ANNOUNCER: IN THE TENS OF THOUSANDS OF YEARS SINCE THE EMERGENCE OF HUMANITY, THERE HAVE BEEN ONLY 3 GREAT EPOCHS: THE ERA OF NOMADIC LIFE AND HUNTER-GATHERERS; THE ERA IN WHICH HUMANS MASTERED SETTLED AGRICULTURE AND CAME TO DEVELOP CIVILIZATION; AND THE VERY SHORT 200 YEARS OF TRANSFORMATION TO THE INDUSTRIAL AGE.

MANY WOULD SAY THAT A FOURTH EPOCHAL CHANGE BEGAN WITH THE CREATION OF DIGITAL COMPUTERS AND THE INTRODUCTION OF THE INTERNET TOWARDS THE END OF THE 20th CENTURY.

BUT WHAT DOES THE 21st CENTURY AND BEYOND HAVE IN STORE?

MANY SEE AHEAD A TRANSFORMATION AS GREAT AS THESE PAST REVOLUTIONS, AFFECTING EVERY ASPECT OF HUMAN LIFE AND SOCIETY, PROPELLED BY ACCELERATING ADVANCES AND CONVERGENCE IN A NUMBER OF VITAL AREAS OF TECHNOLOGY, INCLUDING THE LIFE SCIENCES, ROBOTICS, ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE, AND ENERGY SOURCES NOT DERIVED FROM FOSSIL FUELS.

WHAT WILL THIS FUTURE LOOK LIKE?

SOMETHING CLOSE TO THE UTOPIAS CONCEIVED BY THE MIND OF MANKIND FOR MILLENNIA?

OR MORE LIKE ONE OF THE DYSTOPIAS ENVISIONED IN MUCH OF SCIENCE FICTION?

THIS EPISODE OF "THE WHOLE TRUTH" WAS MADE POSSIBLE BY... PHILADELPHIA'S HISTORIC DISTRICT IS BEST KNOWN AS AMERICA'S BIRTHPLACE; IT MIGHT SURPRISE YOU, THEN, THAT THE OLDEST PART OF PHILADELPHIA HAS THE LATEST AND GREATEST IN STREETS, PARKS, RESTAURANTS, AND SHOPS.

YOU'LL FIND VIBRANT ENERGY ALL AROUND.

LEARN MORE AT VISITPHILLY.COM.

AND BY... FOR HUNDREDS OF YEARS IN ENGLISH-SPEAKING COURTROOMS AROUND THE WORLD, PEOPLE HAVE SWORN AN OATH TO TELL NOT ONLY THE TRUTH, BUT RATHER THE WHOLE TRUTH.

THE OATH REFLECTS THE WISDOM THAT FAILING TO TELL ALL OF A STORY CAN BE AS EFFECTIVE AS LYING IF YOUR GOAL IS TO MAKE THE FACTS SUPPORT YOUR POINT OF VIEW.

IN THE COURTROOM, THE SEARCH FOR TRUTH ALSO RELIES ON ADVOCATES ADVANCING FIRM, CONTRADICTORY ARGUMENTS AND DOING SO WITH DECORUM.

ALL OF THESE APPLY TO THE COURT OF PUBLIC OPINION, WHAT JOHN STUART MILL CALLED "THE MARKETPLACE OF IDEAS."

THIS SERIES IS A PLACE IN WHICH THE COMPETING VOICES ON THE MOST IMPORTANT ISSUES OF OUR TIME ARE CHALLENGED AND SET IN A MEANINGFUL CONTEXT SO THAT VIEWERS LIKE YOU CAN DECIDE FOR THEMSELVES THE WHOLE TRUTH.

THERE IS SIMPLY NO DOUBT THAT WE ARE LIVING TODAY ON THE LEADING EDGE OF A GREAT WAVE, PERHAPS A TSUNAMI, OF TECHNOLOGICAL ADVANCEMENT.

SMARTPHONES AND THE INTERNET NOW LINK BILLIONS OF BRAINS, AND THE GROWTH CURVE SHOWS BILLIONS MORE ADDED TO THIS CONNECT IN HUMAN INTELLIGENCE OVER THE COMING RELATIVELY FEW YEARS.

AT THE SAME TIME, THE PACE OF ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE QUICKENS ENORMOUSLY.

TOGETHER, THESE TRENDS ACCELERATE THE PROCESS OF ACCELERATION, BUT WHAT DOES IT ALL MEAN?

HOW WILL OUR CHILDREN, GRANDCHILDREN, AND GREAT-GRANDCHILDREN LIVE, WORK, PLAY?

IT'S SCIENCE FICTION THAT MANY TURN TO FOR SOME OF THE ANSWERS ON THESE QUESTIONS ABOUT OUR FUTURE.

BUT AS ANY FOLLOWER OF THE GENRE KNOWS, THERE IS A SHARP DIVIDE AMONG THE THINKERS AND WRITERS ABOUT THE FUTURE, BETWEEN THOSE WHO SEE A VIRTUAL UTOPIA WITH DISEASE DEFEATED, PRODUCTIVE LIFE ENORMOUSLY PROLONGED, DANGEROUS AND MENIAL WORK GIVEN OVER TO THE ROBOTS, THE EXPLORATION OF SPACE AND THE EXPLORATION OF THE INNER SPACE OF ALL OF HUMANITY'S HIGHEST AND BEST CAPABILITIES, BUT THERE ARE OTHERS WHO SEE ANY NUMBER OF FORMS OF DYSTOPIA, WHETHER FROM THE BREAKDOWN OF OUR INTRICATE, AND THEREFORE VULNERABLE TECHNOLOGIES, OR FROM THE SUCCESS OF THOSE TECHNOLOGIES, WHETHER IT'S A WORLD IN WHICH ONLY A FEW PEOPLE BENEFIT ECONOMICALLY FROM THE NEW TECHNOLOGIES, WHILE THE REST ARE IMPOVERISHED, OR EVEN A WORLD IN WHICH THE MACHINES AND VIRTUAL LIFE FORMS WE ARE ABLE TO CREATE TURN AGAINST US.

THESE ARE QUESTIONS FOR TODAY'S EPISODE OF "THE WHOLE TRUTH."

HERE TO DISCUSS THESE IMPORTANT QUESTIONS ARE OUR GUESTS: DR. GREGORY STOCK, RESEARCH PROFESSOR OF GENETICS AND GENOMICS STUDIES, AND CO-DIRECTOR OF THE HARRIS CENTER FOR PRECISION WELLNESS, ICAHN SCHOOL OF MEDICINE AT MOUNT SINAI; DR. STEWART PRAGER, DIRECTOR OF PRINCETON PLASMA PHYSICS LABORATORY; EDMUND LEE, MANAGING EDITOR, "RE/CODE."

GENTLEMEN, THANK YOU FOR BEING WITH US TODAY.

I'D LIKE TO START WITH A QUESTION FOR EVERYONE WHICH I BELIEVE IS RELEVANT TO ALL, DESPITE YOUR RESPECTIVE AREAS OF EXPERTISE.

I WILL READ A QUOTE FROM THE FOUNDING EXECUTIVE EDITOR OF "WIRED" MAGAZINE, KEVIN KELLY.

HE WRITES...

IT SOUNDS LIKE A POEM.

THIS IS NOT ONLY ABOUT BUSINESS, BUT THIS IS ABOUT TECHNOLOGY.

THERE HAVE BEEN DIFFERING VIEWS ABOUT THIS, BUT ARE WE LIVING IN THE GREATEST... TECHNOLOGY ERA EVER, WOULD YOU SAY?

DR. STOCK?

WELL, I THINK IT'S VERY CLEAR THAT THERE IS TRANSFORMATIVE CHANGE THAT'S GOING ON TODAY, AND I MEAN FUNDAMENTAL-- A FUNDAMENTAL TRANSITION THAT A HUNDRED YEARS, A THOUSAND YEARS FROM NOW-- AND I THINK KEVIN REALLY UNDERSTANDS THIS-- PEOPLE WILL LOOK BACK AT THIS MOMENT AND SAY, "THIS WAS A TRANSITIONAL MOMENT."

EISENHOWER: WHICH ONE?

THIS IS A MOMENT RIGHT NOW-- FIRST OF ALL, THE INANIMATE WORLD WAS ESSENTIALLY ANIMATED WHEN WE BREATHED INTELLIGENCE INTO THE SAND AT OUR FEET, OK?

FUNDAMENTAL TRANSITION, NOT TO BE REPEATED.

THE OTHER THING THAT'S HUGE IS THAT BIOLOGY, THROUGH OURSELVES, WE'RE COMING TO UNDERSTAND ITS WORKINGS AT A INTIMATE ENOUGH LEVEL, AT A PROFOUND ENOUGH LEVEL THAT WE'RE BEGINNING TO MANIPULATE AND CHANGE THOSE SORTS OF THINGS, TWEAK IT, ALTER IT; ISSUES LIKE LONGEVITY AND LIFESPAN... MM-HMM.

GENETIC ENGINEERING, AND YOU GET, YOU KNOW, ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE.

SO THIS IS A FOUNDATIONAL MOMENT, AND AT A MOMENT OF TRANSITION LIKE THAT, THERE IS GREAT OPPORTUNITY BECAUSE PARADIGMS ARE BEING BROKEN.

LIFE SCIENCE?

HOW ABOUT NUCLEAR PHYSICS?

I WOULD AGREE WITH THAT STATEMENT THAT THIS TIME IS THE MOST PROPITIOUS TIME FOR DRAMATIC TECHNOLOGICAL CHANGE, HOWEVER, I WOULD THINK THAT YOU CAN PROBABLY APPLY THAT SAME CONCLUSION TO ANY PRIOR TIME BECAUSE IF YOU LOOK AT THE DEVELOPMENT OF THE STATE OF KNOWLEDGE OF HUMANKIND, IT'S BEEN PROGRESSIVELY GOING UP AND UP AND UP.

IN THE 20th CENTURY, THERE WAS A HUGE INTELLECTUAL REVOLUTION WITH THE DISCOVERY OF RELATIVITY AND QUANTUM MECHANICS.

THAT INTRODUCED OUR UNDERSTANDING OF THE NUCLEUS, NUCLEAR POWER.

QUANTUM MECHANICS LED TO THE COMPUTER REVOLUTION, SO I THINK IT'S A TRUE STATEMENT, BUT I DON'T SEE ANY REASON TO BELIEVE THAT WE'RE AT A UNIQUE MOMENT; THAT IS, YOU CAN SAY THAT EVERY PRIOR MOMENT WAS ALSO UNIQUELY OPPORTUNISTIC IN TERMS OF TECHNOLOGY.

MEANING THAT LIFE SCIENCE IS ACCOMPLISHING SOMETHING TODAY LIKE FLIGHT.

PRAGER: RIGHT, EXACTLY, SO I THINK THE LIFE SCIENCES MAY BE AT A VERY SPECIAL POINT NOW, BUT IN THE LAST CENTURY, AERODYNAMICS WAS AT A SPECIAL POINT, PHYSICS WAS AT A SPECIAL POINT, THE COMPUTER REVOLUTION WAS AT A SPECIAL POINT.

LEE: I THINK... EISENHOWER: ED?

I THINK, FOR CONTEXT AROUND THAT STATEMENT, I THINK PART OF THE POINT OF THAT, WHAT KEVIN'S REALLY SAYING THERE IS THAT CHANCES, THE OPPORTUNITIES ARE MORE WIDELY DISTRIBUTED NOW THAN EVER BEFORE.

I THINK, YOU KNOW, EARLIER REVOLUTIONS IN TECHNOLOGY SORT OF HAPPENED IN SORT OF R&D LABS AT MAJOR CORPORATIONS OR GOVERNMENT-FUNDED INSTITUTIONS AND WAS NECESSARY TO SORT OF GET THINGS STARTED.

BUT I THINK WHAT'S HAPPENING NOW IN THE INFRASTRUCTURE OF TECHNOLOGY IS SUCH THAT YOU CAN HAVE SORT OF THE GARAGE START-UP, SO TO SPEAK... EISENHOWER: RIGHT.

THE 2 OR 3 CODERS OUT OF UNIVERSITY STARTING A MULTI-BILLION-DOLLAR START-UP, THAT KIND OF THING.

EISENHOWER: WALKING AROUND WITH MORE GIGABYTES IN A SMARTPHONE THAN THE-- BUT, AGAIN, YOU HAVE, YOU KNOW, THE WRIGHT BROTHERS OR-- SOMETHING OF THAT-- RIGHT, WHO STARTED OUT-- BUT I THINK IT REALLY IS TRUE THAT THE TOOLS TO ALLOW...

VERY SIGNIFICANT INNOVATIONS TO OCCUR, AND THEN TO DISSEMINATE THEM QUITE BROADLY IN WAYS THAT CAN BE VERY SUCCESSFUL WITH SMALL NUMBERS OF PEOPLE AND--EXIST RIGHT NOW.

IN YOUR OWN WORK AND SO FORTH, CAN YOU GIVE OUR VIEWERS, I WOULD SAY, YOUR TOP 2 OR 3 PREDICTIONS AS TO WHAT WE WILL SEE IN YOUR FIELD-- DEVELOP IN YOUR FIELD BY, SAY, 2025, 2050?

WHAT'S AROUND THE BEND, DR. STOCK, IN-- WELL, I SEE THAT THE NATURE OF MEDICINE IN HEALTHCARE WILL BE COMPLETELY TRANSFORMED IN A HIGHLY DISRUPTIVE WAY.

I THINK YOU'RE GOING TO SEE DEMOCRATIZATION OF MEDICINE, A PERSONALIZATION OF MEDICINE, A FOCUS ON-- AND BY THAT, I MEAN TAILORED TO THE INDIVIDUAL, YOU'RE GOING TO SEE VERY, VERY DEEP MONITORING THAT'S GOING TO OCCUR-- NOW, WHAT DOES DEMOCRATIZATION MEAN?

DOES THAT MEAN WE BECOME OUR OWN DOCTORS, OR-- I THINK THAT WE WILL BE INVOLVED WITH MEDICINE, AND IT'LL BE PATIENT-CENTERED, RATHER THAN PHYSICIAN-CENTERED.

HMM.

THERE IS GOING TO BE AN INFUSION OF MACHINE LEARNING AND ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE INTO THAT, AND I SEE THAT MOST OF THE DISCUSSION OF HEALTHCARE TODAY IS, "OH, MY GOODNESS.

"THIS IS GOING TO BE A DISASTER.

HOW ARE WE GOING TO POSSIBLY DELIVER IT TO PEOPLE BROADLY?"

AND I THINK THAT IT WILL BE FAR BETTER THAN ANYTHING THAT EXISTS TODAY, THAT IT WILL BE AVAILABLE 24/7, THAT IT'LL COME THROUGH WINDOWS ON YOUR PHONE, BASICALLY; THAT IT'LL BE DRIVEN BY TECHNOLOGY, AND THAT-- SO IT'S GOING TO BE A SITU--YOU DON'T HAVE TO HAVE ACCESS TO THE MAYO CLINIC, SO TO SPEAK, NOR HAVE-- STOCK: YOU'LL HAVE ACCESS TO IT, BUT IT'LL BE THROUGH ALL OF THE EMBODIMENT OF THAT THAT IS GOING TO BECOME, YOU KNOW, AUTOMATED.

STEWART?

I'LL SAY TWO THINGS.

ON THE OPPORTUNITIES SIDE, YOU ASKED IN OUR SPECIFIC FIELD, SO I WORK ON PHYSICS APPLIED TO CARBON-FREE ENERGY SOURCES, PARTICULARLY FUSION ENERGY, AND IF YOU LOOK AT HOW HUMANKIND HAS PRODUCED ENERGY, THE PERIOD OF PRODUCING ENERGY BY CARBON-BASED SOURCES IS GOING TO BE A SMALL, LITTLE BLIP IN TIME.

MMM.

YOU KNOW, IF YOU WERE TO PLOT HOW WE PRODUCE ENERGY FROM 10,000 YEARS AGO TO 10,000 YEARS FROM TODAY, IT'S JUST GOING TO BE A LITTLE MOMENT THAT WE'RE PRODUCING ENERGY BY CARBON-BASED FOSSIL FUELS BECAUSE WE CAN'T CONTINUE TO DO IT AND ALSO BECAUSE WE WILL EXHAUST IT.

SO WE'RE ACTUALLY IN A UNIQUE TIME PERIOD NOW.

IT MAY EXTEND A COUPLE OF THOUSAND YEARS, LOOKING BACKWARDS A LITTLE BIT, MAYBE JUST 50 YEARS LOOKING FORWARD, IN WHICH WE PRODUCE ENERGY BY CARBON SOURCES, SO I THINK, BY 2050, AND IN THE COUPLE OF DECADES BEYOND, WE WILL TRANSITION TO A CARBON-FREE ECONOMY.

EISENHOWER: I'M CURIOUS.

CARBON IS FINITE...

YES.

AND CARBON SOURCES ARE FINITE.

ARE THERE REASONS TO KEEP IT AROUND?

IN OTHER WORDS, WILL WE HAVE ALTERNATIVE USES OTHER THAN JUST SIMPLY BURNING IT UP AS FUEL?

I THINK THAT'S A VERY GOOD POINT.

I THINK IT'S--YEAH, THE ANSWER'S ABSOLUTELY YES.

YES.

I MEAN, THESE MATERIALS THAT ARE IN THE GROUND WE WILL NEED TO DEVELOP NEW MATERIALS FOR THINGS WE HAVEN'T EVEN THOUGHT OF TODAY.

SO EVEN PUTTING ASIDE THE ISSUES OF CLIMATE CHANGE AND THE DAMAGE OF CARBON SOURCES TO THE ENVIRONMENT, IT'S FOOLISH TO USE UP THESE UNIQUE RESOURCES THAT BUILT--THAT'S BEEN BUILT UP OVER MILLIONS OF YEARS.

SO I THINK WE'RE ON THE CUSP OF CHANGING TO A CARBON-FREE ECONOMY.

MY OWN VERY SUB-SUB-SPECIALTY-- I THINK FUSION ENERGY, WHICH IS THE ENERGY OF THE UNIVERSE, WILL BE A KEY PLAYER.

NOW, WHEN YOU ASK THE QUESTION "WHAT DO WE SEE COMING IN TECHNOLOGY BY 2050 OR A LITTLE BIT BEYOND?"

IT'S OUR NATURE TO THINK OF ALL THE POSITIVES, AND NOT TO BE--JUST TO BE A LITTLE, TINY BIT OF A CONTRARIAN, YOU CAN ALSO ASK THE QUESTION "WHAT'S THE TECHNOLOGICAL OPPORTUNITIES TO DO BAD?"

AND THERE YOU BRING IN THE POSSIBILITY OF WARFARE, AND SINCE I CAME-- I'M A PHYSICIST.

YOU KNOW, PHYSICS HAS GIVEN RISE TO NUCLEAR WEAPONS, SO IF YOU REALLY WANT TO HAVE A BALANCED PROJECTION MOVING FORWARD, YOU HAVE TO CONSIDER EVERYTHING WE WANT THAT WILL BE POSITIVELY TRANSFORMATIVE.

BUT ALL OF THAT ALSO-- MOST THINGS THAT YOU DEVELOP THAT ARE POSITIVE CAN ALSO BE USED, HORRIBLE TO SAY, FOR WARFARE, SO...

RIGHT.

I THINK, YOU KNOW-- IN A WAY, IT'S A UNIQUE FIELD BECAUSE THE NEGATIVE LED THE POSITIVE THERE.

IN OTHER WORDS, THE WEAPON IS DEVELOPED BEFORE THE CIVILIAN APPLICATIONS?

THAT'S CORRECT.

YES.

THAT'S CORRECT, SO THERE HAS TO BE-- MAYBE THIS WILL COME BACK TO BIOLOGICAL REVOLUTION-- THERE HAS TO BE SOME ALTERATION IN THE WAY THAT PEOPLE INTERACT SOCIALLY BECAUSE OUR SOCIAL DEVELOPMENT IS VERY OBVIOUSLY BEING FAR, FAR OUTSTRIPPED BY OUR TECHNOLOGICAL DEVELOPMENT.

THAT'S A CRITICAL POINT.

WHAT WOULD YOU SAY, ED?

IT'S ALREADY HAPPENING NOW, BUT ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE IS SOMETHING THAT WILL DEFINITELY CHANGE HOW WE ACCESS INFORMATION, HOW WE ACCESS COMPUTING, SO TO SPEAK, SO WE WENT FROM PERSONAL COMPUTERS TO NOW SMARTPHONES.

WHAT ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE WILL ALLOW US TO DO IS TO JUST ACCESS INFORMATION DATA, JUST SORT OF BE A VOICE, BE A JUST SORT OF MORE-- IN A MORE DISTRIBUTED WAY, SO YOU'RE NOT NECESSARILY GOING TO BE WALKING AROUND WITH SMARTPHONES, OR WHAT WE THINK OF AS SMARTPHONES TODAY.

I THINK COMPUTING POWER WILL JUST BE SO READILY AVAILABLE WHEREVER YOU ARE, THAT THAT'S HOW YOU WILL END UP INTERACTING AND HOW YOU WILL SORT OF MAKE USE OF THE INFORMATION OR THE COMPUTING POWER THAT'S THERE.

WHETHER IT'S, YOU KNOW, WITHIN YOUR HOME ITSELF OR YOU'RE AT A STORE OR AT YOUR OFFICE, FOR THAT MATTER, YOU'RE NOT GOING TO BE TIED TO A SPECIFIC DEVICE, NECESSARILY, AND I THINK THAT'LL BE AN IMPORTANT REVOLUTION, IN TERMS OF HOW THAT'S GOING TO CHANGE.

THE OTHER TOPIC I'D LIKE TO SORT OF ADDRESS A LITTLE BIT IS THE NEWS BUSINESS ITSELF.

I THINK IT'S UNDERGOING MASSIVE CHANGE RIGHT NOW, HAS BEEN FOR AT LEAST THE LAST 15 YEARS, WITH THE ADVENT OF THE COMMERCIAL INTERNET.

I DO THINK, GOING FORWARD, IT'S GOING TO GET MORE DIFFICULT FOR TRADITIONAL NEWS BUSINESSES TO OPERATE IN THE WAY THEY HAVE, LARGELY JUST BECAUSE THE WAY CONSUMERS ARE LOOKING AT NEWS OR GETTING THEIR NEWS IS SORT OF VERY FRACTURED; THERE ISN'T A SINGLE SOURCE, THERE ISN'T...

IT'S AS MUCH WHAT YOU HEAR FROM YOUR FRIENDS, YOUR FACEBOOK FEED, AS ANYTHING ELSE, AND I THINK, YOU KNOW, THAT THERE'S A POTENTIAL CRISIS IN THAT, IN TERMS OF, YOU KNOW, WE'RE ENGAGING NOW IN A POLITICAL PROCESS WHERE A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE JUST DISPUTING FACTS OR DECIDING WHICH FACTS ARE IMPORTANT TO THEM, IF THEY'RE FACTS AT ALL.

WE'VE TALKED ABOUT SORT OF THE GOOD AND THE BAD OF THESE THINGS OR ALLUDED TO THAT BEING A POSSIBILITY, WHICH I THINK IS VERY CLEAR THAT IT'S GOING TO BE VERY CHAOTIC, THAT NOT ONLY CAN YOU USE THINGS IN WAYS THAT ARE DESTRUCTIVE OR PROBLEMATIC, BUT PEOPLE WILL.

I MEAN, THAT'S WHAT'S HAPPENED WITH EVERY TECHNOLOGY, AND THAT IT'S GOING TO BE HIGHLY UNPREDICTABLE.

THIS IS AN EMERGENT PHENOMENON.

IT'S NOT THAT ANYBODY CAN STEP BACK AND PLAN THESE THINGS, NOBODY REALLY HAS A CLUE OF HOW THIS WILL PLAY OUT IN SHORT TERM.

YOU CAN LOOK AT, YOU KNOW, LARGER TRAJECTORIES, BUT THE BALANCE BETWEEN SORT OF WHAT HAPPENS BEFORE ANOTHER THING THAT OCCURS, SO, YOU KNOW, THE RELATIVE POSITIONING OF DEVELOPMENTS, WHAT THE TRANSITIONAL BREAKTHROUGHS ARE, IT'S REALLY GOING TO BE A MESS, AND IN TERMS OF USING TECHNOLOGIES THAT ARE POTENTIALLY DESTRUCTIVE, YOU CAN SEE THAT REALLY EASILY; IT'S NOT JUST NUCLEAR STUFF, IT'S GOING TO BE BIOTERRORISM, IT'S GOING TO BE-- AS YOU BEGIN TO UNDERSTAND THE WORKINGS OF THE WORLD AND HAVE THE TOOLS TO MANIPULATE AND ALTER THAT, TO COMMUNICATE WITH ONE ANOTHER, IT BECOMES VERY DIFFICULT TO CONTROL.

RIGHT.

WHAT'S HAPPENING NOW THAT I THINK IS REALLY DIFFERENT, THOUGH, IS THAT TECHNOLOGY IS MORE AVAILABLE TO EVERYDAY PEOPLE IN SUCH A WAY THAT EVERYDAY PEOPLE CAN CHANGE IT FOR THEIR OWN PURPOSES...

RIGHT.

THEIR OWN USES.

THAT'S WHERE IT'S SORT OF--THE GENIE'S OUT OF THE BOTTLE IN A WAY, AND I THINK IT'S POTENTIALLY MORE PROBLEMATIC.

I THINK THAT THERE'S CERTAINLY NO STOPPING THE EVOLUTION OF TECHNOLOGY AND SCIENCE.

IT'S COMPLETELY UNSTOPPABLE.

THE COLLECTIVE HUMAN BRAIN WANTS TO KEEP PUSHING THAT FORWARD, AND THAT WILL ABSOLUTELY NEVER STOP, NO MATTER WHERE IT LEADS.

DISTINGUISHED, THOUGHTFUL PEOPLE LIKE DR. STEPHEN HAWKING, ELON MUSK, HAVE ISSUED SERIOUS WARNINGS ABOUT MACHINE INTELLIGENCE AND ROBOTICS GETTING OUT OF CONTROL.

IN A LESSER FORM OF THIS FEAR, MACHINES SIMPLY TAKE OVER MOST OF THE JOBS, AND WHILE THERE IS PRODUCTIVE CAPABILITY FOR MATERIAL ABUNDANCE IN THE WORLD, THERE IS ALSO GREAT POVERTY AND MISERY.

IN OTHER WORDS, COUNTLESS PEOPLE BEING MARGINALIZED AND SO FORTH, THE MAJORITY OF THE PEOPLE DO NOT HAVE THE ABILITY TO ACCESS WORK AND INCOME AND THE FRUITS OF LABOR WHICH HAVE BEEN TAKEN OVER BY MACHINES.

WHAT'S YOUR RESPONSE TO THIS?

SO I THINK THERE ARE MULTIPLE WAYS TO ANALYZE THIS.

I THINK, IN TERMS OF THE ECONOMIC ARGUMENT THAT WITH ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE AND THINGS BEING AUTOMATED, ULTIMATELY, THAT JUST SORT OF-- YOU JUST TAKE AWAY THE HUMAN IN THAT EQUATION AND WHAT'S THE NEED FOR A HUMAN?

I THINK THAT'S A LITTLE FAR AFIELD.

I DO THINK, IF YOU THINK ABOUT HOW AUTOMATION HAS GONE ON FOR--WITHIN THE INDUSTRIAL AGE, WHAT IT'S DONE IS IT'S PUSHED ECONOMIES FROM BEING MANUFACTURING ECONOMIES TO BEING SORT OF SERVICE AND WHITE-COLLAR ECONOMIES, SO TO SPEAK, RIGHT, WHICH IS THE TRANSFORMATION THE U.S. IS GOING THROUGH RIGHT NOW STILL, AND MY POINT IS THAT AS AUTOMATION TAKES HOLD IN ALL DIFFERENT FORMS, IT JUST PUSHES THE ECONOMY INTO A DIFFERENT FIELD.

IN OTHER WORDS, THERE WILL ALWAYS BE A NEED FOR A BRAIN AT WORK THAT'S NOT AN AUTOMATED BRAIN, YOU KNOW, WHICH-- WE CALL THEM ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE RIGHT NOW.

RIGHT.

IT'S NOT THAT INTELLIGENT.

IT'S JUST SMARTER SOFTWARE THAT SORT OF CAN ANTICIPATE THINGS AT A GREATER SCALE.

SO THAT'S--I THINK THAT'S ONE SIDE OF IT.

I DO THINK, HOWEVER, ON THE OTHER SIDE, THAT THERE IS A TRUER, DEEPER CONCERN, WHICH IS WE TALK ABOUT HOW TECHNOLOGIES CAN BE RUN AWAY AND THAT TECHNOLOGIES CAN BE USED BOTH IN GOOD WAYS AND BAD WAYS, HOWEVER THEY'RE APPLIED.

THERE IS THIS SENSE THAT WITH ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE, THAT THERE'S SOMETHING INNATE OR INHERENT TO THAT KIND OF TECHNOLOGY THAT ALLOWS IT TO BE MORE READILY MISAPPLIED, RIGHT, AND I THINK THAT IS THE DANGER-- THAT IS A DEEPER DANGER THAT PEOPLE LIKE ELON MUSK AND STEPHEN HAWKING ARE SORT OF HINTING AT, IS THAT IT'S SOMETHING THAT BY ITSELF WILL BECOME POTENTIALLY BAD, THAT WE, YOU KNOW, THROUGH NO FAULT OF OUR OWN, OTHER THAN THE FACT THAT WE STARTED IT IN THE FIRST PLACE.

WE CREATE-- STOCK: I THINK THERE'S A LITTLE BIT OF A DENIAL, LARGE NUMBERS OF PEOPLE, AND I THINK YOU'RE EXPRESSING IT THERE WHEN YOU SAY--YOU KNOW, IN THE PAST, WE'VE ALWAYS ELIMINATED POSITIONS, WE'VE ALWAYS--TECHNOLOGY HAS ARRIVED, AND THERE'S ALWAYS BEEN NEW STUFF TO DO.

WE'VE MOVED FROM FARMING, AGRICULTURE TO MANUFACTURING TO SERVICE.

IF YOU LOOK AT WHAT'S GOING ON NOW IN A RELATIVELY SHORT PERIOD OF TIME, IT IS NOT OBVIOUS WHAT THAT NEXT SECTOR IS.

IF THIS IS A RUNAWAY HORSE... PRAGER: MM-HMM.

AND NO--IS ANYBODY IN CONTROL OF IT?

CAN TECHNOLOGY BE AN INSTRUMENT OF NATIONAL POLICY, SO TO SPEAK?

I THINK THERE IS AN ASPECT OF TECHNOLOGY THAT SHOULD NOT BE AND SIMPLY CANNOT BE AND WILL NEVER BE CONTROLLED, RIGHT?

THAT THE FORWARD ADVANCE OF TECHNOLOGY, I THINK, WILL NEVER STOP UNLESS THERE'S A CATACLYSM.

YOU JUST CAN'T STOP THE HUMANS FROM KEEPING ON INVENTING, AND WE ALWAYS WANT TO INCREASE OUR PRESERVATION, INCREASING LONGEVITY, YOU WANT TO BE AROUND LONGER...

RIGHT.

YOU KNOW, WANT CARBON-FREE ENERGY SOURCES SO WE CAN LIVE MORE HEALTHFULLY, SO WE'RE REALLY NOT THAT DIFFERENT THAN THE PRIMITIVE MAN FROM SOME TIME AGO.

HOWEVER, ALTHOUGH TECHNOLOGY SHOULDN'T BE STOPPED AND CANNOT BE STOPPED, IT REALLY--YOU COULD ARGUE IT MUST BE--MUST HAVE SOME DEGREE OF CONTROL.

SO THERE ARE MUST-BE-- SOME DEGREE OF CONTROL, AND THE SIMPLE EXAMPLE OF THAT IS NUCLEAR WEAPONS.

THERE HAS TO BE A CONTROL OVER NUCLEAR WEAPONS OR WE WILL ANNIHILATE OURSELVES.

SO YOU CAN'T STOP THE DISCOVERY OF THE NUCLEUS OF THE ATOM, YOU CAN'T STOP THE UNDERSTANDING OF ALL THE MECHANICS THAT GOES INTO HOW YOU MAKE A NUCLEAR BOMB, BUT YOU HAVE TO BE ABLE TO CONTROL IT SOMEHOW.

BUT THERE ARE CHOICES THAT HAVE BEEN MADE.

THERE HAS BEEN A CHOICE MADE IN TERMS OF NUCLEAR POWER GENERATION.

THAT IS BASICALLY NEVER GOING TO BE A DOMINANT TECHNOLOGY.

IT'S VERY CLEAR, THE COST OF THAT-- AND I'M TALKING ABOUT FISSION-- THAT IT'S TOO EXPENSIVE RIGHT NOW.

AND THAT'S BECAUSE OF ALL SORT--YOU CAN ARGUE ABOUT WHETHER IT'S VALID IN TERMS OF HOW SOCIETY IS REGULATING THAT OR WHETHER IT COULD BE, BUT IT'S NOT GOING TO BE.

THERE ARE TOO MANY OTHER TECHNOLOGIES THAT ARE EMERGING AT THIS POINT.

LEE: I THINK TECHNOLOGIES IN GENERAL ARE TENDING TOWARDS EFFICIENCIES, RIGHT?

THAT IS "IF I CAN MAKE SOMETHING CHEAPER, "FASTER, MORE READILY AVAILABLE, WE WILL DO SO."

AND I THINK WHAT'S INTERESTING IS YOU'RE SEEING SORT OF THIS-- MUCH MORE FRICTION NOW BETWEEN THE EMERGENCE OF TECHNOLOGIES AND HOW READILY AVAILABLE IT IS AND MAKING THINGS CHEAPER, AND JUST HOW ECONOMIES HAVE WORKED IN GENERAL, WHICH IS TO VALUE THINGS THAT ARE SCARCE.

THE IDEA OF TECHNOLOGY IS TO MAKE THINGS MORE EFFICIENT AND LESS SCARCE, WHETHER IT'S THROUGH BETTER FORMS OF ENERGY OR JUST BETTER SCALE IN TERMS OF SERVICES.

EISENHOWER: RIGHT.

IT'S THE ECONOMIC SORT OF SIDE OF THAT THAT HASN'T CAUGHT UP.

THAT PART OF THE EQUATION HASN'T MATCHED...

RIGHT.

THE PROGRESS OF TECHNOLOGY IN A WAY THAT I THINK THAT'S WHY THERE'S SO MUCH MORE SORT OF AMBIVALENCE OR CONCERN ABOUT TECHNOLOGY AS-- EISENHOWER: WELL, THAT'S WHERE INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY KICKS IN IN A WAY.

IN OTHER WORDS, PEOPLE WHO...HAVE THE ABILITY TO DEVISE SOLUTIONS AND SO FORTH STILL SEEM TO REQUIRE--OR THEY REQUIRE INCENTIVES.

BUT EVENTUALLY, SCIENCE COMES OUT OF THE-- STOCK: SO THE REAL CHALLENGES THAT I SEE, IN TERMS OF ON THE NEGATIVE SIDE AND THE THINGS THAT I THINK WILL BE MOST DIFFICULT FOR US, ARE NOT THE ASPECTS OF ANY OF THESE TECHNOLOGIES WHERE THE VISION THAT PEOPLE HAVE THAT ARE CREATING OR CREATING THE APPLICATIONS OR DEVELOPMENT ARE BASICALLY FOR BENEFIT.

LIKE, IN BIOLOGY, YOU SEE THAT ALL THE TIME, LIKE ISSUES OF CLONING OR GENETIC ENGINEERING, THAT BASICALLY YOU CAN ARGUE ABOUT WHETHER THAT'S A GOOD IDEA OR NOT, BUT IT'S NOT MALEVOLENT; WHEREAS, WHEN YOU CREATE A KNOWLEDGE THAT REALLY GIVES-- LOWERS THE BARRIERS TO MANIPULATION OF FUNDAMENTAL PROCESSES, BE THAT IN ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE, BE THAT IN THE LIFE SCIENCES, YOU KNOW, THE BARRIERS COME DOWN AND DOWN AND DOWN TO WHERE BASICALLY ANYBODY CAN DO IT.

THE JOURNEY IS INCREASINGLY GOING TO BE AN INNER JOURNEY, AND THE REAL ISSUES ARE HOW WE ARE GOING TO TRANSFORM OURSELVES 'CAUSE WE HAVE THE-- WE ARE HERE.

THAT'S MORE INTERESTING TO MOST OF-- MOST PEOPLE IN TERMS OF, YOU KNOW, WHO WE ARE, WHAT IT MEANS TO BE HUMAN, AND THAT'S BECOMING QUITE MALLEABLE, OR HAS THE PROSPECT OF BECOMING MALLEABLE IN A VARIETY OF WAYS; NOT JUST GENETIC ENGINEERING, IMPACTS ON LIFESPAN.

WHAT IS GOING TO BE THE IMPACT IF THERE'S ACTUALLY MACHINE-- NOT JUST INTELLIGENCE, BUT CONSCIOUSNESS?

YOU ALL HAVE GIVEN US A PHENOMENALLY FASCINATING...

GLIMPSE INTO THIS SUBJECT, WHICH IS SOMETHING THAT...FASCINATES ME AND MUST FASCINATE ABSOLUTELY EVERYBODY WHO'S ALIVE TODAY; THAT IS, THE CHANGE WHICH IS UNFOLDING BEFORE OUR VERY EYES.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH, GENTLEMEN.

THANK YOU.

THANK YOU.

THE ECONOMIST JOSEPH SCHUMPETER CALLED CAPITALISM "THE PROCESS OF CREATIVE DESTRUCTION."

THIS DESCRIPTION SURELY APPLIES EVEN MORE SO TO ONE OF THE PRIMARY FORCES WHICH PROPELS CAPITALISM: TECHNOLOGICAL PROGRESS.

THERE IS NO DOUBT THAT WE ARE LIVING THROUGH A CHANGE IN KIND, NOT SIMPLY DEGREE, WITH RESPECT TO THE PACE OF SCIENTIFIC DISCOVERY AND TECHNOLOGICAL ADVANCEMENT.

THE CONNECTEDNESS OF HUMAN INTELLIGENCE AND THE GROWING CAPABILITIES OF ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE ARE MOVING TOWARDS THE CREATION OF SOME SORT OF TRULY NEW WORLD.

BUT WILL IT BE PRIMARILY CHARACTERIZED BY MATERIAL ABUNDANCE, INCREASED LONGEVITY AND LEISURE, AND THE FREEDOM OF HUMAN BEINGS OF ALL SHAPES AND SIZES AND IN ALL PLACES TO DEVELOP THEIR BEST SELVES, OR WILL IT BE ONE OF THE VARIETIES OF BRAVE NEW WORLD PREDICTED BY MANY NOVELISTS ABOUT THE FUTURE?

AND WHAT OF THE PERIOD OF TRANSITION?

WILL LARGE GROUPS OF PEOPLE IN ALL COUNTRIES AND SOME ENTIRE COUNTRIES BE ESSENTIALLY DISPOSED OF-- IN AN ECONOMIC SENSE, AT LEAST--BY THE EMERGENCE OF NEW TECHNOLOGIES?

THERE IS NO DOUBT THAT IN ALL OF THE RAPIDLY DEVELOPING FIELDS OF HUMAN KNOWLEDGE AND CAPABILITY, FROM GENETICS TO ARTIFICIAL INTELLIGENCE TO ROBOTICS TO THE SOURCES OF ENERGY PRODUCTION TO THE ABILITY TO EXPLORE IN SPACE BRING WITH THEM ENORMOUS ETHICAL AND PUBLIC POLICY QUESTIONS AND CHALLENGES OF A SORT NEVER BEFORE SEEN.

IT SEEMS TO ME THAT THE WHOLE TRUTH OF THE FUTURE OF TECHNOLOGY AND ITS EFFECT ON HUMANITY LIES IN WHETHER OR NOT OUR POLITICAL AND CULTURAL INSTITUTIONS CAN KEEP PACE WITH THE TECHNOLOGICAL CAPABILITIES THEMSELVES AND PROVIDE SATISFACTORY ANSWERS TO THE MORAL, ECONOMIC, AND SOCIETAL QUESTIONS WHICH THESE TECHNOLOGIES WILL INEVITABLY BRING.

I'M DAVID EISENHOWER, AND THANK YOU FOR BEING WITH US ON "THE WHOLE TRUTH."

ANNOUNCER: THIS EPISODE OF "THE WHOLE TRUTH" WAS MADE POSSIBLE BY... PHILADELPHIA'S HISTORIC DISTRICT IS BEST KNOWN AS AMERICA'S BIRTHPLACE; IT MIGHT SURPRISE YOU, THEN, THAT THE OLDEST PART OF PHILADELPHIA HAS THE LATEST AND GREATEST IN STREETS, PARKS, RESTAURANTS, AND SHOPS.

YOU'LL FIND VIBRANT ENERGY ALL AROUND.

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