New book offers glimpse inside world of controversial tech firm Palantir and its CEO

John Yang:

Multimillion dollar Palantir Technologies is one of the most secretive and powerful companies in Silicon Valley. It develops software that can quickly analyze massive amounts of data. It's used by government agencies, the military and major corporations. A new book, "The Philosopher in the Valley: Alex Karp, Palantir and the Rise of the Surveillance" gives readers a glimpse inside this controversial tech firm and its outspoken and colorful CEO.

Ali Rogin spoke with the author, New York Times Magazine contributing writer Michael Steinberger.

Ali Rogin:

Michael, thank you so much for joining us. Let's start with the most essential question. Who is Alex Karp and what is Palantir?

Michael Steinberger, Author, "The Philosophy in the Valley": Alex Karp is the CEO and co-founder of Palantir. And Palantir is a technology firm that specializes in data analytics. It makes software that enables organizations to make faster, more efficient use of their own data. It's important to clear up some of the things that Palantir doesn't do. It doesn't collect data. It doesn't store data, and it doesn't sell data. It just enables organizations, and these are typically large organizations, to make better use of their own data.

Ali Rogin:

Depending on who you talk to, Palantir is an amazing tool for data collection and efficiency, or it's very dangerous technology that has potential for great abuse. Why is it that this company arouses such strong feelings on both sides?

Michael Steinberger:

Because both of those things are true. It enables lots of companies to make big better use of the information they collect. It makes their businesses more efficient, their operations more efficient.

But Palantir also works, for instance, with the CIA and a number of other clandestine services. Its technology is being used now by ICE to help facilitate deportations here in the United States. So it's used by a wide range of organizations. Most of the work it does is pretty benign. Some of it is quite laudable. But then there's other stuff that gives a lot of people cause for concern.

Ali Rogin:

Much of the book is a case study on who Alex Karp is. And you write about the fact that he is not a tech guy by training, by background, but he does seem to embody the dominant Silicon Valley ethos right now with a lot of these companies making these very powerful technologies with little to no oversight, with great potential for misuse.

But what they say is if we don't make them, these tools are going to fall into the hands of the bad guys. How do you think about that as it relates to Alex Karp?

Michael Steinberger:

Well, that has always been Karp's pitch. He has emphasized for over 20 years now that Palantir takes great care to guard privacy, is very concerned about protecting civil liberties. Basically, the idea has always been that its software can enable law enforcement to find the bad guys without pulling millions of innocent people into their dragnet and so his pitch essentially has always been, trust me.

But, you know, the reality is that Palantir doesn't police the use of its own technology. It is up to the client to decide how rigorously, for instance, they wish to enforce the privacy controls that the software is equipped with. And the concern has always been that technology this powerful can lend itself to abuse. And there have been instances of abuse.

And there are obviously a lot of concerns at the present moment about how it's being used, for instance, by the U.S. government, by different government agencies.

Ali Rogin:

I want to press on that. You write in the book about how Karp has defended his work with ICE. Palantir has had contracts with ICE for a number of years, and, of course, ICE is coming under greater scrutiny these days due to some of its actions.

How would you think Karp would explain Palantir's work with ICE if he were asked about it today?

Michael Steinberger:

Well, he has defended Palantir's work with ice. You know, his view on immigration has evolved. During the first Trump presidency, when Palantir software was being used by ICE, he did not agree with Donald Trump's views on immigration. He's now singing a very different tune during the second Trump presidency. He believes that the 2024 election, among other things, signaled that basically Americans wanted to keep the demographics of the country the same way, and that essentially empowered Trump to pursue this crackdown.

And you know, Karp has made very clear that Palantir is happy to work with ICE to implement that policy. I have not spoken to him about what happened in Minneapolis, for instance, but he has kind of brushed aside the concerns that people have expressed, even people internally at Palantir, about the work the company is doing with ice.

Ali Rogin:

And your book paints a really detailed and intimate picture of who he is as a person, his eccentricities. And one of the things I wanted to ask you about is the fact that his alma mater, which you share with him, Haverford College, will not invite him to speak. Why is he so obsessed with that?

Michael Steinberger:

Well, I think with a lot of these guys, there's always something in their lives, something. Someone not acknowledging their success, someone not giving them what they think they're due.

And for much of the time that I was reporting the book, this was kind of a jokey thing. I mean, he would kind of joke about it, but you knew that he was being serious. He was very irritated that Haverford wasn't inviting him to speak on campus at commencement or on any other occasion, despite the success he's had leading Palantir.

But it turned more serious after October 7, after the October 7 massacre in Israel, when protests erupted on college campuses across the United States, including at Haverford. And he was very angry about what was happening on the Haverford campus to the point that he said to me that he would never give a dime to the school. So what's kind of a joking through line through much of the book turns quite serious towards the end.

Ali Rogin:

Michael Steinberger, the new book is "The Philosopher in the Valley": Thank you so much for joining us.

Michael Steinberger:

Thank you for having me.

John Yang:

And that is PBS News Weekend for this Saturday. I'm John Yang. For all of my colleagues, thanks for joining us. See you tomorrow.