[CLOSED CAPTIONING HAS BEEN PROVIDED BY CARDI'S FURNITURE AND MATTRESSES] JIM: THIS WEEK ON "A LIVELY EXPERIMENT."

WE SIFT THROUGH WHAT THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY DID AND DID NOT DO IN 2024.

VOTERS WILL DECIDE WHETHER RHODE ISLAND SHOULD HOLD A CONSTITUTIONAL CONVENTION NEXT YEAR.

>> "A LIVELY EXPERIMENT" IS GENEROUSLY UNDERWRITTEN BY.

>> FOR OVER 30 YEARS "A LIVELY EXPERIMENT" HAS PROVIDED INSIGHT ON POLITICAL ISSUES THAT FACE RHODE ISLANDERS.

I AM A PROUD SUPPORTER OF THIS GREAT PROGRAM ON RHODE ISLAND PBS.

JIM: JOINING US ON THE PANEL.

WEAYONNOH NELSON-DAVIES, OF THE ECONOMIC PROGRESS INSTITUTE.

MIKE MARCELLO AND PROVIDENCE STATE HOUSE REPORTER PATRICK ANDERSON.

WELCOME TO THIS WEEK’S "A LIVELY EXPERIMENT."

I AM JIM HUMMEL.

IT HAS BEEN A WEEK SINCE THE GAVEL AFTER ONE LAST MARATHON NIGHT TO CLOSE OUT THE 2024 GENERAL ASSEMBLY SESSION.

NOW ARE ATTENTION TURNS TO THE ELECTIONS IN NOVEMBER.

FIRST, HIGHLIGHTS OF WHAT HAPPENED SINCE LAWMAKERS FIRST CONVENED IN JANUARY.

PATRICK, YOU HAD A FRONT ROW SEAT.

WHAT HAPPENED.

DID ANYTHING SURPRISE YOU IN THE MOMENT?

PATRICK: WE WERE A LITTLE SURPRISED WHEN THE CITIZENS TAX CAME BACK.

IT LOOKED LIKE IT WAS DEAD AND THEN IT ROSE TOWARD THE END.

MAYBE WE SHOULD NOT BE SURPRISED CONSIDERING HOW MUCH PULL CITIZENS HAS IN THE STATE AND HOW MUCH THIS MEANT TO THEM THAT IT WOULD COME BACK.

WE WERE SURPRISED ABOUT THE AMOUNT SPENT IN THE BUDGET FOR THE WHOLE YEAR AND THAT THEN THEY COULD GIVE MORE MONEY TO CITIZENS AND REALLY FIND A LOT OF MONEY IN THE CUSHIONS AND IN THE CRACKS OF THE COUCH FOR ALL KINDS OF STUFF.

THAT WAS PROBABLY THE BIGGEST SURPRISE.

LOOKING AHEAD TO SEE HOW THEY AFFORD THAT GOING FORWARD.

JIM: THE FINAL BUDGET IS ALMOST $250 MILLION MORE THAN WHAT THE GOVERNOR PROPOSED.

SOME OF THAT IS SURPLUS.

DID YOU EXPECT MORE TO BE PUT AWAY?

PATRICK: NO.

I DID NOT EXPECT MORE TO BE PUT AWAY.

[LAUGHTER] JIM: WHETHER IT BE PRUDENT AND WHETHER YOU EXPECTED IT ARE TWO DIFFERENT QUESTIONS.

PATRICK: THEY HAVE BEEN SAYING YES A LOT TO A LOT OF THINGS AND IT HAS BEEN SOME OF THE LEAST RANCOROUS DEBATES ABOUT SPENDING AND ABOUT LEGISLATION AT THE END OF THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY THAT I CAN REMEMBER IN QUITE A WHILE.

A LOT OF THAT IS HAVING THAT EXTRA MONEY BOTH IN THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT AND INFLATION IS HELPING BOOST THOSE NUMBERS.

THE TAX REVENUE KEEPS COMING IN BETTER THAN EXPECTED YEAR OVER YEAR AND THEY HAVE A LITTLE MORE MONEY THAN THAT THOUGHT THEY WOULD HAVE WHEN THEY START.

THAT HAS MADE IT EASIER.

JIM: A DIFFERENT DAY OF RECKONING.

MIKE: I ALSO BELIEVE THE CITIZENS BANK VOTE WAS A SURPRISE.

YOU NEED 50 VOTES TO PASS AND I AM CONCERNED THE SPEAKER -- JIM: DID THEY GET CONFLATED WITH THE LAND PURCHASE DEAL?

MIKE: A LITTLE BIT.

WE WERE GOING TO LOSE TAX REVENUE.

ONCE IT WAS TAKEN OUT OF THE BUDGET, IT WAS A SURPRISE THEY PUT IT BACK SO QUICKLY.

THE CONCERN WAS THEY DID NOT HAVE ENOUGH TIME TO STUDY IT AND FIGURE OUT WHAT WAS GOING ON.

THEY NEEDED THE 50 VOTES.

JIM: A BUSY COUPLE OF MONTHS.

WHAT WERE YOU LOOKING AT?

WEAYONNOH: WE ALWAYS PUSH FOR REVENUE.

THERE WAS INVESTMENT MADE TO ADDRESS POVERTY, CHILDCARE ISSUES.

WORKFORCE DEVELOPMENT PROGRAM WAS NOT IN THE BUDGET.

IT WAS PUT IN BY THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY.

ABOUT 5000 CHILDREN.

THAT WAS A GOOD INVESTMENT.

JIM: I AM ALWAYS INTERESTED TO SEE HOW THE SAUSAGE IS MADE.

THE $250 MILLION WERE FOR THINGS LIKE THAT.

WHERE IS THE MONEY GOING?

THE GOVERNOR DID NOT INCLUDE IT ORIGINALLY AND THEN A LOT OF LOBBYING, TALKING TO PEOPLE IN THE FOLLOWING MONTHS?

WEAYONNOH: MEETING WITH THE SPEAKER, THE HOUSE FINANCE COMMITTEE AND ALLOWING THEM TO UNDERSTAND THAT PROGRAM IS FUNDED BY THE TEMPORARY ASSISTANCE.

WE GET MONEY FROM THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT TO FUND THAT.

WE HAD A RESERVE OF ALMOST $100 MILLION SITTING DOWN FOR YEARS.

WE REALLY PUSHED HARD IN SAYING WE HAVE THE MONEY IN RESERVE, YOU HAVE TO INVEST IN THIS PROGRAM.

JIM: WHAT PRACTICALLY WILL THAT DO?

WEAYONNOH: FOR A FAMILY OF THREE AT THIS POINT, THEY ARE MAKING ABOUT $721 PER MONTH.

THIS 20% INCREASE WILL GET THEM TO ABOUT $865 PER MONTH.

IT IS A GOOD INVESTMENT.

IT IS STILL AT 40% OF THE FEDERAL POVERTY LEVEL.

ACCORDING TO THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT, UNDER 50% IS DEEP POVERTY.

IN 2021 WHEN WE MADE THE FIRST INVESTMENTS, WE GOT IT TO 40%.

WE DID NOT PROJECT FOR INFLATION SO WE ARE BACK TO 40%.

ONE THING WE WERE PUSHING FOR WAS TO GET US TO 50% SO FAMILIES ARE NOT LIVING IN DEEP POVERTY AND TO PROTECT OUR INVESTMENT.

JIM: MIKE, WHAT ELSE ARE YOU LOOKING AT?

MIKE: VERY INTERESTING REFORM.

JIM: THEY GOT PRETTY MUCH EVERYTHING -- THE EXPANDED PANEL , EXPANDED PENALTIES AND THEN THE CHIEFS BEING ABLE TO SPEAK ABOUT IT.

MIKE: THAT HAS BEEN UP THERE SINCE I HAVE BEEN HERE.

I WAS SURPRISED TO SEE IT HIT THE FLOOR THAT QUICKLY.

THERE SEEM TO BE AN AGREEMENT BETWEEN BOTH CHAMBERS.

THE NEW THING THAT I LIKE ABOUT THE BILL IS THE POLICE OFFICERS -- THE THREE OFFICERS ON THE PANEL WOULD BE RANDOMLY PICKED ONCE THEY PUT IN A NAME.

JIM: AND THE PANEL EXPANDED.

MIKE: YOU WILL NOT HAVE -- THE NEUTRAL USED TO MAKE THE DECISION.

JIM: THE NOT SO NEUTRAL SOMETIMES.

MIKE: IT HAS BEEN INTERESTING.

IT DOES NOT TAKE EFFECT UNTIL JANUARY 1.

THEY WILL FIGURE OUT HOW TO GET ON THE LIST AND WHAT JUDGES WILL BE ELIGIBLE.

THAT WAS A BIG LIFT FOR LAW ENFORCEMENT.

PATRICK: THE BIG QUESTION WAS, WOULD THEY KEEP THE PROVISION THAT WOULD HAVE POTENTIALLY ALLOWED BODY CAMERA FOOTAGE OF NON-CHARGED FELONY INCIDENTS INVOLVING POLICE FROM BEING WITHHELD.

I HAVE NEVER QUITE FIGURED OUT WHETHER THAT WAS SOMETHING THAT WAS PUT INTO THE BILL, THE ORIGINAL BILL, BEFORE IT WAS CHANGED THAT THE POLICE UNIONS REALLY WANTED AND WHETHER THAT WAS A BIG DEAL FOR THEM.

I THINK THAT WOULD HAVE MADE IT EVERY DIFFICULT TO GET BODY CAMERA FOOTAGE OF A LOT OF INCIDENTS.

IT COULD HAVE PUT IN SOMETHING THAT IS STRONGER IN THE REFORM BILL THAN IT EVER WAS BEFORE.

BUT THAT GOT TAKEN OUT.

MIKE: I THINK DESCENDANT GETS CREDIT FOR THAT.

THEY MADE A CHANGE AND SENT IT TO THE HOUSE.

JIM: THE TRANSPARENCY ISSUE, TOO.

SUMMARY TIMES THE CHIEF WOULD SAY I CANNOT TALK ABOUT THIS AND THAT RAIES YOUR SUSPICION WHEN POLICE ARE INVOLVED.

AND HE THOUGHT ABOUT THE REFORM?

WEAYONNOH: ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WAS HIGHLIGHTED FOR US WAS GENERAL ASSEMBLY MEMBERS STEPPING UP AND SING WE HAVE A CONCERN ABOUT CERTAIN THINGS.

SOME OF THEM WERE NERVOUS ABOUT DOING THAT.

WE ALWAYS LOOK AT LINCOLN GENERAL ASSEMBLY MEMBERS STEP UP?

A NICE SURPRISE THIS YEAR, SECURE CHOICE RETIREMENT PROGRAM.

THAT WAS PRETTY NEW.

WE HAVE BEEN FIGHTING FOR THAT FOR A FEW YEARS ALONG WITH AARP TO ALLOW FOR 172,000 EMPLOYEES IN THE PRIVATE SECTOR WHO DO NOT HAVE ACCESS TO RETIREMENT FUNDS TO GET RETIREMENT.

THE SPEAKER PUT THAT IN.

WE THINK IT IS A GOOD INVESTMENT.

IT IS GOOD FOR SMALL BUSINESSES WHO CAN AFFORD A RETIREMENT PROGRAM AND DEPLOYS NEVER HAD ACCESS TO THAT.

>> ONE THING THAT DID NOT GET TOUCHED, THERE WAS CONCERN ABOUT TINKERING WITH THE EDUCATION FUNDING AND THEY DID NOT TOUCH THAT.

THERE WAS AN EFFORT TO OPEN THAT UP TO MAKE SOME ADJUSTMENTS.

THAT DID NOT HAPPEN.

THEY PUT MORE MONEY INTO THE EDUCATIONAL BUDGET.

THAT WAS A GOOD LIFT FOR THE CITIES AND TOWNS.

I THINK THE HOUSE GETS CREDIT FOR THAT.

THE GOVERNOR HAD PROPOSED FUNDING.

JIM: HAS THAT USUALLY BEEN THE CASE WHEN THE HOUSE BUDGET COMES OUT?

THEY WANT TO GIVE THE CITIES AND TOWNS A LITTLE BIT MORE.

IT IS POPULAR.

PATRICK: THE FUNDING FORMULA IS SOMETHING THAT NEVER WANT TO BE SEEN AS CUTTING.

THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY, ESPECIALLY IN RECENT YEARS, ALWAYS PROTECTED THAT.

IF THEY HAVE EXTRA MONEY TO MAKE THAT WHOLE, THEY WILL DO THAT.

WE EXPECTED THAT TO HAPPEN, WHETHER HOW MUCH THE GOVERNOR WAS PROPOSING THAT CUT JUST TO MAKE HIS NUMBERS WORK OR HE WANTED TO TINKER WITH THAT, I AM NOT CERTAIN.

NOTHING REALLY SIGNIFICANT WITH CHARTER SCHOOLS.

THAT IS KIND OF STATUS QUO.

SECURE CHOICE, THAT IS A VICTORY FOR THE GENERAL TREASURER.

HE WAS PUSHING FOR THAT.

THAT IS SOMETHING FOR HIM IN THIS SESSION THAT HE CAN RUN ON.

NOT A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE ANGRY COMING OUT OF THIS END OF THE SESSION.

JIM: IT IS HARD NOT TO BE WITH A $14 BILLION BUDGET.

WHAT FLEW UNDER THE RADAR BUT HIGHLIGHTED AT THE END WAS THE STATE RETIREES.

YOU WERE THERE WHEN THEY PASSED THE PENSION REFORM.

YOU WERE RIGHT IN THE MIDDLE OF THOSE DEBATES.

WE NEED TO SAVE THE PENSION SYSTEM.

WHAT DO YOU THINK NOW WITH 10 YEARS’ PERSPECTIVE, RESTORING SOME OF THAT?

>> NO ONE ANTICIPATED INFLATION.

THAT WAS ONE OF THE BIG ISSUES.

MANY DID NOT CONTRIBUTE TO SOCIAL SECURITY.

THAT WAS THEIR ONLY SOURCE OF RETIREMENT INCOME.

BECAUSE OF INFLATION, THEY ARE GOING BACKWARD.

I WAS SURPRISED.

THEY DREW THE LINE THAT ANYONE RETIRED BEFORE 2012 WOULD GET IT RESTORED.

THERE WILL BE A LOT OF PUSHBACK TO TRY TO GET THAT FULLY RESTORED.

SOMETIMES THEY CAN BE A DANGEROUS THING.

THE MONEY IS REALLY NOT THERE YET.

EVERY TIME THEY PUT MORE MONEY INTO PENSIONS, THEY HAVE TO CUT PROGRAMS.

.

.

THERE WILL BE CONTINUED PRESSURE, NO QUESTION ABOUT IT.

THEY WILL HAVE TO DO SOMETHING EVENTUALLY.

WHEN THEY LOWERED THE THRESHOLD FROM 80% TO 75% WHEN THE COLA WOULD KICK IN FOR SOME RETIREES.

IT IS AN ISSUE.

I DO NOT THINK PEOPLE WANT TO DEAL WITH IT BECAUSE IT IS A CONTENTIOUS ISSUE.

THE MORE MONEY IN PENSIONS, THE LESS MONEY FOR OTHER PROGRAMS.

JIM: IT IS A COMPLICATED FORMULA.

I AM NOT SURE ANY TWO PEOPLE IN THE WORLD KNOW WHAT IT IS AND EVEN THEY ARE UNSURE.

I THINK THE RETIREES -- THESE ARE PEOPLE BEFORE 2012, SOME DO NOT HAVE SOCIAL SECURITY.

HEAR THE PENSION PRODUCES.

A FIREFIGHTER MAKING $200,000.

MOST OF THESE PEOPLE ARE PULLING IN $35,000 AND THAT IS ALL THEY HAVE.

>> THIS WAS MORE FOR THE RETIREES THAN MOST PEOPLE EXPECTED THEY WOULD GET.

THEY DO WANT MORE.

IT IS NOT EVERYTHING THEY WANTED OR EVEN CLOSE.

THE QUESTION IS, IS WHAT WAS PROVIDED THIS YEAR SOMETHING THAT WILL SATISFY THEM IN THE YEARS THE BUDGET GETS TOUGHER OR IS THIS GIVING THEM THE SIGNAL OF, NO, WE SHOULD ADD CAN ASK FOR MORE AND GET FULL RESTORATION AND EVERYTHING WE GOT.

I’M NOT SURE EXACTLY HOW THAT PLAYS.

MIKE: A LOT OF PEOPLE WHO VOTED FOR THE PENSION REFORM ARE NO LONGER THERE.

THERE WAS AN UNWRITTEN RULE.

WE WERE NOT GOING TO PUT IN ANY BILLS TO CHANGE IT.

WE TOOK A HARD VOTE AND WE WERE GOING TO LET IT PLAY OUT FOR 10 YEARS.

JIM: THE ONE FINAL THING BEFORE WE MOVE ON.

PAID FAMILY LEAVE.

I KNOW THAT WAS A BIG DEAL FOR YOU GUYS.

IN SIX WEEKS, YOU WANTED 12.

WEAYONNOH: WE ASKED FOR 12, WE ARE AT SIX.

WE GOT FROM FOUR TO SIX AND WE WILL GET TO EIGHT IN 2026.

WE ARE ALSO ABLE TO GET AN INCREASE IN DEPENDENCE ALLOWANCE.

THAT WAS A GOOD START.

IF WE ARE PUSHING FOR BEING COMPETITIVE WITH MASSACHUSETTS, 12 WEIGHTS AT THIS POINT.

WE ARE HAPPY FOR THE INCREASE.

WE GOT TO THE TABLE WITH THE BUSINESS COMMUNITY AND HAD CONVERSATIONS.

WITH THINK 12 WEEKS IS WHERE WE NEED TO BE TO BE COMPETITIVE WITH OTHER STATES AND ANSWER THE CALL.

JIM: EXCHANGING EMAILS BEFORE AND WEAYONNOH SAID, TO BE WANT TO BE LIKE MASSACHUSETTS OR DO WE NOT?

WHEN IT COMES TO PAYDAY LENDING AND FAMILY LEAVE, A LITTLE BIT OF A DISCONNECT.

WEAYONNOH: THIS WAS DISAPPOINTING.

WE GIVE IT OUR ALL.

[LAUGHTER] JIM: HOW MANY DISCUSSIONS DID YOU HAVE?

PATRICK: ONE OF THE LOBBIES ABOUT THIS ARE THE PEOPLE WHO OWN THE STRIP MALLS WHERE THESE PAYDAY LENDERS ARE.

THEY ARE LANDLORDS.

THEY HAVE A PRESENCE UP THERE.

THE PEOPLE WHO OWN THOSE BUILDINGS ARE LIKE, THESE ARE GOOD TENANTS AND THEY PAY THE RENT.

PATRICK: THE COMMERCIAL REAL ESTATE MARKET HAS TANKED.

THERE IS NO ONE TO MOVE IN.

WEAYONNOH: I WILL SAY WE BUILT A LOT OF MOMENTUM.

ALL FIVE STATE OFFICIALS SIGNED ONTO IT.

WE MOVED THE NEEDLE WITH SOME CITY ORDINANCES.

WE LOOK AT THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY, WE DO IT WILL BE A TOUGH CALL AND WE IMPLEMENTED SOME OTHER STRATEGIES.

WE WILL KEEP PUSHING FOR PAYDAY LENDING REFORM.

MIKE: THIS IS THE SECOND OR THIRD BUDGET.

THERE HAS BEEN NO INCREASE IN TAXES OR FEES.

PATRICK: THE REVENUE HAS BEEN UP.

MIKE: THERE IS PRESSURE FOR THE BILLIONAIRES TAX AND THAT HAS NOT HAPPENED.

JIM: VOTERS THIS FALL WILL BE DECIDING WHETHER THEY WANT TO HAVE A CONSTITUTIONAL CONVENTION.

WE HAVE NOT HAD ONE FOR 40 YEARS.

WHAT IS THAT MEAN?

LET’S GO TO OUR FORMER LEGISLATOR AND SOMEONE WHO STUDIES THIS.

THE BILL PASSED, PUT IT ON THE BALLOT IN NOVEMBER AND IF IT PASSES YOU WOULD CONVENE ONE NEXT MONTH.

MIKE:MIKE: IF THE VOTERS APPROVE IT.

THEY HAVE NOT DECIDED ON THE TIMELINE.

IT HAS BEEN 40 YEARS SINCE WE HAD THE CONVENTION.

SOME OF MY FORMER COLLEAGUES DO NOT LIKE THE IDEA BECAUSE THEY ARE AFRAID IT WILL OPEN UP TO EVERYTHING.

JIM: GOD FOR BID.

MIKE: THERE WERE BILLS FILED FOR CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENTS FOR FOUR-YEAR TERMS, A RIGHT TO EDUCATION AMENDMENT, TERM LIMITS PROPOSED, A CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENT THAT WOULD ALLOW JURIES TO NULLIFY CRIMINAL CONVICTION MEANT.

THOSE ARE ALL CONSTITUTIONAL REFORMS PUT IN THIS YEAR THEY DID NOT GO ANYWHERE.

THERE ARE OTHER ISSUES LIKE THE LINE ITEM VETO REFORM.

OPEN GOVERNMENT RECORDS.

I THINK IT IS A GOOD TIME.

IT HAS BEEN 40 YEARS.

LOOK AT HOW TECHNOLOGY HAS CHANGED.

I SUPPORT IT.

I WOULD HOPE THERE IS COMMISSION THAT HAS BEEN APPOINTED WITH DIRECT RESOLUTION.

I HOPE THEY GET THAT UP AND RUNNING TO FOCUS ON SOME OF THESE ISSUES.

AT THE END OF THE DAY THE VOTERS WILL DECIDE TO APPROVE THESE AMENDMENTS OR NOT.

IT IS A GOOD TIME TO ALLOW THE PEOPLE, WHOSE GOVERNMENT THIS IS, OR STUDY THE AMENDMENTS.

WEAYONNOH: CAN HAVE A VOICE, I AM FOR IT.

THE WILL OF THE PEOPLE WILL COME THROUGH.

OR WILL A SPECIAL INTEREST GROUP OVERSHADOW THE PROCESS.

THESE ARE AMENDMENTS THAT PEOPLE WILL LOVE.

ANYTHING THAT GOES THROUGH THE CONSTITUTIONAL CONVENTION, THERE ARE CONCERNS ABOUT ABORTION RIGHTS, CIVIL RIGHTS AND WHO WOULD BE A PART OF THIS.

THE REASON RHODE ISLANDERS HAVE REJECTED IT -- IT MAKES ME EXCITED TO THINK ABOUT VOTERS HAVING A VOICE IN OUR ELECTORAL PROCESS.

WHO WILL REALLY BE LEADING?

MIKE: THERE IS NO OUTSIDE INFLUENCE IN THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY.

YOU ARE NOT GETTING SOME OF THESE THINGS LIKE THE TERM LIMITS.

IT IS CHANGING ONE POLITICAL FORM FOR ANOTHER.

I AM HOPING THE VOTERS TO APPROVE IT.

IT WOULD BE REFRESHING TO SEE RHODE ISLANDERS TAKE A HARD LOOK AT THE STRUCTURE OF THE GOVERNMENT.

PATRICK: TO ME THE BIG THING IS IF THERE IS A CONSTITUTIONAL CONVENTION, DO THEY GO FOR SOMETHING THAT ALLOWS VOTER REFERENDUMS?

IN OTHER STATES, YOU HAVE EVERY ELECTION CYCLE DETERMINED BY REFERENDUM.

HERE, WE DON’T.

IN A LOT OF STATES, THEY UPSET THE STRUCTURE -- LIKE CALIFORNIA -- WITH PROPERTY TAXES.

IN MASSACHUSETTS, ALL KINDS OF THINGS CAN COME UP ON VOTER REFERENDUMS.

HERE, THE LEGISLATURE HAS TOTAL CONTROL, WHICH IS WHY THE DO NOT WANT A CONSTITUTIONAL CONVENTION.

WE ARE DOING A GOOD JOB, THANK YOU VERY MUCH, WE WILL KEEP DOING WHAT WE ARE DOING.

DIRECTOR MARGARET C COULD OPEN UP THE WINDOW -- DIRECT DEMOCRACY COULD OPEN UP THE WINDOW.

THAT IS THE BIG ONE WITHOUT GETTING INTO A SPECIFIC ISSUE.

A STRUCTURAL CHANGE THAT COULD ALLOW OTHER ISSUES.

JIM: THAT WAS THE CONCERN 40 YEARS AGO.

YOU TALKED ABOUT ABORTION RIGHTS.

IT WAS MORE CONSERVATIVE THAN MAINSTREAM RHODE ISLAND.

YOU GET TWO BITES AT THE APPLE.

THE VOTERS HAVE TO VOTE ON THAT.

I UNDERSTAND SPECIAL INTEREST GROUPS ADVERTISING, WHATEVER.

THEY VOTED DOWN THE ABORTION ONE.

I THINK YOU WOULD FIND THAT VOTERS IN RHODE ISLAND WOULD PROBABLY CODIFY OR VOTE AGAINST ANYTHING TO MESS WITH -- MIKE: I THINK VOTERS TODAY WOULD VOTE FOR A RIGHT TO ABORTION.

AGAIN, IT IS THE VOTERS’ CHOICE FOR THAT TO HAPPEN.

DIRECT REFERENDUMS IS AN IMPORTANT ISSUE.

INSPECTOR GENERAL.

IT IS A GOOD CHECK TO HAVE THE PEOPLE ACTUALLY CONVENE AND LET THEM LOOK AT IT.

THERE WILL BE SPECIAL INTEREST.

THERE IS SPECIAL INTEREST IN THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY TODAY.

I THINK THE FEAR -- THE ACLU SAYS THIS WILL OPEN IT UP TO A RUNAWAY CONVENTION.

I THINK THAT IS OVERSTATED.

PATRICK: VOTE FOR DELEGATE IF THERE IS A CONVENTION.

[LAUGHTER] JIM: I DO THINK WHAT HAPPENED, MY RECOLLECTION WAS FROM 10 YEARS AGO THAT THERE WAS A TREMENDOUS AD CAMPAIGN AND LOBBYISTS LOBBIED AGAINST HAVING IT.

LET’S DO THIS QUICKLY BEFORE WE GO TO OUTRAGEOUS.

PATRICK, WE LOOKED AT ELECTIONS IN THE FALL AND THE FILING DEADLINE WILL BE NEXT WEEK.

RHODE ISLAND HAS THIS WEIRD THING WHERE YOU CAN ONLY FILE ON THREE DAYS, IT IS NOT A LONGER PERIOD.

WE WILL KNOW BY THE END OF WEDNESDAY NEXT WEEK WHO WILL RUN.

NO GENERAL OFFICERS THIS YEAR SO WE TURN TO THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY, SOME OF THE LOCAL OFFICES.

WE KNOW SENATOR MILLER WILL NOT RUN AGAIN.

PATRICK: WHO HAS SAID HE WILL NOT RUN AGAIN.

WE ARE WATCHING THE SENATE CLOSELY.

THE SENATE LEADERSHIP PICTURE.

THE SENATE PRESIDENT IS BATTLING CANCER.

HE WAS NOT PRESIDING OVER MOST OF THE SESSION THAT JUST PASSED.

EXACTLY WHAT HIS INFLUENCE WAS HIS INFLUENCE IS NOW IS A BIT OF A QUESTION MARK.

THIS PAST WEEK WE HAVE THE SENATE PRESIDENT ANNOUNCED HE IS RUNNING AGAIN AND THEN A STREAM OF PRESS RELEASES AND SOCIAL MEDIA POSTS AND LETTERS FROM PARTY OFFICIALS, ALL KINDS OF INSIDERS HAILING HIS DECISION TO RUN AGAIN AND WISHING HIM THE BEST OF LUCK.

IT WAS A LITTLE BIT CONSPICUOUS IN HOW THEY DID IT.

USUALLY, IF YOU HEAR ONE OF THE MOST POWERFUL PEOPLE IN THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY IS RUNNING AGAIN, THAT IS EXPECTED.

YOU DO NOT HEAR, "THE SPEAK IS RUNNING AGAIN."

THEY ARE BEING CONSPICUOUS WITH HOW MUCH THEY ARE POINTING TO THAT HE IS RUNNING AGAIN.

EVERYONE IS WATCHING TO SEE NOT JUST IF HE RUNS, BUT EVENTUALLY WHAT THE SUCCESSION PLAN MIGHT BE IN HIS MIND AND OTHERS IN THE SENATE.

>> NOT ONLY THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY BUT WE WERE ALSO TALKING OFF-CAMERA -- IT IS TOUGH TO GET PEOPLE TO RUN THESE DAYS.

THE QUESTION IS WHAT PERCENTAGE OF THE SEATS WILL GO UNCHALLENGED?

MIKE: PEOPLE ARE NOT INTERESTED IN RUNNING.

JIM: WHY?

MIKE: SOCIAL MEDIA HAS A LOT TO DO WITH IT.

PEOPLE DO NOT WANT TO BE FODDER FOR THE FACEBOOK WARRIORS.

JIM: MY WIFE CALLS IT FACEBOOK FOOLISHNESS.

MIKE: CAMPAIGN FINANCE LAWS SOMETIMES DISCOURAGE PEOPLE FROM RUNNING.

.

YOU HAVE TO FILL OUT PAPERWORK.

YOU ARE SPENDING $3000, $4000.

YOU HAVE TO FILL OUT A BUNCH OF PAPERWORK.

A LOT OF PEOPLE DO NOT WANT TO DO IT FOR THAT REASON.

APATHY IN GENERAL.

IT IS NOT A GOOD TIME FOR POLITICS.

WE GET SO DIVIDED.

WE HAVE THE DEMOCRATS AND THE REPUBLICANS AND THEY CANNOT SEEM TO MATTER AND THE TRUTH DOES NOT MATTER AND FACTS DO NOT MATTER.

THIS IS THE EXACT TIME WE GET GOOD PEOPLE TO RUN FOR PUBLIC OFFICE.

WEAYONNOH: I WOULD LOVE TO SEE WITH THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY MORE GRASSROOTS COMMUNITY LEADERS RUN.

DEAL WITH ISSUES FOR LOW AND MODEST INCOME RHODE ISLANDERS IN THE STATE OF RHODE ISLAND.

PART-TIME LEGISLATION, MOST OF THOSE PEOPLE CANNOT AFFORD THE $17,000 A MONTH AND CUT THEIR JOB AT 3:00 P.M. TO GO AND BE THERE.

I LOVE ELECTION YEAR.

IT IS OUR TIME TO CHALLENGE OUR LEADERS AND SAY, "ARE YOU REALLY REPRESENTING THE PEOPLE’S INTEREST?"

MIKE: YOU BECOME A BETTER REP IF YOU BECOME A CHALLENGER FOR ELECTION.

PATRICK: THE LAST COUPLE YEARS, CHALLENGES FROM THE LEFT HAVE BEEN THE DEFINING FEATURE OF A LOT OF GENERAL ASSEMBLY ELECTIONS.

THERE MIGHT NOT BE AS MANY THIS YEAR.

WE DO NOT HAVE -- WE DO NOT KNOW IF THE POLITICAL COOPERATIVE WILL RUN A SLATE OF CANDIDATES.

THAT COULD HAVE A DIFFERENT FEEL TO THOSE ELECTIONS.

JIM: LET’S DO OUTRAGES AND YOUR KUDOS.

MIKE: THE STATE OF LOUISIANA JUST PASSED A LAW DEMANDING THE 10 COMMANDMENTS BE PUT IN EVERY PUBLIC SCHOOL CLASSROOM EVEN THOUGH THE SUPREME COURT RULED DECADES AGO THEY COULD NOT DO THAT.

I LOOKED AT THE EDUCATIONAL RANKINGS, LOUISIANA IS LOW.

THEY SHOULD BE SPENDING THE MONEY INTO EDUCATION.

JIM: IS THE INK DRY ON THE ACLU LAWSUIT?

MIKE: IT WILL BE A WASTE OF MONEY.

MAYBE THEY ARE HOPING THE SUPREME COURT WILL REVISIT THE ISSUE.

I THINK ALL THE MONEY THAT WILL BE SPENT ON A LAWSUIT, THEY COULD HAVE PUT IT TOWARD KIDS IN EDUCATION.

WEAYONNOH: AFTER A LONG AND ACTIVE LEGISLATIVE SESSION, MY KUDOS IS FOR SUMMER IN RHODE ISLAND.

IT STARTED FOR ME AND WEDNESDAY WITH JUNETEENTH NEW ENGLAND WHERE THERE WAS A LOT OF FOOD AT FARM FRESH AND VENDORS.

SATURDAY, THERE WILL BE A JUNETEENTH FESTIVAL.

I’M LOOKING FORWARD TO ALL OF THE GREAT THINGS THAT HAPPENED IN THE SUMMER.

JIM: MAYBE A LITTLE SLEEPING IN?

WEAYONNOH: YES.

[LAUGHTER] PATRICK: PUBLIC RECORDS.

I THINK ON THIS SHOW A COUPLE MONTHS AGO I SAID DO NOT GET YOUR HOPES UP ON PUBLIC RECORDS REFORM BECAUSE EVEN THOUGH THERE WAS ANOTHER PUSH, AS THERE IS EVERY YEAR, TO MAKE IT EASIER FOR THE PUBLIC AND THE MEDIA TO GET PUBLIC RECORDS, IT WAS NEVER REALLY ALIVE IN THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY THIS YEAR.

BUT IT IS NEEDED.

I THINK THERE WILL BE ANOTHER EFFORT WITH MAYBE A DIFFERNT STRATEGY NEXT YEAR.

THE ISSUE AROUND BODY CAMERAS, ONE OF THEM THAT POINTS TO THE NEED TO HAVE BETTER PUBLIC RECORDS LAWS AND BETTER ACCESS.

JIM: MIKE AS YOU KNOW WAS THE ARCHITECT OF THE LAST MAJOR CHANGE MORE THAN A DECADE AGO AND WE HAVE HAD THIS DISCUSSION.

DID THEY BITE OFF TOO MUCH?

IF YOU COULD SUGGEST TO THE PEOPLE WHO WERE GOING TO GO AT IT AGAIN NEXT YEAR, WHAT WOULD BE YOUR SUGGESTION?

MIKE: I WOULD PICK ON THREE BIG ISSUES.

MAKING SURE POLICE REPORTS WERE PUBLIC RECORDS.

I THINK THEY NEED TO PICK ON THAT.

BECAUSE OF THEIR OVERSIGHT RULE, AS WELL AS THE SENATOR.

THEY HAVE TO LOOK AT IT MORE CAREFULLY.

THE ADMINISTRATION WAS AGAINST IT.

THIS IS AN ISSUE THAT COULD BE RIGHT FOR A CONSTITUTIONAL CONVENTION.

I THINK IT WOULD MAKE A BIG DIFFERENCE.

I THINK FLORIDA PUTS IT IN THE CONSTITUTION.

JIM: THAT IS ANOTHER REASON MIKE WANTS A CONSTITUTIONAL CONVENTION.

THAT IS ALL THE TIME WE HAVE.

WE APPRECIATE YOUR TIME.

WEAYONNOH, MIKE, PATRICK, GOOD TO SEE YOU.

I HOPE YOU GET SOME REST OVER THE SUMMER.

WE ARCHIVE ALL OF OUR SHOWS AT RIPBS.ORG/LIVELY.

COME BACK NEXT WEEK.

WE WILL KNOW WHO IS RUNNING AND WHO IS NOT AND WE WILL HAVE A RECAP OF THE FIRST PRESIDENTIAL DEBATE.

COME BACK AND JOIN US AS "A LIVELY EXPERIMENT" CONTINUES.

♪ [CAPTIONING PERFORMED BY THE NATIONAL CAPTIONING INSTITUTE, WHICH IS RESPONSIBLE FOR ITS CAPTION CONTENT AND ACCURACY.

VISIT NCICAP.ORG] ♪ >> "A LIVELY EXPERIMENT" IS GENEROUSLY UNDERWRITTEN BY.

>> I AM JOHN.

FOR OVER 30 YEARS, "A LIVELY EXPERIMENT" HAS PROVIDED INSIGHT AND ANALYSIS OF THE POLITICAL ISSUES THAT FACE RHODE ISLA