NTSB chair discusses airline industry burnout and risks of major disaster

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• Geoff Bennett:

  It's been described as the airline industry's silent struggle, the issue of pilot mental health, which was pushed into the spotlight this fall when an off-duty pilot was charged with trying to crash an Alaska Airlines flight from inside the cockpit. That pilot later told police he hadn't slept in 40 hours and was experimenting with psychedelic mushrooms to help deal with depression.

  Earlier this month, the National Transportation Safety Board held a full-day summit devoted to mental health in aviation. And commercial pilot Troy Merritt shared why he sought treatment for depression despite the potential cost to his career.

• Troy Merritt, United Airlines Pilot:

  I found myself no longer able to function a day-to-day basis and ultimately no longer fit to fly. And that's when I knew I needed to take the next step to address my health.

  For many, including myself, the choice to use an antidepressant can be a very difficult one. It was especially difficult because I knew what was ahead of me. I faced months to years out of work navigating the complicated certification process to get my medical back and the possibility of being told I could never fly again.

  These prospects only worsened my anxiety and depression and made an important personal health decision even more difficult.

• Geoff Bennett:

  We're going to talk more about this with Jennifer Homendy, who chairs the National Transportation Safety Board.

  It's good to see you. Thanks for coming in.

• Jennifer Homendy, Chair, National Transportation Safety Board:

  Thank you for having me, Geoff.

• Geoff Bennett:

  And we should say that Troy Merritt, the pilot we just heard from in that clip, he says his treatment has gone well. He hopes to begin flying again soon.

  But so many pilots say the system is broken. The FAA relies on them to self-report mental health issues, but so many pilots are afraid to do that, for fear of losing their licenses.

  That presents a major safety risk.

• Jennifer Homendy:

  It does present a major safety risk.

  A lot of pilots and air traffic controllers and others in aviation have reported that it's work or seek help. You should be able to seek professional mental health care while still being able to retain your job.

  We're talking about losing loved ones, going through divorces, just the stress of jobs. And it's usually, at least for the pilots, fly or get denied.

• Geoff Bennett:

  And pilots who do seek care say they face long waits, expensive evaluations to prove that they meet the FAA's standards of fitness.

  And they say the process to get back in the cockpit is opaque. How actively are you working with the FAA to modify its position and this process while also maintaining safety?

• Jennifer Homendy:

  Well, I'm very encouraged by the FAA's formation of a rulemaking committee to look at the issue, but I hope there is action.

  I have had a lot of conversations with Mike Whitaker, and the secretary of transportation has been very supportive of mental health care and has said some great things with respect to pilots and others in the aviation community. So, I hope that we are headed in the right direction to some help for others.

• Geoff Bennett:

  There are more demands than ever on pilots right now. What particular pressures and stressors do pilots face?

• Jennifer Homendy:

  They have an extremely stressful job. I mean, they have safety in the skies. They have so much on their shoulders, not to mention everything that they face in their personal lives. And we expect pilots to be superheroes, as if they don't need help during their most difficult times in life.

  They should be no different than you, me, say, a locomotive engineer who's also responsible for the safety of others, surgeons and others, where they are able to get the care that they deserve.

• Geoff Bennett:

  Do you also worry about overtaxed and potentially stressed-out air traffic controllers, especially given the uptick in the near-miss collisions, as reported recently by The New York Times?

• Jennifer Homendy:

  I do.

  And we know this is occurring right now, just from our interviews alone and recent investigations on runway incursions. We have a shortage among air traffic controllers right now. That shortage has led to mandatory overtime for a number of workers. We're talking six-day workweeks, supervisors that are doing controller jobs.

  They aren't able to receive the training that they should be able to receive right now because they are on duty all the time. That leads to a lot of stress. It leads to fatigue. And so I get very concerned about the impact on each of them.

• Geoff Bennett:

  Changing what it means to need mental health care and aviation, transforming the process is one thing, but it strikes me that this requires sort of a wholesale cultural shift. Am I right in that?

• Jennifer Homendy:

  It does. It does.

  And we have to really look at the research out there and know that aviation is no different here. We know that stress impacts others. We know how prevalent mental health needs are. We know that one in five people have a mental health condition, and we know over 50 percent of them are not able to seek care.

  And so, we know in aviation that they should be able to seek help, and we know that early intervention ensures safety for all.

• Geoff Bennett:

  While you're here, I also want to ask you about Tesla, because Tesla, as you well know, it's recalling nearly all two million of its cars to limit the use of its autopilot feature. And this follows a two-year investigation by safety regulators of roughly 1,000 crashes in which this feature was engaged.

  How big a problem is this? And why didn't regulators catch this on the front end?

• Jennifer Homendy:

  Well, how big a problem is it? It's two million vehicles, to be exact.

  But this is a problem that goes back to 2016, when we investigated a horrific crash in Williston, Florida, and we said right then that this technology leads to driver disengagement and that NHTSA had to take it seriously, that Tesla had to take it seriously, and they had to address it.

  Here we are seven years later, and NHTSA came up with the same exact conclusion that we came up with seven years ago, after several investigations and several deaths. So, if they had acted sooner, I think that would have prevented some fatalities. But here we are. And, hopefully, Tesla is taking this seriously.

• Geoff Bennett:

  Is there a way to prevent that in the future, that same thing, where something you spotted years ago is now finally being addressed?

• Jennifer Homendy:

  This happens a lot.

  We issue safety recommendations after our investigations, and just recommendations, aimed at preventing that tragedy from reoccurring. And, sometimes, we're ignored. And, sometimes, we're ignored far too long. One recently that was implemented was ignored for 50 years.

  We need action, whether it's Tesla or any other vehicle manufacturer or entity, to ensure safety.

• Geoff Bennett:

  NTSB Chair Jennifer Homendy, good to see you.

• Jennifer Homendy:

  Thank you very much.