♪ ♪ >> I'VE BEEN WRITING THE STORY >> I'VE BEEN WRITING THE STORY OF MY OWN LIFE FOR 40 YEARS.

OF MY OWN LIFE FOR 40 YEARS.

SO BEGINS THE DEATH OF SANTINI.

SO BEGINS THE DEATH OF SANTINI.

AGAIN ACCLAIMED SOUTHERN WRITER AGAIN ACCLAIMED SOUTHERN WRITER PAT CONROY HAS PLUMBED THE DEPTH PAT CONROY HAS PLUMBED THE DEPTH OF ABUSE AND FAMILY DYSFUNCTION OF ABUSE AND FAMILY DYSFUNCTION NOVELS SUCH AS THE PRINCE OF NOVELS SUCH AS THE PRINCE OF TIDES AND THE GREAT SANTINI.

TIDES AND THE GREAT SANTINI.

IN THIS MEMOIR, HE CHRONICLES IN THIS MEMOIR, HE CHRONICLES THE FINAL PERIOD OF HIS THE FINAL PERIOD OF HIS RELATIONSHIP WITH THE MAN AT THE RELATIONSHIP WITH THE MAN AT THE HEART OF HIS OBSESSION, WITH HEART OF HIS OBSESSION, WITH GREAT BUT OFTEN POIGNANT HUMOR, GREAT BUT OFTEN POIGNANT HUMOR, CONROY TALKED WITH NPR AS CONROY TALKED WITH NPR AS MAUREEN CORRIGAN ABOUT HIS MAUREEN CORRIGAN ABOUT HIS PARENTS, HIS BROTHERS AND PARENTS, HIS BROTHERS AND SISTERS SOMETIMES ANGRY SISTERS SOMETIMES ANGRY REACTIONS OF BEING THE LEEKLY REACTIONS OF BEING THE LEEKLY SUBJECT MATTER OF HIS WORK.

SUBJECT MATTER OF HIS WORK.

AND HIS SEARCH FOR PERSONAL AND AND HIS SEARCH FOR PERSONAL AND PROFESSIONAL CLOSURE.

PROFESSIONAL CLOSURE.

RECORDED AT THE UNIVERSITY OF RECORDED AT THE UNIVERSITY OF LOUISVILLE, KENTUCKY AUTHOR LOUISVILLE, KENTUCKY AUTHOR FORUM.

FORUM.

THIS IS "GREAT CONVERSATIONS."

THIS IS "GREAT CONVERSATIONS."

PAT CONROY AN MAUREEN CORRIGAN.

PAT CONROY AN MAUREEN CORRIGAN.

[APPLAUSE] [APPLAUSE] >> PAT, WELCOME TO THE AUTHOR >> PAT, WELCOME TO THE AUTHOR FORUM.

FORUM.

I'M SO HAPPY THAT WE HAVE THIS I'M SO HAPPY THAT WE HAVE THIS TIME TOGETHER TO TALK BECAUSE TIME TOGETHER TO TALK BECAUSE I'VE BEEN A FAN OF YOURS FOR I'VE BEEN A FAN OF YOURS FOR YEARS.

YEARS.

LIKE SO MANY PEOPLE WHO HAVE LIKE SO MANY PEOPLE WHO HAVE BEEN YOUR LOYAL READERS, I FEEL BEEN YOUR LOYAL READERS, I FEEL LIKE I WAS A FLY ON THE WALL LIKE I WAS A FLY ON THE WALL WITH THE CONROY FAMILY.

WITH THE CONROY FAMILY.

WATCHING FROM DIFFERENT WATCHING FROM DIFFERENT PERSPECTIVES AS THE FAMILY SAGA PERSPECTIVES AS THE FAMILY SAGA UNFOLDED.

UNFOLDED.

YOU HAD ME AT THE FIRST SENTENCE YOU HAD ME AT THE FIRST SENTENCE OF THIS MEMOIR.

OF THIS MEMOIR.

BECAUSE WHEN YOU SAY I'VE I'VE BECAUSE WHEN YOU SAY I'VE I'VE BEEN WRITING THE STORY OF MY OWN BEEN WRITING THE STORY OF MY OWN LIFE FOR THE PAST 40 YEARS, I LIFE FOR THE PAST 40 YEARS, I THINK AS A READER, WHAT MORE DO THINK AS A READER, WHAT MORE DO YOU NEED TO LEARN AS A WRITER YOU NEED TO LEARN AS A WRITER THAT BRINGS YOU BACK TO THIS THAT BRINGS YOU BACK TO THIS FAMILY STORY ONCE AGAIN?

FAMILY STORY ONCE AGAIN?

WHAT DID YOU NEED TO LEARN?

WHAT DID YOU NEED TO LEARN?

>> IT IS -- I NEEDED TO LEARN >> IT IS -- I NEEDED TO LEARN THAT I WISH I'D BEEN BORN TO A THAT I WISH I'D BEEN BORN TO A DIFFERENT FAMILY.

DIFFERENT FAMILY.

[LAUGHTER] [LAUGHTER] , YOU KNOW.

AND I SAY THIS.

, YOU KNOW.

AND I SAY THIS.

I -- YOU KNOW, I WATCH OTHER I -- YOU KNOW, I WATCH OTHER FAMILIES.

FAMILIES.

AND I FALL IN LOVE WITH THOSE AND I FALL IN LOVE WITH THOSE FAMILIES.

FAMILIES.

I ALMOST WEEP WHEN I SEE -- I ALMOST WEEP WHEN I SEE -- SENSE I WAS A KID, THESE SENSE I WAS A KID, THESE FATHERS, TAKING KIDS TO BALL FATHERS, TAKING KIDS TO BALL GAMES AND THEY WALK THEIR GAMES AND THEY WALK THEIR CHILDREN THROUGH GROCERY STORES.

CHILDREN THROUGH GROCERY STORES.

AND I'M THINKING WHAT'S WRONG AND I'M THINKING WHAT'S WRONG WITH THAT GUY?

WITH THAT GUY?

[LAUGHTER] [LAUGHTER] AND YOU KNOW -- AND SO MY AND YOU KNOW -- AND SO MY OBSESSION HAS BEEN, YOU KNOW, OBSESSION HAS BEEN, YOU KNOW, WHY MY FAMILY WAS LIKE THAT.

WHY MY FAMILY WAS LIKE THAT.

WHY IT WAS SO BRUTAL.

WHY IT WAS SO BRUTAL.

WHY WE WERE SO QUIET ABOUT IT.

WHY WE WERE SO QUIET ABOUT IT.

WE NEVER, EVER DISCUSSED IT.

WE NEVER, EVER DISCUSSED IT.

WE NEVER TOLD ABOUT IT.

WE NEVER TOLD ABOUT IT.

WE WERE LOOKED UPON AS THE WE WERE LOOKED UPON AS THE PERFECT FAMILY.

PERFECT FAMILY.

SEVEN KIDS.

SEVEN KIDS.

AND YOU KNOW, WE WERE LITTLE AND YOU KNOW, WE WERE LITTLE KIDS.

KIDS.

[LAUGHTER] [LAUGHTER] IT WAS THESE LITTLE KIDS AND YOU IT WAS THESE LITTLE KIDS AND YOU KNOW, I SEE PICTURES OF KNOW, I SEE PICTURES OF OURSELVES.

OURSELVES.

DAD WITH A LITTLE MILITARY DAD WITH A LITTLE MILITARY HAIRCUTS AND GIRLS WITH VERY BAD HAIRCUTS AND GIRLS WITH VERY BAD CHEAP EYEGLASSES.

CHEAP EYEGLASSES.

AND IT WAS THE 50s.

AND IT WAS THE 50s.

AND IT WAS NEVER DISCUSSED AT AND IT WAS NEVER DISCUSSED AT ALL.

ALL.

AND WHY IT WAS -- IT HAS AND WHY IT WAS -- IT HAS BOTHERED ME SOME, MAUREEN, THAT BOTHERED ME SOME, MAUREEN, THAT THIS HAS BEEN BASICALLY MY ONLY THIS HAS BEEN BASICALLY MY ONLY SUBJECT.

SUBJECT.

AND I WISH I'D BEEN A DEEPER AND I WISH I'D BEEN A DEEPER MAN, A MORE TOLL TOLSTOYIAN MAN, MAN, A MORE TOLL TOLSTOYIAN MAN, A MORE KENTUCKYIAN MAN.

A MORE KENTUCKYIAN MAN.

THIS WAS WHAT I WAS BORN TO THIS WAS WHAT I WAS BORN TO WRITE.

WRITE.

>> I TEACH A CLASS AT GEORGETOWN >> I TEACH A CLASS AT GEORGETOWN ON THE AUTOBIOGRAPHY.

ON THE AUTOBIOGRAPHY.

AND WE SPEND THE WHOLE SEMESTER AND WE SPEND THE WHOLE SEMESTER FURROWING OUR BROW ON THE FURROWING OUR BROW ON THE QUESTION OF WHAT SEPARATES AN QUESTION OF WHAT SEPARATES AN AUTOBIOGRAPHY FROM AUTOBIOGRAPHY FROM AUTOBIOGRAPHICAL FICTION.

AUTOBIOGRAPHICAL FICTION.

>> RIGHT.

>> RIGHT.

>> WHY GO TO THE AUTOBIOGRAPHY >> WHY GO TO THE AUTOBIOGRAPHY FORM?

FORM?

WHAT DOES IT OFFER THAT THE WHAT DOES IT OFFER THAT THE FICTION DIDN'T?

FICTION DIDN'T?

OKAY, HERE'S WHAT IT DOES: IT OKAY, HERE'S WHAT IT DOES: IT AT LEAST OFFERS, MAUREEN, AS YOU AT LEAST OFFERS, MAUREEN, AS YOU KNOW, BEING AN ACADEMIC, THIS IS KNOW, BEING AN ACADEMIC, THIS IS DEBATABLE.

DEBATABLE.

[LAUGHTER] [LAUGHTER] WHEN I WROTE MY LOSING SEASON WHEN I WROTE MY LOSING SEASON ABOUT MY BASKETBALL TEAM.

ABOUT MY BASKETBALL TEAM.

ALL THE GUYS -- THESE GUYS AT ALL THE GUYS -- THESE GUYS AT THE CITADEL WHO I PLAYED THE CITADEL WHO I PLAYED BASKETBALL WITH, THEY'RE AVERAGE BASKETBALL WITH, THEY'RE AVERAGE IQ IS ABOUT 85.

IQ IS ABOUT 85.

[LAUGHTER] [LAUGHTER] THEY WERE VERY TALL BUT THE IQ THEY WERE VERY TALL BUT THE IQ LEVEL WAS LOW.

LEVEL WAS LOW.

>> YOU DON'T KNOW WHO'S IN THE >> YOU DON'T KNOW WHO'S IN THE AUDIENCE, YOU BETTER BE CAREFUL.

AUDIENCE, YOU BETTER BE CAREFUL.

>> THEIR LITERARY LEVEL WAS >> THEIR LITERARY LEVEL WAS LOWER.

LOWER.

I'D GO TO THEIR BOOKS AND I'D I'D GO TO THEIR BOOKS AND I'D SAY YOU GUYS READ MY BOOKS?

SAY YOU GUYS READ MY BOOKS?

ONE OF THEM SAID I TRIED ONCE, ONE OF THEM SAID I TRIED ONCE, CONROY, BUT I COULDN'T GET INTO CONROY, BUT I COULDN'T GET INTO IT.

IT.

BUT I'VE SEEN ALL THE FLICKS.

BUT I'VE SEEN ALL THE FLICKS.

HE SINCE I'M WRITING THAT BOOK HE SINCE I'M WRITING THAT BOOK AND I SAY, "GUYS, HERE'S WHAT AND I SAY, "GUYS, HERE'S WHAT I'VE GOT TO TELL YOU IS WHAT YOU I'VE GOT TO TELL YOU IS WHAT YOU TELL YOUR STUDENTS IS ESSENTIAL TELL YOUR STUDENTS IS ESSENTIAL AND VERY IMPORTANT.

AND VERY IMPORTANT.

YOU'RE GOING TO TELL ME ALL THE YOU'RE GOING TO TELL ME ALL THE STORIES I LISTENED, I QUESTIONED STORIES I LISTENED, I QUESTIONED THEM.

THEM.

LIKE I QUESTIONED MY BROTHERS LIKE I QUESTIONED MY BROTHERS AND SISTERS, I GOT EVERY STORY, AND SISTERS, I GOT EVERY STORY, WHAT DID HE SAY?

WHAT DID HE SAY?

WHAT DID YOU SAY?

WHAT DID YOU SAY?

WHAT DO YOU REMEMBER?

WHAT DO YOU REMEMBER?

WE DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S EXACTLY WE DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT WAS SAID, BUT AS BEST WE WHAT WAS SAID, BUT AS BEST WE CAN, LET'S FIT THIS TOGETHER.

CAN, LET'S FIT THIS TOGETHER.

>> AND DOES THAT BRING YOU TO A >> AND DOES THAT BRING YOU TO A DEEPER TRUTH?

DEEPER TRUTH?

>> HERE'S WHAT YOU HOPE.

>> HERE'S WHAT YOU HOPE.

AND REMEMBER, 85 IQS.

AND REMEMBER, 85 IQS.

THEY DISTRUSTED ME.

THEY DISTRUSTED ME.

THEIR WIVES WERE THROWING UP IN THEIR WIVES WERE THROWING UP IN ANXIETY OF WHAT I'D WRITE ABOUT ANXIETY OF WHAT I'D WRITE ABOUT THEIR FAMILY.

THEIR FAMILY.

IT WAS AWFUL AND MY TEAMMATES IT WAS AWFUL AND MY TEAMMATES VICIOUS CRITICS, NOT JUST VICIOUS CRITICS, NOT JUST ACADEMIC CRITICS.

ACADEMIC CRITICS.

THESE GUYS COULD ALL BEAT ME UP.

THESE GUYS COULD ALL BEAT ME UP.

THE BOOK COMES OUT AND I WARNED THE BOOK COMES OUT AND I WARNED THEM AND I SAID GUYS, YOU MUST THEM AND I SAID GUYS, YOU MUST UNDERSTAND THIS.

UNDERSTAND THIS.

YOU HAVEN'T READ MUCH.

YOU HAVEN'T READ MUCH.

BUT YOU MUST UNDERSTAND THIS.

BUT YOU MUST UNDERSTAND THIS.

WHEN THE BOOK COMES OUT AND YOU WHEN THE BOOK COMES OUT AND YOU READ IT, TO YOU IT'S GOING TO READ IT, TO YOU IT'S GOING TO SOUND LIKE THE TRUTH BECAUSE SOUND LIKE THE TRUTH BECAUSE IT'S GOING TO BE WRITTEN DOWN.

IT'S GOING TO BE WRITTEN DOWN.

AND THE EXTRAORDINARY POWER OF AND THE EXTRAORDINARY POWER OF THAT IS GOING TO SWEEP YOU AWAY.

THAT IS GOING TO SWEEP YOU AWAY.

THE KID, T. HOOPER WHO WAS MOST THE KID, T. HOOPER WHO WAS MOST HOSTILE ABOUT THE BOOK, HAILED HOSTILE ABOUT THE BOOK, HAILED THE BOOK, HATED THE IDEA OF THE THE BOOK, HATED THE IDEA OF THE BOOK.

BOOK.

READS THE BOOK AND I'M AT FUMAN READS THE BOOK AND I'M AT FUMAN UNIVERSITY DISCUSSING THIS VERY UNIVERSITY DISCUSSING THIS VERY THING, WHAT IS TRUE, WHY -- YOU THING, WHAT IS TRUE, WHY -- YOU KNOW, BIOGRAPHY, AUTOBIOGRAPHY, KNOW, BIOGRAPHY, AUTOBIOGRAPHY, AUTOBIOGRAPHICAL FICTION.

AUTOBIOGRAPHICAL FICTION.

T. HOOPER STANDS UP IN THE T. HOOPER STANDS UP IN THE AUDIENCE AND SAYS, "I HATED THE AUDIENCE AND SAYS, "I HATED THE IDEA OF THIS BOOK.

IDEA OF THIS BOOK.

I HATED PAT WRITING THE BOOK.

I HATED PAT WRITING THE BOOK.

HE I DIDN'T EVEN LIKE PAT WHEN I HE I DIDN'T EVEN LIKE PAT WHEN I WAS IN COLLEGE.

WAS IN COLLEGE.

BUT I WANT TO TELL THE STUDENTS BUT I WANT TO TELL THE STUDENTS EVERY WORD HE SAID IN THIS BOOK EVERY WORD HE SAID IN THIS BOOK IS TRUE.

IS TRUE.

YOU AND I KNOW THAT IS NONSENSE.

YOU AND I KNOW THAT IS NONSENSE.

>> WELL, I THINK YOU TRY TO TELL >> WELL, I THINK YOU TRY TO TELL THE TRUTH.

THE TRUTH.

I THINK THAT'S THE DIFFERENCE.

I THINK THAT'S THE DIFFERENCE.

I THINK YOU MAKE A CONTRACT WITH I THINK YOU MAKE A CONTRACT WITH THE READER THAT YOU'RE GOING TO THE READER THAT YOU'RE GOING TO TRY YOUR BEST TO TELL THINGS THE TRY YOUR BEST TO TELL THINGS THE WAY THEY REALLY HAPPENED.

WAY THEY REALLY HAPPENED.

NOT JUST TO TELL A GOOD STORY NOT JUST TO TELL A GOOD STORY BUT THAT YOU STICK TO WHAT YOU BUT THAT YOU STICK TO WHAT YOU REMEMBER TO THE BEST OF YOUR REMEMBER TO THE BEST OF YOUR ABILITY.

ABILITY.

WAS THAT THE CONTRACT HERE?

WAS THAT THE CONTRACT HERE?

>> THE CONTRACT IS ALSO I TRIED >> THE CONTRACT IS ALSO I TRIED TO QUESTION EVERYBODY THAT WAS TO QUESTION EVERYBODY THAT WAS THERE.

THERE.

TO SEE THEIR MEMORY.

TO SEE THEIR MEMORY.

MY BROTHERS AND SISTERS ARE THE MY BROTHERS AND SISTERS ARE THE WORST.

WORST.

YOU KNOW, FIRST OF ALL, I HAVE A YOU KNOW, FIRST OF ALL, I HAVE A SISTER CARROLL, WHO IS A POET IN SISTER CARROLL, WHO IS A POET IN NEW YORK.

NEW YORK.

A BRILLIANT WOMAN WHO WILL NOT A BRILLIANT WOMAN WHO WILL NOT TALK TO ME.

TALK TO ME.

ABOUT THIS.

ABOUT THIS.

I'M THE ONLY ONE WHO REMEMBERS I'M THE ONLY ONE WHO REMEMBERS THEIR CHILDHOOD AND I REMEMBER THEIR CHILDHOOD AND I REMEMBER IT EXTRA ORDER NAYLY WELL IT EXTRA ORDER NAYLY WELL BECAUSE I FOUND HER AMAZING.

BECAUSE I FOUND HER AMAZING.

AND PRECOCIOUS AND BRILLIANT AND AND PRECOCIOUS AND BRILLIANT AND I'M THE ONLY RECORDER OF THIS.

I'M THE ONLY RECORDER OF THIS.

SO I HAVE TO DEPEND ON MYSELF SO I HAVE TO DEPEND ON MYSELF FOR CAROL BECAUSE SHE'LL GIVE ME FOR CAROL BECAUSE SHE'LL GIVE ME NO HELP.

NO HELP.

THE OTHER KIDS ARE TERRIFIED I'M THE OTHER KIDS ARE TERRIFIED I'M GOING TO WRITE ABOUT THEM.

GOING TO WRITE ABOUT THEM.

I'M SCARED TO GIVE THIS BOOK I'M SCARED TO GIVE THIS BOOK OUT.

OUT.

WHEN THE GALLEYS CAME IN AND WHEN THE GALLEYS CAME IN AND SAID I GOT TO GIVE MY BROTHERS SAID I GOT TO GIVE MY BROTHERS AND SISTERS AND -- ONCE AGAIN, AND SISTERS AND -- ONCE AGAIN, WE'RE DEALING LOW IQS,.

WE'RE DEALING LOW IQS,.

[LAUGHTER] [LAUGHTER] SOUTHERN IRISH.

SOUTHERN IRISH.

HAVE BEEN WATCHING ME HAVE BEEN WATCHING ME SUSPICIOUSLY MY ENTIRE CAREER.

SUSPICIOUSLY MY ENTIRE CAREER.

AND SO I GIVE OUT THESE LITTLE AND SO I GIVE OUT THESE LITTLE BOOKS AND I SAID YOU KNOW, GEE, BOOKS AND I SAID YOU KNOW, GEE, HOW CAN -- YOU KNOW, HORRIFIED.

HOW CAN -- YOU KNOW, HORRIFIED.

AND SO THEY COME BACK WITH -- MY AND SO THEY COME BACK WITH -- MY BROTHER JIM, THE DARK ONE IN THE BROTHER JIM, THE DARK ONE IN THE FAMILY, JIM HAS NEVER HAD A FAMILY, JIM HAS NEVER HAD A BRIGHT DAY IN HIS LIFE.

BRIGHT DAY IN HIS LIFE.

I SAID JIM, I SENT YOU THE BOOK.

I SAID JIM, I SENT YOU THE BOOK.

DID YOU READ IT ?

PGH.

DID YOU READ IT ?

PGH.

YEAH.

YEAH.

>> HOW ABOUT YOU LIKE IT?

>> HOW ABOUT YOU LIKE IT?

>> WELL, I CAN HONESTLY SAY YOU >> WELL, I CAN HONESTLY SAY YOU WROTE A BOOK.

WROTE A BOOK.

MY BROTHER MIKE.

MY BROTHER MIKE.

MIKE, DID YOU READ THE BOOK ?

MIKE, DID YOU READ THE BOOK ?

PGH YEAH.

PGH YEAH.

YOU WANT TO TALK ABOUT IT ?

PGH YOU WANT TO TALK ABOUT IT ?

PGH NO.

NO.

I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT MY FAMILY I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT MY FAMILY WAS GOING TO BE LIKE.

WAS GOING TO BE LIKE.

>> YOU DEDICATED IT TO YOUR >> YOU DEDICATED IT TO YOUR BROTHERS AND SISTERS.

BROTHERS AND SISTERS.

>> THIS IS BECAUSE OF A WEAK AND >> THIS IS BECAUSE OF A WEAK AND COWARD LYMAN.

COWARD LYMAN.

[LAUGHTER] [LAUGHTER] IT HAD NOTHING TO DO IT HAD IT HAD NOTHING TO DO IT HAD NOTHING TO DO AT ALL WITH MY NOTHING TO DO AT ALL WITH MY BROTHERS AND SISTERS.

BROTHERS AND SISTERS.

IT WAS I WAS HOPING BY IT WAS I WAS HOPING BY DEDICATING THE BOOK TO THEM, DEDICATING THE BOOK TO THEM, THEY WOULD THINK -- IT WOULD THEY WOULD THINK -- IT WOULD SOFTEN THEIR ATTITUDE TOWARD ME.

SOFTEN THEIR ATTITUDE TOWARD ME.

>> SO YOU START OFF WITH A >> SO YOU START OFF WITH A FICTION.

FICTION.

>> YES, IT WAS A TOTAL FICTION.

>> YES, IT WAS A TOTAL FICTION.

HOW ABOUT THIS, MAUREEN, MY HOW ABOUT THIS, MAUREEN, MY BROTHER MIKE, I SAID IT TOOK BROTHER MIKE, I SAID IT TOOK OVER A MONTH FOR HIM TO READ THE OVER A MONTH FOR HIM TO READ THE BOOK.

BOOK.

I SAID MIKE, YOU READ IT ?

PGH I SAID MIKE, YOU READ IT ?

PGH NAH, I'VE BEEN SO BUSY.

NAH, I'VE BEEN SO BUSY.

I SAID YOU RETIRED MIKE.

I SAID YOU RETIRED MIKE.

HE SAID OH, I'VE BEEN DOING ONE HE SAID OH, I'VE BEEN DOING ONE THING AFTER ANOTHER.

THING AFTER ANOTHER.

I SAID IF YOU OPEN THE BOOK UP I SAID IF YOU OPEN THE BOOK UP TO SEE THE DEDICATION.

TO SEE THE DEDICATION.

NOT YET.

NOT YET.

I TOLD YOU I DIDN'T HAVE TIME.

I TOLD YOU I DIDN'T HAVE TIME.

THIS KIND OF THING, WHAT YOU AND THIS KIND OF THING, WHAT YOU AND YOUR CLASS GO THROUGH OF WHAT IS YOUR CLASS GO THROUGH OF WHAT IS TRUTH, WHAT IS FICTION, I CAN'T TRUTH, WHAT IS FICTION, I CAN'T HELP YOU WITH IT BECAUSE I HELP YOU WITH IT BECAUSE I SIMPLY DO NOT KNOW.

SIMPLY DO NOT KNOW.

I DO THE BEST I CAN.

I DO THE BEST I CAN.

HERE'S ONE THING I DO KNOW: IF HERE'S ONE THING I DO KNOW: IF YOU WRITE NOTHING, THESE STORIES YOU WRITE NOTHING, THESE STORIES DISAPPEAR.

DISAPPEAR.

IF YOU SAY I CANNOT DO IT IF YOU SAY I CANNOT DO IT BECAUSE I CANNOT TELL THE TRUTH BECAUSE I CANNOT TELL THE TRUTH OF THIS, THAT STORY EVAPORATES OF THIS, THAT STORY EVAPORATES FOREVER.

FOREVER.

AND I WANTED THE STORY OF THE AND I WANTED THE STORY OF THE CONWAY FAMILY TO LIVE ON AND CONWAY FAMILY TO LIVE ON AND SOMEONE ELSE CAN WRITE IT AS SOMEONE ELSE CAN WRITE IT AS THEY SEE IT DIFFERENTLY LATER.

THEY SEE IT DIFFERENTLY LATER.

WELL, I LIKE DETECTIVE FICTION.

WELL, I LIKE DETECTIVE FICTION.

SO I KIND OF LOOKED AT YOUR SO I KIND OF LOOKED AT YOUR WRITING CAREER AND EVOLVES A WRITING CAREER AND EVOLVES A HYPOTHESIS ABOUT WHY YOU'RE HYPOTHESIS ABOUT WHY YOU'RE WRITING MORE AUTOBIOGRAPHY THESE WRITING MORE AUTOBIOGRAPHY THESE DAYS.

DAYS.

>> HYPOTHESES -- >> HYPOTHESES -- >> I'M TRYING TO BE SHERLOCKIAN >> I'M TRYING TO BE SHERLOCKIAN HERE.

HERE.

BUT YOUR DAD DIED IN 1998.

BUT YOUR DAD DIED IN 1998.

YOUR MOM DIED 15 YEARS EARLIER.

YOUR MOM DIED 15 YEARS EARLIER.

YOU BEGAN WRITING MORE AUTO BUY YOU BEGAN WRITING MORE AUTO BUY HE GRAPHICAL BOOKS AFTER YOUR HE GRAPHICAL BOOKS AFTER YOUR DAD'S DEATH, I KNOW THE WATER IS DAD'S DEATH, I KNOW THE WATER IS WIDE IS SOMETIMES CLASSIFIED AS WIDE IS SOMETIMES CLASSIFIED AS A MEMOIR, BUT I THINK IT STARTED A MEMOIR, BUT I THINK IT STARTED LIFE AS AN AUTOBIOGRAPHICAL LIFE AS AN AUTOBIOGRAPHICAL NOVEL.

NOVEL.

BUT YOU'VE GOT MY LOSING SEASON, BUT YOU'VE GOT MY LOSING SEASON, MY LIFE IN BOOKS AND NOW THIS: MY LIFE IN BOOKS AND NOW THIS: THE DEATH OF SANTINI.

THE DEATH OF SANTINI.

IS THERE SOMETHING ABOUT THE IS THERE SOMETHING ABOUT THE DEATH OF YOUR PARENTS THAT MAYBE DEATH OF YOUR PARENTS THAT MAYBE OPENS THE GATES A LITTLE MORE TO OPENS THE GATES A LITTLE MORE TO WRITING STORIES THAT ARE TRUE, WRITING STORIES THAT ARE TRUE, THAT YOU'RE LABELING TRUE THAT THAT YOU'RE LABELING TRUE THAT MIGHT BE OFFENSIVE, THAT THEY MIGHT BE OFFENSIVE, THAT THEY MIGHT CORRECT IF THEY WERE MIGHT CORRECT IF THEY WERE AALIVE ?

PGH THEY'RE NOT HERE AALIVE ?

PGH THEY'RE NOT HERE ANY MORE.

ANY MORE.

IS THAT FREEING.

IS THAT FREEING.

>> YEAH, I KIND OF LIKE BOTH OF >> YEAH, I KIND OF LIKE BOTH OF THEM BEING DEAD WHEN THIS BOOK THEM BEING DEAD WHEN THIS BOOK CAME OUT.

CAME OUT.

[LAUGHTER] [LAUGHTER] I FEEL BAD SAYING THAT BUT THERE I FEEL BAD SAYING THAT BUT THERE ARE THINGS -- I REMEMBER WHEN ARE THINGS -- I REMEMBER WHEN THE GREAT SANTINI CAME OUT, MY THE GREAT SANTINI CAME OUT, MY MOTHER WHO WAS VERY LITERARY AND MOTHER WHO WAS VERY LITERARY AND DIDN'T GO TO COLLEGE BUT SHE DIDN'T GO TO COLLEGE BUT SHE READ EVERYTHING, AND SHE CAME UP READ EVERYTHING, AND SHE CAME UP AND SHE WAS FURIOUS WITH ME OVER AND SHE WAS FURIOUS WITH ME OVER THE GREAT SANTINI.

THE GREAT SANTINI.

AND SHE TOLD ME ONE NIGHT AFTER AND SHE TOLD ME ONE NIGHT AFTER I COOKED AT DINNER, AND SHE I COOKED AT DINNER, AND SHE SAID, "THE ONLY SHAME I FEEL IS SAID, "THE ONLY SHAME I FEEL IS THAT I RAISED YOU TO BE SUCH A THAT I RAISED YOU TO BE SUCH A MEDIOCRE NOVELIST."

MEDIOCRE NOVELIST."

>> OH, GOD.

>> OH, GOD.

>> I SAID, YOU KNOW, MOM, YOU >> I SAID, YOU KNOW, MOM, YOU KNOW, CRITICS HAVE AGREED WITH KNOW, CRITICS HAVE AGREED WITH YOU.

YOU.

IT'S WONDERFUL TO GET THE PERSON IT'S WONDERFUL TO GET THE PERSON YOU LOVE THE MOST ON EARTH TO YOU LOVE THE MOST ON EARTH TO ABSOLUTELY CORROBORATE THEIR ABSOLUTELY CORROBORATE THEIR JUDGMENT.

JUDGMENT.

AND SHE SAID, "YOU GAVE THE BOOK AND SHE SAID, "YOU GAVE THE BOOK TO HIM.

TO HIM.

YOU THOUGHT THAT HE RAN THAT YOU THOUGHT THAT HE RAN THAT HOUSEHOLD.

HOUSEHOLD.

YOU THOUGHT THAT HE WAS THE YOU THOUGHT THAT HE WAS THE MASTER OF THAT HOUSEHOLD.

MASTER OF THAT HOUSEHOLD.

YOU WEREN'T BRIGHT ENOUGH TO SEE YOU WEREN'T BRIGHT ENOUGH TO SEE HE IT, SON.

HE IT, SON.

I RAN THAT HOUSE."

I RAN THAT HOUSE."

THE WOMAN WAS BEHIND EVERYTHING THE WOMAN WAS BEHIND EVERYTHING THAT HAPPENED IN THAT HOUSE.

THAT HAPPENED IN THAT HOUSE.

I COULD CONTROL HIM EASILY.

I COULD CONTROL HIM EASILY.

EASILY HE.

EASILY HE.

AND I TOLD HER AT THAT TIME, I AND I TOLD HER AT THAT TIME, I SAID, MOM, I SAW THAT LIGHT AND SAID, MOM, I SAW THAT LIGHT AND I.E.

WANT TO PROMISE YOU I.E.

WANT TO PROMISE YOU SOMETHING, IF I LIVE LONG SOMETHING, IF I LIVE LONG ENOUGH, I'LL GET TO YOU DOWN THE ENOUGH, I'LL GET TO YOU DOWN THE ROAD.

ROAD.

AND I WAS ALMOST HAPPY THAT MOM AND I WAS ALMOST HAPPY THAT MOM WAS NOT ALIVE WHEN THE PRINCE OF WAS NOT ALIVE WHEN THE PRINCE OF TIDES CAME OUT BECAUSE I THINK TIDES CAME OUT BECAUSE I THINK THAT THAT BOOK WOULD HAVE THAT THAT BOOK WOULD HAVE WOUNDED HER, HORRIFIED HER AND WOUNDED HER, HORRIFIED HER AND EVERYTHING ELSE.

EVERYTHING ELSE.

>> OF ALL THE STORIES YOU TELL >> OF ALL THE STORIES YOU TELL IN THIS BOOK -- AND YOU TELL IN THIS BOOK -- AND YOU TELL TELL SOME DOOZIES.

TELL SOME DOOZIES.

YOU TELL STORIES ABOUT PHYSICAL YOU TELL STORIES ABOUT PHYSICAL ABECAUSE, EMOTIONAL ABUSE, YOU ABECAUSE, EMOTIONAL ABUSE, YOU ALSO TELL A LOT OF FUNNY ALSO TELL A LOT OF FUNNY STORIES.

STORIES.

THE STORY THAT HONESTLY, MY JAW THE STORY THAT HONESTLY, MY JAW DROPPED OPEN, WAS THE STORY YOU DROPPED OPEN, WAS THE STORY YOU TOLD ABOUT WRITING THE GREAT TOLD ABOUT WRITING THE GREAT SANTINI, YOU'RE LIVING IN SANTINI, YOU'RE LIVING IN ATLANTA.

ATLANTA.

AND YOUR DAD IS SEPARATED AND AND YOUR DAD IS SEPARATED AND THEN DIVORCED FROM YOUR MOM.

THEN DIVORCED FROM YOUR MOM.

AND AS YOU'RE WRITING THE GREAT AND AS YOU'RE WRITING THE GREAT SANTINI, YOUR FATHER, DON CONROY SANTINI, YOUR FATHER, DON CONROY IS COMING EVERY EVERY MORNING TO IS COMING EVERY EVERY MORNING TO HAVE COFFEE WITH YOU.

HAVE COFFEE WITH YOU.

EVERY MORNING.

EVERY MORNING.

THIS IS THE GUY WHO YOU'VE SAID THIS IS THE GUY WHO YOU'VE SAID I PRAYED THAT HE WOULDN'T COME I PRAYED THAT HE WOULDN'T COME BACK ALIVE FROM VIETNAM.

BACK ALIVE FROM VIETNAM.

THIS IS A MAN YOU HATE WITH GOOD THIS IS A MAN YOU HATE WITH GOOD REASON.

REASON.

HE'S HAVING COFFEE WITH YOU HE'S HAVING COFFEE WITH YOU EVERY MORNING.

EVERY MORNING.

HE DOESN'T KNOW WHAT YOU'RE HE DOESN'T KNOW WHAT YOU'RE WRITING WITH THE GREAT SANTINI.

WRITING WITH THE GREAT SANTINI.

THE BOOK IS ESTABLISHED, IT THE BOOK IS ESTABLISHED, IT COMES OUT.

COMES OUT.

YOU GIVE HIM A COPY.

YOU GIVE HIM A COPY.

HE SAYS SON, YOU NAMED THE BOOK HE SAYS SON, YOU NAMED THE BOOK AFTER ME, I'M SO TOUCHED.

AFTER ME, I'M SO TOUCHED.

AND THEN TWO HOURS LATER, AS YOU AND THEN TWO HOURS LATER, AS YOU DESCRIBE IT, HE CALLS UP AND I DESCRIBE IT, HE CALLS UP AND I CAN'T QUOTE WHAT HE SAID.

CAN'T QUOTE WHAT HE SAID.

I'M SURE.

I'M SURE.

BECAUSE IT WOULD BE TOO BECAUSE IT WOULD BE TOO OFFENSIVE.

OFFENSIVE.

HOW DO YOU SIT DOWN AND HAVE HOW DO YOU SIT DOWN AND HAVE COFFEE WITH YOUR DAD EVERY COFFEE WITH YOUR DAD EVERY MORNING WHEN YOU'VE HAD THIS MORNING WHEN YOU'VE HAD THIS RELATIONSHIP WHERE YOU'RE READY RELATIONSHIP WHERE YOU'RE READY TO KILL EACH OTHER AND YOU'RE TO KILL EACH OTHER AND YOU'RE WRITING ABOUT HIM THAT WAY?

WRITING ABOUT HIM THAT WAY?

>> THE CONROY FAMILY HAS VERY >> THE CONROY FAMILY HAS VERY LITTLE MORAL LIMITS TO OUR LITTLE MORAL LIMITS TO OUR ACTIONS.

ACTIONS.

AND YOU KNOW, I NOTICE HE WAS AND YOU KNOW, I NOTICE HE WAS THE ONLY FATHER I WAS HANDED THE ONLY FATHER I WAS HANDED OUT.

OUT.

YOU KNOW, WHEN I WAS A KID.

YOU KNOW, WHEN I WAS A KID.

IT ALWAYS BOTHERED ME THAT I IT ALWAYS BOTHERED ME THAT I COULDN'T MAKE DAD PROUD OF ME COULDN'T MAKE DAD PROUD OF ME WHEN I WAS WRITING POETRY OR WHEN I WAS WRITING POETRY OR SHORT STORIES WHEN I WAS A KID.

SHORT STORIES WHEN I WAS A KID.

YOU KNOW, HE'D SAY HOW IS MY YOU KNOW, HE'D SAY HOW IS MY FAVORITE HOMO?

AND GOSH, DAD, FAVORITE HOMO?

AND GOSH, DAD, I'M DOING GREAT.

I'M DOING GREAT.

AND HE SAID -- AND THEN HE WOULD AND HE SAID -- AND THEN HE WOULD KILL ME IN THIS WAY: YOU KNOW, KILL ME IN THIS WAY: YOU KNOW, PAT CONROY, THAT'S NOT -- YOU PAT CONROY, THAT'S NOT -- YOU KNOW, WHAT A CRAPPY NAME.

KNOW, WHAT A CRAPPY NAME.

IT'S LIKE AN IRISH BUS DRIVER IT'S LIKE AN IRISH BUS DRIVER FROM THE BRONX.

FROM THE BRONX.

AND I WAS READ ERNEST HEMINGWAY AND I WAS READ ERNEST HEMINGWAY AND -- SO I WENT TO AN F. SCOTT AND -- SO I WENT TO AN F. SCOTT FITZGERALD PERIOD.

FITZGERALD PERIOD.

SO I WROTE POEMS AND SHORT SO I WROTE POEMS AND SHORT STORIES FOR ONE SHORT YEAR IN STORIES FOR ONE SHORT YEAR IN BUFORD AND I WOULD SIGN THEM D. BUFORD AND I WOULD SIGN THEM D. PATRICK CONROY.

PATRICK CONROY.

SO MY FATHER GETS THIS.

SO MY FATHER GETS THIS.

AND HE SAYS WOULD D. PATRICK AND HE SAYS WOULD D. PATRICK PASS ME THE MILK, PLEASE?

WOULD PASS ME THE MILK, PLEASE?

WOULD D. PATRICK PASS ME THE POTATOES?

D. PATRICK PASS ME THE POTATOES?

SO YOU KNOW, ANYWHERE I WEPT WAS SO YOU KNOW, ANYWHERE I WEPT WAS A -- I WENT WAS A HUME A -- I WENT WAS A HUME HUMILIATION.

HUMILIATION.

I TRIED TO PLAY BASKETBALL.

I TRIED TO PLAY BASKETBALL.

I TRIED TO PLAY BASEBALL.

I TRIED TO PLAY BASEBALL.

IT DID NOT WORK FOR ME AND DAD.

IT DID NOT WORK FOR ME AND DAD.

SO I THINK, MAUREEN, JUST HIM SO I THINK, MAUREEN, JUST HIM COME OVER WAS -- YOU KNOW, I CAN COME OVER WAS -- YOU KNOW, I CAN ALWAYS -- IF SOMEBODY MAKES A ALWAYS -- IF SOMEBODY MAKES A GESTURE, YOU KNOW, I USUALLY TRY GESTURE, YOU KNOW, I USUALLY TRY TO ACCEPT THAT GESTURE FOR TO ACCEPT THAT GESTURE FOR WHATEVER IT IS.

WHATEVER IT IS.

AND DAD, ESPECIALLY AFTER "THE AND DAD, ESPECIALLY AFTER "THE GREAT SANTINI" CAME OUT, HE GREAT SANTINI" CAME OUT, HE HATED THAT BOOK.

HATED THAT BOOK.

BUT HE KEPT COMING TO COFFEE AND BUT HE KEPT COMING TO COFFEE AND HE'D SAY YOU'RE THE WORST WRITER HE'D SAY YOU'RE THE WORST WRITER IN AMERICA.

IN AMERICA.

AND I'D SAY WOULD YOU KNOW, DAD, AND I'D SAY WOULD YOU KNOW, DAD, YOU'VE NEVER READ ANOTHER WRITER YOU'VE NEVER READ ANOTHER WRITER IN AMERICA.

IN AMERICA.

THERE WAS A BAD REVIEW FROM THE THERE WAS A BAD REVIEW FROM THE "NEW YORK TIMES" THAT DAD "NEW YORK TIMES" THAT DAD MEMORIZED.

MEMORIZED.

IT SAID WELCOME TO PARTY IN IT SAID WELCOME TO PARTY IN ATLANTA AND MY FATHER WOULD SAY ATLANTA AND MY FATHER WOULD SAY YES, THE "NEW YORK TIMES" SURE YES, THE "NEW YORK TIMES" SURE DIDN'T LIKE MY BABY BOY.

DIDN'T LIKE MY BABY BOY.

AND HE WOULD QUOTE FROM MEMORY.

AND HE WOULD QUOTE FROM MEMORY.

SO I HAD THIS -- YOU KNOW, AS HE SO I HAD THIS -- YOU KNOW, AS HE WOULD COME BACK, I IN MY WAY WOULD COME BACK, I IN MY WAY APPRECIATED IT.

APPRECIATED IT.

WHATEVER HE COULD GIVE ME, I WHATEVER HE COULD GIVE ME, I WENT ALONG WITH.

WENT ALONG WITH.

>> I THINK ONE OF THE THEMES YOU >> I THINK ONE OF THE THEMES YOU BRING TO LIFE IN THIS BOOK IS BRING TO LIFE IN THIS BOOK IS THAT ART CHANGES YOU.

THAT ART CHANGES YOU.

AND CERTAINLY BOOKS CHANGED YOU, AND CERTAINLY BOOKS CHANGED YOU, "THE GREAT SANTINI" CHANGED YOUR "THE GREAT SANTINI" CHANGED YOUR FATHER.

FATHER.

AS YOU DESCRIBE IT, HE TRIED TO AS YOU DESCRIBE IT, HE TRIED TO SHOW YOU UP BY PROVING TO THE SHOW YOU UP BY PROVING TO THE WORLD THAT HE WASN'T "THE GREAT WORLD THAT HE WASN'T "THE GREAT SANTINI."

SANTINI."

>> HE SHOWED TO SHOW I WAS A >> HE SHOWED TO SHOW I WAS A LIAR.

LIAR.

>> SO HE BECAME A BETTER PERSON.

>> SO HE BECAME A BETTER PERSON.

>> HE WAS GREAT.

>> HE WAS GREAT.

HE WAS GREAT.

HE WAS GREAT.

MY BROTHERS AND SISTERS AND I DO MY BROTHERS AND SISTERS AND I DO NOT KNOW WHAT TO MAKE OF THIS.

NOT KNOW WHAT TO MAKE OF THIS.

HIS FAMILY IN CHICAGO WENT NUTS.

HIS FAMILY IN CHICAGO WENT NUTS.

HIS PARENTS NEVER TALKED TO ME HIS PARENTS NEVER TALKED TO ME AGAIN.

AGAIN.

THERE WAS LITERALLY SUFFERING THERE WAS LITERALLY SUFFERING BECAUSE OF SOMETHING I WROTE.

BECAUSE OF SOMETHING I WROTE.

AND IT'S STIRRING, BUT THEN DAD, AND IT'S STIRRING, BUT THEN DAD, NEXT THING I KNOW, I'M SIGNING NEXT THING I KNOW, I'M SIGNING "THE GREAT SANTINI."

"THE GREAT SANTINI."

AND THIS IS I'M SIGNING TO 5 TO AND THIS IS I'M SIGNING TO 5 TO 10 PEOPLE IN ATLANTA.

10 PEOPLE IN ATLANTA.

AND HE'S SITTING BESIDE ME.

AND HE'S SITTING BESIDE ME.

IRISH DON'T LIKE THAT.

IRISH DON'T LIKE THAT.

DON'T ATTACK MY SON.

DON'T ATTACK MY SON.

I LOOK OVER, I SEE DAD AND HE'S I LOOK OVER, I SEE DAD AND HE'S SIGNING BOOKS WITH ME.

SIGNING BOOKS WITH ME.

[LAUGHTER] [LAUGHTER] HERE'S WHAT IRRITATES ME, HERE'S WHAT IRRITATES ME, MAUREEN, THE BOOKS HE SIGNED ARE MAUREEN, THE BOOKS HE SIGNED ARE WORTH MUCH MORE THAN THE ONES I WORTH MUCH MORE THAN THE ONES I SIGNED.

SIGNED.

[LAUGHTER] [LAUGHTER] >> YOU KNOW HE'S LOVING THAT >> YOU KNOW HE'S LOVING THAT SOMEWHERE.

SOMEWHERE.

>> YEAH.

>> YEAH.

AND HE WOULD SIGN IT "I HOPE YOU AND HE WOULD SIGN IT "I HOPE YOU ENJOY MY SON'S LATEST WORK OF ENJOY MY SON'S LATEST WORK OF FICTION" AND HE UNDERLINES FICTION" AND HE UNDERLINES FICTION.

FICTION.

AND HE SAYS, "MY SON, WHAT A AND HE SAYS, "MY SON, WHAT A VIVID IMAGINATION."

VIVID IMAGINATION."

AND HE WOULD SIGN IT OLD AND HE WOULD SIGN IT OLD LOVABLE, LIKABLE DON CONROY.

LOVABLE, LIKABLE DON CONROY.

AND HE SIGNED BOOKS FROM THAT AND HE SIGNED BOOKS FROM THAT DAY ON UNTIL THE TIME HE DIED.

DAY ON UNTIL THE TIME HE DIED.

>> DID THAT DRIVE YOU CRAZY THAT >> DID THAT DRIVE YOU CRAZY THAT HE TRIED TO TAKE OWNERSHIP.

HE TRIED TO TAKE OWNERSHIP.

>> YES, IT DID.

>> YES, IT DID.

>> I MEAN, IT'S YOUR WORK.

>> I MEAN, IT'S YOUR WORK.

AND HE'S -- AND HE'S -- >> AND I'D SAY DAD, WHY ARE YOU >> AND I'D SAY DAD, WHY ARE YOU SIGNING THE PRINCE OF TIDES?

HE SIGNING THE PRINCE OF TIDES?

HE SAID, "SON, I AM THE SOURCE.

SAID, "SON, I AM THE SOURCE.

I AM THE SEED."

I AM THE SEED."

I SAID, "DAD, YOU MAKE THIS I SAID, "DAD, YOU MAKE THIS SOUND LEEK A LIKE A SPERM LAB."

SOUND LEEK A LIKE A SPERM LAB."

BUT STILL, HE WOULD DO THAT AND BUT STILL, HE WOULD DO THAT AND IN MY WAY, I REALIZED HE WAS MY IN MY WAY, I REALIZED HE WAS MY INARTICULATE FATHER'S TRYING TO INARTICULATE FATHER'S TRYING TO DESPERATELY TO TELL ME LOVED ME.

DESPERATELY TO TELL ME LOVED ME.

AND HE DID NOT HAVE THOSE KIND AND HE DID NOT HAVE THOSE KIND OF WORDS.

OF WORDS.

HE DID NOT HAVE THAT KIND OF HE DID NOT HAVE THAT KIND OF ARTICULATION.

ARTICULATION.

HE COULDN'T DO IT, MAUREEN.

HE COULDN'T DO IT, MAUREEN.

SO I HAD TO TAKE THESE LITTLE SO I HAD TO TAKE THESE LITTLE THINGS.

THINGS.

AND, OF COURSE, THEN DAD GETS IN AND, OF COURSE, THEN DAD GETS IN -- THEY MAKE A MOVIE ABOUT IT.

-- THEY MAKE A MOVIE ABOUT IT.

AND MY FATHER IN HIS AND MY FATHER IN HIS EXTRAORDINARY MODESTY WOULD SAY EXTRAORDINARY MODESTY WOULD SAY "ROBERT DUVALL OWES HIS ENTIRE "ROBERT DUVALL OWES HIS ENTIRE CAREER TO ME."

CAREER TO ME."

[LAUGHTER] [LAUGHTER] AND I SAY WHY DO YOU SAY THAT, AND I SAY WHY DO YOU SAY THAT, DAD?

HE SAID, "BEFORE HE GOT TO DAD?

HE SAID, "BEFORE HE GOT TO PLAY "THE GREAT SANTINI," HE HAD PLAY "THE GREAT SANTINI," HE HAD NO ROLE OF MEAT OR BONES OR NO ROLE OF MEAT OR BONES OR SINEW OR MACHO."

SINEW OR MACHO."

I SAID GODFATHER, NO, HE WASN'T I SAID GODFATHER, NO, HE WASN'T DOING BAD, DAD.

DOING BAD, DAD.

HE SAID YES, BUT I WAS THE ONE HE SAID YES, BUT I WAS THE ONE THAT LET THEM KNOW HE COULD THAT LET THEM KNOW HE COULD CARRY A MOVIE.

CARRY A MOVIE.

>> YOUR DAD WANTED JOHN WANE, >> YOUR DAD WANTED JOHN WANE, RIGHT?

RIGHT?

>> YEAH, IT WAS THIS WAY: IT'S >> YEAH, IT WAS THIS WAY: IT'S A SAME JOHN WAYNE IS DEAD, SON.

A SAME JOHN WAYNE IS DEAD, SON.

ONLY HE COULD GET MY ONLY HE COULD GET MY EXTRAORDINARY MASCULINITY ACROSS EXTRAORDINARY MASCULINITY ACROSS TO THE AMERICAN PEOPLE.

TO THE AMERICAN PEOPLE.

I WENT THROUGH CRAP LIKE THIS.

I WENT THROUGH CRAP LIKE THIS.

AND I'M THINKING TO MYSELF, AND I'M THINKING TO MYSELF, MAUREEN, IF I WRITE THIS, MAUREEN, IF I WRITE THIS, NOBODY'S GOING TO BELIEVE THIS.

NOBODY'S GOING TO BELIEVE THIS.

AND I HAD MOVIE COMPANIES SEND AND I HAD MOVIE COMPANIES SEND DAD A TELEGRAM SAYING WE'VE DAD A TELEGRAM SAYING WE'VE CHOSEN THE ACTOR TO PLAY YOU, CHOSEN THE ACTOR TO PLAY YOU, COLONEL.

COLONEL.

HIS NAME IS TRUMAN CAPOTE.

HIS NAME IS TRUMAN CAPOTE.

AND MY FATHER WENT NUTS.

AND MY FATHER WENT NUTS.

HE GOES CRAZY.

HE GOES CRAZY.

I FIND HIM STRAPPING ON A 6 I FIND HIM STRAPPING ON A 6 SHOOTER TO GO OUT AND KILL THE SHOOTER TO GO OUT AND KILL THE PRODUCER.

PRODUCER.

WHO HAS THESE KINDS OF THINGS?

WHO HAS THESE KINDS OF THINGS?

>> YOU ABOUT YOU MADE AN >> YOU ABOUT YOU MADE AN EXTRAORDINARY OFFER RECENTLY EXTRAORDINARY OFFER RECENTLY YOURSELF.

YOURSELF.

YOU MADE THE OFFER TO ROBERT YOU MADE THE OFFER TO ROBERT DUVALL, BATON ROUGE DANKER, DUVALL, BATON ROUGE DANKER, MICHAEL -- BLYTHE DANNER, THE MICHAEL -- BLYTHE DANNER, THE ORIGINAL CAST, YOU WANT THEM TO ORIGINAL CAST, YOU WANT THEM TO COME BACK AND FILM THE DEATH OF COME BACK AND FILM THE DEATH OF SANTINI.

SANTINI.

>> THIS IS MY DREAM.

>> THIS IS MY DREAM.

THAT MOVIE SAW SOMETHING IN THE THAT MOVIE SAW SOMETHING IN THE HORROR OF MY PUBLISHING THAT HORROR OF MY PUBLISHING THAT BOOK, THAT WAS EXTRAORDINARY.

BOOK, THAT WAS EXTRAORDINARY.

MY FATHER BEING ROBERT DUVALL, MY FATHER BEING ROBERT DUVALL, HE COMES ROARING UP TO MY HE COMES ROARING UP TO MY APARTMENT, MAUREEN.

APARTMENT, MAUREEN.

HE COMES FLYING INTO MY HE COMES FLYING INTO MY APARTMENT.

APARTMENT.

HE HAD A KEY IN ATLANTA.

HE HAD A KEY IN ATLANTA.

HE COMES CRASHING THROUGH AND HE HE COMES CRASHING THROUGH AND HE SAID, "SON, YOU AND I WERE SAID, "SON, YOU AND I WERE NOMINATED FOR AN ACADEMY AWARD NOMINATED FOR AN ACADEMY AWARD LAST NIGHT."

LAST NIGHT."

AND HE SAID, "YOUR MOTHER DIDN'T AND HE SAID, "YOUR MOTHER DIDN'T GET SQUAT."

GET SQUAT."

AND HERE'S WHAT I'D LOVE TO HAVE HAPPEN.

AND HERE'S WHAT I'D LOVE TO HAVE HAPPEN.

IT'S BEEN WHAT?

THIRTY-FIVE IT'S BEEN WHAT?

THIRTY-FIVE YEARS SINCE THAT MOVIE CAME OUT?

YEARS SINCE THAT MOVIE CAME OUT?

I LOVE THAT MOVIE SO MUCH, I I LOVE THAT MOVIE SO MUCH, I WOULD LIKE ROBERT DUVALL, BLYTHE WOULD LIKE ROBERT DUVALL, BLYTHE DANNER, MICHAEL OKEEFE TO PLAY DANNER, MICHAEL OKEEFE TO PLAY THESE PARTS THEY PLAYED AS THESE PARTS THEY PLAYED AS FICTIONAL ROLES AS NONFICTIONAL FICTIONAL ROLES AS NONFICTIONAL CARETERS AS THE REAL CHARACTERS.

CARETERS AS THE REAL CHARACTERS.

I THINK THAT COULD BE A MAGICAL I THINK THAT COULD BE A MAGICAL MOVIE AND AN UNKNOWN MOVIE AND I MOVIE AND AN UNKNOWN MOVIE AND I DON'T THINK IT'S EVER BEEN DONE DON'T THINK IT'S EVER BEEN DONE IN HOLLYWOOD.

IN HOLLYWOOD.

>> YOU HAVEN'T HEARD ANYTHING.

>> YOU HAVEN'T HEARD ANYTHING.

NOT YET.

WELL, WE'LL LOBBY FOR NOT YET.

WELL, WE'LL LOBBY FOR IT.

IT.

>> WELL, YOU KNOW, I TOLD THEM >> WELL, YOU KNOW, I TOLD THEM THEY CAN HAVE IT FOR NOTHINGMENT THEY CAN HAVE IT FOR NOTHINGMENT I'D GIVE IT TO THEM.

I'D GIVE IT TO THEM.

AND SO I KNOW, YOU KNOW, THEY'RE AND SO I KNOW, YOU KNOW, THEY'RE INTERESTED.

INTERESTED.

BUT HOLLYWOOD, AS YOU KNOW, IS BUT HOLLYWOOD, AS YOU KNOW, IS THE STRANGEST PLACE OF ALL.

THE STRANGEST PLACE OF ALL.

THEY THINK I'M NUTS BECAUSE I'M THEY THINK I'M NUTS BECAUSE I'M NOT ASKING FOR MONEY.

NOT ASKING FOR MONEY.

OFFER TO WRITE A SCREENPLAY FOR OFFER TO WRITE A SCREENPLAY FOR NOTHING.

NOTHING.

>> WELL, IT WOULD BE >> WELL, IT WOULD BE EXTRAORDINARY TO FILM THE SCENES EXTRAORDINARY TO FILM THE SCENES YOU GIVE US HERE, THE REAL LIFE YOU GIVE US HERE, THE REAL LIFE SCENES OF THE DEATH OF YOUR SCENES OF THE DEATH OF YOUR PARENTS.

PARENTS.

BECAUSE ANOTHER THING THAT I WAS BECAUSE ANOTHER THING THAT I WAS SO TAKEN BY WAS HOW PHYSICALLY SO TAKEN BY WAS HOW PHYSICALLY YOU -- INVOLVED YOU WERE IN YOU -- INVOLVED YOU WERE IN NURSING BOTH YOUR MOTHER AND NURSING BOTH YOUR MOTHER AND YOUR FATHER.

YOUR FATHER.

AND I MEAN, INTIMATELY INVOLVED.

AND I MEAN, INTIMATELY INVOLVED.

YOU TALK ABOUT YOUR MOM IN THE YOU TALK ABOUT YOUR MOM IN THE HOSPITAL.

HOSPITAL.

SHE'S SUFFERING FROM THE SHE'S SUFFERING FROM THE CHEMOTHERAPY THAT HER LEUKEMIA CHEMOTHERAPY THAT HER LEUKEMIA REQUIRES THAT SHE HAD.

REQUIRES THAT SHE HAD.

VOMITING, HAVING ALL SORTS OF VOMITING, HAVING ALL SORTS OF ACCIDENTS.

ACCIDENTS.

YOU'RE IN THERE WITH HER IN THE YOU'RE IN THERE WITH HER IN THE SHOWER IN THE HOSPITAL SCRUBBING SHOWER IN THE HOSPITAL SCRUBBING HER OFF, STRAUBING YOURSELF OFF, HER OFF, STRAUBING YOURSELF OFF, YOU'RE DOING THAT REAL HANDS ON YOU'RE DOING THAT REAL HANDS ON NURSING THAT MAKES YOU VERY NURSING THAT MAKES YOU VERY INMAT WITH THE BODIES OF YOUR -- INMAT WITH THE BODIES OF YOUR -- INTIMATE WITH THE BODIES OF YOUR INTIMATE WITH THE BODIES OF YOUR PARENTS AND AGAIN THESE ARE TWO PARENTS AND AGAIN THESE ARE TWO PEOPLE WHO EVEN YOUR MOM YOU SAY PEOPLE WHO EVEN YOUR MOM YOU SAY WAS NOT A TOUCHY FEELY MOM WHEN WAS NOT A TOUCHY FEELY MOM WHEN YOU WERE GROWING UP.

YOU WERE GROWING UP.

THE EVOLUTION AS THEY GET OLDER THE EVOLUTION AS THEY GET OLDER OF YOUR RELATIONSHIP IS OF YOUR RELATIONSHIP IS FASCINATING.

FASCINATING.

AND HONESTLY, I STILL DON'T GET AND HONESTLY, I STILL DON'T GET IT.

IT.

BECAUSE FOR PEOPLE WHO WERE SO BECAUSE FOR PEOPLE WHO WERE SO ESPECIALLY YOUR DAD, WHO WERE SO ESPECIALLY YOUR DAD, WHO WERE SO VICIOUS, FOR YOU TO FIND THAT IN VICIOUS, FOR YOU TO FIND THAT IN YOURSELF TO BE ABLE TO BE YOURSELF TO BE ABLE TO BE THEY'RE CAREGIVER IS, I THINK, THEY'RE CAREGIVER IS, I THINK, PRETTY EXTRAORDINARY.

PRETTY EXTRAORDINARY.

-- THEIR CAREGIVER.

-- THEIR CAREGIVER.

>> THE STRANGEST PART OF >> THE STRANGEST PART OF AMERICAN FAMILY LIFE, MY AMERICAN FAMILY LIFE, MY AMERICAN FAMILY LIFE, IS THAT IT AMERICAN FAMILY LIFE, IS THAT IT AMAZES ME THAT -- AND I DON'T AMAZES ME THAT -- AND I DON'T KNOW THAT ANY OF Y'ALL -- AND KNOW THAT ANY OF Y'ALL -- AND MAUREEN I DON'T KNOW YOU -- BUT MAUREEN I DON'T KNOW YOU -- BUT THESE FAMILIES I DON'T KNOW WHY THESE FAMILIES I DON'T KNOW WHY THEY CAN BE THE MOST HORRIBLE THEY CAN BE THE MOST HORRIBLE INCUBATORS, CRUCIBLES ON EARTH.

INCUBATORS, CRUCIBLES ON EARTH.

YET I HAVE NOTICED IT IS HARD TO YET I HAVE NOTICED IT IS HARD TO KEEP LOVE OUT OF THE EQUATION.

KEEP LOVE OUT OF THE EQUATION.

AND YOU KNOW, WHEN MY BROTHERS AND YOU KNOW, WHEN MY BROTHERS AND SISTERS -- WHEN MOM STARTED AND SISTERS -- WHEN MOM STARTED DYING, WE GOT TOGETHER AND SAID DYING, WE GOT TOGETHER AND SAID WE'RE GOING TO MAKE MOM'S DEATH WE'RE GOING TO MAKE MOM'S DEATH AS COMFORTABLE AS WE CAN.

AS COMFORTABLE AS WE CAN.

WE'RE GOING TO BE INVOLVED AS WE WE'RE GOING TO BE INVOLVED AS WE CAN AND WE'RE GOING TO MAKE HER CAN AND WE'RE GOING TO MAKE HER FEEL AS LOVED AS WE CAN.

FEEL AS LOVED AS WE CAN.

SAME THING HAPPENED WITH DAD.

SAME THING HAPPENED WITH DAD.

WE RALLIED TO DAD.

WE RALLIED TO DAD.

AND NO MATTER HOW THEY TREATED AND NO MATTER HOW THEY TREATED US, WE DIDN'T HAVE TO BE LIKE US, WE DIDN'T HAVE TO BE LIKE THEM.

THEM.

WE COULD -- YOU KNOW, WE -- THEY WE COULD -- YOU KNOW, WE -- THEY HAD RAISED KIDS.

HAD RAISED KIDS.

[APPLAUSE] [APPLAUSE] AND THEY HAD RAISED CHILDREN.

AND THEY HAD RAISED CHILDREN.

AND I THINK THEY WERE DEPRESSION AND I THINK THEY WERE DEPRESSION PARENTS.

PARENTS.

AND THEY JUST PUT A ROOF OVER AND THEY JUST PUT A ROOF OVER OUR HEADS, FED US, CLOTHED US, OUR HEADS, FED US, CLOTHED US, SENT US TO COLLEGE.

SENT US TO COLLEGE.

THAT IS WHAT THEY DID.

THAT IS WHAT THEY DID.

BUT AS CHILDREN, YOU KNOW, WE BUT AS CHILDREN, YOU KNOW, WE WERE DIFFERENT.

WERE DIFFERENT.

THEY -- YOU KNOW, THEY FOR SOME THEY -- YOU KNOW, THEY FOR SOME REASON WE CAME OUT WITH ABILITY REASON WE CAME OUT WITH ABILITY TO LOVE EACH OTHER.

TO LOVE EACH OTHER.

THAT'S BOOK, I MEAN, THERE IS NO THAT'S BOOK, I MEAN, THERE IS NO MAGNIFICENT REVIEW I WILL GET MAGNIFICENT REVIEW I WILL GET FROM MY BROTHERS AND SISTERS.

FROM MY BROTHERS AND SISTERS.

THEY CALL UP PAT, WHAT ARE YOU THEY CALL UP PAT, WHAT ARE YOU DOING THANKSGIVING?

I'LL SAY DOING THANKSGIVING?

I'LL SAY GOD, I HOPE I'M NOT SPENDING IT GOD, I HOPE I'M NOT SPENDING IT WITH YOU.

WITH YOU.

AND YOU KNOW, THEY WILL LAUGH AND YOU KNOW, THEY WILL LAUGH AND IT IS -- WHATEVER THE CONROY AND IT IS -- WHATEVER THE CONROY WAY WAS, WE SENT OUR PARENTS WAY WAS, WE SENT OUR PARENTS OUT, I THINK, WITH SOME OUT, I THINK, WITH SOME MAGNIFICENCE.

MAGNIFICENCE.

>> YOU DID.

>> YOU DID.

YOU REALLY DID.

YOU REALLY DID.

MY MOM IS 94.

MY MOM IS 94.

>> MY GOD, YOU'RE SO LUCKY.

>> MY GOD, YOU'RE SO LUCKY.

>> AND SO I'M SPEAKING AS -- >> AND SO I'M SPEAKING AS -- >> YOU'RE SO LUCKY.

>> YOU'RE SO LUCKY.

>> AS AN ADULT CHILD OF AN >> AS AN ADULT CHILD OF AN ELDERLY PARENT.

ELDERLY PARENT.

AND I'M REALLY IN AWE OF YOU FOR AND I'M REALLY IN AWE OF YOU FOR THAT CONSISTENT HANDS-ON CARE THAT CONSISTENT HANDS-ON CARE THAT YOU WERE ABLE TO GIVE.

THAT YOU WERE ABLE TO GIVE.

REMARKABLE.

REMARKABLE.

I FEEL LIKE YOU KEEP TRYING TO I FEEL LIKE YOU KEEP TRYING TO CRACK THE ENIGMA OF YOUR FATHER CRACK THE ENIGMA OF YOUR FATHER ESPECIALLY IN ALL OF YOUR BOOKS.

ESPECIALLY IN ALL OF YOUR BOOKS.

BUT ESPECIALLY IN THIS ONE.

BUT ESPECIALLY IN THIS ONE.

IT SEEMS LIKE ONE OF YOUR IT SEEMS LIKE ONE OF YOUR ANSWERS TO FOR THE VICIOUSNESS ANSWERS TO FOR THE VICIOUSNESS BUT ALSO THE HUMOR OF HIS BUT ALSO THE HUMOR OF HIS CHARACTER AND THE COURAGE THAT CHARACTER AND THE COURAGE THAT HE HAD AS A MARINE FIGHTER HE HAD AS A MARINE FIGHTER PILOT, THAT ONE OF YOUR ANSWERS PILOT, THAT ONE OF YOUR ANSWERS IS THE WHOLE MILITARY CULTURE IS THE WHOLE MILITARY CULTURE THAT YOU GREW UP IN, THAT THAT THAT YOU GREW UP IN, THAT THAT HELPED REALLY SHAPE HIS HELPED REALLY SHAPE HIS CHARACTER AND ALSO HELPED SHAPE CHARACTER AND ALSO HELPED SHAPE YOUR CHARACTER AS A BRAT, A YOUR CHARACTER AS A BRAT, A MILITARY BRAT.

MILITARY BRAT.

YOU'VE WRITTEN ABOUT THE CULTURE YOU'VE WRITTEN ABOUT THE CULTURE OF MILITARY FAMILIES AND I DON'T OF MILITARY FAMILIES AND I DON'T THINK VERY MANY OTHER PEOPLE THINK VERY MANY OTHER PEOPLE HAVE EXPLORED THAT CULTURE TO HAVE EXPLORED THAT CULTURE TO THE EXTENT THAT YOU HAVE.

THE EXTENT THAT YOU HAVE.

WHAT DO THE REST OF US WHO ARE WHAT DO THE REST OF US WHO ARE NOT MILITARY BRATS, WHAT DON'T NOT MILITARY BRATS, WHAT DON'T WE GET ABOUT THAT CULTURE?

WE GET ABOUT THAT CULTURE?

>> WELL, ONE THING YOU DON'T GET >> WELL, ONE THING YOU DON'T GET IS THAT WE'RE INVISIBLE.

IS THAT WE'RE INVISIBLE.

YOU KNOW A MILLION MILITARY YOU KNOW A MILLION MILITARY BRATS.

BRATS.

ALL OF YOU ALL KNOW A MILLION ALL OF YOU ALL KNOW A MILLION MILITARY BRATS.

MILITARY BRATS.

THEY'RE MILITARY BRATS SITTING THEY'RE MILITARY BRATS SITTING IN THIS AUDIENCE THAT NO ONE IN THIS AUDIENCE THAT NO ONE KNOWS WHO THEY ARE.

KNOWS WHO THEY ARE.

THEY HAVE NO IDEA.

THEY HAVE NO IDEA.

WE WALK IN TO TOWNS INVISIBLE.

WE WALK IN TO TOWNS INVISIBLE.

YOU KNOW, I AM RIDICULOUSLY YOU KNOW, I AM RIDICULOUSLY FRIENDLY.

FRIENDLY.

AND IT IS BECAUSE -- I WENT TO AND IT IS BECAUSE -- I WENT TO 11 SCHOOLS IN 12 YEARS.

11 SCHOOLS IN 12 YEARS.

SO I'D LEAVE ONE SCHOOL, I SO I'D LEAVE ONE SCHOOL, I DIDN'T KNOW ANYBODY.

DIDN'T KNOW ANYBODY.

I'D GO TO A NEW SCHOOL AND SO I I'D GO TO A NEW SCHOOL AND SO I HAD A PERPETUAL SMILE TRYING TO HAD A PERPETUAL SMILE TRYING TO GET ONE FRIEND, JUST ONE FRIEND GET ONE FRIEND, JUST ONE FRIEND I COULD MAKE.

I COULD MAKE.

AND IT IS ONE OF THE LONELIEST AND IT IS ONE OF THE LONELIEST PARTS.

PARTS.

YET THERE'S A GLORY TO IT.

YET THERE'S A GLORY TO IT.

THERE IS A PRIDE IN THE FATHER THERE IS A PRIDE IN THE FATHER WHEN I -- WHEN DAD DIED, NONE OF WHEN I -- WHEN DAD DIED, NONE OF US KNEW DAD HAD WON ANY MEDALS.

US KNEW DAD HAD WON ANY MEDALS.

MY FATHER HAD NOT TOLD US HE'D MY FATHER HAD NOT TOLD US HE'D WON ONE MEDAL.

WON ONE MEDAL.

AT ONE TIME I DID RESEARCH FOR AT ONE TIME I DID RESEARCH FOR THIS BOOK.

THIS BOOK.

MY FATHER WAS THE MOST DECORATED MY FATHER WAS THE MOST DECORATED MARINE CORPS FIGHTER PILOT IN MARINE CORPS FIGHTER PILOT IN THE HISTORY OF THE MARINE CORPS.

THE HISTORY OF THE MARINE CORPS.

AND I'M THINKING HE NEVER TOLD.

AND I'M THINKING HE NEVER TOLD.

>> BUT HE WAS -- HE BRAGGED >> BUT HE WAS -- HE BRAGGED ABOUT SO MANY OTHER THINGS.

ABOUT SO MANY OTHER THINGS.

WHY -- WHY -- >> NOT THE IMPORTANT THINGS.

>> NOT THE IMPORTANT THINGS.

>> YEAH.

>> YEAH.

HUH.

HUH.

>> NOT THE THINGS THAT SERVED >> NOT THE THINGS THAT SERVED OUR COUNTRY, NOT THE THINGS HE OUR COUNTRY, NOT THE THINGS HE DID IN THE AIR.

DID IN THE AIR.

AND YOU KNOW, I ALWAYS WOULD SAY AND YOU KNOW, I ALWAYS WOULD SAY YOU WOULD NOT LIKE TO BE OUR YOU WOULD NOT LIKE TO BE OUR NATION'S ENEMY WHEN DON CONROY NATION'S ENEMY WHEN DON CONROY PASSED OVERHEAD.

PASSED OVERHEAD.

WHEN HE WAS DYING HE TOLD ME WHEN HE WAS DYING HE TOLD ME THAT HE PLANNED THE NUCLEAR THAT HE PLANNED THE NUCLEAR DESTRUCTION OF RED CHINA.

DESTRUCTION OF RED CHINA.

I HAD NO IDEA.

I HAD NO IDEA.

I SAID DAD, HOW DID THEY GET THE I SAID DAD, HOW DID THEY GET THE BIGGEST JERK IN THE MARINE CORPS BIGGEST JERK IN THE MARINE CORPS TO PLOT THE DESTRUCTION OF THE TO PLOT THE DESTRUCTION OF THE LARGEST MOST POPULOUS NATION ON LARGEST MOST POPULOUS NATION ON EARTH?

I MEAN, THIS EVEN SOUNDS EARTH?

I MEAN, THIS EVEN SOUNDS -- AND EVERY TIME I SAY THIS, -- AND EVERY TIME I SAY THIS, MAUREEN, IT SOUNDS TOO MUCH FOR MAUREEN, IT SOUNDS TOO MUCH FOR FICTION.

FICTION.

YOU KNOW, AND WHO THESE PEOPLE I YOU KNOW, AND WHO THESE PEOPLE I HAVE, MY FATHER WAS CHECKED OUT HAVE, MY FATHER WAS CHECKED OUT TO CARRY NUCLEAR WEAPONS.

TO CARRY NUCLEAR WEAPONS.

HE WAS -- MY MOTHER DANCED AT HE WAS -- MY MOTHER DANCED AT THE WHITE HOUSE COMING FROM THE THE WHITE HOUSE COMING FROM THE BIGGEST REDNECK BACKGROUND YOU BIGGEST REDNECK BACKGROUND YOU CAN IMAGINE.

CAN IMAGINE.

AND HE LIED TO US.

AND HE LIED TO US.

I TEMPT LIKE MY MOTHER WAS A I TEMPT LIKE MY MOTHER WAS A SOUTHERN BELL, SHE IDENTIFIED AS SOUTHERN BELL, SHE IDENTIFIED AS SCARLET O'HARA.

SCARLET O'HARA.

I FELT MOM CAME FROM THIS AND I FELT MOM CAME FROM THIS AND WHEN SHE WAS DYING SHE TOLD MY WHEN SHE WAS DYING SHE TOLD MY STEPFATHER THAT WE HAD BEEN FROM STEPFATHER THAT WE HAD BEEN FROM THE LARGEST SLAVE OWNING FAMILY THE LARGEST SLAVE OWNING FAMILY IN ALABAMA.

IN ALABAMA.

AND I'M SITTING THERE LOOKING.

AND I'M SITTING THERE LOOKING.

I SAID THE LARGEST SLAVE OWNING I SAID THE LARGEST SLAVE OWNING FAMILY -- WE OWNED MORE FAMILY -- WE OWNED MORE PLANTATIONS THAN ANY FAMILY IN PLANTATIONS THAN ANY FAMILY IN ALABAMA.

ALABAMA.

THEY STRETCHED FROM THE THEY STRETCHED FROM THE CHATTAHOOCHEE TO -- MY MOTHER CHATTAHOOCHEE TO -- MY MOTHER WAS SPECIFIC.

WAS SPECIFIC.

TO THE MISSISSIPPI RIVER.

TO THE MISSISSIPPI RIVER.

AND I'M GOING NO KIDDING, THAT'S AND I'M GOING NO KIDDING, THAT'S INCREDIBLE.

INCREDIBLE.

I SAID WHAT HAPPENED TO FAMILY, I SAID WHAT HAPPENED TO FAMILY, MOM, BECAUSE I -- THE PEOPLE MOM, BECAUSE I -- THE PEOPLE THAT CAME AFTER THEM.

THAT CAME AFTER THEM.

SOMETHING TERRIBLE HAPPENED TO SOMETHING TERRIBLE HAPPENED TO FAMILY.

FAMILY.

AND MY MOTHER SAID TO ME "WO" I AND MY MOTHER SAID TO ME "WO" I SAID THE WO?

AND SHE SAID THE SAID THE WO?

AND SHE SAID THE CIVIL WO.

CIVIL WO.

[LAUGHTER] [LAUGHTER] AND I SAID MAN, THAT WO MUST AND I SAID MAN, THAT WO MUST HAVE BEEN HELL.

HAVE BEEN HELL.

IT MUST HAVE BEEN HORRIBLE, MOM.

IT MUST HAVE BEEN HORRIBLE, MOM.

NOW TELL ME AFTER BECAUSE THE WO NOW TELL ME AFTER BECAUSE THE WO -- AND I SAID THEN WHAT -- AND I SAID THEN WHAT HAPPENED?

SHE SAID THE HAPPENED?

SHE SAID THE DEPRESSION IT WAS HORRIBLE.

DEPRESSION IT WAS HORRIBLE.

YOU YOUNG PEOPLE DON'T YOU YOUNG PEOPLE DON'T UNDERSTAND THE DEPRESSION.

UNDERSTAND THE DEPRESSION.

WE'VE ALL BEEN THROUGH THIS AND WE'VE ALL BEEN THROUGH THIS AND YOU YOUNG SPOILED RIDICULOUS YOU YOUNG SPOILED RIDICULOUS YOUNG PEOPLE DO NOT UNDERSTAND YOUNG PEOPLE DO NOT UNDERSTAND THE DEPRESSION.

THE DEPRESSION.

AND I SAID OKAY, MOM, AFTER THE AND I SAID OKAY, MOM, AFTER THE DEPRESSION, OKAY.

DEPRESSION, OKAY.

THE WO, THE HORRIBLE WO, THE THE WO, THE HORRIBLE WO, THE DEPRESSION WAS AWFUL AND DEPRESSION WAS AWFUL AND TERRIBLE.

TERRIBLE.

YOU HAD NOTHING TO EAT.

YOU HAD NOTHING TO EAT.

AND I SAID WHY AFTER THE AND I SAID WHY AFTER THE DEPRESSION AND THE WO COULD NONE DEPRESSION AND THE WO COULD NONE OF YOUR RELATIVES READ OR WRITE?

OF YOUR RELATIVES READ OR WRITE?

COULD YOU EXPLAIN THIS TO EWHY COULD YOU EXPLAIN THIS TO EWHY COULDN'T THEY -- WHY WERE THEY COULDN'T THEY -- WHY WERE THEY ILLITERATE?

ILLITERATE?

>> BUT DO YOU THINK THAT WHAT >> BUT DO YOU THINK THAT WHAT SHOULD WE POLITELY CALL IT -- SHOULD WE POLITELY CALL IT -- THAT SELF-MYTHOLOGIZING, IS THAT THAT SELF-MYTHOLOGIZING, IS THAT MAYBE ALSO CONNECTED TO MOVING MAYBE ALSO CONNECTED TO MOVING EVERY YEAR AND TRYING TO ALMOST EVERY YEAR AND TRYING TO ALMOST REINVENT YOURSELF TO A NEW GROUP REINVENT YOURSELF TO A NEW GROUP OF FRIENDS?

OF FRIENDS?

>> MAUREEN, I THINK IT IS THAT.

>> MAUREEN, I THINK IT IS THAT.

I THINK IT IS SOMETHING ELSE.

I THINK IT IS SOMETHING ELSE.

I THINK MY MOTHER WAS THE FIRST I THINK MY MOTHER WAS THE FIRST FICTION WRITER IN THE FAMILY.

FICTION WRITER IN THE FAMILY.

I THINK SHE MADE UP A LIFE FOR I THINK SHE MADE UP A LIFE FOR HERSELF.

HERSELF.

I HAD NO IDEA UNTIL THIS BOOK -- I HAD NO IDEA UNTIL THIS BOOK -- YOU KNOW, THERE'S A PICTURE IN YOU KNOW, THERE'S A PICTURE IN THIS BOOK, A PHOTOGRAPH, I SAW THIS BOOK, A PHOTOGRAPH, I SAW THAT AND IT'S MY GRANDFATHER AND THAT AND IT'S MY GRANDFATHER AND HIS FAMILY.

HIS FAMILY.

IT SHOCKED ME.

IT SHOCKED ME.

I MEAN, I'M THINKING I'M RELATED I MEAN, I'M THINKING I'M RELATED TO THAT?

IT LOOKED LIKE JAMES TO THAT?

IT LOOKED LIKE JAMES AGEE'S PICTURES.

AGEE'S PICTURES.

I MEAN, THESE PEOPLE LOOKED HOLY I MEAN, THESE PEOPLE LOOKED HOLY GOD ALMIGHTY.

GOD ALMIGHTY.

AND THEY LOOKED LIKE THEY ALL AND THEY LOOKED LIKE THEY ALL DROWNED ON THE MAYFLOWER AND DROWNED ON THE MAYFLOWER AND THEN SOMEHOW RESURRECTED.

THEN SOMEHOW RESURRECTED.

NONE OF THEM WORE SHOES.

NONE OF THEM WORE SHOES.

AND THESE ARE MY DIRECT AND THESE ARE MY DIRECT RELATIVES.

RELATIVES.

AND VERY FEW COULD READ OR AND VERY FEW COULD READ OR WRITE.

WRITE.

>> I THINK ANOTHER SOLUTION THAT >> I THINK ANOTHER SOLUTION THAT YOU HAVE FOR YOUR DAD'S YOU HAVE FOR YOUR DAD'S CHARACTER, THIS STRANGE CHARACTER, THIS STRANGE CHARACTER THAT IS -- IS THAT CHARACTER THAT IS -- IS THAT HE'S IRISH OR HE WAS IRISH.

HE'S IRISH OR HE WAS IRISH.

AND THIS -- THAT PART OF THE AND THIS -- THAT PART OF THE BOOK OF COURSE INTERESTED ME FOR BOOK OF COURSE INTERESTED ME FOR OBVIOUS REASONS GIVEN MY NAME.

OBVIOUS REASONS GIVEN MY NAME.

I MEAN, YOU WRITE ABOUT A COUPLE I MEAN, YOU WRITE ABOUT A COUPLE TRIPS THAT YOU TOOK TO IRELAND TRIPS THAT YOU TOOK TO IRELAND AND ON THE FIRST TRIP, I THINK AND ON THE FIRST TRIP, I THINK IT IS.

IT IS.

A MAN, A MAN IN DUBLIN TELLS YOU A MAN, A MAN IN DUBLIN TELLS YOU THAT IF YOU HAD BEEN BORN IN THAT IF YOU HAD BEEN BORN IN IRELAND, YOU WOULD NOT BE SELL IRELAND, YOU WOULD NOT BE SELL OPERATED.

OPERATED.

AND HE IS -- CELEBRATED.

AND HE IS -- CELEBRATED.

HE SAID THE IRISH ARE GREAT HE SAID THE IRISH ARE GREAT DEBUNKERS OF EACH OTHER.

DEBUNKERS OF EACH OTHER.

>> HAVE YOU EVER HEARD THAT >> HAVE YOU EVER HEARD THAT PHRASE.

PHRASE.

>> I'D NOT HEARD THAT PHRASE, >> I'D NOT HEARD THAT PHRASE, BUT BOY, THAT ATTITUDE IS REALLY BUT BOY, THAT ATTITUDE IS REALLY FAMILIAR.

FAMILIAR.

IT'S FAMILIAR FROM MY CHILDHOOD.

IT'S FAMILIAR FROM MY CHILDHOOD.

IT'S ALSO FAMILIAR FROM PETE IT'S ALSO FAMILIAR FROM PETE HAMILL'S MEMOIR A DRINKING LIFE.

HAMILL'S MEMOIR A DRINKING LIFE.

THE MEMOIRS ABOUT GROWING UP THE MEMOIRS ABOUT GROWING UP IRISH AND THE ATTITUDE IS ALWAYS IRISH AND THE ATTITUDE IS ALWAYS "WHO DO YOU THINK YOU ARE?"

"WHO DO YOU THINK YOU ARE?"

>> I HAVE HAD THAT AND DIDN'T >> I HAVE HAD THAT AND DIDN'T KNOW WHERE IT CAME FROM.

KNOW WHERE IT CAME FROM.

MY MOTHER -- AND I DON'T KNOW MY MOTHER -- AND I DON'T KNOW CHICAGO IRISH.

CHICAGO IRISH.

DIDN'T NEVER TOOK US THERE.

DIDN'T NEVER TOOK US THERE.

HE DIDN'T TELL US ONE THING HE DIDN'T TELL US ONE THING ABOUT BEING IRISH, HE'D GET ABOUT BEING IRISH, HE'D GET DRUNK ON ST.

PATRICK'S DAY AND DRUNK ON ST.

PATRICK'S DAY AND BEAT US ALL UP.

BEAT US ALL UP.

I CONSIDERED THAT LIKE CRYSTAL I CONSIDERED THAT LIKE CRYSTAL KNACHT.

KNACHT.

WE ALL HAD TO HIDE ON WE ALL HAD TO HIDE ON ST.

PATRICK'S DAY.

ST.

PATRICK'S DAY.

I REMEMBER GOING AS A LITTLE BOY I REMEMBER GOING AS A LITTLE BOY TO MEET MY GRANDMOTHER AND TO MEET MY GRANDMOTHER AND GRANDFATHER.

GRANDFATHER.

MY MOTHER'S FIRST TIME SHE MET MY MOTHER'S FIRST TIME SHE MET THEM.

THEM.

AND ALL I REMEMBER IS MY UNCLES, AND ALL I REMEMBER IS MY UNCLES, MY HIDEOUS IRISH UNCLES.

MY HIDEOUS IRISH UNCLES.

IQS OF 85.

IQS OF 85.

YOU KNOW, SITTING THERE AND YOU KNOW, SITTING THERE AND GOING HOW ARE YOU, PAT?

Y'ALL GOING HOW ARE YOU, PAT?

Y'ALL WANTGRITS?

Y'ALL WANT TO EAT WANTGRITS?

Y'ALL WANT TO EAT SOME GRITS?

AND I REMEMBER MY SOME GRITS?

AND I REMEMBER MY MOTHER CRYING GOING UP THE MOTHER CRYING GOING UP THE STAIRS THAT THEY WERE ON HER STAIRS THAT THEY WERE ON HER ABOUT HER ACCENT.

ABOUT HER ACCENT.

WE NEVER WENT BACK THERE.

WE NEVER WENT BACK THERE.

MY GRANDPARENTS -- YOU KNOW, MY MY GRANDPARENTS -- YOU KNOW, MY GRANDFATHER WOULD SAY -- I ONLY GRANDFATHER WOULD SAY -- I ONLY REMEMBER MEETING HIM ONCE OVER.

REMEMBER MEETING HIM ONCE OVER.

HE SAID JAMES FENIMORE COOPER, HE SAID JAMES FENIMORE COOPER, READ JAMES FENIMORE COOPER, IT'S READ JAMES FENIMORE COOPER, IT'S ALL THERE.

ALL THERE.

RIGHT BEFORE DIED, HE'S 86 OR RIGHT BEFORE DIED, HE'S 86 OR SO.

SO.

I SAID GRANDPA, DID YOU EVER I SAID GRANDPA, DID YOU EVER READ MY BOOKS.

READ MY BOOKS.

MY GRAND FATHER SAID, "PAT, I MY GRAND FATHER SAID, "PAT, I DIDN'T NEED TO.

DIDN'T NEED TO.

I READ JAMES FENIMORE COOPER."

I READ JAMES FENIMORE COOPER."

[LAUGHTER] [LAUGHTER] AND SO THE IRISH -- I'M SURE MY AND SO THE IRISH -- I'M SURE MY DAD'S FAMILY IS GOING TO BE VERY DAD'S FAMILY IS GOING TO BE VERY ANGRY AT ME.

ANGRY AT ME.

BUT IT WAS ALWAYS -- AND IT BUT IT WAS ALWAYS -- AND IT WOULD BE DEBUNKING.

WOULD BE DEBUNKING.

YOU KNOW, WHEN I GET UP THERE, YOU KNOW, WHEN I GET UP THERE, IT WILL BE WHO DO YOU THINK YOU IT WILL BE WHO DO YOU THINK YOU ARE?

WHEN I GET UP THERE.

ARE?

WHEN I GET UP THERE.

AND IN THE SOUTH IT'S MY GOD, HE AND IN THE SOUTH IT'S MY GOD, HE LEARNED TO READ AND WRITE.

LEARNED TO READ AND WRITE.

HOW FABULOUS.

HOW FABULOUS.

>> YEAH.

>> YEAH.

>> BUT IT'S VERY DIFFERENT.

>> BUT IT'S VERY DIFFERENT.

>> IT IS DIFFERENT.

>> IT IS DIFFERENT.

I THINK THE GREATEST COMPLIMENT I THINK THE GREATEST COMPLIMENT THAT MY FAMILY COULD GIVE ANYONE THAT MY FAMILY COULD GIVE ANYONE WAS THAT HE OR SHE DIDN'T PUT ON WAS THAT HE OR SHE DIDN'T PUT ON ANY AIRS.

ANY AIRS.

>> WHAT IS THIS ALL ABOUT?

>> WHAT IS THIS ALL ABOUT?

>> I DON'T KNOW WHAT IT'S ABOUT.

>> I DON'T KNOW WHAT IT'S ABOUT.

IT'S SOMETHING ABOUT STAYING IT'S SOMETHING ABOUT STAYING DOWN, KEYING YOUR HEAD DOWN.

DOWN, KEYING YOUR HEAD DOWN.

>> -- KEEPING YOUR HEAD DOWN.

>> -- KEEPING YOUR HEAD DOWN.

>> IT GOT TO ALL OF US AND WE >> IT GOT TO ALL OF US AND WE DIDN'T KNOW HOW.

DIDN'T KNOW HOW.

IT CAME THROUGH THE BLOODSTREAM.

IT CAME THROUGH THE BLOODSTREAM.

OUR MEAN HUMOR CAME THROUGH THE OUR MEAN HUMOR CAME THROUGH THE BLOODSTREAM.

BLOODSTREAM.

NONE OF MY SONS IN LAW ARE LIKE NONE OF MY SONS IN LAW ARE LIKE THIS.

THIS.

WE SIMPLY DID THE KNOW WHERE IT WE SIMPLY DID THE KNOW WHERE IT CAME.

CAME.

IT WAS ONLY WHEN I STARTED IT WAS ONLY WHEN I STARTED WRITING THIS BOOK THAT I SAID WRITING THIS BOOK THAT I SAID THIS IRISH THING IS A STRONG AND THIS IRISH THING IS A STRONG AND POWERFUL CURRENT IN A HUMAN POWERFUL CURRENT IN A HUMAN LIFE.

LIFE.

AND I KNOW NOTHING ABOUT IT.

AND I KNOW NOTHING ABOUT IT.

>> WELL, ANOTHER BENEFIT MAYBE >> WELL, ANOTHER BENEFIT MAYBE FROM BEING IRISH I'D LIKE TO FROM BEING IRISH I'D LIKE TO THINK IS THAT YOU DO HAVE A THINK IS THAT YOU DO HAVE A LITERARY GIFT OR YEARNING TOWARD LITERARY GIFT OR YEARNING TOWARD YOU KNOW, POETIC, SEEING THINGS YOU KNOW, POETIC, SEEING THINGS IN A POETIC WAY.

IN A POETIC WAY.

I LOVE HOW YOU TALK ABOUT I LOVE HOW YOU TALK ABOUT LITERATURE IN THIS BOOK.

LITERATURE IN THIS BOOK.

AND IN YOUR AUTOBIOGRAPHY ABOUT AND IN YOUR AUTOBIOGRAPHY ABOUT READING LIFE.

READING LIFE.

AND THERE'S ONE PASSAGE THAT YOU AND THERE'S ONE PASSAGE THAT YOU WROTE ABOUT IN THAT OTHER MEMOIR WROTE ABOUT IN THAT OTHER MEMOIR WHERE YOU SAY THAT ONE THING WHERE YOU SAY THAT ONE THING THAT YOU LOVE ABOUT BOOKS IS THAT YOU LOVE ABOUT BOOKS IS THAT A GREAT WRITER CAN MAKE YOU THAT A GREAT WRITER CAN MAKE YOU STEP OUTSIDE YOURSELF.

STEP OUTSIDE YOURSELF.

AND THE PASSAGE STARTS HERE'S AND THE PASSAGE STARTS HERE'S WHAT I LOVE: WHEN A GREAT WHAT I LOVE: WHEN A GREAT WRITER TURNS ME INTO A. WRITER TURNS ME INTO A.

>> FROM CHICAGO, A LESBIAN OUT >> FROM CHICAGO, A LESBIAN OUT OF SOUTH CAROLINA, OR A BLACK OF SOUTH CAROLINA, OR A BLACK WOMAN MOVING INTO A SUBWAY WOMAN MOVING INTO A SUBWAY ENTRANCE IN HARLEM, TURN ME INTO ENTRANCE IN HARLEM, TURN ME INTO SOMETHING ELSE GREAT WRITERS OF SOMETHING ELSE GREAT WRITERS OF THE WORLD.

THE WORLD.

I'M COMPLETELY WITH YOU ON THAT I'M COMPLETELY WITH YOU ON THAT POWER OF LITERATURE.

POWER OF LITERATURE.

WE WALK IN SOMEONE ELSE'S SHOES.

WE WALK IN SOMEONE ELSE'S SHOES.

YET YOU MUST KNOW IN THESE DAYS YET YOU MUST KNOW IN THESE DAYS CERTAINLY IN ACADEMY, THERE'S A CERTAINLY IN ACADEMY, THERE'S A LOT OF CONVERSATION ABOUT, WELL, LOT OF CONVERSATION ABOUT, WELL, WRITING CAN BE A WINDOW, GREAT WRITING CAN BE A WINDOW, GREAT BOOKS CAN BE A WINDOW INTO BOOKS CAN BE A WINDOW INTO SOMEONE ELSE'S LIFE BUT THEY SOMEONE ELSE'S LIFE BUT THEY SHOULD ALSO BE MIRRORS, STUDENTS SHOULD ALSO BE MIRRORS, STUDENTS WANT TO SEE THEMSELVES MIRRORED WANT TO SEE THEMSELVES MIRRORED IN LITERATURE.

IN LITERATURE.

AND I WONDER WHAT YOU THINK AND I WONDER WHAT YOU THINK ABOUT THAT ARGUMENT, ESPECIALLY ABOUT THAT ARGUMENT, ESPECIALLY SINCE YOU'VE HAD THE EXPERIENCE SINCE YOU'VE HAD THE EXPERIENCE OF BEING A WHITE TEACHER IN A OF BEING A WHITE TEACHER IN A CLASSROOM FULL OF CLASSROOM FULL OF AFRICAN-AMERICAN KIDS.

AFRICAN-AMERICAN KIDS.

YOUNG IT WAS IMPORTANT FOR THEM YOUNG IT WAS IMPORTANT FOR THEM AT THE TIME THAT YOU WERE AT THE TIME THAT YOU WERE TEACHING TO READ BOOKS ABOUT TEACHING TO READ BOOKS ABOUT PEOPLE WHO LOOKED LIKE THEM?

OR PEOPLE WHO LOOKED LIKE THEM?

OR WOULD YOU STILL ARGUE FOR THE WOULD YOU STILL ARGUE FOR THE GREATER POWER OF BEING TAKEN OUT GREATER POWER OF BEING TAKEN OUT OF YOURSELF BY BOOKS.

OF YOURSELF BY BOOKS.

>> WELL, YOU KNOW, I DON'T GIVE >> WELL, YOU KNOW, I DON'T GIVE A CRAP ABOUT ANY OF THAT.

A CRAP ABOUT ANY OF THAT.

>> OKAY.

>> OKAY.

[LAUGHTER] [LAUGHTER] >> YOU'VE TOLD ME MORE ABOUT >> YOU'VE TOLD ME MORE ABOUT BEING IRISH TONIGHT THAN I'VE BEING IRISH TONIGHT THAN I'VE EVER READ.

EVER READ.

I GO WHERE -- I GO TO WHERE IT I GO WHERE -- I GO TO WHERE IT CHANGES MY LIFE.

CHANGES MY LIFE.

YOU KNOW, I WALK IN THE TOLSTOY, YOU KNOW, I WALK IN THE TOLSTOY, I'VE BEEN IN LOVE WITH ANNA I'VE BEEN IN LOVE WITH ANNA KARENINA ALL MY LIFE.

KARENINA ALL MY LIFE.

I'VE BEEN IN LOVE WITH ELIZABETH I'VE BEEN IN LOVE WITH ELIZABETH ARCHER FROM PORTRAIT OF THE ARCHER FROM PORTRAIT OF THE ARTIST.

ARTIST.

I HAVE LOVED MIDDLE MARCH AND I I HAVE LOVED MIDDLE MARCH AND I HAVE LOVED -- YOU KNOW, TAKE ALL HAVE LOVED -- YOU KNOW, TAKE ALL OF MIDDLE MARCH MAKE THEM BLACK, OF MIDDLE MARCH MAKE THEM BLACK, MAKE THEM JEWISH, MAKE THEM HER MAKE THEM JEWISH, MAKE THEM HER MAVERICK ROW INDICT.

MAVERICK ROW INDICT.

I DON'T CARE IF THEY HAVE I DON'T CARE IF THEY HAVE PENISES OR VAGINAS, I ADORE PENISES OR VAGINAS, I ADORE THEM.

THEM.

THAT'S WHAT LITERATURE IS FOR THAT'S WHAT LITERATURE IS FOR ME.

ME.

IF YOU'RE A YOUNG BLACK STUDENT IF YOU'RE A YOUNG BLACK STUDENT AND YOU NEED TO READ AND WRITE AND YOU NEED TO READ AND WRITE YOUNG BLACK PEOPLE, SHAME ON YOUNG BLACK PEOPLE, SHAME ON YOU.

YOU.

DO I NEED TO READ ABOUT ALL DO I NEED TO READ ABOUT ALL WHITE PEOPLE?

NO, I DON'T.

WHITE PEOPLE?

NO, I DON'T.

I CAN WRITE THE GREAT AFRICAN I CAN WRITE THE GREAT AFRICAN NOVELIST OR MIDDLE EASTERN NOVELIST OR MIDDLE EASTERN NOVELLIVES.

NOVELLIVES.

LOOK AT THE TIME I WAS RAISED.

LOOK AT THE TIME I WAS RAISED.

MOST RACIST HORRIBLE SOUTH.

MOST RACIST HORRIBLE SOUTH.

YOU'D HAVE HATED LOUISVILLE IF YOU'D HAVE HATED LOUISVILLE IF YOU'D COME AT THE TIME I WAS YOU'D COME AT THE TIME I WAS BORN.

BORN.

YOU'D HAVE HATED MY TOWN.

YOU'D HAVE HATED MY TOWN.

THE RACISM WAS UNBELIEVABLE.

THE RACISM WAS UNBELIEVABLE.

UNFORGIVABLE.

UNFORGIVABLE.

JIM CROW WAS AWFUL FROM JIM CROW WAS AWFUL FROM BEGINNING TO END.

BEGINNING TO END.

BUT LET ME PICK UP A BOOK.

BUT LET ME PICK UP A BOOK.

LET ME JUST PICK UP A BOOK.

LET ME JUST PICK UP A BOOK.

YOU CAN BE ANYBODY ON EARTH AND YOU CAN BE ANYBODY ON EARTH AND YOU CAN CHANGE MY WHOLE LIFE.

YOU CAN CHANGE MY WHOLE LIFE.

I DON'T CARE IF IT'S DON Q3 OAT, I DON'T CARE IF IT'S DON Q3 OAT, I DON'T CARE IF IT'S I DON'T CARE IF IT'S SHAKESPEARE.

SHAKESPEARE.

BUT THE TIME I GREW UP, LOOK AT BUT THE TIME I GREW UP, LOOK AT IT NOW, THERE WERE NO MANY WOMEN IT NOW, THERE WERE NO MANY WOMEN WRITERS WHEN I STARTED OUT.

WRITERS WHEN I STARTED OUT.

NONE.

NONE.

THERE WERE NO WOMEN WRITERS.

THERE WERE NO WOMEN WRITERS.

FEW WOMEN WRITERS, THEY WERE FEW WOMEN WRITERS, THEY WERE SWEPT THROUGH PUBLISHING.

SWEPT THROUGH PUBLISHING.

>> THEY WERE WRITING BUT THEY >> THEY WERE WRITING BUT THEY WEREN'T RECOGNIZED AS GREAT WEREN'T RECOGNIZED AS GREAT WRITERS.

WRITERS.

>> TEST TEST TEST TEST TEST WERE >> TEST TEST TEST TEST TEST WERE NOT EVEN -- NOT EVEN ON THE NOT EVEN -- NOT EVEN ON THE STAGE YET.

STAGE YET.

>> BUT YOU MAKE A GREAT CASE FOR >> BUT YOU MAKE A GREAT CASE FOR MARGARET MITCHELL, GONE WITH THE MARGARET MITCHELL, GONE WITH THE WIND.

WIND.

YOU SAY IT'S THE BOOK THAT MEAD YOU SAY IT'S THE BOOK THAT MEAD YOU WANT TO BECOME A WRITER.

YOU WANT TO BECOME A WRITER.

CHANGED YOUR LIFE.

CHANGED YOUR LIFE.

>> MY MOTHER READ IT TO ME WHEN >> MY MOTHER READ IT TO ME WHEN I WAS FIVE YEARS OLD, IT CHANGED I WAS FIVE YEARS OLD, IT CHANGED MY MOTHER'S WHOLE LIFE.

MY MOTHER'S WHOLE LIFE.

MY MOTHER WHO PRETENDED SHE WAS MY MOTHER WHO PRETENDED SHE WAS SCARLET O'HARA.

SCARLET O'HARA.

AND BY THE WAY, AT HER FUNERAL AND BY THE WAY, AT HER FUNERAL -- MY MOTHER IS CALLED PEGGY -- MY MOTHER IS CALLED PEGGY CONROY.

CONROY.

THE FUNERAL HER NEW HUSBAND AS THE FUNERAL HER NEW HUSBAND AS THEY SEE IS WHAT WE'RE PUTTING THEY SEE IS WHAT WE'RE PUTTING ON HER GRAVE.

ON HER GRAVE.

IT IS FRANCIS MARGARET CONROY.

IT IS FRANCIS MARGARET CONROY.

AND AND PEGGY.

I SAID HER NAME AND AND PEGGY.

I SAID HER NAME IS NOT MARGARET OR PEGGY.

IS NOT MARGARET OR PEGGY.

IT'S DOROTHY.

IT'S DOROTHY.

HE SAID I'M SORRY, PAT, YOU'RE HE SAID I'M SORRY, PAT, YOU'RE WRONG.

WRONG.

I WENT OVER THIS WITH YOUR I WENT OVER THIS WITH YOUR MOTHER.

MOTHER.

I SAID I DON'T CARE IF YOU WENT I SAID I DON'T CARE IF YOU WENT OVER IT WITH MY MOTHER OR NOT, OVER IT WITH MY MOTHER OR NOT, JOHN.

JOHN.

I KNOW MY MOTHER'S NAME.

I KNOW MY MOTHER'S NAME.

OKAY.

OKAY.

AND WE WERE BOTH CRYING.

AND WE WERE BOTH CRYING.

AND SO HE SAID THIS IS WHAT I'M AND SO HE SAID THIS IS WHAT I'M PUTTING ON, PAT.

PUTTING ON, PAT.

SO THIS FRANCIS M. PEGGY CONROY SO THIS FRANCIS M. PEGGY CONROY IS ON HER GRAVE.

IS ON HER GRAVE.

I FOUND OUT WHEN I WENT BACK I FOUND OUT WHEN I WENT BACK FROM AUNT HELEN AND AUNT EVELYN FROM AUNT HELEN AND AUNT EVELYN WHEN SHE READ GONE WITH THE WHEN SHE READ GONE WITH THE WIND, SHE IDENTIFIED SO MUCH WIND, SHE IDENTIFIED SO MUCH WITH SCARLET O'HARA AND SHE SAID WITH SCARLET O'HARA AND SHE SAID SHE WOULD NOT DIE STARVING LIKE SHE WOULD NOT DIE STARVING LIKE WE WERE IN THE DEPRESSION.

WE WERE IN THE DEPRESSION.

SHE WAS GOING TO BE LIKE SCARLET SHE WAS GOING TO BE LIKE SCARLET O'HARA AND THAT WAS GOING TO BE O'HARA AND THAT WAS GOING TO BE THE THEME OF HER LIFE.

THE THEME OF HER LIFE.

THE FIRST BOOK SHE EVER READ ME, THE FIRST BOOK SHE EVER READ ME, WHAT I DID NOT KNOW, SHE CHANGED WHAT I DID NOT KNOW, SHE CHANGED HER NAME TO FRANCIS MARGARET HER NAME TO FRANCIS MARGARET CONROY PEGGY AFTER PEGGY CONROY PEGGY AFTER PEGGY MITCHELL.

MITCHELL.

AND THAT IS HOW STRONG AND THAT IS HOW STRONG LITERATURE CAN.

LITERATURE CAN.

-- IS.

-- IS.

AND I SAID TOO BAD MOM DIDN'T AND I SAID TOO BAD MOM DIDN'T LOOK ULYSSES SO SHE COULD NAME LOOK ULYSSES SO SHE COULD NAME HERSELF MOLLY.

HERSELF MOLLY.

BUT THAT IS NOT WHAT HAPPENED TO BUT THAT IS NOT WHAT HAPPENED TO MY MOTHER OR HER HISTORY.

MY MOTHER OR HER HISTORY.

AND SHE WAS A POOR SOUTHERN AND SHE WAS A POOR SOUTHERN GIRL.

GIRL.

BUT THAT IS WHAT LITERATURE CAN BUT THAT IS WHAT LITERATURE CAN DO.

DO.

>> YOU SPEAK SO POWERFULLY TO >> YOU SPEAK SO POWERFULLY TO LITERATURE AND THE WAY IT CAN LITERATURE AND THE WAY IT CAN CHANGE PEOPLE.

CHANGE PEOPLE.

YOU DON'T HAVE SUCH GREAT THINGS YOU DON'T HAVE SUCH GREAT THINGS TO SAY, PAT, ABOUT BOOK CRITICS.

TO SAY, PAT, ABOUT BOOK CRITICS.

AND I WANTED TO ASK YOU ABOUT AND I WANTED TO ASK YOU ABOUT THAT.

THAT.

YOU SAY THAT YOU LAID A LOT OF YOU SAY THAT YOU LAID A LOT OF ROSES AT THE GRAVE OF THOMAS ROSES AT THE GRAVE OF THOMAS WOLFF BUT YOU HAVEN'T LAID ONE WOLFF BUT YOU HAVEN'T LAID ONE ROSE AT THE GRAVE OF A CRITIC.

ROSE AT THE GRAVE OF A CRITIC.

HAVEN'T WE BEEN GOOD TO YOU?

HAVEN'T WE BEEN GOOD TO YOU?

>> YOU KNOW, I'M LOOKING FORWARD >> YOU KNOW, I'M LOOKING FORWARD TO YOUR DEATH, MAUREEN.

TO YOUR DEATH, MAUREEN.

[LAUGHTER] [LAUGHTER] THERE ARE GOING TO BE MORE THERE ARE GOING TO BE MORE FLOWERS ON YOUR TOMBSTONE THAN FLOWERS ON YOUR TOMBSTONE THAN YOU CAN IMAGINE.

YOU CAN IMAGINE.

IT'S JUST BEING A BOOK REVIEWER IT'S JUST BEING A BOOK REVIEWER IS JUST A WAY OF MAKING A IS JUST A WAY OF MAKING A LIVING.

LIVING.

IT'S A WAY WE GET THROUGH IT.

IT'S A WAY WE GET THROUGH IT.

>> OH, MAN.

>> OH, MAN.

>> AND YOU'RE IN AGONY AND >> AND YOU'RE IN AGONY AND YOU'RE IN PAIN OVER THIS.

YOU'RE IN PAIN OVER THIS.

>> WHAT ABOUT EDMUND WILSON?

>> WHAT ABOUT EDMUND WILSON?

WERE IT NOT FOR EDMUND WILSON, WERE IT NOT FOR EDMUND WILSON, WE WOULDN'T HAVE HAD THE WE WOULDN'T HAVE HAD THE FITZGERALD REVIVAL?

DON'T FITZGERALD REVIVAL?

DON'T CRITICS SOMETIMES HELP US SEE CRITICS SOMETIMES HELP US SEE THE GLORIES OF WRITERS WHO WE THE GLORIES OF WRITERS WHO WE MAY NOT HAVE RECOGNIZED.

MAY NOT HAVE RECOGNIZED.

>> HERE'S WHAT I LOVE ABOUT >> HERE'S WHAT I LOVE ABOUT EDMUND WILSON: I FOLLOW HIS SEX EDMUND WILSON: I FOLLOW HIS SEX LIFE.

LIFE.

>> OH, WELL.

>> OH, WELL.

>> AND I ADMIRE THE WAY HE >> AND I ADMIRE THE WAY HE TREATED HIS WOMEN.

TREATED HIS WOMEN.

AND WHAT A MARVELOUS GUY.

AND WHAT A MARVELOUS GUY.

I THINK FEMINISM BEGAN WITH THAT I THINK FEMINISM BEGAN WITH THAT GUY AFTER I READ HIS THING.

GUY AFTER I READ HIS THING.

YOU KNOW, HE IS OKAY.

YOU KNOW, HE IS OKAY.

I READ AXE EL'S -- YEAH.

I READ AXE EL'S -- YEAH.

I READ IT AGAIN.

I READ IT AGAIN.

EH.

EH.

I READ IT THE FIRST TIME WHEN I I READ IT THE FIRST TIME WHEN I WAS IN COLLEGE.

WAS IN COLLEGE.

I THOUGHT IT WAS FABULOUS.

I THOUGHT IT WAS FABULOUS.

I READ IT AGAIN AND IT JUST I READ IT AGAIN AND IT JUST SEEMS OKAY, IT DATES TO FAST FOR SEEMS OKAY, IT DATES TO FAST FOR ME.

ME.

>> HIS NOVELS STINK.

>> HIS NOVELS STINK.

OKAY.

OKAY.

LET ME DO SAY THAT.

LET ME DO SAY THAT.

THEY'RE NOT ANY GOOD.

THEY'RE NOT ANY GOOD.

OKAY, NOW GO HEAD.

OKAY, NOW GO HEAD.

WELL, I WAS HAPPY TO SEE THAT ON WELL, I WAS HAPPY TO SEE THAT ON YOUR BLOG YOU WROTE A BEAUTIFUL YOUR BLOG YOU WROTE A BEAUTIFUL THING TO CHRISTOPHER HITCHENS.

THING TO CHRISTOPHER HITCHENS.

YOU SEEM TO APPRECIATE HIS YOU SEEM TO APPRECIATE HIS CRITICAL.

CRITICAL.

>> I'VE NEVER MET HIM.

>> I'VE NEVER MET HIM.

>> IT'S ONLY CRITICS YOU'VE >> IT'S ONLY CRITICS YOU'VE NEVER MET WHO YOU LIKE.

NEVER MET WHO YOU LIKE.

>> NOW, MAUREEN, YOU WILL BE >> NOW, MAUREEN, YOU WILL BE SAVAGE MATERIAL.

SAVAGE MATERIAL.

>> YES, I THINK SO.

>> YES, I THINK SO.

>> ONE OF THE THINGS I'VE ALWAYS >> ONE OF THE THINGS I'VE ALWAYS LIKED THAT GUY.

LIKED THAT GUY.

AND ALWAYS THOUGHT HE WAS A AND ALWAYS THOUGHT HE WAS A GREAT SPIRIT.

GREAT SPIRIT.

HOW MANY PEOPLE -- OKAY, NOW HOW MANY PEOPLE -- OKAY, NOW THIS IS -- NOW HERE'S A BRAVE THIS IS -- NOW HERE'S A BRAVE MAN TO ME.

MAN TO ME.

HOW MANY PEOPLE WOULD WRITE A HOW MANY PEOPLE WOULD WRITE A BOOK MAULING MOTHER TERESA.

BOOK MAULING MOTHER TERESA.

I MEAN, YOU'VE GOT TO BE A VERY I MEAN, YOU'VE GOT TO BE A VERY SPECIAL GUY.

SPECIAL GUY.

>> YOU KNOW WHAT I WANTED TO >> YOU KNOW WHAT I WANTED TO CALL THE BOOK THE FIRST TIME?

CALL THE BOOK THE FIRST TIME?

>> WHAT?

>> WHAT?

>> SACRED COW.

>> SACRED COW.

>> GOOD GOD.

>> GOOD GOD.

OH, MY GOD.

OH, MY GOD.

HE HAD NO SHAME.

HE HAD NO SHAME.

>> HOLY GOD ALMIGHTY.

>> HOLY GOD ALMIGHTY.

THIS IS -- I NEVER KNEW MY THIS IS -- I NEVER KNEW MY FATHER WROTE CRITICISM.

FATHER WROTE CRITICISM.

ARE YOU KIDDING?

ARE YOU KIDDING?

>> NOD KIDDING.

>> NOD KIDDING.

>> OH, MY GOD.

>> OH, MY GOD.

>> YOU'RE ALSO -- SEEMS LIKE >> YOU'RE ALSO -- SEEMS LIKE YOU'RE NOT THE GREATEST FAN OF YOU'RE NOT THE GREATEST FAN OF YOUR OWN KIND, FELLOW WRITERS.

YOUR OWN KIND, FELLOW WRITERS.

>> OH, THEY'RE HORRIBLE.

>> OH, THEY'RE HORRIBLE.

YOU KNOW, AND YOU'VE MET THEM, YOU KNOW, AND YOU'VE MET THEM, PLEASE.

PLEASE.

>> PRESENT COMPANY EXCEPTED.

>> PRESENT COMPANY EXCEPTED.

>> NO, NO, YOU DON'T HAVE TO DO >> NO, NO, YOU DON'T HAVE TO DO THAT.

THAT.

WE'RE MONSTERS.

WE'RE MONSTERS.

>> YOU TELL HYSTERICAL STORIES >> YOU TELL HYSTERICAL STORIES ABOUT YOUR FIRST WRITERS ABOUT YOUR FIRST WRITERS CONFERENCE AND MEETING AUDREY CONFERENCE AND MEETING AUDREY AND RICH.

AND RICH.

>> OH, SHE WAS HORRIBLE ARE >> OH, SHE WAS HORRIBLE ARE HORRIBLE.

HORRIBLE.

>> SHE KICKED YOU AND THE OTHER >> SHE KICKED YOU AND THE OTHER MEN OUT.

MEN OUT.

>> HERE IT IS.

>> HERE IT IS.

BECAUSE OF ADRIAN RICH.

BECAUSE OF ADRIAN RICH.

THERE'S A TIME OF FEMINISM.

THERE'S A TIME OF FEMINISM.

1976.

1976.

>> AND WE SHOULD SAY YOU >> AND WE SHOULD SAY YOU IDENTIFY AS A FEMINIST.

IDENTIFY AS A FEMINIST.

>> YES, I DO.

>> YES, I DO.

>> THE FIRST SOUTHERN MALE EVER >> THE FIRST SOUTHERN MALE EVER IDENTIFIED AS A FEMINIST.

IDENTIFIED AS A FEMINIST.

I SUFFERED OUTRAGEOUS SLAYINGS I SUFFERED OUTRAGEOUS SLAYINGS BECAUSE OF THAT.

BECAUSE OF THAT.

YOU KNOW?

HE SAYS HE'S A YOU KNOW?

HE SAYS HE'S A FEMINIST MY GOD.

FEMINIST MY GOD.

YOU KNOW, THIS IS -- YOU KNOW, YOU KNOW, THIS IS -- YOU KNOW, THAT MACHO MONSTER THAT -- AND THAT MACHO MONSTER THAT -- AND YOU KNOW, BUT I WENT TO THE YOU KNOW, BUT I WENT TO THE WRITER'S CONFERENCE, MY FIRST WRITER'S CONFERENCE, MY FIRST ONE.

ONE.

I WAS EXCITED.

I WAS EXCITED.

GREAT WRITERS WERE THERE.

GREAT WRITERS WERE THERE.

ALICE WALKER WAS THERE.

ALICE WALKER WAS THERE.

WE'D NEVER -- SHE WAS HORRIBLE.

WE'D NEVER -- SHE WAS HORRIBLE.

TELL ME A BETTER TITLE THAN TELL ME A BETTER TITLE THAN DIVING INTO THE WRECK.

DIVING INTO THE WRECK.

I THOUGHT THAT'S WHAT I MUST DO I THOUGHT THAT'S WHAT I MUST DO AS A FICTION WRITER, MUST DIVE AS A FICTION WRITER, MUST DIVE INTO THE WRECK INTO THE WRECK SO I WENT OUT TO GET COFFEE FOR SO I WENT OUT TO GET COFFEE FOR THESE WOMEN WRITERS I KNEW IN THESE WOMEN WRITERS I KNEW IN ATLANTA.

ATLANTA.

AND IT TOOK A WHILE.

AND IT TOOK A WHILE.

IT JUST TOOK A WHILE?

SO I GO IT JUST TOOK A WHILE?

SO I GO BACK IN I HAVE 8 CUPS OF COFFEE, BACK IN I HAVE 8 CUPS OF COFFEE, SPILLING ON MY HANDS, LOOKING SPILLING ON MY HANDS, LOOKING DOWN, WALKING IN.

DOWN, WALKING IN.

I HEAR A HISSING BEGIN.

I HEAR A HISSING BEGIN.

IT GETS LOUDER, BESTY SCOTT IT GETS LOUDER, BESTY SCOTT COMES RUNNING UP, SAYS ADRIAN COMES RUNNING UP, SAYS ADRIAN HAS KICKED ALL THE MEN OUT OF HAS KICKED ALL THE MEN OUT OF HER CONFERENCE.

HER CONFERENCE.

I LOOK UP AND 150 WOMEN ARE I LOOK UP AND 150 WOMEN ARE STANDING UP HISSING MY POOR FAT STANDING UP HISSING MY POOR FAT BEHIND I'M LOOKING AROUND AND I BEHIND I'M LOOKING AROUND AND I RUN -- I RACE OUT OF THERE.

RUN -- I RACE OUT OF THERE.

I LOOK AT WRITERS SINCE THEN.

I LOOK AT WRITERS SINCE THEN.

I LOVE THEM.

I LOVE THEM.

I WANT TO FALL IN LOVE WITH I WANT TO FALL IN LOVE WITH WRITERS I LOVE.

WRITERS I LOVE.

IT'S A NECESSITY FOR ME, A IT'S A NECESSITY FOR ME, A WEAKNESS OF MINE.

WEAKNESS OF MINE.

YOU CAN LOOK.

YOU CAN LOOK.

YOU'VE GOT THAT WAY.

YOU'VE GOT THAT WAY.

YOU'VE DEVELOPED THAT CRITICAL YOU'VE DEVELOPED THAT CRITICAL THING.

THING.

>> NO, I WANT TO BE A FAN.

>> NO, I WANT TO BE A FAN.

I WANT TO WORSHIP.

I WANT TO WORSHIP.

>> I DO TOO.

>> I DO TOO.

I JUST CAN'T DO IT.

I JUST CAN'T DO IT.

THE WRITERS I'VE MET ARE ALL THE WRITERS I'VE MET ARE ALL KINDS.

KINDS.

AND SOME OF THEM ARE JUST AND SOME OF THEM ARE JUST MONSTERS.

MONSTERS.

AND I DON'T LIKE THAT.

AND I DON'T LIKE THAT.

>> WHO ARE YOU LIKED?

WHO HAVE >> WHO ARE YOU LIKED?

WHO HAVE YOU PERSONALLY LIKED.

YOU PERSONALLY LIKED.

>> OKAY, I'VE GOT FRIENDS.

>> OKAY, I'VE GOT FRIENDS.

THESE ARE MY FRIENDS.

THESE ARE MY FRIENDS.

THEY GET MAN IF I DON'T MENTION THEY GET MAN IF I DON'T MENTION THEM.

THEM.

AN CITIES, TERRY J., ALL THE AN CITIES, TERRY J., ALL THE GUYS I GREW UP WITH.

GUYS I GREW UP WITH.

I DO THAT.

I DO THAT.

LET'S SEE WHO HAVE I MET THAT I LET'S SEE WHO HAVE I MET THAT I REALLY LIKED.

REALLY LIKED.

HMM.

HMM.

I REALLY, REALLY LIKED.

I REALLY, REALLY LIKED.

HMM.

HMM.

THERE'S A GUY NAMED RON RASH THERE'S A GUY NAMED RON RASH THAT I ADORE.

THAT I ADORE.

HE'S A MOUNTAIN MAN WHO SAYS HE'S A MOUNTAIN MAN WHO SAYS NOTHING.

NOTHING.

MY WIFE CASSANDRA KING.

MY WIFE CASSANDRA KING.

>> YOU'RE MARRIED TO A WRITER.

>> YOU'RE MARRIED TO A WRITER.

>> I'M MARRIED TO HER BUT THAT >> I'M MARRIED TO HER BUT THAT DOESN'T MEAN I LIKE HER.

DOESN'T MEAN I LIKE HER.

OKAY.

OKAY.

BUT YOU KNOW, SHE IS -- SHE'S A BUT YOU KNOW, SHE IS -- SHE'S A QUIET PERSON.

QUIET PERSON.

QUIETEST PERSON I EVER MET.

QUIETEST PERSON I EVER MET.

SHE DOESN'T SAY A WORD.

SHE DOESN'T SAY A WORD.

BUT SHE'S VERY, VERY NICE.

BUT SHE'S VERY, VERY NICE.

IN THIS WAY.

IN THIS WAY.

MOSTLY O ANN PATCHETT, I MET HER MOSTLY O ANN PATCHETT, I MET HER LAST NIGHT.

LAST NIGHT.

BEAUTIFUL.

BEAUTIFUL.

LOVELY.

LOVELY.

ETHEREAL, THROUGH AND LIKE YOU ETHEREAL, THROUGH AND LIKE YOU ASK ME QUESTIONS AND -- ASK ME QUESTIONS AND -- INTELLECTUAL.

INTELLECTUAL.

AND SHE'S LIKE THIS.

AND SHE'S LIKE THIS.

AND I FELT LIKE A BUGGER ON AND I FELT LIKE A BUGGER ON STABLE WITH HER.

STABLE WITH HER.

SHE IS JUST -- SO SHE'S VERY SHE IS JUST -- SO SHE'S VERY NICE.

NICE.

AND I ALWAYS LOOK FOR THAT AND I ALWAYS LOOK FOR THAT MAUREEN.

MAUREEN.

JUST ONE THING.

JUST ONE THING.

OR SOMEBODY THAT WILL TELL ME OR SOMEBODY THAT WILL TELL ME SOMETHING ABOUT THE IRISH, SOMETHING ABOUT THE IRISH, SOMEBODY THAT WILL REVEAL SOMEBODY THAT WILL REVEAL SOMETHING TO ME I ALWAYS SOMETHING TO ME I ALWAYS TREASURE.

TREASURE.

>> WHEN I BEGAN READING THE >> WHEN I BEGAN READING THE DEATH OF SANTINI AND I GOT TO DEATH OF SANTINI AND I GOT TO THE END OF THE PROLOGUE THAT YOU THE END OF THE PROLOGUE THAT YOU WRITE HERE, I ACTUALLY, I WRITE HERE, I ACTUALLY, I STOPPED FOR A MINUTE, IRY READ STOPPED FOR A MINUTE, IRY READ IT AND THEN I STOPPED READING IT AND THEN I STOPPED READING FOR A WHILE BECAUSE I THINK THE FOR A WHILE BECAUSE I THINK THE END OF YOUR PROLOGUE IS SO END OF YOUR PROLOGUE IS SO POWERFUL.

POWERFUL.

AND YOU TALK ABOUT THE REASON AND YOU TALK ABOUT THE REASON WHY YOU'RE GOING BACK TO THIS WHY YOU'RE GOING BACK TO THIS STORY.

STORY.

IT ALMOST SOUNDS A LITTLE BIT IT ALMOST SOUNDS A LITTLE BIT LIKE IT'S THERAPEUTIC FOR YOU TO LIKE IT'S THERAPEUTIC FOR YOU TO KEEP COMING BACK TO THIS STORY.

KEEP COMING BACK TO THIS STORY.

AND, AGAIN, TRYING TO FIGURE OUT AND, AGAIN, TRYING TO FIGURE OUT YOUR PARENTS AND WHERE YOU ARE YOUR PARENTS AND WHERE YOU ARE IN THE WHOLE FAMILY ROMANCE.

IN THE WHOLE FAMILY ROMANCE.

>> I'D BE DELIGHTED.

>> I'D BE DELIGHTED.

WHERE DID YOU SAY THIS THING WHERE DID YOU SAY THIS THING WAS?

WAS?

>> HERE IT IS, THEY MARKED IT.

>> HERE IT IS, THEY MARKED IT.

[CLEARING THROAT] [CLEARING THROAT] >> MOM AND DAD.

>> MOM AND DAD.

I NEED TO GO BACK THERE ONCE I NEED TO GO BACK THERE ONCE AGAIN.

AGAIN.

I'VE GOT TO TRY TO MAKE SENSE OF I'VE GOT TO TRY TO MAKE SENSE OF IT ONE LAST TIME.

IT ONE LAST TIME.

A FINAL CIRCLING OF THE BLOCK.

A FINAL CIRCLING OF THE BLOCK.

A RECKONING.

A RECKONING.

ANOTHER DIVE INTO THE CAVES OF ANOTHER DIVE INTO THE CAVES OF THE CORAL REEF FOR THE MORAY THE CORAL REEF FOR THE MORAY WAIT IN AMBUSH.

WAIT IN AMBUSH.

ONE MORE NIGHT IN THE IMMORTAL ONE MORE NIGHT IN THE IMMORTAL DARKNESS TO STUDY THE HOUSE OF DARKNESS TO STUDY THE HOUSE OF PAIN A FINAL TIME.

PAIN A FINAL TIME.

THEN I'LL BE FINISHED WITH YOU.

THEN I'LL BE FINISHED WITH YOU.

MOM AND DAD.

MOM AND DAD.

I'LL LEAVE YOU IN PEACE AND NOT I'LL LEAVE YOU IN PEACE AND NOT BOTHER YOU AGAIN.

BOTHER YOU AGAIN.

AND I'LL PRAY YOUR STORMY AND I'LL PRAY YOUR STORMY SPIRITS FIND PEACE IN THE HOUSE SPIRITS FIND PEACE IN THE HOUSE OF THE LORD.

OF THE LORD.

BUT I MUST EXAMINE THE WRECK AND BUT I MUST EXAMINE THE WRECK AND ONE LAST TIME.

ONE LAST TIME.

[APPLAUSE] [APPLAUSE] >> HONESTLY, WHAT I THOUGHT, >> HONESTLY, WHAT I THOUGHT, PAT, WHEN I READ THAT THE FIRST PAT, WHEN I READ THAT THE FIRST TIME, IS KNOWING HOW YOUR OTHER TIME, IS KNOWING HOW YOUR OTHER BOOKS OFTEN STIRRED YOU UP OR BOOKS OFTEN STIRRED YOU UP OR ELSE MADE YOU VERY DEPRESSED, IN ELSE MADE YOU VERY DEPRESSED, IN THE ACT OF WRITING THEM, I THE ACT OF WRITING THEM, I REALLY FELT LIKE WELL, I HOPE REALLY FELT LIKE WELL, I HOPE THIS BOOK DOES IT FOR YOU.

THIS BOOK DOES IT FOR YOU.

I HOPE -- I HOPE IT LAYS TO REST I HOPE -- I HOPE IT LAYS TO REST SOME OF THE DEMONS AND I HOPE IT SOME OF THE DEMONS AND I HOPE IT HAS DONE THAT.

HAS DONE THAT.

THANK YOU SO MUCH.

HAS DONE THAT.

>> THANK YOU, MAUREEN.