Interview with Tsuginori Hamamoto
Fisherman, Minamata, Japan
Q: What's your age please?
Hamamoto: I am 57 years old.
Q: In the 1950's, where did you live? What did you do for work?
Hamamoto: After leaving school I started working with my parents. Even before the 50's, I had been always engaged in fishing. I lived in Minamata.
Q: What began to happen to the fishing in Minamata in the 50's? What did the fishermen notice?
Hamamoto: People started looking in the sea; they started seeing small fish dying, then bigger fish, dead and floating. Birds were eating those small fish and they appeared dead also. Then next was cats.
The cats' symptoms varied very much. Some were just dribbling, some were running in circles, even running into fire or running into walls. In the end some jumped into the seawater. Still, people were catching and eating those fish.
People started suspecting that the cause must be somewhere in Chisso. However people had no proof of it.
Q: When did you first start feeling unwell? What happened to your health?
Hamamoto: Every day I used to cook bait for fish and carry it to the sea. The Bora is a fish that looks a bit like a carp. Bait is made from wheat bran mixed with dried, crushed chrysalis boiled in a huge flat pot. We would cook the bait the night before we went fishing.
In the morning we would put a yoke over our shoulders and carry the bait on that. For years I never had any problems, no trouble. However one morning I found it really difficult to cope with this job and I really struggled. I realized that something had gone wrong because I stumbled and fell, dropping the yoke.
"What is the matter with me?" I said to myself.
I put the yoke on my shoulders again and put the bait-baskets back on the yoke, but as soon as I reached the beach I fell over again. Finally, I realized what was the matter -- my whole body was trembling and numb.
Q: Describe your worst moments...
Hamamoto: I have been suffering now for 38 years and in a wheelchair for 19 years. Some time ago I had to have an operation of my coronary...I kept getting worse and, at this time of operation, I really feared that I might be dead.
Q: Describe the behavior of the Chisso Corporation. When the problems began, what action did they take to stop the problem?
Hamamoto: I really don't think that Chisso ever thought of us as human beings.
They were never sympathetic and never treated us reasonably... they were always deeply reluctant to do anything. This impression of them is stamped on my mind.
Chisso is -- a killer, it is not too much to say from our point of view.
Take Minamata Bay - she was a mother to us...a truly great mother to all us fishermen but Chisso destroyed her with their pollution. They killed our mother!
Now the mother is dead, how can we, the children survive?
Chisso itself is greatly to blame - but it was the combination of this with Japan's general economic boom that led to the destruction of nature and of people's health.
Q: How did it come about that the victims of the poisoning came together to fight as a people against the government and against Chisso?
Hamamoto: It took years for Colombia (?) University to find the cause, however they couldn't really say it was Chisso, that Chisso was responsible. So, it took years to be really diagnosed, to be identified by the Government. After many years the victims really got together and stood up in this movement against the Government.
Some of our colleagues were seriously ill but we had no choice other than to keep up regular protests and demonstrations.
Q: What do you remember most about that?
Hamamoto: Well, more than anything else, Chisso's attitude. They were not straightforward at all, they really resisted us...that was really unforgettable.
It was very tough, but we had doctors looking after us. They gave us injections and medicine while we stayed up all night, negotiating with Chisso. We were exhausted and felt absolutely disgusted with Chisso's uncompromising attitude.
At this stage, we were trying to make them promise to sign an agreement to start a proper negotiation in a proper meeting room. We wanted them to agree to this basic condition -- and to sign an official document saying so.
This kind of basic thing took a long time -- they only signed up to this after lengthy and exhausting negotiations.
Q: Could you explain to us what a dogesa is?
Hamamoto: Dogesa means you apologize with your forehead pressed on the ground. The president [of Chisso] apologized in that gesture.
Chisso eventually offered their most humble apologies - they literally kowtowed in submission.
However, you see, it took so long for them to make an apology...the time taken showed that they were not really sincere.
Chisso says that they eventually realized that they were responsible, and that they were sorry for what had happened - but we victims look at it very differently.
I mean, if Chisso were really conscientious and felt responsible, it would not have taken them so long to meet our basic demand for an open meeting.
The fact that it did take them so long shows that their ritual apologies were so much hypocrisy.
Q: Do you think that, in the last 30 years, thinking has changed about the environment, about the importance of the environment?
Hamamoto: Well, the movement gained some achievements -- the peoples' awareness has changed, it is true. However, looking at the damage of environmental pollution spreading worldwide -- particularly exported pollution by Japan...Japanese economic and industrial advancement has been achieved through the victimization of weaker nations, weaker countries; that is regretful and a sad thing.
Q: Are you optimistic or pessimistic about the future of planet earth?
Hamamoto: Well, in order to have hope, we have to work -- we have to work at it. To be hopeful or pessimistic, it depends upon our effort. No matter how small it is, I will make an effort for it.
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