>> LAURA PASKUS: THIS WEEK ON NEW MEXICO IN FOCUS... NEW CONTEXT FOR QUESTIONS FROM AN ADVOCATE AND A MOTHER AFTER THE GOVERNOR CLOSED A TASK FORCE TO ADDRESS THE CRISIS OF MISSING AND MURDERED INDIGENOUS WOMEN AND RELATIVES.

>> WE HAVE TO SUPPORT ONE ANOTHER, BECAUSE NO ONE ELSE IS THERE TO SUPPORT ONE ANOTHER >> LAURA: WE EXPLORES WHY RIVERS DON'T HAVE LEGAL RIGHTS TO THEIR OWN WATERS.

NEW MEXICO IN FOCUS STARTS NOW.

>> LAURA PASKUS: THANKS FOR JOINING US THIS WEEK.

I'M SENIOR PRODUCER LAURA PASKUS.

COVID, R-S-V, AND FLU CASES ARE ON THE RISE IN NEW MEXICO...AND HERE AT NM PBS, STAFF HAVE BEEN HIT BY THE VIRUSES, TOO.

THAT MEANS INSTEAD OF AIRING A NEW SHOW...WITH SENIOR PRODUCER LOU DIVIZIO HERE IN THE SEAT, I'M REVISITING SOME PAST STORIES.

OF COURSE, WHEN IT COMES TO THESE VIRUSES, THERE'S A LOT WE CAN DO TO SLOW THEIR SPREAD.

MASKING IS STILL A GOOD IDEA.

STAY HOME IF YOU ARE SICK.

AND IF YOU STILL NEED YOUR BOOSTERS, VISIT VACCINE DOT D-O-H DOT N-M DOT G-O-V TO FIND OUT WHERE TO DO THAT.

LAST FALL, GOVERNOR MICHELLE LUJAN GRISHAM SHUT DOWN THE STATE'S MISSING AND MURDERED INDIGENOUS WOMEN AND RELATIVES TASK FORCE.

FORMER TASK FORCE MEMBERS AND FAMILIES OF THOSE MURDERED OR MISSING WERE OUTRAGED.

IN THE SECOND HALF OF TODAY'S SHOW, WE RE- AIR A CONVERSATION NEW MEXICO IN DEPTH REPORTER BELLA DAVIS HAD IN NOVEMBER.

AT THE TIME, SHE TALKED WITH A MEMBER OF THE DISBANDED TASK FORCE, AND A MOTHER WHOSE SON WAS MURDERED THREE YEARS AGO.

SINCE THAT INTERVIEW, THE GOVERNOR'S CONTROVERSIAL CHOICE TO LEAD THE STATE INDIAN AFFAIRS DEPARTMENT HAS STEPPED DOWN.

AND IN ABOUT 20 MINUTES, WE PARSE THROUGH OLD NEWSPAPERS AND BROADCAST CLIPS TO BRING YOU ALONG ON THE ALBUQUERQUE MUSEUM'S EXHIBIT, "NEWS FOR THE PEOPLE."

YOU'LL HEAR FROM A CURATOR ABOUT SOME OF THE TRAILBLAZERS OF THE 1970S AND A RETIRED REPORTER WHO TALKS ABOUT HOW JOURNALISM HAS CHANGED IN THE 50 YEARS SINCE SHE FIRST WORKED AT THE ALBUQUERQUE JOURNAL.

IN NEW MEXICO, RIVERS LACK RIGHTS TO THEIR OWN WATERS.

THAT MEANS WHEN DRY TIMES STRIKE - AS THEY DO -- OR PEOPLE ARE UNWILLING TO SHARE - RIVERS RUN DRY.

LATER IN THE SHOW, I EXPLORE THAT ISSUE WITH AN ADOCATE WHO HAS SOME GOOD IDEAS FOR HOW LAWMAKERS CAN PROTECT THE STATE'S RIVERS.

BUT FIRST, AUTHOR REBECCA CLARREN TALK ABOUT HER NEW BOOK.

"THE COST OF FREE LAND: JEWS, LAKOTA, AND AN AMERICAN INHERITANCE."

IN THE LATE 19TH CENTURY, CLARREN'S ANCESTORS FLED ANTISEMITISM IN RUSSIA.

WHEN THEY GOT TO AMERICA, HER JEWISH RELATIVES BOUGHT LAND THAT THE U-S GOVERNMENT HAD STOLEN FROM THE LAKOTA PEOPLE.

HERE, WE TALK ABOUT HOW CLARREN EXPLORED HISTORY IN HER BOOK...AND ACTS OF RECONCILIATION AND REPATRIATION WITH HER FAMILY AND JEWISH COMMUNITY.

>> LAURA: REBECCA CLARREN, I AM SO HAPPY TO HAVE YOU HERE TODAY.

>> CLARREN: IT'S AMAZING TO BE HERE.

THANKS FOR HAVING ME.

>> LAURA: YOUR NEW BOOK THE COST OF FREE LAND INTERWEAVES THE HISTORY OF YOUR ANCESTORS, JEWISH IMMIGRANTS WHO WERE FLEEING ANTI-SEMITISM IN RUSSIA AT THE TURN OF THE 20TH CENTURY AND THE HISTORY OF THE LAKOTA PEOPLE, WHOSE LANDS WERE TAKEN AWAY BY THE U.S. GOVERNMENT.

I HAVE SO MANY QUESTIONS FOR YOU BUT I WANTED TO START WITH WHAT DID THIS PROJECT START AS AND WHERE DID IT TAKE YOU?

>> CLARREN: IN A WAY THIS PROJECT STARTED IN THE EARLY DAYS OF MY JOURNALISM CAREER, WHICH WAS 23 YEARS AGO, 22 YEARS AGO.

I WAS A STAFFER AT HIGH COUNTRY NEWS.

I WAS A YOUNG STAFFER THERE AND IT WAS MY FIRST REPORTING ASSIGNMENT WHERE I GOT TO LEAVE THE OFFICE AND NOT JUST REPORT OVER THE PHONE AND I WENT UP TO THE PINE -- IT WAS ONE OF MY FIRST, I DON'T KNOW IF IT WAS MY VERY FIRST, BUT IT WAS ONE OF THE FIRST TIMES I WAS ON THE ROAD.

AND I WENT UP TO THE PINE RIDGE RESERVATION.

I GOT TO DRIVE THE COMPANY CAR.

WE DIDN'T HAVE CELL PHONES BACK THEN.

WE HAD LIKE BURNER PHONES WITH US LIKE WE WERE DRUG DEALERS.

AND I WAS -- THE BOOK OPENS WITH THIS BUT I WAS IN THE CAR WITH A LAKOTA MAN WHO IS A BUFFALO RANCHER AND TRYING TO MAKE FRIENDS WITH HIM AND I WAS VERY UNCOMFORTABLE AND I DIDN'T KNOW WHAT I WAS DOING.

I TRIED TO BE PALS BY TELLING HIM, OH, MY FAMILY USED TO BE RANCHERS IN SOUTH DAKOTA.

WE WERE HOMESTEADERS, THINKING THIS WOULD MAKE HIM LIKE ME.

BUT HE WAS POLITE AND A BIT COLD AND IT TOOK ME AN EMBARRASSING LONG TIME TO REALIZE WHAT IMMEDIATELY WHAT THAT WOULD HAVE MEANT TO HIM.

WHICH MEANT, WELL, YOUR FAMILY GOT LAND THAT WAS TAKEN INCREDIBLY UNFAIRLY FROM MY ANCESTORS BY THE U.S. GOVERNMENT, BREAKING TREATIES THAT WERE SIGNED BETWEEN MY NATION AND THE UNITED STATES.

AND SO THAT IS WHERE THIS, IN A WAY, THAT IS THE BEGINNING OF THIS STORY AND I HAVE WRITTEN -- I SPENT MY WHOLE CAREER WRITING ABOUT THE AMERICAN WEST, BASICALLY, MOST FOR NATIONAL MAGAZINES.

I DID WRITE A ONE-OFF NOVEL A FEW YEARS AGO BUT THAT ALSO WAS CONCERNED WITH PEOPLE AND PLACES THAT ARE THE AMERICAN WEST.

AND A FEW YEARS AGO I WROTE -- I WAS HIRED BY AN INVESTIGATIVE NONPROFIT TO WRITE A SERIES OF STORIES ABOUT NATIVE NATIONS AND NATIVE CITIZENS AND IT WAS REALLY WHEN I WAS ABLE TO REALLY LIKE JUST WRITE ONLY ABOUT NATIVE COMMUNITIES INTENSELY FOR A FEW YEARS THAT I REALIZED, OH, I AM SO UNCOMFORTABLE PRETENDING, AS A JOURNALIST, THAT I AM AN UNBIASED OBSERVER TO THIS HISTORY AND LEGACY OF THESE FEDERAL POLICIES THAT ARE NOW PLAYING OUT ACROSS INDIAN COUNTRY IN AMERICA.

BECAUSE I HAVE CLEARLY BENEFITED AS A DESCENDENT OF HOMESTEADERS FROM POLICIES THAT CAUSED GREAT HARM TO NATIVE PEOPLE.

>> LAURA: AS THE GREAT GRANDDAUGHTER OF HOMESTEADERS YOU WRITE ABOUT HOW THE LAND WAS TAKEN AWAY FROM THE LAKOTA.

HOW THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT DIDN'T JUST MURDER PEOPLE, STEAL AND ABUSE CHILDREN, BREAK TREATIES, AND SO MUCH MORE, THEY ALSO SWINDLED INDIGENOUS PEOPLE OUT OF THEIR LAND AND OUT OF THE PAYMENTS THAT WERE SUPPOSED TO BE HELD IN TRUST.

AND YET WHITE HOMESTEADERS INCLUDING YOUR FAMILY WERE ABLE TO LEVERAGE LAND INTO CAPITAL AND WEALTH.

CAN YOU TALK ABOUT WHY IT IS SO IMPORTANT FOR US TO CONTINUE RECKONING WITH THIS 100 YEARS LATER?

>> CLARREN: I LOVE THAT QUESTION BECAUSE TO ME IT IS AT THE HEART OF THIS BOOK TO SAY THIS ISN'T HISTORY.

THIS ISN'T SOMETHING THAT HAPPENED IN THE PAST.

AND THAT WE HAVE MOVED ON FROM.

I THINK A LOT OF THE WAYS, AT LEAST THE WAY I WAS BROUGHT UP, I HAD AN EXCELLENT EDUCATION, AND YET THE WAY I LEARNED THIS HISTORY WAS VERY MUCH THIS HAPPENED A LONG TIME AGO.

AND I FEEL VERY MUCH, ESPECIALLY AFTER LEARNING FROM LAKOTA ELDERS AND STUDYING WITH JEWISH LEADERS THAT, SO, THERE IS SORT OF THIS CULTURAL, A DIFFERENT CULTURAL IDEA OF TIME, BUT ALSO IT IS JUST WHAT IS SO TRUE, IS THAT THE PAST, I THINK, FAULKNER SAID IT, THE PAST ISN'T PASSED.

IT IS STILL HAPPENING.

AND IN A WAY, AND I WRITE THIS IN THE BOOK, I FEEL LIKE THE PAST IS LOOPED TO THIS CONTEMPORARY MOMENT LIKE THREADS THROUGH A SEAM.

TO ME THAT WAS WHAT WAS SO IMPORTANT ABOUT THIS HISTORY, THAT IT IS HAPPENING RIGHT NOW.

AND I USED THE WAY THAT MY FAMILY WAS ABLE TO MONETIZE OUR LAND TO DEMONSTRATE IN REALLY STARK ECONOMIC TERMS, THIS IS WHAT THIS LAND IN SOME WAYS HAS DONE FOR ME AND WHAT IT HADN'T DONE FOR LAKOTA PEOPLE BECAUSE, TO EXPLAIN, I PULLED EVERY SINGLE DEED ON THE LANDS MY FAMILY HAD.

THERE WERE SIX -- MY GREAT GRANDPARENTS WERE HOMESTEADERS.

MY GREAT, GREAT GRANDPARENTS WERE HOMESTEADERS AND FIVE OF MY AUNTS AND UNCLES AND THEIR HUSBANDS AND WIVES WERE ALSO HOMESTEADERS.

AND THEY OVER AND OVER AGAIN WOULD TAKE OUT A MORTGAGE ON THE LAND.

YOU SEE -- AND I WAS ABLE BECAUSE OF LIKE ORIGINAL FAMILY DOCUMENTS, LETTERS, JOURNALS, NEWSPAPER CLIPPINGS THAT I FOUND FROM OLD PAPERS AND THEN THESE DOCUMENTS FROM THE DEEDS OFFICE, THESE MORTGAGE PAYMENTS, I COULD SEE THIS TIMELINE THAT THEY WOULD TAKE OUT A MORTGAGE ON VALUE OF THEIR LAND AND THEN THEY WOULD MOVE.

OR THEY WOULD START A NEW BUSINESS THAT WAS NOT CONTINGENT ON WEATHER.

MY FAMILY GOT INTO THE SALOON BUSINESS.

IT WAS MORE STEADY IN NORTH DAKOTA THAN FARMING AND RANCHING.

SO YOU JUST SEE THESE LITTLE BITS OF MONEY, RELATIVELY LITTLE BITS OF MONEY, OVER TIME IS REALLY WHAT BUILDS THE PATHWAY FOR THEM TO BECOME MIDDLE CLASS AND BEYOND.

AT THE SAME TIME THAT THAT IS HAPPENING, THE LAKOTA, AS YOU SAID, ARE NOT ALLOWED, MOST OF THEM, TO MANAGE THEIR OWN MONEY.

THEIR MONEY IS HELD IN TRUST BY THESE RESERVATION SORT OF FEDERAL APPOINTED MAYOR'S OF THE RESERVATION AND THEY WERE CALLED SUPERINTENDENTS OR INDIAN AGENTS.

AND OFTEN THEY WEREN'T RECEIVING THEIR MONEY FOR A LONG TIME.

THERE IS DOCUMENTS OF PEOPLE DYING OF STARVATION WHILE THEY ARE WAITING TO GET THEIR MONEY AND PAYMENTS OFF THE VALUE OF THEIR LAND THAT THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT IS SUPPOSEDLY KEEPING IN TRUST FOR THEM AND KEEPING TRACK OF.

AND SO YOU SEE THE DISPARITY.

THIS IS NOT WHERE MY OWN PERSONAL FAMILY, THEN, COMPLETELY CROSS- SECTS WITH COLLECTIVE HISTORY AND COLLECTIVE EFFORT.

SOCIOLOGISTS AT THIS POINT TODAY HAVE CONNECTED A PERSON'S ABILITY TO OWN A SECOND HOME, TO PAY FOR COLLEGE, TO HAVE WEALTH, TO THE HOMESTEAD ACT.

THE HOMESTEAD ACT, LEGAL SCHOLARS HAVE CALLED THIS A MASSIVE AFFIRMATIVE ACTION FOR WHITE PEOPLE, THE HOMESTEAD ACT WAS.

AND THERE IS SOMETHING LIKE 25% OF AMERICANS LIVING TODAY, ADULT AMERICANS, DESCEND FROM HOMESTEADERS.

>> LAURA: THE SECOND CHAPTER OF YOUR BOOK IS TITLED THE HOLOCAUST AT HOME AND THE USE OF THAT WORD IS CLEARLY DELIBERATE COMING FROM A JEWISH WRITER.

WHY IS IT IMPORTANT FOR US TO USE THAT WORD?

>> CLARREN: SO, WHEN I WAS A KID I WAS OBSESSED WITH THE HOLOCAUST AND NOW I HAVE A KID WHO IS OBSESSED WITH THE HOLOCAUST AND IT IS TOTALLY UNNERVING.

BUT I WAS ALWAYS LIKE I WANTED TO READ EVERYTHING I COULD GET MY HANDS ON.

I THOUGHT I KNEW A LOT ABOUT THE HOLOCAUST AND YET IT WASN'T UNTIL A LAKOTA ELDER BECOMES REALLY CENTRAL TO THE PROJECT AND TO ME PERSONALLY, DOUG WHITE BULL, TOLD ME, YOU KNOW, YOUR FAMILY, THE JEWS, THEY SURVIVED A HOLOCAUST.

IT WAS HORRIBLE BUT WE HAD A HOLOCAUST HERE AND IT LASTED FOR 400 YEARS.

AND NO ONE EVER TALKS ABOUT IT.

YET, WHEN YOU'RE IN LAKOTA COUNTRY PEOPLE TALK ABOUT THE HOLOCAUST THAT HAPPENED TO THEM ALL THE TIME.

AND I LEARNED THROUGH DOUG TELLING ME ABOUT IT AND THEN GOING OFF AND STUDYING AND READING BOOKS BY MANY SCHOLARS THAT HAVE WRITTEN ABOUT THIS, THAT, IN FACT, HITLER AND HIS LEGAL TEAM BASED MANY OF THEIR POLICIES ON HOW TO RESTRICT RIGHTS FROM JEWISH PEOPLE BASED ON THE WAY AMERICA WAS TAKING RIGHTS FROM NATIVE PEOPLE AND BLACK PEOPLE IN THIS COUNTRY.

THAT BLEW MY MIND.

AND THE FACT THAT AGAIN IT IS ONE OF THESE POINTS WHERE YOU THINK YOU UNDERSTAND -- I THOUGHT I UNDERSTOOD AMERICAN HISTORY AND MORE GLOBAL HISTORY AND SUDDENLY EVERYTHING I THOUGHT I UNDERSTOOD WAS REALLY SHAKEN WHEN SEEING IT FROM THIS NATIVE PERSPECTIVE.

SO, YEAH, I USE THAT WORD VERY INTENTIONALLY BECAUSE THAT IS THE WAY THAT MANY LAKOTA ELDERS WHO I SPOKE WITH TALK ABOUT IT AND I THINK IT IS REASONABLE.

CHILDREN WERE MURDERED.

PEOPLE WERE STARVED INTENTIONALLY TO BE CONTROLLED BY THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT.

AND THEY WERE RESTRICTED ON TO RESERVATIONS WHICH HITLER HIMSELF USED AS A PREMISE FOR CONCENTRATION CAMPS.

>> LAURA: RIGHT.

SO, YOU ALSO WRITE IN YOUR BOOK THAT AMERICA HAS FAILED TO UNDERGO ANY PROCESS OF NATIONAL TRUTH TELLING, REPARATION OR RECONCILIATION LET ALONE ANY REAL PUBLIC AMENDMENTS.

THAT CLEARLY NEEDS TO HAPPEN IN THIS COUNTRY.

BUT, AS YOU FOUND AND AS YOU WRITE, THERE ARE ALSO WAYS FOR FAMILIES AND COMMUNITIES TO BE MAKING REPARATIONS AND RECONCILIATION.

I WOULD LIKE TO HEAR MORE ABOUT THE WORK THAT YOU AND YOUR FAMILY ARE DOING BUT ALSO THE COMMUNITY WORK THAT YOU HAVE BEEN DOING WITH RABBI BENJAMIN BARNETT.

>> CLARREN: EARLY IN THIS PROCESS, AN INDIGENOUS JUDGE, JUDGE ABBY ABINANTI, WHO IS A JUSTICE OF THE YUROK NATION AN INDIGENOUS AND SHE ALSO A FORMER CALIFORNIA SUPERIOR COURT JUDGE.

SHE IS A TOTAL BAD ASS.

AND SHE IS LIKE IN HER MID 70'S, BEEN DOING THIS WORK HER WHOLE YEAR.

SHE WAS THE FIRST NATIVE AMERICAN, I THINK, FIRST NATIVE AMERICAN TO PASS THE BAR IN CALIFORNIA.

SHE RUNS HER COURTROOM FOR THE YUROK NATION WITH AN EYE TOWARD HOW DID WE DO JUSTICE BEFORE CULTURAL INTERRUPTION?

IT IS ALL ABOUT, SHE SAYS, AND WHAT SHE TAUGHT ME IS JUSTICE WORKS BEST WHEN IT IS EMBEDDED IN YOUR OWN CULTURE.

SO, EARLY ON WHEN I WAS -- BEFORE THIS WAS EVEN IN THE BOOK, WHEN I WAS JUST THINKING ABOUT IT, SHE SAID TO ME, IF YOU WANT TO LOOK AT THIS HISTORY AND YOU WANT TO GRAPPLE WITH HOW TO RESPOND TO THIS HISTORY, YOU NEED TO STUDY THE JEWS.

WHAT DO THE JEWS SAY ABOUT HOW TO RESPOND TO A HARM, MAYBE ONE YOU DIDN'T DIRECTLY CAUSE BUT ONE YOU HAVE BENEFITED FROM.

AND THAT -- I HAD A THOUGHT IN THIS BUT I BELONG TO A SYNAGOGUE.

I LIGHT CANDLES EVERY WEEK WITH MY FAMILY TO DO SHABBAT BUT I HAD NEVER DONE TOUR STUDY.

I DIDN'T REALLY KNOW HOW TO DO THAT AND LUCKILY I DIDN'T HAVE TO DO IT ALONE.

RABBI HERE IN TOWN, RABBI BARNETT, WHO CARES DEEPLY ABOUT SOCIAL JUSTICE, MY SYNAGOGUE IS A COMMUNITY OF PEOPLE WHO CARE ABOUT SOCIAL JUSTICE, SAID LET'S DO THIS LEARNING TOGETHER.

THIS LEARNING WILL BENEFIT OUR OR WHOLE COMMUNITY.

AND SO WE SPENT SEVERAL YEARS STUDYING ANCIENT JEWISH TEXTS AND CONTEMPORARY RABBIS WHO ARE WRITING INSPIRED BY ANCIENT TEXTS TO CONSIDER WHAT ONE RABBI, IN PARTICULAR, SAID IS THE SORT OF FOUNDATIONAL SINS OF OUR COUNTRY, WHICH IS WE BUILT OUR COUNTRY WHICH IS THE STEALING OF NATIVE LANDS AND STEALING OF ENSLAVED PEOPLES BODIES.

AND SO I AM ANSWERING THIS IN A VERY LONG ROUNDABOUT WAY BECAUSE IT IS VERY IMPORTANT TO ME THAT WHAT MY FAMILY IS DOING TO RESPOND TO THE REALITY OF OUR HISTORY IN AMERICA IS GROUNDED DEEPLY IN THIS JEWISH LEARNING THAT WE DID.

AND ALSO AT THE SAME TIME, I HAD MANY CONVERSATIONS WITH LAKOTA ELDERS WHO -- AND ASKING THEM, WHAT WOULD BE AN APPROPRIATE RESPONSE?

WHAT WOULD WORK FOR YOU?

AND IT TOOK A LONG TIME.

IT WASN'T UNTIL A COUPLE OF YEARS INTO MY RELATIONSHIP WITH WHITE BULL WHEN I ASKED THE QUESTION A COUPLE TIMES THAT HE ACTUALLY FINALLY RESPONDED.

HE IS -- WHITE BULL WAS A VETERAN TEACHER, AND HE, LIKE A TEACHER, HE NEVER REALLY SAYS, THIS IS WHAT YOU SHOULD DO.

HE SORT OF JUST LEADS YOU TO MAKE CONNECTIONS ON YOUR OWN.

HE SAID TO ME, WELL, HE REMINDED ME, AGAIN, OF SOMETHING HE TOLD ME ABOUT BEFORE WHICH IS THERE IS A NATIVE LED EFFORT TO BUY UP, WHEN PRIVATE LAND COMES UP FOR SALE IN THE BLACK HILLS OF SOUTH DAKOTA, THERE IS A NATIVE EFFORT TO BUY PRIVATE LAND AND HELD IN TRUST FOR ALL LAKOTA PEOPLE TO USE FOR CEREMONY AND OTHER PURPOSES.

AND EVEN THE U.S. SUPREME COURT, THERE IS NO DEBATE.

SUPREME COURT IN 1980 MADE VERY CLEAR, OH, WE STOLE THIS LAND.

WE UNFAIRLY STOLE THIS LAND FROM LAKOTA AND THERE IS A LOT OF MONEY SITTING IN A BANK ACCOUNT THAT THE UNITED STATES SAID, HERE, WE ARE GOING TO PAY YOU BACK BECAUSE WE SHOULDN'T HAVE TAKEN THIS LAND FROM YOU AND THE LAKOTA DON'T WANT IT, BECAUSE THEY WANT THE LAND INSTEAD.

SO, THIS IS A LONG WAY OF EXPLAINING THAT WHAT MY FAMILY HAS DONE IS I HAVE STARTED A FUND CALLED A RECOVERY FUND WITH THE INDIAN LAND TENURE FOUNDATION FUND WHICH IS A NONPROFIT THAT IS NATIVE LED THAT HAS BEEN DOING THIS WORK FOR 30 YEARS.

WE ARE NOT INVENTING ANYTHING HERE.

I THINK THAT IS VERY IMPORTANT.

I THINK THAT AS DESCENDENTS OF THE SETTLERS YOU DON'T WANT TO BE LIKE, OH, I HAVE GOT THE SOLUTION.

I AM JUST FOLLOWING THE GUIDANCE OF SOMETHING THAT NATIVE PEOPLE ARE ALREADY DOING AND SO WE HAVE CREATED A FUND AND I HAVE SET AS OUR FUND RAISING GOAL 1.$1 MILLION.

1.1 MILLION-DOLLAR IS NOT A HYPOTHETICAL NUMBER.

IT IS THE NUMBER WHEN ADJUST FOR INFLATION.

WHEN I CALLED ALL THOSE MORTGAGES THAT MY FAMILY RECEIVED FROM 1908 TO 1960'S, I THINK IS MAYBE THE LAST MORTGAGE WE GOT, I MADE A SPREADSHEET.

I ADJUSTED FOR INFLATION.

I HAD MATH NERDS CHECK MY MATH.

AND 1.1 MILLION IS THE AMOUNT THAT WE RECEIVED OFF THAT FREE LAND.

OF COURSE, WE HAD TO PAY THAT MONEY BACK, AND, OF COURSE, MY FAMILY WORKED SO HARD AND REALLY STRUGGLED ON THAT LAND BUT TO ME THAT MONEY, IT IS WHAT WE OWE.

IT IS OUR PIECE OF THIS.

>> LAURA: THANK YOU REBECCA.

I LOVED YOUR BOOK.

I LEARNED SO MUCH AND I LOOK FORWARD TO SEEING WHERE THIS BOOK OUT TO AND I AM SURE TONS OF PEOPLE WILL READ IT BUT I HOPE TO SEE IT IN CLASSROOMS ALL ACROSS THE COUNTRY, BUT THANKS FOR JOINING ME.

I APPRECIATE IT.

>> CLARREN: THANK YOU, GREAT TO BE HERE.

>> SO WE WERE LED TO BELIEVE ALL THE WAY UP TO MAY OR JUNE, THAT THIS WAS CONTINUING.

THAT WE WERE IN THE SECOND PHASE OF IMPLEMENTING THE 60 PAGE PLAN.

SO, EVEN TODAY IT'S STILL HARD TO BELIEVE THAT WE ARE ACTUALLY DISBANDED AND WE JUST CAME BACK FROM A MEETING WITH THE INDIAN AFFAIRS DIVISION AND A REPRESENTATIVE OF MICHELLE LUJAN GRISHAM'S OFFICE BECAUSE WE REALLY FEEL THERE NEEDS TO BE A NEW EXECUTIVE ORDER EXTENDING THE TASK FORCE INTO IMPLEMENTING THE PLAN.

>> LAURA: IF YOU HAVEN'T BEEN OVER TO THE ALBUQUERQUE MUSEUM YET TO SEE THE EXHIBIT, "NEWS FOR THE PEOPLE: JOURNALISM IN THE 1970S," YOU'VE GOT UNTIL MARCH THIRD.

IT'S AN EXHIBIT THAT SHOWCASES LOCAL JOURNALISM IN THE STATE DURING THAT ERA.

IT ALSO SHINES A LIGHT ON THE WAY NEWSROOMS BEGAN TO CHANGE, AS MORE WOMEN JOINED THE STATE'S MEDIA LANDSCAPE.

IN THIS SPECIAL SEGMENT FIRST BROUGHT TO YOU BY PRODUCER ANTONIO SANCHEZ AND PHOTOJOURNALIST ROBERT MCDERMOTT, YOU'LL HEAR FROM CURATOR JONATHAN WRIGHT AND RETIRED REPORTER DENISE TESSIER ABOUT THOSE NEWS-BREAKING DAYS FIFTY YEARS AGO.

>> JONATHAN: ABOUT A YEAR AND A HALF AGO, WE WERE THINKING ABOUT, YOU KNOW, THIS IDEA OF WHAT'S HAPPENING RIGHT NOW IN THE NEWS.

WE'RE COMING UP ON A FEW 50-YEAR ANNIVERSARIES, WHICH IS ALWAYS A GOOD MOMENT TO SIT AND REFLECT ON WHAT'S CHANGED IN THAT TIME.

A LOT OF THE THINGS THAT I THINK WE THOUGHT ABOUT DURING THE MAKING OF THIS SHOW WAS THE MAJOR THEMES.

SO WE LOOKED AT THE VIETNAM WAR, WHAT'S BEEN HELD ONTO SINCE THEN, WHAT STORIES ARE STILL TO BE TOLD FROM THAT TIME LOCALLY AND WHAT WAS BROUGHT BACK.

BUT THEN YOU ALSO HAVE THINGS THAT HAVEN'T CHANGED A LOT.

WE'VE GOT ITEMS IN THIS EXHIBITION THAT FOCUS ON SOMETHING LIKE THE EQUAL RIGHTS AMENDMENT AND WHAT WERE PEOPLE DOING HERE IN THE STATE TO, YOU KNOW, CHALLENGE THEIR LOCAL CONGRESSMAN OR PEOPLE WHO WERE IN POLITICAL POWER TO SAY, WE NEED TO SEE SOME CHANGE.

>> "BE PERSISTENT."

>> "THIS IS THE WAY THE PUBLIC FINDS OUT THINGS, MAYOR."

>> JONATHAN: AND AGAIN, 50 YEARS LATER, MAYBE NOT MUCH HAS CHANGED IN A LOT OF PEOPLE'S EYES.

SO I THINK BRINGING ATTENTION TO THE FACT THAT WHILE THE MEDIUMS OF HOW PEOPLE RECEIVED THEIR NEWS HAS CHANGED A LOT, IN A CERTAIN WAY THE NEWS ITSELF HASN'T CHANGED ALL THAT MUCH.

>> "SIR, WE'VE GOT TO HAVE IT ON AT 6:00."

>> JONATHAN: THERE'S A WHOLE STORY IN THE '70S THAT CAN BE REALLY DELVED INTO, WHETHER IT'S THE ETHICS OF WHAT JOURNALISM MEANT AND WAS AT THE TIME, WHETHER IT'S THE PIONEERS, THE TRAILBLAZERS, OR EVEN JUST THE MAJOR EVENTS SINCE THE TIME OF THE VIETNAM WAR.

WE ALSO HAVE WATERGATE, NIXON, EVERYTHING HAPPENING NATIONALLY THAT ALSO HAD AN IMPACT HERE, RIGHT HERE IN NEW MEXICO, AND TIE INTO THAT ALL THE THINGS THAT MAKE NEW MEXICO UNIQUE, AND YOU HAVE A REALLY AMAZING SORT OF SENSE AND SCENE FOR WHAT HAPPENED AND UNFOLDED IN THOSE TEN YEARS.

>> "WHAT HAPPENED ON THIS SUNDAY AND THE FILMS YOU'RE ABOUT TO SEE ARE ACTUAL NEWS FILMS TAKEN FROM THE FILES OF KGGM-TV IN ALBUQUERQUE.

A NUMBER OF PATROL CARS WERE TOTALLY DESTROYED AS THE RIOTING CITIZENS LITERALLY PICKED UP THE PATROL VEHICLES, TURNED THEM OVER, AND THEN SET FIRE TO THEM."

>> JONATHAN: IT WAS AN INTERESTING TIME.

WE WERE COMING OUT OF SIXTIES, WHERE THERE WAS A LOT OF SOCIAL CHANGE NATIONALLY, AND I THINK A LOT OF FOLKS IN NEW MEXICO SAID, THIS IS GREAT, BUT IT'S NOT GONE FAR ENOUGH.

THERE'S THINGS LIKE, WE TALKED TO FOLKS AT THE BLACK BERET, WE WENT FROM THAT TIME, WHO ARE STILL ACTIVISTS TODAY.

A LOT OF THE TIMES, IT'S THE ALTERNATIVE JOURNALISM THAT WAS MADE AT THAT POINT THAT REALLY STOOD OUT TO US IN TERMS OF WHAT DO WE WANT TO DISPLAY, WHAT STORIES CAN WE TELL THAT MAYBE NOT EVERYONE KNEW ABOUT.

>> "THE MAJOR ORGANIZER OF THE DEMONSTRATION WAS THE BLACK BERETS, BUT ALSO GETTING TOP BILLING WERE LT.

GOVERNOR ROBERTO MONDRAGON AND ATTORNEY GENERAL DAVID NORVELL."

>> "I WANT TO REITERATE WHAT I SAID ABOUT THE BLACK BERETS.

THERE ARE SOME CHICANO BROTHERS HERE WHO FEEL THAT WE SHOULD BE YELLING, PEOPLE POWER, AND ULTIMATELY, WE WANT PEOPLE POWER.

BUT LET THE CHICANO FIND THE CHICANO-ISM ALONE TOGETHER.

EVERY TIME A HIPPIE THROWS A ROCK, IT IS A CHICANO THAT GETS KILLED."

>> DENISE: ALL OF US WHO WORKED AT THE JOURNAL, AND I'M SURE AT THE TRIB, FEEL WE WERE FORTUNATE TO BE IN THE TRENCHES AT THAT TIME BECAUSE WE HAD THE BACKING.

I MEAN, IT'S REAL BACKING WHERE THEY HAVE LAWYERS, EVEN, IF YOU GET IN TROUBLE.

BUT THEY HAVE THE FINANCIAL RESOURCES TO SEND YOU OUT OF TOWN, TO MAYBE GIVE YOU A CAR.

NOW REPORTERS, THEY'RE ON THEIR OWN.

THEY GOT TO HAVE THEIR PHONE.

THEY'RE USING THEIR OWN EQUIPMENT.

>> ANNOUNCER: "WHEN NEWS HAPPENS, YOU'LL SEE IT HAPPEN ON NEWS 4."

[CHANTING] >> JONATHAN: WE ALSO HAVE TRAILBLAZERS, LIKE THE FIRST FEMALE GENERAL MANAGER AT KOAT, FOR EXAMPLE, MARY LYNN ROPER, WHO BECAME A FORCE AT THAT TIME.

YOU ALSO HAVE SHARON IRISH, WHO WOULD THEN LEAD KUNM, AS WELL, ON THE RADIO.

SO THESE VOICES DIDN'T GO AWAY AND BECAME NATIONAL FIGUREHEADS, AND THEY WERE RIGHT HERE IN NEW MEXICO.

>> ANNOUNCER: "BECAUSE FIRST YOU HAD TO GET THE FILM BACK TO THE STATION AND THEN PROCESS IT."

>> "WE'VE GOT TO HAVE THIS FILM FOR 6:00."

>> "SORRY, MAN, YOU'RE TOO LATE."

>> ANNOUNCER: "BUT NOW THERE'S EYEWITNESS NEWS MINI-CAM."

>> DENISE: THE MUSEUM PUT THAT SUSAN LANDON AND I ARE PIONEERS, AND THAT KIND OF EMBARRASSED ME, BECAUSE I FELT LIKE THE PIONEERS WERE VAL COOPER OF THE FARMINGTON DAILY TIMES, WHO WAS THE FIRST WOMAN EDITOR IN NEW MEXICO.

FRANKIE MCCARTY, THE ONE WHO REALLY GOT ME MY JOB AT THE JOURNAL, WAS THE FIRST MANAGING EDITOR AT THE ALBUQUERQUE JOURNAL AND ONE OF THE FIRST IN THE NATION.

BUT THEN I THOUGHT ABOUT IT, AND I THINK WE WERE PIONEERS AS PART OF A HUGE INFLUX OF WOMEN JOURNALISTS.

WE WERE THE FIRST WHO WERE THERE WHEN THERE WERE LOTS OF WOMEN, AND THEY WEREN'T JUST IN THE SOCIETY PAGE.

>> "GOOD EVENING.

FIRST AT 5:30 TONIGHT, A TRAGIC ACCIDENT."

>> DENISE: THE WORLD HADN'T QUITE ADJUSTED YET TO WOMEN BEING REPORTERS.

IT COULD BE AN ADVANTAGE, WHERE THEY WOULD NOT TAKE YOU SERIOUSLY AND MAYBE SAY THINGS THAT THEY DIDN'T THINK YOU'D RUN WITH.

ONE TIME I WAS COVERING A FEDERAL COURT CASE, AND THE LAWYER FOR THE DEFENSE CAME UP TO ME IN THE HALLWAY DURING A BREAK AND SAID, 'YOU SHOULD BE HOME COOKING FOR YOUR HUSBAND.'

AND THIS WAS IN THE COURT OF H. VEARLE PAYNE, FEDERAL JUDGE, AND HE ACTUALLY HAD A SIGN OUTSIDE THE COURTROOM THAT SAID: WOMEN IN PANTS WILL NOT BE ALLOWED IN THE COURTROOM.

YOU HAD TO WEAR A DRESS.

>> DENISE: BECAUSE WE WERE STILL COVERING LIKE A MOSTLY ALL MALE WORLD, I WAS FORTUNATE TO JOIN NEW MEXICO PRESS WOMEN.

WHEN WE'D HAVE A CONFERENCE, THERE WOULD BE TEN TABLES, AND EACH TABLE WAS FULL WITH FEMALE REPORTERS FROM THE PAPERS.

IT SHOWS YOU HOW THE REAL BEST JOURNALISM WAS THEN.

LOS ALAMOS MONITOR.

SANTA FE NEW MEXICAN.

TAOS NEWS.

HOBBS NEWS-SUN.

DEMING HEADLIGHT.

SILVER CITY DAILY PRESS.

I MEAN, THOSE ARE JUST SOME OF THE WOMEN, NOT EVERYONE WAS A PRESS WOMAN.

SO WE WERE PART OF THIS WAVE OF JOURNALISTS, WOMEN JOURNALISTS.

>> JONATHAN: AND THEN I WAS BLOWN AWAY BY THE FOLKS WHO I REACHED OUT TO, WHO WERE JOURNALISTS AT THAT TIME OR MAYBE NEWS JOURNALISTS WHO WORKED IN STATIONS, WHO SAID, OH, WELL, HANG ON, WE MIGHT HAVE ONE MORE THING IN OUR POSSESSION THAT WE HELD ONTO.

BECAUSE A LOT OF THE EQUIPMENT, YOU KNOW, GOES OUT OF DATE.

WHY WOULD YOU KEEP AN OLD CAMERA TEN YEARS LATER IF YOU'RE NOT GOING TO USE IT.

SO A FEW OF THOSE THINGS.

WE HAVE MICS, YOU KNOW, RADIO MICS FROM FOLKS WHO WERE LIVE ON AIR AT KUNM IN THE '70S.

WE MANAGED TO GRAB THOSE.

TELEVISIONS FROM THE TIME THAT WE'VE REWIRED AND TRIED TO SHOW BLACK AND WHITE FOOTAGE.

[CHANTING] >> JONATHAN: AND THEN THERE'S A COUPLE OF DIFFERENT GROUPS, TOO.

NEW MEXICO PRESS WOMEN HAVE BEEN PHENOMENAL THROUGHOUT ALL OF THIS PROCESS.

FROM THE START, I THINK I REACHED OUT, JUST KIND OF MAYBE BLINDLY HOPING THAT THEY WOULD HAVE SOME BOOKS FROM THE TIME OR SOMETHING.

AND NO, THEY WENT TEN BETTER AND SAID, WE'VE GOT FOLKS WHO KEPT AHOLD OF THEIR NOTEBOOKS, THEIR GREASE PENCILS, AND WE CAN SHOW YOU HOW JOURNALISM WAS AT THAT TIME.

>> "BILL WAS PUNCHED IN THE FACE, BREAKING HIS EYEGLASSES.

I WAS KICKED, BUT I PROTECTED MYSELF WITH A CAMERA, AND ONLY THE LENS WAS DAMAGED."

>> JONATHAN: YOU KNOW, WE'RE VERY THANKFUL TO ALL THE FOLKS WE WORKED WITH.

THE STORIES AND THE PEOPLE ON THE BOARD, A LOT OF THEM WERE STILL AROUND TO TELL THEIR SIDE OF THE STORY.

SO WE'RE HOPING ANOTHER THING THAT MAKES THIS EXHIBIT MAYBE A LITTLE UNIQUE COMPARED TO OTHER HISTORY EXHIBITS, LOOKING AT CENTURIES, YOU KNOW, A LOT OF LONG TIME AGO, IS THAT THESE PEOPLE COULD TELL THEIR STORY.

SO WE LISTENED, AND THIS HAS BEEN A GREAT SPACE, IN THIS COMMUNITY EXHIBIT SPACE, TO SHOWCASE THE PEOPLE'S STORIES AND WHY NEWS WAS FOR THE PEOPLE.

>> WATER IN NEW MEXICO IS MANAGED ON WHAT'S CALLED THE PRIORITY ADMINISTRATION SYSTEM.

AND THIS IS LIKE MOST OTHER WESTERN STATES MANAGED ON A SIMILAR SYSTEM.

AND IT'S A SYSTEM OF EXTRACTION.

IT'S A WINNER-TAKE-ALL KIND OF SYSTEM AND HOW IT WORKS IS THAT PERMITS ARE ISSUED FOR WATER RIGHTS USERS UNTIL THERE'S NO WATER LEFT."

>> LAURA: FOR FOUR YEARS, MEMBERS OF THE NEW MEXICO MISSING AND MURDERED INDIGENOUS WOMEN TASK FORCE MET WITH ONE ANOTHER AND PRODUCED A REPORT FULL OF RECOMMENDATIONS TO SLOW THE CRISIS.

MEMBERS BUILT PARTNERSHIPS ACROSS TRIBES AND LAW ENFORCEMENT AGENCIES, AND THEY ADVOCATED FOR FAMILIES AND COMMUNITIES.

THEN, LAST OCTOBER, NEW MEXICO IN DEPTH REPORTER BELLA DAVIS BROKE THE STORY ...

THE GOVERNOR'S ADMINISTRATION HAD SHUT DOWN THE TASK FORCE -- NEWS THAT SHOCKED ITS OWN MEMBERS.

DAVIS CONTINUED REPORTING ON THE FALLOUT OF THAT DECISION.

FAMILIES WITH MISSING AND MURDERED RELATIVES PROTESTED THE MOVE, AND THEY ASKED THE GOVERNOR TO APOLOGIZE.

IN RESPONSE, THE GOVERNOR PROPOSED AN EIGHT-PERSON ADVISORY COUNCIL TO REPLACE THE TASK FORCE ... A CALL SOME LAWMAKERS HAVE DESCRIBED AS A HALF MEASURE AT BEST.

THEN IN DECEMBER, INDIAN AFFAIRS SECRETARY-DESIGNATE JAMES MOUNTAIN STEPPED DOWN FROM HIS POSITION.

MOUNTAIN'S 10-MONTH TENURE WAS ROCKY FROM THE START, AND THE FORMER GOVERNOR OF SAN ILDEFONSO PUEBLO HAD BEEN A SOURCE OF CONTROVERSY FOR TASK FORCE MEMBERS AND FAMILIES.

AT THE TIME OF HIS APPOINTMENT, TASK FORCE MEMBERS CLAIMED THAT A KIDNAPPING AND AGGRAVATED BATTERY CASE AGAINST HIM, WHICH WAS LATER DISMISSED, SHOULD KEEP HIM FROM OVERSEEING THE DEPARTMENT.

IT 'S STILL UNCLEAR WHY MOUNTAIN LEFT THE AGENCY - AND HE'S SINCE JOINED THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE AS A SENIOR POLICY ADVISOR FOR TRIBAL AFFAIRS.

GIVEN ALL THESE DEVELOPMENTS, AND IN COLLABORATION WITH NEW MEXICO IN DEPTH, WE REVISIT BELLA DAVIS' WORK.

HERE, SHE INTERVIEW DARLENE GOMEZ, AN ATTORNEY AND FORMER TASK FORCE MEMBER - AND VANGIE RANDALL-SHORTIE, A DINÉ MOTHER WHO'S SON ZACHARIAH WAS MURDERED THREE YEARS AGO.

>> BELLA: VANGIE, DARLENE, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR JOINING ME TODAY ON NEW MEXICO IN FOCUS.

WE'RE HERE TO TALK ABOUT THE DISBANDING OF THE MISSING AND MURDERED INDIGENOUS WOMEN AND RELATIVES TASK FORCE BY GOVERNOR MICHELLE LUJAN-GRISHAM'S ADMINISTRATION EARLIER THIS YEAR, AND WHAT THAT MEANS GOING FORWARD IN A STATE THAT'S BEEN DEEPLY IMPACTED BY THIS NATIONAL CRISIS OF DISPROPORTIONATE VIOLENCE AGAINST INDIGENOUS PEOPLE.

VANGIE, OVER THE PAST FEW YEARS, YOU'VE BECOME AN ADVOCATE NOT ONLY FOR YOUR SON, ZACHARIAH, BUT ALSO FOR OTHER INDIGENOUS FAMILIES WHO HAVE LOST LOVED ONES.

TO START, CAN YOU TELL US ABOUT WHO YOUR SON WAS?

>> VANGIE: MY SON, ZACHARIAH JUWAUN SHORTY, HE WAS 23 YEARS OLD, LOVED MUSIC, LOVED TATTOOING, WAS A VERY FUN PERSON, LOVING PERSON.

HE WAS A DAD, HE WAS A GRANDSON, A BROTHER, AND MY BABY.

STARTING LIFE.

STARTING LIFE.

HE WENT OUT WITH SOME FRIENDS TO MAKE MUSIC, WENT MISSING, WAS FOUND FOUR DAYS LATER ON THE NAVAJO RESERVATION, AND HE WAS MURDERED.

THREE YEARS LATER, I'M HERE BECAUSE I'M STILL WAITING FOR ANSWERS.

I JUST RECENTLY FOUND OUT THAT THE FBI AGENT WORKING ON HIS CASE, SHE'S NO LONGER IN THE OFFICE, AND SO WE HAVE A NEW AGENT, AND I'M STILL WAITING TO MEET WITH THAT AGENT, AS WELL.

AS FAR AS THE NEW MEXICO TASK FORCE, I'VE BEEN VERY DEVASTATED WITH THAT.

WHEN IT FIRST STARTED, I HAD HOPES, YOU KNOW, THAT -- NOT ONLY MYSELF, BUT OTHER FAMILIES HAD HOPES OF, YOU KNOW, BRINGING THEIR LOVED ONES HOME, AND IN MY CASE, YOU KNOW, GETTING JUSTICE FOR ZAC.

AND AGAIN, THREE YEARS LATER, I'M STILL WAITING.

AND WITH IT ENDING, WHERE DO WE GO FROM HERE, IS MY QUESTION.

>> BELLA: I'M SO SORRY FOR YOUR LOSS.

YOU TOUCHED ON THIS A LITTLE BIT, BUT WHAT ARE SOME OF THE CHALLENGES THAT YOU FACED IN TRYING TO GET JUSTICE FOR YOUR SON?

>> VANGIE: LACK OF COMMUNICATION AND JURISDICTION.

YOU KNOW, WE HAVE DIFFERENT ORGANIZATIONS.

FROM THE VERY BEGINNING, AS FAR AS WHEN I WENT BACK TO MAKING THAT FIRST PHONE CALL WHEN HE WENT MISSING, THAT WAS WITH THE FARMINGTON POLICE DEPARTMENT.

AND THEN WHEN HE WAS FOUND, HE WAS FOUND ON THE NAVAJO RESERVATION, SO HAVING TO DEAL WITH THE NAVAJO NATION POLICE DEPARTMENT, THE DETECTIVES FROM SAN JUAN COUNTY, THE CRIMINAL INVESTIGATOR FROM NAVAJO NATION, AND THEN BACK TO THE FBI HAVING, YOU KNOW, THE CASE IN THEIR HANDS.

AND THEN, YOU KNOW, THROUGH THIS TASK FORCE, BEING INVOLVED WITH THE BIA MISSING AND MURDERED UNIT, AS WELL.

SO HAVING THEM ALL TOGETHER, IT FEELS LIKE THERE'S BEEN THAT POWER STRUGGLE OF, OKAY, WE DON'T HAVE THE CASE, THEY HAVE THE CASE.

OKAY, WE HAVE TO CONTACT NAVAJO NATION.

NO, THE FBI HAS THE CASE.

SO JUST, YOU KNOW, FINGER POINTING IS WHAT IT SEEMS TO HAVE BEEN THESE PAST THREE YEARS.

>> BELLA: GOING BACK TO ABOUT SIX MONTHS AGO, THE GOVERNOR'S ADMINISTRATION MADE THE DECISION TO DISBAND THE TASK FORCE.

THAT WAS REALLY CREATED TO FIND SOLUTIONS TO THE CHALLENGES YOU JUST DESCRIBED, ALONG WITH SO MANY OTHERS.

DARLENE, WHAT DID YOU THINK AND FEEL WHEN YOU LEARNED THE TASK FORCE WAS DONE?

>> GOMEZ: SO, I WAS INVITED TO A TASK FORCE SUMMIT MEETING, WHICH OCCURRED I THINK IN JUNE, AND AT THAT TIME I WAS NOT TOLD THAT THIS WAS GOING TO BE A MEETING ENDING THE TASK FORCE.

121 PEOPLE WERE INVITED TO THAT MEETING, AND I WOULD SAY MAYBE 25 SHOWED UP.

SO THROUGHOUT THE MEETING, THE SUMMIT, WE WERE TALKING ABOUT, YOU KNOW, HOW TO TAKE CARE OF OURSELVES, AND WE WERE HEARING FROM A WOMAN WHO IS THE GOVERNOR OF A PUEBLO, AND JUST SOME REALLY MOVING STORIES ABOUT PEOPLE WITHIN THE MOVEMENT.

SO AT THE VERY LAST, BEFORE IT CLOSED, WE WERE TOLD THAT THE MMIWR TASK FORCE WAS GOING TO BE ENDING.

SO I, OF COURSE, AFTER MELODY DELMAR CAME OFF THE STAGE, I TALKED TO HER AND I SAID, REALLY?

ARE YOU GOING TO DO A PRESS RELEASE?

ARE YOU GOING TO MAKE A PUBLIC ANNOUNCEMENT?

BECAUSE NOBODY KNOWS, AND THERE'S ONLY LIKE 25 OF US IN THIS ROOM.

SO I LEFT THAT DAY STILL NOT REALLY REALIZING THAT IT WAS A TRUE AND CORRECT STATEMENT THAT THE TASK FORCE WAS ENDED.

SO I KIND OF WENT ON THE NEXT SIX MONTHS NOT GETTING CALLS FROM ANYONE FROM THE NEW MEXICO INDIAN AFFAIRS DEPARTMENT, NOTHING ABOUT THE TASK FORCE, AND THEN I THINK I RECEIVED A CALL FROM YOU, BELLA, ASKING ME IF, INDEED, THIS WAS TRUE.

AND I SAID, YEAH, I HEARD ABOUT IT IN MAY OR JUNE, BUT I NEVER SAW A PRESS RELEASE, I NEVER SAW A PUBLIC ANNOUNCEMENT, AND I HAD BEEN LOOKING FOR THEM.

SO STILL TODAY, I'M IN COMPLETE SHOCK, BECAUSE ALTHOUGH WE FINISHED THE -- WE CAME UP WITH THE PLAN, THE STATE PLAN, AS IT'S CALLED, BUT THAT WAS A WHOLE YEAR AND A HALF AGO.

SO WE WERE LED TO BELIEVE ALL THE WAY UP TO MAY OR JUNE THAT THIS WAS CONTINUING, THAT WE WERE IN THE SECOND PHASE OF IMPLEMENTING THE 60- PAGE PLAN.

SO EVEN TODAY, YOU KNOW, IT'S STILL HARD TO BELIEVE THAT WE'RE ACTUALLY DISBANDED.

AND WE JUST CAME BACK FROM A MEETING WITH THE INDIAN AFFAIRS DIVISION AND A REPRESENTATIVE OF MICHELLE LUJAN-GRISHAM'S OFFICE, BECAUSE WE REALLY FEEL LIKE THERE NEEDS TO BE A NEW EXECUTIVE ORDER EXTENDING THE TASK FORCE INTO IMPLEMENTING THE PLAN.

>> BELLA: THE TWO OF YOU WERE ONE OF A FEW DOZEN PEOPLE WHO WENT TO SANTA FE IN OCTOBER TO PROTEST THE DISBANDING OF THE TASK FORCE.

WHAT WERE YOU HOPING TO GET OUT OF THAT PROTEST?

MAYBE VANGIE, IF WE COULD START WITH YOU.

>> VANGIE: ANSWERS.

YOU KNOW, I WAS SHOCKED.

LOTS OF EMOTIONS.

I WAS UPSET.

LIKE, YOU KNOW, WONDERING, WANTING TO KNOW WHY THEY SAID THE TASK FORCE ENDED.

BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, FROM MY POINT OF VIEW, FROM BEING ZACHARIAH'S MOM, THEIR JOB IS NOT DONE.

IT'S FAR FROM BEING DONE.

AND I THINK ALL THEY DID WAS GATHER STATISTICS, WHICH I DON'T THINK ARE EVEN ACCURATE.

THERE'S MORE THAN 181 PEOPLE THAT ARE MISSING AND MURDERED, AND THOSE THAT ARE MISSING HAVE NOT RETURNED HOME.

IN ZAC'S CASE, WITH HIM BEING MURDERED, I'M STILL WAITING FOR JUSTICE.

SO THEIR TASK FORCE IS FAR FROM BEING DONE.

>> BELLA: AT THAT PROTEST IN SANTA FE, YOU ALL MET WITH A SPOKESWOMAN FOR THE GOVERNOR AND ASKED FOR A MEETING, WHICH DARLENE YOU MENTIONED JUST RECENTLY HAPPENED.

CAN YOU TELL US A LITTLE BIT ABOUT SORT OF THE EXPLANATION THAT YOU GOT FOR WHY THE TASK FORCE HAS BEEN DISBANDED?

>> GOMEZ: SO INITIALLY WHEN WE DID OUR PROTEST, OUR RALLY, I THINK ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE WANTED THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE TO KNOW IS THAT WE WILL NOT BE SILENCED, THAT WE HAVE BEEN SILENCED FOR FAR TOO LONG, AND THAT WE ALL HAVE VOICES.

ZACHARIAH'S MOM IS HIS VOICE.

WE HAVE CALVIN MARTINEZ, AND BECKY IS HIS VOICE.

AND WE WANTED TO SHOW THAT WE'RE UNITED, THAT YOU COULD TAKE THIS TASK FORCE AWAY, BUT WE'RE STILL PUSHING FOR ANSWERS.

SO WHAT WE LEARNED THAT DAY WAS THAT THE GOVERNOR'S TEAM FELT THAT THE EXECUTIVE ORDER HAD BEEN FULFILLED BECAUSE WE DID HAVE THIS MMIWR STATE RESPONSE PLAN.

SO IN THEIR MIND, THAT WAS THE END OF THE EXECUTIVE ORDER.

SO IT FELT LIKE TO ME THAT THEY HAD NOT REALLY IMPLEMENTED ANYTHING FROM THAT PLAN, AND WE'RE A WHOLE YEAR AND A HALF LATER.

SO ONE OF MY QUESTIONS WAS, WELL, WHY DID YOU GO A WHOLE YEAR AND A HALF LETTING US BELIEVE THAT THIS TASK FORCE WAS STILL GOING TO BE WORKING TOGETHER?

AND SO BASICALLY, SHE SAID, WELL, YOU KNOW, I APOLOGIZE.

MAYBE WE SHOULD HAVE BEEN MORE TRANSPARENT BY DOING A PRESS RELEASE.

AND WE ARE NOT SAYING IT'S ENDING - QUOTE - BUT IT'S JUST ON TO A DIFFERENT PHASE THAT IS NOT COVERED UNDER THE EXECUTIVE ORDER.

SO IN TODAY'S MEETING, WE CAME UP WITH, ALL OF US COLLECTIVELY THAT CAME TO THE MEETING TODAY, AND ALSO THE OTHER FAMILIES THAT COULDN'T MAKE IT, WE CAME UP WITH SOME IDEAS ON WHAT INDIAN AFFAIRS DIVISION AND THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE COULD DO IMMEDIATELY.

ONE WAS TO HAVE AN MMIWR LINK ON THE PAGE.

SO THAT WOULD ALLOW EVERYONE TO SEE WHO IS MISSING.

AND THEN ALSO, TO ALLOW EACH FAMILY TO TELL THEIR STORY, WHO THEIR LOVED ONE WAS.

BECAUSE OFTENTIMES, I FEEL LIKE PEOPLE DON'T REALIZE, BEHIND A STATISTIC, THERE'S AN ACTUAL PERSON THAT IS BEING MISSED AND THAT'S LOVED.

AND ONE OF THE SECOND THINGS IS THAT WE REALLY WANTED THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE AND THE INTERNAL AFFAIRS DIVISION TO HAVE A RESOURCE LIST WHERE FAMILIES COULD GO TO HAVE A RESOURCE LIST.

AND WE ALSO ASKED THAT A NEW EXECUTIVE ORDER BE DRAFTED BY THE GOVERNOR FOR THE SECOND PART OF THE MMIWR TASK FORCE, AND THAT WOULD BE THE IMPLEMENTATION TEAM.

AND I THINK FOR ME, ONE OF THE THINGS WITH THIS TASK FORCE ENDING IS THAT I NO LONGER HAVE ACCESS TO THE 121 PEOPLE WHO WERE A PART OF THE TASK FORCE, BECAUSE OFTENTIMES IT WOULD BE THE FBI, BUREAU OF INDIAN AFFAIRS, THE DISTRICT ATTORNEY, AND WE WERE ABLE TO TALK TO THEM AND SAY, LIKE, HEY, I CALLED YOU TWO WEEKS AGO, DO YOU HAVE A FEW MINUTES TO TALK?

OR, I ALSO HAD A LIST OF EVERYBODY WHO WAS ON THAT TASK FORCE, AND I WAS ABLE TO CALL, LIKE, THE FARMINGTON POLICE DEPARTMENT AND ASK ABOUT A CASE.

AND IT ALSO GAVE ALL THE MEMBERS A CHANCE TO TRUST ONE ANOTHER, BECAUSE WHEN I SAY SOMETHING, I'M GOING TO DO IT.

AND THERE'S ALL THESE MISCONCEPTIONS IN THE PAPER.

YOU KNOW, I'M THIS ACTIVIST THAT'S ALWAYS YELLING AND SCREAMING.

BUT THEN WHEN PEOPLE MET ME, THEY JUST KNEW I HAD A PASSION FOR FINDING OUR MISSING AND MURDERED.

SO IT BASICALLY WIPED AWAY THAT LINK.

SO I'M IN THE SILO BY MYSELF WITH THE FAMILIES.

WE'RE OUR OWN -- WE HAVE TO SUPPORT ONE ANOTHER, BECAUSE NO ONE ELSE IS THERE TO SUPPORT ONE ANOTHER.

AND WITHOUT THIS TASK FORCE, THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE AND THE INDIAN AFFAIRS DIVISION, THEY CAN'T FORCE PEOPLE TO WORK ON THIS PLAN, BECAUSE WE HAVE FEDERAL AGENCIES THAT THEY HAVE NO CONTROL OVER.

WE HAVE SOVEREIGN NATIONS THAT THEY HAVE NO CONTROL OVER.

IT GOES TO NONPROFITS.

SO I FELT LIKE THIS TASK FORCE ALLOWED EVERYBODY TO BE COHESIVE AND WORK ON A PLAN, NO MATTER WHAT AGENCY THEY CAME FROM.

AND EVERYBODY WAS REALLY DEDICATED TO IT.

SO TO JUST END IT AND SAY -- YOU KNOW, I HEARD THAT THE INDIAN AFFAIRS SECRETARY FOR MOUNTAIN STATES, THAT THEY WANTED TO HIRE FOUR MORE INDIVIDUALS.

WELL, WHAT'S FOUR MORE INDIVIDUALS GOING TO DO WHEN YOU HAD 121 EXPERTS IN MMIWR FROM ON THE GROUND FAMILY MEMBERS, ADVOCATES, LAW ENFORCEMENT, LEGISLATORS.

YOU CAN'T GET THAT IN FOUR PEOPLE.

SO THOSE WERE SOME OF OUR QUESTIONS TODAY.

LIKE, WHAT DOES THIS MEAN?

AND THEN WE ALSO WERE REALLY FRANK ABOUT GETTING DATA, BECAUSE WE WERE TOLD, OH, YEAH, WE'VE BEEN WORKING ON THIS THE ENTIRE TIME, BUT WHEN WE PRESSED THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE AND THE SECRETARY OF INDIAN AFFAIRS OFFICE, THEY COULDN'T PROVIDE EXACT DATA FOR US, OR THEY COULDN'T TELL US WHAT STEPS THEY TOOK TO IMPLEMENT THE PLAN.

THEY SAID, OH, WE'RE FOLLOWING THIS PLAN.

WELL, THE PLAN IS 60 PAGES.

>> BELLA: YOU TALKED ABOUT THE PLAN, THAT IT CONTAINS SO MANY RECOMMENDATIONS.

DOZENS OF RECOMMENDATIONS, FROM BETTER DATA COLLECTION TO FUNDING FOR LIAISONS WHO CAN HELP AFFECTED FAMILIES NAVIGATE THE CRIMINAL JUSTICE SYSTEM.

I'M WONDERING FOR YOU, VANGIE, IF THERE ARE ANY PARTICULAR RECOMMENDATIONS FROM THAT RESPONSE PLAN THAT YOU FEEL LIKE STATE LEADERS SHOULD REALLY BE PRIORITIZING.

>> VANGIE: I THINK THAT OPEN COMMUNICATION BACK UP, YOU KNOW.

JUST LIKE DARLENE HAD STATED, SHE CAN'T JUST PICK UP THE PHONE AND REACH THESE DIFFERENT ORGANIZATIONS.

YOU KNOW, IT'S NOT THERE ANYMORE.

SO I THINK THAT NEEDS TO BE ADDRESSED AND OPENED BACK UP.

DARLENE IS MY RESOURCE, MY GO-TO PERSON, AND THEN SHE'S THAT MIDDLE PERSON THAT HELPS ME CONNECT WITH THE FBI AND WHOEVER ELSE THAT I NEED TO CONTACT ON ZAC'S BEHALF.

>> BELLA: DARLENE, AS AN ATTORNEY, YOU'RE SO FAMILIAR WITH KIND OF HOW THESE CASES WORK, AND WE TALK ABOUT KIND OF THE CRIMINAL JUSTICE SYSTEM.

SO FOR YOU, ARE THERE ANY RECOMMENDATIONS THAT REALLY STAND OUT FROM THE RESPONSE PLAN?

>> GOMEZ: WELL, I THINK ONE IS THE COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT.

LIKE, ENGAGING THE COMMUNITY AND HAVING RESOURCES FOR THEM, BECAUSE I WORK WITH 20 FAMILIES AND THERE'S NO RESOURCES.

THERE'S NONPROFITS WHO GET DOLLARS FOR MMIWR, BUT TO HAVE THEM ACTUALLY ADVOCATE FOR THE FAMILIES AND HELP THE FAMILIES, IT'S NOT GOING TO THOSE FAMILIES DIRECTLY.

IT'S LIKE BIG TRAININGS.

I REALLY THINK THE DATA COLLECTION IS VITAL, AND I FELT LIKE WITH THE TASK FORCE BEING TOGETHER -- LIKE, WE HAD GOVERNORS FROM PUEBLOS, WE HAD PRESIDENTS FROM THE JICARILLA APACHE INDIAN TRIBE, MESCALERO, AND WE HAD PEOPLE SITTING AT THE TABLE FROM ALL THE SOVEREIGN NATIONS WHO COULD COMMIT.

SAYING, LIKE, OKAY, I'LL GIVE YOU OUR DATA, GIVE ME WHAT DATA WE'RE GOING TO FOLLOW, GIVE ME THE STANDARD MODEL AND I'LL TAKE IT BACK TO MY TRIBE AND WE WILL IMPLEMENT IT.

WELL, NOW IT'S NOT THERE, AND SO MANY TRIBAL LEADERS HAVE 100 THINGS ON THEIR PLATES.

SO I FELT LIKE THE TASK FORCE MADE EVERYBODY ACCOUNTABLE, AND IT MADE PEOPLE REALLY WANT TO BE LIKE, OKAY, WELL, I'M GOING TO SHOW YOU WHAT OUR NATION IS DOING, I'M SHOWING YOU WHAT THE FBI IS DOING.

SO I FELT THAT THIS ALSO GAVE PEOPLE THE INCENTIVE TO START NEW PROGRAMS IN THEIR OFFICE SO THEY CAN GET ON THE MEDIA AND SAY, LIKE, HEY, LOOK WHAT WE'RE DOING, IT'S REALLY WORKING.

AND I THINK THAT WAS REALLY RELEVANT WITH THE FBI WHEN THEY STARTED THE MISSING PERSON IN NEW MEXICO, NATIVE AMERICAN LIST OF PICTURES THAT COMES OUT ONCE A MONTH.

THAT TOOK A LOT OF WORK AND IT TOOK A LOT OF COMMITMENT FROM THE FBI, BUT I THINK THAT PARTIALLY, IT WAS BECAUSE THERE WAS THIS FORUM WHERE WE WERE ABLE TO TELL THEM, LIKE, THIS IS WHAT WE NEED.

AND I THINK OFTENTIMES, LAW ENFORCEMENT DOESN'T REALLY GET THE OPPORTUNITY TO KNOW THE VICTIMS' FAMILIES OR THE ADVOCATES.

THEY CAN LEARN SO MUCH FROM VANGIE AND THE REST OF THE FAMILIES.

THEY CAN LEARN FROM ME.

AND WE CAN ALSO TALK TO THEM, AND WHEN THEY TELL US, LIKE, LOOK, THESE ARE OUR BARRIERS, WE'RE ABLE TO FIGHT FOR THEM, WHETHER IT'S IN CONGRESS OR AT THE STATE LEVEL.

AND WE ALL KNOW THAT EVERYBODY IS UNDERFUNDED, LACK OF RESOURCES, LACK OF OFFICERS, BUT THAT DOESN'T GIVE ANYONE THE EXCUSE NOT TO PROPERLY INVESTIGATE MMIWR.

>> BELLA: AT THIS POINT, THERE'S SOME DISAGREEMENT ABOUT HOW WE, AS A STATE, SHOULD MOVE FORWARD.

YOU TALKED ABOUT HOW THE INDIAN AFFAIRS DEPARTMENT HAS REQUESTED FUNDING FROM THE LEGISLATURE FOR FOUR FULL-TIME EMPLOYEES TO FOCUS ON CARRYING OUT THE TASK FORCE RECOMMENDATIONS, AND THEN SORT OF ON THE OTHER HAND, THERE ARE A FEW STATE LAWMAKERS WHO HAVE EXPRESSED INTEREST IN BRINGING THE TASK FORCE BACK.

I THINK PART OF THE IDEA THERE IS THAT IT'S GIVING THE TASK FORCE SORT OF LONGEVITY INSTEAD OF HAVING ANOTHER EXECUTIVE ORDER.

SO I'M WONDERING FOR YOU, DARLENE, WHAT YOU HOPE TO SEE HAPPEN DURING THIS UPCOMING LEGISLATIVE SESSION.

>> GOMEZ: WELL, WE HAVE COLLECTIVELY ASKED FOR A STATUTE THAT WOULD MAKE THE INDIAN AFFAIRS -- OR THE MURDERED AND MISSING INDIGENOUS WOMEN AND RELATIVES TASK FORCE A STAND-ALONE DIVISION.

WE WERE TOLD TODAY THAT THAT'S SOMETHING THAT'S NOT POSSIBLE FROM THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE, SO, YOU KNOW, WE REALLY NEED IT INTO STATUTE.

IF THAT'S NOT SOMETHING THAT IS POSSIBLE WITH THE GOVERNOR, THEN WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO ASK OUR STATE LEGISLATORS TO PUT IT IN STATUTE, BECAUSE NEW MEXICO'S RANKED NUMBER ONE IN THE ENTIRE NATION FOR MISSING AND MURDERED INDIGENOUS PEOPLE.

I DON'T FORESEE THAT WE'RE GOING TO BE 50TH AT ANY TIME SOON.

THIS IS AN ISSUE THAT HAS GONE BACK TO THE 1900S AND EARLIER WHEN SPAIN CAME INTO NEW MEXICO, ARIZONA, AND SO THIS IS JUST GENERATIONAL.

AND THIS IS NOT GOING TO END.

SO JUST TO THINK THAT FOUR PEOPLE ARE GOING TO BE ABLE TO CONTROL THIS, THAT'S NOT ANYTHING THAT IS POSSIBLE.

SO WE NEED TO EXTEND IT ALL THE WAY, YOU KNOW, UNTIL WE'RE NO LONGER ON THIS EARTH, BECAUSE IT IS AN ISSUE AND HAS BEEN AN ISSUE FOR A VERY LONG TIME.

>> BELLA: VANGIE, DARLENE, THANK YOU BOTH SO MUCH FOR YOUR TIME AND JOINING ME TODAY.

>> GOMEZ: YOU'RE WELCOME.

>> VANGIE: THANK YOU FOR LISTENING.

>> LAURA: THANKS AGAIN TO BELLA DAVIS.

SHE'S KEPT AT THE STORY AND IN A FEATURE PUBLISHED AT NEW MEXICO IN DEPTH IN NOVEMBER, SHE REVEALED THAT STATE ATTORNEY GENERAL RAUL TORREZ HAS FAILED TO SPEND A MILLION DOLLARS SET ASIDE BY THE STATE LEGISLATURE.

THAT MONEY WAS ALLOCATED NEARLY TWO YEARS AGO TO HELP TRACK CASES OF MISSING INDIGENOUS PEOPLE.

YOU CAN READ THAT AND ALL OF HER WORK AT 'N-M IN DEPTH DOT COM.'

LOOKING AHEAD TO THIS YEAR'S WATER SUPPLIES, IT'S NOT TOO SOON TO WONDER ABOUT HOW OUR RIVERS WILL FARE THIS SPRING AND SUMMER.

IN 2022, THE RIO GRANDE DRIED IN ALBUQUERQUE, AND IT CAME CLOSE TO DRYING IN 2023.

OF COURSE, IT DRIES ALMOST EVERY SUMMER SOUTH OF SOCORRO AND IS DRY MOST OF THE YEAR THROUGH LAS CRUCES.

AND WHILE WE SAY WE HATE TO SEE THAT HAPPEN, THERE'S NOTHING IN STATE LAW TO PREVENT THE RIO GRANDE ... OR ANY OF THE STATE'S RIVERS... FROM DRYING.

IN 2022, THE OUR LAND CREW WENT TO THE RIO GRANDE TO EXPLORE THIS ISSUE WITH AUDUBON SOUTHWEST'S PAUL TASHJIAN.

>> LAURA: FOR DECADES, THE RIO GRANDE DOWNSTREAM OF ALBUQUERQUE HAS DRIED DURING IRRIGATION SEASON.

NOT A LOT OF PEOPLE PAY ATTENTION TO THAT.

BUT, THIS SUMMER IN JULY, THE DRYING MARCHED UPSTREAM INTO ALBUQUERQUE.

AND PEOPLE NOTICED.

WHAT MOST PEOPLE PROBABLY DON'T REALIZE IS RIVERS IN NEW MEXICO DON'T HAVE RIGHTS TO THEIR OWN WATERS SO THE WATER YOU SEE FLOWING PAST IT IS ALL MEANT FOR SOMEONE ELSE DOWNSTREAM.

AND SOMETIMES WHAT THAT MEANS IS THERE IS NOT ENOUGH WATER LEFT FOR THE RIVER ITSELF AND THE SPECIES THAT RELY UPON IT.

PAUL TASHJIAN IS DIRECTOR OF FRESH WATER CONSERVATION FOR AUDUBON SOUTHWEST.

KEEPING WATER IN RIVERS IS SOMETHING HE THINKS ABOUT A LOT.

>> TASHJIAN: IN NEW MEXICO LIKE MANY WESTERN STATES, THERE ARE NO INHERENT RIGHTS OR CLAIMS THAT RIVERS HAVE ON THEIR WATER.

WATER IN NEW MEXICO IS MANAGED ON WHAT IS CALLED THE PRIORITY ADMINISTRATION SYSTEM AND THIS IS LIKE MOST OTHER WESTERN STATES MANAGED ON A SIMILAR SYSTEM.

IT IS A SYSTEM OF EXTRACTION.

IT IS A WINNER-TAKE- ALL KIND OF SYSTEM AND HOW IT WORKS IS THAT PERMITS ARE ISSUED FOR WATER RIGHT USERS UNTIL THERE IS NO WATER LEFT.

>> LAURA: IN NEW MEXICO WHEN DRY TIMES STRIKE, PEOPLE WITH THE OLDEST WATER RIGHTS, SENIOR WATER RIGHTS, GET WATER FIRST.

AND UNLESS PEOPLE DECIDE TO SHARE SHORTAGES, JUNIOR OR NEWER WATER RIGHTS CAN GET CUT.

THE OLDEST USERS, THE RIVERS THEMSELVES, THEIR ECOSYSTEMS, THEIR WILDLIFE, THEY CAN BE LEFT WITH NOTHING.

>> TASHJIAN: THESE WATER RIGHT ISSUES WERE ISSUED DURING WETTER TIMES UNDER THIS MODEL OF PRIOR APPROPRIATIONS WHERE THERE ARE MORE WATER RIGHT PERMITS THAN THERE IS WATER IN THE SYSTEM.

THAT WAS BEFORE WE REALLY STARTED TO SEE THE IMPACT OF CLIMATE CHANGE.

>> LAURA: IT IS CLEAR DRY RIVERBEDS ARE BAD FOR FISH, COTTONWOODS FOREST, ALL THE SPECIES INCLUDING HUMANS WHO RELY ON THEM.

>> TASHJIAN: DRY RIVERS ARE NOT GOOD FOR WATER MANAGEMENT ITSELF.

JUST TO MOVE WATER DOWN TO FARMERS DOWNSTREAM OR BE MOVING WATER FOR DELIVERING IT TO OUR NEIGHBORING STATES LIKE TEXAS, HAVING A DRY RIVER IS NOT AN EFFICIENT WAY OR EFFECTIVE WAY TO MOVE WATER.

ACROSS THE BOARD, DRY RIVERS ARE DETRIMENTAL.

>> LAURA: THERE ARE WAYS TO CHANGE THIS.

>> TASHJIAN: NEW MEXICO HAS DEVELOPED TOOLS TO KEEP WATER IN THE RIVERS WITHIN THE WATER RIGHTS SYSTEM AND I THINK IT IS REALLY IMPORTANT.

I CRITICIZE THE PRIORITY ADMINISTRATION SYSTEM BUT TO DISMANTLE IT ISN'T FEASIBLE.

>> LAURA: WE HAVE THE STRATEGIC WATER RESERVE USED TO KEEP WATER IN RIVERS FOR RARE ANIMALS PROTECTED UNDER THE ENDANGERED SPECIES ACT.

FISH LIKE THE RIO GRANDE SILVERY MINNOW, THE PECOS BLUNT-NOSE SHINER AND THE PIKE MINNOW IN THE SAN JUAN RIVER.

TO HELP THOSE SPECIES THE STATE CAN LEASE WATER FROM WILLING FARMERS.

>> TASHJIAN: ANOTHER TOOL IS THIS THING CALLED DYNAMIC WATER LEASING.

IT IS SORT OF A NEWER TOOL DEVELOPED BY IRRIGATION DISTRICTS, ONE WHERE IRRIGATION DISTRICTS THEMSELVES ARE LEASING WATER FROM WILLING LESSEES AND PUT INTO A SIMILAR KIND OF BANK AND STORED AND USED FOR ENVIRONMENTAL PURPOSES.

>> LAURA: THERE IS SO MUCH MORE TO DO.

>> TASHJIAN: WE ARE THE ONLY WESTERN STATE THAT DOESN'T HAVE AN ENVIRONMENTAL FLOW PROGRAM AND IT HAS BEEN TALKED ABOUT FOR A LONG TIME.

WHAT AN ENVIRONMENTAL FLOW PROGRAM DOES IS IT USES THE TOOLS THAT ARE TALKED ABOUT IN OTHER TOOLS LOCALLY TO TRY TO FIND CREATIVE SOLUTIONS AND IT REALLY SHIFTS THE GAME, SHIFTS IT FROM ONE WHERE YOU'RE MANAGING FOR ENDANGERED SPECIES AND IT IS OUT OF FEAR OF LITIGATION.

IT LEADS TO KIND OF EDGY MANAGEMENT AND I HAVE SEEN IT.

BUT IF YOU SHIFT IT TO WHAT DO LOCAL COMMUNITIES WANT?

WHAT IS IMPORTANT?

WHAT TOOLS WORK IN THAT LOCAL COMMUNITY.

IT IS A MUCH DIFFERENT WAY OF MANAGING A SYSTEM.

I THINK THAT IS REALLY IMPORTANT.

ENDANGERED SPECIES ARE CRITICAL AND IMPORTANT, BUT WHEN YOU'RE DEALING WITH ENDANGERED SPECIES, YOU'RE ALREADY AT A CRISIS POINT.

>> LAURA: ONCE THE RIVER DRIES AND DRIES THE NEXT YEAR AND DRIES AGAIN, WE GET USED TO THAT.

WE ACCEPT DRY OR BROKEN RIVERS AS NORMAL.

WE EVEN STOP REMEMBERING, STOP TELLING STORIES ABOUT WHAT A LIVING RIVER WAS LIKE.

>> TASHJIAN: EL PASO IS PRETTY REMARKABLE IF YOU HAVE EVER BEEN DOWN THERE.

IT IS BASICALLY A LARGE CONCRETE CHANNEL, WITH MAYBE A THREAD OF LEFT-OVER SEWAGE WATER OR SOMETHING RUNNING IT IN.

IT IS REALLY DEGRADING AND NO CORRIDOR OF TREES AROUND IT.

IT IS JUST A FUTURISTIC, CONCRETE, POST APOCALYPSE DITCH.

VERSUS HERE, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE A CORRIDOR OF COTTONWOOD AND WILLOW TREES AND GRASSLAND AND A FLOWING RIVER.

IT IS QUITE DIFFERENT.

HARD TO GO BACK.

YOU CAN'T SORT OF GO BACK TO -- A PLACE LIKE EL PASO, YOU CAN'T ALL OF A SUDDEN RESTORE THAT RIVER DOWN THERE.

ONCE IT IS GONE.

IT IS GONE.

>> LAURA: IN NEW MEXICO OUR RIVERS HAVE TAKEN CARE OF US FOR CENTURIES, FOREVER AND IF WE WANT TO KEEP THEM, IT IS TIME FOR US TO BE GIVING BACK.

FOR OUR LAND AND NEW MEXICO IN FOCUS, I AM LAURA PASKUS.

>> LAURA: THANKS FOR WATCHING - WE'LL SEE YOU NEXT WEEK.

>> Funding for New Mexico in Focus provided by Viewers Like You.