HOST: THIS WE, THE FIRST PHONE NUMBER SINCE THE PRIMARY IN TWO MARKING MATCH UPS.

THAT SHOWS ONE RACE IS TIGHT AND THE OTHER IS NOT SO MUCH.

>> A LIVELY EXPERIMENT IS GENEROUSLY UNDERWRITTEN BY -- >> HI.

FOR OVER 30 YEARS A LIVELY EXPERIMENT HAS PROVIDED INSIGHT AND ANALYSIS OF THE POLITICAL ISSUES THAT FACE RHODE ISLANDERS.

I AM A PROUD SUPPORTER OF THIS GREAT PROGRAM AND RHODE ISLAND PBS.

HOST: JOINING US WITH THE ANALYSIS IS DAVE LAYMAN, FORMER COMMUTE OCCASIONS CONSULTANT.

ATTORNEY AND LEGAL ANALYST, LOU PULNER, AND LISA RANGLIN, PRESIDENT OF RI BLACK BUSINESS ASSOCIATION A POLL RELEASED THURSDAY EVENING SHOWS GOVERNOR MCKEE THAT THEY DOUBLE-DIGIT LEAD OVER HIS REPUBLICAN CHALLENGER, ASHLEY KAYLA'S.

45% TO 32% WITH A 15% STILL UNDECIDED MARGIN.

IN THE RACE FOR RHODE ISLAND'S SECOND CONGRESSIONAL DISTRICT, ALLAN FUNG IS A 46 TO -- 46% TO 40% LEAD OVER SETH MAGAZINER WITH 9% UNDECIDED.

BUT WITH A 6.2 MARGIN OF ERROR, IT MEANS THIS RACE IS A VIRTUAL DEAD HEAT.

LET ME BEGIN WITH YOU, DO THESE NUMBERS SURPRISE YOU?

LOU: NOT REALLY.

AS WE WERE TALKING PRESHOW, GOVERNOR HAS DONE A LOT OF THINGS TO BOOST HIS COFFERS AND BOOST HIS POPULARITY, ESPECIALLY WITH WHAT I KNOW WHERE WE WILL GET INTO THE RIGHT CAST BUT THE MONEY HE WAS GIVING AWAY, IT IS IN ABUNDANCE, $3000 HERE, $3000 HERE.

HE PLEASED EVERYBODY IN NANTUCKET BY GIVING $60 MILLION THERE AND $40 MILLION HERE.

HE HAD A LOT GOING ON THAT HE HAD THE POWER OF THE PURSE TO ENHANCE HIS POPULARITY.

I'M NOT SURPRISED.

I'M NOT SURPRISED EITHER BOUT ALLAN FUNG.

RHODE ISLAND TRADITIONALLY AS WE KNOW GENERALIZATION ONLY PULLS THE LEVER FOR THE DEMOCRATS.

AFTER THE LAST TWO YEARS IN THIS NATION, IT WOULD BE DIFFICULT TO PULL THE DEMOCRATIC LEVER.

MY CONCERN IS THAT MOST PEOPLE STILL WILL AND THAT IS WHY I QUESTION THE NUMBERS ON THE PHONE MAGAZINER.

HOST: WHAT YOU THINK?

I WOULD AGREE.

I WAITED THINK SETH IS GOING TO WIN.

I THINK HE WILL CARRY THE WOMEN'S VOTE AND I THINK THERE IS NO WAY WE WILL SEND A REPUBLICAN TO WASHINGTON.

I THINK WE GOTTA MAKE SURE WE HOLD ONTO THAT SEAT FROM A DEMOCRATIC PERSPECTIVE.

THEN ON THE GOVERNOR SIGH, I THINK THE GOVERNOR EXPECTS TO WIN.

I DON'T THINK IT IS READY FOR PRIME TIME AND I THINK THE GOVERNOR WILL BE ABLE TO BUILD A REALLY GOOD TEAM AND I THINK HE WILL DO A LOT OF GREAT THINGS FOR RHODE ISLAND'S.

JIM: WHAT DO YOU MAKE OF THE POLL NUMBERS -- THIS IS A SNAPSHOT AND I UNDERSTAND, THIS SNAPSHOT IN TIME, HE IS UP BY SIX POINTS.

ERROR.

WERE YOU SURPRISED HE WAS LEADING BY MORE THAN A COUPLE POINTS?

LISA: YEAH.

I THINK YOU WILL SEE IT IS REALLY CLOSE, DOWN TO THE WIRE, BUT I DO BELIEVE -- I'M SURPRISED BUT WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE MARGINS, I THINK IT IS REALLY A DEAD ON HEAT.

I THINK IN THE END, SETH WILL WIN BUT I DO THINK ALAN, HE IS A GOOD MAYOR, PEOPLE LOVE HIM, I THINK HE WILL DO FAIRLY WELL BUT FROM A BIG PICTURE, WHO'D WE WANT TO SEND TO D.C., I THINK RHODE ISLAND WILL SHOW UP AND SHOW UP IN A BIG WAY.

JIM: BUT YOU AGREE WITH LOU, DON'T ALWAYS TAKE THE PULSE -- YOU NEVER KNOW WHAT WILL HAPPEN TO YOU GET THERE?

LISA: ABSOLUTELY.

JIM: YOU HAD A CHANCE TO TALK TO A POLLSTER.

DAVE: I DID ABOUT HALF AN HOUR BECAUSE I SAW SOME THINGS THAT I THOUGHT WERE INTERESTING.

FOR EXAMPLE, 24% OF THE DEMOCRATS SUPPORT ALLAN FUNG.

THIS IS A BLUE STATE, THAT IS VERY UNUSUAL.

AND HE ACKNOWLEDGED THAT THAT THAT IS VERY UNUSUAL BUT ALSO, WE HAVE TO REMEMBER THE CONGRESSIONAL DISTRICT NUMBER TWO TENDS TO BE A LITTLE MORE OF A MODERATE DISTRICT AS COMPARED TO CD1.

SO YOU HAVE A LITTLE MORE -- YOU HAVE A LITTLE MORE I GUESS SOMEONE SAY POLITICAL TOLERANCE FOR THE REPUBLICANS.

BECAUSE IT IS A LITTLE MORE MODERN.

-- MODERATE.

ONE OF THE THINGS THAT SURPRISED ME WAS, IN LOOKING AT THE% NUMBERS, I REALLY WAS SURPRISED THAT HE WAS AHEAD.

I'M AM TALKING ABOUT ALLAN FUNG.

I'M SURPRISED HE WAS AHEAD AT THE LEVEL HE WAS.

BUT I DO THING, AND JOE MENTIONED THIS TO ME AS WELL, HE SAID YOU HAVE TO REMEMBER THIS IS A DEMOCRATIC STATE AND YOU CAN HAVE A LOT OF THESE POLLS THAT WILL SHOW INTERESTING NUMBERS AND KIND OF SURPRISE YOU.

BUT DEMOCRATS TEND TO COME HOME WHEN THEY GET INTO THE POLLING BOOTH AND THEY TEND -- THEY MAY HAVE SAID I'M SUPPORTING ALLAN FUNG BUT WHEN IT COMES DOWN TO IT, THEY WILL THINK ABOUT WHAT IS AT STAKE IN WASHINGTON, AND OF COURSE ONE OF THE POINTS WE SHOULD MAKE IS THAT THE ALLAN FUNG RACE HAS BEEN WATCHED NATIONALLY.

A LOT OF MONEY GOING IN NATIONALLY FOR THIS BECAUSE THEY TRIED TO TURN THE HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES FROM WASHINGTON INTO A REPUBLICAN HOUSE.

SO THIS IS NOT JUST A LITTLE RACE FOR US, THIS IS A BIG, NATIONAL RACE AS WELL.

JIM: LISA, YOU ARE FAIRLY CONFIDENT MAGAZINER WILL COME BUT WHAT DOES HE HAVE TO DO?

WE ARE A MONTH OUT, WHAT DOES HE HAVE TO DO TO CLOSE THE DEAL?

JIM: I THINK HE REALLY HAS TO EXCITE THE BASE.

BEING A BLUE STATE AND UP ON ELECTION DAY.

I THINK HE REALLY HAS TO MOBILIZE.

HE HAS TO MOBILIZE WOMEN.

I THINK WOMEN ARE SCARED WHAT WOULD HAPPEN IF WE HAVE A SWITCH IN D.C., RIGHT?

A WOMAN'S RIGHT TO CHOOSE.

WE CANNOT SEND A REPUBLICAN TO WASHINGTON.

THERE IS ABSOLUTELY NO WAY.

SETH MAGAZINER HAS TO STEP UP AND MOBILIZE THE MINORITY COMMUNITY, THE HISPANIC WOMEN AND BLACKS AND IF HE IS ABLE TO DO THAT, HE WILL DEFINITEY HAVE VICTORY.

JIM: AT THE SAME TIME, LOU, THAT POLL SHOWED THAT OF THE ISSUES IMPORTANT TO PEOPLE, THE ECONOMY WAS THREE TIMES OVER ABORTION, EDUCATION, SURPRISINGLY, AND I UNDERSTAND THAT IS IMPORTANT FOR A SECTION OF PEOPLE WHEN YOU ARE FILLING UP AT THE GAS PUMP AND ALL OF THAT.

YOU WONDER HOW THAT WILL TRANSLATE INTO THE VOTING POLL.

LOU: I THINK IT WILL HAVE A HUGE FACTOR.

WHO WANTS TO SEE TO MORLEY -- TWO MORE YEARS LIKE THE YEARS WE HAD.

RIGHT NOW THERE IS NO SIGN OF ANYTHING CHANGING.

AS BITING CONTINUES WITH HIS POLICIES, THE AVERAGE VOTER WILL SAY I DON'T KNOW IF I WANT TO DO THIS AGAIN.

THAT IS WHY I THINK I WOULD NOT BE SO SURE THAT SETH MAGAZINER WILL MAKE IT TO WASHINGTON.

JIM: IT WILL BE CLOSE EITHER WAY.

YOU HAD A CHANCE TO MEET ASHLEY KAYLA'S.

SHE HAS BEEN EVERYWHERE AND SHE HAS BEEN ON SOCIAL MEDIA, GONE TO A LOT OF THE EVENTS.

YOU SAID THE POLL DID NOT SURPRISE YOU, BUT WHAT WAR -- WHAT WERE YOUR IMPRESSIONS?

SHE HAS SHOWED UP TO EVENTS YOU THEN ADD TO AND WITH THE BLACK BUSINESS ASSOCIATION, SHE'S GETTING OUT THERE.

LISA: I THINK SHE IS TRYING.

SHE IS NEW TO THE STATE, CAME IN PROBABLY SIX MONTHS AGO AND I THINK REALLY RHODE ISLAND, WE DON'T REALLY KNOW HER MUCH.

WE ARE HEARING A LOT OF DIFFERENT THINGS BUT SHE IS SHOWING UP AND SHE IS STAYING.

I DON'T THINK SHE HAS BUILT THAT TRUST YET WITH COMMUNITIES.

I THINK THE BIGGEST THING FOR HER IS SHE IS BRAND-NEW TO THE STATE, MAYBE BEEN HERE FOREVER, BUT SORT OF NEW COMING BACK, AND I DON'T -- I DON'T THING WE KNOW ENOUGH ABOUT HER AND FOLKS DON'T TRUST HER.

LOU: I THINK THERE IS AN IMPORTANT POINT THAT YOU ARE MAKING.

SHE IS NEW TO THE STATE.

WHEN YOU ARE NEW TO THE STATE, A LOT OF PEOPLE SAY THEY DON'T KNOW IS HERE AND ALL OF THAT.

THAT IS NOT A BAD THING.

SOMETIMES YOU NEED THAT -- WE TALKED ABOUT AT THE LAST TIME I WAS ON, YOU NEED FRESH IDEAS, YOU NEED AN OUTSIDE PERSPECTIVE SOMETIMES.

THE PROBLEM WITH ASHLEY IS SHE HAS CREATED MORE OF HER OWN CONTROVERSIES.

WHERE DOES SHE LIVE?

THEY HAVE TWO HOUSES IN FLORIDA, AND HOUSE AT HIGHLAND PARK, ILLINOIS, AND HOUSE IN NEWPORT, AND THERE IS A WHOLE QUESTION ABOUT WHAT IS THE PRIMARY RESIDENCE?

THE LAST THING YOU WANT TO DO IN MARKETING AND BUSINESS, YOU DO NOT WANT TO RAISE QUESTIONS ABOUT THINGS YOU HAVE CONTROL.

IT IS A DIFFERENT THING TO DISAGREE ABOUT ABORTION OR ABOUT HOW TO HEAL THE ECONOMY.

IT IS ANOTHER THING TO THROW A LOT OF CONTROVERSY BECAUSE NOW IT STARTS TO STINK IT UP A LITTLE BIT.

IT LOOKS SUSPICIOUS.

WE DON'T KNOW MUCH ABOUT HER.

HOW DO WE KNOW?

CONSEQUENTLY, I THINK SHE HAS CAUSED A LOT OF HER OWN PROBLEMS HERE IN TERMS OF HER OWN CREDIBILITY, AND YOU CANNOT DO THAT WHEN YOU ARE ARRIVING ON THE SCENE AND NOBODY KNOWS WHO YOU ARE AND THEY ARE A LITTLE SUSPICIOUS BECAUSE, WHY WOULD YOU JUST DROP INTO THE STAY AND SUDDENLY YOU WANT TO RUN FOR THE HIGHEST OFFICE.

JIM: WHAT ABOUT THAT?

LOU: DAVE MAKES A VALID POINT.

THEY'VE GOT A LOT OF ENERGY.

I ADMIRE SOMEONE WITH ENERGY.

I THINK SHE IS RUNNING A GREAT AD CAMPAIGN.

SHE IS LAYING IT OUT THERE ABOUT THE IOWA CONTRACTS AND ABOUT THE $3000 GIVEAWAYS.

BUT THE FACT IS YOU DON'T WANT A CARPETBAGGER AND THAT TAKES ME BACK TO WHEN HILLARY CLINTON MOVED TO NEW YORK AND RAN FOR CONGRESS AND ONE.

JIM: HERE CHOSE REPUBLICANS HAD A PATH TO THE GOVERNORSHIP.

CERTAINLY GOVERNOR DEPREE.

16 YEARS OF GOVERNORS.

THEY WERE WELL KNOWN QUANTITY.

LOU: THEY WERE RHODE ISLANDERS.

JIM: SO YOU THINK THE GOVERNOR, THE SHIP IS STEADY?

LISA: I THINK FOR SURE THE GOVERNOR WILL COME NOT AS A WINNER.

HE IS CARRYING THE MINORITY COMMUNITY, HISPANIC, RALLYING AROUND HIM, AND I THINK WE ARE LOOKING AT IT, WHO DO WE WANT -- IT MAY NOT BE THE EXACT CANDIDATE WE WOULD HAVE LOVED TO HAVE HAD BUT HE IS WHAT WE WILL BE STUCK WITH FOR THE NEXT FOUR YEARS.

I THINK THE UNIONS ARE GOING AND BACKING HIM.

LOU: COULD BE A YEARS.

JIM: LET'S TAKE IT FOR YEARS AT A TIME.

LET'S NOT GET AHEAD OF OURSELVES.

[LAUGHTER] LISA: I THINK IN THE END, SMALL BUSINESS LET -- OWNERS LIKE YOU BECAUSE HE'S APPROACHABLE, HE HAS DONE A LOT FOR SMALL BUSINESSES, SO IN THE END, HE WILL COME OUT ON TOP FOR SURE.

JIM:?

?

ANY FINAL THOUGHTS DAVE: JUST A COUPLE THINGS GOING BACK TO THE RACE.

A COUPLE THINGS HE HAS GOING FOR THEM THAT I THINK CANNOT BE UNDERESTIMATED.

HE MENTIONED THEY KNOW HIM WELL IN THE SECOND CONGRESSIONAL DISTRICT, HE WAS THE MAYOR OF CRANSTON, A PRIG GOOD RUN THERE, HAD A POLICE PROBLEM THERE FOR A WHILE, BUT DID A PRETTY GOOD JOB.

RAN FOR GOVERNOR TWICE WITH A NAME RECOGNITION THERE, SHOULD BE LIKABLE, HIS WIFE, AND NOBODY MENTIONED THIS, HIS WIFE HAS BEEN A POLITICAL ASSET FOR HIM.

SHE ONE A BIG RACE IN THE DISTRICT, TOOK ON THE SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE, UNHEARD OF.

SHE HAS BEEN A POLITICAL FORCE TO BE RECKONED WITH THERE SO SHE HAS BEEN A POSITIVE ASPECT FOR HIM AND I'VE NOT HEARD ANYBODY MENTION THAT.

ALSO, JOE FLEMING'S SENT TO ME HE THOUGHT THE BIG CHALLENGE FOR FONG IS HE HAS TO BE CAREFUL ABOUT EMBRACING THE REPUBLICAN PRINCIPLES TWO STRONGLY.

HE REALLY NEEDS -- JIM: HE IS STRADDLING THAT FENCE, ISN'T HE?

[LAUGHTER] DAVE: HE IS TRYING IN THE NEXT MONTH WILL BE ROUGHER HM BECAUSE THEY GOT THE THAT SHE GOT THE GUNS OUT FOR HIM.

HE WILL BE APPEALING TO THE INDEPENDENCE, WHICH HE SEEMS TO BE DOING WELL WITH, HE HAS A GOOD RELATIONSHIP WITH SOME PARTS OF THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY, AND OF COURSE THE REPUBLICANS LIKE HIM.

I THINK HE HAS A PRETTY GOOD SHOT AT THIS THING.

I'M NOT SURE HE IS GOING TO MAKE IT TO THE FINAL ROUND.

-- FINAL ROUND -- MAKE IT -- JIM: OVER THE GOAL LINE.

DAVE: OVER THE GOAL LINE IF YOU WELL.

ONE MORE POINT BEFORE WE LEAVE, THE CONVERSATION, A LOT HAS BEEN MADE ABOUT THE ECONOMY BEING THE NUMBER ONE ISSUE AND ABORTION BEING WAY DOWN AT 14%.

JOE FLEMING MADE A GOOD POINT, HE SAID THE ECONOMY AND INFLATION MAY BE THE BIGGEST ISSUE FOR MOST PEOPLE.

HOWEVER, WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT ABORTION, THAT CAN EASILY BE A DIFFERENTIATOR AND TAKE ON A MUCH MORE POWERFUL ROLE.

IT COULD BE THE WEDGE ISSUE.

PEOPLE MAY SAY I'M WORRIED ABOUT THE ECONOMY BUT I'M REALLY CONCERNED ABOUT ABORTION.

THE ABORTION THING, EVEN AT 14%, COULD BE A BIG WINNER OR LOSER, DEPENDING ON WHICH SIDE YOU ARE ON.

JIM: RIGHT.

LOU: IF IT'S A REPUBLICAN CONGRESS, YOU WILL NOT EVEN HAVE ABORTIONS ANYMORE, THAT IS NOT THE PREMISE.

THE PREMISE IS THERE WILL BE LIMITS, WHETHER 15 WEEKS OR 20 WEEKS.

JIM: I THINK THE CONCERN IS A NATIONAL BAN.

LINDSEY GRAHAM IS TALKING ABOUT THAT, SO NOBODY THOUGHT RELL WAS GOING TO BE OVERTURNED, THAT CATCH OF THE WAY, NOW IT IS LIKE THEY WILL -- THERE WILL NEVER BE A NATIONAL BAN AND NOW YOU SEE SOME FAR RIGHT PEOPLE INTRODUCING THAT.

SO HONESTLY, IF YOU HAVE THE SENATE AND HOUSE, THEN WHERE ARE YOU?

ISN'T THAT THE CONCERN?

LISA: I THINK WOMEN ARE GOING TO COME UP FOR THE DEMOCRAT THIS YEAR.

I THINK WE ARE SCARED, WOMEN ARE SCARED WHAT COULD HAPPEN.

WITH SOMEBODY TRYING TO POLICE OUR BODIES.

WE WANT TO ENSURE OUR DAUGHTERS, IF SOMETHING HAPPENED TO THEM, THAT THEY HAVE CHOICES.

I THINK WE DO NOT WANT TO FEEL LIKE SOMEBODY IS TRYING TO CONTROL US.

WE SHOULD HAVE CHOICES AND I THINK WOMEN WILL SHOW UP IN A MEANINGFUL WAY AND WILL BRING VICTORY FOR A LOT OF DEMOCRATS IN NOVEMBER.

JIM: LISA, THE STANDARDIZED TEST, THE M CAST, IT SEEMS LIKE EVERY ELECTION CYCLE THE NUMBERS ARE DELAYED.

[LAUGHTER] I THINK IF THESE NUMBERS WERE GOOD, RELEASED A MONTH AGO, THE LARGER ISSUE IS WE UNDERSTAND THERE IS A PANDEMIC BUT EDUCATION HAS BEEN SUCH A TOUGH ISSUE IN THE RHODE ISLAND AND IT IS A RIPPLE EFFECT, TRACKING BUSINESSMEN AND WHERE ARE YOU GOING TO SEND YOUR KIDS TO SCHOOL?

YOU HAVE THE LUXURY AND PROVIDENCE TO TAKE OVER.

WHAT IS YOUR THOUGHT ABOUT WHERE WE ARE?

FIRST OF ALL RIGHT CAST IN DELAYED, DO YOU THINK THEY SHOULD HAVE THE NUMBERS?

LISA: IT IS SAD.

THE NUMBERS SHOULD BE OUT THERE.

THEY ARE TYING IT TO POLITICS.

THEY ARE LOOKING AT IT FROM A POLITICAL STANDPOINT.

WE WANT TO ENSURE WE ARE LOOKING AT THE NUMBERS TO HELP IMPACT OUR CHILDREN.

OVER THE LAST 2.5 YEARS, COVID IMPACTED THEM.

WE KNOW WE NEED TO UNDERSTAND THE TEST RESULTS SO WE CAN START LOOKING AT WAYS TO IMPROVE THE OUTCOME FOR STUDENTS.

DELAYING THE NUMBERS BECAUSE OF SOMEBODY'S CAMPAIGN OR THE ELECTION AND WHERE THEY WANT TO BE, IT IS GOING TO IMPACT ALL OF OUR COMMUNITY AND ALL OF OUR CHILDREN.

JIM: AND WITH SO MUCH FOCUS ON LOCAL SCHOOL COMMITTEES, YOU WANT TO KNOW HOW YOUR DISTRICTS ARE DOING.

LISA: ABSOLUTELY.

LOU: IF THE NUMBERS WERE GOOD -- LISA: THEY WOULD HAVE RELEASED THE NUMBERS.

LOU: THE BOARD OF EDUCATION, THE TEACHERS UNIONS, ENDORSED GOVERNOR MCKEE AND SUPPORTED HIM FINANCIALLY.

HE IS OBVIOUSLY INSURED GIVING THEM MONEY BACK BUT THE REALITY IS IT IS POLITICS.

THEN GENERATIONALLY, WE KNOW THE NUMBERS WILL BE BAD.

WE KNOW THAT.

LISA: I DID DECIDE WE ARE PUT IN POLITICS FIRST.

AND NOT OUR CHILDREN -- PUTTING POLITICS FIRST AND NOT OUR CHILDREN.

WE SHOULD THINK ABOUT RELEASING THE NUMBERS, SEE WHAT THEY ARE, THEN DEVELOP A PLAN TO EXECUTE AND SUPPORTED AND SUPPORT TEACHERS, STUDENTS, AND FAMILY.

JIM: I DON'T THINK ANYONE IS EXPECTING MIRACLES.

WE HAVE HAD A PANDEMIC.

PUT IT OUT THERE AND FIX IT.

LISA: EXACTLY.

DAVE: I'M GOING BACK TO MY YEARS OF JOURNALISM AND WHAT IS GOOD FOR THE PUBLIC SPEAR AND SO FORTH, I THINK THERE IS A LOST OPPORTUNITY HERE.

IF THEY WOULD PUT THESE NUMBERS OUT, NOW YOU WOULD HAVE LOCAL CANDIDATES ALONG WITH STATEWIDE CANDIDATES WHO HAVE TO ANSWER FOR THIS.

IT PULLS PEOPLE TOGETHER TO SAY WE NEED TO GO FORWARD ON THIS.

NOW, YOU CANNOT ASK YOUR LOCAL SCHOOL COMMITTEEMEN OR SCHOOL BOARD MEMBER, WHATEVER, WHAT THEY WOULD DO BECAUSE THEY DO NOT KNOW WHAT THEY HAVE TO DO.

THEY KNOW THEY HAVE TO DO SOMETHING BUT WE DO NOT KNOW SPECIFICALLY.

THERE IS A LOST OPPORTUNITY HERE TO HAVE YOUR OWN LOCAL ELECTED CANDIDATES OR LOCAL CANDIDATES FOR OFFICE TO HAVE TO STAND UP AND SAY THESE NUMBERS ARE BAD AND THIS IS WHAT I WILL PROPOSE.

I REALIZE I -- WE ARE CLOSE TO AN ELECTION BUT WE NEED TO GET THIS DONE.

WE WASTED 25 YEARS IN RHODE ISLAND.

WE WATCH MASSACHUSETTS TAKE THIS LONG TO OCCUR.

LOU: THEY ATE OUR LUNCH AND WE WATCH THEM DO IT.

DAVE: THAT'S RIGHT.

LISA: AND THERE HAS TO BE INTENTIONAL WORDS AROUND WRAPAROUND SERVICES.

THERE ARE TOO MANY POINTING FINGERS, FOCUSING ON WHAT THE PROBLEMS ARE, HOW DO WE ENSURE WE ARE SUPPORTING FAMILIES AND CHILDREN AND FACULTY AND TEACHERS?

BECAUSE EVERYONE NEEDS TO BE ALL IN AND YOU ARE RIGHT, WE CANNOT ASK THESE CANDIDATES ANYTHING AROUND THE NUMBERS.

SOME OF THEM MAY HAVE GREAT IDEAS.

AROUND FIXING SOME OF THE CHALLENGES WE HAVE.

WE KNOW WE HAVE CHALLENGES, RIGHT?

AND WE GOT A WORK TOGETHER TO GET THESE THINGS -- WE GOT TO WORK TOGETHER TO GET THESE THINGS DONE BUT WE CANNOT IF THE NUMBERS ARE HELD UP UNTIL AFTER NOVEMBER, THE ELECTION.

LOU: IN RHODE ISLAND, THE COST OF EDUCATING A CHILD HAS ALWAYS BEEN THE TOP PERCENT IN THE COUNTRY AND OUR RESULTS AND WHAT WE'RE DOING WITH THEM IS ALWAYS AT THE VERY BOTTOM.

IT IS NOT JUST THIS YEAR, AS DAVE SAID, IT IS GENERATIONAL.

IT HAS BEEN 25 TO 30 YEARS THESE KIDS HAVE BEEN SUFFERING AT THE JIM: I DON'T KNOW IF YOU BEEN PAYING ATTENTION TO WHAT IS GOING ON IN NORTHERN RHODE ISLAND BUT WHEN THE MAYOR WAS BACK BECAUSE SHE IS ON POSE, THERE'S A BIG FRITTATA GOING ON.

LISA HAS HAD HER OWN ISSUES OVER THE YEARS.

DAVE: YOU HAD YOUR ISSUES WITH HER.

[LAUGHTER] JIM: I HAD A COUPLE RUNNINGS, A STORY -- RUNNINGS, A STORY THAT CAME WITH COMPLAINTS.

I GET A LOT OF TIPS ON THAT.

EVERYONE IS RALLYING TO YOUR DEFENSE BECAUSE YOU HAVE A CITY COUNCIL BECAUSE YOU CAN TAKE OUT A DULY ELECTED MAYOR.

DAVE: ON THE BASIS OF A COMPLAINT.

JIM: THERE WERE THINGS SHE WAS NOT FOLLOWING THROUGH AND THAT DID NOT SURPRISE ME BUT SHOULD THAT RESULT IN HEARTACHE NOT OUT OFFICE -- TAKEN OUT OF THAT SHOULD ALLOW HER TO BE TAKEN OUT OF OFFICE?

DAVE: IT'S AMAZING, I HAD NEVER HEARD OF THIS STIPULATION THAT THEY COULD DO THAT.

CLEARLY IF YOU HAVE JOHN MARIAN AND STEPHEN BROWN SAYING THIS IS NOT A GOOD IDEA, BY AND LARGE THAT IS PROBABLY NOT A GOOD IDEA.

LOU: [INDISCERNIBLE] MEANWHILE, SHOULD THE CITY COUNCIL HAVE THE RIGHT TO NEGOTIATE CONTRACTS AS OPPOSED TO THE MAYOR?

JIM: THAT'S THE ADMINISTRATION, RIGHT?

LOU: THE WHOLE CITY OF WOONSOCKET.

[LAUGHTER] DAVE: YOU ALSO HAVE THE POLICE CONTRACT, THE COUNCIL NEGOTIATED A POLICE CONTRACT AND THEN SHE REFUSED AND NONE OF THAT HAS TAKEN PLACE SO THIS IS A LONG, LONG TIME OF DISSENSION GOING BACK TO 2013.

THE POINT IS, THEY OUGHT TO GET THIS FIXED.

THIS IS AN EMBARRASSMENT FOR THEM AND FOR THE STATE.

LISA: IT IS SHAMEFUL.

WE ARE IN CHAOS AND THEY HAVE TO FIX IT.

BUT THERE HAS TO BE A REVIEW IN TERMS OF WHAT MAKES SENSE.

SOMEBODY IS ELECTED AND THEN YOU HAVE A CHARTER THAT SAYS YOU CAN BE VOTED OUT AND SHE IS NOW RUNNING UNOPPOSED.

SO SHE WILL BE RIGHT BACK BUT I THINK WE NEED TO HOLD OUR ELECTED OFFICIALS ACCOUNTABLE.

THEY NEED TO BE DOING WHAT IS BEST FOR THE PEOPLE.

IT SOUNDS LIKE, AND I DON'T LIVE IN WILL ONE SOCKET, -- IN ONE SOCKET, -- I DON'T KNOW IN WOONSOCKET BUT THAT SOUNDS LIKE JIM: JIM: -- I JIM: JIM: HAVE ALWAYS HAD FINANCIAL CHALLENGES.

THE LEAST YOU WANT IS A GOVERNOR THAT DAVE: FUNCTIONS.

DAVE:THE ONE WE KICKED OUT, SHE'S BACK.

LISA: TOTALLY DYSFUNCTIONAL.

IT IS THE PEOPLE THAT ARE WOUND SOCKET THAT WIL BE IMPACTED.

THE CHILDREN, WE GOT ENSURE WE HAVE A CITY THAT WORKS, TRANSPARENCY AND ACCOUNTABILITY, AND CLEARLY WE DO NOT HAVE THAT.

JIM: I NEVER THOUGHT I WOULD SEE A STORY WHERE LISA IS A VICTIM.

[LAUGHTER] IT'S BASICALLY LIKE A TWO-MONTH UNPAID VACATION.

SHE WILL BE BACK IN DECEMBER AND SWORN IN.

DAVE: MY QUESTION IS, IF THEY DON'T LEARN FROM THIS CONVERSATION HERE, IS IT POSSIBLE THIS WILL BE REPEATED IN A COUPLE OF MONTHS AFTER SHE IS REINSTATED?

LISA: ABSOLUTELY.

ABSOLUTELY.

JIM: WE HAVE A COUPLE OTHER THINGS BUT LET'S GO TO OUTRAGES AND/OR KUDOS.

IT LISA, DO YOU HAVE ANY OUTRAGE OR KUDO?

LISA: I WOULD SAY KUDOS.

I WAS EXCITED TO SEE WHAT IS HAPPENING AROUND AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

LOTS OF MONEY IN THE FY 23 BUDGET, A 200 $50 MILLION ALLOCATED FOR AFFORDABLE HOUSING.

I HOPE SOME OF THOSE MONEYS ARE USED TO ADDRESS ROOT CAUSES.

AROUND HOMELESSNESS.

WE HAVE TO LOOK AT THE BARRIERS AND SOME CHALLENGES.

THERE COULD BE SUBSTANCE ABUSE OR THERE ARE LOTS OF FACTORS THAT NEED TO BE CONSIDERED AND I HOPE THESE MONEYS ARE GOING TO BE SPENT 12.

WE HAVE ACCOUNTABILITY AND TRANSPARENCY IN THAT WE ARE NOT LEVERAGING THOSE MONEYS THE SAME WAY WE ARE DONE HISTORICALLY.

WE'VE GOT TO THINK ABOUT HOW DO WE CREATE AFFORDABLE HOUSING AND AFFORDABLE FOR THE PEOPLE THAT NEED IT THE MOST?

JIM: WE HAVE SO MUCH MONEY SLOSHING AROUND AND YOU STILL SEE THERE ARE PEOPLE SAYING WE HAVE PEOPLE ON THE STREET.

I KNOW SOME OF THEIR OWN VOLITION BUT YOU WONDER WITH THIS MONEY, WHY CAN'T WE SOLVE THE HOMELESS -- TO BUILD FACILITIES OR GET PEOPLE OFF -- I KNOW IT IS NOT THE EASY ANSWER.

LISA: IT IS NOT JUST BUILDING A HOUSE, RIGHT?

THE SUPPORT WRAPAROUND SERVICES NEED TO BE IN PLACE.

I THINK YOU CAN BUILD AS MUCH AS YOU WANT -- AND KEEP IN MIND, RHODE ISLAND, WE DON'T HAVE ENOUGH SPACE ESPECIALLY IN THE URBAN CORE BUT WE HAVE TO THINK ABOUT HOW DO WE BUILD RESPONSIBLE FOR THE NEED THAT EXISTS TODAY BUT ALSO ENSURING WE DO NOT LEAVE ANYONE BEHIND BECAUSE IF YOU HAVE OTHER FACTORS THAT NEED TO BE ADDRESSED, WRAPAROUND SERVICES, MENTAL HEALTH.

I THINK TOO OFTEN WE LOOK AT STUFF IN SILENCE -- IN SILOS AND WE ARE GIVING MONEY TO THE SAME GROUP GIVEN MONEY YEAR OVER YEAR AND WEEK SPECTER FOR RESULTS.

I THINK WE NEED TO BRING MORE PEOPLE INTO THE TENT TO THINK OF DIFFERENT IDEAS AROUND HOW DO WE FIX THESE ISSUES?

IF I'M GOING TO GIVE YOU MONEY YEAR-OVER-YEAR AND I SEE THE SAME PROBLEMS, PEOPLE ARE STILL ON THE STREET, WHY ARE YOU GETTING MONEY IF YOU ARE NOT CORRECTING THE ISSUE?

JIM: SOUNDS LIKE THE SCHOOL SYSTEM.

DAVE, WHAT DO YOU HAVE?

DAVE: LOU WILL PROBABLY WANT TO GIVE ME A BIG HUG AND KISS.

NOT THIS FAR.

I LIKE ONE ASPECT -- SOME ASPECTS OF JOE BIDEN.

I THINK HE TRIES TO BE A LITTLE MORE OPEN-MINDED ABOUT DEALING WITH PEOPLE AND NOT BEING SO ICE COLD AND CUT AND DRY.

HOWEVER, I THOUGHT IT WAS THE BIGGEST MISTAKE, ONE OF THE BIGGEST MISTAKES OF HIS PRESIDENCY TO GO OVER TO SAUDI ARABIA AND DO A FIST BUMP WITH THEIR LEADER OVER THERE, SPS, OR WHATEVER HIS NAME IS.

AND IN HOPES OF GETTING SAUDI ARABIA, THE SECOND LARGEST OIL PRODUCER IN THE WORLD, PROBABLY, TO INCREASE THEIR OUTPUT AS WE TRIED TO GET THROUGH THE ENERGY ISSUES WE ARE HAVING NOW.

JIM: HOW DID THAT WORK OUT?

DAVE: THAT WAS MY POINT.

HOW DID THAT WORK OUT?

HE GAVE AWAY THE OFFICE OF THE PRESIDENCY TO A THUG, TO A REGIME THAT DOES NOT CARE ONE BIT ABOUT ANYBODY ELSE.

I HOPE I LIVE LONG ENOUGH TO SEE THE DAY WHERE IT STARTS TO GO DRY BECAUSE WE DON'T NEED THEM ANYMOR.

BUT WE HAVE SUPPORTED THOSE THUGS AND THERE ARE PROBABLY BETTER WORDS FOR THEM BUT I CANNOT USE IT ON PBS.

I THINK JOE BIDEN MADE A REALLY BIG MISTAKE.

HE IS ENTITLED TO MAKE HIS MISTAKES.

I THINK HE WENT THERE IN GOOD FAITH AND IT WAS STUPID.

I'M SORRY HE DID IT AND THIS WEEK, OPEC IS NOT GOING TO DO ANYTHING BUT SHUT DOWN SOME OF THEIR OIL OUTPUT, AND HE LOST AN AWFUL LOT OF -- JIM: LOU, WHAT DO YOU HAVE?

LOU: I DID NOT KNOW THESE THINGS BUT IF YOU GREW UP IN A PUERTO RICAN COMMUNITY IN DELAWARE, -- HE GREW UP IN A PUERTO RICAN COMMUNITY IN DELAWARE.

AND THROUGH FUNDRAISER FOR THE DEMOCRAT PARTY SO HE IS ALWAYS EXPOSING HIMSELF TO TELLING US MORE ABOUT HIM THAT I THINK WE NEED TO KNOW IS A COUNTRY.

THE REALITY IS IT IS HIS FIRST DAY IN OFFICE, HE CLOSED DOWN THE KEYSTONE PIPELINE, THEN HE OPENED UP ORDERS FROM TWO PIPELINE FOR RUSSIA.

THEN, WHY I DON'T KNOW, HE STARTS BEGGING OUR ENEMIES FOR THEIR DISGUSTINGLY -- THE POOREST GRADE OIL, WHETHER IT WAS GOING TO RUSSIA ORIGINALLY AND NOW IT IS SAUDI ARABIA.

BY THE WAY, SAUDI ARABIA DID NOT JUST SAY NOTHING TO YOU, THEY FLIP TO THEM THE BIRD.

WHEN YOU SAY WE WANT YOU TO INCREASE BY ONE MILLION AND THEY SAY NO, WE WILL CUT BACK BY 2 MILLION BARRELS PER DAY, THAT IS WHAT HAPPENS WHEN YOU CALL THEM A PRIOR NATION AND THREATENED TO NOT GIVE THEM ANYMORE WEAPONS DURING THE COURSE OF YOUR PRESIDENCY BUT HERE HE IS, PRESIDENT OBAMA SIGNED AN EXECUTIVE ORDER TO DECLARE VENEZUELA WAS AN EXTRAORDINARY THREAT TO THE UNITED STATES NATIONAL SECURITY, AND NOW BIDEN IS CONTEMPLATING GOING TO MADURO , A BRUTAL DICTATOR, AND ASKING HIM FOR OIL BECAUSE NO ONE ELSE IS GIVING IT TO US.

MY POINT IS, HE CANNOT GET OUT OF HIS OWN WAY AND YOU GO BACK TO AFGHANISTAN, BUT EVERYTHING HAS DONE JIM: YOU GOTTA WONDER WHO'S ADVISING HIM.

HE HAS PEOPLE AROUND HIM.

LOU: HAS FOREIGN POLICY HAS BEEN NOTHING BUT A DISASTER FOR THIS NATION.

TAIWAN AND UKRAINE, ADDED TOGETHER.

JIM: DAVE, GOOD TO SEE YOU, LISA, WELCOME BACK.

NICE TO SEE YOU AFTER A LITTLE HIATUS.

IF YOU DON'T CATCH US FRIDAY AT 7:00 OR SUNDAY AT NOON, CHECK US OUT ON SOCIAL MEDIA OR FACEBOOK, TWITTER, WHERE WE POST OUR SHOWS AT RIPBS.ORG/LIVELY.

WE ARE HEADING INTO ELECTION DAY.

WE HOPE YOU WILL BE WITH US BECAUSE WE WILL HAVE THE LATEST OF THE BREAKDOWN OF PHONE NUMBERS AS THEY COME IN AND THE ANALYSIS COME BACK NEXT WEEK AS A LIVELY SPARE BUT CONTINUES.

-- EXPERIMENT CONTINUES.

♪ >> A LIVLY EXPERIMENT IS GENEROUSLY UNDERWRITTEN BY -- >> HI, I'M JOHN HAYES 00 HAZENWHITE JUNIOR.

A LIVELY EXPERIMENT LOOKS AT THE