‘We’re playing into Russia’s hands’: Ex-U.S. ambassador to Ukraine on why she resigned

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• Amna Nawaz:

  Today's prisoner exchange between Russia and Ukraine was the largest since the war's onset. But skepticism of a lasting truce and President Trump's peacemaking remains.

  Former Ambassador to Ukraine Bridget Brink resigned her position in mid-April, faulting the Trump administration's Ukraine policy. A diplomat for nearly three decades, Brink served as ambassador to Ukraine under both Presidents Biden and Trump starting shortly after Moscow's full-scale invasion three years ago.

  She's now considering a congressional run as a Democrat representing Michigan, and joined me yesterday to discuss her resignation and the war.

  Ambassador Brink, welcome to the "News Hour." Thank you for being here.

  Bridget Brink, Former U.S. Ambassador to Ukraine: Amna, thanks for having me on.

• Amna Nawaz:

  So, in your op-ed for The Detroit Free Press, you explained why you chose to resign.

  And you wrote this. You said: "I could no longer in good faith carry out the administration's policy."

  What specifically did you see or did you hear that pushed you to make this decision?

• Bridget Brink:

  Well, maybe I can just step back a minute to talk about the context, but over three years of leading my team in Kyiv, I was there as Russia launched thousands of missiles and drones that killed men, women, and children in their sleep, that tried to take down the energy grid and take out the power, the heat, and the lights for millions of people, and committed war crimes and atrocities at a level we have not seen since World War II.

  It was absolutely devastating and horrifying. And to see that firsthand was something that left a big impression me. I agree that the war needs to end, but the policy of the Trump administration was to put pressure on the victim, Ukraine, rather than on the aggressor, Russia.

  And peace at any price is not peace. It's appeasement. And we know from history that appeasement only leads to more war. The specific thing that started my questioning, could I remain implementing the president's policy, it wasn't a quick decision. It was when I took over about three months, the first three months of the administration.

  But the first sign was the Oval Office meeting, which was horrifying to see, and also to see that we weren't standing up with our democratic partners and allies.

• Amna Nawaz:

  That was the meeting between President Trump and President Zelenskyy you were referring to in February.

• Bridget Brink:

  In February, yes.

• Amna Nawaz:

  Yes.

  We saw there that President Trump blamed President Zelenskyy for the war. We all saw the contentious nature of that meeting as well. After that, I should point out that you had reposted, in Ukrainian, something that Secretary Rubio had posted, basically thanking the president, saying that he was standing up for America in a way that no president has ever had the courage to do before, very supportive of the president's approach.

• Bridget Brink:

  Yes.

• Amna Nawaz:

  Why repost that? You did face backlash from Ukrainians for that.

• Bridget Brink:

  I did, but, at that time, I was the president's representative and representing the president's policy. And I reposted Secretary Rubio's tweet, and that's something that we do routinely to use the talking points of the president or the White House. And, to me, this is part of our professional ethos.

  However, it was internally a sign that I wouldn't — I didn't think I would be able to remain in the position. It wasn't the only sign, but it was the first sign. There were other things. we withdrew our defense, our security, and our intelligence assistance for a period of time. That too is something I don't think is the right approach to support a democratic partner.

  We also changed the way we talk about the war. So, instead of talking about Russia's war of aggression in Ukraine, we call it now the Russia-Ukraine war. I think to stop Putin, which I think is in U.S. national interests, we have to be clear on who's responsible for the war, and it's Russia.

• Amna Nawaz:

  What is it that you hope changes as a result of your resignation? Do you see this White House's approach to the war changing?

• Bridget Brink:

  I mean, I can't predict the future. And I resigned not to try to change the policy, but because I myself felt that I couldn't execute the policy.

  But the reason that I'm speaking out is because I think it's important for people to know the truth and people to understand the reasons behind the resignation. For me, this is about the United States being on the right side of history. For the first time in 28 years of service under five different presidents, I felt we were on the wrong side of history.

  And, to me, this is something that's not acceptable as someone who has devoted a life of serving the American people and presidents, but also trying to achieve our foreign policy goals.

• Amna Nawaz:

  Are there other people in the embassy in Ukraine, other people in the Foreign Service who share your concerns, who talk to you about this?

• Bridget Brink:

  I mean, of course, we have a robust policy debate, and that's a normal thing. I have seen that happen, especially on very high, important, high-level policy issues. I think, as part of our profession, that's good. That's healthy.

  I think, right now, especially after a lot of the cuts in government and the way in which those have gone about, it's made debate less, and it's made people afraid to speak out. To me, that's very dangerous. I haven't seen this kind of atmosphere in our country in my professional lifetime. I have seen it a lot overseas.

  I have seen it a lot in democracies that are very young and not 20 or 30 years old. But I think to have that happen in our country, a democracy, the biggest, strongest, in my view, best democracy in the world, is quite disconcerting.

• Amna Nawaz:

  As you noted, you did say peace at any price is not peace at all. You went on to say it is appeasement.

  Do you believe that it is President Trump's goal here to appease Putin? And why, if so?

• Bridget Brink:

  I mean, I take President Trump at his word that his goal is to end the war.

  I just believe that, to end the war, we have to take a much stronger, harder line with Putin and that we must be clear in our principles. We must be clear about who's responsible. And we need to find a way where we're playing on our playing field, not on Vladimir Putin's playing field. I think, by not doing so, we're playing into Russia's hands.

• Amna Nawaz:

  There are experts and Russian analysts we have talked to who say that this is actually not a war of territory, it's a war of identity, that Russia is looking to change the very fabric of Ukrainian culture and identity.

  Do you agree with that, based on what you have seen?

• Bridget Brink:

  Absolutely. I think it's even broader than that. I think, horrifyingly, that Vladimir Putin wants to wipe Ukraine off the map as a country, as a people, as a culture.

  And, to me, this really hearkens back to some of the darkest periods of Europe. And this is why I never thought I'd be in a position to resign and then speak out publicly. But I think the stakes are so high, not just for Ukraine, not just for Europe, but for the United States. And we must be on the right side of history.

• Amna Nawaz:

  Bridget Brink, former U.S. ambassador to Ukraine.

  Thank you for joining us, Ambassador. Appreciate your time.

• Bridget Brink:

  Thank you.