Leave your feedback Share Copy URL https://www.pbs.org/newshour/show/panel-finds-progress-problems-with-iraqi-security Email Facebook Twitter LinkedIn Pinterest Tumblr Share on Facebook Share on Twitter Transcript A report from the Iraqi Security Forces Independent Assessment Commission found the Iraqi Army is improving but the national police are dysfunctional. Panel Chairman retired Marine Gen. James Jones and former Washington, D.C. police chief Charles Ramsey discuss their findings. Read the Full Transcript Notice: Transcripts are machine and human generated and lightly edited for accuracy. They may contain errors. JIM LEHRER: And to today's report on the Iraqi army and police. Joining us now are: the chairman of the Iraqi Security Forces Assessment Commission, former Marine commandant and NATO commander General James Jones; and commission member and former Washington, D.C., Police Chief Charles Ramsey.Welcome, General Jones, Chief Ramsey.GEN. JAMES JONES, Former NATO Commander and Marine Commandant: Thank you, Jim. JIM LEHRER: General, first, some overall conclusions, that the Iraqi security forces — army and police together — are not going to be able to secure Iraq independently, at least until another 18 months, or 12 to 18 months. What caused you to draw that conclusion? GEN. JAMES JONES: Well, I think the commission came to the conclusion that the progress has been measured but uneven across the spectrum of the Iraqi security forces. We specifically evaluated the progress made by the Iraqi armed forces and the police forces and the two ministries that oversee these two elements, specifically the ministry of defense and the ministry of security.We found that the army is moving in a positive direction and the police, generally speaking, is not. And so, as a result of that, we came to the conclusion the likely pattern of progress over the next 12 to 18 months will be for a more capable army able to take on the internal security threats facing the country, but a police force that needs a lot more work, a lot more training, and a lot more focus. JIM LEHRER: Chief Ramsey, your report went even beyond that. You said it ought to be disbanded and reorganized. Why did you say that? CHARLES RAMSEY, Former Washington, D.C., Police Chief: Well, we're talking about the national police when we make that recommendation. The Iraqi police service has about 230,000 members, and that is not the group that we're talking about. They certainly face challenges, primarily because of the ineffectiveness of the Ministry of Interior.But it's the national police that really drew our attention and our concern. And that's due to the widespread negative comments that we got about the national police. They don't really have a clear policing mission. They don't seem to know whether or not they want to be a military unit or a police unit.Last year in October, an entire brigade was disbanded because of allegations of kidnapping of 26 Sunni men and the killing of seven of those individuals. They aren't able to deploy beyond Baghdad because of a lot of sectarian issues. Our sense was that, if they were disbanded but then reorganized with a different mission, a smaller unit that would focus on legitimate police functions, such as bomb squads, SWAT teams, river patrol, air support, urban search-and-rescue, those kinds of things, they would be far more effective. And the remaining personnel, once they're properly vetted, some would go to the military, some could go into the Iraqi police service.