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TED: COMING UP IN THE NEXT HOUR OF LOCAL NEWS ON ARIZONA PBS.

ON "ARIZONA HORIZON," THE JOURNALISTS' ROUNDTABLE LOOKS AT AMONG OTHER THINGS THE RELENTLESS INTRIGUE OVER THE SENATE RECOUNT OF MARICOPA COUNTY VOTES.

>>> ON CRONKITE NEWS, THE PUSH IN ARIZONA TO PRESIDENT BIDEN'S INFRASTRUCTURE PLAN.

>>> AND ON "BREAK IT DOWN," THE CONTROVERSY SURROUNDING UNPAID INTERNSHIPS, COMING UP IN THE NEXT HOUR, ON ARIZONA PBS.

>> THIS HOUR OF LOCAL NEWS IS MADE POSSIBLE BY CONTRIBUTIONS FROM THE FRIENDS OF PBS, MEMBERS OF YOUR PBS STATION.

THANK YOU.

TED: GOOD EVENING, AND WELCOME TO "ARIZONA HORIZON."

I'M TED SIMONS.

FALLOUT OVER GOVERNOR DUCEY'S DEMAND THAT TWO ARIZONA SCHOOL DISTRICTS RESCIND THEIR COVID QUARANTINE POLICIES.

THE PEORIA AND CATALINA FOOTHILLS DISTRICTS WOULD UNVACCINATED STUDENTS EXPOSED TO COVID-19 TO BE SUBJECT TO QUARANTINE, BUT THE GOVERNOR SAYS THAT THOSE POLICIES ARE DISCRIMINATORY AND THAT THEY BREAK STATE LAW.

THE DISTRICT'S COUNTER THAT THE POLICIES ARE IN FULL COMPLIANCE WITH THE LAW BECAUSE THEY DO NOT MANDATE MASKS OR VACCINATIONS.

ARIZONA SCHOOL BOARD ASSOCIATION CALLED THE GOVERNOR'S DIRECTIVE, QUOTE, NONSENSICAL.

>>> THIS AS ARIZONA TODAY REPORTED OVER 1200 NEW CASES OF COVID-19.

THAT MAKES FOR A SEVEN-DAY AVERAGE OF 898 CASES, THAT'S AS HIGH AS IT'S BEEN SINCE MID-MARCH.

THERE WERE 17 COVID-RELATED FATALITIES REPORTED TODAY WHICH PUTS THE SEVEN-DAY DEATH RATE THE SEVENTH HIGHEST IN THE COUNTRY.

OFFICIALS SAY THE SPREAD OF THE DELTA VARIANT AND LAGGING VACCINATION RATES ARE TO BLAME.

>>> OTHER NEWS, THE DACA PROGRAM WAS PUT ON HOLD BY A FEDERAL JUDGE IN TEXAS.

THE JUDGE RULED THAT FORMER PRESIDENT OBAMA DID NOT HAVE THE AUTHORITY TO CREATE THE PROGRAM WHICH PROTECTS IMMIGRANTS BROUGHT TO THE U.S. AS CHILDREN FROM BEING DEPORTED.

AS SUCH, THE JUDGE RULED THAT THE BIDEN ADMINISTRATION MUST STOP APPROVING NEW DACA APPLICATIONS.

THE JUDGE SPECIFIED THAT THE DECISION DOES NOT AFFECT CURRENT RECIPIENTS FOR NOW.

>>> COUNTY ELECTION OFFICIALS IN ARIZONA HAVE IDENTIFIED FEWER THAN 200 CASES OF POTENTIAL VOTER FRAUD IN LAST YEAR'S ELECTION, OUT MORE THAN 3 MILLION VOTES CAST.

THE ASSOCIATED PRESS REPORTS OF THE CASES OF POTENTIAL FRAUD SO FAR.

ONLY FOUR LED TO CHARGES.

NO ONE HAS BEEN CONVICTED AND NO PERSON'S VOTE WAS COUNTED TWICE.

THIS INFORMATION RUNS COUNTER TO CLAIMS BY DONALD TRUMP AND ALLIES OF WIDESPREAD VOTER FRAUD AND COINCIDES WITH PREVIOUS STUDIES THAT SHOW THAT VOTER FRAUD IS EXTREMELY RARE.

>>> GOVERNOR DUCEY DECLARED A STATE OF EMERGENCY FOR COCONINO COUNTY GOING THROUGH EXTREME POST WILDFIRE FLOODING.

THE EMERGENCY DECLARATION MAKES UP TO $200,000 AVAILABLE FOR RESPONSE EFFORTS.

>>> AND THE PHOENIX SUNS ARENA HAS A NEW NAME, THE FOOTPRINT CENTER.

A GILBERT-BASED CONSUMER-PACKAGING COMPANY.

NO WORD ON THE FINANCIAL ASPECTS OF A LONG-TERM NAMING RIGHTS DEAL.

FOOTPRINT WILL HAVE NAMING RIGHTS OF THE HOME STADIUM OF A SPANISH SOCCER LEAGUE TEAM CO-OWNED BY SUNS OWNER ROBERT SARVER.

>>> TIME FOR THIS WEEK'S JOURNALISTS' ROUNDTABLE, AND FOR A LOOK AT GOVERNOR'S FIGHT WITH SCHOOL DISTRICTS ON COVID PROTECTION AND THE LATEST ON SENATE RECOUNT OF MARICOPA COUNTY BALLOTS, WE WELCOME JEREMY DUDA OF THE "ARIZONA MIRROR" AND LUIGE DEL PUERTO OF THE "ARIZONA CAPITOL TIMES."

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR JOINING THE JOURNALISTS' ROUNDTABLE.

LET'S GET THINGS STARTED AND JEREMY, WE START WITH YOU AND START WITH THE GOVERNOR TELLING A COUPLE OF SCHOOL DISTRICTS IN ARIZONA, DON'T DO THIS AS FAR AS COVID MITIGATION BUT THEY'RE SAYING WHAT WE'RE DOING IS NOT AGAINST THE LAW.

>> WE HAD LEGISLATION PASSED AS PART OF THE BUDGET THAT REQUIRE SCHOOL DISTRICTS THAT STUDENTS WEAR MASKS OR VACCINATIONS FOR COVID-19.

THE TWO SCHOOL DISTRICTS IN PEORIA AND CATALINA FOOTHILLS ARE NOT REQUIRING EITHER OF THOSE THINGS.

WHAT THEY'RE REQUIRING IS STUDENTS, UNVACCINATED STUDENTS EXPOSED TO COVID QUARANTINE FOR TEN DAYS.

THE GOVERNOR'S EDUCATION ADVISER SAID YOU ARE NOT ALLOWED TO DO THIS UNDER THE LAW.

THEY RESPONDED AND SAID THAT'S NOT AGAINST THAT LAW.

THE LAW DOES NOT PROHIBIT QUARANTINES FOR THAT, AND THESE ARE THE RECOMMENDATIONS OF THE DEPARTMENT OF HEALTH SERVICES, THEY'RE FOLLOWING.

THAT KIND OF A CONFUSING THING WHERE ONE AGENCY, THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE IS TELLING THEM ONE THING, HEALTH OFFICE TELLING THEM ANOTHER.

ALL WHILE WE HAVE AN UPTICK OF CASES IN THE STATE.

THE GOVERNOR SENDING THE WHITE HOUSE LETTERS DEMANDING THEY KEEP ORDER RESTRICTIONS IN PLACE SO MIGRANTS WITH COVID CAN'T GET IN.

TED: SOUNDS LIKE, LUIGE, THE DISTRICT IS SAYING, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT SCHOOL DISTRICT HEALTH POLICY A AND B, IT'S NOT EXACTLY THE LAW.

>> THE LAW SAYS YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO LET STUDENTS, WHETHER VACCINATED OR UNVACCINATED INTO THE CLASSROOM SO THEY CAN HAVE IN-PERSON INSTRUCTION.

IF YOU ARE A STUDENT AND NOT VACCINATED AND EXPOSED TO COVID-19, YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO DO A 10-DAY QUARANTINE, DOESN'T EXACTLY MATCH.

UNDERSTAND, THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE IS COMING DOWN WITH A HAMMER, SAYING NO, YOU CAN'T DO THIS.

JEREMY MIGHT BE CORRECT, THERE IS CONFUSION HERE.

AT THE END OF THE DAY, THE GOVERNOR GETS WHAT HE WANTS.

WE HAVEN'T LIFTED THE EMERGENCY MISTAKE AND JEREMY, HAVE WE RECEIVED THE EMERGENCY -- TED: NOT THE ORIGINAL EMERGENCY.

>> THE EXECUTIVE ORDERS.

>> RIGHT, THAT MEANS IF WE'RE STILL UNDER AN EMERGENCY, THE GOVERNOR CAN DO AN EXECUTIVE ORDER, IF FOR EXAMPLE, THERE IS SOME RESISTANCE ON THE PART OF THE SCHOOL DISTRICT.

I DON'T SEE THE SCHOOL DISTRICTS WINNING THIS FIGHT, AND I THINK THE GOVERNOR SAID THAT THEY'RE SUPPOSED TO DO THIS.

THEY EITHER DO IT OR SOMETHING ELSE IS GOING TO COME DOWN TO FORCE THEM TO DO IT.

TED: JEREMY, DO YOU SEE THE GOVERNOR GOING THAT FAR ON SOMETHING LIKE THIS, ESPECIALLY WITH AN UPTICK IN CASES?

>> HE MAY WELL.

THEY PUBLICIZED IT, THEY TWEETED OUT THE TWO LETTERS, WANTED TO MAKE SURE EVERYONE SAW IT, RESTRICTIONS HAVE BEEN ROLLED BACK.

THE GOVERNOR APPROVED RESTRICTIONS ON POWERS OF PEOPLE TO REQUIRE PRIVATE BUSINESSES TO MAKE PEOPLE WEAR MASKS.

SINCE LAST YEAR, SINCE PEOPLE HAVE BEEN GETTING VACCINATED, CASES HAVE BEEN GOING HARD THE OTHER WAY IN TERMS OF OPENING UP AND NOT IMPOSING NEW RESTRICTIONS.

HE MAY WELL WANT TO GO TO THE MAT ON THIS.

>> I THINK HE WILL.

THE REASON FOR THAT IS -- THE GOVERNOR IS ADAMANT THAT THE SCHOOL DISTRICTS MUST NOT IMPOSE ANY KIND OF A POLICY THAT WOULD LEAD TO STUDENT MISSING INSTRUCTION IN PERSON, OR OTHERWISE, AND I THINK WHAT YOU'RE GOING TO SEE HAPPEN IS THE SCHOOL DISTRICTS DON'T COMPLY, YOU'RE GOING TO SEE AN EXECUTIVE ORDER FROM THE GOVERNOR, JUST SAYING YOU GOT TO DO THIS AND, OF COURSE, THAT'S ONE THING THE SCHOOL DISTRICTS ARE FORCED TO COMPLY.

TED: JEREMY, A JUDGE RULES THAT THE SENATE ON THE SENATE RECOUNT AS FAR AS INFORMATION BETWEEN THE SENATE AND THE CYBER NINJAS AND ALL POINTS IN BETWEEN, THAT THIS IS PUBLIC RECORDS LAW, THE PUBLIC RECORDS LAW APPLIES HERE.

TALK ABOUT THE RULING AND WHAT IT MEANS AS FAR AS THIS NEVER-ENDING RECOUNT?

>> THE WORDS A LOT OF US HAVE BEEN WAITING TO HEAR, WE ALL HAD PUBLIC RECORDS REQUESTS REJECTED UNDER THE SAME GROUNDS OF AMERICAN OVERSIGHT, A DEM-LEANING NONPROFIT.

STARTED TO GO AFTER THE TRUMP ADMINISTRATION WHEN HE WAS IN OFFICE.

THEY PUT IN A REQUEST FOR A LOT OF RECORDS THAT THE REST OF US HAVE ESPECIALLY WHO IS PAYING?

THE SENATE IS PAYING 150,000, OTHER PEOPLE ARE PAYING POTENTIALLY MILLIONS.

WE DON'T KNOW WHO'S PAYING.

IF THERE'S CONTRACTS OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT.

CYBER NINJAS AND SUBCONTRACTORS, THERE ARE AGENTS BUT JUST BECAUSE OF THAT DOES NOT MAKE IT A PUBLIC RECORD.

THIS JUDGE VERY MUCH DISAGREED AND SAID THIS IS A SUBSTANTIAL NEXUS, THAT THESE RECORDS HAVE A PUBLIC BUSINESS.

THE FACT THEY'RE NOT IN THE HANDS OF THE SENATE IS PRETTY MUCH IRRELEVANT, AND THAT WOULD LEAD TO AN ABSURD RESULT THAT PEOPLE SIDE STEP PUBLIC RECORDS LAW ALTOGETHER AND SAID SOMETHING TO THE EFFECT, I CANNOT THINK OF A MORE COMPELLING EXAMPLE OF SOMETHING THAT REQUIRES PUBLIC DISCLOSURE.

THIS IS PART OF THE SENATE'S REJECTION ON MOTION TO DISMISS THE CASE.

THEY SAID HEY, THIS WASN'T AN ORDER, AND IF THERE IS AN ORDER, WE'RE GOING TO APPEAL.

THIS CASE IS FAR FROM OVER.

TED: LUIGE, THE JUDGE SEEMED TO SAY, YOU MAY NOT HAVE THE RECORDS BUT BEST GET THEM BECAUSE THEY ARE PUBLIC RECORDS, IT IS PUBLIC INFORMATION, IT'S GOT TO GET OUT THERE.

>> THIS RULING IS CONSISTENT INSOFAR AS WHAT WE KNOW ABOUT PUBLIC RECORDS.

A PUBLIC RECORD HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE MEDIUM, IT CAN BE STORED IN E-MAIL, ELECTRONIC, IN A TEXT, [INDISCERNIBLE] THE GOVERNOR SAID ALL DOCUMENTS AND COMMUNICATIONS RELATING TO THE PLANNING AND EXECUTION OR THE AUDIT, ALL POLICIES AND PROCEDURES USED BY THE SENATE DEFENDANTS OF ALL RECORDS DISCLOSING SPECIFICALLY WHO IS PAYING FOR IT, THE LEGISLATIVE ACTIVITY, GOVERNMENT ACTIVITY AS MUCH AS THEY PAID TO THE PUBLIC RECORDS CLAUSE.

TED: WHAT'S NEXT IN HERE?

>> I IMAGINE THERE WILL BE AN OFFICIAL RULING IN THIS CASE, ORDERING WHAT AMERICAN OVERSIGHT WANTS IS FOR THE SENATE TO TURN OVER THE RECORDS AND SENATE'S ATTORNEYS MADE IT CLEAR THEY'RE GOING TO APPEAL.

READING WHAT WAS WRITTEN YESTERDAY, NOT SURE I SEE DAYLIGHT FOR AN APPEAL.

THIS IS AS ADAMANT AS A JUDGE CAN GET, THIS IS A PUBLIC RECORD AND TRIED TO CHASTISE THEM IT WASN'T, WE MAY SEE THE CASE DRAG ON FOR A WHILE.

I GOT A LOT OF RECORDS REQUESTS.

>> IT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE FOR THE ARGUMENT TO SAY THAT IT'S A GOVERNMENT ACTIVITY, IT'S PAID FOR BY GOVERNMENTS, BUT WE'RE GOING TO GIVE IT TO A THIRD PARTY AND WE DON'T HAVE PHYSICAL CUSTODY OF THE RECORDS ANYMORE, AND THEREFORE THEY'RE OUTSIDE OF THE PURVIEW OF PUBLIC RECORDS LOST.

AGAIN, THAT'S -- THAT'S NOT THE WAY WE'VE INTERPRETED PUBLIC RECORDS LOST, AND YOU KNOW, I THINK THE JUDGE IS EXACTLY RIGHT ON THIS POINT.

>> SEEMS LIKE IT WOULD CREATE A GAPING LOOPHOLE.

TED: ALARMING.

>> THAT THE STATES WANT TO HIDE SOMETHING FROM THE PUBLIC.

TED: JEREMY, THE RULING CAME DOWN WITHIN THE HOUR OF A START OF A SENATE, THEY CALLED IT A HEARING BUT TWO SENATORS PRESENT, AND THE WHOLE LOT OF FOLKS INVOLVED WITH THE RECOUNT, WHAT HAVE YOU GOING ON HERE AT THE COLISEUM, THE FAIRGROUNDS, WHEREVER IT'S HAPPENING.

WHAT DID WE LEARN FROM THIS QUOTE, UNQUOTE HEARING?

>> WE LEARNED A LOT.

THE BIGGEST THING WE LEARNED IS THE AUDTHEY THE WAS SUPPOSED TO BE DONE IN MAY IS A MONTH FROM BEING DONE.

WE'RE GOING TO SEE PROBABLY MORE SUBPOENAS FOR STUFF THE SENATE ASKED FOR, THE COUNTY HASN'T TURNED OVER.

ROUTERS THAT COMPROMISE PRIVATE INFORMATION, LOT OF THINGS FOR THE SENATE TO COMPLETE THE INQUIRY, AND THAT MAY END UP IN COURT, THE ISSUE WITH THE ROUTER.

WE LEARNED THAT CYBER NINJAS, DOUG LOGAN, THE HEAD NINJA ITSELF WANTS TO REVIVE A PLAN THEY PREVIOUSLY CANCELLED TO GO LITERALLY KNOCKING ON VOTERS' DOORS TO CHECK TO MAKE SURE THAT THE PEOPLE LISTED AS VOTING IN THE OFFICIAL RECORD DID CAST BALLOTS, WHICH RAISE A LOT OF CONCERNS WITH THE DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE, WITH A LOT OF FOLKS DOWN HERE BY POTENTIAL VOTER INTIMIDATION.

YOU MAY NOT WANT THE CYBER NINJAS ASKING IF YOU VOTED, AND I WOULD EXPECT WE MIGHT SEE LITIGATION FROM THE DEPARTMENT OF JUSTICE ON THAT.

WE ALSO LEARNED THAT DEPENDING ON WHO YOU ASK, THESE FOLKS MIGHT NOT UNDERSTAND ELECTION PROCEDURES SO WELL.

DOUG LOGAN CLAIMED THEY FOUND ABOUT 74,000 EARLY BALLOTS THAT WERE CAST, MORE OR 74,000 MORE VOTES OF EARLY BALLOTS THAT WERE CAST AND COUNTED THAT WERE SENT OUT AND THE COUNTY SAID YOU ARE INCOMPETENT, YOU DON'T UNDERSTAND ELECTION PROCEDURE BECAUSE NOT ALL EARLY BALLOTS THAT ARE CAST ARE MAILED OUT.

2,000 WERE CAST AT EARLY VOTING CENTERS AND THOSE ARE PRINTED ON DEMAND.

TED: MARICOPA COUNTY WAS FOLLOWING THIS AND DOUG LOGAN, HEAD NINJA, SAID IT WAS MADE MORE COMPLICATED, THEIR JOB MORE COMPLICATED AND DIFFICULTY BECAUSE OF MARICOPA COUNTY'S RECALCITRANCE AND SAID THAT'S LIKE ASKING DOUG LOGAN TO PLAY POINT GUARD FOR THE SUNS.

THAT WOULD BE COMPLICATED AND DIFFICULT AS WELL BECAUSE HE'S NOT QUALIFIED FOR IT.

ANY OF THIS RINGING TRUE.

>> THE POINT OF VIEW OF THE COUNTY IS, FIRST, WE NEED TO PROTECT THE SANCTITY OF THE BALLOTS, YOU DON'T WANT TO GIVE UP THE RECORDS BECAUSE THESE ARE BALLOTS AND THE CHAIN OF CUSTODY HAS TO BE PRECISELY SECURED.

ON THE OTHER HAND, YOU KNOW, PART OF THE CYBER NINJAS, THEY'VE BEEN WANTING THE RECORDS BECAUSE I THINK THEY WENT INTO THE AUDIT VERY CLEARLY WITH A CASE IN PROOF.

THEY HAVE A CONCLUSION SET, JUST TRYING TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO PROVE THE CONCLUSION THEY ALREADY HAVE.

I DO WANT TO SAY THAT THE SENATE'S AUTHORITY TO SUBPOENA SHOWN IN COURT CASES IS PRETTY MUCH OBSOLETE.

I DON'T SEE THE COUNTY WINNING A COURT CASE WHICH IT WOULD RECEIVE A SUBPOENA FROM THE SENATE.

THEY TRIED THAT ONE BEFORE, AND HAD BEEN PREVIOUS CASES AS WELL WHICH OTHER ENTITIES, WE BROUGHT THE SUBPOENA FROM THE LEGISLATURE AND THEY JUST LOST EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM.

TED: BEFORE WE CLOSE OUT ON THAT PARTICULAR ASPECT, JEREMY, SENATE PRESIDENT KAREN FANN SAID THIS WAS NOT ABOUT TRUMP, NOT ABOUT OVERTURNING THE ELECTION, THEY MADE IT VERY CLEAR AT THE START OF THE HEARING.

ANYONE BUYING THAT?

>> IF SHE THINKS IT'S NOT ABOUT TRUMP, SHE MIGHT BE THE ONLY ONE.

ONE THING ABOUT THE AUDIT THAT CRITICS AND SUPPORTERS AGREE ON.

THIS IS ALL ABOUT TRUMP AND THE COMPLETELY BASELESS AND DEBUNK CLAIMS THAT THE 2020 ELECTION WAS RIGGED AGAINST HIM.

WE SAW PEOPLE OF SENATOR FANN'S CAUCUS SAYING WE NEED A NEW PRESIDENTIAL ELECTION BECAUSE THE ELECTORS WERE FRAUDULENTLY APOINT.

TRUMP LOOMS OVER EVERYTHING, AND TRUMP VERY MUCH THINKS THIS IS ABOUT HIM.

HE'S PUTTING OUT STATEMENTS ABOUT HOW THIS SHOWS HE REALLY WON ARIZONA.

HE WON MARICOPA COUNTY.

>> ONE THING ABOUT WENDY RODGERS SAYING DECERTIFY THE 2020 ELECTION.

SHE WON THAT RACE.

I'M NOT SURE IF SHE'S MEANING DECERTIFY HER ELECTION.

>> I WOULDN'T THINK SO, BUT UNDER THE U.S. CONSTITUTION, I DON'T THINK THERE'S A WAY TO PULL BACK OUR ELECTORS.

TED: BEFORE WE GO.

WE GOT TO TALK ABOUT THE COUNTY BOARD OF SUPERVISORS VOTING FOR A NEW BUNCH OF MACHINES BECAUSE THE OLD MACHINES FONDLED BY GOODNESS KNOWS WHO AT THE FAIRGROUNDS, 3 MILLION BUCKS, HUH?

>> 2.8, BUT WHO'S COUNTING?

THAT'S A LOT OF MONEY.

345 COUNTERS.

NINE CENTRAL COUNT TABLARITIES FROM THE MAIN BUILDING.

DOMINION, WHICH MAKES THE MACHINES THE SECRETARY OF STATE'S OFFICE AND THE COUNTY AGREE BECAUSE OF THE UNAUTHORIZED AND UNACCREDITED PEOPLE FROM THE AUDIT TEAM ACCESSED THE MACHINES THAT MADE DIGITAL COPIES AND MAY HAVE TAKEN THEM INTO THE WOODS IN MONTANA, THE COUNTY DECOMMISSIONED THEM.

THEY APPROVED THE LEASE FOR THE NEW MACHINES AND THE SENATE IS ON THE HOOK.

THEY HAVE AN INDEMNIFICATION AGREEMENT WITH THE COUNTY, ANY EQUIPMENT OR MATERIALS THAT ARE DAMAGED OR HAVE TO BE TAKEN OUT OF SERVICE, THE SENATE'S GOING TO PAY, AND YOU SAY KAREN FANN AND SENATOR WARN PIERCE WERE ON THE ISSUE, HEY, IN YOUR PROFESSIONAL OPINION, THAT'S NOT REQUIRED, IS IT?

NO, OF COURSE NOT.

I CAN DEFINITELY SEE LITIGATION.

TED: WRAP IT UP, ARE WE GOING TO SEE LEGAL ACTION HERE?

>> I THINK WE WILL.

I WANT TO LEAVE WITH YOU WHAT COUNTY SUPERVISOR JACK SELLER SAID, YOU ARE IN THE HOPE THEY PAY OFF THE WRECKED CAR, PLUS YOU NEED A NEW CAR, THAT'S WHAT WE'RE DOING WITH THE AMENDMENT.

TED: LUIGE DEL PUERTO, ARIZONA CAPITOL TIMES AND JEREMY DUDA, THE "ARIZONA MIRROR."

APPRECIATE IT.

>> THANK YOU.

>> THANKS FOR HAVING US.

TED: COMING UP, A CELEBRATION OF ARIZONA'S ROLE IN SPACE EXPLORATION.

.

TED: ARIZONA HAS LONG BEEN AT THE FOREFRONT OF NASMATIONS AND SPACE EXPLORATION.

THE ARIZONA HISTORICAL SOCIETY IS CELEBRATING WITH AN EXHIBIT TITLED READY TO LAUNCH, ARIZONA'S PLACE IN SPACE.

WE LEARN MORE FROM THE MUSEUM'S CURATOR, SHANNON FLEISCHMAN.

WELCOME TO "ARIZONA HORIZON."

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR BEING HERE.

WE'RE TALKING ARIZONA AND ITS PLACE IN SPACE.

WHAT IS ARIZONA'S PLACE IN SPACE?

>> WELL, YOU KNOW, NOT THAT MANY PEOPLE KNOW ARIZONA'S ROLE IN SPACE EXPLORATION IN HISTORY, AND ALL OF THE BIG NAMES, FLORIDA, HOUSTON, WE HAVE A PROBLEM, PEOPLE KNOW THOSE TWO LOCATION, BUT YOU KNOW, ARIZONA TRAINED ALL THE APOLLO ASTRONAUTS, WE DISCOVERED PLUTO.

THERE'S A LOT OF SPACE HISTORY THAT'S HAPPENED IN OUR STATE.

TED: CAPTURING THE FIRST IMAGE OF A BLACKHOLE, ARIZONA SCIENTISTS WERE INVOLVED IN THAT, TRUE?

>> VERY TRUE AND WE HAVE THE GUINNESS BOOK OF WORLD RECORDS FOR THE MOST DETAILED IMAGE FOR AN OBJECT IN NEAR ORBIT SPACE.

TED: WOW, LOTS OF STUFF GOING ON HERE.

HOW DO YOU COMBINE IT ALL AND PRESENT IT IN AN EXHIBIT THAT THE CASUAL PERSON, NOT THE NASA SCIENTIST, BUT THE CASUAL PERSON CAN WALK IN AND SAY THAT'S COOL?

>> WELL, LUCKILY I'M NOT A NASA SCIENTIST, I'M A HISTORIAN, I COME FROM IT WITH A SIMILAR BACKGROUND, JUST BEING FASCINATED WITH THE NIGHT SKY, AND I GREW UP GOING TO THE OBSERVATORY FOR THE FIELD TRIPS IN ELEMENTARY SCHOOL, I GREW UP GOING TO METEOR CRATER, I KIND OF HAVE ALWAYS HAD THIS SPARK OF CURIOSITY AND SO I'M HOPING THAT VISITORS BRING THAT SAME KIND OF CURIOSITY AND INTEREST, AND SO I FEEL LIKE I'M APPROACHING IT FROM THE SAME LEVEL THAT ANY VISITOR WOULD BE COMING INTO THE MUSEUM WITH.

GOING FROM THAT, I WANT TO BE SURE TO HIT THE HIGHLIGHTS OF ARIZONA'S IMPORTANCE IN STATE HISTORY AND TO GIVE AN OVERVIEW WHERE ANY VISITOR THAT'S MORE EXCITED, WE HAVE QR CODES, MORE INFORMATION THAT IS AVAILABLE TO THEM, BUT REALLY THIS EXHIBIT IS MEANT TO PIQUE THE INTEREST AND SHOW YOU KIND OF THE BREATH OF ARIZONA SPACE HISTORY.

TED: WITH THAT IN MIND, TALK ABOUT MULTIPLE MISSIONS TO MARS, ARIZONA INVOLVED IN SO MANY OF THOSE.

HOW DEEP DO YOU GO?

HOW SCIENTIFIC DO YOU GET?

>> TO BE HONEST, MOST OF THE LABELS AND PHOTOGRAPHS ARE NOT SCIENTIFIC WHERE THE AVERAGE VISITOR OR EVEN MIDDLE SCHOOL OR ELEMENTARY SCHOOL CHILD WOULDN'T FIND THEM ACCESSIBLE.

WE MADE SURE THE READING WAS UNDERSTANDABLE, ALL OF THE PHOTOS WERE BIG AND VISUAL SO ANYBODY COULD SEE THEM AND MAKE SURE ANY VISITOR COULD APPROACH THIS EXHIBIT, BUT HOW DEEPLY WE GO?

DEEP INTO THE BLACKHOLE WITH ALL OF OUR QR CODES AND ADDITIONAL RESOURCES THAT WE HAVE, BUT WE DO HAVE A BIG MARS CURIOSITY SELFIE PHOTO, WHY NOT PUT THE FIRST SELFIE IN SPACE IN EXHIBIT.

TED: WHY NOT?

I KNOW YOU HAVE SOME SPACE SUITS AS WELL, AND DID I READ CORRECTLY A HAND-DRAWN MOON MAP?

WHAT'S THAT ALL ABOUT?

>> YEAH, YOU READ QUICKLY, FROM LOWELL'S OBSERVATORY, HOW INFLUENTIAL THEY WERE IN THE MOON MISSIONS, THEY WOULD HAND DRAW MOON MAPS LOOKING FROM THE TELESCOPES, TURN THEM INTO GLOBES AND THE MAPS WERE USED TO PICK THE LANDING SPOTS FOR THE APOLLO SITES.

WE'RE LUCKY ENOUGH TO HAVE ONE OF THE HAND-DRAWN MAPS AS WELL AS ONE OF THE AIRBRUSH FOUNTAIN PENS USED TO DO THAT.

TED: SOUNDS VERY COOL.

A BIG DEAL OF EXHIBITS IS ACQUIRING THE THINGS THAT NEED TO MAKE THE EXHIBIT SHINE.

WHEN IT COMES TO GOING TO NASA, GOING TO ASU AND U OF A, LOWELL OBSERVATORY.

HOW DO YOU PROCURE THIS KIND OF STUFF?

>> I'M A BIG PROPONENT THEY CAN ONLY SAY NO, BUT THEY CAN'T SAY NO IF YOU DON'T ASK.

I WAS LUCKY, I SENT OUT E-MAILS AND TOLD THEM MY BACKGROUND WHICH I SPOKE TO YOU ABOUT PREVIOUSLY AND JUST SAYING WE WANTED TO HIGHLIGHT ALL OF THE EXCELLENT RESEARCH AND EXPLORATION GOING ON IN ARIZONA, AND WE'RE LUCKY THAT THE INSTITUTIONS REALLY WANT TO PARTICIPATE, AND THEY'RE EXCITED TO GET THEIR NAME OUT BECAUSE WHILE WE KNOW AND ARE EXCITED ABOUT, YOU KNOW, OSIRIS-REx AND THE PSYCHE MISSIONS, NATIONALLY THEY ARE NOT WELL KNOWN, NASA IS HAVING IMAGES LIKE THE ONE BEHIND ME THAT ARE GORGEOUS BUT NOT MAKING THE FRONT PAGE OF THE NEWSPAPERS LIKE THEY DID IN THE 50s AND 60s LIKE THEY USED TO.

WE WANTED TO MAKE SURE WE WERE GETTING THEIR PROGRAMS, THE RECOGNITION THEY DESERVE BECAUSE ARIZONA DESERVES THE RECOGNITION AND THE INSTITUTIONS HAVE A LARGE PART TO DO WITH IT.

TED: A GOOD SELLING POINT.

YOU MENTIONED QR CODES, HOW INTERACTIVE IS THE EXHIBIT?

>> IT'S FAIRLY ACCESSIBLE.

QR CODES, YOU NO LONGER NEED A QR READER FOR ANY SMARTPHONE, YOU OPEN THE CAMERA AND IT WILL LOAD TO THE WEB PAGES THAT WE HAVE FOR THE SPECIFIC MISSIONS THAT ARE IN THE EXHIBIT, AND THEN WE DO HAVE SOME INTERACTIVE ELEMENTS OUTSIDE THE EXHIBIT.

L ROCK FROM ASU 3-D-PRINTED MOON CRATER PUZZLES THAT YOU CAN USE AND PLAY WITH FOR KIDS.

THERE'S A BUNCH OF STICKERS AND ACTIVITIES FOR KIDS OUTSIDE THE EXHIBIT, BUT REALLY WE'RE ASKING YOU TO READ THE PANELS, LOOK AT THE OBJECTS, AND USE YOUR IMAGINATION ON WHERE ARIZONA SHOULD GO NEXT IN SPACE.

TED: AND HOW LONG IS THE EXHIBIT UP FOR?

>> THE EXHIBIT RUNS THROUGH NOVEMBER 30 OF THIS YEAR.

JUST AFTER THANKSGIVING WEEKEND.

TED: WE TALK ABOUT THE ARIZONA HISTORICAL SOCIETY.

THIS IS THE ARIZONA HISTORY MUSEUM, THIS IS IN TUCSON, CORRECT?

>> CORRECT, RIGHT NEXT TO U OF A'S CAMPUS, RIGHT ON SECOND STREET.

TED: BEFORE WE LET YOU GO, AND THANKS FOR YOUR TIME, APPRECIATE IT.

WHAT KIND OF RESPONSE HAVE YOU HAD?

>> WE'VE HAD AN OUTSTANDING RESPONSE.

HOW CAN YOU NOT WHEN YOU HAVE BUZZ ALDRIN'S SPACE SUIT AND MARK KELLY'S SPACE SUIT, THEY ARE TELLING THEIR FRIENDS AND WE'RE GETTING PEOPLE EXCITED ABOUT ARIZONA'S PLACE IN SPACE, SO WE HOPE THAT YOU COME IN AND SEE THAT AS WELL.

TED: ALL RIGHT, SOUNDS LIKE A LOT OF FUN, SHANNON FLEISCHMAN, ARIZONA HISTORICAL SOCIETY.

THANK YOU SO MUCH, APPRECIATE IT.

>> YEAH, THANK YOU SO MUCH.

.

TED: AND THAT IS IT FOR NOW.

I'M TED SIMONS.

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR JOINING US.

YOU HAVE A GREAT WEEKEND.

COMING UP IN THE NEXT HALF HOUR OF LOCAL NEWS ON ARIZONA PBS.

ON CRONKITE NEWS, RECENT RAINS MEAN FIRE RESTRICTIONS ARE LIFTING ACROSS THE STATE.

AND ON "BREAK IT DOWN," THE BENEFITS AND CHALLENGES OF SERVING AN INTERNSHIP.