Covert cash: How did CIA money end up in al-Qaida coffers?

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• HARI SREENIVASAN:

  Now to the revelation reported by The New York Times: At least a million dollars from the CIA evidently wound up in the coffers of al Qaeda in 2010.

  I'm joined by New York Times reporter Matthew Rosenberg in Washington, D.C.

  So, that million was part of a larger sum. Where did this money come from, and where did it go?

• MATTHEW ROSENBERG, The New York Times:

  The CIA, for years, starting in 2003, provided what amounted to basically a slush fund for President Karzai of Afghanistan and his office.

  And they used this money to pay off various warlords and other people they needed to keep onside and things they didn't really need — want to do on the books.

  And so, a few years earlier, in 2008, an Afghan diplomat had been kidnapped.

  The Afghans were negotiating a ransom to get him back. Finally, a price was settled at $5 million.

  And they needed to find $5 million in cash. So they went to the slush fund they had.

  And they had about a million there they had put aside. They took that.

  The rest of the four — there was another $4 million they got from Iran and Pakistan and some of the Gulf states that also helped them out with cash. And it all ended up with al Qaeda.

• HARI SREENIVASAN:

  And, when you say cash, you mean actual dollar bills in bags dropped off at the palace?

• MATTHEW ROSENBERG:

  Yes.

  Every month, they would go there with suitcases, backpacks, sometimes even plastic shopping bags, like they were coming from Safeway, and would just drop off the cash.

  It tended to range from a few hundred thousand dollars to over a million, maybe a few million at times.

  And it went to a variety of purposes.

• HARI SREENIVASAN:

  And so how do we know that al Qaeda actually got some of those dollars?

• MATTHEW ROSENBERG:

  We know because, when the Navy SEALs killed Osama bin Laden, they seized a tremendous amount of computers and documents from his compound.

  And a series of letters between bin Laden and one of his chief lieutenants was introduced at trial last week — trial last month in New York. And we took a look at these letters.

  And in these letters, bin Laden and one of his lieutenants are discussing getting the ransom. They're going to buy weapons with it.

  And then there's all kinds of weird concerns. You know, bin Laden is warning him to be careful. The Americans could be tracking this.

  They have maybe put radiation or some substance on it. And he actually seems much more concerned and seems to give American officials a lot more credit for being able to track their own spending than was actually the case or has ever been in the case in Iraq or Afghanistan.

• HARI SREENIVASAN:

  And so those letters also point out that these funds were going to be used to buy weapons for their fight.

• MATTHEW ROSENBERG:

  Yes.

  That — they were going to help support people whose families were — fighters who were in prison, help support their families.

  Some was going to be put aside for a rainy day.

  Also, we have to understand, this cash delivery came, this infusion of cash to al Qaeda came at a very crucial moment, in the — kind of in 2010, the drone strikes in Pakistan on their hideouts in Pakistan had decimated the ranks of the organization.

  They were having trouble raising money. They were not in good shape.

  I don't want to say that this helped reinvigorate them solely, but it certainly helped get them back on their feet.

  It was certainly part of a bigger picture that has helped them survive.

  And even past bin Laden, al Qaeda remains a threat today. It is not coming after us, but they are there, and they have not been defeated or completely dissipated.

• HARI SREENIVASAN:

  And when these dollars from the CIA made it into the hands of al Qaeda, other groups heard about this and kind of stuck their hand out as well.

• MATTHEW ROSENBERG:

  Yes.

  You know, I want to be careful not to be too glib about this, but there is a sense in the letters of, you know, some guy from the neighborhood makes it rich, and suddenly everybody else has the hand out to kind of help them out.

  I think one of the lieutenants is quoted as saying, you know, all the other groups have heard about this, and they all want money. "May God help us," I think was the exact quote.

  A certain kind of people seemed a little exasperated by it.

• HARI SREENIVASAN:

  All right, Matthew Rosenberg of The New York Times joining us from Washington, D.C., thanks so much.

• MATTHEW ROSENBERG:

  Thank you.