Attack on Brazil’s government raises concerns about how U.S. extremism has spread abroad

Amna Nawaz:

For now, calm has been largely restored in Brazil after supporters of the former president swarmed the Brazilian Congress, Supreme Court and presidential palace on Sunday.

But what, if any, connections are there between Sunday's attack and other anti-democratic moves worldwide?

Here's Laura Barrón-López.

Laura Barrón-López:

The scenes of Jair Bolsonaro's supporters storming Brazil's capital were eerily reminiscent of the January 6 insurrection here almost two years to the day earlier.

Both attacks were inspired by lies of election fraud, but the ties between the two are deeper. Former President Donald Trump and the defeated Brazilian leader share allies and a playbook.

Joining us to break down the network of anti-democracy far right figures that traffic and extremism is Ruth Ben-Ghiat, historian at New York University.

Ruth, thanks so much for joining us.

What is the clearest connection between former Brazilian President Bolsonaro and Mr. Trump?

Ruth Ben-Ghiat, NYU History Professional:

Well, there's a very direct connection in the form of Eduardo Bolsonaro one of his sons, who's a member of Congress, who's often come to the States.

He was in Washington, D.C., on January 5 at the White House speaking with Ivanka Trump. And he's very close with Steve Bannon, who is an adviser of Jair Bolsonaro, as is Jason Miller. And Eduardo Bolsonaro, after his father lost the election, came to Florida and met with all of these characters and was encouraged to continue to contest the election.

So there is a common playbook that the — that Trump and Bolsonaro have followed, where you disseminate — you get the public to lose faith in the electoral system. And Bolsonaro did this relentlessly. And this was not a theme in Brazil before. And then you have a personality cult, so people will believe your false claims.

Laura Barrón-López:

And Steve Bannon and Jason Miller both also former Trump advisers.

But you have also said that this isn't as simple as American right-wing forces exporting extremism. What other international leaders or influencers are in this network?

Ruth Ben-Ghiat:

Well, it's important to see the Republican Party today as not only a party that is dedicated to destroying democracy at home.

And it's quite relevant that, in February 2022, the GOP decreed that the January 6 attack was — quote — "legitimate political discourse," meaning the coup attempt and the violence was — they consider it a valid way to meet their political goals.

But — and this is — has in common with a lot of extremists abroad. And they are — the GOP is immersed in these far right networks that stretch from Moscow to Budapest. And it's well-known the amount of interchange with Orban. They had their political — Conservative Political Action Conference in Budapest. Tucker Carlson broadcast for a whole week from Budapest.

But also in Rome now with the new neofascist prime minister, she gave an interview to The Washington Post, and she said that she — she's attended the National Prayer Breakfast. And she said the GOP and her neofascist party are kindred spirits, and that the GOP's battles were similar to things that they discussed as well.

Laura Barrón-López:

When you talk about Viktor Orban in Hungary, as well as Vladimir Putin in Russia, is there a common playbook across all of these figures, whom you have called strongmen?

Ruth Ben-Ghiat:

Yes, these are — these are people who use — they use disinformation. They repress dissenters.

They also — I refer to the strongmen as these leaders who use machismo. And they — and the personality cult is very, very important, because people bond to them. And then they believe the fraudulent things they say about them. So, in Bolsonaro's case, he got people to believe that he was the victim. Victimhood is very important to all of these strongmen.

And he also disseminated the idea that violence might be necessary. This is another hallmark of these extremist leaders. In June '22, he said — and he — this was — he's setting up that violence might be necessary if he loses. He said, "If necessary, we will go to war."

And they did go to war for him on January 8.

Laura Barrón-López:

And you say, strongmen like Mr. Trump and Bolsonaro aren't necessarily going to go away.

But Daniel Twining of the International Republican Institute told my colleague Nick Schifrin this:

Daniel Twining, President, International Republican Institute:

I think we can look at the fact that our system worked,that that's the long-term takeaway. The institutions held. Good people, Republican and Democrat, proceeded to effect a peaceful transfer of power.

And guess who had a bad subsequent year or two following January 6? Actually, it wasn't the United States. We had political change. We had some economic renewal. What — the people who had a bad year were actually dictators in Iran, Russia, and China.

Laura Barrón-López:

So, what do you say to that assessment that, overall, democracy seems to have held?

Ruth Ben-Ghiat:

We are witnessing a time when authoritarianism has been — is being revealed to be weak.

I mean, these protests in China are a really big deal, as they are in Iran. And Putin's war is a classic example of autocratic backfire, where the terrible performance of the Russian military is showing that it is an institution that has been ravaged by Putin's kleptocracy and by institutionalized lying, that everybody's too afraid of falling out of a window to tell the truth.

So, authoritarianism has never been weaker, in a sense, and — but that's why these people are kind of roaring back, grasping at anything they can do. It's like their last chance to prevail.

Laura Barrón-López:

Ruth Ben-Ghiat of New York University, thank you so much.