House deal to secure aid for Israel and Ukraine could hinge on border funding

Read the Full Transcript

• Amna Nawaz:

  With U.S. allies embroiled in wars overseas, members of Congress face a pivotal decision whether to green-light more aid.

  Congressional correspondent Lisa Desjardins spent the day on Capitol Hill, where a deal could hinge on U.S. border funding.

  Lisa, good to see you.

• Lisa Desjardins:

  Hi.

• Amna Nawaz:

  So, help us understand. This is a little confusing. How are aid to Israel and aid to Ukraine tied at all to what's happening at the U.S. Southern border?

• Lisa Desjardins:

  This is complicated, so let's try and make it clear.

  There are two ways these things are tied together. One is from former President — from current President Biden himself and his proposal for national security funding. This is an emergency request he has. Let's look at what he's requested from Congress.

  You will see all of these things bundled together, Ukraine with the biggest request from him, about $60 billion, more than that. Israel, he wants that money, about $14 billion. For the U.S. border, he's added to that another almost $14 billion and some humanitarian aid.

  So, already, he's saying, I want these things together. Politically, essentially, he's saying, I want these — Ukraine as — money for our allies, but also I understand that there is need for work on our own border.

  The other reason this is tied together, Amna, is timing. Ukraine and Israel both need funding now. We are running out of time in this calendar year. Republicans realize there are not that many must-pass bills left this year. They want border security, so they are also pushing for border security to be part of any kind of package for Israel and Ukraine.

• Amna Nawaz:

  So let's drill down on the border piece then, right, because this is not an easy issue for Congress to reach consensus on. What's on the table? What could a deal look like?

• Lisa Desjardins:

  The last day has really been quite wild in terms of what's happening.

  There is a small group of U.S. senators trying to forge a compromise. Now, to explain this, it gets very technical, but I want people to understand two very broad concepts that we have in terms of border talks. There are two key terms I want to talk about. And you have talked about this on there before.

  Parole, that is something that means that it's temporary and emergency. That's allowing people into this country for brief periods of time. The other is asylum. That is a permanent kind of state. Both of those things are things that Republicans want to limit, some very sharply.

  Now, I asked Speaker Johnson about this today. How important is it? Are there any red lines for him for what has to happen for border security in order to get Ukraine and Israel money? I want you to listen to his answer for what kind of priority he has for that money.

• Rep. Mike Johnson (R-LA):

  People are deeply concerned about their safety and security and all the things, all the societal ills that happen at the border. So that is a top priority for us in all these negotiations to get that secured. And we need policy changes, not just further funding to process people.

• Lisa Desjardins:

  OK, he wants policy changes. That's a top priority.

  Now, listen a few hours later to a Senate news conference I was at. This is Senator Roger Marshall, how he puts the way he thinks border funding should be involved here.

• Sen. Roger Marshall (R-KS):

  My priorities one, two and three are the border, the border and the border, and that, unless there's meaningful reform that secures our border, we're hell no. We're not going to vote for cloture on any type of legislation, supplemental legislation, unless it includes border security.

• Lisa Desjardins:

  In other words, border security or nothing.

• Amna Nawaz:

  So what about the aid to Israel, aid to Ukraine? What's on the table there?

• Lisa Desjardins:

  There are separate debates there. Let's talk about some divides.

  Israel, there is a very difficult discussion that Democrats are having over whether there should be conditions for that, perhaps limiting the way Israel uses some weapons that America funds, protecting civilians, somehow codified it. Now, also in Ukraine, there are calls, especially from Republicans, for more checks on spending.

  They are dubious of some of that money. And then, for both of those, there are questions about how much should we give and for how long, are these endless wars, what kind of limits are there here? Those are difficult discussions to have.

• Amna Nawaz:

  That's a lot to work out in not a lot of time.

• Lisa Desjardins:

  Yes.

• Amna Nawaz:

  What's the timeline here?

• Lisa Desjardins:

  OK, here we go. Let's look at the calendar.

  Just on the verge of December, this is the timeline we're looking at. This is when the Senate is hoping to have a vote on some kind of foreign aid and border bill, maybe next week. But then look at the entire calendar for this year. Congress is only in session next week and the week following it.

  So it is really hard to do the math to see how they get all of this done. Hope springs eternal. But it's all to say that there has to be a deal, essentially, this week. And I'll tell you, walking here from the Capitol tonight, it seemed like they are farther away than closer.

  Senator Chris Murphy, who was involved in that gun deal that we have talked about before, he said having a bipartisan compromise on guns was a cakewalk compared to what he is talking about now.

• Amna Nawaz:

  It doesn't look good. You will be following it all.

  Before I let you go, you have been following this other story about Congressman George Santos of New York. Will the House vote to expel him?

• Lisa Desjardins:

  It looks like it, but it's not entirely clear yet.

  Mr. Santos is having a news conference tomorrow. He has said he will not resign. It is still not clear that the votes are there. It takes two-thirds vote in the House to expel him. Clearly, a majority wants to expel him. That vote could happen as soon as tomorrow, but the latest was that they were leaning toward moving it to Friday.

  It's going to be something we will watch very closely in the next couple of days.

• Amna Nawaz:

  A lot happening in these last two weeks before the year ends in Congress.

• Lisa Desjardins:

  Yes.

• Amna Nawaz:

  Lisa Desjardins, always good to see you.

• Lisa Desjardins:

  You too.