♪ >> Hello everyone and welcome to Amanpour and Company.

Here is what is coming up.

>> As American lawmakers race to avert a catastrophic debt default, what exactly is in the deal.

We hone in on what will mean for climate policy and then: >> They described them as a paramilitary menace.

There also a social movement.

>> The brutal tactics of the right -- magna group and how its influence extends far beyond Ukraine.

Plus the land of hope and fear.

Israel's battle for its inner soul.

Author and veteran New York Times Jerusalem respondent joins us for her new Burke -- book.

>> We haven't seen this guy for a month.

And you're marrying him.

>> Polite society.

Taking us to her new film and its salvation of sisterhood.

-- through whom new film and its celebration of sisterhood.

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>> Welcome to the program everyone.

I am Bianna Golodryga sitting in for Christiane Amanpour.

Lawmakers are racing to get a debt ceiling bill through both chambers of Congress and signed into law.

D-Day for a disastrous default would be June 5, when the Treasury Department says it would no longer be able to pay all of the nation's bills.

It wide range of lawmakers on both sides are getting behind the deal and on today's show we want to focus on one key element, climate policy.

Environmentalists are warning that this deal could have significant ramifications because it fast-track say controversial gas pipeline in West Virginia.

The White House says the bill protects Biden key climate achievements.

Let's dig into all of this with Michael Jarrard, the founder and faculty director of the Stephen center for climate change law at Columbia University and he joins us now from New York.

They cue so much for joining us.

This is not it done -- thank you so much for joining us.

This is not a done deal and there is so much more to come.

Given where this stands in your current form, what are your thoughts in terms of what it is able to salvage of the president's key policies with the inflation reduction act?

>> We were afraid that it would be a lot worse, there are efforts by some of the Republican Party to peel some or -- repeal some or all of the provisions of the inflation reduction energy act.

This law does not do that.

It speeds up some permitting processes for both fossil projects and renewables but leaves almost all of the major initiatives intact.

>> $370 billion for cream -- green energy remains intact.

Let's dig in more on some of the concerns that you do have, namely the controversial gas pipeline, Mountain Valley pipeline which goes from West Virginia to Virginia, spending over 300 miles across nearly 1000 streams and wetlands.

Talk about some of your concerns specific to the pipeline.

>> In order to reduce greenhouse gas emissions we should not be building anymore fossil fuel infrastructure.

It is unfortunate that the deal good at this pipeline and some of us know that President Biden approved a massive oil drill field in Alaska.

We are also seeing tremendous progress on wind and solar and the other things that have to go in a positive direction.

>> Argue more optimistic about where things stand not only with the debt ceiling, but also with policy related to clean energy in this administration?

>> The inflation reduction act and the early bipartisan infrastructure act made in Norma's amounts of money available for the clean energy transition.

They have survived the debt limit fight, it seems to have not heard them, and everyone agrees that it takes too long to permit these facilities and we will have an ongoing fight over permit reform and that is part of the debt package that is now being voted on.

Brianna: Where do you stand on permit reform, become -- because some may argue that it works in both ways in terms of promoting and instigating a grain energy production, and again, you have the fossil fuel supporters who are that this will trigger quicker action on that front as well.

They point to what happens in terms of permits in other countries, specifically in Europe, and they are much faster than the United States.

>> So, we note that nobody is building coal foul -- coal powered power plants.

Those of the worst.

We are increasing controls on natural gas, the largest raining source of fossil fuels for ellipticity.

But I think that the damage that is done by somewhat faster permitting of those facilities is not as bad as -- is overcome by the good by speeding up wind and solar.

We need to be building literally thousands of wind farms and solar farms and hundreds or thousands of miles of transmission.

We need permits reform to speed that up.

And this Congress is not going to give us changes that will only help one side and not the other side.

There are trade-offs.

Brianna: Another area of concern specific to this mountain Valley pipeline is that not only does it push it forward and greenlighted although the administration says this is something that they agreed to in the past in order to get Joe Manchin from West Virginia on board with the IRA itself, it takes measures to shield it from judicial review.

Can you explain the significance of that?

>> There have been lots of lawsuits, including successful lawsuits against this pipeline, because of issues with endangered species and other things.

And the legislation says that the courts cannot touch it.

That regardless of those kinds of problems these permits are in place and cannot be challenged in court.

There are a few precedents for this kind of thing but not many.

It is not a good thing to shield these projects from a challenge in court when they would have negative environmental impacts or go through direct procedures.

Brianna: Speaking of court challenges we have seen the Supreme Court curtailed some of the EPA's legislative authority.

With regards to wetlands, the Clean Water Act, that's the most recent that we have seen from this Supreme Court.

What are your concerns regarding what we can and cannot see stemming from this going forward as far as any authority that the EPA may have if we continue to see these types of rulings from the Supreme Court?

>> As you alluded last week, the Supreme Court issued a decision which really cuts back on the EPA's authority under the Clean Water Act.

Last year they issued a decision in a case called West Virginia which restricted the EPA's authority under the clean air act to regulate greenhouse gas emissions.

With a 6-3 conservative majority, we have court that likes to cut back on regulations, especially environmental regulations, that is a major concern.

Brianna: What are the real world impacts?

>> On the water impact it will allow people to fill in and pollute lots of various -- areas that had in previous or protected.

The court is allowing much more development in areas that are of ecological significance which are also important to preserve drinking water.

It is something Congress can fix.

But they want.

Brianna: There's a lot they could fix.

We don't have a long time -- and a time to go down that road.

That is something the Supreme Court is saying that it is the response will be of Congress to legislate.

We will have you on to discuss that at another time.

We really appreciate your insight and expertise.

>> Thank you.

Brianna: Turning to the poor in Ukraine there are new signs that the battle is creeping across the border into Russian territory.

The Kremlin is calling the situation in the bow outreach and alarming after a massive strike wounded four people.

It comes just a day after drone attacks damaged civilian buildings in the heart of Moscow.

So far, Russia has relied heavily on the Wagner group in their war efforts, but who are they and what is their relationship with the Kremlin?

Professor Candace Ron do is an expert on Putin's alleged private army and joins us to discuss this.

>> Welcome to the show.

>> There have been joint attacks in Moscow this week, are those done by the Ukrainian military and likewise, are the drone attacks in Kyiv being done by the Russian military?

>> There is a lot we don't know about the recent drone attacks in Moscow and around that area, certainly there are reasons to suspect Ukrainian forces of some sort are behind the attacks, a good reason to believe that is the attacks that we saw in the town of Belgrade -- Belgorod, and there seems to be a dual track approach, penetrating beyond Russian borders deep inside as a means of sending a message to the population as well as the politicians who are responsible for the work in the Kremlin.

-- war in the criminal.

We have a lot to learn about what happened there, and there are questions as to whether this is a false flag operation that the chemic -- the Kremlin has created as a way of previewing or link the political groundwork for a major mobilization, and there may be if all sales open mobilization according to rumors where conscripts as well as officers and active reservists would be called into force.

There's a sign that there are serious challenges for Russia in terms of their own internal security, which is increasingly becoming a problem for the criminal.

>> You are an expert on the Wegner group.

A private parent military group run by Goshen -- a mercenary leader.

He seems to be inconsistent in his allegiance.

It's plain what the situation is as they pulled out of parts of Ukraine -- explain what the situation is as they Paul out of parts of Ukraine?

>> They are not private in the classic sense.

A lot of people have compared them to Blackwater, the American PMC that acted in Iraq during the squares crisis back in 2007.

They are different in the sense that they get their supplies from the Ministry of defense and think contracts from the Ministry of Defense and they serve state enterprises like the big arms dealers and power companies, and the flow of weapons and men and material and their missions come from the Russian state.

To call them private is not really the best way to describe them.

>> Is it true that Putin has control over them or not?

>> Certainly has control over them in the sense that the minute the Ministry of Defense decides that they no longer want to supply Prigozhin's forces is the minute they become an inoperable force.

There is an interdependency between the Ministry of Defense and the Wegner group, but your question about Prigozhin is important, is this important -- judgment becoming a rogue force within Russia?

Certainly his very loud critiques of the Minister of defense as well as the Chief of Army staff, the criticism about the lack of ammunition, support, the lack of men, the inability of the entire country to mobilize behind this war effort, Prigozhin's complaint about that are in some ways well-founded -- complaints are in some ways well-founded from a soldiers perspective.

But he is also doing something that Putin would also like to be able to say but is politically constrained from doing so.

We cannot have the president of Russia saying that this more effort is going terribly, who is responsible, who is in charge of this war when we all know that he is.

Prigozhin in a way aligns with what Putin wants to say openly and we should always be thinking and hearing when we listen to his critiques a little bit of Putin.

But I will say that is more recent comments about the risks of revolutionary movement in response to the poor coronation of this war and the poor handling of this war, those should be taken seriously.

We have never seen at least not in the last 30 years or so since the end of the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan back in 1979, we will not see the moment in Russian history where we have potentially constant -- hundreds of thousands if not millions of Russian men coming back from the front broken, wounded in some cases addicted, I think that this is a repeat of history and we are in a very dangerous point in terms of the trajectory of stability and pressure going forward.

>> There -- in Russia going for it.

>> There was a statement that he would not participate in a coup, but instead of a strong denial he said he did not think he would be able to pull it off.

That seems like a frightening thing to say.

And he even suggested that the Russian military might do a coup against Rush -- Putin.

Why is he getting so comfortable with him?

>> I have a slightly different interpretation that is slightly counterintuitive.

My sense is that is a warning about anyone trying to pull it off from Putin directly.

Anyone who is thinking that this is may be an opportune moment to come at the Kremlin with a coup and some sort of internal push either from inside Moscow or outside Moscow, I think that Prigozhin is wagging his finger and saying don't even think about it.

He is saying that on behalf of Putin.

>> You say that Prigozhin is just channeling Putin.

He is saying what Putin wishes that he could say in public.

He said somehow nothing is working out for us in Ukraine.

He said one of the strongest in the world militaries, meaning the Russian military, has been transformed and weakened.

He said that we are unable to defend the country and that the generals were trying to deceive Putin.

Do you think that he believes all of that?

>> I think there is a good logic for Putin now to kind of start listening to different types of messages.

I think the most important thing to understand is that Prigozhin is not wrong.

Unfortunately.

And he is not the only one on the far right in Russia today who is making the assessment that Russia was ill-prepared for this war and that the military generals who assured Putin ahead of the invasion that everything would be OK somehow they maybe misled Putin on some level.

I think that assessment seems to be correct.

And I don't think there is anything to contradict that evidence right now.

At the same time, it is possible to consider that the inter-factional rivalry has gotten to the point where some elements within the military and the intelligence services feels it is now time to express extremes.

-- feel it is now time to express extremes.

We need to turn things around and get some sort of secured victory, even if.

Victory over Ukraine.

-- Stephen A.

Can victory over Ukraine.

Goshen -- Prigozhin is not the only person saying this.

He is saying it louder and more effectively, he has been more conscientious a student of media relations and he understands how to plant a message and how to capture people's imaginations, that has been his great success and to some degree that is why Putin chose him as this kind of new spokesman or interlocutory for the kind of martial general for the war.

At the same time, it is worrying that the script that we are hearing from Prigozhin in the far right is becoming increasingly more shrill and the criticism of the generals and Putin is starting to actually fight.

-- bite.

It says that a extreme ultranationalist faction is starting to gain the political upperhand.

This does not mean that Putin will suddenly now encounter a coup, but it does mean that he is deeply constrained by that element, which is to say he has to answer to those critiques and he has to find a way to counter them before the narrative gets ahead of him.

>> If he has to counter the narrative of ultranationalist, those who express real dismay at the Russian military, but would that mean, a full mobilization, full invasion, use of tactical nuclear weapons, how far could they go?

>> Unfortunately, Putin is in a no-win situation.

I think he was in a no-win situation before he even started and that is why he started the war.

Unfortunately for global stability, there really is not an offramp.

There is not a quick peck -- path to victory here.

We will not see the full outcome of the mobilization until sometime next year.

What that should tell everybody who is watching what is happening with Russia and the Ukraine -- and Ukraine, wondering what is the impact on energy prices and inflation, everyone should be clear that this war will not be over tomorrow or next year, it will not be over until there is true resolution to put down the weapons and stop the fight.

And we don't see any signs of that anytime soon.

And I think whatever happens we are very much on the escalatory path right now.

>> The Weiner group was founded by a soldier who had swastikas and Nancy tattoos on -- Nazi tattoos on.

It is often claimed to be a Neo-Nazi groups.

>> There is a large contingent that seems to be very attracted to the idea of white supremacy, and that is a very troubling part of their organizational drive.

Many people have described the wagoner group as a paramilitary and that is true, they are paramilitary but they are also a social movement which represents a very extreme white nationalist pan-Slavic mentality and ideology that Putin and others would like to see spread across Europe.

And we can see it in Spain.

There were a few that are bombs earlier in 2022 which were attributed to the Russian Imperial faction, linked to the wagoner group.

That is a very frightening pattern.

In some ways, this may seem extreme now but in two years time, we are looking at the early progenitor of an Al Qaeda or ISIS like force in the sense that they extreme positions on social cohesion and their extreme positions on what it takes to run a society, and actually frightening prospect is the idea that movement would start to chic -- seep out of Russia.

And we note that there are a lot of fans of the Weiner group online.

We have tracked that for the last several years and seen how the Weiner group ran on social media -- wagoner group ran a social media, using that neofascist symbolism and culture.

>> You say they are somewhat like Al Qaeda in a way, and just seeping out of Ukraine and Russia into the west of Europe.

Tell us what that portends and whether or not the U.S. should therefore label as a terrorist organization and treated thusly.

>> This has been a big debate in the White House and Washington.

I have been present at many of these conversations.

How do we deal with wagoner, -- the wagoner group, if we cannot categorize them as one thing or another how to be a person.

One thing that is encouraging is that the debate has become more nuance.

This recognition within the White House and other parts of Congress that declaring the wagoner group a foreign terrorist organization would only take us so far in terms of policy.

The biggest risk there is essentially treating an arm of the Russian state as if it were not an arm of the Russian state and that has convocations for things like war crimes accountability, reparation -- reparations and more response abilities.

If you treat them like Al Qaeda, you would not expect Al Qaeda to own their war crimes or be responsible for destruction.

The reality is Wagner Group is a paramilitary cartel.

The White House has come down with the decision of categorizing them as an organized transnational crime group.

So, basically a mafia that is on international steroids which operates worldwide.

That is probably the most appropriate way to go largely because it makes it less controversial for partner states that make -- might have issues about how we fought the war on terrorism and it makes it less controversial for them to go after organized crime figures or entities that help and support the wagoner group in that context.

At the end of the day, the best approach is to really enhance the ability of many partners around the world, beyond Russia and Ukraine and places in Africa where we see them to really go after those supply channels and go after those internal intermediary hubs where we know they are very important for the deployment of weapons and men and to do bad things in countries where there is great instability.

>> You have written about and described sort of horrible war crimes and torture that the Wagner Group does.

Including a man and his whole family in Ukraine.

We see that everywhere they operate.

In Mali in Africa.

Tell us how they are using those terroristic tactics in places like Africa.

>> This is one of the saddest parts of this entire situation, we have just seen countless victims of the wagoner group -- Wagner Group, especially in Mali, where you have large scale extradition killings, mass graves.

-- extrajudicial killings, mass graves.

This has been happening for years, not just as part of this work.

Russian regulars have been imported for the use of torture, illegal detention and so forth and so on.

The psychology here at work, it is important to remember that many of the commanders in the wagoner group -- Wagner Group come from a long line of engagements where they are special forces, Spatz Knotts, deployed to handle problems the Russian military could not.

All of these commanders have, at some stage, spent years and years and years on the front lines, deploying again and again to extreme crisis situations.

They come back, noting knows what their mission is, they cannot talk about it, in some ways they are social outcasts.

In many ways they're suffering from a lot of posttraumatic stress disorder.

That is the reality.

I think what we are seeing in terms of the torture of civilians is not only the indiscipline of this group but something deeper here in terms of the psychology of the commanders.

But it does also reflect on the idea of the Russian military doctrine that civilians just do not matter and it is not as important as territorial control.

That is where we -- they start to privilege their mission status on the control it and what can we do to get it done.

>> Thank you so much for joining us professor.

Brianna: Learn so much from that conversation.

Thank you to Walter.

Has it -- many tumultuous few months and Israel as the prime minister's overhauls because weeks of mass protests.

Those reforms are on pause and demonstrations continued over the weekend for the 21st straight week.

The country marks its 75 years since declaring independence and what holds it together and what divides it and what internal and external forces threatening its future.

To answer all this, Isabel Kershner is here, in -- a long time it -- Jerusalem correspondent to the New York Times.

Her new book deals with these issues.

This is a fascinating book, really a page turner and I learned so much from it already.

Let's talk about the country and its history looking back 75 years because what united the country to be five years ago August he was a combination of Jewish tragic recent history at the time from the Holocaust, its biblical connection to the land and the external threats facing the country even before its inception.

What unites them today?

>> Thank you for having me and that is a great question.

In the old days, in the beginning, 75 years ago, we had these divisions, very deep divisions over the establishment of the state.

There was one thing then which was a common purpose.

Which was to build the homeland and see it survive and now five years on, Israel is splurging in many ways, it is a strong country of many people, and innovative strong economy, yet it is more divided than ever.

And when you asked what is holding it together, I think there is something that I found on my journey to write this book, and that is however polarized people are, all the different sectors of society do share one thing.

That seems to be a passion for being here and a sense of belonging and at -- an identity they hold very dear.

Even though they compete in their worldviews and contradict each other and almost cancel out each other in terms of their vision for the future of the country and which way it should go, nobody is going anywhere.

And I think that is one of the binding factors here.

Which is holding this place together.

>> I think a lot of people would be surprised what a melting pot Israel is.

Obviously it is a Jewish homeland.

But behind that label, there is so much rich history from various backgrounds.

And you have people who call themselves sovereigns, people born in Israel.

Asking Ozzie juice who have -- Ashkenazi, Sephardic, ultraconservatives, Russian, Ethiopian Jews, tell us about that melting pot working today.

Is it as goose -- cohesive as one would hope, but have you discovered frictions as well?

>> It is not cohesive at all, with generational change here even though you might expect that across the generations some of the old conflict in some ways what I found is that they have become more acute and you have younger generations in various sectors of society who are looking back now more educated than in -- they were in many cases and are going back through the archives and trying to write some of the wrongs, which have just not been addressed here, for so many decades.

We think also we have the generational cage, and also the changing of the guard in terms of the elite in the country.

So the old Ashkenazi socialist leaning elite that ruled the country and dominated politics here for the first decades of the state have really found themselves on the way and in recent years and now we have a much stronger less liberal right-wing population coming up.

We have we have a much a much more conservative section of society which is perhaps seeing some of the definition of a Jewish state in a different way.

And a different kind of Judaism which is less humanistic or universal, and more nationalist.

And we also have the ultra Orthodox population which is the fastest growing population in the Western world.

With very large families.

Voice certainly, most children who are not receiving a secular immigration -- education at all and are coming out of school very unequipped for the modern economy.

All of these challenges are not coming to a kind of boiling point because BRC introductory where there is demographic change as well as generational change which is accentuating rather than healing these will -- divisions.

>> Your second chapter focuses on Civil War, Judy -- dating back to the inception of the country and its first prime minister and his concern about war and divisions between rival factions which ultimately culminated in death.

And fighting between these two factions.

That simmered down but not really.

And it brings us to where things stand today.

Two major parties, and a center right right-leaning party has become more extreme and dominant as of late given some of the strange bedfellows that the leadership finds itself in, and it seems to be that the current prime minister, now the longest-serving prime minister, can you talk about his role in leadership and where that has taken at least part of that faction of the party?

>> Well.

The backdrop for the book, I would say, is Netanyahu's Israel.

He has had the longest term of power.

He has shaped this country in many ways and on one hand he has made it strong and he has championed the high-tech industry and he has an outsized role on the world stage for a country the size of Israel and on the other hand he has proven in recent years since he was charged with corruption he has proved to be a divisive leader.

What we are seeing today is that his grip on power and his determination to remain in power has made him take in coalition partners who were really on the fringes of Israeli politics and society until very recently, who were now sitting in the government with him.

And we do see a move towards this extremism with lots of toxic rhetoric and the promise or finds himself in a coalition government where he is the most centrist person there.

And all the others are much more ultraconservative.

He is really trying to maintain the balance and position himself as being a liberal.

And the forces that he is struggling with within his own government are creating a lot of noise.

>> He is struggling with his own legal challenges as well.

He is an indicted prime minister and that is raising concern as to what his focus is, on his country as a whole or is it really on himself and protecting himself and that leads us to the big controversy we have been talking about for months now which has led to so many weeks of demonstrations in the country, and that is his attempt, at overhauling duty judiciary which has been put on pause for now take -- given some of the backlash.

But what are the long-term ramifications and concerns that has -- for the country that has prided itself on being the sole democracy in the Middle East?

>> The judicial overhaul is very fundamental and its supporters would say that it is a democratic plan, it is actually trying to redress the balance of powers in Israel and give, rightly, as the supporters would say, more power to the elected government and a bit less to unelected judges.

As you have noticed, there has been huge opposition and a massive push back and really a kind of liberal awakening in the country from the other side of the camp which says the Supreme Court here is really the only check and balance on the government, the only real institution that can guarantee protection for minorities because Israel has no formal written Constitution, it has one house of parliament and not a federal system or a based system, basically whoever manages to cobble together a coalition which can create a coalition within the government and that the Supreme Court, and what this plan is proposing is to increase the power of the politician -- politicians for things like the selection of judges which critics say will harm the independence of the Supreme Court, which has quite a prestigious repetition both here and abroad which is trying to curb judicial review, the ability of the Supreme Court to strike down legislation in the parliament, which does not comport with basic values here, and we can the judiciary in general.

Most people here will say that there is room for some judicial reform and not like this, not in such a drastic way, not so quickly.

The prime minister did not really campaign for this election on an agenda of such a drastic judicial overhaul.

And it is something that appears to have come out of the blue on generate the fourth when his justice minister announced the plan.

But of course he did not come out of nowhere, and it is more of a symptom of the deep changes that have been going on in this society as the book records.

At the same time, this is not the kind of return people want.

Ask especially with the deal he made going into this coalition maybe he does not carry all the power now but he is still at the home of the government.

As you brilliantly go through all of the different challenges and evolutions which we have seen in the country over the past few decades, over the past several decades there have been things that remained constant and unanswered and that is perhaps where does a two state solution go, in terms of the Palestinian question and the expansion of settlements.

These issues go hand-in-hand, what did you walk away from this study from this book feeling in terms of any sort of resolution, on that big big issue.

>> My basic issue is that there will not be any resolution of that conflict until Israelis find some kind of resolution within themselves because the country is so split on that very issue, and at the same time, on the Palestinian side we have a week and defined it Palestinian leadership which is a disappointment in many Israelis and Palestinians in terms of delivering the kind of deal which would be required, the deep compromise which would be required.

Unfortunately, I don't see it resolution around the corner.

We have not actually have formal peace talks here for almost a decade.

With the growth of the settlements and the disarray on the Palestinian side as well, this is only becoming harder to resolve and not any easier.

>> Before I let you go, what is the status in your field currently, we know what the current president, the president says that they have a very close and warm connection with the state of Israel, over the last several years.

There have been some concerns about the direction the country has headed in and the personal relations between the two leaders.

Are you getting the sense that bond is still as solid as it has been for so many years?

>> I think the U.S.-Israel relationship is extremely solid.

But I think the personal relations between president Biden, the White House and President Net -- the prime minister and the hardline parties within it is very problematic, he was reelected and came back into office six months ago and has unusually not received an invitation to the White House, President Biden made it clear not long ago that there was not one forthcoming right now.

I think a lot depends on what happens with this judicial overhaul plan and quite honestly, I don't think even the prime minister could tell you right now where that is going.

>> So great to have you on the program finally, congratulations on a fantastic book.

Next, turning to an action-packed portrait of the TH experience and a love story between sisters.

White society follows a young British Pakistani stunt woman in training as she sets out to stop her beloved sister from marrying.

>> I'm never is.

This family is up to something.

>> I just don't trust them.

>> I have to stop this wedding.

>> I'm not letting you do this alone.

>> I've got my eye on you.

>> The writer and director joins us now from London.

It is a catcher to have you on.

It was a pleasure and joy to exit watch this movie I loved every moment of it, I laughed, I was in suspense, you have all of these reactions that a director and writer would want for the audience.

What made you make this film?

>> Thank you for having me.

I had this idea over 10 years ago, I decided to create a film that brought all the films I left together, Jackie Chan and Baldwin, and centering it around a Southeast Asian teenage girl, to let her do these big fun over stunts and explore what it means to be a teenage girl using the action genre to see the violence that you feel and kind of use action to explore that.

>> It takes sibling fight into a whole new level because there is so much that you can relate to in this film, and all of a sudden you see these scenes and you are like whoa, what am I watching here.

And it talks about the love between sisters, and those emotions come loose in these dramatic action scenes.

Let's just see what -- one of the scenes.

>> It bumped into him at the gym.

Really.

>> No, I followed his movements and tracked him down.

I wanted to meet him as he is soon to be my brother-in-law.

>> What did I tell you about staying out of my life?

>> Oops.

[THUNDER CRASHING] [EAGLE SCREAM] ♪ >> I love how that ends by their mother saying screaming down from -- from down it -- answers I don't care who started it you have to clean it all up.

Is this somewhat inspired by fights at you and your sister had when you moved from Singapore to London?

>> Very much so, there is a kind of asked between two siblings and I think when you fight with your sibling it can be brutal difficult emotionally because they know your pressure points and your wounds and I knew with this fight I wanted it to be the most physically violent to kind of externalize that in turn on small emotional violence we can exist between two sisters, and it is inspired by my darling older sister.

>> Her name is Lena and the younger sister is Leah, and the younger sister is trying to stop her older sister from marrying someone who think -- she thinks is not a right match and suitable for her.

He saw that clip and you have to say it, it really made me think that it reminded me a bit of Tarantino, a bit like Tarantino.

He mentioned Jackie Chan.

Can you talk about your influences -- you mentioned Jackie Chan can you talk more about your influences?

>> I was inspired by Quentin Tarantino's love of genre and playfulness.

And I wanted to use genre to export the female experience, the woman's expanse, which is something that I have not seen, my influences are so very, I love Cohen brothers films, Edgar Wright, and Polly Wood.

I grew up on on an insane diet of films and it is so great to pull together all the movies I love and explore a sister relationship, and this is a love story between two sisters and I don't think we see that enough in cinema, the sister relationship is always a romantic relationship or a band of brothers, but where are the sister stories so I was excited to explore that.

>> They are the heroines and also the friends, this is a rival I'm, I'm not going to give too much away, this extends well beyond the bloodline and you mentioned the body would influence, and there is an -- a real focus that you bring on the South Asian cinema, that experience.

To life in London and the U.K.. As well.

We have seen films with these themes in the past, Bend it like Beckham comes to mind, but why is it so important for you to focus on this cultural aspect?

>> It is something that is part of my -- identity is a film maker and an artist and I wanted to show all these aspects of my identity sitting side-by-side, is not just Polly Wood, it is not just Baldwin kung fu, it's also Westerns and it can coexist in a London setting, it is not just a South Asian story, which is one thing, it contains all of these different threats.

That is the 1 -- one of the most exciting things for me.

I can bring all of my love of genre and all of these strange movies I grew up on as well as belly went cinema and they can coexist because that was my expense as a film maker and a person, and there are so many aspects my identity.

Hope >> It is your personal cultural experience and background in these topics that almost any family can relate to and so many women can relate to and sisters as well.

Without getting too deep here, there is really a focus on a woman's control of her destiny and her strength and her body.

And it is a very timely issue I think especially the United States when you follow politics and the issue over abortion rights here, again without giving too much away, in this movie, did that resonate with you at all, the timing of this movie coming out and some of the headlines which we are seeing play out in real life?

>> Absolutely.

I wrote the script before any of these things happened and there was a sad timeliness to it as you say, and it has galvanized me into keeping that storyline in the script because there is a version of the film where it stays very light and frothy and fun and I knew that I wanted to have this sort of more serious slant on it because these issues exist, we think it is OK now but the fight is still very much ongoing and say with what is happening in the U.S., I think we are proud of this film stuck to its guns with keeping that kind of darker storyline that is very much part of our reality.

>> Should have started this, this movie has received rave reviews not just for me but from critics, movie critics 100% rating, Rotten Tomatoes, you two-putt fun at some cultural issues and South Asian troops.

I had curious, and again for an equal opportunity person here who makes fun across the board.

But have you received any backlash at all from the community given that.

>> Is a great question.

I heavily received so far, anyway, very sort of positive kind of affirming reactions of people saying that we feel seen and I play on the mother-son dynamic where it stayed loving, overly loving mother, shall we say, and just pushing and heightening that.

I have only received positive stuff of people being like yes, you're finally showing parts of the culture that may maybe do not get shown and getting to poke fun at all kinds of different aspects of what was really part of my reality and I think it some ways I get away with it because it comes from a place of my authentic experience and in some ways genuine affection for my own community and the world I grew up in.

>> How has your family responded, how about your parents and sister?

>> I had such a delightful expense getting to watch the film with my family, and I think they told me they loved it, life -- my parents were extremely encouraging and what often call me to give me extreme levels of validation.

And my sister was lovely, she cried I think tears of joy I hope, just getting to see it because it is very much our relationship and she is such a muse for me.

It was positive for my family thankfully.

>> That is always a relief because they can be your biggest critics, so I bet you were a bit nervous having them watch this film but knowing that they loved it is very rewarding to hear.

How did you blend, in the research that went into some of the more cultural dynamics that we see in this film, the dance scenes for example.

Did you do research, did you, Robert -- corroborate and collaborate with others in the field,?

>> This film is put together by an incredible group of people and the martial arts is drawn from the films I'd love, but the Stunt team also worked closely with the actors, with the ball he would had a fairly dance choreographer who came on board and I told her that I was inspired by one film and I said could be filtered through a teenage girl from London and she sort of was able to bring her eye to it, and it is such a collaboration, in any film and we got to work with pretty actors who brought some of their own takes.

I guess it was this research given that it came from so much of my own experience but I drew from Mike collaborators, my costume designer brought so much witness -- which -- richness and color to the world.

>> The actors themselves, South Asian actors were really fascinating to watch and so talented.

Talk to us a bit about these main characters in real life, these sisters.

>> Priya khansara was someone who came to the door and blew us all away, she only started acting a year ago and she is just this incredible new talent, so much joy and enthusiasm onset but also did so many of her own stats, performed her dance.

Just really brought her a game.

I was so thrilled to get to work to with her -- with her.

And I have worked with the actress who plays Lena so many times before.

She is a South Asian actor who has such a punk energy, and alternative edge, and it is such a nuanced performer.

Separately to see them both together on screen.

>> They are beautiful and definitely have chemistry as sisters.

I hope that everyone gets a chance to watch this film, as I mentioned, I loved every moment of it.

Thank you so much on this -- and congratulations on this head.

And that is it for our program tonight.

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