40 YEARS AFTER WAIKIKI NATATORIUM CLOSED ITS DOORO THE PUBLIC, THE COUNTRY ONY OBSERVATION WATER POOL IS POISE THE FOR A RETURN.

BUILT IN 1927, TO HONOR HAI WORLD WAR II VETERANS, OAHU LANDMARK HAS BEEN A SOURCEF MUCH DEBATE SINCE EXPOSURE.

CITY & COUNTY COMMITTING TO RESTORATION.

IS THE FUTURE OF THE WAIKII NATATORIUM FINALLY BECOME CLEAR?

JOIN THE CONVERSATION NEXTN INSIGHTS.

♪ ♪ ALOHA AND WELCOME TO INSIGS ON PBS HAWAII.

I'M DARYL HUFF.

ORIGINALLY DEDICATED IN THE 1927, THE WAIKIKI WAR MEMOL NATATORIUM WAS BUILT TO HOR THE 10,000 HAWAII CITIZENSO SERVED IN WORLD WAR I.

IT ALSO SERVED AS AN SEAWAR SWIMMING POOL AND ENTERTAINMENT VENUE.

THE NATATORIUM WAS DECLARED UNSAFE IN 1979 AND THE BLEACHERS AND SWIMMING POOL HAVE BEEN CLOSED TO THE PUC EVER SINCE.

AFTER YEARS OF DEBATE ABOUT THE NEXT STEPS FOR DECAYING STRUCTURE, THE CITY AND COY OF HONOLULU HAS A NEW PLANO RESTORE THE WAIKIKI LANDMAK AND OPEN IT TO THE PUBLIC E AGAIN.

SO WHAT IS NEXT FOR THE WAIKIKI WAR MEMORIAL NATATORIUM?

WE LOOK FORWARD TO YOUR PARTICIPATION IN TONIGHT'S SHOW.

YOU CAN EMAIL OR CALL IN YR QUESTIONS AND YOU'LL FIND A LIVE STREAM OF THIS PROGRAT PBSHAWAII.ORG AND THE PBS HAWAII YOUTUBE PAGE.

NOW, TO OUR GUESTS.

ANDY SUGG IS THE CHIEF OF STAFF FOR THE OFFICE OF THE MAYOR RICK BLANGIARDI.

PRIOR TO JOINING THE MAYO'S OFFICE, HE WORKED IN TELEVISION IN BOSTON AND HONOLULU AT HAWAII NEWS NOW WHEN THE MAYOR WAS GENERAL MANAGER.

JIM BICKERTON IS THE FOUNDG PARTNER OF THE BICKERTON LW GROUP.

HE HAS BEEN PRACTICING LAWN HAWAII FOR MORE THAN 40 YE.

HE'S THE ATTORNEY FOR THE KAIMANA BEACH COALITION, WH IS COMMITTED TO PROTECTINGD PRESERVING KAIMANA BEACH, E BEACH RIGHT NEXT TO THE NATATORIUM.

DONNA L. CHING HAS SERVED S AN OFFICER AND BOARD MEMBEF THE FRIENDS OF THE NATATORM FOR 30 YEARS AND ON THE BOD OF THE KAPIOLANI PARK PRESERVATION SOCIETY FOR OVER 20 YEARS.

SHE IS A FREQUENT USER OF KAIMANA BEACH.

PAT HENRY HAS SERVED ON THE BOARD OF THE KAPIOLANI PARK PRESERVATION SOCIETY FOR OR 10 YEARS.

HE LIVES ACROSS THE STREET FROM KAPIOLANI PARK.

HE IS A RETIRED UH MANOA PROFESSOR WHO TAUGHT THERER 32 YEARS.

LET ME START OFF.

WITH EACH YOU.

DESCRIBE WHERE YOU ARE IN TERMS OF THIS PROJECT, IN TERMS OF H HOW HE FEEL WHAE PROJECT SHOULD BE DOING AND WHAT YOU DO BECAUSE SOME OF THESE ORGANIZATIONS I DON'T THINK ANYBODY KNOWS WHAT TY ARE.

WE KNOW WHAT THE CITY IS.

GIVE US QUICK DESCRIPTION F WHAT YOUR POSITION ON DEAL WITH THIS PROJECT AND HOW O YOU GUYS ABOUT WHERE IT'S HEADING.

>> THANKS DARYL.

FIRST OF ALL NICE TO BE HE.

WITH THIS ESTEEMED PANEL.

CITY'S POSITION AND THE MAYOR'S POSITION FIRST AND FOREMOST IS THAT WE'RE NOTN THE BUSINESS OF TEARING DON WAR MEMORIALS.

START AT THAT BASELINE.

AND WE WOULD LIKE TO SEE TE NATATORIUM REHABILITATED.

OBVIOUSLY MANY STEPS TO GO BEFORE WE GET TO THAT POINT THE CITY COUNCIL HAS COMMID COUPLE MILLION DOLLARS OF E LAST FEW YEARS FOR DESIGN D DRAWINGS FOR NEW REIMAGINED NATATORIUM.

THAT IS WHERE THE CITY IS T THIS POINT.

>>Daryl: JIM BICKERTON KAIMANA BEACH COALITION.

WHAT IS THAT AND WHAT IS TR POSITION ON THE MEMORIAL?

>> GROUP THAT WAS FORMED IN THE LATE 90s AND WE STILL N EXISTENCE.

VERY LOOSE AND INFORMAL COALITION.

ALL THE PEOPLE THAT ENJOY THAT WE HAVE AMR OUREN TYPE LIVES AND HOPE O ALWAYS HAVE.

WHICH IS FREE AND COMPLETEY UNFETTERED USE AN ACCESS TO THE SHORELINE THERE.

TO BE ABLE TO ACCESS THE BEACH.

OUR VIEW OF IF IS THAT PEOE LIVE IN HAWAII SUBSTANDARD HOUSING, WITH TRAFFIC WORSE THAN OTHER PLACES, AND BEAH AREAS ARE SHRINKING ALL THE TIME ONE THING THAT MAKES T WORTH LIVING HERE IS ACCESO THE OCEAN.

FREE ACCESS TO THE OCEAN.

AND ANY PROJECT INCLUDING S ONE THAT IS GOING TO PUT TT IN JEOPARDY, WE WILL BE OPPOSING.

>>Daryl: MORE INTO DETAIL WHAT'S BEING PROPOSED.

FRIENDS NATATORIUM, 30 YEA.

>> 30 YEARS.

>> KIND OF TELLS HOW LONG WE'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT T. WHAT IS THE POSITION OF THE FRIENDS OF NATATORIUM?

>> FRIENDS WAS FORMED IN 16 WITH THE PURPOSE OF TRYINGO MAKE SURE THAT'S NATATORIUS RESPECTED AN REMEMBERED AND PRESERVED.

>>Daryl: IT 7 YEARS AFTER THEY CLOSED IT.

>> THAT'S RIGHT.

STARTED OUT WITH THE WIDOW ACTUALLY OF THE LAST LIVING SUPERINTENDENT OF THE NATATORIUM.

KAYE NAPOLEON WIFE OF WALTR NAPOLEON LAST LIVING SUPERINTENDENT OF THE NATATORIUM.

AND START OUT WITH JUST SHE WANTED TO MAKE SURE THAT'S PEOPLE REMEMBERED IT WAS A WAIKWARMEMORIAL.

MEMORIAL SERVICE.

THIRTY-SEVENTH ANNUAL MEMOL DAY SERVICE.

MAKE SURE PEOPLE DIDN'T FOT IT WAS FIRST AND FOREMOST A WAR MEMORIAL.

AND THEN 501C3 FORMED IN 18 OF 1986PURPOSE CONTINUING E PEOPLE WHAT WAS INSIDE.

AT THIS POINT, THE GATES WE CLOSED IN A 79.

OLD ENOUGH TO REMEMBER SWIMMING THERE WITH MY GRANDFATHER.

REALITY IS ANYONE UNDER THE AGE OF 60 HAS NEVER SEEN INSIDE.

SO PEOPLE DON'T REALLY KNOW WHAT THEY'RE MISSING.

WE WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT PUBLIC KNOWS WHAT IT IS, WT ITS PURPOSE WAS AND WHAT IT COULD BE.

>>Daryl: THEN PAT HENRY FRM KAPIOLANI PARK PRESERVATION SOCIETY,.

>> CORRECT.

>>Daryl: WHAT IS THAT AND WHAT IS ITS INTEREST IN THE NATATORIUM.

>> KAPIOLANI PARK PRESERVAN SOCIETY FORMED IN 1980 TO OPPOSE THE CITY, LEASE TO BURGER KING.

THAT EVENTUALLY WENT ALL TE WAY TO SUPREME COURT.

>> A LEASE TO USE PART OF E PARK FOR BURGER KING.

>>Daryl: OKAY.

>> SO IT'S AMAZING THAT THT WENT ALL THE WAY TO THE SUPREME COURT.

AS PART OF THE PREPARATIONR THOSE CASES, REDISCOVERED T MOST OF THE PARK IS UNDER E TERMS OF TRUST AGREEMENT.

CITY ACCEPTED THE PARK UNDR THE TERMS OF A TRUST.

AND ABOUT 90% OF KAPIOLANI PARK IS UNDER THIS TRUST AGREEMENT.

SUSS SIJ SIJT WAY THAT'S TT AGREEMENT PARK WILL BE FREE AND OPEN TO ALL FOREVER.

SUCCINCT WAY.

ALL COMMERCIAL ACTIVITY, OPPOSED TO ALL COMMERCIAL ACTIVITY SOMETIMES TALK TO PEOPLE AND TRY TO FIND ALTERNATIVES FOR THEM.

BUT WE ALSO HAVE TAKEN CASS TO COURT, TWO THAT I AM THE BEST I THINK, SUPREME COURE SAID THAT YES, CITY IS TRYG TO MAKE A LEASE TO THE BURR KING CORPORATION.

THEY CANNOT DO THAT.

AND THE OTHER IS COURTS TOD THE CITY TO PUT ADDITIONAL LANDS INTO THE PARK THAT TY HAVE TAKEN OUT ILLEGALLY F, FOR EXAMPLE, KAPAHULU FIRE STATION.

>>Daryl: MOVE ALONG NOW.

MORE TO GO THROUGH.

I HAVE QUESTIONS COMING IN.

WE'LL GET THESE LITTLE, WHT CCOLOR IS THIS.

ORANGE QUESTIONS.

APOLOGIZE LOOKS LIKE I'M NT LISTENING.

I'M READING CARDS.

ONE MORE STAKEHOLDER ON VIO TO HEAR FROM.

LIFEGUARD ACTUALLY WORKS AT THE NATATORIUM.

SEES IT EVERY DAY.

HAS BEEN DOING THAT FOR YE.

QUITE INTERESTING INTERVIE.

COULD PLAY IT NOW.

>> YOU KNOW, ACTUALLY REALY GREAT RESOURCE AND FACILITY FOR US LIFEGUARDS.

WE HAVE OUR OFFICES LIEUTET OFFICES CAPTAIN OFFICES AND JET T TAXI RESOURCES IN THE NATATORIUM BUILDING JET SK.

I'VE BEEN OTS ON THE SKI O8 YEARS NOW.

ONE.

INTERESTING THINGS IS ACTUALLY BEEN SEEING THE RD DETERIORATION OF CONCRETE D SOME OF THE THINGS CRACKS D WATER COMING UP IN THE SPO.

AND SOME HOLLOW SPOTS HAPPENING.

BUT WE'RE FORTUNATE STOKEDO HAVE THIS.

GREAT PLACE FOR OUR LIFEGUD RESOURCES AND FACILITY FOR SURE.

>> I'M HAPPY THAT THEY MADA DECISION AND CHOICE TO KEET AND RESTORE IT.

BECAUSE IT'S SUCH A BEAUTIL PART OF HISTORY.

FOR THE WAR MEMORIAL, FOR L OF THE OLD STORIES OF DUKED ALL THE WATERMEN SWIMMING THROUGH HERE AND FAMILIES,Y FATHER AND MY GRANDPARENTS' GROWN UP SWIMMING HERE ANDT WOULD BE COOL TO SEE THIS THING COME BACK TO LIFE ANE OFFERED AND UTILIZED BY THE PUBLIC AND ENJOYED BY THE PUBLIC.

>>Daryl: ALWAYS STRIKES ME HOW BIG THAT IS.

LACKS A LOT BIGGER FROM THE BACK.

LOOKS A LOT BIGGER FROM THE BACK WHEN YOU'RE ON THE OC.

SUING'SANDY SUGG FROM THE ' OFFICE.

CAN YOU DESCRIBE WHAT THE VISION IS FOR HOW THIS WOUD WORK?

I REMEMBER OVER THE YEARS,A LOT OF QUESTIONS ABOUT WHER YOU COULD EVEN DO SALTWATER POOL AND PROTECT PEOPLE'S HEALTH FROM VARIOUS ISSUES.

CAN YOU GIVE US DESCRIPTIO.

WE WILL HAVE SOME GRAPHICS THAT COULD POP UP.

>> SURE.

PLAN AS IT'S BEEN WORKED ON NOW IS PERIMETER DECK.

ESSENTIALLY SAME DESIGN THT YOU SEE IN THE VIDEO SHOWN THERE.

WE ARE NOW IN THE PROCESS F PRELIMINARY DRAWINGS MIGHTE SEEING ON THE SCREEN THAT E HAD.

SOME PRELIMINARY DRAWINGS I THINK FAIRLY EXPLANATORY.

SEE THE BLEACHERS AND PERIMETER DECK.

BUT THOSE WERE DESEENS THAN PRESENTED TO THE DIAMOND HD WAIKIKI NEIGHBORHOOD BOARD LAST AUGUST.

JUST ABOUT A YEAR AGO.

WE ARE WAITING ON THE FINAL DESIGN WHICH SHOULD BE SOMETIME IN THE NEXT MONTH SORE.

>>Daryl: WHAT IS HOW DOES OCEAN WATER GET IN AND OUTF THE NATATORIUM?

UNDER THIS PLAN?

>> IT'S KIND OF GREAT GRATE SYSTEM.

BRICOMES IN EWA END AND MAI END.

MAKAI SIDE.

COMES OUT FLOWS OUT.

KAIMANA SAID, DIAMOND HEAD SAID OF DID NOT BAFFLED.

IT WOULD HAVE, FLE FLOW IND FLOW BACK OUT FOR NORTH OR WEST OF WHERE KAIMANA BEACS MY DIRECTIONS ARE NOT EXACY RIGHT.

>>Daryl: I THINK.

>> YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN.

COMES IN LIKE TH THIS AND N THAT DIAMOND HEAD SIDE OF E POOL, DON'T CALL IT A POOL.

DIAMOND HEAD SIDE OF THE STRUCTURE WOULD BE BLOCKED OFF.

SO THE WATER WILL FLOW OUT THAT WAY.

>>Daryl: SO YOU DON'T HAVE IT OPENING ALONG THE BEACHSIDE?

>> IT DOESN'T FLOW DIRECTLY INTO KAIMANA.

>>Daryl: JIM BICKERTON, I'M SURE YOU'VE SEEN THIS PLAN.

WHAT IS THE RESPONSE OF THE KAIMANA COALITION TO IT?

>> WELL, THIS IS IMPROVEMET OVER T THE PLAN JEREMY HARS LAWMPLED IN ALMOST EVERY OR WAY, JUST DEJA VU.

WE'RE SEEING ALL THE SAME ISSUES AND PROBLEMS ARISE.

AND SO WHAT THIS ONE DOES, MR. SUGG JUST DESCRIBED, IS ONE THAT WILL ALLOW WATER O FLOW THROUGH.

WHICH OLD PLAN DIDN'T.

IT DIDN'T TURN OVER ENOUGHD WAS GOING TO BE VERY UNHEALTHY.

ORIGINAL NATATORIUM FAILED.

NOT ONLY BECAUSE OF WATER DOESN'T TURN OVER, BUT BECE IT'S REALLY HARD TO PUT STL AND CONCRETE INTO THE OCEA.

IT DOESN'T LAST.

IT COSTS A FORTUNE NOT ONLY BUILD TO MAINTAIN.

THOSE ARE THE PROBLEMS THAT STILL REMAIN.

IT'S THIS IDEA OF HOW MUCHS IT DISGOING TO COST, WHOSEO PAY FOR IT, WHY ARE WE DOIG IT IS IT A EXPENSE AND YOU KNOW WHOSE GOING TO PAY FOT PARTNERSHIP.

WHAT WE HEARD.

PRIVATE PARTNERSHIP IS DONA GROUP SUPPOSED TO RAISE CURRENTLY QUOTED 35 MILLIO.

PUBLIC/PRIVATE PARTNERSHIP, EVERY SINGLEEL PROJECT BEEN FAR OVER BUDGET AT THIS LOCATION CAN YOU INCLUDINGE JEREMIAH HARRIS TO RESTOREE FACADE.

50 APPLE?

50 MILLION?WE DON'T KNOW.

WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO GIVEE FOR THAT.

HAVE CHARGE ADMISSION.

VERY SHOWS.

HAVE A STAGE.

PLAN TO HAVE A STAGE IN THE MIDDLE OF THE POOL.

>>Daryl: FRIEND OF NATATORIUM.

HOW DO YOU ANSWER WHAT HE T SAID.

>> POINT OF CLARIFICATION.

NOT DONNA'S GROUP RAISING 0 OR $50 MILLION.

OVER THE COURSE.

>>Daryl: LET ME ASK WHO IS GOING TO BE RAISING MONEY.

>> LET ME GET TO THAT.

YOU KNOW I, SUPPORT FROM TE NATATORIUM BEING REOPENED S REALLY BROAD AND DEEP.

AND GIVE YOU SOME EXAMPLE F THEETHE ENDORSEMENTS GARNER THE LAST 30 OR 40 YEARS.

ASSOCIATION OF HAWAIIAN CIC CLUBS.

58 CLUBS 11 STATES.

OAHU VETERANS COUNCIL, 30 ORGANIZATION.

AND 100,000 PEOPLE.

ASSOCIATION OF UNIFORM SERVICES, 138,000 PEOPLE.

OF COURSE NATIONAL TRUST FR HISTORIC PRESERVATION.

OVER THE YEARS, HAD U.S.

SENATORS, INOUYE, AKAKA, MATSUMOTO NEW GUINEA A.

REPRESENTATIVES MOIRCHG.

ABERCROMBIE.

OLYMPIC SWIMMING COMMUNITY, LOCAL SWIMMING COMMUNITY.

GIVE YOU EXAMPLE.

UNHEARD OF 1200 PEOPLE RESPONDED IN WRITING TO THE EISPM.

PUBLIC NOTICE.

TYPICALLY YOU'LL GET HALF DOZEN, LETTERS FROM STAKEHOLDER GROUPS.

1200 PEOPLE WROTE IN AND SD WE WANT TO SEE THIS THING REOPENED.

SO I WAS ALSO THE STATE'S CHAIR, COCHAIRMAN OF THE WD WAR II CENTENNIAL, GLOBAL CELEBRATION OBSERVANCE OF COMMITTEE RATING END OF WOD WAR II.

COMMEMORATING END OF WORLDR II.

JUST BEEN THAT AS A CATALYT EVENT.

A LOT OF INTEREST WE'VE HA.

GOVERNMENT OF BELGIUM, INTERNATIONAL, NATIONAL INTEREST IN PRESERVING WORD WAR II MEMORIAL BECAUSE ITA GLOBAL, GLOBALLY IMPORTANT SITE.

>>Daryl: LET ME LET HENRY FROM THE KAPIOLANI PARK.

WHAT IS YOUR GUYS' CONCERN ABOUT WHAT MIGHT HAPPEN THE AND WHAT WOULD YOU OPPOSE?

ARE YOU OPPOSED TO THE REBUILDING OF THE POOL ARE?

>> WE HAVE NO OPINION.

POOL AREA IS NOT ON TRUST LANDS.

WE ARE CONCERNED THAT THE TRUST LANDS BE USED ACCORDG TO THE TERM OF TRUST.

WHAT IS IN THE TRUST LAND S THE WAR MEMORIAL PARK.

WHICH IS MAUKA OF THAT FAC.

AND CURRENT PLAN DOES ALMOT NOTHING TO THE TRUST LANDS.

>>Daryl: WE TALKED EARLIER THERE IS A CONCERN ABOUT COMMERCIAL ACTIVITY AROUND THAT AREA.

>> YES.

WE WILL FIGHT COMMERCIAL ACTIVITY ON TRUST LANDS.

WE HAVE FOUGHT COMMERCIAL ACTIVITIES ON TRUST LANDS.

>> POINT OF CLARIFICATION.

IN THE YEAR-AND-A-HALF THAT I'VE BEEN INVOLVED IN THIS PROJECT, THERE'S BEEN NO TK OF COMMERCIALIZATION.

NO TALK OF ANY SORT OF PERFORMING PLATFORM MIDDLEF THE POOL.

THAT HAS NOT COME UP.

SO I DON'T KNOW IF JIM HAS SEEN PLANS THAT I HAVEN'T SEEN.

OR JIM HAS SEEN WHITE PAPER THAT I HAVEN'T SEEN.

THAT IS NOT BEEN PART OF IT FOR US.

I DON'T THINK AND I KNOW TE MAYOR DOES NOT WANT THIS TE A COMMERCIALIZED WAR MEMORL FRANKLY.

>> PAT HENRY SAID EARLIER, KAPIOLANI PARK PRESERVATION SOCIETY ABSOLUTELY WILL SUE THE CITY IF THERE'S ATTEMPO COMMERCIALIZE THE AREA BY E NATATORIUM.

AND ALSO, I HEARD JIM MENTN IN OTHER VENUES AND ON THE SHOW, IN 2018, ABOUT TOUR BUSSES AN TRYING TO CAST TS VISION OF HOW TERRIBLE IT'S GOING TO BE.

THERE ARE NO TOUR BUSSES BRINGING PEOPLE TO THE AQUARIUM FOR THE CONCERTS SERIES OR WHAT NOT.

I MEAN, WE DON'T ANTICIPATE VENUE IS GOING TO BE OPEN R PEOPLE TO SUBMIT AS THEY ALWAYS HAVE.

NEVER BEEN TO A BUSINESS IN THE PAST.

AREN'T ANY TOUR BUSSES GOIG TO THE AQUARIUM.

IT'S JUST I FEEL LIKE THATS KIND OF DOG WHISTLE THING.

LIKE JUST TRYING TO PORTRAY WHAT MAY HAPPEN AND THESE BOOGIE MEN JUST NOT, IT'S T POSSIBLE.

KAPIOLANI PARK PRESERVATION SOCIETY IS NOT GOING TO STD FOR IT.

>>Daryl: JIM GO AHEAD.

>> LITIGATE THIS AGAINST C. I TOOK JEREMY HARRIS DEPOSITION GOT HIM ON STANN IT COURT AND THE REASON THT WE DID THAT WAS TO FIND OUT WHAT WAS THE REAL PLAN.

HE HAD BEEN COMMUNICATING H THE POLYNESIAN CULTURAL CENTER.

IDEA WAS BECAUSE THE TOURIS CURRENTLY DON'T HAVE A VENE WHERE THEY CAN SEE SHOWS IN WAIKIKI THAT IS LIKE THIS.

ALL HAVE TO GO OUT TO GERMAINE'S LUAU OR SOMEPLAE IN KO OLINA.

HOTELS WANT THIS REALLY BA.

WANT A VENUE HAS 2,000 SEAS RIGHT ON THE OCEAN.

WATCH SUNSET.

AND THEY WERE ALL FOR THIS.

BACKED JEREMY HARRISON THI.

AND THAT WAS THE QUID PRO O THAT WAS DONE WE EXPOSED TO PUBLIC TURNED AGAINST IT RADICALLY.

THAT WAS 20 YEARS AGO.

THINGS DON'T CHANGE.

THIS THING BEEN THERE 100 YEARS.

ANDY SAYING WE HAVEN'T HEAD ANYTHING ABOUT THIS.

WELL, YEAH GOING TO KEEP IT QUIET.

THAT'S WHY DOESN'T THAT DIT ANSWER YOUR QUESTION.

DONNA DIDN'T ANSWER.

WHO IS GOING TO PAY FOR THS $50 MILLION?

>> I DID ANSWER.

ANSWERED.

>> BELGIUM?

HAWAIIAN CIVIC CLUB?

HOLD ON.

>> ANSWER IS WE HAVE HUNDRS OF THOUSANDSES OF PEOPLE, O SUPPORT THE RESTORATION AND I'M QUITE CONFIDENT THAT CAPITAL CAMPAIGN INCLUDES PHILANTHROPIC APPROACHES PRIVATE SECTOR, FEDERAL AND FOREIGN GOVERNMENTS PEOPLEE READY TO OPEN THEIR WALLETS AND KEEP THIS THING OPEN.

>>Daryl: WANT TO SAY, THREE PEOPLE HERE THAT SAY THAT ISN'T GOING TO HAPPEN.

BUT YOU'RE JUST ABSOLUTELY BELIEVE THAT'S GOING TO BE COMMERCIALIZED?

>> IT'S POSSIBLE THAT IT CD BE NOT COMMERCIALIZED.

BUT IT WOULD HAVE TO BE WRITTEN INTO STONE BEFORE, THEY PUT THE CART BEFORE TE HORSE.

THEY'RE OUT THERE DRAWING P PLANS, GETTING CONTRACTS I THINK DONNA HERSELF AT LAST LAST TIME WE WERE ALL DOING THIS, SHE WORKED FOR ONE OF THE COMPANIES THAT WAS INVOLVED NO DOING THE PLANNING.

I DON'T KNOW IF SHE STILL DOES.

THERE'S A LOT OF MONEY TO E MADE THIS IN THESE THINGS.

MAKE SURE BEFORE WE START SHELLING OUT CASH, START PUTTING OUTBIDS OR ANYTHING ELSE, IT'S WRITTEN INTO LA, NOT JUST -- >> ALREADY ENSHRINED INTO .

>> NOT JUST DOCUMENT.

BUT THE CITY COUNCIL THAT THERE IS A COMPLETE AND PERMANENT BAN ON ANY COMMERCIAL ACTIVITY.

BUT NOT JUST THE BAN ON COMMERCIAL ACTIVITY.

WHAT IF THEY DECIDE THEY ND TO CHARGE YOU TO ENTER THE NATATORIUM?

BECAUSE SOMEONE GOT TO PAYR IT.

>>Daryl: LET'S GET OTHERS CHANCE.

NOW, PAT GO AHEAD.

WOULD YOU ALSO WANT TO SEE SOMETHING IN WRITING THAT SAYS, THIS IS THE PARAMETES AROUND WHICH THIS CAN OPER?

>> THIS IS SOMETHING IN WRITING.

ENACTED IN 1896.

>>Daryl: 1896?

>> YES.

PARK IS BOMBED BY THE CITYD STATE.

BOUND BY THE CITY AND STATE BOUND BY THE TERM OF TRUST WHEN IT C COMES TO KAPIOLAI PARK.

>> PROMISE YOU EVERYBODY AT SOWPT.

CITY & COUNTY REALLY GOOD LAWYE.

THOSE OF US NOT LAWYERS KNW ABOUT THE KOP THE KAPIOLAT THE FACT THAT THERE'S NO AMBIGUITY ABOUT NO COMMERCIALIZATION.

>> HARD LINE.

>> WE DON'T LET THEM FORGE.

WE TESTIFIED.

WE FILED COURT CASES.

>>Daryl: LET ME PICK UP A LITTLE BIT OF JIM'S ARGUME.

WHY NOT PUT PARAMETERS IN WRITING, ESPECIALLY IF NEWG TO OTHER PEOPLE FOR MONEY.

GO TO SOMEBODY I AND SAI IO VOTE A THOUSAND DOLLARS TOE WAR MEMORIAL NATATORIUM AND THEY SAY, WELL, ALL OF A SUDDEN, FEW YEARS LATER THY SEE FEE OR THEY SEE TOURIST APPLICATION, THEY'RE GOINGO BE MAD AT YOU.

NOT A BAD IDEA TO PUT THATN WRITING.

>> LETS ME POINT HANAUMA BY AS EXAMPLE IS PLACE WHERE E CHARGE TOURISTS 25 BUCKS A HEAD TO GO IN THERE.

AND LOCALS GO IN FOR FREE.

AND FUNDS THAT ARE RAISED O INTO THE MAINTENANCE AND UP KEEP OF THE PARK.

SO.

>>Daryl: RULE OUT?

>> TO JIM'S ISSUE I DON'T E ANY PROBLEM WITH CHARGING NONRESIDENT A FEE TO GO PLACES.

WE DO IT DIAMOND HEAD.

HIKE.

WE DO IT HANAUMA BAY.

WE'RE DOING IT WITH THE NEW TRAVEL TOURISM GREEN FEE.

I MEAN, THIS IS JUST, I DOT HAVE A LOT OF HARP ON THATN THE CONSTITUTION.

>>Daryl: WHICH ONE IS UNCONSTITUTIONAL.

>> CHARGING FEE AT HANAUMA BAY.

FOR ANOTHER SHOW,.

>>Daryl: ANOTHER 20 YEAR THING GOING ON.

STILL GOING.

UNCONSTITUTIONAL, LET ME GT SOME QUESTIONS IN GETTING E QUESTIONS THAN I THOUGHT.

ERIC IN KAUAI COUNTY SAYS, RESTORING NATATORIUM WOULDE VERY COOL IF THE MONEY COUD BE FOUND.

MY CONCERN IS WHERE THE MOY COMES FROM AND WOULD THEREE CONDITIONS COME WITH THE MONETIZE AND NAMING RIGHTS.

>>Testifier: SHORT ANSWER S NO ON THE ADVERTISING AND NAMING RIGHTS.

AS DAN IN A ARTICULATED, DA AIR ARELIANOSARTICULATED PN HAWAII COMMITTED TO RAISING GOOD CHUNK OF THE MONEY AN, YOU KNOW WE WOULD LOOK AT FEDERAL MONEY, LOOK AT STA, BUT NO.

THERE'S NOT GOING TO BE.

IT'S NOT GOING TO BE THE TARGET NATATORIUM.

>>Daryl: KODAK?

GETTING A LOT OF QUESTIONS ABOUT HOW MUCH THINGS WILL COST.

>> CAN I JUST SAY SOMETHING ABOUT THAT?

BECAUSE I REALLY RESPECT WT PAT IS SAYING ABOUT WHAT TR POSITION IS.

BUT HE WAS VERY CLEAR THAT THEIR JURISDICTIONS STOPS N THE MAUKA PARK.

THE ACTUAL STRUCTURE, BLEACHERS, AND THE POOL, AE NOT IN HIS BAILIWICK.

SO IT WILL BE VERY DIFFERET CASE THAN THE ONES THAT HAE COME UP IN THE PAST.

PEOPLE DONE COMMERCIAL ACTIVITY IN THE PARK, AND COURTS HAVE SAID NO.

WHAT ABOUT WHEN YOU DO IT RIGHT NEXTDOOR AND WHAT THT DOES IS PUT POPULATION PRESSURE ON THE PARK.

IT REMOVES PARKING.

IT CAUSES PEOPLE TO BE UNAE TO GET TO THE BEACH.

BECAUSE THERE'S A BIG EVENT THE NATATORIUM.

THAT IS WT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT.

I DON'T SEE ANYTHING EITHEN THEIR TRUST OR IN THE LAW, THAT IS GOING TO STOP THATD MAKE SURE THAT DOESN'T HAP.

>>Daryl: LET ME BRING UP TE COST ISSUE AGAIN.

JUST TALK ABOUT THIS FEE A LITTLE BIT.

YOU FOLKS, IS THAT A CORRET INTERPRETATION DO YOU THINK THAT A FEE TO GET IN THAT WOWOULD BE APPLIED TO THE T OF MAINTENANCE, WOULD ALSOE A VIOLATION OF THE TRUST?

>> NO.

>>Daryl: IT WOULD NOT BE A VIOLATION.

>> NOTHING IN THE NATATORIM IS ON TRUST LAND.

>>Daryl: WHEN YOU TALK ABOT FIGHTING COMMERCIAL ACTIVI, YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT THE BUSSES OR THE ,BUT INVITING TOURISTS IN TO WATCH A SHO, AT THE NATATORIUM, WOULD PROBABLY NOT BE A VIOLATIO?

>> AS LONG AS COLLECT MONEN NATATORIUM LAND.

>>Daryl: OR SOMEWHERE ELSE.

>> OR SOMEWHERE ELSE.

YES.

>>Daryl: BACK TO YOU ANDY.

I FEEL LIKE I'M MODERATING COURT HEARING HERE.

IS THE IDEA OF AT SOME POI, CHARGING SOMETHING THAT WOD BE ON THE TABLE?

FOR ACCESS?

>> I CAN'T SAY YES OR NO.

I WOULD NOT SAY NO.

THAT DECISION WOULD BE MADY OTHERS AND I DON'T -- THATS NOT PART OF OUR PLAN RIGHT NOW.

JUST TELLING YOU WHERE WE STAND RIGHT NOW, THERE'S NO TALK OF CHARGING ADMISSIONR KAMA'AINA OR VISITORS.

>>Daryl: BACK TO THIS QUESTION.

HOW MUCH IS IT GOING TO CO?

WHAT IS THE REASONABLE FIGE FOR HOW MUCH IT'S ACTUALLY GOING TO COST?

>> THAT'S THE BIG, THE TENF MILLION-DOLLAR QUESTION, DARYL.

I THINK WHEN JIM WAS ON THE SHOW IN 2018, I THINK THERE WAS A QUOTE OF $35 MILLION.

SO THAT WAS 7 YEARS AGO.

OBVIOUSLY THINGS HAVE INCREASED IN PRICE SINCE T. >>Daryl: FEW THINGS HAVE HAPPENED.

>> FEW THINGS HAVE HAPPENE SO I CAN'T NECESSARILY GUES BUT I WOULD.

>> ADVANCE?

>> I WOULD GUESS WE'RE TALG ABOUT $50 MILLION.

>>Daryl: THEN SO COUPLE OF QUESTIONS.

BEGINNING TO RUN OUT OF RO.

WHY KPT THE CITY REOPEN ITS A SLAU SLAU SALTWATER POOL.

ANSWERED THAT QUESTION.

LET ME ASK THIS.

JIM, BECOME TO THE FEE THI.

GOING ALL OVER THE PLACE.

SORRY.

WHY WOULD THE KAIMANA PARK COALITION BE AGAINST A FEEO HELP SUPPORT THE MAINTENANE OF IT?

WHEN YOU DON'T WANT THE THG TO FALL APART NEXT TO YOUR BEACH EITHER.

RIGHT?

>> FLEX THERE WAS A PLAN TS IN PLACE AND TWO MAYORAL ADMINISTRATIONS SUPPORTED T AND PUSHED IT AFTER JEREMY HARRIS.

MUFI HANNEMANN AND AFTER T, NEXT MAYOR AS WELL.

AND SO THAT PLAN WAS TO REN THE FACADE, ARCHES AND BLEACHERS.

MAYBE RELOCATE SOME OF THOA LITTLE BIT INLAND.

AND PUT A BEACH THERE.

SO IT WOULD BE ACTUALLY INSTEAD OF THE POOL, YOU WD TAKE OUT THE SEAWARD OR MAI WALL AND THEY HAD ALL DESIN AND FIGURED OUT.

MUCH LESS EXPENSIVE THAN BUILDING A POOL OUT, POOL DECKS OUT INTO THE OCEAN.

SO THAT WAS SOMETHING THATE WERE NOT AGAINST.

WHWHAT WE'RE REALLY ALL ABT CAN PEOPLE ACCESS THE SHORELINE?

FOR FREE?

FOR FREE.

WHEREVER IT IS.

IF YOU'RE GOING TO CREATE A PIECE OF SHORELINE, THIS IS MOST VALUABLE RALLIES TATEN THE WORLD.

PIECE OF WAIKIKI OVER 200 YARDS LONG I THINK.

SHORELINE ACCESSIBLE NOW?

>> IT IS.

SINCE 1927, THAT STRUCTURES JETTED OUT INTO THE OCEAN T THE SHORELINE AT K KAIMANAD SHORELINE EWA THE NATATORIM HAS BEEN OPEN TO THE PUBLI.

>> IF AIN'T BROKE, DON'T FX IT.

>>Daryl: SORRY.

I WANT TO ASK READ THIS QUESTION.

FACILITY BEEN HERE NEARLY 0 YEARS.

WHEN WAS BUILT, DID IT ALTR BEACH OR HELP FORM IT TO WT IT IS NOW?

WHAT STUDIES WHAT COULD HAN TO KAIMANA BEACH WALLS NATATORIUM ARE ALTERED.

>> ANSWER THAT.

LOOK AT PHOTOGRAPH OF THE SHORELINE, IN 1921, BEFOREE NATATORIUM WAS BUILT, AND BEFORE KAIMANA BEACH WAS CREATED, IT'S NATURAL, BASICALLY THE SHORELINE IN FRONT OF AQUARIUM NOW.

WHICH IS SCRUBBED ROCK SHORELINE.

AND KAIMANA BEACH MANMADE BEACH.

AFTER THE NATATORIUM WAS BUILT, THAT BEACH, BEACH, S STILL SCRUBBED ROCK SHOREL.

AND SAND WAS TRUCKED IN BECAUSE THEY REALIZED, WE E THIS NICE RETAINING WALL N. THEY TRUCKED IN SAND TO BUD THAT BEACH.

IT'S THE MOST STABLE SECTIN OF BEACH ON ALL OF WAIKIKI.

BECAUSE OF NATATORIUM IS BG BOX.

IS THERE.

IT'S NOT WE SEEN IDEA THATU COULD TEAR DOWN THE POOL AD LEAVE A STICK LINE, WE HAVE HOW MANY STICK LINES GOING DOWN INTO WAIKIKI?

WE HAVE SEEN HOW THEY DON'T WORK.

BECAUSE SAND JUST WASHES OT FROM THE SHERATON, ROYAL HAWAIIAN.

ALL OF THOSE STICK LINES TY DON'T WORK.

ONLY THING THAT DO WORK ARE CARIBBEACREUB LIKE AT KUHI.

TO THE POINT OF SORT OF IRC SAVE KAIMANA BEACH COALITI.

NATATORIUM IS WHAT CREATED, AND MAINTAINING KAIMANA BE.

>>Daryl: DO YOU AGREE WITH THAT THEORY?

>> IT'S FACT.

>> NO.

>> SHORELINE IS BEAR COUNTD ROCK SHORELINE WITHOUT THE NATATORIUM.

>>Daryl: WOULDN'T IT BE RISKY TO REMOVE THAT?

SEEN IT WHEN THEY REMOVED OBSTRUCTIONS.

DON'T KNOW WHAT HAPPENS.

>> AS I UNDERSTAND WHAT ANY WAS DESCRIBING ON KAIMANA E NOT GOING TO HAVE THE FLOW COMING OUTRIGHT NEXT TO THE BEACH.

GOING TO BE POINTED MAKAI R OUT TOWARDS THE END.

>>Daryl: STILL BE WALL THERE.

>> STILL A WALL THAT PROTES KAIMANA BEACH.

>>Daryl: MAYBE I'M MISUNDERSTANDING WHAT YOUR POSITION S I THOUGHT WHAT U WERE SAYING WHAT THIS PERSN SUGGESTS.

MOVE NATATORIUM TO FORT RUR NOT TALKING ABOUT THAT.

WAR MEMORIAL AND LEAVE KAIA BEACH.

ANOTHER QUESTION HERE.

>> YOU NEED A WALL.

DO YOU NEED A WALL TO PRESE THAT BIECH.

BEACH DISAGREE THIS WAS ARTIFICIALLY CREATED IN THAT SENSE.

IF YOU ACTUALLY LOOK FOR EXAMPLE OUTRIGGER CLUB, NET TO THE WALL, THERE'S A BEA.

BEACH IS ALWAYS FORMING ONE DIAMOND HEAD SIDE OF ALL OF THESE GROINS.

AND DEPENDING ON THE SIZE F GROIN, YOU GET A BIGGER BE.

NATATORIUM IS THE BIGGEST GROIN WE GOT.

THAT WALL IS MASSIVE.

AND SO WE BIG BEACH THERE.

>>Daryl: WHAT YOU'RE PROPOSING YOU WOULD HAVE TE FACADE, HAVE THE MEMORIAL,D WOULD YOU HAVE A RATHER LAE SEA WALL THERE.

>> YEAH.

YOU HAVE ONE ON THE OTHER E TOO.

SO IT WOULD FILL IN.

ALL PLANNED OUT.

BEAR IN MIND, ISN'T OUR ID.

OUR GROUP'S IDEA.

THIS WAS A FULLY REALIZED N DRAWINGS EVERYTHING, WERE E BY THE HANNEMANN ADMINISTRATION.

SO IT'S NOT.

>> DIFFERENCE IS THAT PLAN NEVER HAD AN ACCEPTED EIS.

IT WAS NEVER FUNDED.

IT WAS NEVER PERMITTED.

SO THE RESTAURANT THAT JEREMIAH HARRIS UNDER TOOKN 1998 AND COMPLETED MAUKA PORTION IN 2001 WHY THE LIFEGUARDS IN THERE NOW, AL OF THAT LAND BASED PORTIONS BEEN RENOVATED.

SO WE HAVE LOCKER ROOMS AND BATHROOMS OPENED SINCE 200.

LIFEGUARDS HAVE OFFICE.

GOT THEIR DISTRICT 1 SUBSTATION IN THERE.

REALITY IS THE ONLY THING T HAS BEEN STUDIED AND PERMID IS RESTORATION.

ALL OF THOSE OTHER IDEAS AE JUST SPIT BALLING.

>> DON'T HAVE SMA PERMIT FR THIS YET.

THAT IS GOING TO BE JOB.

>> PREVIOUS RESTORATION WAS FULL SET OF PERMITS FULLY FUNDED UNDER CONTRACT FOR CONSTRUCTION.

>> AND COURT STOPPED IS BECAUSE IT WAS ILLEGALLY PERMITTED BECAUSE THEY WERE DOING IT IN A SEGMENTED WAY WHICH YOU'RE NOT ALLOWED TO THE ENVIRONMENT.

>>Daryl: WE'RE GETTING VERY LEGALISTIC RIGHT THERE.

I DO HAVE ANOTHER PIECE OF TAPE.

THIS IS FROM EXPRESSES CONN THAT VIEWER EXPRESSED ABOUT ANY CHANGES THAT MIGHT AFFT THE BEACH.

LET'S DO IT NOW.

>> MY CONCERN IS THAT KAIMA BEACH IS A COMMUNITY TREAS.

SUCH A PRECIOUS PRECIOUS RESOURCE FOR SO MANY PEOPL.

AND WHATEVER THEY DO TO THE NATATORIUM, I HOPE THAT DECISION MAKERS KEEP THIS N MIND.

THIS IS WHERE YOUNG FAMILIS BRING THEIR CHILDREN.

TO LEARN HOW TO SWIM.

THIS IS WHERE KUPUNA COME N TO EXERCISE.

THIS PLACE IS SO IMPORTANTO SO MANY PEOPLE.

AND FOR ME, IT'S CRUCIAL TT THEY KEEP THIS IN MIND, THT WHATEVER THEY DO TO RENOVAE THE NATATORIUM, DOESN'T INE A WHOLE SWARM OF MORE USERO COME IN THAT VERY NATURE OF THE BEACH IS NOT CHANGED.

SO MANY PLANS MADE AND I UNDERSTAND THE NEED.

IT IS AN EYESORE AND I THII CAN UNDERSTAND THE URGENCYO EITHER TEAR IT DOWN OR TO RENOVATE IT.

BUT I HOPE THAT WHATEVER DECISION IS MADE, THAT THEY RESPECT THE NEEDS OF THE LL PEOPLE WHO USE THIS BEACH.

THERE REALLY IS NO BEACH AS IMPORTANT AS THIS ONE ON TS SIDE OF THE ISLAND.

THAT IS AS CONVENIENT, THAS CLEAN AND USABLE.

USER-FRIENDLY AS THIS BEAC.

>>Daryl: WANT TO REINFORCE THOSE COMMENTS FROM A NUMBR OF PEOPLE CALLED IN.

KAIMANA BEACH AND PARK NEXO IT LAST LOCAL PEOPLE IN WAIKIKI.

CAN SWIM.

HAVE A FAMILY BARBECUE, RE.

ET CETERA.

IT EVEN HAS PARKING.

WILL IMPROVING FACILITY MEN EVENTS GET SCHEDULED THERE AFFECT PARKING AND BEACH AD PARK ACCESS?

>> I CAN'T SPEAK TO THE, PARKING IF THE NATATORIUM S OPEN, THERE WILL BE PEOPLE THERE SWIMMING AND I WOULD IMAGINE THAT PARKING WOULDE IMPACTED.

I WANT TO TWO BACK TO THE KAIMANA BEACH PIECE OF IT.

WE HAVE PEOPLE IN OUR HONOU HALE THAT SWIM AT KAIMANA BEACH EVERY WEEK.

WE HAVE FAMILY AND FRIENDS, JIM AND 2018 ON SHOW, SAIDE TAUGHT HIS KIDS IT HOW TO M AT KAI MANU A ALL THREE OFS KIDS SWIM AT KAIMANA.

FOUR NOW.

>> THERE YOU GO.

>> WE HAVE NO INTEREST, THERE'S NO PART OF THIS PLN THAT ELIMINATES KAIMANA BE.

I CAN'T BE MORE CLEAR THAN THAT.

>>Daryl: RIGHT, BUT IT COUD CHANGE THE ACTIVITY THERE CERTAINLY?

>> WELL, YES.

>> PEOPLE WHO AT THE BEACHE GOING TO THE POOL INSTEAD.

AS FAR AS EVENTS ARE CONCERNED, NOBODY GOES TO E BEACH AFTER DARK.

IF THERE'S AN EVENT, PROBAY BE EVENING EVENT.

LIKE AQUARIUM CONCERT SERI.

THAT DOESN'T REALLY IMPACT.

>>Chair Cordero: THAT OKAY WITH YOU GUYS, AQUARIUM CONCERT?

>> AQUARIUM NOT ON TRUST L. : WHERE IS THE LINE?

THAT TERM GOES RIGHT UP TOE LITTLE PARKING LOT AREA RIT THERE.

>> THAT SECTION, OF THE BE, GOES FROM STARTS AT THE AQUARIUM, AND ENDS AT THE KAIMANA BEACH HOTEL.

THEN IT GOES MAUKA FROM TH.

>>Daryl: YOU MAY WONDER WHO ACTUALLY DOES OWN THE LAND THAT THESE THINGS ARE ON.

AND THIS MAY NOT BE KNOWN O ANDY EVEN.

I TALKED TO FRANK FASI YEAS AGO AND I ASKED HIM.

I SAID, HOW COME YOU MAYOR2 YEARS AND NEVER FIXED UP TE NATATORIUM.

HE SAID, I'M NOT PUTTING CY MONEY INTO LAND THAT WE DOT OWN.

IT'S OWNED BY THE STATE.

AND IT'S ONLY LOANED TO USN EXECUTIVE ORDER.

GOVERNOR CAN TAKE IT AWAY M US WITH A STROKE OF PEN, WY SHOULD WE PUT 50 MILLION OR WHATEVER IT WAS IN $2,005.

>>Daryl: IS THAT,.

>> I AM AWARE OF THAT.

FOR THE REPORTED.

I'M AWARE OF THAT.

>>Daryl: FORD THE RECORD.

>>Daryl: STATE IS WHERE THE NATATORIUM IS OR IS THAT KAIMANA BEACH PARK?

THE PARK.

>> STATE OWNS NATATORIUM.

THEY'VE OWNED IT SINCE IT S BUILT.

>>Daryl: WHY DON'T THEY FIX IT.

>> THAT'S WHAT FRANK FASI POSITION WAS.

WHY SHOULD CITY I PAY FOR SOMETHING STATE OWNS.

STATE ISSUED EXECUTIVE ORDR TO LET THE CITY OPERATE NATATORIUM.

CITY HAS OVER THE DECADES, MADE INVESTMENTS.

IN FACT, UNDER THE HARRIS ADMINISTRATION, FULL RESTORATION WAS FULLY FUND, 11-AND-A-HALF MILLION DOLL, AND IT WAS UNDER CONTRACT.

TO BE BUILT.

AND THEN THERE WAS A CHANGN ADMINISTRATION.

REMAINING FUNDS WERE THROWN BACK INTO THE GENERAL FUND.

SO YEAH, THERE WAS FOR A WHILE, IN THE SIXTIES AND 70s, LIKE WE NEED TO DO SOE REPAIRS.

WHWHO'S GOING IT PAY FOR I?

CITY WAS LIKE, WELL, STATE OWNS IT.

STATE SAYS YOU'RE OPERATING IT.

KIND OF YOU PAY FOR IT.

NO.

YOU PAY FOR IT KIND OF THI.

>> STILL THERE.

>>Daryl: >> I WANT TO POINT OUT NOT UNIQUE TO THE NATATORIUM.

CITY HAS TO MAINTAIN KOP LI PARK NOT ALLOWED TO MAKE AY MONEY OFF OF IT.

ALWAYS TRYING TO SOMEHOW MONETIZE IT.

AND WE'RE ALWAYS TRYING TO STOP THEM FROM DOING THAT.

SO IT'S NOT UNIQUE.

>>Daryl: TOURISTS HAVE A LT OF MONEY.

>> THEY DON'T GIVE IT TO TE CITY.

IS THE PROBLEM.

>>Daryl: SO WE KIND DID TAK ABOUT THAT QUESTION.

NATATORIUM BATHROOMS, MJ KAIMANA EMAIL, NATATORIUM BATHROOMS ARE DISGRACE.

BEEN FOR QUITE A WHILE.

BEFORE ANY ACTION OR FURTHR DEVELOPMENT OR RECONSTRUCTN OF THE POOL, BLEACHER AREA, VERY LEAST FIX THOSE BATHROOMS.

EMBARRASSMENT.

>> HERE, HERE.

>>Daryl: IS IT REALLY BAD?

>> CAN'T SPEAK TO THE CONDITION OF BATHROOMS AT T AREA.

HAVEN'T SEEN THEM.

>> I USE THEM.

REGULARLY TODAY IN FACT.

PARKS DEPARTMENT WORKS VERY HARD AT HUNDREDS OF PARKS L ALLTHE ISLAND AND SOME, I M, THE ISSUE HERE ON OAHU IS LARGELY THAT EVERY SINGLEEL DAY OF THE YEAR.

>>Daryl: BY THE END OF THE DAY,.

>> EXACTLY.

>>Daryl: I THINK LITTLE DIFFERENT THIS ONE.

>> WHAT HAPPENED WAS THEY D NOT DO A GOOD JOB ON THE CONSTRUCTION.

IT'S BEEN FALLING APART.

I MEANS NOT JUST LACK OF MAINTENANCE OR DON'T SWEEPP THE SAND THAT PEOPLE TRACK.

ALL FIXTURES DON'T WORK.

THINGS ARE BROKEN PRETTY MH NEW.

THIS HAPPENED WITHIN A COUE OF YEARS AFTER THEY WERE PT IN.

SO YOU CAN SPEND THIS 50 MILLION BUT WHAT QUALITY ARE YOU GOING TO GET?

WHAT OTHER THING I'VE ALWAS FOCUSED ON WHAT IS GOING TO COST TO MAINTAIN?

YOU CAN GET THAT ONE TIME PAYMENT FROM THE GOVERNMENF BELGIUM MAYBE.

I DON'T BELIEVE IT.

BUT EVERY YAHIRO IN AND YER OUT CITY COME UP WITH 2 OR $3 MILLION TO KEEP THIS THG RUNNING TO CLEAN THOSE GRIS THAT HE DESCRIBED, ANYONE T METAL IN THE OCEAN FOR A FW WEEKS, COVERED LIMU.

>> I USED WOMEN'S LOCKER ROOMED TOO.

NO BETTER OR WORSE THAN ANY OTHER PUBLIC RESTROOM OR LOCKER ROOM ON THE ISLAND.

>>Daryl: I THINK ONE OF THE THINGS THAT HAPPENS IS SOME PEOPLE HAVE HIGH EXPECTATI.

MAY I HAVE FAMILY IN CANAD.

YOU GO TO THEIR PARKS THER.

IT'S LIKE BEAUTIFUL AND HAI IS ALWAYS HAD A HARD TIME MAINTAINING PARKS.

BUT I THINK IT SOUNDS LIKE KIND OF GOT GOTTEN TO A PN THIS CONVERSATION WHERE REY COMES DOWN TO ARE THE TAXPAYORS OR ARE WE GOING O BE ABLE TO REALLY BE A AFFD TO BUILD AND MAINTAIN THIS POOL?

SORT OF QUESTION HERE.

SOUNDS LIKE JIM SAYING, HE DOESN'T THINK YOU COULD EVR GET ENOUGH MONEY TO REALLY BUILD AND MAINTAIN THIS THG FOR A LONG PERIOD OF TIME.

>> WITHOUT SELLING OUT.

>>Chair Cordero: DO WE HAVE A PLAN FOR LONGTERM SUSTAINABILITY?

>> YEAH.

WE WOULDN'T KNOW THE QUESTN IS CAN YOU RAISE THE MONEYS NEVER ANSWERABLE UNTIL YOUY TO RACES THE MONEY.

ANYBODY RUN CAPITAL CAMPAIN FOR ANYTHING KNOWS.

BUT I JUST WANT TO SAY THAN ADDITION TO LIKE I SAID INTEREST THAT WE SAW DURING THE WORLD WAR II CENTENNIAL INTERNATIONAL EVENT, SHOULD NOT FORGET THAT'S NATATORIM IS GOING TO HAVE ITS OWN CENTENNIAL AUGUST 24, 2027.

AND THE RUN UP TO THAT REAY EXCITING OPPORTUNITY TO BUD ENERGY AROUND PEOPLE WOULD WANT TO SEE THE HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDSES OF PEOPLE WHO E SUPPORTED US IN THE PAST.

>> WOULD WANT TO SEE THE NATATORIUM PRESSED INTO PUC USE AND REOPENED FOR PEOPLO ENJOY, YOU KNOW, THERE'S POTENTIAL THERE TO LEVERAGE THE CENTENNIAL OF THE NATATORIUM INTO A VERY ENERGETIC CAMPAIGN.

I MEAN, YOU SAW THE PEARL HARBOR WHEN THE PEARL HARBR 50TH AND 75TH AND THERE WEA LOT OF PEOPLE CAME FORWARDO HELP MAKE THAT HAPPEN.

SO THESE BIG CENTENNIAL EVS REALLY BIG OPPORTUNITY.

>>Daryl: GET BACK TO THE SUSTAINABILITY AND FINANCIG IN A BIT.

I WANT INTERESTING QUESTIO.

MIGHT TAKE TAKE US A FEW MO DISCUSS.

RICK FROM HONOLULU ASKS, NW PLAN FOR THE SWIMMING POOL INCLUDES DEMOLITION OF THE MAUKA AND EWA WALLS.

MAUKA, MAUKA IS.

>> NO.

DO NOT INCLUDE THAT DEMOLIN OF THAT WALL.

>>Daryl: BUT I THINK.

>> THAT WALL WOULD BE BLEACHERS., REHABILITATED.

>>Daryl: THAT'S THE BLEACHERS.

THIS PERSON IS ASKING, AT LEAST TWO WALLS WILL HAVE GRATES SOME OTHER WAY WATER COMING IN.

HIS QUESTION IS HOMES TO TS POTENTIALLY CAN TRAP CHILDN IN A AREA.

JUST BRINGS YOU UP OVERALLW SAFE IS THIS GOING TO BE?

HOW DEEP IS IT?

SOMETHING THAT YOU CAN TEAH YOUR CHILDREN HOW TO SWIM T OR SOMETHING THAT FOR LONG DISTANCE SWIMMERS OR OLYMPC QUALITY SWIMMERS?

>> I THINK ANY REIMAGININGF THE NATATORIUM WOULD UNDERSTAND THAT PEOPLE PROBABLY WON'T BE ABLE TO M IN THERE 365 DAYS A YEAR.

DEPENDING ON O SOUTH SWELL, THAT SORT OF THING.

WE GIVEN A PRESENTATION FEW MONTHS AGO AND THE REEF REY KNOCKS DOWN A LOT OF IT'S REALLY STRONG SWELLS.

SO WE DON'T CONSIDER THAT O BE A REALLY BIG ISSUE.

BUT I WOULD IMAGINE THERE WOULD BE DAYS IF THIS WEREO HAPPEN.

THAT THEY WOULD JUST CLOSEE POOL FOR SWIMMING.

>>Chair Cordero: DID YOU .>>Daryl: YOU EVER SWIM IN IT.

>> NO.

WENT INSIDE STILL OPEN BUT NEVER SWAM IN IT.

>>Daryl: WHAT IS IT LIKE.

>> I THINK WHAT PEOPLE DONT REALIZE NATATORIUM IS NOT OLYMPIC POOL.

IT'S DOUBLE.

WHEN YOU'RE IN IT, THERE'S THIS TRUE SENSE OF AWE BECE IT IS JUST SO STUPIFYING BEAUTIFUL AND BIG.

THAT YOU DON'T REALIZE HOWG IT IS UNTIL YOU'RE IN THER.

AND I REMEMBER WHEN I SWAMN IT, MOST RECENTLY, WITH ENGINEERING TEAM, ACTUALLY, CLIMBED OUT OF POOL AND PUY FEET INTO THE STEPS ON THE SIDE OF THE WALL, ALL I COD THINK OF WAS DUKE KAHANAMOU FEET WERE IN THESE STEPS.

AND IT WAS REAL WAS REALLN SWIMMER REALLY SPECIAL THI.

BEAUTIFUL.

WATER IS BEAUTIFUL.

ALL YOU CAN THINK OF ABOUTL OF THE OLYMPIANS AND INTERNATIONAL SWIMMERS AND HISTORY.

NATATORIUM IS ST. ANDREWS COMPETITIVE SWIMMING.

INTERNATIONALLY.

INTERNATIONAL SWIMMING HALF FAME WANTED TO COME AND OPA MUSEUM THERE.

AND JUST A REALLY CHICKEN N KIND OF THING.

>>Daryl: I CAN SWIM AND I COULD PROBABLY SWIM IN THE.

BUT MY QUESTION WAS, DO YOU THINK IT WOULD BE A PLACE WHERE LITTLE KIDS WOULD GON THE WATER?

>> BEAUTY OF IT IS THAT BECAUSE IT'S A CONTAINED A, YOU'VE GOT ADA ACCESS TO FM THE STREET ALL THE WAY IN D ONTO THE DECK AND BEFORE TE RESTORATION I HAD ENVISIOND ADA ACCESS INTO THE POOL WH OF THE LIFTS SO FORTH.

SO WE'RE TALKING ABOUT GETG PEOPLE INTO THE OCEAN WHO PROBABLY WOULDN'T OTHERWISE ABLE TO.

DON'T HAVE TO WALK ACROSS SAND.

THERE'S A LIFT TO GET IN TS THE POOL.

KUPUNA, DISABLED PEOPLE, CHILDREN, LEARN TO SWIM, GG TO BE CALM OCEAN WATER.

AND LIKE I SAID, ADA ACCESP TO THE WATER.

>> AND I THINK THE VIEWER'S QUESTION WAS ABOUT PEOPLE GETTING STUCK IN THE GRATE.

>>Daryl: THAT WAS SPECIFIC QUESTION.

>> THAT IS NOT, FROM WHAT WE'VE BEEN TOLD BY THE ENGINEERS, AECOM WORKING ON THIS FOR US, THAT WOULD NOE AN ISSUE.

>> NOT REALLY GETTING STUBG IN THE GRATES.

GRATES ARE FINE.

STUCK IN THE GRATES MEANT O KEEP OUT SMALL SEA CREATURS IT IS DESIGNED OLD POOL FAILED.

>>Daryl: GRATES REALLY SMALL?

>> NO.

LIKE A FENCE.

MORE LIKE A FENCE.

>> A GRILL.

>> MADE OUT OF PLASTIC.

NOT GOING TO RUST AWAY.

>> OLD POOL FAILED BECAUSET HAD NO FLOW CURRENT.

IT WAS THE CALM PARADISE IN TERMS OF FLAT WATER, AND STILLWATER.

>> 1919 ENGINEERING.

>> BUT WHAT WE'RE SAYING NW CAN'T DO THAT.

THAT'S NOT HEALTHY.

CHILD DID DROWN THERE BECAE OF THE POOL VISIBILITY.

SOME YEARS BEFORE WHILE ITS STILL OPEN.

SO WE CAN'T HAVE THAT KINDF POOL.

WE GOT TO FLOW THE WATER THROUGH.

WHEN SOUTH SWELL COMES, WEE NOT WORRIED ABOUT WAVES COG OVER THE WALL.

WORRIED ABOUT LONGSHORE CURRENT GETS SET UP.

OCEAN OGBU PERS STUDY IN.

CONDITIONS GO THROUGH IT.

KEEP THE WATER CLEAN.

SWIMMING THERE, AND YOU FID YOU'RE GETTING U PUSHED NOT STRONG SWIMMER GLAMMED UP AGAINST THE WALL -- SLAMMEP AGAINST THE WALL.

WATER FLOWING AGAINST THE GRILL.

CAN YOU BE P TRIAD AGAINSTE WATER OR GRILL.

YOU CAN BE TRAPPED.

HAVE TO CLOSE IT SOME DAYSI DON'T THINK IT BE RIGHT FOR LITTLE KID OF STRONG SWIMM.

>> WE'RE IN AGREEMENT.

WE WOULD CITY & COUNTY WOUD CLOSE THE POOL UNSAFE.

LIKE ANY CITY AND COUNTY BEACH.

IF THEY CLOSE THE BEACH BECAUSE SWELLS ARE TOO BIG.

IT WOULD BE SIMILAR MECHAN.

>>Daryl: HOW DEEP IS IT?

>> I DON'T KNOW.

HOW DEEP.

>> I HAVEN'T SEEN.

THAT LEVEL OF DETAIL HARD O ANSWER SOME OF QUESTIONS EN ON COST.

DRAWINGS HAVEN'T ADVANCED O LEVEL OF SPES F SPECIFICITU HOW DEEP THE WATER IS GOINO BE.

>> DO REMEMBER IN THE OLDER RESTORATION, THERE WAS AN A TO ENCAPSULATE THE EXISTING BOTTOM, SEDIMENT FORMED FRM ALL THE HUNDRED YEARS WORTF CORAL AND SAND DEPOSITS.

D RAISED MEAN DEPTH TO BETWE6 AND 8 FEET.

DEPENDING ON TIDAL FLUCTUATION.

SOME OF THE SPOTS.

>>Daryl: LIKE SM CEMENT EYS IT.

>> I DON'T WANT TO SAY.

WE DON'T HAVE THAT EFERL WL OF DETAIL.

CEMENTIZE IT.

PARTS 15 TO 20 FEET DEEM.

OLD DIVING TOWER.

FEET DEEM I'M SURE THEY'RE GOING TO MAKE A UNIFORM DE.

I AM SURETY DEPTH WILL BE SHALLOWER THAN IT IS.

SOMEHOW THE BOTTOM WILL BE ENCAPSULATED ENGINEERED SIA SAND MAYBE OR WHAT.

BUT AGAIN, WE'RE NOT AT THT LEVEL OF DETAIL WITH THE DRAWINGS.

>>Daryl: SHOCKING TO ME HOW MANY QUESTION WES GET.

SOME OF THESE THINGS.

GIVE OUR VIEWERS, RODNEY PL CITY, THEY SHOULD REIS IT STORE IT LAST RESEMBLANCE T WAIKIKI USED TO BE.

RESTORE IT.

EVERYTHING ELSE IS SO COMMERCIALIZED ALREADY.

HOW ABOUT RESTORE IS IT BAK TO THE 1800'S?

>> THAT WOULD BE SCRUBBED K THAT YOU HAVE IN FRONT OF AQUARIUM.

NOT A GOOD CHOICE.

>>Daryl: QUITE A QUANDARY.

I DO AGREE.

RESTORING HISTORIC FACILITY AND OPENING USING IT VERY ATTRACTIVE.

SWAM THERE AS A CHILD.

GREAT MEMORIES.

NOT USE BEEN IN USE FOR 40 YEARS.

REOPENING DRAW MORE OPENIN.

COULD BE GREAT OR AWFUL.

NOT SURE WHO DO FEEL.

I AGREE WITH YOU.

WHAT TO FEEL.

ANDY HO HONOLULU D DRINKING FOUNTAIN TOOK 2 YEARS AND MILLION DOLLARS.

$11 MILLION.

HOW LONG WOULD THIS NATATOM PROJECT TAKE CONSIDERING HW MUCH LARGER SIZE, HOW MUCH WOULD IT COST?

>> STATEMENTS MADE MAYBE WE COULD GET THIS DONE BY THE CENTENNIAL.

AIN'T GOING TO HAPPEN.

2 YEARS.

WHAT IS THE TIMELINE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT NOW?

>> REALLY HARD TO SAY.

REALLY IS HARD TO SAY.

A LOT OF IT DEPENDS WHAT E DRAWINGS SHOW US.

COMES BACK TO MONEY.

HOW QUICKLY FUNDS CAN BE RAISED.

IF THIS IS WHERE WE END UP, AND 2027, I CAN GUARANTEE T WON'T BE DONE.

>>Daryl: I MEAN, WE'RE GOIG TO HAVE SPECIFIC PLANS OR PERMITS BY THEN ANYWAY.

>> DESIGN AND CONSTRUCTION DRAWINGS ARE BEING WORKED N IN PARALLEL TO THE PERMITTG PROCESS.

SO NOT GOING TO WAIT TILL Y HAVE CONSTRUCTION FINAL CONSTRUCTION DRAWINGS TO ST APPLYING FOR PERMITS.

I THINK THERE ARE 18 PERMIS THAT ARMY CORPS OF ENGINEE, WHOLE SLEW OF PERMITS THATE PART OF THIS PROJECT.

SO THEY'RE WORKING ON PARAL PATHS AS FAR AS THAT'S CONCERNED.

>>Daryl: LET ME THROW OUT ONE MORE QUESTION.

THEN WE'RE GOING TO KIND OF START RUNNING OUT OF TIME.

SOMEONE N ANONYMOUSLY.

NATATORIUM BE INSTEAD RETROFITTED TO BECOME BEACH VOLLEYBALL COMPLEX.

HOLD U.H.

OTHER NATIONAL, INTERNATIONAL EVENTS.

YOU KNOW, IS THERE A PLAN N THE CITY?

IF FOR FRIENDS NATATORIUM, THAT IS SAY PLAN B LIKE, IF THE MONEY DOESN'T COME IN,R IF THE ENGINEERING GETS TOE POINT THEY SAY, YOU KNOW, S ISN'T GOING TO BE SAFE FOR PEOPLE.

JUST MAKING UP SCENARIOS.

IS THERE A PLAN B?

>> THING THAT PEOPLE DON'TI THINK MAYBE PUBLIC DOESN'T REALIZE IS THIS IS DECADES LONG PROCESS AND YOU CAN'T JUST SPIT BALL IDEAS LIKE D VOLLEYBALL COURTS OR WHATE.

WE'RE WAY PAST THAT.

YOU NEED TO ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACT STATEMENT.

YOU NEED TO SCIENTIFIC STUS ENGINEER STUDIES AND PUBLIC COMMENT PERIOD AND HAVE ALF THESE THINGS HAPPEN.

AND TIME FOR DEBATING WHATS GOING TO BE DONE IS OVER.

LIKE WE HAVE EIS.

CITY HAS INTENT TO RESTORE.

WE'RE GOING DOWN THAT PATH.

ANY OTHER IDEAS ABOUT DOINA CORAL FARM OR SAND VOLLEYBL COURT OR WHATEVER ELSE, TEARING DOWN PART, LEADING PART, THERE'S NO ENVIRONMEL STUDY OF THAT.

THERE'S NO PUBLIC COMMENT N THAT.

THAT PROCESS IS HAS BEEN M, MANY YEARS IN THE MAKE TO T TO THIS POINT.

>>Daryl: I'M SORRY IF I'M BANGING THESE TWO MORE THAN OTHERS.

IF THE CITY PAID FOR IT, RIGHT?

HOW MUCH, ASSUMING CITY PAS FOR IT, THAT'S THE F.A.R.sEST WAY TO GET THE MONDAY FASTEST WAY TO GET E MONEY.

IF YOU HAD, BIKE CHECK DO THIS, HOW LONG WOULD IT TAE TO GET GOING?

GET THOSE WALLS OUT OF THEE AND RESTORE.

>> CITY PROCESS IS MUCH LOR MORE CUMBERSOME PROCESS.

>> CITY NOT GOING TO PAY FR THE RESTORATION OF THE NATATORIUM.

FAR TOO MANY OTHER PROJECTS THAT TAKE PRECEDENCE FOR TE TAXPAYORS, CITY & COUNTY.

>>Daryl: ONE CALLER SAID, I'D RATHER HAVE THE WAR MEMORIAL THAN THE RAIL.

N LAUGHTER.

>> ME TOO.

SECOND SEGMENT RAIL OPENING OCTOBER 15.

GET TO THE WAR MEMORIAL.

>> MY POINT ABOUT THE FUNDG IS THAT NEVER BEEN PART OF EQUATION FOR THE BLANGIARDI ADMINISTRATION.

WE AND CITY COUNCIL ALLOCAD CERTAIN AMOUNT OF MONEY FR THE DESIGN AND THAT IS WHEE WE ARE RIGHT NOW.

THE MONEY HAS TO BE RAISEDN DIFFERENT WAYS BECAUSE AGA, TAXPAYORS HAVE MUCH GREATER PRIORITIES.

AS ROMANTIC AS THE NATATORM IS, AND WE LOVE NATATORIUME HAVE TO MAKE SURE THAT OTHR PRIORITIES.

>> ANY PRECEDENT FOR $50 MILLION PROJECT TO BE D FOR BY CHARITABLE GROUP AND HAVE T THE CITY OPERATE IT?

>>Daryl: ARIZONA MEMORIAL WAS RAISED THEY RAISED THAT MONEY.

THAT WILL PROBABLY BE $50 MILLION TODAY.

I WANT TO GIVE PAT HENRY A CHANCE TO SPEAK.

BECAUSE YOU LIVE THERE.

AS A PERSON, I KNOW YOU GUS ARE ACTIVELY USING IT.

DON'T KNOW EXACTLY WHERE YU LIVE.

JIM LIVES CLOSE BY.

HOW DO YOU FEEL ABOUT THISS A PERSON LIVES IN WAIKIKI,.

>> JUST MEMBER OF PUBLICLYI WENT TO THE REDEDICATION OF WHAT HARRIS DID.

WALKED DOWN THERE, REALLY T GREAT.

I THINK IT'S EYESORE.

SOMETHING HAS HAD TO BE DO.

>>Daryl: CONCRETE POOL PART IS EYESORE?

>> YEAH.

POOL PART IS EYESORE.

PARK PART IS FINE.

GRASS.

TREES.

KIDS RUNNING BACK AND FORT.

ACCESS TO KAIMANA IS ALSO T OF KAPIOLANI PARK TRUST.

SO WE LOVE KAIMANA BEACH.

I WISH SOMETHING WOULD HAP.

I JUST CAN'T BELIEVE THAT TAKES SO LONG.

>>Daryl: I THINK THAT YOU PROBABLY ARE SPEAKING FOR MANY, MANY PEOPLE.

>> I THINK WE ALL AGREE ON THAT.

I THINK WE CAN ALL AGREE ON THAT.

>>Daryl: WHERE WE'VE GOTTEN TO IN THIS CONVERSATION SES TO BE THAT SOMETHING HAS TE DONE, ARE WE CLOSE TO HAVIG EMERGENCY HERE THOUGH?

LIKE IS IT DANGER?

FALLING INTO THE OCEAN?

ONLY GOT ABOUT 20 SECONDS.

>> THAT ABOVE MY PAY GRADE.

I DON'T KNOW.

I KNOW, I MEAN,.

>>Daryl: HEARD FROM THE LIFEGUARD.

>> SAYING THAT CHUNKS OF IT ARE DEGRADING A LOT OF IT S BEEN.

>>Daryl: GOT TO WRAP IT UP.

FAST HOUR.

THANK YOU SO MUCH AND THANK YOU TO ALL OF YOU VIEWERSD IN.

WATCHING US.

TONIGHT AND WE THANK OUR GUESTS• ANDY SUGG, CHIEF OF STAFF R MAYOR BLANGIARDI AND DONNA.

CHING FROM THE FRIENDS OF THE NATATORIUM, JIM BICKERTON FROM BICKERTN LAW GROUP, AND PAT HENRY FM THE KAPIOLANI PARK PRESERVATION SOCIETY.

INSIGHTS IS OFF NEXT WEEK T PLEASE JOIN US FOR KAKOU, HAWAII'S TOWN HALL WHERE WE WILL BE DISCUSSING THE ART, WHY WE NEED THEM.

JOIN THE DISCUSSION NEXT THURSDAY.

I'M DARYL HUFF FOR INSIGHTN PBS HAWAII.

ALOHA!

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