"The whole program was basically pushing your psychological
and physical limits to extremes, so actually you can kill
someone. And, you know, that whole experience was very difficult
to swallow. It’s a process of dehumanization."
"I became interested in the idea behind the military
dog tag. It’s a form of identification..."
"The old work never goes away. It stays there, you
just don’t notice it."
"I wanted the viewer to have an experience with these
little dog tags, these thousands of dog tags. It symbolizes
each individual’s identity...these many dog tags create
this one, larger-than-life figure. It’s ambiguous whether
you’re a part of it or not."
"I allow people to make multiple associations to the
work. I really like it when that happens. I don’t know
whether it's simply coincidence or not, but I think I carefully
manage to keep the work open so it could be read in different
ways."
Why do you have these military
supplies in your studio? What's your interest in them?
SUH:
I have some old army surplus
stuff that I collected for a school assignment, which ended
up being the first sculpture in my life. I didn’t actually
use these things. I was going to, but I sort of changed my
mind. Somehow the project came from collecting these materials
and also from my interaction with the army and the navy surplus
store owner who happened to be an old Korean guy in Cranston,
Rhode Island.
I explained to him that I was doing a project at school and
he gave me a lot of stuff for free. And he had many dog tags.
At the army surplus they make dog tags for you and sometimes
they made a mistake and spell wrong and so they have these
rejects. And also he helped me to get the blank dog tags and
gave me a really good deal. Not only that, he allowed me to
use this special typewriter for the dog tags. And it was spring
break so I went there every day, I think, for almost two weeks
and typed dog tags. And I had around thirty thousand dog tags
there. And we had a conversation, you know, we talked about
things going on back in Korea.
But it all started with an assignment for this sculpture class
that I accidentally took. I was a painting major at RISD and
at RISD you have to take at least one non-major elective studio
course. And I wanted to take a glassblowing class, but it
was already filled. So this sculpture course was the only
course that was open. And it was called "The Figure In
Contemporary Art." It changed my life because it was
just such an important experience and after that class I slowly
abandoned my painting and then became a sculptor. The assignment
was using the form of clothing to address this issue of identity.
And that was only one semester after I came here from Korea.
That was also right after the L.A. riots and I think there
were some issues related to the Korean-American communities
in L.A. during the riots. That was what really allowed me
to think about my identity as a Korean in the United States,
through that project. I think somehow my experience in the
military in Korea was also something that I wanted to address
through the project. So that’s why I got into the whole
the military stuff.
ART:21:
Unlike the United States, in
Korea young males are required to do military service. What
was that like for you?
SUH:
Yes, every male has to go. It’s
mandatory. I was in the army for almost two years. It’s
probably a different experience than here, because from the
moment that you’re born you know that you’re going
to be in the military. Everybody has to go. And so that’s
a great deal of the Korean man’s identity. And usually
everyone goes to the military right after they graduate from
high school. It's a good initiation to the real world because
the whole Korean society, the whole system is actually based
on this militaristic, very hierarchical structure. So you
learn a lot of things from the military before you have a
real job. I was a little bit of a different case. I was probably
one of the oldest soldiers in the entire division because
I went to graduate school and then went to military. So I
was like six or seven years older than most of the soldiers.
I was the same age as a captain, so it was quite an experience.
I mean, physically it was very difficult. But at the same
time I was just old enough to take everything too seriously
I guess.
I was really good at many things. I was a sharpshooter. And
I had a black belt before the military, so that was easy.
And I could run really fast and that was very helpful. But
because of my age I think it took me longer to recuperate
from the hard training. And the way they treat you, basically
they train you as some kind of...you know I don’t know
if this is something that I should say or not...but after
several weeks of boot camp there were like two days of vacation
and I felt that I cannot be killed like anything. So like
if a car hits you...I felt like I could survive that. That’s
actually a good way of putting it. The whole program was basically
pushing your psychological and physical limits to extremes,
so actually you can kill someone. And, you know, that whole
experience was very difficult to swallow. It’s a process
of dehumanization. And you got a lot of punishment. Now it
sounds really hilarious, but during that time it was like
"This is crazy!" I have some great stories but I
think they're irrelevant. Like the younger kids didn’t
really care, you know. And for me, everything was something
to think about. So I think that was the difference of being
a little bit older than other guys.
I wanted to come to the U.S. even before I joined the army.
But I think in the army I experienced what it means to be
dehumanized. So that was tough. I was challenged in many different
ways, physically, but also it wasn’t like the army that
I always imagined. It was a very difficult time but at the
same time I’m glad that I did it. Every man talks about
it, their own experience in the military. You know like when
you have a drink with someone and it’s just unbelievable.
They’re unbelievable stories. And also they were funny
times. Great times too, unreal mostly.
ART:21:
Why does this American military
equipment bring up these memories for you?
SUH:
Basically we used almost the
same equipments as Americans. The whole thing is based on
the U.S. military system. I think also that probably most
Korean men also have this interest...I don’t know if
it’s the right word...but some kind of fetishism about
this stuff. In Korea it’s illegal to buy or have military
stuff. So when I saw these things I wanted to get it. But
after that piece was done, I never actually opened this box.
It was sealed until now. And I just really didn’t need
to look at it.
ART:21:
What did your first sculpture
"Metal Jacket" look like, the one you made for your
sculpture class?
SUH:
It looks like a kind of ancient
Oriental armor. The first sculpture was covered with three
thousand military dog tags. From a distance the dog tags look
like fish scales. The shape of that jacket was not something
that I invented. I used the U.S. military jacket liner and
just put the dog tags on the top of it. So I used all contemporary
materials but they ended up looking like ancient ones.
ART:21:
Maybe this is a silly question,
but do you think your experience in the military influenced
your decision to become a sculptor?
SUH:
I didn’t even want to be
a sculptor at all, that’s one thing for sure. And I didn’t
want to make something about the military at all, either.
But gradually, it came very naturally. For me, again, this
experience in the military was not something special because
everyone had to go through and has to go through that process
in Korea. So if you talk to someone who went to military,
they all have similar stories. That made me a little bit more
comfortable to use this military experience. Maybe it’s
something special here in the States, but if I show "Some/One"
in Korea then I think it will get a different response because
it was part of their everyday life.
ART:21:
Where did the dog tags come from
and what do they mean to you?
SUH:
I became interested in the idea
behind the military dog tag. It’s a form of identification
and it’s made out of stainless steel. So it’s a
permanent material—it will not rust. And each soldier
has to carry two dog tags. And when a soldier is killed in
battle, one dog tag has to remain on the dead body, and one
is taken away by a surviving soldier in order to report the
death of that soldier. In order to secure the identity of
that soldier. I don’t think it’s actually a practical
thing to do, but you put these dog tags in your mouth, so
basically between your upper and lower teeth, and you just
kick your jaw and then that will go between your teeth. This
is what I was told to do in Korea and in the military.
ART:21:
What was the title of that first
sculpture?
SUH:
The title of that work is "Metal
Jacket". I was almost going to use "Full Metal Jacket",
but I think that was too much.
ART:21:
Are the dog tags typed in English
or in Korean?
SUH:
Oh, it’s in English. Yes,
English and numbers. It's totally nonsense, just a series
of letters and numbers.
ART:21:
Can you talk a little about "Some/One"?
SUH:
Well "Some/One" evolved
from that first sculpture, "Metal Jacket." The old
work never goes away. It stays there, you just don’t
notice it. But I think in the back of my mind I constantly
thought about it. I had a dream one day after I finished "Metal
Jacket" when I knew that I wanted to turn this piece
into some kind of larger installation but I didn’t have
the money, space, or the chance to do it. But I think at a
subconscious level, I had been thinking about it for a long
time.
And the dream was quite vivid. It was night and I was outside
of this kind of football stadium and I was approaching this
stadium from the distance and I saw this light in the stadium.
And so I thought there’s some kind of activities going
on. And as I approached the stadium in order to enter the
stadium, I started to hear these clicking sounds, like the
sound when the metal pieces touch together. It was like there
were thousands of crickets in the stadium. And then I entered
the stadium in the way that the football players enter the
stadium. I walked slowly and went into the stadium on the
ground level. And then I see this reflecting surface in the
dream and I realized I was stepping on these metal pieces
that were the military dog tags. And it was slightly vibrating.
The dog tags were touching each other and the sound was from
that.
And from afar I saw the central figure in the center of the
stadium. I slowly proceeded to the center and then I realized
it was all one piece that gradually raised up and formed this
one figure. And it tried to go out the stadium but couldn’t
go out because the train was just too big. You know it was
just too big to pull all the dog tags. So that was a dream
and the image that I got. After that I made a small drawing.
The small drawing was about this vast field of military dog
tags on the ground and then a small figure in the center.
That was the image I got and I just waited. I waited for the
right time to come. I mean, obviously, I could not create
the piece that I dreamed of. It's impossible. But it was a
kind of image and a kind of hope. That was the impact that
I wanted to somehow convey through that piece.
ART:21:
When the viewer approaches the
piece, it's a similar experience to your dream because the
figure of "Some/One" is hollow and inside are all
these mirrors. It comes as quite a surprise.
SUH:
Every time I install "Some/One"
you always face the back of the piece first. That’s how
I orient my piece. And that means you don’t see the interior
of the piece when you enter the room. You have to go through
the steps and walk on the piece and then walk around the piece
and then finally you face the front of the piece and then
you are able to see the inside of the piece. And that moment
is very important, I think. Not only experiencing the piece
physically by stepping on the dog tags, but also when you
see the reflection of yourself inside of the piece. Then you
truly become a part of the piece. I wanted the viewer to have
an experience with these little dog tags, these thousands
of dog tags. It symbolizes each individual’s identity...these
many dog tags create this one, larger-than-life figure. It’s
ambiguous whether you’re a part of it or not. Whether
you are the owner of this robe when you see your own image
over there. So that’s why I had the mirror inside. And
also it's an ideal situation because it gives the inside a
particular lighting. It’s hard to create that kind of
situation, but because of the illusion and the reflection
you feel like there is another dimension inside. It’s
just really hard to see the depth and where the surface stops.
It’s really hard to see that. And it becomes like another
dimension.
ART:21:
Do you intend for the work to
be read in a particular way?
SUH:
I knew that if I extended the
train or tail of the "Metal Jacket" piece that it
would look like an emperor’s robe. So I went with that.
But it could be read as so many different things. Somebody
told me it reminded them of Christ or that statue in Rio de
Janeiro. And a lot of Koreans think that it looks like the
armor of this very famous general in the 15th Century who
protected Korea from Japanese invasion. And we have a statue
of him in the center of Seoul. Also, this general invented
a battleship that looks like a turtle. And the turtle has
this exoskeleton that looks like fish scales. And the way
they arranged the metal on the ship was exactly the same way
I did it in the "Some/One" piece. So not only General
Lee, but his ship and everything else somehow all come together
in this one piece. I allow people to make multiple associations
to the work. I really like it when that happens. I don’t
know whether it's simply coincidence or not, but I think I
carefully manage to keep the work open so it could be read
in different ways.
