Vivek Ramaswamy says he’s the best candidate to push Trump’s agenda forward

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• William Brangham:

  In the crowded race for the Republican presidential nomination, there are governors, a senator, even a former president.

  Then there's Vivek Ramaswamy, a first-time candidate who has spent millions of his own money to capture the attention of primary voters. And as of now, it seems to be paying off. He is polling higher than many of his competitors who have far more political experience.

  Lisa Desjardins has our conversation.

• Lisa Desjardins:

  William, Ramaswamy will share the stage with several of those candidates at the first GOP debate next month after his campaign announced recently that he has met the fund-raising and polling qualifications.

  Before jumping into politics, Ramaswamy ran a biotech company, managed a hedge fund, authored books, including "Woke, Inc.," and made regular appearances on conservative media. The son of Indian immigrants, Ramaswamy is clear and vocal on the campaign trail, criticizing the left on cultural issues and pledging to pardon Donald Trump. Just 37 years old, he's also hoping to be the youngest president in American history.

  And Vivek Ramaswamy joins me now.

  The big question, why should Republicans choose you as their nominee?

  Vivek Ramaswamy (R), Presidential Candidate: I think I'm best positioned to advance our America first agenda, take it even further than Trump did, but also unite the country in the process.

  I think we live in an interesting moment today in the year 2023. I think it's a 1776 moment. If you want incremental reform, there are plenty of other candidates who promise to offer that. I stand on the side of revolution, the American Revolution, reviving those 1776 ideals today, when it comes to shutting down the administrative state, restoring three branches of government, rather than four, declaring independence from our enemy, communist China, reviving national pride in the next generation, growing the economy.

  I think I'm the candidate best positioned to achieve these things, because I'm delivering on my own vision of how to actually accomplish them. And that's why I'm in this race.

• Lisa Desjardins:

  As you and our viewers know, former President Trump has a massive lead right now in polls about the Republican race.

  I want to ask you, who, other than President Trump, do you think is your next toughest competition? And what makes you a better candidate than former President Trump and that other person?

• Vivek Ramaswamy:

  I think there's only two candidates who matter in this Republican primary. That's President Trump and myself.

  I went from 0.0 percent now to polling third nationally, second in one national poll that came out last week. So I think very soon this is going to be a two-horse race between Trump and myself. I think the question is this. Who's going to actually take our America first agenda even further?

  I think he was a good president. I agree with many, if not most of his policies. But the reality is, about 30 percent of this country suffers from psychiatric illness when he's in the White House. People start to disagree with policies they otherwise would have agreed with just because he's the one advancing them.

  And my question is — for the Republican base is, who's your actual loyalty to? If it is to this country, then ask who's going to advance that agenda even further. I have said I would secure the Southern border, not just by building the wall, but by using the U.S. military to secure the Southern border.

  I'm achieving more than Trump did with our own shared agenda to put this country first, but at the same time uniting the country in the process?

• Lisa Desjardins:

  Well, let me ask you.

  I hear you talking about trying to unite the country, but you're also talking about pushing an agenda further from a man who you say people suffered under in some form. What does that mean pushing that agenda further? And how is that better for the country?

• Vivek Ramaswamy:

  I think the way we get to national unity is not by compromising on our principles.

  I think it is about being uncompromising about the principles that set this nation into motion 250 years ago, principles like self-governance over aristocracy, principles like the pursuit of excellence and meritocracy, the idea that you get ahead in this country, not on the color of your skin, but in the content of your character and your contribution.

• Lisa Desjardins:

  Let me ask you about that.

  I know that you are someone who opposes affirmative action. You and I have talked about this, and you told me that you don't see a difference in opportunity for people based on color in this country. But we do know data say that Black mothers and babies are more likely to die at a rate of two to three times those of whites.

  We also know, when it comes to income, for example, that Blacks and Hispanics often earn, on average, a third less than whites. Where do you think those disparities come from? And how would you, as president, address them?

• Vivek Ramaswamy:

  They come from disparities in the fatherlessness epidemic across this country; 25 percent of kids, sadly, of all skin colors are born into fatherless homes in the United States of America today.

  Those kids are eight times more likely to end up in jail, in poverty. Those kids are more likely to suffer from mental health disorders later in life, to underperform in schools, regardless of what race they are. Now let's actually take a look at the racial disparities. It's upwards of 50 percent, 40-plus percent of Black kids born into single parent households. For Asian American kids, it's single digits.

  That's what explains the difference in achievement, not systemic racism. That's the problem we need to fix.

• Lisa Desjardins:

  I want to do come back to former President Trump.

  You have said that candidates should pledge to pardon him in his classified documents case. We now expect an indictment for him related to January 6. Does your pardon approach extend to his role on January 6? And how would you describe his role in fueling that day?

• Vivek Ramaswamy:

  I'm guided by the facts and the law. So, if that indictment should be issued, I would read it before making a commitment on a pardon.

  I did read the first two indictments, both Alvin Bragg's disastrous and politically tortured indictment in the state of New York, invoking federal law to bring a local case, and then, also, I did read the documents and case. And I think, in both of those instances, those are politicized persecutions.

• Lisa Desjardins:

  And on January 6?

• Vivek Ramaswamy:

  So, on January 6, I have to read the indictment to say.

  But I personally, based on the facts that I'm aware of, I think that it would be a mistake to bring that indictment. I would have, to be clear, in each of these instances, made very different judgments than Trump did. I wouldn't have handled those documents in the same way. I would have handled January 6 very differently had I been in the White House, instead of him.

  But a bad judgment, even a very bad judgment, is not the same thing as a crime. And when we start to conflate the two, I think that is a dangerous precedent for the political weaponization of police power in this country. And I think that's going to take us in the wrong direction, closer to a national divorce, when I actually want to lead us forward to a national revival.

• Lisa Desjardins:

  You are number three in national Republican polls, but some of your views on things like abortion, affirmative action, those are out of step with where independents and some swing voters are nationally.

  How do you win in November?

• Vivek Ramaswamy:

  I actually respectfully disagree with you on that, because there's something fundamentally un-American about using racial quota systems.

  I think the same comes to securing the Southern border. Most Americans err on the side of actually doing it. So, when you look at my top policy measures for this country, I think more Americans are actually united around the basic principles.

  And that's why I'm confident we're going to deliver a Ronald Reagan-style mandate, an electoral mandate, a landslide like Reagan did in 1980. That's what I'm delivering in 2024. If that was the Reagan Revolution back then, it's the Ramaswamy revolution this time around. I'm confident that's exactly what we're going to deliver.

• Lisa Desjardins:

  Vivek Ramaswamy, candidate for president, thank you for talking with us.

• Vivek Ramaswamy:

  Thank you.