Q: Tell me how you felt when the book, Dead Man Walking came out. How did
you feel about Sister Helen Prejean at that point?
Morris: I was shocked by the book. I hadn't heard that it was in the
making or anything. I was upset about it. I think it was the unknown more than
anything. I was angry. I felt like Sister Helen was writing a book in
support of these people.
Q: And -
Morris: Well I think after I read the book, I wondered how could she
have written this when I was really the only person who would know this and she
didn't ask me.
Q: So there were things in the book that just didn't ring true to
you?
Morris: Yes.
Q: And what about the picture of Robert Willie she drew in the book?
Morris: I think that the main thing that I disagreed with was that in
the book Robert Willie was made to seem like the follower of the two. That
Joseph Vaccaro was more the leader and Robert Willie was following him and
under his control. And in my experience with them, it was the opposite, that
was not the truth and I just thought that I really am the only person living
that knew and I wondered why I never was asked about it.
Q: Is there a side of Robert Willie that Sister Helen probably never saw
that you did?
Morris: Sister Helen Prejean never saw the side of Robert Willie that I
saw. She saw a person who had been in prison for quite some time on death row.
And that has to change a person who's facing death. I saw a mean, vicious,
evil person, and I don't know that he ever showed that side of himself to her.
I may be wrong. But I know for sure that she did not know him in the same way
that I knew him.
I was somewhat angry with the book and with Sister Helen Prejean at that time.
I felt that if she was gonna write a book and bring up things that happened
that only I would know that she should have asked me. I felt like she was
believing him instead of me because I knew that to write this book and to deal
with him on the level that she had, that she must have read the transcripts
from the trials or my statement, things like that. And I felt as if she chose
to believe him instead of me. It hurt a lot.
Q: When you first contacted Helen Prejean. What was it that you wanted to
tell her?
Morris: There are a lot of things. I think I mostly wanted to make her
see my feelings about all of this, about everything that had happened. About
Robert Willie's execution. And to say that I could be relieved that he's dead.
But not happy about it. That I sleep a lot better at night knowing that he's
dead. But that I have really been through a lot in -- in making -- in
changing, I guess I've really changed a lot about how I feel about the death
penalty. And I guess I just wanted to discuss all of that with her. The
changes that I've been through and the fact that not everyone who supports the
death penalty is doing it out of revenge and anger and hate. For me it was
fear. And I just feel a lot better knowing that he's dead. I don't have to be
afraid of him anymore.
Q: And tell me how you contacted Helen Prejean and what you said to her?
Morris: I contacted her sometime after the movie or when the movie was
going to come out. I don't know exactly what made me do it at that particular
time but I called her on the telephone and told her who I was. Asked her if she
would like to meet with me.
Q: And she said?
Morris: She said yes instantly. She didn't need to think about it.
Q: And what again was it that was driving you, motivating you...
Morris: I wanted to somehow make Sister Helen Prejean understand that
not all people who supported the death penalty did it out of hate and anger and
revenge but that they were motivated by fear. I was motivated by fear mostly.
Q: Of?
Morris: Fear that as long as that person was alive that person was
still a threat to me. I was still afraid. And that when that person died,
when Robert Willie died, I didn't have to be afraid of him any more.
Q: You've come to some understanding about the book or about Helen Prejean,
that she's not a journalist...tell me about that.
Morris: I think after some time and especially after meeting her, I can
understand that the book was not written as though it was a new story from an
objective point of view, that it was based on her relationship with Robert
Willie and the conversations that she had with him and that's how she needed to
write the book.
Q: When you contacted Helen Prejean, what were the questions really
burning in you?
Morris: When I called Helen Prejean I wanted to know why she had never
called me. Did she ever have any interest in calling me or knowing what I had
to say about things? I wanted to know some things about Robert Willie. At the
end I wanted to know did he ever -- did he ever talk about me? Did he ever
express any regrets or remorse about what he had done.
Q: And did she answer you?
Morris: She answered some of my questions. I never really asked some
of those questions directly to her.
Q: Tell me about the phone call and her reaction.
Morris: I called Sister Helen Prejean and when she answered the phone,
I asked to speak with her and she said speaking, and I said "Sister Helen, my
name is Debbie Morris, you probably won't recognize my name but you'll know me
better as this 16-year-old girl from Madisonville, or the girl from
Madisonville," I can't remember what I said. And there was silence on the phone
for just a minute and she said, "Oh Debbie!" And I could tell she realized who
I was and I laughed later and I thought for Sister Helen to be speechless was
really something, it was probably about the first time ever.
Q: How does Sean Penn's character compare to Robert Lee Willie?
Morris: I definitely think he deserves the Academy Award.
The way he -- the way he looked was so much -- was a lot like Robert Willie
but it was -- it was more -- the way he would move, the glances he would give.
The expressions on his face. The main difference I think is that he seemed
bigger, more muscular than Robert Willie was.
Q: Tell me about the Harveys.
Morris: It really is difficult for me to make any judgments about how
the Harveys have handled things because my family and I didn't experience the
same kind of loss that they did. I don't see that what they've done has
brought them any kind of relief. It's hard for me to relate to being able to
celebrate anybody's death. Or to be happy about it. That's just hard for me
to understand. And I just feel like by continuing to attend you know the, the
-- like when they go outside the gates of the prison when someone is executed
and all, for me personally I couldn't do that. It just would keep all of the
anger in and hate alive. For me. But everyone has a different way of dealing
with pain like that. Like I said, I didn't lose a daughter.
Q: How do you feel about the death penalty? How have you come to feel
about the death penalty? Where are you in this whole struggle yourself?
Morris: I think right now I'm in a great deal of conflict about it
because in my head I know all the arguments against the death penalty and I
understand those. And I know that the death penalty doesn't deter crime and I
know that it doesn't take away people's pain. But at the same time I know that
I felt a great deal of relief when Robert Willie died. I think what I'm trying
to do I'm kind of in the process of this journey, I've changed a lot about the
way I feel about it and I really want to believe what's right about it or
what's expected from me by God. But I don't think I'm quite there yet. I
think if what I'm supposed to believe is that that Robert Willie deserves his
place in heaven, right there, next to me and Faith Hathaway and whoever else,
I'm not quite there yet.
Before I was a victim in this crime, I didn't really have an opinion about
the death penalty. I never really thought about it. And then afterwards, I
felt like I had just been done a terrible wrong and I didn't deserve it and I
was angry. I had just a lot hate, a lot of anger and I was definitely in
support of the death penalty. Not as much because of what had happened to me
but because of what had happened to Faith and because of what had happened to
Mark. And I felt like the only justice would be Robert Willie's death. And I
felt that way about other people who had done such terrible things to people.
I think over the years there've been lots of things that have affected the way
I felt about the death penalty and that have softened what I so rigidly felt
before. I think that coming to some understanding that these people who do
these terrible crimes just don't get like that by themselves. That there're so
many things that must happen in their lives or that affect the kind of person
that they end up becoming.
Q: You had talked about how before Robert Willie died you felt the need to
forgive him. And yet, at other times, you've said he didn't really show any
remorse towards what he did. How do those two things go together?
Morris: It was really hard trying to find a way to forgive someone who
didn't have any remorse and who didn't care whether I forgave him or not. And
it was hard being able to do something like that without being able to talk to
that person. Which at the time I really didn't want to do.
Q: Why did you feel like you needed to forgive him? What did you need to
forgive him for?
Morris: I needed to forgive him for what he had done to me and to
people that I care about. I needed to be able to do that before he died and I
don't know exactly why. I still don't really know. But I did know that that
was really the only way that I was going to be able to get rid of some of the
anger that I had -- I wanted him to be sorry. I wanted him to have some
feelings of remorse.
Q: And does it feel unfinished because you didn't get that?
Morris: Sister Helen told me that she didn't really know if he was
capable of that but he, he never, she doesn't feel that he ever really had an
understanding of what, really what he did. I mean he understood what he did
but an understanding of how deeply that affected people's lives. Yes it, it
feels unfinished because of that. I think I would feel more satisfied or even
a greater sense of relief or something if I knew that he regretted what he
did.
Q: We did talk about some of your resentment before meeting Helen Prejean.
What was your impression of her when you did meet her?
Morris: Well even my initial impression of her on the telephone was
that she was extremely caring and genuine and when I met her I just could sense
that immediately. She was so energetic and she was very excited to meet me. She
felt that we had a lot to talk about. I have a lot of respect for her.
Q: What has the impact been of all of this attention suddenly of the book,
of the movie....on you?
Morris: I think that the book and now the movie has kind of made me
continue a little further along this journey that I've been on. It has -- it
has definitely made me have to take a look at myself or inside myself and
rethink my position on the death penalty. It made me take a look at how I
feel about it and the fact that that's changed a lot now. So I think that
Sister Helen has definitely played a role in how I feel about things. Maybe
not by what she said but just by the things that she has done through this book
and this movie, the fact that it's made me start thinking about it again.
Q: What was your reaction to the movie?
Morris: I was tense through the whole thing. I just felt like I had
knots in my stomach that something was just tight inside. The resemblance of
Sean Penn to Robert Willie first of all and then just seeing things from so
many different people's point of view brought up a lot of feelings. A lot of
those that I've been having for quite some time now.
Q: Like.
Morris: I think what mostly made an impact on me was the character in
the movie Matthew Poncelet - his mother's feelings. Since I became a mother I
have thought about Robert Willie's mother many times and wondered how she must
have felt about her son, about seeing what her son had done and what was
happening to her son. I know she must -- she must have just been in awful pain
over that.
Q: Tell me about your connection in a way to Faith Hathaway, the fact that
you lived to explain many of the things that happened to her.
Morris: There's almost some guilt there on my part that I lived and she
didn't. I feel like I have this bond with her in a way because we both
experienced this terror. Of course hers was just much greater than mine. I
think in some way I'll always feel connected to her because of that. There's
no one else that can understand what the two of us went through. I feel like I
can in some way understand what she must have gone through just because I
experienced something similar.
Q: Debbie, tell me about what's going on in your head and in your gut..
and what you still need to struggle with that we all do.
Morris: I think the conflict is that I know in my head all of the
things -- all of the reasons to be opposed to the death penalty. But I know
that inside me I'm still relieved that Robert Willie is dead and if I had the
power to I wouldn't bring him back to life. What's confusing is trying to
figure out what really is expected of me from God because I want to do what's
right. And if that means needing to get past these personal feelings to do the
right thing, to think and feel the right thing, then that's what I need to do.
And I'm not there yet. I'm still on that journey.
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