JIM: THIS WEEK, THE NEW GENERAL ASSEMBLY SESSION IS JUST WEEKS AWAY.

WHAT WILL THE TOP ISSUES BEGIN 2023?

THE SAUGUS OF RUNNING A HOMELESS ENCAMPMENT IN FRONT OF THE STATEHOUSE DRAGS ON FOR ANOTHER WEEK.

>> "A LIVELY EXPERIMENT" IS GENEROUSLY UNDERWRITTEN BY -- JOHN: FOR MORE THAN 30 YEARS, "A LIVELY EXPERIMENT" HAS PROVIDED INSIGHT AND ANALYSIS OF THE POLITICAL ISSUES THAT FACE RHODE ISLANDERS.

I AM A PROUD SUPPORTER OF THIS GREAT PROGRAM AND RHODE ISLAND PBS.

JIM: JOINING US, MAUREEN MOAKLEY , RETIRED POLITICAL SCIENCE PROFESSOR FROM THE UNIVERSITY OF RHODE ISLAND.

IAN DONNIS, POLITICAL REPORTER FOR THE PUBLIC'S RADIO AND CORPORATE COMMUNICATIONS CONSULTANT AND FORMER TELEVISION NEWS ANCHOR DAVE LAYMAN.

HELLO AND WELCOME TO "LIVELY."

GREAT TO HAPPY WITH THIS.

RHODE ISLAND IS FLUSH WITH MONEY.

MANY TIMES HAVING A SURPLUS IS MORE CHALLENGING THAN DEFICITS WHERE THE ANSWER IS OFTEN NO TO THOSE REQUESTING FUNDING.

JOE SHEKARCHI IS LOOKING AHEAD.

EARLIER THIS WEEK HE SAT DOWN WITH THE PROVIDENCE JOURNAL.

YOU HAD A ONE-ON-ONE WITH HIM.

WHAT DID YOU TAKE AWAY AS HE LOOKS AT TH SESSION?

JIM: SPEAKER -- IAN: SPEAKER SHEKARCHI IS LOATH TO BE SPECIFIC ABOUT COMMITMENTS WITH A PROMISING ESTIMATED $610 MILLION SURPLUS.

HE SAYS THERE IS STILL THE REVENUE ESTIMATING CONFERENCE AND HOW THE BUDGET OUTLOOK CAN CHANGE.

A LOT OF PEOPLE THINK THEY CAN BE WORSE ECONOMIC FACTORS NATIONALLY.

THE ONE CONCRETE COMMITMENT HE MADE WAS SOME MONEY SHOULD GO TO THE RAINY DAY FUND.

THAT IS NOT REALLY A RADICAL OR BOLD STEP.

THAT FUND HAD BEEN DEPLETED DURING THE COVID PERIOD.

SOME OF HIS OTHER MESSAGES IS THE HOUSE WILL OFFER OVERSIGHT ON THE ALLOCATION EARLIER OF $250 MILLION OF HOUSING MONEY.

HE EXPRESSED INTEREST IN TRYING TO BUILD OF THE BIOSCIENCE INDUSTRY IN RHODE ISLAND.

WE SEE HOW THE HOUSE HAS OFFERED OVERSIGHT ON THE SCHOOLS ISSUE.

SHEKARCHI IS WEARY OF GETTING OVEREXTENDED AND SENSITIVE TO HOW FACTORS CAN CHANGE BY THE TIME THE HOUSE IS PARSING GOVERNOR MCKEE'S BUDGET PROPOSAL AND HE WANTS TO HEAR FROM MEMBERSHIP ON THEIR PRIORITIES ALSO.

JIM: DAVE?

DAVE: I SPOKE WITH AN INSIDER WHO WISHED NOT TO BE IDENTIFIED.

IT ECHOES SOME OF WHAT YOU JUST SAID.

A COUPLE OF THINGS THAT HAVE NOT BEEN REPORTED.

THIS WHOLE ISSUE OF THE BILL OF RIGHTS, POLICE OFFICER BILL OF RIGHTS, THIS INDIVIDUAL TOLD ME IT IS GOING TO GET SOME GAS THIS YEAR.

IT IS GOING TO BE -- THEY WILL PROBABLY BE A MEASURED APPROACH TO IT.

I WONDERED IF IT MIGHT BE A WHOLESALE REVISION OF IT.

MY SOURCE SAYS IT WILL NOT BE THAT PROBABLY BUT IT IS GOING TO BE MODIFIED.

HE BELIEVES THIS WILL HAPPEN.

JIM: THE WHOLE STUDY COMMISSION, THE ONE WILDCARD IS ANASTASIA WILLIAMS.

THAT IS SOMETHING TO KEEP AN ION.

WHAT ELSE DID YOU HEAR?

DAVE: THE CABINET WILL BE EASILY APPROVED, WHICH IS NOT A BIG SURPRISE I DON'T THINK.

THEY ARE GOING TO HOLD THE GOVERNOR TO ACCOUNT ON THE MONEY THAT WAS ALLOCATED LAST YEAR TO BE SURE THAT GETS SPENT PROPERLY.

ALSO I WAS TOLD THEY ARE PLEASED WITH THE FINANCES AS IAN WAS TALKING ABOUT.

THEY POINT OUT THAT $610 MILLION SEEMS LIKE A LOT OF MONEY TO ALL OF US, BUT, YOU KNOW, IT HAS GOT TO BE PROPERLY PARSED, WHICH YOU WOULD EXPECT HIM TO SAY.

THEY ARE GOING TO HOLD THE GOVERNOR TO PAY THE MONEY THEY ARE SUPPOSED TO ALLOCATE ANIMAL GET REDIRECTED.

MAUREEN: I THOUGHT HIS INTERVIEWS WERE VERY THOUGHTFUL.

HE DID A LONGER ONE WITH THE JOURNAL.

THE THING THAT WAS INTERESTING IS, HE DOES NOT MAKE COMMITMENTS.

HE HAS TO WAIT AND SEE.

I THINK HE IS VERY -- BETWEEN HIM AND -- THEY PUT OUT PROGRAMS.

HOUSING IS GOING TO BE A BIG THING.

HE WILL CHECK ON THAT.

THE OVERSIGHT OF THE TAKEOVER IS IMPORTANT.

THEY WILL GET INTO THAT.

THE OTHER THING IS HE TALKED ABOUT CHANGING ZONING LAWS.

IF YOU WANT TO BUILD HOUSES, YOU HAVE TO MAKE IT EASIER FOR DEVELOPMENTS AND HAVE SOME ACCOUNTABILITY.

THE OTHER THING THAT WAS INTERESTING WHEN ASKED ABOUT A CONSTITUTIONAL CONVENTION -- JIM: NOW WAS NOT THE TIME.

MAUREEN: NOW WAS NOT THE TIME BECAUSE OF DARK MONEY.

HE TALKED ABOUT AN AMENDMENT TO THE CONSTITUTION TO ENSURE PRIVACY.

NOT ONLY AS IT COMES TO ABORTION BUT OTHER SOCIAL ISSUES.

UNDER THE WEB OR THE UMBRELLA OF PRIVACY A LOT OF THESE THINGS WOULD BE PROTECTED.

I THINK HE DOES A GOOD JOB AND HE'S A GOOD SPEAKER.

JIM: SHEKARCHI WAS NOT COMMITTAL ABOUT GUNS AND ABORTIONS.

ADVOCATES ARE PRESSING FOR LAWMAKERS TO EXTEND ABORTION COVERAGE TO EMPLOYEES OF THE STATE.

AN EMPLOYEE PLAN AND WOMEN ON MEDICAID, AND ALSO THE OPPONENTS OF GUNS WANT A BAD ON SO-CALLED ASSAULT RIFLES.

HE WAS NONCOMMITTAL ON THE OUTCOME.

DAVE: I UNDERSTAND THEY ARE PROBABLY GOING TO MAKE A BIG EFFORT DURING THE SESSION TO GET ABORTION RIGHTS ENSCONCED IN THE STATE CONSTITUTION.

IN ORDER TO PREVENT ANY PROBLEMS WITH THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT WITH THE REPUBLICANS, THEY ARE MORE CONSERVATIVE ABOUT IT.

THIS -- I DON'T THINK IT IS A CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT BUT I'M NOT SURE HOW THAT WOULD WORK.

THAT WILL BE A TOPIC OF DISCUSSION AS WELL.

TO BE SURE ABORTION RIGHTS ARE PRESERVED IN RHODE ISLAND.

MAUREEN: I THINK THAT PRIVACY THINK IS A NICE UMBRELLA.

IF THEY PUT THAT, IT WILL BE A PUBLIC QUESTION AND GO INTO THE CONSTITUTION.

THAT PROTECTS A RANGE OF RELATIONSHIPS.

GAY AND SO FORTH AND SO ON.

IT IS A THOUGHTFUL APPROACH.

IT HAS A LOT OF PROMISE.

JIM: YOU WONDER HOW LONG HAVE WE TALKED ABOUT 250 MILLION OF THE DEFICIT AND WE NEVER HAD A RAINY DAY FUND.

AS DAVE SAID, IT CAN EVAPORATE QUICKLY.

WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT STUFF LIKE FREE FOR BUSES, THAT'S GREAT WHEN YOU'RE FLUSH WITH MONEY BUT IT BECOMES AN ENTITLEMENT.

LIKE CCRI.

YOU CAN'T GIVE THE KIDS FREE TUITION AND THEN PULL BACK ON IT.

THAT IN EFFECT GETS BAKED INTO THE BUDGET.

TO ME THEY ARE WALKING THIS WORRIED ABOUT THE OUT YEARS ON WE ARE FLESH NOW.

IAN: ABSOLUTELY.

SHEKARCHI SAID THIS GOOD BUDGET OUTLOOK RIGHT NOW WHERE THERE ARE SURPLUSES FOR MULTIPLE YEARS, WE HAVE NOT SEEN THAT IN DECADES.

I THINK THE ARE VERY COGNIZANT OF HOW THIS IS A FUNCTION OF ONE TIME MONEY FROM THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT.

IT IS VERY EASY TO SPEND IT DOWN.

I THINK THERE IS A WARINESS ABOUT FUNDING PROGRAMS THAT MIGHT BE AFFORDABLE IN THE SHORT TERM BUT WOULD BE UNAFFORDABLE IN THE LONG TERM WITHOUT DIFFERENT FUNDING SOURCES.

MAUREEN: LAST YEAR HE TALKED ABOUT THAT.

HE'S ALWAYS BEEN CAUTIOUS ABOUT SPENDING.

HE ALWAYS LOOKED AT THE IDEA THAT WE CAN'T JUST BUILD UP ENTITLEMENT PROGRAMS.

JIM: IT'S AN INVESTMENT, NOT AN EXPENDITURE.

MAUREEN: THAT IS PUTTING IT WELL.

DAVE: ANOTHER POINT MADE WAS THAT THE $13 MILLION BUDGET -- 13 BILLION OTHER BUDGET WILL PROBABLY GO DOWN TO $12 BILLION.

JIM: AS IT SHOULD.

I HAVE ASKED THAT QUESTION FOR A LONG TIME.

WE WERE AT NINE POINT SOMETHING.

THE FEDERAL COVID MONEY MUDDIED THE WATERS A LITTLE BIT.

THAT'S A GREAT POINT.

GOVERNOR MCKEE ANSWERED THAT IN ONE OF THE DEBATES.

HE SAID IT WILL BE 11 SOMETHING.

IT GO DOWN.

DAVE: THIS WILL LIKELY BE THE FOURTH YEAR WITHOUT A TAX INCREASE, WHICH LAWMAKERS LOVE TO BE ABLE TO BRAG ABOUT.

VERY OFTEN IN THE PAST WE HAVE NOT HAD THAT KIND OF MONEY.

WE END UP -- JIM: IT IS ALL NICKEL AND DIMING ON FEES.

DOUBLE THE SCARBOROUGH AND ALL THAT.

ANYTHING ELSE YOU ARE LOOKING FOR IN THE SESSION?

MAUREEN: I'M CONCERNED ABOUT HOW THEY WILL HANDLE THE GUN ISSUE.

I THINK JACK MCCONNELL WROTE A DECISION THAT WAS ELOQUENT AND THOUGHTFUL.

THERE WERE THREE THINGS HE TALKED ABOUT.

SECOND AMENDMENT.

HE TALKED ABOUT TAKING.

HE TALKED ABOUT IRREPARABLE HARM.

THOSE ARE THE THREE -- THE PLAINTIFFS, THAT IS WHAT THEY WERE TALKING ABOUT.

HE ANSWERED EACH ONE BEAUTIFULLY, I THOUGHT.

JIM: WAS HE WRITING TO SURVIVE THE APPEAL?

WRITING FOR THE HIGHER COURT.

MAUREEN: IT SEEMS TO ME -- I READ AN EXTENSIVE PART ABOUT IT.

AS FAR AS THE TAKINGS, THIS IS IN THE PUBLIC INTEREST AND A MINOR THING YOU HAVE AND YOU WILL NOT GET YOUR MONEY BACK ON THESE THINGS.

HE TALKED ABOUT THE SECOND AMENDMENT.

THESE ARE INSTRUMENTS OF MASS SLAUGHTER.

THEY DON'T FIT INTO THE SECOND MINUTE CATEGORY.

YOU DON'T HAVE THESE THINGS IN YOUR HOME TO PROTECT YOURSELF.

THESE ARE WEAPONS PEOPLE USED TO GO OUT AND KILL PEOPLE.

HE SAID IT COULD HAPPEN HERE.

I THOUGHT IT WAS VERY THOUGHTFUL.

IN TERMS OF IRREPARABLE HARM, HE JUST DISMISSED THAT.

THEY CAN'T HAVE MAGAZINES.

THAT IS NOT IRREPARABLE HARM.

THAT'S A GOOD DECISION.

JIM: IT WAS VERY DIRECT.

DAVE: PEOPLE TALK.

MAUREEN: I THINK THAT WILL INFLUENCE EFFORTS IN TERMS OF PUSHBACK FROM THE GUN PEOPLE.

JIM: YOU WONDER, IT DEPENDS ON HOW MUCH MONEY YOU WANT TO SPEND.

IF YOU WANT TO SPEND MONEY TO GO TO THE APPEALS COURT WHICH MAY BE MORE LIBERAL THAN GETTING TO THE SUPREME COURT.

DO THEY SEE A PATH OR AT THE SUPREME COURT, WHICH HAS CHANGED NOW, THEY MIGHT HAVE A LITTLE BIT BETTER LUCK IN TERMS OF SUSTAINING AN APPEAL?

THAT IS A LONG WAY OFF.

IAN: I WOULD NOT BE SURPRISED IF GUN INTERESTS SUPPORT AN APPEAL .

THEY DON'T LIKE THESE KINDS OF RESTRICTIONS ON WHAT THEY PERCEIVE.

JIM: IT IS CHIPPING AWAY.

IAN: RIGHT.

DAVE: I'M NOT SURE THAT IS RIGHT, THAT THEY ARE WELL-FUNDED.

JIM: ELAINE LAFAYETTE.

-- DUANE LAPIERRE.

DAVE: THEY HAVE OTHER ALLIES INDIVIDUALLY.

THERE'S A LOT OF DARK MONEY AS WELL THAT WILL HELP THEM.

THE MAIN LOBBY HAS HAD SOME REAL PROBLEMS THE LAST TWO YEARS, AS YOU MENTIONED.

JIM: APART FROM THE NRA NATIONALLY THERE ARE A LOT OF -- THEY COULD RAISE MONEY EASILY.

ALL YOU HAVE TO DO -- YOU HAVE BEEN AT THE STATEHOUSE FOR THE SECOND AMENDMENT RALLIES.

A LOT OF PEOPLE WOULD PUT UP MONEY TO DO THAT.

THAT IS ONE THING WE WILL KEEP A TRACK ON.

IT'S BEEN INTERESTING FROM A POLITICAL STANDPOINT.

WE FEEL FOR THE HOMELESS PEOPLE WHO ARE TRYING TO DEAL WITH IT.

IT SEEMS WORSE THIS YEAR.

THE IRONY IS WITH ALL THIS MONEY SLOSHING AROUND THE GOVERNORS FINDING MONEY DOES NOT ALWAYS SOLVE THE PROBLEM.

YOU HAVE TO HAVE SERVICES AT ALL OF THAT.

AS YOU LOOK AT THIS FROM STANDING BACK, HOW DO YOU THINK HOW THIS HAS PLAYED OUT?

MAUREEN: THERE IS A HUGE CRISIS.

PEOPLE ARE RECOGNIZING THAT.

IT WAS HIGH ON SHEKARCHI'S AGENDA.

IN TERMS OF THE IMMEDIATE PROBLEM WITH PEOPLE AT THE STATEHOUSE, FIRST OF ALL I DON'T KNOW THE INSIDE STORY.

IT WAS A HUGE BLUNDER FOR HIM TO GO AHEAD AND CREATE THESE EVICTION NOTICES TIED TO FINES WITHOUT PETER NAVONA.

HE IS OUR LAWYER.

HE IS THE LAWYER FOR THE GOVERNOR.

THE FACT THAT HE DIDN'T PARTICIPATE -- JIM: NAVONA SAID I DON'T WANT ANY PART OF THIS.

MAUREEN: IT WAS A REAL BLUNDER IN TERMS OF TRYING TO GET -- THIS IS A VERY TOUCHY CONSTITUTIONAL ISSUE.

THE FACT IT WAS NOT MORE THOUGHT OUT, I WAS REALLY SURPRISED THE ADMINISTRATION WENT ABOUT IT THIS WAY.

THAT SAID, IN TERMS OF THE IMMEDIATE SITUATION, WE HAVE TO SEE WHAT THE JUDGE SAYS.

I THINK THEY WILL HAVE ANOTHER HEARING.

JIM: THEY WILL BE IN COURT LATER TODAY.

MAUREEN: THE GOVERNOR HAS CALLED OUT THE NATIONAL GUARD.

THEY ARE GETTING THESE THINGS UP AND RUNNING.

IT IS A DELAY BUT IT'S A NECESSARY THING.

THE OTHER THING IS, AND I'M LIKE THE GRINCH, I THINK THE TENT SHOULD BE REMOVED.

THEY ARE A HEALTH HAZARD.

.

I REALLY DO.

I'M PART OF THE PEOPLE.

IT IS MY STATEHOUSE.

I WAS UP THERE FOR SOMETHING AND STEPPING OVER WIRES AND THE PEOPLE, I THINK IT IS TIME THEY OFFERED EVERYONE A PLACE.

THOSE PEOPLE THAT ARE THERE.

THEY DON'T TO GO BECAUSE THEY CANNOT BRING THEIR PETS OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.

I THINK THE GOVERNOR HANDLED THIS BADLY.

I THINK IN THE END IT IS TIME TO GET BEYOND THIS.

JIM: CAN I NOT ARGUE PUBLIC SAFETY?

OUR LAWYER SAYING WE HAVE PEOPLE DEFECATING IN THERE IS NEEDLES AND WHATEVER ELSE.

DOES FREE-SPEECH TRUMP THAT?

THAT IS WHY LAWYERS ARE HIRED.

DAVE: ON BOTH SIDES.

I KIND OF AGREE WITH YOU ON THIS.

I HAD NOT REALLY THOUGHT THAT OUT OF MY OWN.

I THINK THERE'S A LOT OF TRUTH TO THAT.

IT'S ALSO AN AWFUL STATEMENT TO OTHER PEOPLE WHO COME HERE AND GO TO THE STATEHOUSE, PEOPLE FROM OTHER -- NOT JUST OUR OWN PEOPLE BUT PEOPLE FROM OUT OF STATE.

IT JUST LOOKS TERRIBLE.

IT PULLS US DOWN.

AT THE SAME TIME I UNDERSTAND THESE PEOPLE.

THIS HOMELESS PROBLEM IS NOT -- JIM: THAT IS HOW YOU GET THE GOVERNMENT'S ATTENTION, WALKING THROUGH IT EVERYDAY.

IAN: PROVIDENCE, RHODE ISLAND ARE NOT UNIQUE HAVING A WORSENING SITUATION WITH HOMELESSNESS.

THIS SEEMS TO BE THE KIND OF CANARY IN THE COAL MINE OF A RANGE OF HOUSING ISSUES.

IT IS THE EXTREME END.

SOME OF THEM ARE HARDLUCK CASES.

SOME HAVE MENTAL HEALTH ISSUES OR SUBSTANCE ABUSE ISSUES.

THEY ARE COMPETING INTERESTS IN TERMS OF THE RIGHT TO PROTEST VERSUS NOT WANTING TO SEE ANYONE BE DAMAGED OR HURT DUE TO THE COLD WEATHER.

HOPEFULLY THEY WILL BE A RESOLUTION MOVING FORWARD.

DAVE: THE FACT THAT THEY ARE TALKING, AND YOUR CONVERSATION WITH SHEKARCHI THEY WERE TALKING ABOUT DEALING WITH THIS HEAD ON.

GET TO A POINT WHERE YOU CAN'T IGNORE IT.

THAT IS WHY PEOPLE DEMONSTRATE UP THERE.

YOU KNOW, WHAT OTHER PEOPLE ARE NOT FOCUSED ON RIGHT NOW -- THIS WILL GET WORSE.

WE ARE GOING TO THE NEXT COUPLE OF YEARS WITH A POTENTIAL RECESSION OR LIGHT OR MEDIUM OR HARD RECESSION.

JIM: RENTER NOT COMING DOWN.

-- RENTS ARE NOT COMING DOWN.

DAVE: THIS IS A PERFECT STORM TO GET THIS ATTENTION DIRECTED AT HOMELESSNESS, BECAUSE IT IS A PROBLEM.

IF THEY DON'T DEAL WITH IT, I THINK THAT AFFECTS CRIME.

THAT AFFECTS OTHER PARTS OF OUR ENVIRONMENT HERE THAT CAN'T STAND THIS ANYMORE.

PROVIDENCE ALREADY HAS A SERIOUS CRIME PROBLEM THAT THE NEW MAYOR HAS TO TACKLE.

I THINK THERE IS SOMETHING TO BE SAID ABOUT MAKING YOUR POINT.

YOU HAVE BEEN UP THERE FOR A COUPLE OF MONTHS WITH ALL OF YOUR TENTS AND SO FORTH.

I THINK HE CAN MAKE AN ARGUMENT ABOUT PUBLIC SAFETY.

JIM: YOU THINK ABOUT THEM STAYING OUTSIDE LAST NIGHT.

THERE IS WATER AND RAIN AND IT WILL BE BITTERLY COLD NEXT WEEK.

WE HAD ANGEL TO VERIZON AND HE REMINDED ME ABOUT OCCUPIED PROVIDENCE AND HOW THEY OKRA THE DEAL.

THE WEATHER WORKED IN THEIR FAVOR.

YOU NEVER WANT TO HAVE CAMERAS WITH PEOPLE BEING DRAGGED OUT.

IT IS A BAD LOOK.

IAN, AROUND THE COUNTRY -- IMAGINE THE NEW MAYOR OF LOS ANGELES.

THEY HAVE 100,000 PEOPLE IN THE STREET AND IT'S A PLACE WHERE YOU CAN CAMP OUT PRETTY MUCH YEAR-ROUND.

I THINK THE WEATHER SOLVED SOME OF THE PROBLEM BUT NOT ALL OF IT.

IAN: I'M NOT SUGGESTING THERE'S AN EASY SOLUTION BUT IT'S NOT NEWS THAT WINTER POSES MORE CHALLENGES FOR ON HOUSED PEOPLE.

IT WOULD HAVE BEEN NICE IF THE STATE GOT MORE IN FRONT OF THIS ISSUE.

IT'S BECOMING AN ANNUAL THING.

IT IS A DIFFICULT ISSUE.

JIM: PROVIDENCE SCHOOLS.

HOW LONG HAVE WE BEEN TALKING ABOUT PROVIDENCE SCHOOLS?

JUST A BOX ROLLOUT.

I JOKE DOCUMENT.

DAVE, THEY COULD HAVE USED MEDIA ADVICE ON HOW TO ROLLOUT THE SCHOOL CLOSURE.

IT SPEAKS TO ME ABOUT WHERE IS THE STATE, WHERE THE SCHOOLS, PROVIDENCE CONTROLS THE BUILDING BUT THEY WERE WAITING FOR THE SUPERINTENDENT TO COME OUT AND RECOVER FROM KNEE SURGERY.

SOCIAL MEDIA.

IT IS NOT LIKE THE OLD NEW CYCLE THAT YOU HAD TO WAIT FOR THE PAPER TO COME OUT.

AS YOU LOOK AT THIS -- IT BEGS THE QUESTION.

I DON'T KNOW -- IT'S ANOTHER SHOW.

NOBODY SEEMS TO BE TALKING TO EACH OTHER.

DAVE: THE WORST THING YOU WANT TO DO IS DAMAGE FURTHER THE RELATIONSHIPS BETWEEN THE STATE AND THE CITY.

AT SOME POINT THE CITY WILL TAKE BACK CONTROL, I WOULD ASSUME.

ALL THESE CREATE BARRIERS TO A SOLUTION.

IF YOU'RE LOOKING FOR SOLUTIONS, THIS IS NOT THE WAY TO GO.

THERE SHOULD HAVE BEEN A KUMBAYA MOMENT ON THIS.

LOOK, WE HAVE PROBLEMS HERE.

THIS IS WHAT WE GOT TO DO.

FOR THE FOLKS WHO HAVE NOT FOLLOWED THIS CAREFULLY, THERE WAS A LEAK ABOUT WHAT THE CITY OR STATE WAS GOING TO DO.

THEY WERE GOING TO CLOSE TWO SCHOOLS.

A THIRD ONE IS GOING TO BE CLOSED AS WELL.

ONCE YOU START DEALING WITH NEIGHBORHOOD SCHOOLS, LET ME TELL YOU, YOU WILL GET A LOT OF ENEMIES FAST.

COOLER MINDS NEEDED TO BE IN OPERATION HERE AND THEY DIDN'T.

THEY SHOULD HAVE SAID, LOOK, HERE IS WHAT WE HAVE TO DO.

WE ARE SHARING IT WITH YOU AND WE WILL GET SOME COMMUNITY INPUT BEFORE WE DO IT.

JIM: I COVERED THE HOUSE OVERSIGHT MEETING ON THURSDAY NIGHT WHERE THIS ISSUE WAS VETTED.

THERE WERE TWO DIFFERENT STORIES.

STATE EDUCATION COMMISSIONER THOUGHT THERE WAS A GOOD NEW STORY TO TELL.

SHE SAID DESPITE COVID THERE IS IMPROVEMENT HAPPENING IN THE SCHOOLS.

THERE IS MONEY THANKS TO THE APPROVAL OF A CONSTRUCTION BOND IN PROVIDENCE.

OUTDATED SCHOOLS WILL BE REPLACED WITH NEWER AND IMPROVED SCHOOLS AND IS A NEED FOR FEWER SCHOOLS DUE TO DECLINING ENROLLMENT, NOT JUST IN PROVIDENCE BUT EVERYWHERE.

THERE WERE LAWMAKERS INCLUDING OVERSIGHT Y CHAIRWOMAN WHO WAS CRITICAL ABOUT HOW THIS INFORMATION OF SCHOOL CLOSINGS LEAKED OUT.

SHE SAID IT WAS HANDLED POORLY.

ONE OF GREEN'S DEPUTIES RELUCTANTLY ADMITTED UNDER PRESSURE IT COULD HAVE -- THEY WERE SORRY ABOUT IT AND EXPRESSED A DEGREE OF CONTRITION.

HOPEFULLY THIS WILL BE PUT IN THE REARVIEW MIRROR AND THE FOCUS CAN RETURN TO TRYING TO IMPROVE EDUCATIONAL QUALITY.

IAN: THE HOUSING SECRETARY DID THIS TO TRY TO ANSWER A YES-NO QUESTION AND THEY DODGED.

GREEN IS A SMART WOMAN BUT IT WOULD HAVE HELPED IF THEY SAID THEY AGREED IT WAS POORLY ROLLED OUT AND SHE SAID YES, AND MOVE ON.

THEN THE ISSUE BECOMES A COULD HAVE DONE BETTER.

MAUREEN: I WANT TO INTRODUCE ANOTHER IDEA IN TERMS OF THIS.

I THINK THE PROCESS AS THEY LAID IT OUT INITIALLY WAS A GOOD ONE.

THE WORST THING YOU HAVE TO DO IN THIS SITUATION, THE PEOPLE THAT WILL BE AGAINST IT ARE THE UNIONS AND THE PARENTS.

IT IS A NIGHTMARE, AS YOU SAID.

WHAT THEY DID WAS THEY DECIDED AMONG THEMSELVES EXACTLY WHAT SCHOOLS ARE GOING TO BE CLOSED.

THEN THE IDEA WAS THEY WOULD THEN TALK TO THE TEACHERS AND THE PARENTS BEFORE GOING PUBLIC.

I THINK THAT WAS A GOOD STRATEGY.

DAVE: I DON'T AGREE.

MAUREEN: I THINK IF YOU START ENGAGING THE TEACHERS AND THE PARENTS BEFORE, I THINK THEY WERE RIGHT TO SAY THESE ARE THE SCHOOLS WE ARE GOING TO CLOSE.

JIM: IT'S INTERESTING TO NOTE HOW THE PROVIDENCE TEACHERS UNION THAT LET THE CAT OUT OF THE BAG EVADED ANY CRITICISM DURING THIS OVERSIGHT HEARING.

GREEN SAID THE REASON THEY WER HOLDING OFF ON SHARING THE INFORMATION WAS THEY WANTED PROVIDENCE SCHOOLS SUPERINTENDENT TO BE THE ONE LEADING THE PROCESS.

HE'S BEEN AWAY FROM WORK RECOVERING FROM KNEE SURGERY.

THE PROVIDENCE TEACHERS UNION PUT OUT THE INFORMATION.

IAN: IN THIS DAY OF SOCIAL MEDIA -- DAVE: THERE ARE NO SECRETS IN RHODE ISLAND.

WHEN YOU ARE DEALING WITH THE TEACHERS UNION THAT IS ALREADY HOSTILE TO THE STATE, YOU WILL HAVE PARENTS WHO ARE GOING TO BE UPSET THEIR SCHOOL IS GOING TO BE CLOSED.

JIM: EVEN IF THEY HEAR THERE IS A NEW OR BETTER WHEN ON THE HORIZON.

DAVE: BUT I WAS DISAGREEING WITH HIS I THINK BECAUSE WE ARE A SIV, YOU CANNOT KEEP A SECRET HERE.

ESPECIALLY WHEN YOU BRING IN THE PRINCIPLES WE TALK ABOUT.

THESE PEOPLE DEAL WITH GOSSIP AND ALL THAT.

THEY ARE HUMAN BEINGS YOU HAVE TO FACTOR THAT INTO YOUR COMMUNICATIONS PROGRAM, BECAUSE NOTHING IS GOING TO STAY A SECRET FOR MORE THAN EIGHT MINUTES.

JIM: THEY COULD'VE SAT DOWN WITH US AND SAID WHAT ARE THE POTENTIAL PROBLEMS HERE WHEN WE CAN TELL MORE THAN THREE PEOPLE ABOUT THIS, ABOUT WHAT IS GOING ON.

MAUREEN: I THINK IT WAS UNFORTUNATE.

THIS IS A REALLY BIG DEAL.

THE SUPERINTENDENT WAS GETTING HIS KNEE FIXED.

THEY SHOULD HAVE BEEN PREPARED FOR THIS, GET SOMEONE ELSE TO DO IT.

WE DROPPED THE BALL BECAUSE THIS GUY HAD A KNEE SURGERY.

IN TERMS OF AN ISSUE LIKE THIS, I THINK IT'S PRETTY LAME.

JIM: UPSET THAT THE UNION WAS DISAPPOINTED.

WELCOME TO THE REAL WORLD.

OH COURSE IT'S GOING TO GET OUT.

THE LARGER ISSUE ABOUT PROVIDENCE SCHOOLS AND THE TAKEOVER, I UNDERSTAND THEY HAD A PANDEMIC MULLIGAN.

THERE'S A GROWING -- I DON'T KNOW THE ALTERNATIVE.

SEND IT BACK TO PROVIDENCE WHICH DID NOT DO A GREAT JOB TO BEGIN WITH.

IS IT LIKE OK, LET'S GIVE THE STATE MORE TIME?

IAN: GREEN HAD AN HOUR-LONG PRESENTATION WITH POWERPOINT ELICITING HOW IMPROVEMENT IS BEING MEASURED AND MADE IN A VARIETY OF WAYS.

WHETHER INDEPENDENT ANALYST WOULD AGREE WITH THAT REMAINS TO BE SEEN.

I THINK THERE ARE SOME SIGNS OF IMPROVEMENT.

GOVERNOR MCKEE, EDUCATION HAS BEEN A BIG THING FOR HIM.

HE SIGNED OFF ON A CONTRACT AGREEMENT WITH THE PTU THAT WAS FAR SHORT OF THE INFORMATION OF CONTRACT CITED AS A GLARING NEED BY JOHNS HOPKINS.

NOW THAT MCKEE HAS A FULL TERM, I EXPECT HE WILL FOCUS MORE ON EDUCATION.

MAUREEN: I THINK THE LEGISLATURE --SHEKARCHI INDICATED THAT THEY SUPPORT THIS.

THEY ARE STILL IN ON THE TAKEOVER.

JIM: LET'S GET TO OUTRAGES AND/OR KUDOS.

HERE WE ARE.

IAN: PROBABLY -- WE TALKED ABOUT MY OUTRAGE WITH THE WAY THIS WHOLE THING WAS HANDLED.

I WILL MAKE MORE TIME FOR EVERYBODY ELSE.

WE HAVE ALREADY TALKED ABOUT MY -- JIM: LET ME TAKE NUMBER EIGHT.

IAN: AS A RED SOX FAN IS HE TO BE OUTRAGED ABOUT EVERY THING WITH THE RED SOX BUT I WILL GO IN A DIFFERENT DIRECTION.

ELON MUSK'S MANAGEMENT OF TWITTER IS COMING UNDER GREATER SCRUTINY.

ON THURSDAY, THERE WERE A NUMBER OF REPORTERS WHO REPORTED ON MUSK WHO HAVE BEEN BLOCKED AND EXCISED FROM TWITTER.

THAT IS A STARK CONTRAST FROM PEOPLE WHO DESCRIBED MUSK AS A CHAMPION OF FREE SPEECH.

I THINK THAT IS A SITUATION THAT BEARS CLOSE SCRUTINY.

JIM: I READ THAT THE WASHINGTON POST -- WE ARE ALL COVERING IT.

SOME OF THE REPORTERS ARE INVOLVED.

HE SAID YOU DISCLOSED WHERE I WAS.

THAT IS A THREAT TO MY SAFETY.

WHETHER IT IS FREE SPEECH WERE NOT.

THE POST -- IT SOUNDS LIKE THE RERUN OF FOUR YEARS OF TRUMP.

WE KIND OF EVIDENCE THAT WAS THE CASE.

-- FOUND NO EVIDENCE THAT WAS THE CASE.

WE ALL USE IT FOR INFORMATIONAL PURPOSES.

HE SEEMS TO HAVE THIN SKIN.

IAN: THERE WAS A YOUNG GUY WITH A TWITTER, ELON'S JET TRACKING HIS TRAVEL.

I CAN UNDERSTAND THAT.

THE PEOPLE WHO HAVE BEEN KNOCKED OFF TWITTER BY HIS MANAGEMENT OR REPORTERS DOING LEGITIMATE JOURNALISM, THAT'S A SERIOUS CONCERN.

MAUREEN: I THINK THAT IS A SERIOUS CONCERN.

WE HAVE TO THINK ABOUT THAT.

JIM: YOU GET THE LAST ONE.

MAUREEN: MY OUTRAGE OR DEEP CONCERN IS ABOUT THE DISCOVERY OF A RUSSIAN SPY NETWORK IN NEW HAMPSHIRE.

THEY WERE ACTUALLY RUSSIAN SPIES.

THEY WERE LIVING IN NEW HAMPSHIRE.

THEY WERE RECEIVING BULLETS AND RECEIVING DIGITAL EQUIPMENT AND CHIPS AND SETTING THEM UP TO ESTONIA.

IT WAS GOING TO THE RUSSIANS.

IT IS REALLY SCARY.

THEY HAD BEEN OPERATING WITH IMPUNITY FOR A COUPLE OF YEARS.

THEY WERE FINALLY TRACKED DOWN.

THEY SAY THEY DON'T KNOW HOW MANY MORE OF THESE NETWORKS EXIST.

IT IS FRIGHTENING TO THINK ABOUT THE SUBTERFUGE IN TERMS OF INTERNALLY.

IT IS SADDENING.

THE WAR IN UKRAINE.

THE RUSSIANS HAVE LOST A LOT OF PEOPLE.

THEY ARE DEPENDENT ON THIS.

UKRAINE IS CAUGHT IN THE MIDDLE AND IT'S REALLY TRAGIC.

JIM: THAT IS ALL THE TIME WE HAVE FOR THIS WEEK.

THIS SAME PANEL WILL BE HERE NEXT WEEK OR ONE OF MY FAVORITE SHOWS OF THE YEAR.

WE DO THE YEAR-ENDER WHERE WE LOOK AT THE TOP STORIES OF THE YEAR.

AND A LOT MORE.

DO NOT MISS THAT.

IAN, DAVE, MARINE, WE WILL SEE YOU NEXT WEEK AS "A LIVELY EXPERIMENT" CONTINUES.

♪ [CAPTIONING PERFORMED BY THE NATIONAL CAPTIONING INSTITUTE, WHICH IS RESPONSIBLE FOR ITS CAPTION CONTENT AND ACCURACY.

VISIT NCICAP.ORG] ♪ >> "A LIVELY EXPERIMENT" IS GENEROUSLY UNDERWRITTEN BY -- JOHN: I AM JOHN HAZEN WHITE, JUNIOR.

FOR OVER 30 YEARS ALIVE THE EXPERIMENT HAS PROVIDED INSIGHT AND ANALYSIS OF POLITICAL ISSUES THAT FACE RHODE ISLANDERS.