelosi, you were wrong and had NO RIGHT to do such a thing), the one Representative WHO WENT TO THE PEOPLE IN MAILINGS AND ON THE WEB to gauge our sentiment was

Dennis Kucinich.

He then stood up to Pelosi, took our table back, and submitted Articles against Mr. Cheney. He has attained co-sponsorship for hearings from almost half of the representatives that John Conyers had signed on when he was still willing to impeach.

Never mind that he is running for President, he had said this is more important. Quite frankly, I think he was even a little late, but he did have the legitimate situation that (1) John Conyers already had articles that were going no where in a GOP Congress, and (2) It was a GOP Congress until January. Which is when he came to us to get our opinions.

He is submitting articles for Cheney to stop the worst of the horrors, those that are done in the name of foreign policy and national security (and undermine one while destroying the other) and undermine the Constitution most severely. That means investigating Mr. Cheney, as Mr. Cheney is using this war he concocted with PNAC to create imperial foreign policy and claim it must remain secret in the hands of the President alone for our protection. When in fact, he's giving Karl Rove just the tools necessary to go after political "enemies."

Now we need John Conyers to step up, regardless of whomever threatened him and begin hearings. If Scooter Libby's judge can do it, Mr. Conyers, so can you. Schoolyard bullies are cowards. They talk big, but will not follow through unless they can do something really underhanded that only makes them look childish and vindictive. That is what happened to Valerie Plame, and it the fallout of that mess that has finally made the People see that we can no longer let the Constitutinal crisis continue. A remedy is IMPERATIVE.

The following was taken from elsewhere on the site: In his recent article, "In Praise of Impeachment," Nichols argues "While the Constitution handed Congress the power to officially check such despotism, Jefferson and his colleagues fully expected the American people {emphasis added} to be the champions of the application of the rule of law to an errant executive."

The current situation is directly and immediately applicable. The populace should push the media --- all media --- to saturation coverage (e.g. this Moyers' program run and rerun everywhere) and the congress to action to build on the "seed" that's already planted, i.e., H.R. 333.

It is crystal clear that the media and congress were cowered into submission by the occurrence of September 11, 2001. There were a few righteous souls who were not intimidated by the politics of fear and demonization. However, for the most part, at best, they both, if truth be told, feared the reaction of a scared and manipulated populace. Of course, there were those who joined the team of fear mongers. After circa 6 years of this, it is only the unrelenting insistence of the populace which will move the process along the path which Fein and Nichols (and Kucinich) delineate.

What took you so long?

Thank you, Bill, for bringing these two brilliant and convincing speakers into a forum that laid out the case for impeachment. The richness of the posts from around the nation on this blog convince me that we are finally ready to move forward. On Friday someone gave me a flyer urging attendance at a rally Monday afternoon in Times Square to demonstrate to Nancy Pelosi that there's support for impeachment. This group, whose endorsers included Mike Gravel, Howard Zinn, and Alice Walker, pledged to wear orange until Congress gets the message. I keep thinking about what Bruce Fein said, that if we don't stand up for our Constitutional rights now, the powers claimed by this administration will become a part of assumed executive power inherited by our next president. We must not let that happen.

I would strongly recommend that every citizen of the United States watch this entire program before making up their mind about impeachment.

I must say, there were several issues brought up during the discussion that I had never considered before.

As one of the gentlemen in the program points out, it is time to put party affiliation aside and do what is best for our country.

Bill Moyers' "Tough Talk on Impeachment" was outstanding. The passion shown by both guests for the Constitution and rule of law, together with their rational, concise, and rock sold arguments for impeachment, was riveting and heartening. Their clear, unequivocal framing -- that impeachment is not a Constitutional crisis but the CURE for one -- is a take-way that I will remember and pass on repeatedly. I especially appreciated Bruce Fein. It wasn't surprising that John Nichols would be pro-impeachment, but Fein turned my notion of a Clinton impeachment supporter on its head. His willingness to be non-partisan and to hold Bush/Cheney's feet to the fire was not something I would have expected from someone who authored an impeachment article against Clinton and worked for the AEI. For him, love of country and democracy truly seemed to trump partisan politics.

One small, but not negligible, criticism. The blasting of Congress' abject failure to fulfill its Constitutional responsibilities was more than warranted. However, I was somewhat surprised that no one mentioned H.RES 333, introduced by Dennis Kucinich to start impeachment proceedings against Cheney and co-sponsored by some 14 members of Congress.

But back to the positive. A huge thanks to Bill Moyers -- a national treasure -- for his amazing and courageous reporting and to PBS for airing it.

Bill Moyers, you are a real American hero. I wrote letters re the absolute requirment for impeachment hearings to Sen. Pelosi, Sen. Clinton, Sen. Obama, Edwards and Joe Biden (who might actually have the juice to love his country more than his party).

It is time that the American people and those men and women who represent our wishes take our constitution and our country back. I believe we sent a clear message to the Congress and the President in November of 2006 that “we the people” want a change and we want it now; we expected that change to start then, not nine months later, not after we implement a “SURGE” that may or may not work, and surly not after we find out that apparently no one, or very few, of our elected representatives got the message. I am outraged at the direction our government has taken since George W. Bush and Dick Cheney came to power.

Something must be done to rein in this executive branch that daily thumbs its nose at our legislative branch and has turned our judicial branch into a powerless limb that has been diseased and weakened by political corruption and cronyism. It is time that our elected representatives listen to what the people have said. If impeachment of Dick Cheney, or George W. Bush is the only way to get the job done; then so be it!

Mr. Moyers, Thank you for your program on impeachment... One of your best programs and should be required viewing for every one of our senators and representatives!

I can only say that it can't happen too soon while we still have a chance of regaining what significant ground we have lost under this administration.

Egads! As a U.S. Citizen I have an important job that I have neglected far too long. Thank you, Mssrs. Moyers, Fein and Nichols for kicking me in the backside. It IS time to call for impeachment hearings. How dare George Bush and Dick Cheney blatantly disregard our rights, disrespect our democracy and denigrate the Constitution of the United States. If we don't have that, what do we have?
I'm firing off letters to my representative and senators, to the members of the House Judiciary Committee and to Speaker Pelosi.
I even want to fly the flag (which I haven't done since pre-Viet Nam) to show that I believe in our constitution and democracy.

About four years ago when I heard president Bush say something to the effect that "You are with us, or against us." that something was terrible wrong. Unfortunately millions of Americans didn't sense the same alarm.

Now we have NSA collecting information about American citizens with no oversight from Congress. We have secret CIA prison camps in far corners of the globe. We have military tribunals where people can be cages for years with no legal representation and no Geneva Conventions rights.

We have camps being built around the country that the media almost never covers. What are those camps for anyway?

We have an administration that swore to uphold the Constitution, but has on many occasions violated its oath, even to the point where Federal courts and the Supreme Court has ruled that the Administration has violated the law.

We had a Republican-controlled congress overlook Administration infractions of the law, or rewrite the law when the outcry was too great.

Now we have a Democrat-controlled congress that refuses to exert its congressional authority to maintain checks and balances.

Our country is in serious trouble and citizens need to wake up soon and exercise their authority to get Washington back on track. It is not a problem caused by Republicans, not a problem caused by Democrats. It is an inherent problem with Washington.

The sooner citizens realize that the liberal and conservative labels are a tool to divide citizens and to obscure the devious deeds of politicians, the sooner we citizens can come together and reverse the frightening direction our great nation has been heading.

Thank you for an excellent and cogent discussion about the Constitution and impeachment last night.

Likes others here, I wish every member of Congress and the Judiciary would watch it -- and that someone would have the courage to puncture the absess that this monarchical administration has festered into.

What stymies me are the comments that WE, the People are responsible for what has happened.

I didn't vote for this president. I didn't vote for Heather Wilson or Pete Domenici -- but I'm stuck with them. I can't give money to the Democratic national party because, to me, my party has become completely spineless and without concern for the good of the country.

How do concerned citizens take back the nation? How do we voice our tremendous concern when partisanship has become the rule rather than true democracy?

If anyone here has the answer, I'd be most grateful.

Thank you, Bill Moyers, for having tonight's intelligent discussion of impeachment! This should be required viewing for all of Congress AND the judiciary. I also totally agree that PBS needs to reclaim the high ground of airing important issues that really matter to the American people and your show is a great example of that.

Nichols and Fein gave voice to why I have such a sick feeling almost all the time about how our government is being perverted away from the high ideals upon which it was founded.

I love this country and am so afraid that our incredible Republic, with all the challenges we have endured, may be finally done in by the destruction of the Rule of Law and the end of the Checks and Balances that were so beautifully constructed to allow the people to be heard and to preserve our freedom.

Thank you for doing REAL journalism! It's been so long since I've experienced it and I miss being treated like citizens and not as idiots like our corporate-based media treats us.

I will write my representatives and try to make them see this is the only way to keep our Republic. God bless and keep inspiring us, Bill.

Mr Bush is likely a decent guy standing firm on his beliefs. The problem is his beliefs, or at least the way in which they are implemented have been almost completely wrong. One problem has been created solely by the White House; the American public by in large no longer trusts the behind-closed-doors activities in the White House. I blame Chenney and Rove for this. Chenney's incredible arrogance and contempt for legitimate questions leaves us to wonder who is really in charge. Conversations and decisions made by the vice president and others in the White House are presumably made on behalf of the American people. We have the right, and I do not use that term lightly, to know how and by whom decisions are made. Chenney appears not to care.

As voters we should demand that politicians operate in a sunshine, open door decision environment, decisions affecting state secrets or national security aside. There is no way that the appointment of federal attorneys falls under those exceptions. Neither does political influence over science or secret meetings with industry representatives (al la Chenney's meetings with industry representatives on energy policy).

As voters we should speak with our ballots to ensure that future presidents, regardless of party affiliation, operate in a more open environment. Maybe denying a future president a second term will send a message. After all, we are the government; it serves us, not the other way around. That one concept is what separates American from all other countries.

Last nights show with Bruce Fein and John Nichols was simply, stunning!! It's time for us all to take back our country and be citizens again! Thank you so much for the shinning a light on one of our nations most dire problems!

Thank you, thank you, thank you, Mr. Moyers! I thank God for your integrity and for your show, even though I have to stay up until 1 AM to watch (It is well worth it!). Thank you for putting impeachment back on the table and for your two intelligent and concise guests, Conservative Constitutional scholar Bruce Fein and liberal author John Nichols. How shameful that there are not more Conservatives (as well as Liberal members of Congress) standing up for the only cure of this Constitutional crisis we have: IMPEACHMENT! Thank God for Mr. Fein, Mr. Nichols, and Mr. Moyer. From your mouths to Nancy Pelosi's ears! The citizens of the United States DEMAND it!

Bill Moyers' Journal is the best program on TV. I was riveted by last evening's discussion with a liberal and conservative who both say that we must impeach bush and cheney now. Every American should hear what they say and especially those who are unaware of our constitutional crisis wherein these two in the administrative branch believe that they do not have to answer to anyone, not the congress and not the people. They have repeatedly flaunted the law to the detriment of our constitution and our democracy. Impeach! I say.

My posting here of July 13, 2007, was simply taken off or erased. I did not break any of the rules. Unless someone emails me with a reasonable explanation, I will assume that when it comes to respect for the First Amendment and true democratic values of free speech and no censorship, Mr. Moyers is all hat and no cattle.

I applaud the PBS concept that allows couragous and informed people to express views in an intelligent and understandable format versus the fitered entertainment we are subjected to with our network, CNN, etc. news programs. The Bill Moyers program I viewed last night regarding impeachment was both enlightening and distrubing as an American. The general complacent paralysis our legislature, media and the American people have shown toward this administration's flagrant misuse of power is puzzling. A compelling case for beginning the impeachment process was presented by Nichols and Fein and my faith in our current political system would be reinstated if it were to proceed.

I happened upon Bill Moyers program and was whooping and hollering. It is wonderful to hear voices of reason, finally. The most important statement was that impeachment should be viewed as part of the system of checks and balances our forefathers had in mind. They obviously knew all too well the corruptability of power.

I agree with your comments that PBS should be televising impeachment proceedings and making constitutional awareness a priority.

I apologize for associating the wrong names with the posts. Correct names(I think) associated with the following:

I have a son who is a pilot in the USAF and had been on six tours to the Middle East.
Bill Moyers is a disgrace for having these two egghead pukes on his show advocating impeachment of Bush. Mr. Moyers, you and all of the other liberal skirts out there are traitors for dissing a president who has done his best in trying to keep us safe.
What will you say Billy Boy when the next attack hits....Bush didn't do enough?
You are the Neville Chamberlain types who would rather kiss an atacker's ass rather than defend ourself. I'd imagine you'd hide in a closet if someone was breaking into your house and tried to hurt your family, you coward puke.
Posted by: Phil | July 14, 2007 12:48 AM

Bill Moyers is a communist A- Hole who has turned against his country and President. Spew your propaganda elsewhere and leave our country.
Posted by: Thomas Ripkoski | July 14, 2007 12:33 AM

Nothing I like better than being called names when trying to discuss something so serious.

I am posting a couple of the posts in this thread which seem to show just how valid this discussion is. This administration and it's supporters will not suffer a differing point of view or be called to task for thier behavior. Their methodology is to shout them down and call them age old names like cowards and commies:

Posted by: Aaron M. Cohen | July 14, 2007 12:48 AM
I have a son who is a pilot in the USAF and had been on six tours to the Middle East.
Bill Moyers is a disgrace for having these two egghead pukes on his show advocating impeachment of Bush. Mr. Moyers, you and all of the other liberal skirts out there are traitors for dissing a president who has done his best in trying to keep us safe.
What will you say Billy Boy when the next attack hits....Bush didn't do enough?
You are the Neville Chamberlain types who would rather kiss an atacker's ass rather than defend ourself. I'd imagine you'd hide in a closet if someone was breaking into your house and tried to hurt your family, you coward puke.


Posted by: Gail | July 14, 2007 12:36 AM
Bill Moyers is a communist A- Hole who has turned against his country and President. Spew your propaganda elsewhere and leave our country.

What a show. Thank You Kenn Meister

Why not recognize and support the only two candidates running for president that actually agree with what you and your guests have to say,( Ron Paul and Dennis Kucinich) instead of focusing on the other 99% that have been bought and payed for many times over.

Ron Paul for President !

Thank you for your 7/13 program. A copy of this discussion should be sent to every member of Congress!

Mr. Moyers, thank you for opening my eyes and ears. I have signed the IMpeachment petitions at www.ImpeachBush.org and at www.democrats.com. On September 15, there will be a march on Washington DC to protest the war and call for impeachment resolutions.

As was brought out most clearly, passionately and objectively by Bruce Fein and John Nichols, the impeachment of both Bush and Cheney for the many crimes they've committed and the powers they've usurped is necessary if this country is to survive in the way in which the framers of our great Constitution so thoughfully and deliberately decided. The separation of powers and the system of checks and balances, if not preserved, would lead - has led - to perhaps the gravest consequences this country and its people have ever faced. Let Congress have respect for our country, its people and its laws. And let the American people have respect for its lawmakers. Doing something right, honorable and just, however unpleasant or even wrenching, is the only way to make our country great again. The current administration has made us and the world ashamed. The imperial claims and crimes of Bush & Cheney, not to mention so many others in their employ, need to be dealt with immediately and forcefully, without, if at all possible, any political considerations in back rooms. Idealism? Yes. But why not ask for something good, right and clean in our leaders and of our government?

I found the impeachment conversation a breath of fresh air. However, I was very disappointed Dennis Kucinich was not mentioned. Fein said we need a congressman to stand not with party but with the constitution. Kucinich did literally that very thing, holding up his pocket constitution in a presidential debate when asked about the impeachment issue. I believe any serious impeachment conversation should include Dennis Kucinich.

I found the impeachment discussion exhilarating.

But, like someone else has alrready pointed out, I am astonished that the viewer was led to believe that NO ONE on Congress was talking seriously about impeachment, when there already is HR 333, authored by Dennis Kucinich, that specifies articles of impeachment against Dick Cheney, already introduced into Congress.

Bill Moyers should interview Dennis Kucinich as soon as possible to correct this error.

Thank you Bill Moyer for helping us see the importance of impeaching Cheney before it is too late.

Impeachment, while a possibility, is the least of Bush and Cheney worries. There's also the War Crimes statute in the Code of Federal Regulations (USC Title 18, Part I, Chapter 118 § 2441) which both have publicly bragged about violating and which has no statute of limitations. It's one of the reasons President Bush recently retained private counsel.

On April 24, 2007, U.S. House Representative Dennis Kucinich introduced a bill, H. Res. 333, calling for articles of impeachment to be sent to the U.S Senate with regards to Vice President Richard B. Cheney.

Here's an "action form" where you can vote on whether or not Mr. Cheney should be impeached. Your vote will be submitted to your member of congress:

http://www.usalone.com/cheney_impeachment.php

Also, see the July 06 press release from Dennis Kucinich about how 54% of adults in the US favor impeaching Mr. Cheney:

http://kucinich.us/node/4798

Bill, when are you going to interview Dennis Kucinich?

I have to agree with Natalie's comments that last night's show with Fein and Nichols was thrilling. The founding fathers created a country, based on Sovereignty. Which meant, anyone could do whatever they would like, as long as they were "responsible". From 1776 to 1935, the Law of Americans was called, "Common Law". The Common Law was simple and unchanging. The Common Law was based on the Laws of Science, Nature and God. Basically, the Common Law said, in order for a crime to be committed , there must be an injured party. So-called crimes nowadays, such speeding,dwi or prostitution,smoking marijuana would not be crimes under the Common Law, because there wasn't an injured party. For example, the act of "driving while intoxicated" was not a "crime" because under Common Law no one was injured or damaged in some way. The same idea with "speeding", since no one was injured while you were traveling at 75 miles per hour,there wasn't any crime, unless you hit someone with your car, then you must be responsible to pay for the other person's injuries. The Common Law was changed in 1938. President Franklin Roosevelt, overstepped his power and Nationalized American Industries, so that is why certain farmers receive hundreds of thousands of dollars from the Govt. for not raising crops. In 1935, FDR's programs were declared unconstitutional by the Supreme Court of the United States. So then FDR, vowed, he would "stack" the Supreme Court. Which meant, FDR would keep appointing Justices to the Supreme Court until the interpretations of the Supreme Court would favor his policies. FDR accomplished his vow. We still have Common Law, but most people are ignorant of it. Congress only makes statues nowadays, which is not Real Law,but a reasonable facsimile. If you would notice, all the "new laws" have fines attached to them, in some way. This done to raise the salaries of the our public servants. For example, the basic Magistrate starts out at a salary of $130,000. So the more people go to traffic court, the more they can raise their salaries without the American people voting on it. The main idea behind the Constitution is the People of the United States have the only real authority to make Laws. Ordinary people can submit proposals for Laws on the floor of the Congress. You have the right, because you are a Sovereign man or woman of the United States of America. You have the right because you were given your rights of Life, Liberty and the pursuit of happiness by God at your birth. Your rights came from God and not from any Government. Remember, in a Democracy, your rights can voted away by your Congressmen. In a Republic, your rights can't be voted away by your Congressmen. That is the difference between a Democracy and Republic. Ultimately it up to the People of the usa, what their future is to be. This is a pivotal point in our history. What do you want, Freedom or Tyranny? Recently, the Detrimental Immigration Bill was defeated by a determined number of Americans that yelled, screamed and demanded that their Congressmen vote against the Immigration Bill. However, I know and you should too, that the enemies of Freedom will never give up trying to take away our American Freedoms. Like Thomas Jefferson said "Eternal Vigilance Is The Price of Freedom."

Mr Moyers, You are doing heroic work in dark times. May history remember you correctly for what I hope, but am not at all certain, will be a turning point in our countries destiny.

Mr Fein deserves much credit as a conservative for speaking up yet fell flat by declaring all we may really need is for the President and Vice President to apologize and or just stop what they are doing.

The crimes are far to great in their horrific motives and far to many in number for anything other than removal from office and a lifetime of criminal proceedings and incarceration. This administration and many of their minions must be held to account while the truth in all its horror is exposed or we will surely repeat this scenario as we have from Nixon, Iran Contra through our current shame.

No more excuses, no more pardons, no more wars based on lies and empirical robber baron motives. No more disposable civil liberties and no more secrets!

Thank you again, this program should run seven nights a week until impeachment is complete.

The day before Bill Moyer's program I was feeling so desperate over what we could do to save our country from despotism, that I turned to the U.S. Constitution and wrote down all the articles related to impeachment.
Now, thank heavens, I know that there are many, many of us who have been having the same desperate thoughts. The next steps are critical. We have to encourage — no demand — our Congressional leaders to realize how important this moment is.
If our Congress refuses to impeach both Bush and Cheney, we couldl see these extra powers passed on to the next administration, and possibly into perpetuity: thus destroying our democracy.

My Desperate Thoughts on Impeachment
1.The President and Vice President knowingly and falsely led this nation into an unnecessary war in Iraq that should never have been started. At the time I and many others easily recognized that the President and Vice President were misleading the nation into that unnecessary war so that our country could take control of the oil in Iraq. The President and Vice President refused to wait for the reports to the United Nations from the weapons experts who were searching for weapons of mass destruction in Iraq. Instead, so that their plan could not be undone, they moved forward with the war before the reports were in hand.

2. The President and Vice President knowingly permitted violations of the Geneva Conventions, in spite of the fact that the United States has ratified that binding international agreement.

3. Rather than abiding by the Geneva Conventions, the President and Vice President have knowingly permitted the use of torture, in direct contravention of the obligation of the United States as signors of the Geneva Conventions.

4. The President and Vice President have permitted some of the individuals who have been held in our name at various venues around the world to have been tortured to death. Thus, these are criminally, heinous crimes.

5. The President and Vice President have violated U.S. law and the U.S. Constitution through widespread wiretapping of phone calls and emails of Americans — without a warrant!

6. The President and Vice President have knowingly violated U.S. law by subverting the Constitution and abusing Presidential power by asserting a “Unitary Executive Theory” so as to give himself unlimited powers.

7. The President and the Vice President have subverted the Constitution by obstructing efforts by Congress and the Courts to review and restrict Presidential actions, and by promoting and signing legislation negating the Bill of Rights and the Writ of Habeas Corpus.

911 was Our Reichstag and the continuation only of a well thought out conspiracy against America that goes back even further than 1913 which does mark the beginning of the bankrupting and enslavement of the people of America.
The highest of high crimes was not only perpetrated but was carried out against us. Bin Laden and Al Queda like Oswald are "patsies". The video "leaked" of his supposed confession video was just another pitifully lame part of scheme like the "centrifuge story," that if you look at it closely doesn't even look like Bin Laden. He was accused tried and convicted for this crime without evidence. Calculate the time it would take an apple or a building top for that matter to fall simply through thin air with no obstacles beneath it. Simple math (see http://nomoregames.net/index.php?page=911&subpage1=free_fall_bodies ) and find out that Niel Bush (Bush Sr's illigitimate son who has also been implicated in the S&L scam of the early 90s that robbed the citizenry of over $1 billion) was in charge of security at WTC prior to 911 and they are owners of demolitions companies.... and explosives stockpiles... WMD's... weapons manufacturers.. ask what happened to the us army anthrax investigation...
Here I must reflect and make reference to the fact that Paul Revere was considered a "terrorist." Bill Moyers is our Paul Revere here in this respect. We must all shout this knowledge from the rooftops. Write your newspapers, etc..
If you want see damning video look for guilty demeanor. Remember things like the attempt to appoint warcriminal Kissinger as 911 commission chair. It is only this miniscule shred of conscience left in these MEN, perpetrators of barely comprehendable abhorrent events, that gives hope to the future of humanity, because if you trust your instincts while in witness you can see through it. Look at the 1920s housing bubble and what it did and consider what is the planned fallout from this latest pump-up and dump. (Debtors prisons?) They have horrific plans for us all... They do not want a people, a public that is informed, of commoners, sharing knowledge "liberally" on mediums such as this internet.
Remember the Chicago seven... Think that your dollar (now fiat, privately backed) is worth 4 cents relative to what it was in 1912. Think that since "womens lib" that it now takes two earners to pay the usury tax to the greedy monarchy (system) to survive, to the monarchy that continues its squeeze.
There is a monster folks but it isn't "retail" "terrorism" or anything new for that matter. It is older and more cunning than this. It is state/corporatocracy sponsored "shock and Awe..ful" propaganda/exploitation/terrorism. It is the same "war" since the beginning of Kings and Men, supremacy vs egalitarianism.. the paradox in the minds of men thinking and acting from scarcity versus abundance, competition vs cooperation, totalitarianism versus democracy.
We must not now have impeachment fatigue...
God Bless George Bush

I found the discussion on impeachment very dissapointing at the end when all three of you bemoaned the lack of a congressperson with the principles and integrity to stand up for impeachment. You are falling into the failing of the mainstream media! What about Cynthia McKinney who called for and introduced a resoluntion for Impeachment years ago? See the film "American Blackout". What about Dennis Kucinich the congressman from Cleveland who is all to quickly being dismissed as a candidate for president? HR 333 which he introduced to impeach Cheney now has 17 co sponsors. The World can't wait, we citizenz of the USA owe the people of the planet a profound appology which should be initiated by the impeachment of our two chief war criminals.

I have heard or seen Mr. Fein speak many times on the Constitution but never with as much emotion as he displayed in this latest interview. It is apparent that Mr. Fein, a conservative in the traditional sense of the term, truly loves and has tremendous respect for this document. It is indeed a tragedy that most members of Congress have more love for their positions of power than they do for this nation's future. As Mr. Fein and Mr. Nichols stated, members of Congress have little sense of history nor an understanding of their role as described in the Constitution. As many others who have grave concerns in regard to the future of our nation, I have written to both of my senators and to my representative posing the question of articles of impeachment to be filed against both the president and the vice president but to no avail. I am not even extended the courtesy of a response. Perhaps they are too embarrassed by their inaction as individuals and as an institution. Or perhaps they are "invertebrates." It is said that we get the leaders that we deserve. Have we become disinterested consumers only interested in our iPods and iPhones and 'iMe'? If this is true I am indeed fearful of our nation's future. I wonder.

We have been rallying, marching, demanding impeachment since January 2003 (to prevent the War on Iraq- We wanted "Pre-Emptive Impeachment.") Sadly, Congress and the media have supported the "bogus War on Terrrorism," the attacks on the Constitution, Bill of Rights, the Patriot Act, Military Commissions Act. They have gone along with the kangaroo 9/11 Commission which sold "Homeland Security" and an expansion of the war into Iran by omitting or distorting all the damning evidence indicating that 9/11 was a classic "false flag operation." (Just as the "tossing the babies out of the incubators, Gulf of Tonkin, FDR's 8 point plan to provoke the Japanese/the breaking of the Japanese code were used to drum up public support for war.")

Moyers, Nicholls and Fein failed to mention Cynthia McKinney and Dennis Kucinich's courageous articles of impeachment, just as the media ignored 2006 Congressional candidates, like myself, who ran on an Impeachment, 9/11 Truth, Peace platform. Despite the media, the high crimes and threat of the current administration are obvious now to most Americans and the world.

What we need are more courageous journalists, and elected officials, and people to take to the streets to show the strength of the American outrage at a "criminal occupation of the White House."

I passionately believe that "Impeachment is the best hope for the country." However, I disagree with Nicholls and Fein that a mild apology from Bush and Cheney would be enough to halt an impeachment process. Only a repudiation and reversal of the horrendous power grab and violence of these seven years will serve the country and prevent future "nuclear 9/11"s which would allow them to consolidate and expand control over Americans, that they have been promising us for years.

I urge Moyers and the others to find more courage, to dig deeper, to cast light on the larger crimes that this administration has committed. Courage Moyers! More courage! Get David Ray Griffin on your show to Debunk the 9/11 Debunkers! Get Steven Jones, Kevin Ryan, Richard Gage to expose the horrendous lies of 9/11- "the catastrophic and catalyzing event like a New Pearl Harbor" that the Project for a New American Century (neo-con cabal) wanted in their documents to expedite the military transformation of our country in their quest to maintain global hegemony.

Thank heavens there are courageous people bringing forth the necessity of impeachment of these sociopathic criminals. But we need much more information disseminated among the sheeple who are too tired, busy, and distracted by American Idol, P. Hilton, et al to understand our country has been hijacked.

It didn't start with these criminals by any means, though it has been jumpstarted to horrific new heights of abuse by them.

Read "Confessions of an Economic Hitman"; The Sociopath Next Door"; "A New Pearl Harbor" "Crossing the Rubicon"; "It Can Happen Here"; "Armed Madhouse" and weep, then get out on the streets to fight our government that is dismantling our safety net, stealing our money, killing millions in our name, torturing, building concentration camps in the US, etc etc.

Bill, have some of these authors on your show. Get together with other brave and famous patriots to publish articles in papers that tell people what is REALLY going on. Sponsor round table discussions nationally that inform people about this and train leaders to bring these discussions locally. The time is NOW!!!!!

This was an absolutely fascinating and important discussion, and I say that as someone who was very skeptical about the usefulness of impeachment at this stage of the game. I was particularly impressed by the passionate and unrelenting argument made by the true blue conservative at the table, Bruce Fein. Conservatives generally have lost all credibility for me, which I don't particularly relish given that I believe it's healthy to have at least two parties strong enough to question one another and call each other out on political nonsense and expediency (they are all politicians after all). Fein restored my hope that there are still genuine conservatives out there, rather than the phony lot we've been seeing over the last years, and that's good news for everyone, including liberals, conservatives, and everyone in between. Competition is a good thing - it keeps everyone on their toes, making them explain what they mean and justify their actions. In addition to that, the program went a long way in explaining what impeachment is actually all about, rather than what it appears to be about, and prompted me to write to Speaker Pelosi and my Congressional Representative about taking a very serious look at this issue and reconsider its place at "the table."

Great Show...I will write my two Senators and Congresswoman today.

I couldn't sleep last night after this enlightening program. Thank you, Bill Moyers, for contining to provide us with sustenance in this troubled time. Your willingness to speak for those of us who hesitate to voice our feelings because we think we don't know enough astounds me every time. It is as though you have the ability to second guess the more timid among of your viewers. The expression "blessed unrest" (the title of an incredible book by Paul Hawken) defines what the Bill Moyers Journal is about.

Thank you for the debate on impeachment. It certainly clarifies in my mind why it is necessary to go ahead with it. I thought the best analogy was of "George Washington's little wooden box" where the "tools of power" began and have been rearranged & added to ever since...without impeachment the next President, whether Democratic or Republican, will be handed this box & also will not be giving away any of the tools. We MUST implore Congress to
make sure Bush/Cheney's extraordinary powers do not get handed off! I see impeachment as the only way to do this.

Thank goodness that Mr. Fein, a atrong conservative voice, rises above partisan politics and addresses the core issue facing the existence of our nation as a democracy. This should be a bold reminder to those who carry the mantle of the Right that the founding principles of our nation requires that we put partisan politics aside before the pressing demands of upholding our Constitution.

As one on the Left of politics, I join hands will those on the Right to take on the task necessary for the continuance of our nation as one that operates under the Constitution and the rule of law. We must impeach both Bush and Cheney, not for personal reasons regarding their character or persons, but for reasons higher: our duty to leave our nation to our heirs intact as a democracy. This nation stands at the Rubicon looking to the other side, the dark side of a despotic power grab. What will we as a people do? Forego our history and the Founding Fathers desires and cross into the darkness, or stand firm for democracy and law?

The show was nothing but a liberal Bush bashing.Completely unobjective with no counterpoint. Poor journalism.
Usual Moyer's propaganda. Liberals watching this are like conservatives watching Fox News.
Can any entity in the press present a balanced discussion?

PBS should can this show before PBS gets de-funded for biased.

Bruce Fein and John Nichols were excellent. They expressed exactly what the character of the American Govt. should be. I think Bill Moyers showed he was lacking in his understanding of the American Constitution. America is Bill Moyers's country unless he has dual citizen citizenship. Bill Moyers should start taking Constitutional Classes from Bruce Stein. The majority of Americans(including Congress) are ignorant of the Constitution. Americans do not realize the "purpose" of the Constitution is to place restrictions on the people we elect to run our govt. Otherwise, those elected people might start to think that could and should run the govt. better than the American people. If too many Americans are ignorant about their own Laws and their Constitution, they will be taken over by any opportunistic Dictator that may come along. In the Constitution, the Congress, for example has only 18 jobs appointed to them, the first one "is lay taxes". Nowhere in those 18 jobs, does it say, Congress has the duty to investigate Baseball Players for steroids. Like Mr. Nichols and Mr. Fine said, Congress is overstepping their boundaries. Another "job" that Congress has, is to, "Declare War". The Constitution saids the President becomes the Commander in Chief only after the President is asked(and accepts) by the Congress to assume that role. When Congress abrogates one of their duties( to declare War) to the Sovereign American people, then the rascals(the ignorant Congressmen) should be thrown out for not doing their job. Congressmen nowadays,are only knowledgeable about getting elected,they spend a great deal of time studying what it takes to get elected. If the Congressmen would take the same amount of time to study the American Constitution then I believe we would not have all the problems, that we are having nowadays. The Constitution is not taught in our schools anymore, maybe that is why the American People are ignorant of the Constitution. The Framers of the Constitution meant it to be a "hands on" type of document, which means the American people had to take responsibility for the actions of the people that they "Elected"(not "voted" -there is a difference)into office.


Bill Moyers's discussion with conservative constitutional scholar Bruce Fein and liberal writer from The Nation, John Nichols "Tough Talk About Impeachment" was a thrilling discussion and masterpiece of journalism. It is one everyone should review.

Bill Moyers is the absolute best in broadcasting. I love him like I love my country. I love my country and its principles as his guest Bruce Fein conveyed, to the very core of my being, to the depths of my soul so when our deepest values are severely threatened and tested we must ALL step up to the plate to ensure our country's Constitutional survival as a Republic. I have never in all my many years of television and news viewing seen or heard a more wonderful broadcast than I did last evening. It made me so proud of my country because he and his guests -- Democrat and Republican alike; conservative and liberal alike were united and one in their understanding of exactly what we are about, what the genius of Founders knew about tyranny and what is at risk in this country now through the usurpation of the balance of power by Bush, Cheney, et al. You would do well to listen to and study the discussion about impeachment and the glory of our Constitution's fathers for iterating it six times within that document. It was more than superb. Listen to it and heed because it has meaning not only for the after effects of this current administration but for future legacies of future presidents in future times.

(Also check out the excellent article "in The Last Throes, Judiciously" by David Michael Green published on Friday July 13 in CommonDreams.org)
From the time that humans turned from a nomadic hunter-gatherer and began to establish communities. Laws and guidelines needed to be established. As our societies and became more complex nation states developed the rule of law became even more important. While the law taking precidence, is not
without its inherent problems, the foundation of this country is the Constitution. When people place themselves above this law, they are in the process of
destroying the constution and the country upon which it is based.

The Roman empire collapsed in on itself, not from exterior threats from enemies without. Similarly, the attacks of 9/11 will not destroy this country. It is
being taken apart from within. It is indeed true that those who give up their freedom for security, deserve neither. The United States is also collapsing,
falling down like London Bridge. The fault lies with the administration, and congress and the judicary. The fault lies with the republicans, who placed
party politics and power above their country. The fault lies with the democrats, who have been spineless and are more concerning with regaining power
than the country. The fault lies with Nancy Pelosi and Harry Reid, the congressional leaders who won't lead. The fault lies with the media who, increasingly
owned by a small cadre of partisan corporations, present a one-sided story that is anything but fair and balanced. The remainder of corporate media
ownership sacrifices the public's right to know in favor of the business bottom line. The media seeks to avoid controversy and instead of costly in-depth
coverage of real news, fills the air with celebrity fluff. The Fault also lies with the the people. We all shoulder the responsibility. We stood by while
democracy was being mugged. We didn't demand honesty and openness from our government and our media. We unquestioningly swallowed all we
were told. We need to be in fear. But have no fear, our big brother government will protect us. We closed our eyes and ears and reveled in our ignorance.
When we glimpsed what what was happening, we threw up our arms and said What can we do? We have too much to worry about with our own lives.
Besides what can happen to us we're Romans.

I couldn't answer the poll question because, as pointed out on the TV program, during a time of perpetual war there's no time to restore civil liberties.

Thank you SO MUCH for this fabulous program. It was wonderful to hear such sharp minds talk about this vital issue. I wish this show were required viewing for every citizen, and hope you will show it again.

I will do my part and write to Nancy Pelosi and John Conyers.

If we are to remain a democracy (sort of... more like an oligarchy), a line in the sand must be drawn.

The Founding Fathers probably never dreamed that all main media sources would be owned by, what is it... 5 or 7 corporations. How we get out from corporate control with politicians bought and paid for I don't know (especially considering that the Supreme Court just threw out the Feingold/McCain campaign reform act... moving totally in the wrong direction).

Impeaching Bush and Cheney is the least we can do. They have violated the Nuremberg principles: Principle Vl...
1. Crimes against peace:
1. Planning, preparation, initiation or waging of a war of aggression or a war in violation of international treaties, agreements or assurances;
2. Participation in a common plan or conspiracy for the accomplishment of any of the acts mentioned under (i).

I had several Iraqi friends in college and I am appalled and horrified by what we in our ignorance have done to the people of Iraq. We need to grow up and accept and admit our guilt in what we allowed to happen. Bush, Cheney, and all their co-conspirators who planned the invasion should be arrested and sent to the Hague to be tried for war crimes.

Fein and Nichols have some of the handles of the problem of the American monarchy in hand. My gratitude to them for using their offices to ventilate the nature of the difficulty.
I would like to add a couple of facets to their purview.
During WWII, Roosevelt was successful in obtaining war powers from Congress that controvert the Constitution. This created an economic power that peacetime presidents have coveted. Notice how there has had to be some bullet-slinging conflict in each presidential term since then. The program, Expose', about SAIC and Barlett and Steele, which followed this Moyer broadcast in my market has nailed it for this administration.
Second point, the headline writers in the newspapers, radio and TV newsrooms demonstrate a total lack of comprehension of the separation of powers when they write lines that imply that the president "spent public dollars" here and "installed a program" there. Since only the House of Representatives can spend public money and institute programs, the people are being uneducated by the "media."

I have done my duty as a citizen and recently read the constitution in its entirety. It is easy enough, having done so, to determine that congress has a DUTY to bring impeachment proceedings against this administration. To not do so is a direlection of their sworn duties to "protect and defend the constitution against all enemies, forieng and domestic". But I also believe that such agregious violations of the rule of law that this administration is guilty of demands more than impeachment and removal from office. The constitution itself clearly states that, "...but the Party convicted shall nevertheless be liable and suject to Indictment, Trial, Judgment and Punishment, according to Law." Article 1, Section 3. In other words, after removal from office, the President and Vice President must be convicted and punished according to law. Unless these two monarichal despots go to prison, the constitution will not have been defended as set forth in the constitution itself. Our congress members have all sworn to this duty.

Great show. I sent this email to spineless Pelosi. It is disrespectful because she has disprected us the constitution on all those brave people who made the ultimate sacrafice so that we would have a government of the people by the people and FOR the people.

Comments: I will make this blunt. Your leadership is deplorable. You did not fillibuster the supreme court nominees and the recent court decisions can be related to no backbone. Let me break it down for you. If you do not impeach these destroyers of our democracy I will not vote Repub and I will not vote Dem because I cant see the difference. If a mans wife is being raped the Democratic reponce would be based on your actions since you took power is, we can fight because the rapist has good lawyers or he owns the judges and we cant win. I am glad the Democrats are not the football coaches for my childrens high school because they would tell them to concede the game before its been played. Do the right thing or be considered part of the problem.

Thank you sir Mr. Moyer for the enlighting discussion this evening and to the others for interesting comments. I do tend to agree that the time has come for Impeachment.

One thing I have observed since coming back to the US, I've been a Peace Corps Volunteer and am still adjusting to the US, is that the constitution itself is flawed. I know its our Holy Grail but hear me out. Current interpretation of the constitution treats businesses as individuals. The ramifications of this are significant, it puts our democracy for sale. Until or unless the common man can afford as many lawyers and lobbyists as large businesses I don't think we will live in a democratic system.

An "Impeach George Bush" group of over 150 strong was recently started in my city. Guess who became a new member tonight? Thank you, so much, for your shows guests. They validated my beliefs that the deplorable behavior of this administration has been defiling our constitution and gravely threatening our democracy. Great job!!! Please rebroadcast ASAP & announce it so we can call it to the attention of others! Thanks, again!!!

Light in the thick dark viscous night. Your table held the faint possibility of true conversation. Three men who may not share the same party but clearly love inquiry, truth and courage.

I do know who can straighten out all of Congress, actually all three branches ~ Sister Caroline, my eighth grade civics teacher. She might have been channeling the Founders and she knew her US Constitution. It is because of her that I am active in politics and so distressed about our very own King George.

Thank you for tonight's Journal.

Thanks for a Great Show! Mr. Moyers, I think if you & the other gentlement were to go out on the internet, you would find a vast sea of Americans who have been literally screaming impeachment for a long, long time. Right after your show I emailed Pelosi & Boxer, something I have been doing on a regular basis. I also post comments on mainstream media sites, write to TV news shows, and send letters to my newspaper. The subject of impeachment is far from new... but now, you have presented it in a very knowledgeable way on mainstream media! Yea!

Mr. O'Malley 10:14
Troubling question. I too would like an answer.

The insight exhibited on the Bill Moyers Journal of July 13 should wake Americans to a desire to find a way to retake our government and our Constitution.

Please, please rebroadcast this very important program so I can tell my children and grandchildren to watch, listen and learn some very important civic lessons...
Thank you for creating a program of conviction, courage and thought.

John Dean has talked about "Inherent Contempt" that is available to the Congress to act very quickly,to have the House Sargeant at Arms escort the guilty person, such as Harriet Miers, out, in custody, charged with Inherent Contempt. No long drawn out court proceedings. Please, friends, look into this and inform our Congressmen.
This appears to be a little known fact by our representatives.

Wouldn't it be ironic if the U.S.A., cradle of Democracy, ends up as a monarchy or dictatorship, while Iraq, which has suffered under the thumbs of a monarchy and dictatorship for decades, ends up as a democracy! And all because the cradle of Democracy is sitting on its heels waiting for a "savior" to come and rescue it. Thank you, Bill Moyers, for inviting guests who can speak for the rest of us. God bless the Constitution and those who fight to uphold it.

Thank you so much - Moyers,Fein, Nichols, and PBS! I've emailed Pelosi and others. I've urged them to watch this show and take the necessary steps.I hope many others, who watched the show, do the same. The information your guests shared was inspirational, educational, and critical! Thank you

The program tonight was a powerful demonstration of the validity of the American Constitution, and a strong reminder that it has been thoroughly disregarded by our president, vice president, and their many appointees. They should be impeached for overreaching their authority so far as to have violated the Constitution. I have been dismayed by the consistent evidence that this administration has considered itself above the law and the Constitution, while attempting to portray themselves as conservative. The discussion on Bill Moyers Journal tonight focused on the many documented ways in which this administration has violated the Constitution relative to decisions related to prosecuting the war on terror. Consequently civil liberties, international treaties, constitutional principles, rights to due process, the rule of law, etc. have been violated. In the process the principles upon which this nation was founded have been flaunted both to us and to others around the world. No longer is it possible for honest US citizens to believe our country can be seen as a defender of freedom in the world. It may yet be possible to recover the moral high ground. However, the road to that ground must pass through impeachment and conviction of our president and vice president.

The pattern of considering itself above the law established by this administration is not limited to violations of our Constitution. Many environmental laws and regulations have also been intentionally violated (witness the recent Supreme Court decision requiring EPA to fulfill its legal responsibilities by deciding whether or not CO2 is a pollutant). Our Surgeon General refused reappointment to a second term because of political interference in discharge of his responsibilities. The Union of Concerned Scientists documented a consistent pattern of political interference, suppression, or alteration of scientific consensus by this administration. Modification of information produced by the intelligence community was used to justify war with Iraq. Time and again this administration has violated law, violated the Constitution, modified scientific consensus based on political ideology, and in general placed belief above rational analysis as the basis for decision making. It is essential for us to reestablish the rule of law in the US!

Impeachment should be a step taken after all other reasonable alternatives have been exhausted. Impeachment should only be considered when the standards of conduct of the accused have clearly and without question made such action necessary. Tonight’s discussion was so well presented and arguments supported to a level that all U.S. citizens should be able to understand the serious impact this administration has had and continues to have on our way of life and the future of our nation. We have lost world respect, we have lost respect for our government officials, and we no longer trust the word of the president and our elected officials. There has been no leadership in government; not from the White House, Congress or the Senate. Our elected officials have set back and allowed this administration to degrade our nation. I was once told that “if you walk past a standard violated and do nothing to correct it you set a new standard.” I fear if we allow Bush and Cheney to continue in office we will have set a standard that will lead to the end of our democracy as our founding fathers intended and we once enjoyed. It is essential that impeachment includes Bush and Cheney; allowing Cheney to step to the plate would equate to the proverbial fox guarding the hens! And - for Phil; (Bush is doing the best he can)the best he can do is obviously far from being sufficient; and for Ctrenta, correctly stated (represent all citizens)but that needs to apply to all our elected officials. If they would spend as much time working for the best interest of the citizens rather than fighting with each other we would not be in the mess we are in. They should have taken action long ago to correct this problem. Those who have been in office for the past seven years and have allowed these things to develop to the point they are are just as guilty as Bush and Cheney. On the other hand – every president enters into history with something to his credit; Bush will become known as the president who returned lawlessness to the Wild West, and East, and South and North!

Excellent lesson in history and civics. Two items remain with me, Fein, "...precidents that lay about like loaded weapons." Nichols, "... impeachment is the cure for constitutional crisis."
Rebroadcast, please.

My letter to my Representative:

Dear Mr Cole,
Dark clouds hang over our beloved country. Sir these are sad times and the ghosts of our forefathers call to you. They need you to honor your oath, honor their precedent and reclaim the light that was and still is the basis of all life on mother earth. We cannot allow the perpetrated lie of perpetual war to be continued to be imposed upon us. Now can we allow renegade, above the law [leadership] 'control' over the people. This continued attempt toward totalitarian rule will only end in a much greater demise for humanity.
While the times are dark and evil has us wrapped in its greasy claws, we must above all remain hopeful and stand with our backs straight. We must release the corruption of ourselves and breathe justice and moral rectitude back into the soul of our still great nation. Do not allow history to be rewritten. Stand tall and purge the putrid stench of this administration from Washington. The ghosts of justice command it.
IMPEACH
While you're at it abolish the (criminal) Fed.

Hey all, and if I happen to mysteriously disappear, know that I died in defense of freedom.

What will it take to educate , inform , and motivate ???? when people are so helpless to protect themselves from the MIS-DIS-and PISS-information put out by the wealthy and powerfull . It is still the same people running the world now that have since the beginning of time!!!!!!!

Tonight's impassioned discussion on this country's constitutional crisis propelled me to my computer. John Nichols and Bruce Fein were eloquent in expressing the argument for impeachment of George Bush and Dick Cheney. It is a view I have held following enactment of the Patriot Act. Since that time, Bush has displayed a pattern of behavior consistent with a monarchy. The two latest examples are his commuting Scooter Libby's sentence for lying, and directing White House counsel, Harriet Miers not to appear before a Congressional hearing investigating actions within the Attorney General's office. No matter your political affiliation, every American should be outraged. This behavior is at best disrespectful of the basic tenents on which this country was founded. No man is above the law. At its worst it is dangerous to the future of our democracy. Checks and balances at the executive level of government has been eroded in this administration. I agree with the inference from Nichols and Fein that our democracy is on the verge of collapse if George Bush is allowed to continue in this way. The media has failed in its role to hold the president accountable for acting outside of the constitution. We have failed to hold our government accountable to us. For the sake of this country, George Bush must be stopped. Impeachment is the appropriate solution.

Gwendolyn Flynn
Los Angeles

Great program and illustration of the fragile nature of our republic.

Most of the thoughts expressed on this page are well articulated.

However, what are the steps we should all take as individuals to move this process forward? (i.e. write your congressman/congresswoman, etc.)

It is easy to make a comment but to make a real change takes real action. I am not criticizing those you are commenting but have realized that these debates lack a real force of action to actually produce change.

Let's continue the debate and share steps that individuals can take (include links) to effect change.

Go to thhis link to write to your representative
http://www.house.gov/writerep/

All the evidence came down (like an apple falling through thin air) in convenient 30 foot long sections to be loaded on trucks and were immediately shipped off to Asia somewheres, meanwhile $7,800,000,000 in gold that was there to back the trade of the United states remains unaccounted for. No black boxes!!
No WMD... 9/11 was "Shock & Awe" an exercise to initiate the plans of the "New World Order." Amazing relief that this program aired. My mom & I, my wife and friends I've all talked with have relayed the concern with exercising dissent that we in doing so cause ourselves subject to blacklisting, seizure, imprisonment, torture. Who knows? THEY have gotten away with too much for to long...
The answers, motives and connections are all disturbing to comprehend for the normal citizen. We must understand the depravity of these elitists families that have been playing with the citizenry as though they are pawns in a game of chess for their own entertainment.
To do you research you might begin with operation mockingbird.. check out "manchurian candidate," Northwoods... I also believe that they've incorporated the calculations of nobel prize mathematician Nash to stay a step ahead always of the people's options...
This is about global dominance... Check out Dubai.. new site of the worlds tallest skyscraper... elitist paradise.. for only those who have a Kiss My Ass "KMA" card.
Hang the murdering, warcriminal fascists!
GUILTY DEMEANOR
It is so easy to see. The evil of the plan (protocols of zion, NWO... who knows) VERY difficult to comprehend. Generations of illness in thought is the ONLY way to explain it.
We must stand courageously with our backs straight until the Country once again this time by impeachment (throw the tea overboard) retains some resemblance of its previous moral rectitude in the world. Let us not let this evil that has been purposely perpetrated with the sole intention of PERPETUAL WAR destroy us.
"The Truth Remains, And The Dream Shall Never Die," JFK

I'm so tired of yelling at the TV every time Bush, Cheney, or the other republicans who support this president are on. And I'm so afraid of the trouble they will get us into in the next 2 years. I don't know if they are dishonest or totally incompetent... either way they need to be removed from office NOW. Thank you Bill Moyers.

I sent this email to Speaker Pelosi. Everyone should do the same....

Dear Speaker Pelosi,

I'm writing to you tonight because there is a "constitutional crisis" in our nation. I had the pleasure of watching the Bill Movers Journal program on PBS tonight regarding "Tough Talk on Impeachment". It was riveting television. I am shocked and appalled by our nations President and Vice-President total disregard for the United States Constitution and the rules of law that govern our nation.

These men gave their oath: "To solemnly swear to faithfully execute the Office of President and Vice-President of the United States, and will to the best of their Ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States."

They both have easily violated their respective oaths of office and such should be held accountable for their high crimes and misdemeanors against the Constituion. I am in full agreement with the guest opinions of Bruce Fein and John Nichols for the impeachment of the President and Vice-President. We, as American citizens have an obligation to our great Constitution and we must stand up to the high crimes and misdemeanors perpetuated by our current leaders. Please, please reconsider your stand regarding impeachment. I think the nation thirsts for Constitutional accountability and impeachment will be the only beverage capable of quenching that thirst.

I have included a short blurb from the PBS website. I pray that you hear the voices of the majority of American citizens and support impeachment.

God Bless America,
Sincerely,
ednycinc
New York, NY

Thanks to Bill Moyers and PBS for allowing an open discussion of impeachment. The only problem with this action is that as soon as Congress begins hearings and actually suggests that Bush and Cheney have circumvented the law and the Constitution, there will be another "allowed terrorist" attack on the country and the name of the neocons game will be martial law. These proceedings should have been instituted 5 years ago...but better later than never.

Thanks Bill Moyers for such an informative and important discourse. I would support the impeachment process if that is what we need to do to get back to the business of open and transparent government.

It is time to impeach Bush and Cheney. Additionally, those who helped them subvert the constitution and rule of law must also be investigated and charged with appropriate crimes, including Bush legal counsel John Woo, Secretary Rice, Rumsfeld, Powell, and Rove.
All who were involved in the illegal invasion of another sovereign nation by the USA, who deliberately lied to Congress and the people, and who sacrificed our democracy, our soldiers, and our well being should be held accountable.
Bush and Cheney should also be the defendants in a class action lawsuit to seek damages. Who will bring such a case against them on our behalf? On the behalf of the soldiers and their families? On the behalf of the civilians killed?

Impeach Bush and Cheney for high crimes and treason.

First of all, discussion surrounding our civil liberties and the checks and balances that are set forth in our consitution are healthy. I am shocked and abhored at the verbally abusive attacks posted by those who have felt personally offended by the discussion. We can debate and agree to disagree. That's the beauty of freedom of speech! I love my country. Fighting a never ending war with the tremendous loss of life is fruitless. I was a child during Vietnam. I watched the blood and gore every night. I worried about myself, my brother and my friends going to a war that was not going to be won. I find it offensive that anyone who opposes the tactics the administration has used and abused are considered "scum" or "cowards." I guess I still wonder where the weapons of mass destruction are? In my mind, the new weapons of mass destruction are the youth in the middle east who are learning to hate Americans. The anger and hatred presented on this blog by those offended is disturbing. BTW, I'm a card carrying Republican. I'll pray for you.

Kudos to Bill Moyers for producing such a measured, balanced, thoughtfull, and compelling show. It was so refreshing to see Bill play the devil's advocate and express the fear that many Americans feel. The fear that has been so carefully cultivated by this imperial presidency. Bush and Cheney committed treason when they falsified intelligence reports and knowingly lied to the Congress and the entire American people about the justification for war against Iraq. The most scientific estimation of Iraqi casulties stands at just under 1 million since the U.S. invasion. Other studies show another 1 million Iraqi deaths due to the 10 year long siege of Iraq begun by Pres. H. W. Bush and continued under the Democrat Clinton administration. These are crimes against humanity. Americans must hold these leaders accountable or we are complicit in these crimes.

Thank you! At last, at last, we have intelligence shining forth.

Thank you! At last, at last, we have intelligence shining forth.

I just want to say thanks, Mr. Moyers, for continuing to present television shows that inform and make me think. I was feeling so alone ... thanks.

Although I agree with both guests assessment of the responsibility of both branches of government for the over reaching of this administration, the question was never answered WHY the congressional leaders are allowing this. In my opinion, the judicial branch also bears responsibility for this happening with their recognizing corporations rights. Without their participation in this mess K Street would not have the power it has over congress. All branches of government walked hand in hand down the path to this monarchy.

Mr. Moyers,

AMEN! Thank you for the program and the guests who spoke OUR words and validated this issue for so many of us.The immigration bill was a start, now we need to continue to take back OUR America, clean her up, and stop the leadership hypocrisy, corruption, and lawlessness that devalues/ tarnishes her.

Citizens- step up and be heard. Do YOUR part.

Can you impeach someone who was never elected in the first place?

Bravo, as always, to Mr. Moyers for continuing to be one of the very few voices in mass media journalism who dare to question, examine, think critically, educate, and speak truth to power. (Fred Friendly is smiling down on you for the way you handled the discussion).

Mr. Moyers, you exemplify the essence of responsibilities citizens in a democracy must embrace in order to play a role in ensuring that this political experiment endures.

And a special tip of the hat for keeping alive that moment in this past week's Senate hearings when we heard about the "oath to the President" rather than to the Constitution. It was a jewel of a moment.

Additionally, Bruce Fein deserves great admiration and attention for his willingness to place country over political party.

As always, Mr. Nichols remains one of the most insightful and important voices today.

Some day, someone will connect all the dots -- from the 2000 election to now. I was present at the 2000 debacle; saw the ballots while participating in the national media's ballot study; and observed and wrote about the propaganda machine that led to what history will one day understand was a coup d'etat.

At that moment, the mass media fell into a deep pit of cognitive dissonance from which it cannot recover. It parroted the propaganda then, and the parroting has spiraled out of control and led the media onto a Mobius strip dilemma: any return to journalistic integrity would have to be prefaced by an admission of the responsibility the mass media shared in the election debacle, the race to war, and all that has unfolded as a result.

That, sadly, will not happen.

Luckily, we have a few voices who have remained above that debacle, and kept their eyes on the Constitution.

And a hearty thank you to all the program's underwriters for your courage.

Aaron M. Cohen
Culver City California

The Iraq invasion and occupation is a war crime by Geneva Convention standards. There is no way to "win" anything in Iraq during the commission of a war crime. The torture and concentration camp at Gitmo is a war crime. It needs to be closed immediately.

We have been fed lies, lies, and more endless lies to cover the original lies, and all for the sake of gaining control of Iraq's oil fields for US oil corporations and enrich Halliburton and other mercenary groups.

Enough!

IMPEACH! Support HR 333 to impeach Dick Cheney first, then ask Congress to quickly move to impeach George Bush immediately thereafter. They are incompetent criminals and fools who are not fit to "lead" this nation.

Bravo, as always, to Mr. Moyers for continuing to be one of the very few voices in mass media journalism who dare to question, examine, think critically, educate, and speak truth to power. (Fred Friendly is smiling down on you for the way you handled the discussion).

Mr. Moyers, you exemplify the essence of responsibilities citizens in a democracy must embrace in order to play a role in ensuring that this political experiment endures.

And a special tip of the hat for keeping alive that moment in this past week's Senate hearings when we heard about the "oath to the President" rather than to the Constitution. It was a jewel of a moment.

Additionally, Bruce Fein deserves great admiration and attention for his willingness to place country over political party.

As always, Mr. Nichols remains one of the most insightful and important voices today.

Some day, someone will connect all the dots -- from the 2000 election to now. I was present at the 2000 debacle; saw the ballots while participating in the national media's ballot study; and observed and wrote about the propaganda machine that led to what history will one day understand was a coup d'etat.

At that moment, the mass media fell into a deep pit of cognitive dissonance from which it cannot recover. It parroted the propaganda then, and the parroting has spiraled out of control and led the media onto a Mobius strip dilemma: any return to journalistic integrity would have to be prefaced by an admission of the responsibility the mass media shared in the election debacle, the race to war, and all that has unfolded as a result.

That, sadly, will not happen.

Luckily, we have a few voices who have remained above that debacle, and kept their eyes on the Constitution.

And a hearty thank you to all the program's underwriters for your courage.

Aaron M. Cohen
Culver City California

I have a son who is a pilot in the USAF and had been on six tours to the Middle East.

Bill Moyers is a disgrace for having these two egghead pukes on his show advocating impeachment of Bush. Mr. Moyers, you and all of the other liberal skirts out there are traitors for dissing a president who has done his best in trying to keep us safe.

What will you say Billy Boy when the next attack hits....Bush didn't do enough?

You are the Neville Chamberlain types who would rather kiss an atacker's ass rather than defend ourself. I'd imagine you'd hide in a closet if someone was breaking into your house and tried to hurt your family, you coward puke.

In theory, I believe that Bush and Cheney should be impeached. I, also, think they should be tried for war crimes and treason. In practical terms, I think that this might well prove to be a wasted effort.
Impeachment would only mean charging Bush and Cheney with wrong doing. Even if a majority of The House of Representatives voted for inpeachment, Bush and Cheney would still have to be tried by The Senate. It is extremely unlikely that 2/3 of the Senate would vote to remove them from office due to the extreme partisanship of the Republican Senators and Representatives who support Bush and Cheney in almost everything. Indeed, it has been seen that Republicans have largely prevented Democrats from passing a number of bills that would benefit the American people. The bills to redeploy the troops and to increase funding for stem cell research are examples, as the lack of a 2/3 majority vote enabled Bush to veto them.
I believe that
Rep. Pelosi and
Sen. Reid decided to concentrate on trying to pass legislation rather than instituting impeachment procedures because they knew that it would be difficult or impossible to remove Bush and Cheney from office under these circumstances. In addition, this is an election year. If Bush and Cheney were to be impeached, the rightwing pundits, etc. would begin screaming that Democrats were using this as a way to victimize Bush and Cheney who are (in THEIR opinions) only trying to protect Americans from
Al Qaeda and other terrorists in order to gain support for Democratic candidates. This would get the sheeple out to vote, and probably gain Republican candidates many swing votes.
I believe that it is wrong to criticize Sen. Reid, Rep. Pelosi, and other Democratic Representatives and Senators in this regard, as it will only cause Democrats and swing voters who don't understand the complex nature of this issue to defect to 3rd parties or not vote and enable Republican candidates to win offices they might not have, otherwise.

Finally. Serious talk about what needs to happen, Impeachment. Nancy Pelosi, don't disappoint. Bush and Cheney need to account for their actions. Enough, Enough.
"IF democracy is breached - we must Impeach."

I'd love to see one of these constitutional scholars design a competency test on the Constitution and every candidate running for office would be required to score 100% in order to be on the ballot. Questions could be random and come from all sections of the document. This would be much more revealing than the lip service contained in the televised debates. Then we would know which candidates are statesmen and which are political pansies. Anyone who cannot uphold their oath to protect the Constitution and the freedoms it guarantees doesn't deserve the privelege of representing us. Thank you for an informative and uplifting presentation!

Bill Moyers is a communist A- Hole who has turned against his country and President. Spew your propaganda elsewhere and leave our country.

So if we do this and remove Bush and Cheney, who is next in line...Nancy Pelosi. God help us. Is it worth the time and effort to engage in an exercise like this to define the presidential powers and then hand over these powers to someone who seems to be on shakey ground most of the time? Are we prepared to follow this through to it's conclusion? Perhaps we could drag the proceedings out to election day because I would be terrified to put this woman in the White House for any length of time. Correct me if my confidence level is misplaced here...would this be a risk or just a bump in the road we would be willing to live with?

I certainly want the presidential powers defined and limited. I believe we have a gross lack of leadership right now in our government as Fien said...no statesmen/women willing to be courageous and act in a selfless way for the sake of the country and what is best for the people. I do believe there are enough educated people in this country who can think clearly given information that is truthful and presented in a way that allows for conclusions to be drawn based on honest debate. Thank you Bill for trying to bring about clarity. I love your questions. Both Fein and Nichols were extremely enlightening and their passion is what we need right now.

So how do we call these people and ourselves to account? Where are the statesmen/women like Barbara Jordon? Wow, what a terrific speech that person provided the link for in this blog...thanks. Certainly the conduct of the executive branch in this war has exceeded its bounds...I hope we can rebuild these before the next President steps in or the next Al Qida cell launches another attack on American soil and we are scrambling for a response from our government. Funny we have not had much news coverage about England or Spain's response to attacks/attempts on their soil. It might be helpful for us to see how they are managing their response. There you go, Bill..another good program idea! Get some of these folks to sit down at the table and talk to you.

Bill Thanks for being a true American. I needed reminding what that meant.

Bill Thanks for being a true American. I'm needed reminding what that meant.

I just sent the following e-mail to Nancy Pelosi:
"Dear Ms. Speaker,
I urge and request that you put the question of impeachment back on the table immediately. Both the Vice President and the President have demonstrated their complete disregard for the constitution and the rule of law, repeatedly, in every way they can. If they are not impeached, no one will ever be able to be impeached. The constitution will lie trampled on the ground and will have lost its beauty, strength and meaning -- to us and to the world. I beg you to have the courage and strength to put the nation and the constitution ahead of your own job, your political connections, your financial supporters. You are the only one who can."
Sincerely, (my name)

Incidentally, the first king of Rome was named Romulus, and over e thousand years later, the last Roman emperor, who was removed by barbarian invaders in the final sack of the city, was also named Romulus. Our first president was a George W. I really don't know if the glorious experiment of American democracy will survive. I hope so, but I'm unconvinced that we can save ourselves from the corruption that seems to engulf us.

What a fascinating and intelligent discussion. Thank you Mr. Moyers. What is at stake is preservation of our country and our constitution. I have never supported the current administration and I found the impeachment discussion to be amazingly impersonal toward the two men. When Colin Powell resigned, in my mind, that was the first public display that things were truly not right at the White House. I hope with all my heart that the American people can think for themselves long enough to contact their representatives in Washington and let their voice be heard. There is enough evidence that both have repeatedly committed dangerous high crimes and misdemeanors, jeopardizing our nation. Nationalism and fear of what is not understood were Adolf Hitler's greatest propaganda mechanism. I find it disturbing that these same tactics have been used since 911. Just another abuse of power. Impeach Bush. Impeach Cheney. Our children's future depends on it.

Bravo, Bill. Another excellent show with no agenda other than to inform and educate.

Yes. It is time. This administration is not capable of changing on its own, nor can we trust them under the threat of impeachment to do the right thing.

A lesson needs to be learned here by all citizens and especially those who wish to hold office: You are obligated to serve us, not screw us.

Great job, Bill.

A relief to hear we may be further along in the "organic" process of impeaching both the president and vice president than I thought. It is so frustrating that congress has not taken seriously the use of impeachment when called for as clearly as it has been calling in the case of this president, it is long overdue.

Every member of congress should be required to view Bill Moyers program on Impeachment aired Friday July 13, 2007... from beginning to end!

Thank you, Bill. The Impeachment movement nationwide is taking off. Recently, on July 4th, Los Angeles took a major step forward in the nation-wide clamor for Impeachment. Leaders of the Westside Greens, the Progressive Democrats of Los Angeles, the Los Angeles Greens, and the Santa Monica Democratic Club established the Los Angeles National Impeachment Center to provide a facility for phonebanking, letterwriting, and the distribution of lawn signs, bumper stickers and a full range of impeachment action items and related literature.


As our nation celebrates the Fourth of July, many Americans are asking whether President George Bush and Vice President Dick Cheney have committed "High Crimes and Misdemeanors," justifying their impeachment and removal from office

Have Bush and Cheney abused their powers of office by using information they knew to be false as justification for the U.S. invasion of Iraq; condoning and authorizing the torture of prisoners of war and rendering detainees to foreign countries know to torture; maintaining secret prisons and other detention facilities in violation of the Geneva Conventions; authorizing warrantless wiretaps on U.S. citizens; disclosing the name of an undercover CIA operative contrary to law in retaliation for her husband's opposition to the Iraq War; and suspending and denying the historic Writ of Habeas Corpus by ordering the indefinite detention of so-called "enemy combatants" without charge and without access to legal counsel?

In the history of the United States, two presidents have been impeached, Andrew Johnson and Bill Clinton, and Richard Nixon resigned to avoid impeachment. No President has (yet) been removed from office. The process of impeachment is secured by the U.S. Constitution. Article II, Section 4, provides that "the President, Vice President, and all civil officers of the United States shall be removed from office on impeachment for, and conviction of, treason, bribery, or other high crimes and misdemeanors."

Removing an official from office requires two steps: a formal accusation, or impeachment, approved by a simple majority in the House of Representatives, and a trial and conviction by two-thirds in the Senate. Nothing in the Constitution prevents a President and Vice President from being impeached and removed from office in the same proceeding, in which case the Speaker of the House would become President.

In 1974, Texas Congresswoman Barbara Jordan gripped the country during the Nixon impeachment hearings when she declared "My faith in the Constitution is whole, it is complete, it is total. I am not going to sit here and be an idle spectator to the diminution, the subversion, the destruction of the Constitution."

Now, former Congresswoman Elizabeth Holtzman, who voted to impeach Nixon as a member of the House Judiciary Committee, publicly supports the impeachment of Bush and Cheney. "President Bush has committed a great many grave and dangerous offenses, and subverted the Constitution. The evidence is clear and strong. Congress cannot shirk its responsibility to protect the nation from tyranny."

Just this past April, a group of prominent Americans gathered at the U.S. Capitol to speak in support of beginning impeachment proceedings against Bush and Cheney. Among them were Mayors Rocky Anderson of Salt Lake City and Mayor John Shields of Nyack, NY; state legislators including Washington State Senator Eric Oemig; city council members, including Dave Meserve of Arcata, CA; and former government officials, including Daniel Ellsberg who released the Pentagon Papers; David MacMichael, a former analyst for the Central Intelligence Agency and a member of the steering committee of Veteran Intelligence Professionals for Sanity; and retired Army Colonel Ann Wright, a career diplomat who quit in protest the day the war began.

Also participating were authors, journalists, poets, and playwrights, including Chris Hedges, Justin Frank, Mark Kurlansky, John Nichols, David Lindorff, Gerald Stern, and Ann Marie Macari; actors, producers, and photographers , including Eunice Wong, and Kathy Chalfant, leading anti-war voices, including Andy Shallal, Cindy Sheehan, Tina Richards, Medea Benjamin, Bob Fertik, David Swanson, Debra Sweet, Kevin Zeese, Michael Berg, Carlos Arredondo, and Elaine Brower.

Eight members of the House of Representatives are actively calling for Bush's impeachment with growing Democratic and Republican support. The Vermont Senate adopted an Impeachment Resolution and similar resolutions are pending in California, Hawaii, Illinois, Maine, Minnesota, Missouri, New Hampshire, New Mexico, Texas, Washington and Wisconsin. At least 22 statewide and national political committees and 80 cities and towns around the country have passed resolutions supporting impeachment.

The Los Angeles and the nationwide movements to impeach Bush and Cheney are quickly gathering steam. Public sentiment for impeachment is becoming more vocal and organized.


The Center (www.bcimpeach.com) will also serve as an organizing center for volunteers to plan lobbying sessions with local politicians. Five members of the powerful House Judiciary Committee are from Los Angeles including Maxine Waters, Howard Berman, Adam Schiff, Brad Sherman and Linda Sanchez. The Center will focus on urging the cities of Santa Monica, West Hollywood, Beverly Hills, and Los Angeles to adopt resolutions supporting the convening of public hearings into impeachment.

Accordingly to Alexander Hamilton, impeachable offenses arose "from the misconduct of public men, or, in other words, from the abuse or violation of some public trust. They are of a nature which may with peculiar propriety be denominated Political, as they relate chiefly to injuries done immediately to society itself."

Our country needs to mourn how far our country has strayed from its founding principles if the people themselves fail to take action to remove from office leaders who have so arrogantly abused their powers, failed to fulfill their duty to "take care that the laws be faithfully executed," and have willfully violated their oath to "preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States."

See www.BCIMPEACH.com for more details on The Los Angeles National Impeachment Center (LANIC).

Your discussion should be mandatory viewing during the next session of Congress, then followed by a line by line analysis of our constitution.

Bush and Cheney must be impeached before they are able to pass to the next administration the illegal liberties they have taken with our constitution.

It's pretty obvious you only run the comments that kiss your backside.

THE 911 DECEPTION IS THE TOP REASON WHY OLD W. AND DICK SHOULD BE IMPEACHED NOW.
DEMO OF WTC 7 AT 5PM BY SILVERSTIEN.
ROBBERY OF BILS. IN GOLD BARS FROM WTC 4 VAULT.
15 FT HOLE PENTAGON.
DICKS NORAD EXER THAT LEFT OUR COUNTRY NAKED FOR ATTACK.
ALL SMOKEING GUNS IN ZIONIST LED DECEPTION TO BRING US TO IRAQ.
MUST SEE WHAT GOULIANI DOES NOT WANT YOU TO KNOW GO TO -
LOOSE CHANGE 2ND EDIT ON YOU TUBE .

AND

ZIONIST CRIMES- USS LIBERTY AND
DOV ZAKHEIM.

GET THE ROPES READY TO HANG ALL THE TRAITORS AT GRD. ZERO.

ITS 3 STRIKES AND YOUR OUT BUSH AND CHENEY
911

IRAQ

KATRINA

THE JIG IS UP.

WILL WE NEVER FORGET !!!!

THE 911 DECEPTION IS THE TOP REASON WHY OLD W. AND DICK SHOULD BE IMPEACHED NOW.
DEMO OF WTC 7 AT 5PM BY SILVERSTIEN.
ROBBERY OF BILS. IN GOLD BARS FROM WTC 4 VAULT.
15 FT HOLE PENTAGON.
DICKS NORAD EXER THAT LEFT OUR COUNTRY NAKED FOR ATTACK.
ALL SMOKEING GUNS IN ZIONIST LED DECEPTION TO BRING US TO IRAQ.
MUST SEE WHAT GOULIANI DOES NOT WANT YOU TO KNOW GO TO -
LOOSE CHANGE 2ND EDIT ON YOU TUBE .

AND

ZIONIST CRIMES- USS LIBERTY AND
DOV ZAKHEIM.

GET THE ROPES READY TO HANG ALL THE TRAITORS AT GRD. ZERO.

I was so happy to hear a conservative speak with such passion, intelligence and courage as Bruce Fein did on this program. As soon as I heard that he was associated with the "think tank" the heritage foundation I was ready to dismiss him as another conservative, I have been listening to most of them tow the party line for six years. I have been listening to people on the left complain for six years with no result, it seems like we have all been talking to ourselves. To hear a republican say everything that I believe in my heart to be true about this great country, as well as this terrible, corrupt administration gives me some hope that this country may be able to mobilize against this attack on our constitution, not along party lines, But as a people. We need to impeach these men, Not as punishment , But to tell these men that we will not tolerate this perversion of our constitution, and assault on our liberties. Thank you once again Bill Moyers, You may be the last real journalist in this country.

Our two party system is badly worn out. The failure of elected officials in Washington to handle proper governmental business is appaling, and has been for years. Now is the time for us to finally bring about a true third party, one that understands our Constitution and is willing to govern by it. Of all the politicians running for president today, only Ron Paul is paying attention to our Constitution. All others are only interested in personal power and receiving all things offered by lobby groups. There are only something like a half-dozen senators and representatives who are in Washington to actually help our country. The others are there for the money and power.

Whatever happened to "liberty and justice for all"? The current White House administration has turned our Constitution into a sham, and our Congress is doing nothing about it. When I write to my Senators (Cornyn and Hutchison), I get back polite form letters that convey their thanks for my input, but make it clear that they have no intention of changing their position.

Your segment on impeachment tonight was excellent. I have never heard the impeachment procedure and purpose so clearly explained. I look forward to downloading the transcript so that I can use it as a basis for numerous letters that I will be sending to newspapers, congressmen, and senators.

Thank you for your coverage of this critical issue.

Whatever happened to "liberty and justice for all"? The current White House administration has turned our Constitution into a sham, and our Congress is doing nothing about it. When I write to my Senators (Cornyn and Hutchison), I get back polite form letters that convey their thanks for my input, but make it clear that they have no intention of changing their position.

Your segment on impeachment tonight was excellent. I have never heard the impeachment procedure and purpose so clearly explained. I look forward to downloading the transcript so that I can use it as a basis for numerous letters that I will be sending to newspapers, congressmen, and senators.

Thank you for your coverage of this critical issue.

I have been reading the comments from the public and wanted to take some action that would make my voice heard. I e-mail Speaker Polesi and ask that she watch the program and take action for impeachment, while believe she is more of a poloitican than a statesman; I felt I had taken some action to make my voice heard. Her e-mail address is:

http://www.speaker.gov/contact/

Finally someone has put the topic on the table: The damage being done by the Bush administration to the United States government.
And by Congress for letting it happen.
And by the
Fourth Estate for watching it happen.

Vote in the National Cheney Impeachment Poll -

Now near 90,000 strong -

http://www.usalone.com/cheney_impeachment.php

The root of the problem discussed is this: In the lead up to the 2004 elections, Republican Operative Peggy Noonan wrote that the Republicans are 20 years ahead of the Democrats when it comes to manipulating the Media toward its agenda. Due to extensive Media Training.

I Know all about the process of Media Training and it is the only thing I agree with Peggy Noonan about.

In the 90s Gnewt Gangrene use to Fax his daily talking points to thousands of Republicans. So on any given day, the one on channel 5 was telling the same lies as the one on channel 68.

The power of the Repetition of lies was first discovered by effective Fascist Party:

As is taught in Speech classes..Hitler and his "architect"
Geobbles discovered to their delight that when you repeat lies people begin to believe that they are true. This is how the Natzis were able to pull of the Holocaust.

These days The Tim Russerts and Chris Mathews of the word use Republican Talking Points, AS OPPOSED TO HISTORY AND THE FACTS erroneously challenge Democrats.

Remember when Democrats were coming up with Policy after Policy proposal with regards to Iraq?

From inclusion of Suniis in the constitution (before it was ever voted on) to Kerry pushing for more Special forces, to fight Al Quaeda, while pulling combat troops out of the center of a civil war..and driving over the same IEDs over and over again.

One attempt after another to try to rectify an awful situation.

But what were the Tim Russerts and Chris Mathews saying OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN? Quote:
"The Democrats have no plan, the Democrats have no Plan, the Democrats have no Plan, the Democrats have no Plan"

And while the American Fascist Republican Party and their Media appeasers thrive on an ignorant electorate, (people are just too busy working, American education has been declining since Reagan..and lets not forget that only 28% of Americans have college education...

By contrast when the Kerry campaign was asked why they did not fight back and attack Bush they said:
"we believed that people already knew who Bush is"

Well nothing is farther from the truth. How many Americans know that the Republicans have been trying to get rid of FEMA or the Army Corp of Engineers for decades..or the department of education, and all the other agencies that we pay to protect us.

So while the Democrats believe that the Electorate knows more than they do (UNTIL ITS TOO LATE BECAUSE ALL OF THE TRAGEDIES WE ARE ENDURING HAVE BEEN PREDICTABLE AND A TORTURE TO WATCH AS THEY UNFOLD)

While the Democrats fundamentally represent Policies for the "Greater Good" and do not like the **PHONY** game of Politics. ANYTHING THEY DO IS also MISREPRESENTED
BY THE THE MEDIA...

As a result of not getting that they must Be phony and Manipulate the Media
like the Republicans do...
they end up being milder than they should be.

Come on let's not forget what happened when Democratic Senators angrily challanged the Bush Supreme Court appointees at their hearings..THE REPUBLICAN CONTROLLED MEDIA MADE THEM LOOK LIKE SHRILL CARTOON!!

And while we may need to have impeachment to restore our constitution (and it would sure make a lot of people feel relieved)..Fact is that the 12 year Republican Congress and the Juvenile Delinquents in the White House have left such a MESS
THAT IT IS IMPOSSIBLE TO KNOW WHERE TO BEGIN!!!

It is highly ironic that after 6 months of trying to restore checks and balances through hearings and changes in budgetary priorities WHILE NOT TREATING THE REPUBLCANS IN THE TERRIBLE MANNER THEY WERE TREATED, WHICH GIVES THE REPUBLICANS FAR MORE POWER THAN THEY DESERVE AND WHICH THEY ARE USING TO BLOCK THE Democrats..

..It is ironic to constantly hear the Democrats be criticized AFTER THE REPUBLICANS HAVE SOLD OUR COUNTRY TO **THE LOWEST BIDDERS** AND WHILE HOPeFULLY RETRIEVED...THANKS TO THE Democrats we are beginning to come back, at the 11th hour from BECOMING A RADICAL RIGHT WING TOTALITARIAN at the hands of the Republicans.

If people want impeachment you are going to have to let your congressional leaders know that it is more important than Iraq, or restoring all the other damage the Republicans have done to the Agencies that we pay to protect us!

One of the ironic elements of all this is that Americans would like to see Bipartisan efforts happening BUT WORKING WITH REPUBLICANS IS LIKE EMPOWERING HAMAS.

These are not normal times.
And to claim that the Democratic Candidates do not know or believe in the constitution ...I was surprised this angle on it.

Let's not forget that while the Republicans have the "Federalist Society" The Democrats have "The Constitution Society"

And to blame Pelosi for not impeaching Bush& Cheeney...YOU ARE BLAMING HER FOR NOT WANTING TO BECOME PRESIDENT!

The constant blame, on your show of the Democrats every week, reminds of when Incest Survivors begin to remember what has been done to them they Blame the mothers who did not protect them rather THAN THEIR PERPETRATORS.

I have C-SPAN and CNBC on every day, AND HAVE SEEN THE EFFORTS ON THE PART OF DEMOCRATS AND THE MISREPORTING ABOUT THEM.

Bruce, I have seen your intelligent self at congressional hearings and respect you highly..Have even cried by your validation of my observations.. But please take into the account the imossible situation the Democrats are in, Sorry for anyone who does not see that they are the last hope for our nation. Help empower them, THEIR MAJORITY to repair the damamge IS FAR FROM GUARANTEED. Republicans will do anything (while accussing others of precisely what they themselves are doing.

IN the last 27 years we have had 20 year of Republicans rule while the American Middle Class is declinging and declinging. The Democrats need to be bolsterered not put down week after week. You want impeachment (and you make a good case both on the merits and constitutionally) then help make it a priority.

We clearly have a constitutional Crisis. Bruce GO ANNOUNCE IT FROM THE ROOF TOPS. If you are lucky the Tim Russerts of the world will grant you time to repeat your message over and over again. Then we may get somewhere.

Provide the Democrats with Research services to BUILD a case for impeachement (WHITH NO JOHN DEAN AS WHISTLE BLOWER) And make it worthwhile to GIVE UP ALL THE OTHER EMERGENCIES IN THE NEXT YEAR AND A HALF.

I can tell you one thing that without the Decocrats
-- WHICH REQUIRES VOTES-- THIS COUNTRY WILL BE COOKED FOR DECADES AND POSSIBLY FOR EVER!!!!

If the Republicans are from Mars (the planet of war) and the Democrats are from Venus (the planet of Nuance and Diplomacy.. not wiminess), we have been like a nation run by the mafia chief with his son, the Juvenile Delinquent at the helm.

You are Welcome
Dani

Vote in the National Cheney Impeachment Poll -

Now near 90,000 strong -

http://www.usalone.com/cheney_impeachment.php

Thank you for an excellent program tonight. its so nice to view points and thoughts from a responsible conservative and a progressive on this important and relevant impeachment issue. Good reflections about the media as well. the american corporate media seems obsessed with trivial and superficial matters of the day. its such a bore to watch the news and media in this country. it is refreshing to watch a commercial free news related program with thought provoking and relevant topics such as impeachment.

the one woman stephanie is right. the bill introduced by dennis kucinich (hr 333) is important and should be supported by everyone.

Thank you for the great insight on the very meaning of impeachment. Bush needs an advisor like Fein to explain the constitution to him. dc

Fein and Nichols were brilliant in their explanation of why there must be an impeachment to reverse the precedents of Bush and Cheney and set this country back on the course it deserves.

They put into words the feelings I have about the state of the nation's leadership and its people. I am scared for what lies ahead for all of us if Congress does not take action soon.

Mr Moyers,
I have written all of the representatives from my district and pointed out that impeachment is in order. I do not consider President Bush capable nor of the temperment of aggression or intelligence to be capable of creating the situation that exist today. The aggression and intelligence required can only come from Mr Cheny. His position and reputation are second to no other in government. He intimidates to get accomplished his agenda which is big business profitting at unbelieveable levels. Americans must demand their removal before their term runs out. The public will bear the fault if nothing is done. Our representatives lack initiative and need to get motivated. Your guest talked of things I was feeling and in my attempts to stir Pelosi and others have garnered no results. Is rebellion in order to get houses to act. I feel we are near that level. I'm upset with the TOTAL LACK of REPRESENTATION the public is recieving. Thanks for your show....I hope we are not to late to salvage democracy....seriously. God Speed

This was a thought provoking program. I think that the discussion clearly underscored how confused so many of us are, at least I know I am and for that I am ashamed, about our Constitution, why it was written and how it works. I found it especially interesting when Mr. Nichols spoke of the misconception that we have about impeachment - that we are mistaken when we think of impeachment as a "constitutional crisis" when it is impeachment itself that is actually the cure for the crisis. I also really liked when Mr. Nichols argued against the leadership that brought the impeachment issue to force with President Clinton because he pointed out that in that instance, the proceedings were about removing a President from office, and not a greater sense of obligation to uphold our constitutional law, which must be the real impetus for impeachment.

Listening to the impeachment discussion this evening two observations came to mind. First, the men that met in Philadelphia created a system of government that is astounding because they so well understood the concept of political power and how it can threaten liberty. Second, how did my generation come so far as to be willing to sacrifice those core ideals, and a way to acheive them, that those men over two hundred years ago set to paper. Our political apathy, obsession with wealth, addiction to greed,curiosity about mindless celebrity and unwillingness to demand the whole truth from those we elect and engage in business, will leave for our children a nation that, for the first time in our history, is worse than that which was left to us by our parents. We are responsible and its time we started to act like it. I think of that Lady in the Harbor and wonder if she is not, for the first time, crying.

I just followed the urging of TByrne by going to Ms. Pelosi's website and urging her to reconsider her position on impeachment. Mr. Fein and Mr. Nichols have convinced me. They've inspired me to take my responsibility as a public citizen instead of wringing my hands in private. "C'mon people now, everybody get together...."

Clearly we must impeach to save our constitution. If we don't then I am moving to B.C because this will be the end of it all.

great show again mr. moyers. I think it is time to impeach both of these criminals for this war and spying and everything else.
col ann wright was in houston this week for forum with cindy sheehan( she is on a caravan from crawford to washington dc to demand that pelosi start impeachment hearings)and she said people should push conyers to start impeachment hearings. she also said many people should go to washington and go to every congressperson's office and demand that they end this war and impeach bush and cheney.

Hell, yes, impeach Bush and Cheney. John McCain's comments are out of line. There was a draft in place during the Vietnam war. Soldiers served less time (one tour unless they voulunteered for more) than our current soldiers do. My military family has suffered great hardship for a lie and others have had children die for a lie, while the rest of the country discusses the immature antics of a spoiled Paris Hilton. Wake up America. While you sleep, the neocons/corporate America are willing to take over.

I've read all these comments and it seems that all are in favor of impeachment. Bruce Fein's comments cut to the heart of the situation. I hope congress takes heed.

BRAVO! Nichols is brilliant with his broad bush strokes & Fein is a perfect example of what honest conservatives should be saying. Maybe everyone in congress should get a copy of this show delivered and then a call on Monday to see what they think about impeachment.

However there was no mention that Kucinich has a resolution before congress to impeach Cheney that only 9 congressmen have signed on to. While criticizing the media in it's lackluster efforts, no one would give the "poverty" candidates (Kucinich & Gravel) who are the only ones even talking about challenging the Bush-Cheney Oligarchy, even a mention. Indeed any of the monied candidates that the media deems "realistic" (and will pay them hansomely soon) are strangely quiet on the topic of an Imperial Presidency, especially when they are at work in Congress where they could do something about it. The unsung heros like Kucinich who have committed to saving our constitution and practicing the statesmanship that Fein was pining for cannot even rate a mention. Maxine Waters clled for Bush-Cheney's impeachment in her Forth Of July Address in LA while the media prefered the patriotism of giant Uncle Sam's on parade. Barbara Boxer and the other members of the Progressive are blue in the face insisting on this every day and they didn't rate a mention. This is the fragmentation that kills efforts to take down this Imperial conspiracy to deconstruct our tconstitution- we forget who our allies are.

Bill, this is in no way do question the quality or veracity of your guests & this may sound demanding, but progressives have little access to get our message out on TV other than Olbermann on Cable and the unsinkable Amy Goodman wherever she can squeeze out some air time. Air America & The Nation are great, but these congresspeople need the exposure that someone is trying to do something need to be addressed by you by name on your show, not as a matter of partisanship, but as a matter of recognition of their courage.

Maybe you could do a followup with John Bonifaz and David Swanson.
More attention must be paid to the fact that congress and the media have known since the Downing Street Minutes that Bush-Cheney co-presidents lied to congress & then repeated the lie in the state of the union. If this "lieing" was the benchmark set for Clinton, impeachment should be something that needs to be pursued until this happens. THere is going to be an impeachment rally in Kennebunkport August 25th & 26th, why not cove the movement to push the point that impeachment isn't something that congress doest when it is conveinient, it is something that and Nichols correctly stated is the necessary medicine that the crisis caused by this concerted attact on the constitution demands. Personally, I think that Pelosi has to be forced to take up impeachment because removing this co-cpesidency puts her in as president, so if she drives it it looks self serving. That being said, if the madia would hold her feet to the fire of the questions that Nichols & Fein raise, we can turn this around. Thanks for taking this up in the media blackout on IMPEACHMENT. We have had a 20 foot banner in our driveway for two years.

Thank you, Bill Moyers, for your courage and the courage of your guests, Mr. Fein and Mr. Nichols for explaining so clearly why impeachment is so vital right now!

I hope Nancy Pelosi was listening.

Posting our approval of impeachment of Bush and Cheney will not do the trick. Would Bruce Fein and John Nichols be willing to start a grass roots campaign? They have the expertise and a national forum.

hi, chaney and bush have run amuck. how about early retirement. thier both use less now and only will make more of a mess. offer it if they scoff at it move to impeach.

Benjamin Franklin said it best when confronted with this dilemma: "Those who would give up liberty for a modicum of security deserve neither liberty nor security." In other words, once citizens give up their liberty, they rarely retrieve it. Tyrants never willingly return liberty; it is only retrieved by revolution.

Bill Moyers continues to uphold my ideals of the best qualities of journalism. Tonight's program was without doubt, Brilliant. When Bruce Fein launched his lecture about congressional resposibility and the constitution I was breathless. His passion for the essence of America is rarely ever seen or felt in such a profound way. While I previously agreed with Pelosi that impeachment would be a distraction, I now understand why it must be pursued. Fein and Nichols were brilliant in their explanation of why there must be an impeachment to reverse the precedents of Bush and Cheney and set this country back on the course it deserves.

Our governing system, representative Democracy, assumes that an informed and thoughtful public is numerous enough to unify their voices, votes, and grass roots fundraising enough to curb the would be dictators. I sense that the potential for this to work is gravely limited now in the United States. The percentage of Americans who are informed enough, can grasp difficult concepts, and reason with a calm logic are not numerous enough to give a good fight against the well funded army of special interests. We have brilliant lobbyists and media savy groups who can turn Democracy very far away from any idealistic system of sober voters governing themselves. Probably a couple million other Americans enjoy pretending that such discussions presented on this Moyers program elevate the public debate. But, alas, we are simply being entertained by this thoughtful television, just as the majority of Americans are watching 'reality programming' on commercial television opposite this. Short attention span sells, and this wonderful Moyers programming is simply an unsaleable 'what if' vision from college humanites classes that I enjoyed. Face it, we are outnumbered by a over-spun voting public that is mentally bought and paid for, easily, by pragmatic capitalists who use the media brilliantly for their own short term purposes. I love the discussion.

i actually shed tears during this show, bill! i don't think i have heard it so coherently put by two guys who would normally be verbally duking it out: where are the statesmen?
we are in crisis, and it can be seen and felt all the way down here at the corner of walk and don't walk in anytown, usa.
it saddens me. to run for office has become a huge industry. to be in office has become a huge industry. the money is mind boggling. i don't see many leaders emerging because they simply can not afford to get into the industry of politics.
i cried, bill. i cried.

I fear that the healing balm of impeachment has passed into history right along with the Congress' responsibility to declare war.
The failure to impeach Nixon sent an unmistakable message to future PsOTUS: "I got away with it!"
The Republican engine that set forth to Clinton impeachment sent a message to the people: "We've sniffed up a sex scandal and trapped the boob in a lie. Now let's reverse the election results." Remember, as the Clinton proceeding marched on, his poll numbers rose accordingly.
Citizens have come to hold as much contempt for the impeachment palliative as they do for indiscriminate wars.

Everyone here who feels strongly about the need to restore our constitution by Impeaching this lawless administration, needs to send a link of this interview to the Speaker of the House and to their own elected representatives and urge them to ACT NOW!

I just did, Please join me indoing the same!

In the past, I believed the congress had more important business than to impeach the president and vice-president (that seemed like the tactic of the Republicans against Bill clinton). But now it seems to be really taking away our rights and lying about important things, I have changed my opinion. Impeach and show the world we care.

If you need inspiration on this, listen again to Barbara Jordan's speech on impeachment: http://americanrhetoric.com/speeches/barbarajordanjudiciarystatement.htm

It'll make you remember what this is all about.

I have had two "ImpeachBush.Org" signs in front of my house for about a year now.

But I have never heard the case for impeachment made so convincingly.

I have written my Congressman and will continue to urge him to take a leadership role in curing our Constitutional Crisis with the remedy of impeachment.

Bill Moyers is a true American Hero and Nichols and Fein deserve every honor the Republic can bestow.

I hope the Republic does survive. It all depends on us. Without strong pressure, our Congress will only play politics even though we are at a stage where statesmanship is demanded.

thank goodness bill has finally put the "impeachment" show on, i've been waiting since the show began again...great work. recruit bruce fein to be the independent counsel in the proceedings.

remember people, back to '73-'74....very possibly the most admired people in the country were sam ervin and john sirica! if you're too young ask your parents or grandparents.

conyers already has the list made up with help from kucinich,de la vega, and elizabeth holtzman. this must happen to save the country from the death spiral we find ourselves in...it's up to us folks to apply the pressure. call your reps until they're sick of hearing from you.

Congressman Dennis Kucinich has introduced a bill to impeach Cheney, it is H.R. 333 and so far it has 14 co-sponsors in congress.

While watching this segment on impeachment, I was extremely disappointed and frustrated over the neglect of either Bill Moyers or Bruce Fein or John Nichols to mention this initiative. There were many opportunities to do so.

It is not being done for political reasons, but Kucinich has made it clear that he loves this country and wants to protect the constitution.

Dennis Kucinich is running for president in 2008, but is never mentioned for some reason, as being different from the other democrats. He voted against the war from the beginning and has been outspoken against torture and the other crimes of the Bush adminstration.

Visit his website at kucinich.us and read some of his past speeches and look at his record.

And just a word to the gentleman who said he was heartsick over the impeachment issue because he lived under a dictatorship and he feels free here. Yes, you feel free now, but what Bush and Cheney are doing is setting up this country for a dictatorship or police state. It is the constitution and the separation of powers that have safeguarded our freedom. We are losing that freedom because of this administration.

I hope people will wake up and demand impeachment. We can start with Cheney and then Bush. Support H.R. 333!

This program was powerful and stirring. It was so refreshing to witness a non partisan intellectual discussion of these critical national issues. Thank God we still have PBS. How and if Americans respond will determine whether the United States continues as a leading democracy in our world.

As former member of the military, defenders of the Constitution, I have been deep appalled at how the Congress has behaved.

Bush and Cheney have put themselves above the law and ramrodded policies onto the American public and the world unchecked.
He scoffs at the law and Congress.

Who can contact to demand hearings be started?
Congressmen seem to have no interest.
I am saying "WHEN" now.

Wonderful, Wonderful program. Thank you so much. I hope this program gets repeated many many times and that every congress person gets a copy of it--and WATCHES it.

What a stimulating show on impeachment! I only wish the 20, 30, 40 and 50 somethings were watching. I fear their view of personal freedom is another two word for tv and MacDonalds. Not to blame an entire generation duped into chasing the corporate carrot but when you come down to it, isn't that the problem; souls chasing the souless rewards of material gratification here on earth? Freedom's just another word for nothing left to lose someone sang. What a perfect environment for royalty to take root; in a deep vein of rot right here in America. Dig out the rot and royalty like a fungus will dry and blow in the wind. I loved Bruce, it was like watching Colbert on steriods and I wanted to jump out of my chair and cheer. By God, someone else knows what the hell's going on!

Impreachment? At first the idea was astounding to me given our current state of affairs. But as the program unfolded the "truth" and historical record of this administration does scream 'impreachment' - especially given its definition to expose and hamper the excess of government. I have often felt that most egregious mistake made re: Iraq has been that we imposed an artificial deadline on the elections without the completion of the Iraq constitution. Without a constitution - where is the commitment, where is the evidence of negotiation and where is the vision of the future? Thank you ever so much for such intelligent and insighful television. It is indeed rare...

We found your discussion on impeachment very relevant, passionately argued and with a great deal of truth. We were non-plussed, however, that there was no mention by either Mr. Moyers or his guests, of H.R.333 for the impeachment of Mr. Cheney. This was brought bravely forward by Mr. Dennis Kucinich, representative from Ohio, one of the Presidential candidates. How do you account for this lapse?

Why is there never any discussion of Leo Strauss and the Straussian political and social philosophy that is the foundation of the neo-conservative oligarchy. The American people are not unintelligent, they would make the connection between Strauss and Rumsfeld,Wolfewitz,Perle,Rove et al. PBS is the only media outlet where this discussion would be possible
Tom O'Malley
Ottawa

Here is a question I would've liked answered. Both gentlemen talked close to the point, but neither of them actually talked about - the failed conviction. Understand, that I think that this president and VP have done horrible things, and deserve removal from office. But what happens, if we start impeachment proceedings, and the impeachment happens, but the conviction doesn't? What is to then stop this president (or for that matter a future president) from saying "We've had the national debate, and these impeachment proceedings prove that this is within my authority."?

Fein and Nichols were **BRILLIANT** in the energy, passion, and clarity they brought to the issue of impeachment as a necessary protection to the Constitution and the Rule of Law.

PLEASE send a copy of the Fein-Nichols interview to every Congressperson -- and, if possible, find a way to have the entire video included in the Congressional Record. Mr Fein spoke of his belief that congresspeople don't understand the Constitution and think only of political expediency -- this interview could electrify national debate.

THANK YOU from the bottom of my heart for this show!

Impeach them both for the sake of our country.

Thank you for such a brilliant discussion with such excellent discussants.

I urge Nancy Pellosi to stand up and do justice to her position...instead of worrying about the politics of it all, by voting to impeach the president and vice president...We have proof that crimes and misdemeanors have been commited and this is probably the tip of the iceberg...

Tonight it was announced that the White House is now exercising it's "Executive Privilege" regarding the Pat Tillman friendly fire issue.

This is yet another ploy to hide purposeful inappropriate unethical behavior of the criminality which is this Administration. Members of this Administration aren't & weren't worthy to shine Pat Tillman's boots.

Just like Guantanamo the directions & orders came directly from that White House. Both the President & Vice President need to be removed from office. I firmly believe that they are not done with their dirty deeds. They have inexplicity harmed our country & it's citizenry purposely & with malice.

No one on the show tonight mentioned that Sen. Barbara Boxer advocated impeachment today and noted that we are "as close as we've ever come to dictatorship."

NOR did anyone mention the totally insane behavior of first Cheney and then Bush last week in declaring themselves not a part of the Executive Branch-!!!
Why did we not send men in White Coats to find out what was going on? And an amnesia seems to have settled in about this embarrassing event.

Also, the program tonight didn't consider this . . .

QUOTE:
From Judiciary In '74-
"
If The President Be Connected In Any
Suspicious Manner With Any Person..."
The following is from a report written and released by
the Judiciary Committee in 1974 in the aftermath of the Watergate
crisis.

In the (Constitutional) convention George Mason argued that the
President might use his pardoning power to "pardon crimes which were advised
by himself" or, before indictment or conviction, "to stop inquiry and
prevent detection." James Madison responded:

If the President be connected, in any suspicious manner, with any
person, and there be grounds to believe he will shelter him, the House of
Representatives can impeach him; they can remove him if found guilty...

....................

Madison went on to say contrary to his position in the Philadelphia
convention, that the President could be suspended when suspected, and his
powers would devolve on the Vice President, who could likewise be
suspended until impeached and convicted, if he were also suspected.
UNQUOTE

The founders well understood the dangers of a standing army as the lead in to perpetual war.
Truman complicated this with establishing the CIA which has increased government secrecy and taken power from Congress and the people. Eisenhower well understood the dangers as he suffered his instructions being ignored by the military/intelligence complex. NOTE: Eisenhower added "intelligence" to his warning twice and twice it was removed from his speech.


Thank you for such an incredible program on such an important issue. Both speakers were excellent. Many, many of us across the US believe that Cheney (1st) and then Bush should be impeached and the Congress should get the courage to start the process ASAP. There are so many reasons, many of which were discussed by your guests. The one that wasn't discussed was the Administration's program to steal the last presidnetial election and lay the groundwork for doing so again in 2008. This is the real scandal behind the Aministration's firing of certain US Attorneys as they were part of the process of using the justice system to subvert the electoral process and the Constitution. Some refused and they were fired. Monica Goodling aluded to this in her testimony before Congress several weeks ago when she discussed "vote caging." Amy Goodman on Democracy Now and the BCC have begun exposing the plot but the American media aren't listening. Unfortunately, like with torture, extraordinary rendition, the Patriot Act, NSA surveillance and spying on Americans, pre-emptory war on false grounds, and generally lying to Congress and the American people, etc., Congress does not have the courage and guts to exercise the powers the Constitution gives it to protect our liberties and the Constitution. I hope your program will give some of them the courage to begin being true to their oath of office to uphold and protect the Constitution of the United States.

I urge all to send a short, sharp message to Nancy Pellosi and John Conyers to urge them to put Impeachment "back on the table".
It is clear from the events of the last few weeks that Cheney/Bush is not the slightest bit interested in the Constitution, as written; let us then provide the correction specified in that extraordinary document!

I am writing this message while I happen to watch what about impeachment of the president and vice president. What are we waiting for. I am sorry but I have my blood boiling. I' ve been to this country for 40 years (I am from Greece)

I left it because I had a military dictatorship. 40 years in this country and I never felt threatened. This time I do. I am writing to my representatives, and I don't know what they will do.

We have only two choices: wait until Bush's term is up, or to work to end it. If Bush and Cheney were merely mistaken or ineffective there would be no harm in waitng. But, these men and the people around them are damaging the country, bullying the people, and dismantling the Constitution. If we cower to any man who does not live up to his oath of office to uphold the Constitution, we are not a strong nation. If the Congress doesn't have the courage to try to end their reign of imperialism, then members of Congress should have their careers ended. If no one cares enough about the Constitution to stand up for its tenents, our children will look upon the devastation of corruption and our massive cowardice, and weep at the aftermath.

This is one of the rare moments in history where Congress (and I mean the Republicans and ESPECIALLY the Democrats) needs to put aside policy and elections. Nichols is right on when he says, "Pelosi needs to put the country ahead of the party." Elections and policy issues will always be there for Congress to handle. But as I said, this is just one of those rare moments in our history where the abuses of power is just so obvious and if Bush and Cheney are not held accountable, then it sends a message to future leaders that they too can get away like Bush and Cheney did. I don't care how much time they have left in their final term. Presidents and Vice-presidents should be held accountable AT ALL POINTS in their term.

If this discussion reflects the overall attitude of American citizens, it is undeniably apparent that we are screaming for Ron Paul. He is the only presidential candidate that even mentions the Constitution. He's called Dr. No because he curbs his votes by the Constitution. He is incredibly consistent when it comes to the Constitution. Why would we even think of considering anyone else for the office of the Presidency? It's absurd to disregard Dr. Paul, especially seeing as he is the only qualified candidate. Please people, think rationally and objectively. Party doesn't matter, the Constitution does. Our personal liberties matter. Ron Paul must be elected.

Nichols and Fein have articulated the issues that have worried us about this president since his inauguration. He swore to protect and defend the constitution of the united states, as did the vice president.

he is worried about his legacy without any comprehension of the fact that his real legacy will be to make the nixon whitehouse look like an open, honest, and ethical administration.

Having just voted for preserving our liberties in time of war, I should add that this is no war. This is a corporatist ploy: a means of siphoning billions out of taxpayers' pockets into contractors' coffers ($12 billion per week at last count), while they wrench control of the Iraqi oil, if they can, and jack up the prices.

During World War II, a real war, there were reasonable restrictions -- censorship of international mail, for instance -- which I wouldn't oppose in similar circs. As for the unreasonable restrictions, such as detention of Japanese-Americans, I hope that I would have spoken harshly against them, had I been alive then.

The huge problem with this question is that it implicitly accepts there is such a thing as waging "war" against a methodology. We've really got to stop calling this corporate rape launched in the name of defeating "terror" a war.

When the suicide attacks on the U.S. took place on September 11, 2001, I was as shocked and dismayed as any, but I strongly disagreed with any act of retribution. Those who committed the acts were dead by their own hand. Those who conspired, planned on exactly that kind of reaction because of what it would mean for their ultimate cause.

More than anything else, I wanted America to stand tall with integrity and engage in a national debate about why others would hate America enough to perpetrate such acts. And then, I hoped your great country would extend its hand to others to ameliorate such causes. Giving Bin Laden so much power and attention only served to strengthen him and his cause. Invading Afghanistan only served to sow further seeds of discord - and invading Iraq even more so. Far from punishing the Taliban, even the current NATO actions are only serving to strengthen them as a grassroots force.

Your administration is responsible for everything bad that has happened since that date in 2001. It has fulfilled George Orwell's vision of a totalitarian future with Big Brother watching its citizens, while a perpetual war serves to consume up the valuable resources of the country. "We can't improve health care, or education, or infrastructure because we are spending billions upon billions on a war that produces nothing in return." Katrina is a classic consequence of this strategy.

I can't think that the Americans want that boot to be smashing them in the face for eternity. Surely, there is goodness and hope in your country. I hope and pray you find it before long.

If Americans were prepared to impeach Bill Clinton for a minor transgression, why would they balk at impeaching men who caused an unnecessary war and who has ridden roughshod over the rights and liberties which your country had come to epitomize?

This corrupt administration uses "national security" to help them cover-up and hide all of their crimes and misdemeanors. Bush and Cheney are most deserving to face impeachment and then put on trial for war crimes and treason and last a long stay in a Federal prison without a pardon. They have ruined the DoJ by using it as a political tool and to obstruct justice. Justice only applies to their criminal friends and teasonous corporate contributors. They have slimed everything they have touched from the enviornment,education, health care and our own national security and every other government department. If they are not impeached that is a crime as well. The list of broken laws is to long for now but the time to do something is NOW. If Congress does not start impeachment hearings I think they will pay for it in the next election. This is what the majority wants, so wake up Congress, it is time to stand up and free us of this destructive administration starting at the very top. We must restore our civil liberties and face the world with brave hearts and honest souls instead of cowering behind this corrupt administration as they continue to spin their fear mongering. I don't want to stand with the cowards.

We don’t need any abridgment of civil liberties to fight terrorism. Data mining just creates huge numbers of false hits that waste the time of professionals who could be following up on actual leads; the FISA law (from before the so-called PATRIOT Act was passed) is quite sufficient for anything more precise. I recommend Bruce Schneier’s writings, particularly his book Beyond Fear to anyone who wants to develop their thinking on security.

To impeach Bush also means his VP must also be impeached! Maybe even the next in line! What viable alternatives do we, the American (REAL) people have? Congress still lacks the necessary votes to do its business; and Bush always has veto power! Maybe more underlies this frustration for the log haul than many realize. If this is "government by the people" seems to me "the People" as in the MAJORITY of the people must speak up loud and clear - and long! Are we, the People, accurately informed? Are we, the People, willing to find out the FACTS??? or are most 'too busy', too seduced by 'entertainment', too overwhelmed by violence to go the next step - OUT of "Oh, well-ism". Is it asking too much in today's world to "Think about it!"???

It happened in 1976 and does happen with any failed states from time to time. The people's response to unhampered governmental powers is revolution.

To avoid necessarily violent revolutions as in 1976, the Constitution gives our people the powers to throw elected officials out by voting them out or through legislative impeachment.

I used to long for 2008 to get over the Bush nightmare. I believe the difference between a truly failed democracy and a robust one is its ability to restore essential balances. This is irrespective of the nutcase temporarily holding office. It is not possible to produce the perfect administrator at each election.

But if a transfer of power without exorcising Bush Adm. excesses will result in the institutionalizion of such excesses, then action needs to take place now. In this case, Bush Inc. represents a clear and present danger to our democracy and perhaps to the civilized world order as we know them.

Short of that, one hopes that our nation-state will withshand the passage of our failed government.

Our government is that organization of individuals elected, appointed, hired or contracted to serve all the people of our nation. It carries out its public service transparently and pragmatically in accordance with our constitution, based foremost on real needs of the people, not on personal dogma, superstition, ideology, secret agendas, or other secondary allegiances. And always, the government serves us at our pleasure. But we also, ultimately, get the government we deserve.

If we are engaged in a legitimate war, meaning one where we have no choice but to defend ourselves from clear and present, direct or indirect harm, then it may be necessary for the government to limit certain freedoms temporarily, where we all share in this sacrifice, and then only with the people's majority consent. But if a war is begun surreptitiously, deceptively, proactively and recklessly, based on claims of defense against a false, weak or unlikely threat, and then executed incompetently, even immorally, with all the attendant negative blowback, then those public servants responsible should be removed ASAP, in accordance with the constitution.

In my view, and on a number of counts, Bush and Cheney deserve nothing less than the due process of impeachment, the sooner the better. They've had almost 7 years to prove their worth, mostly only proving their disworth. They must be openly held accountable, and if found guilty, removed from office in disgrace and dishonor. I have no sentimental attachment to any president or vice president, especially ones so arrogant, manipulative and self-serving. Yes, impeachment would be a painful proceeding, but this time necessary, and we'll all emerge the better for it, perhaps relearning why we revolted against an oppressive king 235 years ago, and started an open, citizen-governed country that supports and shares equal rights, freedoms and opportunities.

"He that would make his own liberty secure must guard even his enemy from oppression; for if he violates this duty he establishes a precedent that will reach to himself."
~Thomas Paine

We need to remember that the Constitution doesn't give us our rights. They are "self-evident" and extant whether acknowledged by any written source. The Constitution wasn't written to make us free, but to remind us, and the government that followed, that we are.

To change anything in regard to our civil rights as a result of a terrorist attack gives victory to the terrorists. The solution to "they hate us for our freedoms" is not to make ourselves less free, yet that's exactly what the administration has done. I can't believe Americans fell for it, and let it happen. When did we become cowards?

The Bush Administration is the great American nightmare. They are everything our government was designed to prevent. The 2000 election could not have turned out as it did if 1) we conducted our elections according to the original text of the Constitution or 2) the Electoral College functioned as intended, which was to prevent the popular vote of the lesser-educated masses from electing an idiot. For that matter, if we stuck with the original structure of the Constitution, there would be more than two (or really one) viable parties. The founders specifically wanted to prevent a two-party system which would degenerate into oppositional stasis. These things were changed and need to be changed back. (Note that I'm only talking about structure of government; other things, like slavery and or lack of women's suffrage, were never originally intended to be included in the text - they were compromises made to get the government established, albeit imperfectly, while the time was right. Jefferson and others fully expected equality to be extended to everyone as people became more educated.)

The idea that anyone, from anywhere, can be denied Constitutional protections is utterly, definitively wrong. Even if the liberties suspended by BushCo had made us any safer, that safety wouldn't be worth the cost of our principles. The fact that this administration has made us more vulnerable to attack by creating enmity abroad while dismantling our infrastructure (FEMA, the National Guard, our treasury) here makes it all the more tragic. Their venality, their incompetence, their hubris and their disdain for all but the wealthiest and whitest among us is poisonous. Their refusal to submit to the rule of law is treason.

They MUST be impeached or we are no longer America.

Civil liberties are defiantly under assault here. Much of the problem seems to stem from the fact that our president considers the Constitution to be “a (crude expletive) piece of paper.” He has apparently said as much. During a meeting about The Patriot Act an aide told the president, “There is a valid case that some of the provisions in this law undermine the Constitution.” According to witnesses Bush screamed, “Stop throwing the Constitution in my face, it’s just a (geedee) piece of paper!” Don’t believe me? Put that phrase in Google and see what happens. There is documentation out the wazoo.
Google up PNAC while you’re at it. PNAC, a neo-con think-tank, released a report titled Rebuilding America's Defenses (September 2000). Check out the part that says they will need a “new Pearl Harbor” to get the political capital for their dreams of empire. You want to catch some evildoers? Look at the signatories on that puppy and go get ‘em! Godspeed!
Have you noticed all the vehicles for sale by the side of the road? People can’t afford them now. The DOW is up but that don’t put one biscuit on a poor man’s table. Our wages have shrunk by about 22% thanks to rising fuel and food costs. Remember inflation? It’s back. We’re headed for some economic times the likes of which our generation has not seen.
The right speaks of returning the nation to a morality? Well that one is true if you eliminate the space between the “a” and the “morality”. Is torture moral? How about war-in-Iraq-for-kicks, elimination of Habeus Corpus, roll back of civil liberties, illegal wire-tapping? Come on folks are we going to have to catch them eating a baby to realize they’re bad guys?
Well they’ve kept us safe, right? Wrong! Experts agree Bush’s quagmire-of-choice is the best recruiting tool Al Qaeda ever had. Also Bush let bin Ladin go at Tora Bora. Don’t believe me? Look it up.
This is the first faith-based presidency. Never mind about the facts, if we pretend real hard, and repeat ourselves endlessly (thank you FOXNEWS) everything will be like we wish it was. Enjoy the dream while it lasts because your falling butt is about to have a rendezvous with the ground!

Although I agree with Bruce Fein that the burden is on the government to show why any limitations on civil liberties are necessary, I disagree with his reasoning regarding the basis for this obligation. As Thom Hartmann, commenting on the writings of Thomas Jefferson, points out, the revolutionary idea underlying the United States went beyond the principle of individual liberty espoused by conservatives like Mr. Fein. Rather, the goal of the founding fathers was to place power in the hands of the people. In all previous governments, the elite had the power and doled out privileges, such as they were, to ordinary people. However, in the United States of America, the people would have the power and they would determine what extra privileges, if any, the elite would have. The consequences of this revolutionary notion, in which our founding fathers reversed the traditional power structure of society, are many. One of the most obvious is that the government -- our government -- cannot take away our freedom without our express consent, and then only to the extent necessary to secure that freedom.

It saddens me to say that in fact I have come to believe that our president and his vice president should indeed be impeached. Not only impeached but removed from the offices they hold.And I say this with great trepidation. What has happened to our country both in our own eyes and the eyes of the world is a tragedy.

Civil liberties and national security are not mutually exclusive, and are, in fact, inextricably tied to one another. The Constitution limited the power of goverment to exploit the governed, the common citizens. Some of our leaders have said it is just a piece of paper. I say that piece of paper gives us the power to remove such people from government office, and we should do that through impeachment. High crimes and misdemeanors have been committed. I also say that Congress should recognize and act on its constitutionally defined obligation to call an Article V amendment convention. Patrick Herndon

Phrases like "any means necessary" and "ensure national security" are overly broad. Do they include torture, or imprisonment without trial, or spying on citizens without a court order? Adolph Hitler thought so.

THE MOYERS BLOG
A Companion Blog to Bill Moyers Journal

Your Comments

Podcasts

THE JOURNAL offers a free podcast and vodcast of all weekly episodes. (help)

Click to subscribe in iTunes

Subscribe with another reader

Get the vodcast (help)

For Educators    About the Series    Bill Moyers on PBS   

© Public Affairs Television 2008    Privacy Policy    DVD/VHS    Terms of Use    FAQ